/sffg/ - Science Fiction and Fantasy General

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Gene Wolfe is objectively the greatest living American author.

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Donate to my charity anon

Second Gentleman Bastards book. Only a few chapters in but so far I'm enjoying it as much as the first - which is to say it's perfect for killing time, but not something I feel the need to pour through in a single sitting.

What's some good political scifi? Without ayyyliens.

I took a Sci-Fi course, reading Delaney and Dick now, and watching Tarkovsky and shit.

Got any Sci-Fi criticism books you'd rec?

>>9221887
The ones I can think of are more fantasy-centered. What did your course tell you? The TTC course makes a big deal out of Delaney because he's gay and black but his language that makes you betray people sounds really interesting. Makes more sense at least than a language that lets you see the future.

Hey /sffg/ let's read a short story.
http://www.e-reading.club/bookreader.php/69834/Le_Guin_-_Solitude.html
Ursula K. Le Guin, Solitude, I read it once and thought it was kind of neat, came back to it and didn't speed read and it was a horror story. It's anthropological SF about a society where adults don't talk to each other, not even on the internet.

>>9221900
They did give us some books, but I thought you'd have something more based here, as is usually the case.

Yeah, the language thing is interesting, but they are probably forcing him because he's gay as you said.

>Atwood
>Le Guin
Them too, because they are women, I guess. Although Le Guin is fun.

>>9221913
Yeah, Le Guin's a legit good author, much, much better at shorts than novels though. I have never met anyone who likes Atwood.

I could give you some neat stuff about fantasy but I haven't found much good SF criticism. You might like Appendix N, it's about a guy reading the books Gygax recommended in the back of the first D&D and finding hidden gem after hidden gem. It's a neat perspective that goes back to way before anyone tried to make SF literary, taking all these works on their own terms and not for what they're subverting. There's a noisy fanbase springing up around it but Jeffro's got a good style.

Our very own Aramini published a couple of books on Wolfe, so technically SF criticism but it's all Wolfe-centered.

Ah, Le Guin's Language of the Night has some good stuff. A lot of her observations on SF are way off though imo.

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So I've watched The Magicians tv show. It was a good enjoyment. So I liked Julia story a lot, especially part about false goddess, Chrisitians symbols, you know. So any books about these themes: gods summoning in modern setting, good gods turn evil, like that?

inb4 Buffy novelizations

Has anyone read Sins of Empire yet? It's been out for a few days. I guess I was absent on launch day, probably missed the fans.

just finished Justin Cronin's Passage trilogy. I thought it was pretty good. Scott Brick was an amazing narrator otherwise I don't think I would've gotten through some of the slower parts in the first book...but once I got to the end of book one I was hooked. Also really liked City of Mirrors, wasn't at all what I expected from the third book in a trilogy.

...also Zero's backstory made me cry a bit.

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Gene Wolfe >>>>>> Your favourite author

>>9222488
>>9221750
And you wonder why people detest Wolfe fanboys. You don't actually like books, you just want to feel superior and smart.

>>9221976
American Gods?

Does anyone know anything similar to Blood Song by Anthony Ryan ? With a lot of fighting/battles and an op warrior MC.

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>>9222490
If you like books so much what do you have against good ones?

>>9221887
How did you like Dhalgren and Hogg?

>>9221976
>So I've watched The Magicians tv show.
I can assume you read the books that series was based on right?

>>9221983
No one was shilling it, no one talked about it for that matter. The author didn't instill trust when he rushed that third book. I have it bookmarked and will get to it sometime this year, it's not something I would drop all my current books to read.

Same shit will happen with ADARE and the blood song guy when they drop their books this year.

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>>9222488
>>9221750
How is that Catholicism coming along?

>>9222715
I'm curious, which book is most 'catholic'?

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>>9222715
I like it when I read about it in books but then whenever I meet the real thing I feel uncomfortable and slightly disgusted and just want to go back to my books. I like Christian writers but IRL everyday Christians just aren't my kind of people. But then I don't like people in general. They're not like the ones in my books.

>>9222727
Summae Theologica

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>>9222732
>Summae Theologica

>>9222715
Should have used one of those breaking sound barrier effect just under the sledge to show how hard he is hitting home. The mound on the book is telling, but some more hints would have been nice.

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>>9222518
Nothing, but people who sperg the fuck out if someone likes a book that their favorite critic said had subpar prose are more annoying than an itchy asshole.

>>9222754
Nam2 of anime?????? Some context???

>>9222754
Nobody was talking about critics here. And I'm the only critic that matters.

>>9222765
boku no pico

>>9222765
My Little Sister Can't Cum This Much

>>9222774
You sure? The character does look kinda like a guy. And the condom could be from gay sex. Ep number?
I already fap to tomgirls on sadpanda, my soul can't get more damned.

>>9222794
watch from the start dude the plot builds up well

>>9222754
>>9222765
>>9222774
>>9222794
>>9222801
Fucking degenerates.

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>>9222754
Cream Lemon is the only officially /lit/-approved hentai. Accept no substitute.

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What should I watch else? I've watched all this shows on list.

Get the fuck out anime fags

>>9222959
Are Saint Seya and CC Sakura on there?

>>9222959
I've never watched a book before. Is it fun?

>>9223192
Do you read all books in Braille?

I think GRRM ruined fantasy for me, nothing I read holds up to ASOIAF

>>9223251
lol

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I am enjoying this.

>>9223341
Good for you.

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How much longer til The Winds of Never Ever?

Have any of you plebs read Ben Galley yet? If so, What'd you think of him?

>>9223396
The Written looks interesting, might read.

>>9223251
haha

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>space opera set in our solar system
>Mars is a military dictatorship

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>>9223477
>Earth are the good guys

>that one friend who always needs the author to explain things
>Characters must also always have "logical" reasons for doing what they do, or they're shit
>Likes "bad ass actions"
Don't even understand why he liked Malazan so much.

And the daily tirades when he's whining about people who are whining about Trump, or why Nintendo is retarded

He used to be so much nicer but now 80% of the time on skype it's tirades.

How is Jeff Vandermeer or Virconium?
I need some escapism.

>>9223251
hehehehe

The Grim Company was fantastic. Found it really funny at times too.

What's the SF equivalent to asoiaf in terms of scale

>>9223526
Asimov's shit.

I'm about to order The Moon Is a Harsh Mistress and I'm thinking about also getting Stranger in a Strange Land. Thoughts? Are they shit?

>>9223829
You can just download them and read the first few pages yourself if you're unsure.

Is Jeff Vandermeer any good?

>>9223898
You already asked a few posts above. If you want opinions you can always use the search function and look in the archive.

>How is Jeff Vandermeer or Virconium?
Anyone?

>>9223829
>>9223890
Shit nigga you aint even gotta download them, there are free pdfs online
Also I damn near loved Stranger in a Strange Land but have yet to read Moon, so I would recommend it strongly

>>9223902
>You already asked a few posts above.

Different guy. I just jumped into the thread. I usually use warosu but I was feeling peculiarly social.

Yo, read The name of the wind, best book ever

>>9224038
What's the wind's name anyway?

>>9224038
delet

>>9224043
If you listen close enough you can hear it softly as a breeze passes you by. "Gary Stu" it moans as it travels the lands. "Kvothe is a Gary Stu" the wind whispers in its wake. "Rothfuss is a hack and will never ever ever release Book 3" say the rustling leaves to each other in frustration.

>>9221588
>what are you reading?
Leviathan Wakes
>how is it so far?
It's shit, but it's entertaining enough.
>expected releases?
Too much backlog even think of new books.
>>buyers remorse: what shit book were you shilled?
Leviathan Wakes. I'm reading it to be up to date in the sphere of what everyone's talking about, but then again I could be reading something actually good.

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>>9224038

>>9221976

In case you didn't read them, the books are quite different from the TV show. DESU after reading the books first, I couldn't stand the show.

>>9223898

He edited some fuck huge Anthologies with his wife. The Weird, Time Travelers Almanach, The Big Book of Science Fiction. Great stuff. Just ignore the few token Authors who obviously were included because diversity.

ʸᵉᵃʰ ᵘᵘᵘᵘʰ ᶜᵃᶰ ᴵ ᵍᵉᵗ ᵃ ᵀᵁᶜ ᵉˣᶜᵉʳᵖᵗ

>>9221750
croats should be banned

Is this more entertaining than anime?

>>9224544
yeah

>>9224544
Not really. I'm only here because I already watched 300+ anime and there's nothing interesting left.

>>9224505
I'm sure the answer will be different today than yesterday. Be sure you keep posting it in every thread!

>>9221840
How do all these professional writers live without writing anything? What do they do all day? Is all their income from Patreon?

>>9224629
Rothfuss gets huge word-of-mouth sales. Lots of my normie friends try to get me to read NotW. He's probably just living off royalties still. Jemisin makes five grand a month off Patreon though.

>>9224629
The more people that read you, the less you have to write. The less people that read you, the more you have to write.

>>9222754
Has any author ever set a work in the fantasy universe where Rothfuss prose=Wolfe prose? Cause this butthurt little fella could use some validation.

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>>9223477
Pierce Brown writes anime.

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Does anyone here keep up with Kingkiller or ASOIAF and can tell me what the latest news are?

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>>9223493
>the solar system is ruled by corporations under the iron fist of a large military contractor that has the monopoly on the production of top end military hardware
>off-world workers and colonists are downtrodden and only people on earth live in prosperity
>the story is infantile, edgy bullshit

I read Walter Miller's 1951 post-apocalyptic novelette Dark Benediction, where a space borne virus has landed on Earth. Those who are contaminated by it turn grey and are inflicted with a frenzied desire to lay hands on others, thereby passing on the contagion. With no cure found, the virus soon spreads widely, and society regresses to murder and brigandism; civilisation collapses.

Two years on, a young man scavenges for food around Texas (Houston and Galveston) where the action takes place. He encounters dangerous men, a love interest, and a religious hospital who aim to research the virus and rebuild society. Here there is much of the same imagery and meaning as can be found in Miller's later novel A Canticle For Leibowitz. However, this is arguably better written: a more concise treatment of similar aspects in a more approachable package. Overall it deserves four 'dermies' out of five.

>>9223829
Did not read stranger, but moon is a great book, although I did not read it in english.

>>9225297
Last I heard rothfuss had his draft for book three sent back for serious reworks

Any gay SFF kino?

>>9225297
GRRM postponed his book another year. Just like he did last year. No idea what the other fat fuck is doing.

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>>9225359
I googled that and he says he's mentally ill and has to focus on health, therapy and hobbies right now. Also he's hysteric about Trump, because we all know Trump will exterminate the Rich.
Fuck.

>>9225408
I remember being hyped last year.

Time to pirate some Sanderson I guess. Just feels so empty and soulless.

>>9225402
The steel remains

>>9225424
>Just feels so empty and soulless.
Well, he is a Mormon.

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Why are you not reading this right now? How do you deal with never being as cool as Lord Juss of many mountained Demonland or as cunning as Lord Gro?

>>9225335
Thanks dinon. What collections are you reading these out of? I have fond memories of an SF novella collection than had some I barely remember, like one where a guy walks across the US to avoid teleportation booths, and Enemy Mine.

>>9225470
But Card's a Mormon and he's got too much soul, everyone mooning around talking about how they feel.

>>9225479
>Why are you not reading this right now?
I was skeered and awa' from Brandoch Daha.

>>9225524
I'm going through an Asimov and Greenberg edited anthology called The Mammoth Book of Vintage Science Fiction: http://www.isfdb.org/cgi-bin/title.cgi?35507

But there are a lot of cheap old anthologies out there with similar stories, usually edited by Greenberg, Silverberg, or Asimov. ISFDB and then Amazon is handy for finding them. This goes for you fantasy folks as well.

>>9225479
This book is amazing. It's like what a ten year old boy would write if he were some sort of genius.

>>9221588
any tips on writing a sci-fi book?

>>9222959
>>>/a/

>>9225479
I just finished it yesterday. Fantastic read.

>>9222959
Find the oldest, most worn books on the fantasy shelf of your library. Report back.

Which is best between Malazan, The Prince of Nothing, and The Dagger and the Coin?

>>9225297
TWOW is mostly finished, going through rewrites

but you know GRRM is the type of writer who randomly decides to delete 10 chapters he had and start over, or think of a new plot twist and rewrite half the book to accommodate it.

In other words it's a case of when his editors can pry it out of his hands, I'd expect it will be finished in late 2017 with a publication in 2018

>>9225730
Malazan - a billion fucking names dressing up epic fantasy
The Prince of Nothing - a billion fucking names dressing up a rejected philosophy phd
Dagger and Coin - Looks like trade fantasy/politics at first but has an awful "I twirl my cape" pov villain

I'd rank them D&C>Bakker>Malazan but I really dislike Malazan, I know others don't

>>9225746
>The Prince of Nothing - a billion fucking names dressing up a rejected philosophy phd
PON doesn't have that many characters compared to most epic fantasy

>>9225754
Nah but it's all names, titles and names of places names of battles

>>9222959
is there a sci-fi list?

>>9225479
so A Voyage to Arcturus came first right?
What influence do you think it had if any on Eddison?

Rec me some good fantasy books I would be likely to find at a small town library in the south that isn't written by Tolkien. Pls.

>>9225824
I have no idea whether Eddison read it, but the two are nothing alike. A Voyage to Arcturus is overtly allegorical and has blunt, ugly prose – the Worm is more like a boy's fantasies transformed into a full-fedged epic (and Eddison like Tolkien is explicit that he intends no allegory), and the prose is extremely lyrical.

In spirit, Voyage is Gnostic and cynical (even frightening at times), and the Worm is, I don't know what you would call it, pre-modern? Pagan? Homeric? Great figures doing great deeds, fighting and fucking and living forever.

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>>9225878
>in the south
Redneck approved?

>what are you reading?

Woken Furies.

>how is it so far?

After plowing through the first two I find everything is still holding up, if possibly just by the premise and setting.

>expected releases?

I just take things as they come.

>buyers remorse: what shit book were you shilled?

I wasn't shilled, but those shitty Otori books. I didn't even pay for them and I felt cheated, but my autism rarely lets me not finish a book.

I have a bunch of superpowers that I want to do something with but the project I created them for has been abandoned. What do /sffg/?

>>9225878
I'm sure even the tiniest public library will have a copy of the arabian nights, even people did fill the inside cover with swastikas

>>9225297
Never ever

Someone please fucking help me.

I had a book years and years ago and it's haunting me that I cannot remember the title or the authors name. I would kill someone to read it again.

I know the novel is part of a series, or at least based in a pre-established universe. It takes place on Earth I think. Basic premise is a brother and sister who are part of a family of warlords who rule a wasteland. The brother is set to replace his father and take over his crime syndicate but doesn't want to. There is a huge futuristic city and the criminals are banished to live in the wasteland. The original novels would have been about this city I think. There are themes of paganism throughout. There are a couple of scenes in the novel where Odin literally makes an appearance. The sister is married away to another warlord where she is hamstrung and kept in a tower. Her brother goes on a journey to find and save her. There is one part where the sister is visited by some sort of god and becomes a bird. She goes and visits her brother like this. There are half human half animals in the wasteland and the warlords make a sport of killing and enslaving them I think? The cover of the book featured a hulking half-man half-pig or maybe half-warthog.

This is all the information I have but if anyone could fucking help me I'd be very grateful.

Is Neil gaiman's American God's worth it? I started reading it like 3 months ago after getting it as a present, but I stopped because I was reading other stuff.

Friendly reminder that PKD, Ellison, Stapleton and Lem are the only SF authors worth talking about.

>>9226120
If your goal is sucking up to your lit professor, you're absolutely right.

>>9226120
The interesting thing, it seems, is that most of those are more accomplished in the shorter form, or are not fiction writers in the conventional sense. PKD's best writing is his shorts, ditto Ellison, and Stapledon's two standout works are hardly novelistic, more like fictional non-fiction (e.g. Star Maker.)

The short form would appear ideal for writing SF, and less suited for novels (where character study is king.)

What is the GOAT scifi/fantasy book/series?

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>>9226224

>>9226120
Add Wolfe and I agree.

>>9226224
New Sun.

>>9226224
My diary desu

What do I do if all my ideas are too anime to write without feeling disgusted with myself?

>>9226379
There is literally nothing wrong with anime.

>>9226385
Writing anime makes me feel ashamed of myself unless it ghibli's quality and feeling. I'm not good enough to do either and I end up with shit that sounds like a generic low fantasy anime with a modernish setting

>>9225965
Did... did the brother and sister.. did they fuck?

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>>9226379
>>9226402
Read, learn, stfu and get out.

>>9225972
no. to me it read like something a slightly talented 16 year old would write, too much edge, too many cliche characters, and terrible descriptions. full disclosure: i tossed it after about 40 pages, so maybe it gets better. i wasn't willing to find out.

>>9226437
>House of Blades is anime as fuck
>manages to create a new series that's even more anime
impressive desu

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>mfw it's the gory 90's OVAs and bloated powerlevel shonen that gets imitated
>mfw no comfy slice-of-life SFF about decent people being decent to each other anywhere

>>9226437
Is this good? Got it on Kindle during a giveaway.

>>9226471
>TFW I wasted over a year on a concept before realizing I was literally recreating Kekkai Sensen but with a plot

Anon, how much worse would that have been if I was recreating My Bride Is A Mermaid or some shit like that instead?

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>>9226485
It would have been better.

>>9226485
>literally recreating Kekkai Sensen but with a plot
And you stopped?

>>9226514
yeah, and it wasn't even a good plot. It's been compared to Percy Jackson in terms of concept and shittiness

I'm still attached to the characters and their animesque powers so I intend to reuse them at some point. Only problem is I don't know where to do it and how without making it seem equally shitty to me

>try reading Sins of Empire
>all the characters have high-larious quirks because that's how you distinguish them in the Sanderson school
>murderous duelist politician kills three dudes in a swordfight then calls a pamphlet "leftist drivel"
>go on /sffg/ to complain about it
Does it get any better? I don't think McClellan's learned from his mistakes.

>>9225972
American Gods is his best non-comic work desu. It's not hard to get through so give it a shot and find out.

>>9226545

Was about to buy this tomorrow. Really enjoyed the first three books, finished the third one last week- I enjoyed the briskness of the pace and the natural world building, leaving a lot of room for the reader's imagination- but I was turned off to find out it's an episode of "Vlora and Olem in Not-India adventures, I.E Sharpe"

>>9226894
From what I've read apparently Taniel died offscreen? Or did he die at the end of the third book? I think I'd have remembered that. And hopefully the not-Americans are going to get some redeeming qualities pretty darn quick, it's all been native massacres and everyone thinking oh, those poor natives, so far, and then the guy actually says "leftists." I'm a bit tired already. Hopefully we'll see the natives eat somebody or something like that.

>>9226907
He didn't die, but iirc he basically fucked off to live with his loli waifu in peace, and left everyone thinking he was dead so he could stay out of the political sphere.

>>9226545
Sanderson is just shit all around.
Re-reading Silmarillion over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again, that's where it's at.

>>9226921
Ah, that makes me happier.

>>9226907
>he thinks taniel is dead
>he thinks ka-poel won't be relevant in a book about her adoptive people

>>9225424
If Trump exterminated Rothfuss I don't think anyone who isn't a neckbeard would mind. He would do literature a service.

>>9226983
It's been a long time. Wait, adoptive? She's one of the natives, right? They're just Celts in Mohawk clothes.

>>9225972
I stopped reading when I had to read 5 pages of muslims sucking each other's dicks and swallowing.

>>9227005
>not stopping when the fertility goddess eats a guy with her hoo-ha

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>what are you reading?
Xenocide
>how is it so far?
Bretty gud. Speaker for the Dead was more engaging.

Can someone recommend me some near future military sci-fi?

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>>9226471
>90's OVA imitations
please point me towards these

>>9225656
yes, set it in the future

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Anything like LoGH that isn't Dune?

>>9225656
learn2sci

is The Long Price Quartet any good?

>>9227215
Unironically Game of Thrones, if you mean like LOGH lots of people scheming against each other and being ambitious while politics happens. Foundation if you want a humanities lesson with a plot.

>>9221878
The Foundation series.

>>9227338
already read them both, but thanks

>>9227348
Have you read Ender's Game? Written to be readable by Children but it has incredibly wide appeal and covers war, tactics and genius. It's not half as gay as it sounds.

>>9227357
>It's not half as gay as it sounds.
No, with all the child nudity it's actually gayer.

>>9227357
I haven't. I might try it, but really it seems like something i would have enjoyed as a kid/teen, but i doubt i would enjoy it now.

>>9227367
It's incredibly easy reading if nothing else. I still think it's worth it even if you aren't 12.

I read Roadside Picnic and it was great.

Now what?

>>9227367
Enders game is "starship troopers meets harry potter" and is a pretty good read. The sequels are way less kid-friendly (as in, more philosophical or whatever) and are good as well.

>>9227507
Rendezvous with Rama?

>start reading the third book in a series about preparing for an invasion by technologically superior alien fleet
>opens by describing the fall of Constantinople to technologically superior Muslim cannons
I hope this isn't foreshadowing of some kind.

>>9227538
Ember War Saga is pretty fun

>>9227545
If it's a more optimistic take on the concept than this utilitarian "the universe is just one big deathmatch" Chinese shit I'm reading now I'll put it on the backlog.

Why do so many authors have to force morally grey shit?

Why can't good just be good?

>>9226907
>hopefully the not-Americans are going to get some redeeming qualities pretty darn quick
>muh whites killing natives and feeling bad
>when will natives proves the whites were right
I'm not saying pol... but..

>>9226991
He might take a page from mother Russia like days of ole and start killing the intelligensay like in the book I'm currently reading

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>>9227246
You tell me

>>9227246
It's fantastic.

>>9227507
Were you the guy that thanked me for shilling you library at mount char? I told you roadside picnic, metro 2033 and shades of grey.

>>9227580
World has changed, women have bittered men against them. There are fewer and fewer white knights around that would do the "good" and "right" thing by sacrificing themselves for some girl they meet less than a week ago and know nothing of.

Why should they die to let her live when they were surviving for years by themselves? She didn't even have sex with them, they would throw themselves on the bomb so she could go ride post apoc chad's dick?
It's an author's job to read the atmosphere and social climate. They know if they write unbelievably shit they will tank.
Would you throw yourself in front of a gun for a girl you met 3 days ago and just held your hand to thank you for feeding her?(post disaster setting). I wouldn't.

>>9227580
Because there is no good without evil.

>>9227580
Only the Sith deal in absolutes.

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>>9227580
Most authors aren't wise enough to embrace Catholicism.

>>9227665
>strawman
You don't need self-sacrifice to be good.

>>9227710
Fucking protestants reeee

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>>9227710
That's a nice pupper.
I think wolfe will get a shit load of acclaim after he is dead. The reason he ain't getting shit now is that no one likes living authors. Professors and critics want to say what something "means" without having the author contradict them.

Hell Wolfe might join the big 3 meme of the future. Look what dying did for that hack dfw.

>>9227740
>You don't need self-sacrifice to be good.
You don't read much do you faggot? That is how most authors righg a "good" person. Willing to die for others.

I laugh when authors try to justify the military killing people and saying 'thank you for your service' and going on rants (in book mind you) about military vets, or when someone killed a soldier, when the military is just trained killers who work for the state.

Authors always see the military as good (only when they are Americans or not!Americans), authors always sees self-sacrifice as good, authors always sees someone jumping infront of a gun to save some kid who is going to die next week anyways, and will just waste food till them.

Self-sacrifice = good. That is how authors sell it.

>>9227559
It relies a bit too much on tired tropes, but it's got enough originality and a good enough pace to be enjoyable anyway.

The spaceship combat is utter bollocks which kind of bothers me though.

>>9227748
A fast track to being irrelevant and forgotten? DFW is just a lit meme.

>>9227777
And another straw man.

And there are different ways to write a "good" character, it doesn't need self-sacrifice.

If an author can only signify how good a character is by self-sacrifice then he is just as shit as authors who constantly kill off random characters just to show off how edgy their novel is.

>>9227601
>if you think American colonists had redeeming features you are /pol/
well then call me /pol/

>>9227800
You sound like georgie boy touched you someplace you didn't like.

>>9227580
it's what sells now (thanks GRRM)

I don't mind cynicism and grey characters in a story but too much of it becomes dull. A Song of Ice and Fire at least has some characters who retain romantic ideals (Barristan, Sansa, Brienne etc.)

Modern fantasy writers ruin it by having every character be some post-modern cynical wise cracker who would be more at home in the 21st century than a fantasy novel, lack of self-awareness

>>9227879
The Borgias (tv series) was pretty much all morally gray and I didn't get the
> post-modern cynical wise cracker
feeling at all.

>>9227889
oh I was talking about books

for TV it's just tits and violence to keep the plebs entertained, nothing more

>>9227902
>oh I was talking about books
Yes I understand, I only used it as an example of near universal gray morality not necessarily being bad in fiction. The important thing is whether the characters are well written or not, no matter their morality or lack thereof.

>>9227889
Leave him be. He is one of those who romanticize the past. He thinks the gentry wasn't cynical wisse cracking assholes. He thinks royal courts back in the day was made of better stuff.

>>9221588
I just finished Howl's Moving Castle.
It was fantastic.
What now?

>>9228163
The other books by the same author? Hell there's more books in the same series.

>>9228170
Yes? I guess... I don't like reading a series if the first book was 1) really great and 2) was properly concluded.

I regard them with the same inherent distrust as I do movie sequels.

Is that weird?

>>9225438
Gay sex, no sf, and shit over all story.

>>9228212
>no sf
>race of tech warriors with ai run ships

>>9228218
you mean the glowing guy he bones? Yeah, for like a chapter. The point is, it's pretty boring. I liked the steppe people chapters, but other than that, the plot was shit. If you want gay sex, there's better shit out there.

>>9227507
Their earlier novel, Hard To Be a God, where Earth scholars covertly observe an extra-terrestrial race. It's in a good Bormaschenko translation in the SF Masterworks line.

>>9227580
You can go back to the Golden and pulp age for red-blooded fiction where men are heroic, violence is a genuine solution against evil, family values are a virtue, and where men are allowed to be strong and protect women (who in those more stratified times were actually written as women and not just men with breasts.) In short, the differences between masculine and feminine were reveled in, admitted, and celebrated, without being hateful.


That's what all this veneration of Edgar Rice Burroughs and pulp writers is about at places like Castalia/Vox Day. It remains to be seen if there will be a turn in mainstream tastes.

>>9227622
This is obviously a troll image when you put Vance's Dying Earth alongside that trash.

>>9227748
Some young creative will want to make a BOTNS TV series or movie in the near future, I'm certain. It'll be an abortion, but the paperback tie ins will bring in a lot of readers.

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lmao theodore beale is so butthurt.

>>9228186
Yeah it is. You can just think of it as two separate books by an author you like. If the first was great and the second is only "good" is that really a loss? And you can think of it the opposite way too, what if the second book is even better? Wouldn't want to miss that.

>>9228227
No I mean the lesbian chick who maybe only shows up in the second book.

The glowing dude is literally an elf

>>9228288
Yeah, I never read the second one, and I don't remember shit, really.

is game of thrones worth a read? My library has it and I am thinking of picking it up.

>>9228416
The TV series is better honestly.

>>9228422
This is objectively wrong

Yo anyone who has read the expanse

Does the biocomputer/grey goo/man eating fungus plot continue for the whole series?

Because I like Leviathan Wakes for being human focused and political and not about the commander of a fleet of battleships

But I hate the alien shit

>>9228470
It does, but serves as a catalyst for more human bitching

Except for book 3, which is a detour from human infighting, also the worst book in the series

>>9228416
Yeah, it's good.

>>9228416
yes

people on here will be contrarian and say it's shit but ASOIAF is easily the best epic fantasy series of the past 20 years

>>9228565
You're just the opposite sort of contrarian that exaggerates everything. It's okay, but has massive amounts of flaws.

>>9228416
Just read it and form your own opinion. It's not much worse (and actually better in some cases) than a lot of stuff people already recommend here

>>9228575
name one epic Fantasy since 1990 that is as good as ASOIAF

>>9228579
flashbird the vampire

>>9228186
Diana Wynne Jones sequels are always self-contained. Her other books are often just as delightful. My favorites are Archer's Goon and Deep Secret, with Dark Lord of Derkholm a close third.

What do y'all think about Janny Wurts?

>>9228626
Bad Reddit author.

>>9228605
Thank you, I'll check them out
Deep Secret especially seems fun

>>9228635
It really is, and there's some really neat fantasy moments mixed in, old-feeling fantasy too where it's forces you may not understand but need to work with. Also there's a wizard casting spells while trying to hack a floppy disk to keep its counterhexes from melting it.

>>9228579
Glen Cook's shit, Sanderson's shit, Erikson's shit, Abercombie's shit.

Though Black Company began before 1990.

They're all flawed, just like asoiaf but do some things better some things worse.

>>9228416
Give it a try but remember that later on the books will start dragging on and on and it goes to a snail's pace.
So if you don't like it after the first or second book, just stop. It won't get better.
Otherwise enjoy it.

Or watch the TV show, that's also an option.

>>9221976
>summons god and gets brutally raped

Goddamn wasn't expecting that what the fuck lev?

>>9228279
I bet his doesn't even have a strong powerful woman taking advantage of a subordinate and powerfully raping him while conducting fruit trade business.

>>9228163
>muh young adult

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What's not to love about THE DIRECTION OF HUMAN EE-VOLUTION and nanotech apparently being black magic to these people?

>>9228680
Amos/Jayne are the only characters that have any real similarities in that list. Maybe the black women at a push. Oh and the spoiled rich girl who gets kidnapped for government experiments.

>>9228688
>nerdy pilot that never feels good enough
>betrayed former soldier that can't escape his feelings of responsibility for "his" people
>former officer who after getting involved in shady stuff now dedicates his life to helping the unfortunate, makes strained faces at the camera a lot and is black

>>9228708
Yeah those are half-accurate at best. Stretching pretty poorly. Their personalities and backgrounds hardly match up.

That said, The Expanse is terrible. I'm not trying to defend it, I just don't think those characters fit. If they did it might be watchable.

>>9228716
Yeah, I'd love to see Amos pumping iron with Fred Johnson. They're still based, poorly, on the same archetypes as the Firefly cast. Miller was a better character, he kind of split Mal's character with Holden, but he was insufferable and I hated when he was onscreen. He's probably going to come back as a goozombie though.

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>>9228671

>>9228722
he becomes a hallucination to holden

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>"Please, Mother," he heard himself murmuring. "It's been so long. I've been so lonely... Only you, Mother. Only you understand."
>He laid her across the great Black Sun embroidered into his coverings. His hands trembled as he fussed with her gowns. His groin throbbed so sweetly he feared he might soil his robes.
>"You do love me," he gasped. "You do love..."
>Her painted eyes had become drowsy, delirious. Her flat chest heaved beneath the fabric. Somehow he could see through the skein of wrinkles that made a mask of her face, down to the serpentine truth of her beauty. Somehow he could see the woman who had driven his father mad with jealousy, who had shown her son the ecstasy of secrets bundled between sheets.
>"My sweet son," she gasped. "My sweet..."
>His fingers and palm found warm skin. His heart became a thunderclap. He ran his hand along her calves, which she shaved in the fashion of the Ainoni, then across her still-smooth thighs. He clutched at her groin, squeezed the haft of her erection

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>>9228875

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>>9228875

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>>9228875
HE CANT KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH IT

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>>9228875

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>>9228875
Wtf I love Prince of Nothing now

>>9228279

Vox is pretty retarded but his trolling of SFWA is god tier.

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>>9228875

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>find an author who isn't afraid to not be politically correct
>he's literally a racist

>>9229351
The best authors are racist.

>>9229351
who are you referring to

>>9228416
The first book is great and justly made huge waves in the SFF world when released, unfortunately the author has at present let the series meander out of control and shows signs of having lost interest.

>>9229351
Chances are, if someone brags about being politically incorrect, they're an unabashed bigot.

Bigots feel the need to reframe their biases as a positive thing. Non-racists who nonetheless have an offensive sense of humor don't need to go on the defensive when people are offended because they won't defend something they don't believe is right.

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What is the literary equivalent of Zeno Clash?

For those unaware, it's a series of 2 PC first-person punchers with some adventure and clumsy gunplay elements. The gameplay tries to be original but it's pretty unpolished and not particularly good, but the real good thing about it is the setting.
It's set in a "bonepunk" world - basically a prehistorical/early civ society, but with weird animals and furries (not the cute kind) and technology like rifles made out of bones that shoot nuts.
It's not like the Flintstones, it's actually kinda surreal, but I liked how the story of the first one wasn't an epic Hollywood adventure but rather like one of the exotic folk tales I read as a kid. Most high fantasy games are just Tolkien ripoffs, so it was a breath of fresh air. Any books like this?

>>9229508
t.pleb
the first book is the weakest one

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>>9229548
Will post 2 more pieces of concept art if y'all don't mind

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>>9229654

>>9229548
never heard of "bonepunk", so I've got nothing to recommend
neat idea though

>>9221588
any of you punks ever read Star Maker? get crackin

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>"Please, mummy," he heard himself murmuring. "It's been so long I'm dying for a taste. I've been so lonely mum... Only you, mummy. Only you understand." This is no time to be using English accents Wayne though.

>He laid her across the great Ladrian emblem embroidered into Wax's coverings. "Wax is gonna kill me for soiling his sheets". His hands trembled as he fussed with her gowns, it's like his fear of guns all over again. His little brother throbbed so sweetly he feared he might milk his slacks.

>"You love me mum," he gasped. "You do love..."
>Her painted eyes had become drowsy, delirious. Her flat chest very unlike Chariss', heaved beneath the fabric. Somehow he could see through the many wrinkles that made a mask of her face, a nice face I might add that would be a great disguise someday, to the serpentine truth of her beauty. Somehow he could see the woman who had driven her many, many lovers over the years mad with jealousy, who had shown her son the ecstasy of secrets viewed from cupboard slits, as she entertained her lovers.

>"My sweet son," she gasped. "My sweet..."
>His fingers and palm found warm skin. His heart became a thunderclap. He ran his hand along her calves, which she shaved in the fashion of the Elendelians, then across her still-smooth thighs. He clutched at her groin, squeezed the haft of her metal mine.

>>9229687
I don't know if there's a name for this, I think they rather call it "stonepunk" or "bronzepunk" instead.

>>9229720
Not /lit/ but I watched a bit of The Hundred and that's got crazy dark-age pricks running around alongside some future tech

>>9229701
DELET

>>9229351
anyone who moans about political correctness is using it as a euphemism for open racism

Nobody else fucking cares about it, literally all "political correctness" means is treat other people nicely.

>>9229796
Well it is /lit/ since it's a (ya) novel adaptation

>>9230032
>literally all "political correctness" means is treat other people nicely.
lol

>>9230032
If only the definition of "nice" weren't part of the Newspeak dictionary and constantly subject to change, and vicious enforcement of the new nice.
>If there were anything fixed in nature, if there were truths, all this would, of course, be wrong. But fortunately, all truths are erroneous. This is the very essence of the dialectical process: today's truths become errors tomorrow; there is no final number.
>Revolution is everywhere, in everything. It is infinite. There is no final revolution. There is no final number.

>>9229701
This is more disgusting in every way than anything Bakker has ever written.

Well done.

>>9230042
Yeah or just stop calling a transgender woman "him" all the time like a cunt

>>9230054
I will call those mentally ill abominations what they are.

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>>9230054
It could have gone the other way, you know? With feminists attacking transsexuals as men attempting to colonize female spaces? None of this is objective. It's a power play. SFF is about freedom, freedom to do what you want, which is why I'm not calling on anyone to lynch Jemisin or anything stupid like that. I want Jemisin to keep doing her thing. I just want the courtesy to be allowed to do my thing even if I don't follow your marching orders.

>>9230066
>>>/pol/

>it's a female reviewer
>her entire review of the book is judging it based in the context of a 21st Century Western liberal democracy, with a heavy flavour of gender politics
Everytime, are women incapable of understanding that the point of fantasy and science fiction is to develop interesting worlds and cultures, different to our own?

Is there any scifi set during a big space opera war but without the PoV being someone directly involved in fighting said war?

>>9230119
Not only women. The autists in this thread screech at novels that clearly don't take place in our time, because it doesn't follow current rules or line of thought. They also judge fantasy books wirh a 21st century eye.

>>9230126
So basically you want a God narrator? Sees all hears all reports all? Third person godhood?

>>9230140
Nah just not a solider/general/someone who ends up fighting

>>9230126
>but without the PoV being someone directly involved in fighting said war?
>>9230142
>Nah just.. someone who ends up fighting
Cunt what do you really want?

>>9230149
>reading comprehension
>>9230126
Maybe de Bodard or someone like that, but generally big space opera wars are the most interesting things going on and so authors put viewpoints there.

>>9229548

I don't know anything about bonepunk either but Jean Aule wrote a series set in prehistory although without fantastical or technological elements, so far as I know.

I can't vouch for it. My father read at least one of them and I glanced through "Clan of the Cave Bear". Still, if the prehistoric setting is what you're after, there you go.

hey /sffg/, I need something to inspire me right now. Exotic settings, unfamiliar myths, intricate plots and especially clever protagonists. I need to be freed from the late winter funk

>>9230535
CONAN
O
N
A
N

Or Cugel I guess

Snow crash is terrible.

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>>9230535
Inspiring enough?

>>9230126
A Talent For War by Jack McDevitt might qualify. The basic premise is that in the distant future, a antiques dealer sets off to solve the mystery of his missing uncle against the backdrop of a cold war with the one alien race humanity has encountered.

The sequels take place afterwards and switches viewpoint to the star-ship pilot/private investigator who works for the antiques dealer. They're entertaining but kinda formulaic adventure-mysteries.

>>9230535
Not exactly what you want but maybe try Goblin Emperor by Katherine Addison? It's a chill, relaxing story about a unwanted fourth son becoming emperor after everybody else in line for the throne dies in a airship accident.

I don't get how writers create short stories.

Like, I know they're a great way to practice, but either I create something with no plot where nothing happens, or the first scene ends up taking up the entire expected length

>>9230701
Everything needs to contribute to the point. Very little time for scenery. Try diagramming one.

jesus fucking christ. I just read a story I wrote almost two years ago and it's amazing. a little more than 2000 words long, sweet and to the point, vivid and poetic yet simple

my writing these days is absolute crap. How the hell have I gotten worse?

>>9230623
agreed. Ironically bad writing is still bad writing

>>9230701
It interests me as well. I read a lot of PKD, Lovecraft, Chekhov, Bradbury, for pleasure and to try and gain an insight into how it's done by successful short story writers. I also looked at online learning materials and video lectures.

I'm still fairly in the dark, except now I believe short story writing is a very individual thing. Chekhov has little in common with Lovecraft, different ideas at the outset of what they want to achieve; so I think it must follow that composition methods differ between writers.

But you can deconstruct many short stories down to a narrow but deeply explored aspects of plot, setting, and character. Often the story arises from a clash/conflict of the qualities of these three basic components. Some people just outline some individually interesting plots, characters and settings and then look for conflicts to explore if these things were thrown together, e.g. hypochondriac at a doctor's office in a love plot.

I have never written a short story in my life though. I'm just a feller who is spitballing on an image board.

>>9221750
Wolfie trolls ruin those threads
I swear, if any of his books were my first contact with fiction i would never fucking read again

>>9229548
>Zeno clash
Always made me think of Planescape Torment, the game and Brandon Sandersons Elantris, dont know why
It has no prehistoric looking shit, but zombiefied still alive people, that depressing feel of a dying fucked up society on its way out the door living in scrapped together parts of a time when they were still prospering

As for the game, fuck me was it waste in every way possible
You can see that there wasnt talent and budget involved needed to make it something more

>>9231040
Then you'd have no reason to hang around these threads. Mission accomplished I'd say.
>tfw not even a Wolfeposter

>>9229548
The closest I can think of is Dinotopia. It's technologically "advanced" but everything's made of leather and wood and stone. Alan Dean Foster wrote a couple novels, if you don't want to read the kids books.

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Can't sympathize with the protag at all. Honestly hoping he dies painfully and horrifically. Everything he does is frustrating and counter-productive. If you think you're in a dream, why not enjoy it? Why keep on insisting you're a leper? Why wear boots? Why stop eating? Why make a nonsensical pact with a herd of horses?!? Not to mention the rape. Every fantasy book has rape, but it's rarely the protag who does it, and for no apparent reason.

Also, I think the double-sided tape is stupid.

>>9231158
I dropped it sometime during the boatride with the non-human creature

>>9231158
Oh yeah, and Donaldson's similes suck ass.

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>>9230701
My brain-cunny is sore and bruised with how many times you took it by force.

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>>9230034
YA should remind us how important the spirit of adventure is - if poorly written wish fulfillment for teenagers can have adventure, couldn't professional writing by and for adults have even better adventure?

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>>9231233
Is it as good as Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality?

>>9231233
>*so*
I don't trust you

>>9231237
Yes. I liked HPMOR, but MoL is much better.

>>9231239
You don't have to trust me. Try it.

>>9230738
I do this all the time. Apparently my best writing was when I was 17. Now I'm 25 I can write longer works but they're not as good.

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>tfw I absolutely abhor Sanderson's writing style but in the end I'll read his novels anyway

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I enjoyed this. Didn't feel like fantasy, but it was in the fantasy section of the library, so whatever.

I could tell it was translated, but the translation wasn't too distracting or inept-seeming. Just a few awkwardly rendered puns, things like that.

>>9230337
Clan is supposed to be good, and the first half of the second is more prehistoric survival, but then it just turns into caveman sex and shitty romance.
Not recommended.

>>9231498
I remember enjoying it and for some reason it was one of the novels that really sticks with you and you think about occasionally. But I read it when I was 13 or something and I'm not sure it would stand up to a re-read or if I'd ruin the memory I have of it, like what happened when I re-read Magician.

>>9230054
"No"
I wouldn't want to disrespect my mother with placing her in the same category as those degenerates.

>>9231233
The very first chapter reeks of a teenage, and asspie, protagonist. I could stand one or another, but together they become too heavy.

>>9231158
>Why keep on insisting you're a leper? Why wear boots? Why stop eating? Why make a nonsensical pact with a herd of horses
Ok that book sounds slightly retarded.

>>9231233
>Fictionpress
AO3 has superior organisation, professional looking CSS and layout honestly fampai.

>>9228680
>tfw read the first book but couldn't finish it because how awful and generic the characters were
That police dude was the worst.

daily reminder that Name of the Wind is a piece of shit and that Rothfuss is biggest hack ever

>>9231739
anon, that's not EDGY enough. It's boring, we all agree, you're preaching to the choir. Now Bakker, Bakker you can be controversial about.

>>9231739
GRRM is a pretty big hack though.

>>9231749
His characters are decent but his writing is unbelievably bad and he is shit with numbers.

A little bit like a male Rowling.

I'm about halfway through Jonathan strange and Mr. Norrell. Found it on here and it's been great. Really funny in that dry British way and the lore packed into it is pretty interesting. I like how she puts it in footnotes.

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>>9231766
Yeah, it really is great, and the magic is the farthest thing from Sanderson comic book physics, it's actually got a moral dimension to it.
>mfw Strange reanimates those Napolitan soldiers and they won't stop screaming

>>9228579

Farseer Trilogy & Tawny Man Trilogy.

Robin Hobb can be a bit hit and miss, but those two are pure gold. And she can actually put books out at a half reasonable pace.

>>9231875
farseer is fucking terrible

>>9231880
Go to bed, Fitz.

>>9231875
Hobb is one of the worst mainstream fantasy writers today m8, she's even worse than Rothfuss

>>9231889
not even close

>>9231889
kys

>>9231894
>>9231908
t. nu-male cucks

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927KB, 410x282px

>>9231912

new bread:

>>9221588
>>9221588
>>9221588
>>9221588
>>9221588

>>9231983
aw heck, meant to say the bread's right here:

>>9231981
>>9231981
>>9231981
>>9231981
>>9231981

>>9231880

K bro.

>>9223829
I loved Moon is a Harsh Mistress i started reading it in the morning and I was finshed by night, loved it.

>>9231683
I told you asspies not to read Thomas Covenant the unbeliever, but you cunts just love to be contrary.
Enjoy your wasted time.

>>9231158
>Can't sympathize with the protag at all
T H A T ' S
T H E
P O I N T