/plg/ - Pokemon Lore General:

gey feggits

>>28628669
>about Kalos-Unova
>I heard about some NPC in BW2 which says that poke balls are mass-produced in a factory in a "nearby region", someone can confirm?

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>>28634024
Also reposting this

Hey, I've been wanting to look a little into alchemy after hearing about the themes in SM

I haven't been looking at the threads properly, but could one of you point me in the general direction I need to go to learn about classical alchemy?

I think an NPC mentioned that there are places where humans don't exist, only Pokemon live there. That could mean that whatever happens in PMD could be canon.
There are different items because it's a different country, maybe even a different continent or an island. Everything built there looks different than what humans would build because it's a society made entirely of Pokemon.
An interesting thing to note is that humans can apparently get there too. Sure, in every game you are a human that turned into a Pokemon (don't know if that's the case in Super Mystery Dungeon) but in PMD2 it is mentioned that before you turned into a Pokemon, you were a human and Grovyle was your partner. That means that humans can somehow get there too.
Now, where exactly would this place be for it to be accessible to humans, yet only populated by Pokemon? It has to be really hidden, since humans would just start living there and building things. It can't be impossible to find though, since, as mentioned earlier, the mc in PMD2 got there and he/she was a human.

Reposting the links between the alchemical triangle, Solgaleo, Lunala, Zygarde, and the Zygarde Cube, with said triangle being in >>28569827 's Pic related because of duplication, sorry for inconvenience:

From >>28346446
>Anima is the sun
>Spiritus is the moon
>Corpus just has a cube to represent it, and the "arrow" that contains the symbol is pointing down
So is the Corpus legendary Earth or something?

From >>28346536

>>28346446
Literally Zygarde

Azoth = 5 planets (5 mons) + Sun/soul + Moon/spirit + physical hermaphrodite body (perfect Z, which have red (Yveltal, Y chromosome) and blue (Xerneas, X chromosome) wings)

Azoth = Solgaleo + Lunala + Zygarde + Xerneas + Yveltal

>>28634302
The dude just meant really remote areas like the antarctic, very deep underground or deep in a huge sahara-like desert.

>>28634024
I was gonna ask if these threads are still headcanon general, but

>Do NOT reply to Richard.
>No arguing about timelines/dimensions, or posting fan-made Guides (including fan maps).

so, I guess I have my answer.

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reposting azoth alchemy notes:

Azoth is the single force -- the "spiritus animatis," as Wikipedia puts it -- of humanity that drives it to attain physical and spiritual perfection. Not only this, the Azoth seems to also have a physical incarnation as the "Elixir of Life" or "The Universal Solvent," and was known as the cure for any mental, spiritual, or physical ailment. Essentially, it's liquid perfection.

Another thing of note is that Azoth's name was constructed from the first and last letters of the Latin, Greek, and Hebrew alphabets, in that order: A/Alpha/Aleph, Z, Omega, and Tau, which ties in to the "Beginning and End" motif present in AZ, and Alpha and Omega.

Additionally, Azoth is another, less used name for the chemical Mercury, which is a part of a very significant trio in alchemy, with the other members being salt and sulfur. The chemical symbols of all three can be seen within the starter Pokemon, as shown in pic related.

>>28634319
>5 planet = 5 pokemon

>You should update this

>reposting about Aether and UB
>Aether = space
>Gladion looks like Expansion, Mars' UB
>Lusamine looks like Beauty, Venus' UB
>>28499494 →
>>28499801 →

Also "Gladion" is named after "gladiolus", of latin "gladius", a roman sword

>Aether fundation = "space fundation"
>Lusamine = Venus = UB02 Beauty
>Faba = Saturn/Jupiter = UB0X ???
>Wacka = Jupiter/Saturn =UB0X ???
>Lillie = Mercury = UB01 ???
>Gladion = Mars = UB02 Expasion


Ultrabeast are confirmed to be hyperspatial pokemon from other dimension >>28494185 →

BUT Sinnoh lore states that humans ARE pokemon. Maybe in that dimension, some pokemon don't go through a darwinian evolution to humans... but evolve to ultrabeast? Expasion is the Gladion's counterpart, Beauty is the Lusamine's, etc

>>28634347
I'd call it fanon general.

Agreed upon statements that have most of their basis in canon things.

>>28634358

>known as the cute for any mental, spiritual or physical ailment
>mercury will literaly kill you in horrible ways if even a little gets inside you

Alchemy was weird man

reposting >>28560913 →
>>28553385 →
If we take Zygarde as being one of the oldest beings on the planet and serves only to protect the planet, then only Cyrus would actually make sense for him to intervene.

The planet is a fucking tough bitch to kill off. You get extinction catastrophes, you get enormous climate changing events, but in the end the planet will remain, and life will eventually find a way to rebuild a brand new ecosystem.

Groudon/Kyogre wouldn't destroy the world, just force the living species to adapt to a new desert/ocean world. Zygarde has no reason to interfere, since life will just continue in a different way.

N and Ghetsis were in no way a threat to the planet or the environment, and neither was Lysandre in the long run.

The meteor is nothing the planet hasn't experienced before (assuming the Pokemon world went through a similar extinction event to get rid of what would became the fossil Pokemon), and hasn't bounced back already.

It's possible that Zygarde, after seeing its planet bounce up and down from all sorts of shit, has decided "why should I care if some human wants to kill 50% of life on the planet/if humans are polluting shit/if another legendary is going crazy, if everything will reset in a few million years anyway?"

Though, again, no excuse for not stepping in against Cyrus, except for the fact Zygarde likely didn't exist inside a crazy Japanese man's head at the time.

>>28634392
reposting more

>>28560981 →
This.
Shit.

Also, Zygarde it had no way of knowing about Cyrus's purpose
He's just a guy who appears, summon Dialga/Palkia and... is defeated 15 minutes later


>>28561153 →
>Zygarde had no way of knowing about Cyrus's purpose
That can be argued, but is heavily reliant on exactly HOW Zygarde can tell if the ecosystem is under threat.

Is it only in tune with stuff like plants and the soil, and can only notice a threat if those are things being threatened? Then no, Cyrus would fly right under his radar since Team Galactic did nothing to affect the environment in any way.

However, if Zygarde is in some way empathic, then Cyrus's experiments on the Lake Trio should have raised a red flag or two on the big guy. GIven that the Lake Trio were literally responsible for freewill, their agony should have been "louder", so to speak, and more noteworthy than the Pokemon used to power Lysandre's death flower.

>>28634347
You can still post your headcanon if you want, you just have to be very careful since timelines, dimensions and maps have led these threads to become major shitfests.

Someone repost this too
>>28568940
>>28569827
>>28569921
>>28569028

>>28634302
In Super you can see the map of the whole world. So no, it doesn't work. The only connection to the main series PMD has is a reference to Mt. Coronet that is never explained.

In PMD's world humans exist, but are supposed to be incredibly rare and almost extinct.

I love these threads. They're the only threads on /vp/ that are filled with fun discussions and multiple paraghraph long posts that are filled with interesting ideas and trivia. Most other threads here are just filled with shitflinging over some random stuff, so this is quite nice.

>>28634270
LEEpsT DoRE holyshit Pokemon don't forget shit.

>>28634270
I don't get it.

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>>28634441

So, question, has it been discussed how the overlap between the genies and the weather trio works?

They may not be exactly the same, but storms and gale winds fucking shit up sound pretty familiar. Are they just minor punks not worth bigger legendarie's time except for Landorus?

>>28634384
>Agreed upon statements that have most of their basis in canon things.
I wish that was the case.

>>28634408
>You can still post your headcanon if you want
It´s what everyone does.

>you just have to be very careful since timelines, dimensions and maps have led these threads to become major shitfests
Only by retards who want to push their headcanon and completely ignore what´s stated in the games.

>>28634552
>Hating a guy just because he disagrees with you despite him posting actual proof based on game content instead of supporting your headcanon.

He´s wrong on the ORAS thing though, since timelines and canon are different things and that post was before ORAS was announced.

>>28634441
For the flower pic, Looker's French name is also Beladonis (Adonis)

>>28634652
Are you here to comment on what's posted rather than just post?

>>28634746
Well, having pokemon lore threads is nice, but discussion should be good, don´t you think?

>>28634687
Heat posting outdated information (like references to real world places), contradictory information, anime canon, and ignoring info that clashes with what he believes to be right with no basis, and treating it as fact rather than theory.

Come on man

>>28634767
So the answer is no. One guy saying discussion is lame and not discussing isn't going to look more appealing to everyone else simply discussing

>>28634792
Or the answer is yes, rather

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>>28634575
I came across this thread earlier this year when we didn't even know the starters yet. This guy somehow immediately made a connection between SM and Colress. I thought it might be interesting so I capped it, I'm glad I did.

>>28634270

Parallel universe.

>>28634792
>utdated information (like references to real world places), contradictory information
At least is shit that´s actually in the games instead of made up. Both are wrong, but one is unarguably preferable.

>anime canon
That pic literally has post saying the anime is not canon.

> and treating it as fact rather than theory.
As everyone else does.

>One guy saying discussion is lame and not discussing isn't going to look more appealing to everyone else simply discussing
Sorry for not supporting your headcanon safespace anon.

>>28634836
Yeah, you aren't here for discussion. Just repeatedly posting a longer version of "this post is major autism" whenever someone makes a post that isn't genwars or waifus.

Were only 30 replies in so I can waste a few on replying to you at least.

>>28634893
I mean that's a book so it would technically be a theory, but if its put in the games then that should mean we should treat it as having some truth

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>>28634024

So the Egg that Arceus hatch from came from a Vortex.

That's a wormhole right?

So, do we consider the Sinnoh folklore on the origin of humankind as truth?
Where does that leave the other animals and plants in the Pokémon world?

>>28634895
>Yeah, you aren't here for discussion.
Yes, I just dont think enforcing your headcanon is discussion.

>Were only 30 replies in so I can waste a few on replying to you at least.
So....you´re not here for discussion and you´re just gonna post a longer version of "this post doesnt want discussion" whenever someone doesnt make a post you like. Ironic, don´t you think?

>>28634832
I remember this thread. It's too bad we didn't have more to work with back then so it died super quickly.

Now we have more material though

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>>28634911

It's right about Uxie, Azelf and Mesprit.

>>28634948
>That's a wormhole right?
Who knows?
>>28634954
>So, do we consider the Sinnoh folklore on the origin of humankind as truth?
Do you have proof it isnt?
So it is.

>Where does that leave the other animals and plants in the Pokémon world?
Pretty sure it´s about the same as IRL after the Universe and Earth were created.

>>28634792
>references to real world places
>outdated
Unless stated otherwise, things likeTiksi Branches, Lightning Americans, and Indian Elephants are still canon. They haven't been retconned.

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>>28634954

Pokémon are not animals.

Pokémon is short for Pocket Monsters.

>>28635045
>Pokémon are not animals.
He never implied that tho.

>>28634993

"Vortex" and "Wormhole" are generally synonymous and used interchangeably in
Likeky in this case

>>28635067

just making sure.

>>28635116
Tell that to the guy asking the question then.

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>>28634948
Eh, it doesn't seem like they're the same to me.

>captcha: select all flowers

>>28635045
>Pokémon are not animals.
Corals are.
If Humans aren't Pokémon, they are almost certainly animals. Which would probably make them more closely related to the plate corals seen in the Marine Tube than primate Pokémon like Infernape.

>>28635151

Before you go against me.

I hope you pay attention to the information in Pokémon platinum right?

>>28634497

Just wait, /vpol/ will find a way to somehow taint this refuge of sanity eventually.

>>28635170
>Humans aren't Pokémon.


Human are Pokémon.

>>28635045
hello richard

>>28635222
Why do they have a different term?
Why can´t you catch humans with poke balls?
Why don´t humans have a type?

And before you mention that DP quote keep in mind that it implies that they werent different before, not now. If they werent now, then that quote would have no place. It would be equivalent to saying that theories of common ancestors imply all living creatures are the literal same species.

>>28635250

Hi.

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>>28635289

did anyone ever try to capture a Human using a Pokéball?

>>28635222
Pokemon can be caught with Pokeballs, humans can't be caught. All Pokemon might share something that connects them, yet differentiates them from humans. Maybe it's a gene humans don't have, which might be the reason they can be caught, can learn many different moves and evolve. After all, pokeballs were made to catch Pokemon and nothing else. They were most likely built to only capture creatures that have this extra gene or power, because only those can be called Pokemon.

>>28635401

did anyone ever try to capture a Human using a Pokéball?

>>28635289
>Why do they have a different term?
Why do not we call ourselves animals often?

>Why can´t you catch humans with poke balls?
Actually that has never been canonically proved. Also, may it be created to not work with a specific pokemon specie

>Why don´t humans have a type?
>who is Type ???

>>28635425
I think someone threw a pokeball at a person in the anime once or twice but I don't know which season or episode exactly and I'm not sure if the anime can be considered canon. It didn't work, by the way.

>>28635045
Even Humans are animals Richard

>>28635007
References to real world places have been slowly removed. I'm fairly certain that outside a few dex entries, the furthest you will find references to locations like South America or Guyana is FRLG.

Even in HGSS, they just call the combined area of Kanto, Johto and Sinnoh "the island' rather than Japan. I dont see why Tiki's cant exist though

>>28635451
>Why do not we call ourselves animals often?
Because we aren´t the same species as other animals, but we do consider us animals. We also don´t call dogs animals, whe often call them dogs.

>Actually that has never been canonically proved.
Why don´t people use them to catch people in-universe then?


>who is Type ???
A failsafe type that has never been stated to be human´s type.

>>28635502
And maybe when they refer to Lt Surge in the PWT.

>>28635451
Type ??? no longer exists as the move with that type is now just Ghost Typed

>>28635502

Pokémon is a Pokémon.

a Animal is a Animal.

You know by that Pokémon are not animals.

>>28635493

I was talking about core-series of Pokémon.

The core-series video games are the ultimate canon.

>>28635045
So you mean that regular animals exist in the Pokeworld?

>>28635794
"Pokemon are not animals" doesnt mean "there are animals in the pokemon world though".
That´d be like saying pokemon arent digimon and inferring digimon exist in the pokemon world.

>>28635520
>failsafe type
??? type is "a type yet unknown", that's why Shadow moves are ??? type in games where Shadow type is unknown.
That has not yet established a type for humans does not mean they haven't it. Until then they are ??? type, because it's unknown, like eggs

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>>28635579
>eggs

>>28635715
Shut the fuck up, Richard.

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>>28635794

Yes and why do you labelle them "regular animals" instead of animals?!

>>28635493
>>28635736
Found it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPYByk5UtbU
It's around minute 11. Ash tells Charmander to use flamethrower and then throws a pokeball because he thinks there's a Pokemon, but the ball just hits Jessie in the face. She doesn't get caught. Since we've never heard of a human getting caught in a pokeball in the main series games I guess they work the same as in the anime. Humans can't be caught.

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>>28635970

Inaccurate information.

>>28636051

Anime series is a different continuum.

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>>28635151

Vortex to the Distortion World.

>>28635970
>never refer to Pocket Monsters as "monsters"

>>28636108
Did you even read the post?
>Since we've never heard of a human getting caught in a pokeball in the main series games I guess they work the same as in the anime.
If humans can't be caught in the anime why should you be able to catch them in the main series? That doesn't make any sense, now does it?

>>28635970
>>28636017
>>28636060
Conflicting. Not inaccurate.
Also, the book is official.

>>28635736
According to the core series, Pokémon can be stored in a computer.
It seems pretty unlikely humans can be stored in a computer, because we have no evidence humans can be converted into energy like Pokémon.

>>28635913
>Until then they are ??? type
Are trees ???-type too?

>>28636308

That Book is inaccurate.

>>28636187

Anime series is a different continuum.

>>28636383
Conflicting.

>>28636404

It's inaccurate and cannot be trusted.

>>28636321

Has it ever been confirm that Human can't be capture in Pokéball?

>>28636464
The lack of trainers using humans as Pokémon seems to imply such a thing.

>>28636438
The other one is also inaccurate when compared to this, which is as official as everything in the games is. It's dumb that they make mistake like this, but it's up to them to decide which one is the accurate one and which one isn't, regardless of what they've said in the past.

>>28636402
richard you're a fucking idiot holy shit

>>28636496

Did anyone ever try to capture a Human using a Pokéball?

>>28636520

You are stupid.

Anime series is inaccurate.

>>28636512

In the information in the games can be trusted.


That Book cannot be trusted.

>>28636576
The anime is accurate to the anime's universe.

>>28636512
>>28636520
Just stop replying to him, this isn't gonna go anywhere. You're arguing against a wall. He's not gonna accept your arguments or evidence if he doesn't agree with them. That's not how discussion works, so you might as well stop talking to him and wait for the smart people to arrive so we can have an actual discussion.

>>28636634

We're talking about core-series.
Not the anime.

>>28635913
>??? type is "a type yet unknown"
Ghost was unknown in Gen 2?

>That has not yet established a type for humans does not mean they haven't it.
Nigga, burden of proof of humans having a type is still on you.

> because it's unknown, like eggs
You mean the eggs of pokemon?

>>28636705
>so you might as well stop talking to him and wait for the smart people to arrive so we can have an actual discussion
>OneEnternityLater.jpg

>>28634270
that's nothing
There's no "deepest lore" if there is no strong indication as to what it is about, just random conspiracy nutcase shit

Gathered Information from last thread: (These are direct quotes from the games.)
>All lives
>touch other
>lives to create
>something
>anew and alive
The Solaceon Ruins after catching all Unown

>Our friends look
>up and heartily
>congratulate us
The Unown Report after catching all Unown
>A strange sound is coming from UNOWN...
>UNOWN started spinning around in circles.
>UNOWN is growling in a way that sounds almost like speech...
>Your Pokémon isn’t moving.
>Your Pokémon seems to be singing something?
Unown when brought to the Ruins of Alph

>ARCEUS looked up at the sky and shouted loudly!
>DIALGA gathered itself up and let out a huge roar!
>PALKIA’s body shook with a great roar!
Arceus, Palkia and Dialga when brought to the Sinjoh Ruins

>But that was not it. A long time ago... people came from Sinnoh to live here.
>They must have built a temple here while longing for home. That's why we call these theSinjoh Ruins...
>According to an ancient document, time, space, and antimatter, or what combined we call the world, shall be born whenArceusstands on theMystri Stage.
>This is where one might say, "The lead enters theMystri Stageat last." All my study of ruins and Pokémon mythology in Sinnoh may have been to bring you up on this stage here today...
>Depicted on theMystri Stageare the Pokémon that shaped this world. The circle in the middle isArceus, the origin of it all...
Cynthia at the Sinjoh-Ruins

>The three living things wished, and
>from them, spirit came to be.
>The world created, the Original One
>took to unyielding sleep...
Canalave Library

>>28636991 (additional information and possible interpretations.)

>May I say one last bit? A long time ago, I wonder what sort of person painted this?
>Dialga's Roar of Time...Palkia's Spacial Rend...
>To the people back then, those Pokémon really must have appeared to rule over time and space.
>Seeing them must have shaken the people to their very core.
>This painting represents those feelings of awe, wonder, and everything else.
>It passed that memory to countless people, eventually becoming a myth...
Cynthia in the ruins of Solaceon Town

>The Original One breathed alone before the universe came.
>When the universe was created, its shards became this Plate.
>The power of defeated giants infuses this Plate.
The Hiker on one of the plates

Arceus is only ever mentioned by three NPCs: Cynthia, the Hiker and the Scientist at the Ruins of Alph.
The people who used to live together with the Unown are all dead.
Sinjoh is between Sinnoh and Jotho. It‘s exact location is unknown.
Sinjoh is a place where people from both Sinnoh and Jotho gathered to worship Arceus.

Things we don't know for sure:
Arceus is long forgotten, but Dialga and Palkia are still worshipped in the Sinnoh region and mentioned a few times by NPCs.
Arceus must have at least once created Dialga, Palkia or Giratina whith humans watching it.
We don‘t know if Arceus is native to Sinnoh.

Possible interpretations:
It might have left Sinjoh for the Spear Pillar for reasons unknown.
The Mystri stage might be the key to Arceus‘s full power and might the place where it hatched from an egg.
It „sleeping“ is potentially a metaphor for being in a state where it doesn‘t have access to all of it‘s power.

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>>28634948
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archeus
More likely a portal from the higher dimension that the true Arceus inhabits. The theory follows that the Arceus you obtain in game is merely the avatar of the one true Pokegod. Pokejesus, if you will. Could The Aether foundations dimensional experiments be trying to gain access to Arceus' God dimension, only to stumble upon and disturb the UB dimension instead?

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>>28637067

>true Arceus?
Are you talking about the original Spirit?

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>>28637067

Are you talking about the original Spirit before It become a Pokémon?

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>>28637126
Could be. That would fit in with Alchemy and mysticism symbology. The idea being that "God", a being on a higher dimensional plane, would be, for lack of a better term, too big to fit entirely into a lower dimension. So the original spirit (what God is called in mysticism) comes into a lower plane via egg through a vortex, and creates the universe. People cannot distinguish between Arceus and the original spirit and, from a certain point of view, they are the same being.

>>28637247
>that pic
Humans are as much as Arceus creations as the pokemon.

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>>28637340

Arceus didn't create everything.

>>28637394
Then it didnt create pokemon.

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>>28637340

Arceus did not create everything.

>>28637418
>>28637414

>>28637394
>>28637418
Richard that's not proof of them not being created by Arceus. They obviously were.

>>28637459

I doubt that.

>>28637459
i though arceus only created the following:
dialga
palkia
giratina
uxie
mesprit
azelf
mew
unown (as extensions of itself)

the rest either evolved from mew, were created by other pokemon or formed magically.

>>28636991
>>28637059
>The power of defeated giants infuses this Plate
What?

Also, what exactly are the Plates and Shards, come to think of it?

>>28637394
>>28637418
It made the pokemon that made the world. Arceus didnt make TIme or Space either, it made the embodiments of them with Palkia and Dialga.

>>28637247
>Plato and Aristotle taught that the stars were composed of a type of matter different from the four earthly elements - a fifth, ethereal element or quintessence. In the "astral mysticism" of the classical world the human psyche was composed of the same material, thus accounting for the influence of the stars upon human affairs. In his commentaries on Plato's Timaeus, Proclus wrote;

>Man is a little world (mikros cosmos). For, just like the Whole, he possesses both mind and reason, both a divine and a mortal body. He is also divided up according to the universe. It is for this reason, you know, that some are accustomed to say that his consciousness corresponds with the nature of the fixed stars, his reason in its contemplative aspect with Saturn and in its social aspect with Jupiter, (and) as to his irrational part, the passionate nature with Mars, the eloquent with Mercury, the appetitive with Venus, the sensitive with the Sun and the vegetative with the Moon.

Mercury + Venus + Mars + Jupiter + Saturn + Sun + Moon = universe

>>28634319
>>28634377
universe + man + woman = Azoth = God essence

>>28637649
We know its related to Unown, but not it created them. And no relation to Mew either.

>>28637681
>It made the pokemon that made the world.
It really depends on whether we´re going by actual creationism(Arceus created the universe, so everything in it was created by it) or american´s idea of creationism(where Arceus only created the universe, not everything).

Pokemon lore-wise it doesnt really matter since both sides here seem to know how it is.

>>28636438
Official and your word is not more trusting.

>>28637728
>We know its related to Unown, but not it created them.
they are the 1000 arms
>And no relation to Mew either.
then where the fuck did mew come from

>>28637762
>they are the 1000 arms
sauce on that? Not saying its fake, but I´m curious.
>then where the fuck did mew come from
We dont know. Maybe Arceus, but we dont have an explicit statement. People say Arceus because it makes sense.

>>28636893
Well obviously.

It's just saying that say, any old nutjob in SM who is a medium or fortune teller could have a Xatu for a Pokemon that sees of these beasts or whatever the hell they wanna do just for a nod to it's lore

>>28637805
That's still not a nod to its lore. It's like saying Zubats being found in caves is the deepest lore.

>>28637059
>>28637681
>The power of defeated giants infuses this Plate
Does anyone here remember that author that tried to assign elemental properties to lovecraftian horrors? Like, Cthulhu was water, Hastur was wind, etc?

Elder Gods/Great Old Ones legendaries that existed at the same time as Arceus, defeated at the very birth of the universe by the Original Spirit, and whose power was then infused into the Plates?

>>28637834
How would a Xatu being acknowledged as seeing into the future or other dimensions of beasts not be a nod to it's lore about how it can see into the future and comes from other dimensions?

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>>28637762

I'm more interested in where that egg come from?

What's on the other side of that Vortex?

>>28637762
The Unown could have come into existence along with arceus at the same time.
It could also be that Arceus and the Unown once were one being and after the creation of our universe they were split apart.

"The Mystri stage might be the key to Arceus‘s full power and might the place where it hatched from an egg."
It is there where Arceus creates the Dimenional eggs along with the Unown.
The stage could have possibly existed beforre Arceus did.

Someone here mentioned the "original one". Maybe it created the stage and put the egg onto it from another dimension.

>>28637793
>sauce on that? Not saying its fake, but I´m curious.
i don't have an official direct confirmation, but it's fairly obvious. unown, while pathetically weak on their own, have an immense amount of power that can bend timespace (in the anime at least) and cause a lot of interference to radiowaves. a huge amount of them appear when arceus creates an egg at sinjoh ruins.

>>28637878
By your own logic, bats being found in caves is deepest lore. Fish being caught by rods in rivers is deepest lore.

>>28637762
>they are the 1000 arms
That's a very good explanation as to what the fuck the Unowns are, but still we need a link or confirmation

Remember that Unown was introduced in gen2 when they had no plans on continuing pokemon

>>28637881
>What's on the other side of that Vortex?
Us, Game Freak, our universe.

>>28637892
Why should we care if you have official information or not when you don't even believe official information?

>but it's fairly obvious
>anime references that you don't even agree with

>>28637914

In lore

>>28637878
Natu can only found in the Ruins of Alph and the Ruin Valley by regular means (apart from swarms).

>>28637892
So no sauce?

>>28637642

Stop pretending to be me

>>28637973
Stop being you.

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>>28637887

I doubt that.

>>28637901
Why would the Pokedex ake you doubt it?
According to myth Arceus used the Unown as it's "arms" but it created teh dimension trrio first so it couldn't have created Unown beforehand.

>>28637898
Not him, but you are a dense fucker anon.
Xatu´s lore wasnt referenced outside the dex before SM, if that unlikely scenario happens then yeah, it will be a nod since the only previous source was the dex.

>>28637932
I´m joking anon,we don´t know and probably never will. Meta references like that did happen in other media tho, so if it were true, it would also be in lore.

>>28637908
>Remember that Unown was introduced in gen2 when they had no plans on continuing pokemon
this is true, however, regigigas was introduced in gen 4, so it isn't as if cross-generational lore cannot exist.

>>28637942
>So no sauce?
it's a theory. which is what this topic is all about.

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>>28637995

Arceus was alone when it created the Universe.

>>28637898
How?
A fish Pokemon being found in a lake and swimming is par the course for a fish

Heatran being fond in Volcanoes is par the course for Heatran, but as that thing is specific to Heatran, it is a part of it's own specific lore. The fact that every time we see it, it's in volcanoes, is them being consistent with that.

Xerenas has lore related to being related to the concept of life (or something) but this has not actually been referenced in the games, unlike Heatran's lore doing so.

Xatu is said to have powers to see in the future and past, but this hasnt been demonstrated. If it is, it's lore will be referenced.

I havent made a single "deepest lore" thing yet it is in every response to my posts you've done so far, because whatever I suppose? Reply with actual statements for me to have my opinions changed by, instead of telling me what I apparently mean

>>28638011
Xatu´s lore wasnt referenced outside the dex before SM, if that unlikely scenario happens then yeah, it will be a nod since the only previous source was the dex.
Okay, but you're not understanding that that's still not a nod to lore. Wheres the connection? One side of the argument is saying it's not lore, the other side of the argument is going "what is Xatu was Absol but with trainers"

>>28635425

Try catching a trainers Pokemon. At least in gen 1. Theu jump in front of it.

Also pretty sure the dppt line meant to say human and Pokemon were once equals.

>>28637681
>What?
I originally thought that Arceus came from a universe that died and was the last survivor. That is just my headcanon, of course.

>Also, what exactly are the Plates and Shards, come to think of it?
The plates are the ones that give Arceus it's typing.
Maybe connection to Unown? The only learn hidden power which has it's type based on the IVs, the "innate power" of a Unown.

>>28638024
unown aren't individual life forms. they are like psychic ants or bees, relaying a message and doing what the main body, arceus, commands.

>>28638089
Unown are not Arceus 1,000 arms.

Arceus was alone when it created the Universe.

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>>28638024
>>28637987
>Richard saved multiple of the same image to use them multiple times instead of just replying to himself
Why is this funny to me?

>>28638048
>a fish Pokemon being found in a lake and swimming is par the course for a fish
Exactly. Xatu seeing bad things is par the course for Xatu.

>>28638024
HGSS comes after Pt, so if it brings fourth previously unknown information, then that's the one that should be followed Richard

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>>28638096
>unown aren't individual life forms

I doubt that.

>>28638020
>it's a theory. which is what this topic is all about.
No, it´s about lore in general. If you have a theory, then say its a theory, dont claim it as fact.

>>28638070
>that's still not a nod to lore
How´s not referencing a part of the lore of a pokemon not a nod to it. Do you even know what a lore is?

>>28638024
Unown are from their own dimension tho

>>28638020
The difference is that the regis were introduced on gen3 so it makes sense for GF to have planned ahead or whatnot
You can't say that in gen2 when they were about to end the series

>>28638133

No. Arceus was alone when it created the Universe

>>28638135
>there are being with unknown potentials
>therefore, Unown are individual beings
I mean I dont agree with the anon you´re arguing against but come on.

>>28638146
sauce?

>>28638133
How does HG/SS come after Pt when Pt references the Red Gyarados?

>>28638146

In the Anime series?

Yes.


In the core-series?

Not Known

>>28638168

Arceus was alone when it created the Universe.

There was no Unown there.

>>28638114
The Unown don't really breath you know?
Also, they could have been a singular being, you know? And when Arceus "fell asleep", meaning it lost access to it's limitless power and Arceus and Unown became seperate entities.
Like I mentioned: Only at the Mystri Stage it connects with the Unown.

I have this suspicion that Unown predate Arceus

>>28638161
This is what I mean. This isnt a discussion where both people bring fourth their points and help convince each other of their different viewpoints, but a one sided conversation where the other person repeats the same statements 50 times, even if we've long moved past it. This is why I dont like when Richard enters the thread. Like >>28638191. This post is nothing but thread bloat.

>>28638173
HGSS was released after Pt, so any additions it makes to the lore are the most up to date when looking at the two

>>28638122
Yes, but if it's par for the course, but hasnt been seen a single time, then when it has been seen or mentioned, it will be them acknowledging what was previously stated. What is not there to get in that?

>>28638138
>dont claim it as fact.
I didn't.

>>28638147
Okay, maybe it wasn't a good comparison, but you understand what i mean right? before arceus came along, unown were just mysterious beings that had some strange power in large concentrations. arceus is the context, much like how regigigas gives context to the other regis.

>>28638193

They are not Arceus 1,000 arms.

>>28638024
My original statement also contained Arceus and Unown being a single pokemon (or whatever) and that they fell apart after the creation of the world.
It being alone could still mean that the Mystri Stage existed prior to it.

>>28638243
>What is not there to get in that?
It's not lore.

Kakuna's Gen I Pokedex entry says it can only use Harden but if a Kakuna uses Harden it's not lore.

>>28638243

Talking about the Unown being Arceus 1,000 arms, cause that's wrong.

>>28638347

No. Arceus was alone when it created the Universe.

Unown are not Arceus.

They were not around when Arceus created the Universe.

>>28638316
Did you even read that post?
I did not say that Unown were it's arms but instead were one being.

>>28638297
What? Each game is canon, so if a newer game makes an addition to something previously stated, then it can only be assumed that it is true. Like Sea Spirit's Den where the legendary birds are referencing Lugia, with the implication that Lugia indeed has some reign over them. That came in a game later than FRLG, so even though FRLG didnt say so, it can still be believed as true.

Just as an example.

>>28638348
So what is lore?

>>28638377
So what are they then? His teeth?

>>28638377

Unown are not Arceus.

>>28638392

Arceus gender is unknown.

>>28638406
I don't know what kind of women you're into but all genders at least originally have teeth.

>>28638392
They were one being. They just seperated eventually. That is my theory.

>>28638394
>>28638406
Please stop it, Richard.

UNOWN is the programming language for the Pokemon Universe.

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>>28638406
>>28638394
>>28638316
>>28638161
God fucking dammit Richard. There are two types of people. Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data

>>28638438
http://www.pokemon.com/us/pokedex/arceus


It's gender is listed as "Unknown"

>>28638478
Who's the other kind?

>>28638478

Arceus was alone when it created the Universe.

Facts are facts.

>>28638245
You are the one who is not getting what I am saying.When Unown was in the game, even the idea of Arceus did not exist since they were not planning on realeasing other games, thus introducing Arceus. So by the time the Unown existed they had something else in mind for them.

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>>28638478
>>28638587

>>28638610
Not him, but that doesnt meaning anything. What they had planned for the Unown in Generation 2 doesnt change what they do with Unown now. And between the Asure Flute music being related to the Unown signal, Arceus using Unown at the Sinjoh event, and the dex entries talking about the Unown's growing power the more there are, it is clear that they are very related now

>>28638610
yes, i understand that. it would be absurd for me to suggest that they planned this in gen 2.
what i am saying is that when gen 4 came about, unown were revealed to be related to arceus in some way. we saw that in sinjoh ruins. i am proposing that they are the 1000 arms of arceus. it makes perfect sense.

>>28638569
And what does that have to do with teeth?

Before you answer, just know that I don't give a fuck what's you say about anything other than teeth. That's my question.

Not sure if it's the right thread but anyone got that large picture that suggests Colress will be in SM? I forgot to save it

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>>28638464

UNOWN are nothing more than Symbol Pokémon.

They are not meant to be Arceus 1,000 arms.

Unown being Arceus 1,000 arms nothing more than fan fiction.

Don't do it guys. I know it's tempting. Don't give in. Don't reply.

>>28638587
In threads like these, they are called "Richard"

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>>28638712

The posted image speaks for me.

>>28638783
Why do Unown appear when Arceus creates the egg in the HGSS event?

>>28638849
UNOWN ≠ Arceus 1,000

>>28638783
>>28638882
you cannot deny the relation between arceus and unown, richard.

So, Arceus and the Unown possibly being one at some point is fanfiction?
Do you have any other idea why the Unown are featured in the creation of the egg?
There are no Pikachu, Marill or other generic Pokemon.
There is Arceus and the Unown.
Obviously Arceus gains access to the power of the Unown on the Mystri Stage which possibly was already there before Arceus. This is such a no-brainer GF could just easily confirm that this is the origin of the Unown and it would take less than two lines to explain why.

I am very open to other possible ideas but I haven't seen such yet. At least from your side, Richard.

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>>28638849

UNOWN are Symbol Pokémon.

>>28638882
Please just stop it, Richard. We don't want you here, go help your mother prepare lunch.

>>28638944

Because of the People of sinnoh and johto

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>>28638976

I know you don't.

>>28638988

Two regions that are very linked lore-wise as of HGSS. Arguably the two are quite close too.

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>>28639046
According to Cynthia and a Hiker in the cabin, the Sinjoh Ruins are the remains of a temple created hundreds of years ago by two groups of humans: one who had come from Sinnoh, and another who had hailed from Johto, or specifically the Ruins of Alph. Because of this, the ruins contain elements of both the Spear Pillar and the Ruins of Alph, as a sign of the blending of the two cultures. It is unknown what brought the two clans together to build a temple for Arceus.

>>28638783
You should at least try to know a thing or two about what you are talking about. You are only going off of Pokedex entries and things people say as if you've never even played the games.

>>28638817
>can't answer the question

Thanks for showing you can't have a discussion, just burp out nonsense that you can't even defend.

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>>28639039
welp time to abandon thread

>>28639163

UNOWN being Arceus 1,000 is purely speculation.

>>28639192

You disappointed me.

>>28639213
Yes, but they is a lot more to them then what you're going on about.

>source: everything involving Unown other than Pokedex entries

>>28639236
And? Not like anyone gives a fuck about you.

>>28639239

You should never confuse speculation for facts.

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>>28639264

Funny.

>>28639298
Prove one person here does.

Oh wait, you can't back anything up because you're an epim trill

>>28639270
Just because it happens outside of a one sentence description of a Pokemon does not mean it isn't a fact that is happens in the games, anime, etc.

So, why is it off the table that Unown could be Arceus "1,000 arms"?
We know for a fact that Arceus must have once created an egg while humans were watching. As Cynthia says, it was documented in an ancient script.
The Unown appearing at the Mystri Stage could always happen and people could have interpreted it them as Arceus 1,000 arms.
This is such a no-brainer.

I put all necessary information in these two posts.
>>28636991
>>28637059

If anyone wants to add anything, go ahead.

>>28639370

It's not a fact. Because. Arceus was alone when it created the Universe.

>>28639496
That has nothing to do with what I'm talking about.

>>28639518

What are You talking about?

>>28639496
why did unown appear at the sinjoh ruins event?

>>28639547
I agreed with you about that here >>28639239
where I clearly said "yes". My point is that there is more to the Unown than what you are claiming. Learn how to read, mate.

It would at least explain the story behind the thousand arms. People saw the Unown and didn't know what they were.

But I am sure Arceus being alone when it created the universe means that it couldn't possibly connect with the Unown afterwards when it was worshipped by humans.

>>28639587
>But I am sure Arceus being alone when it created the universe means that it couldn't possibly connect with the Unown afterwards when it was worshipped by humans.
Why not?

>>28639609
I meant this.
>>28639213
>>28638882
>>28638783
>>28638594
>>28638394
>>28638375
>>28638358
>>28639496
And possibly more.
Ugh, I'd rather go back to Red being 31 than this BS.
I already put every evidence in those two posts up there.

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>>28639587

Arceus was sleeping after Earth was created.

we could just stop replying to richard

>>28639701
Something just being speculation does not make it any more right than wrong. You have no point.

>>28639715
Sleeping as a metaphor. Or why is it awake at the Sinjoh Ruins?
You also think that Palkia and Dialga just clapped their hands together and said "Creation of space/time" three times? Because according to that text they "made a wish".

>>28639742
It's a hypothesis based on the fact that humans must have witnessed Arceus true power at least once and the Unown appearing during the egg's creation.
Only at the Mystri Stage!

>>28639866
It isn't any more right than wrong. You aren't any more right than wrong. They aren't any more right than wrong. It is speculation.

>>28639866

It's not metaphor.
It's a fact.

>>28639553

the ruins contain elements of both the Spear Pillar and the Ruins of Alph.

Holy fuck Richard. You are such a pathetic manchild. You're probably sitting in your mother's basement right now, glued to your pc 24/7. You most likely haven't left that room for weeks because no matter what kind of thread you're in, you never leave until it hits page 10. Sitting there in your dirty, old chair and typing three word sentences in response to everything. No one can even fully understand what you're saying because your english is worse than that of a four year old child with brain damage, you little cunt. This site requires basic knowledge of the english language, yet you ignore this and continue to annoy every single user on this board. Holy hell, how retarded can someone be? Not only do you sound like some mentally ill toddler, you emit the intelligence of a fucking slice of moldy bread. Just reading your "sentences" makes me want to turn off my computer because simply reading a single letter of what you type makes me feel like I'm slowly losing brain cells one by one. You're a waste of space and oxygen. Your mother thinks the same for sure. She's probably suicidal because her son is such a huge failure of a human. You make me want to vomit. If I ever saw your face I probably would. You are such an incompetent piece of shit, even a slice of bread can do more productive stuff than you, because it can at least rot. You are such an unnecessary being, no one would want to bury you, not even your mother, because that would be considered
environmental pollution. You should just be thrown into the sun and die a lonely, painful death there. Youd' die lonely anyway. No one wants to fuck that greasy body let alone look at it. That's good, you'll never have any children. The world doesn't need more of your kind. Even one of you is too much already. No one wants you and no one likes you. You'd be better off dead, at least you can burn in the flames of hell for eternity, just like you deserve. Though that would still be just a small punishment.

>>28639931
is this a new copypasta

>>28639987
I don't see why not. He has a point, I've shut you up twice ITT so far.

>>28639931
new pasta. fucking saved.

>>28639880
It is a hypothesis. I never claimed it was wrong.

>>28639890
So, then it should be easy for you to answer this one simple question:
Why is it awake now?

>>28640022
>I never claimed it was wrong.
Yes, you have. Multiple times.

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>>28639931

do Our existence even matter?

Do you know small you are to the possibly infinite Universe?

We nothing more than leftovers from dying stars and etc.

>>28640022
Oops, meant to say "right". My bad.

>>28640022

How do you know it's awake now?

>>28640008
I'm not Richard though, I don't put unnecessary spaces between my sentences and I don't type like a third grader either.

>>28639890
>>28640090
According to _you_ it must have been asleep after it created the universe an could not have created the eggs on the Mystri Stage when other humans were watching it in ancient times.

>>28640051
lmao did he actually respond to the fucking copypasta? It's not proper english either, jesus christ that's surprisingly hilarious.

I assume we should ditch the Arceus discussion.
Arceus was alone when it created the universe anyway and is asleep currently so there is no arguing about it's connection to the Unown. There just isn't any, get over it.
Why should we consider anything that isn't explicitly stated in the games?

>>28640173

I ask you do our existence even really matter?

>>28640454

the ruins contain elements of both the Spear Pillar and the Ruins of Alph.

That's their only connection.

>>28640127
>>28640135
Still waiting for an answer, btw.
So you are saying Arceus is currently asleep and the events in Sinjoh never happened?

>>28638882
>>28638948
Yeah, I agree with you on both of these. Can you answer my question now? Why do Unown appear when Arceus creates the egg in the HGSS event?

>>28640485
>>28640518
At least answer everything in one post, you imbecile. Anyone can tell that you are the exact same person. Your posts aren't even one and a half minute apart from each.

>>28634494
We know that Pokemon came from space in a meteorite that fell into what is today Mt Moon. Humans actually seem to know quite a bit about that, but it's not dicussed much with the players as its not relevant. I think that the pokemon homeworld is the PMD world and that there have been human expeditions to it. Humans are rare there not because they're extinct, but because astronauts only how up once in a blue moon.

>>28640614

I do that, because. I don't like answering everything.

I leave some things unanswered.
Because. They are easy to find out by yourself.

>>28640454
>>28640518
Arceus literally recreates Dialga/palkia/Giratina using Unowns. Of course there is a connection.

>>28640635
That sounds like a nice headcanon, but I think there are some problems to it. Like, RT seems to imply that humans actually stopped at some point since it says one of the friend areas has been abandoned by humans, and I assume they would bring Pokéballs to catch them. That and, well, wouldn't Pokémon in the human world be able to talk with each other (they don't seem to be able to do so in the way they do it in PMD) and build facilities and stuff?

>>28640669
Haha, stop it Richard, please.

>I don't like answering everything.
>Still answers to both posts.
>Doesn't unterstand that I meant putting both answers in one single post rather than answering each in an individual post.

Please go pollute the waifu threads with your nonsense. That should be an appropriate level of autism for you.

>>28640735
Well, they do seem able to communicate, wasn't the player Grovyle's trainer before being turned into a Pokemon in explorers? And astronauts might not be able to bring pokemon with them on their journey, depending on the specifics of how they travel though space.

>>28638245
>I didn't.
>>28637762
>they are the 1000 arms
You should have said that you think they are the 1000 arms.

>>28640730

Nah. Arceus create them using Nothing.

>>28640741
That fucker is so full of himself, if I ever wanted to kill myself I'd just have to jump from his ego to his niveau.

>>28640904
okay

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>>28640923

>>28640888
>Well, they do seem able to communicate
Yes, but not to the extent they do in PMD.

>wasn't the player Grovyle's trainer before being turned into a Pokemon in explorers?
Nope, it's just said to be their partner.

>>28638391
>Each game is canon
No.
Your example is right, though, but it doesnt prove each game is canon.

>>28638947
>So, Arceus and the Unown possibly being one at some point is fanfiction?
We have no statement on the matter.

>Do you have any other idea why the Unown are featured in the creation of the egg?
Who knows? Why does the answer HAVE to be your headcanon?

>his is such a no-brainer GF could just easily confirm that this is the origin of the Unown and it would take less than two lines to explain why.
Did they do so? You need to learn to accept that you can´t state what GF didn´t.

I think the Unowns aren't and weren't part of Arceus. Rather Arceus was born of them, they are the primordial void's inhabitants.

>>28640981
>We have no statement on the matter.
It was meant to combine the idea of the original one being both alone and still using Unown as it's 1,000 arms. I never claimed my personal ideas were fact. It was what seemed most likely to me after putting together all the evidence in those two long posts up there.
Please share your own ideas on the matter, but I guess there will still be one person that will say it is wrong.

>Did they do so? You need to learn to accept that you can´t state what GF didn´t.
I said it was simple idea that could be explained in a few lines. It was meant to explain why the Unown could be given an additional function after their initial appearance in Gen 2.
Jesus Christ, do you even read a post actually? Do you just see the words and rearrange them?

>>28641037
That was also an idea proposed in the last thread. But you know the answer.
>because

>>28640730
That was ironic.

>>28641037
That seems likely, actually. So I guess the stage is the gate to their own dimension or something like that?

>>28640981
Yes each game is canon and newer games' info update the older ones.

Which can be scaled up to a whole game too. HGSS clarifies what happens in Johto entirely, so it replaces GSC. Before HGSS existed, GSC was canon

>>28639726

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>>28640923
HAHAHAHA

OH FUCK

>>28642061


Stop lying.

赤緑≒RS→金銀≒DPPt→BW→BW2≒XY

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>>28642673
>timeline post, AND Richard post

Good lord

>wake up
>new thread
>250+ post
>hell yeah, I can't wait to see the discussio-
>Richard has raped the thread
Oh.

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I'm gonna go ahead and guess you weren't very good at these at a child, Richard.

>>28645325
kek

>>28645325
lies.

so brainwash.

pokedex is canon.

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Did ANYONE read the OP?

>>28645774
So are the games. The games are more than pokedex entries. Play the games

>>28647184
Not everyone gets your dank memes, jabroni.

BAZICUASH!

The "Z" imagery in SM (Zygarde, Z moves, all the gotdamn zigzag teeth) makes me think of parallel dimensions connected at the end of one and the beginning of another...

>>28647357
I literally screenshotted the OP.

>>28647429
>Meaningless babbling in the OP becomes meaningful when screenshotted

>>28647426
also, X being a sign of unions/fusion and Y of divergence (or convergence)

>>28647184
I always reply to Richard so that I can learn the way he thinks and imitate him. This way, I'll be able to Richard the thread up even when he sleeps.

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That can't be an one man army.
I mean come on, you have made Richard so popular that we have at least 5 copycats in this fucking thread...

>>28647510
Explain your reasoning here

>>28647982
One question. Why?

>>28649482
4chan. People don't come here for any reason but to masturbate and argue.

>>28649718
Head back to /b/, man. These threads were created for speculative debate and friendly conversation. There's no reason for anyone to stir up arguments based on the denial of another's interpretation of the games' timeline.

>>28649926
Lurk more. I haven't been on /b/ in 8 years.

>>28650086
Then maybe you should check it. Its community is definitely more your speed.

>>28649482
That was a joke.

>>28649718
If by "people" you mean normalfags who heard about it on Facebook and by "here" you mean the most popular boards, then yes, you're right.

>>28650156
Anon from >>28649482 & >>28649926
Sorry, thought you and >>28649718 were the same guy.

>>28650150
Do you have a reading problem or something? Are you new? I'm not even this guy >>28647982 so wtf is your issue? I'm not wrong with my response here, >>28649718 and if you think otherwise, lurk more.

>>28650247
But you are wrong. Have you never been to good boards/generals?

>>28634024
So I have a question, can anyone explain to me why Steven freaked out in the ruins in HGSS? It had to do with Genesect and I was always so confused by it

>>28648447
X is an intersection, two lines meeting at the center. Life, embodied by Xerneas, is the product of two things meeting, like seed and egg. Also, the X continues on unimpeded in each direction, endless like the cycle of life.
Y, depending on if you start from the bottom or the tops, is either a rising force that splits apart or a clash of forces coming together and falling. Yveltal represents destruction, like that of the war, which divided Pokemon into opposing sides, then returned both to the earth when most were wiped out.

The leaked Robinhoot design also wears an X on its chest, where the Heart Chakra is (also representing life) and it's lush with leafy feathers, very foresty. Even more of a reach, but a Y looks a little like a human pubis, the bottom of which is where the red Root Chakra lies, representing potential power and carnality. I bring up chakras because I think the other two Alola starter designs (esp the leaked final evos) reference the chakras which correspond to their respective colors. I've seen other people mention that the box legendaries are also chakra references, Solar Plexus (Solgaleo obviously) and either Eye or Crown for Lunala. Doesn't seem that far-fetched considering all the other magical/occult references in Sun and Moon

>>28650460
Uhh, I consider myself an expert on Pokémon Lore, and I have no clue what you are talking about. Steven has nothing to do with Genesect, which didn't even exist back in HG/SS. And Steven doesn't appear in the Ruins of Alph. (Embedded Tower, maybe, I'll have to double check that)

>>28650544
It may have been embedded tower, I haven't played in a long time. I think he makes a reference to it, because I just remember him freaking out over something.

>>28650600
Give me a little bit to go through what happens with that. He was probably just surprised to discover that the Hoenn Legends have a secret history in Johto

Just in case anyone missed this, this article pretty much summarizes the links between the lores of Gens VI and VII. Don't be deterred by the premise, it's a lot more than it initially seems:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rebis