Warhammer 40,000 general

Epubs are shit. SHIT.

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FIrst for the machine god

>>50643838
Not an argument.

>>50643837
Reading comprehension anon. They're the same as Orks in the sense of all of them being Cyborgs and using a bunch of robots for war. The difference being that most Ork models actually look good, while AdMech troops and walkers are the result of trying to mix a bunch of different things together and ending up with a nonsensical mess.

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ORKS

1. An Initiative increase across the board. Boyz are now I3, Nobz are now I4, and Warbosses are now I5.

2. Army-wide Furious Charge.

3. A Ballistic Skill increase across the board. Boyz are now BS3, Nobz are now BS4, and Warbosses are now BS5.

4. Choppas are now AP4. Big Choppas are now AP3.

5. A Toughness increase across the board. Boyz are now T4, Nobz are now T5, and Warbosses are now T6.

6. A Leadership increase across the board. Boyz are now LD8, Nobz are now LD9, and Warbosses are now LD10.

7. Army-wide Feel No Pain 6+. This can be improved with Wargear and Painboyz up to a maximum of 4+.

8. Painboyz and Mekboyz are Elite choices. You may take up to 3 of each type as a single Elites choice, and you may distribute them as Independent Characters.

9. Mekboyz now have access to Kustom Force Fields. A Kustom Force Field grants a 4+ Cover Save to all models completely within 18 inches, including vehicles.

10. A Waaaaagh may be called once per game, and grants all Orks in your army Fearless for that turn. Calling a Waaaaagh also allows all Orks in your army the ability to reroll their Charge distance for that turn.

11. Characters now have access to non-Mega Armour wargear that grants a 2+ armour save, 1 per army.

12. Characters now have access to non-Mega Armour wargear that grants a 3+ invulnerable save, 1 per army.

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>>50644009

>>50644023
>I can't justify my shit taste
Noted.

>Traitor legions gives a swath of buffs to every chaos legion
>most are still pretty bad
>Thousand Sons get six new plastic kits
>still one of the worst factions in the game (not counting Magnus the Friend Ender)
Huh, I though GW was supposed to be getting better. This really seems like the same old "throw a dart at the wall to see how good a release will be."

>>50644020
Is this a bot?

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>>50644031

>>50643912
Pretty fucking high
Pushing something that unsettling out of your vagina cannot be good for your mental health

>>50644020
>orks
>being bs more than 2
fuck off newfag

>>50644032

Death Guard, World Eaters, and Emperor's Children to a lesser degree are all very solid armies now.

>>50644032
Thousand Sons are only bad because of point costs, which will be fixed next codex. Supplements and Campaigns only add Detachments and Formations.

What's the easiest way to paint Nurgle marines?

>>50644020
Go play like iron hands and call them orks.

>>50644055
>World Eaters
>good
Worst melee faction.

>>50644062
Spray white, apply various green and yellow washes, paint metallics, add rust and grime effects, done.

>>50644062

Dipping is a really fast way that produce a decent quality end result (easily tabletop).

>>50644072

Super fast melee army - just don't run Berzerkers and you'll be OK.

>>50644062

>Paint green
>toss into a vat of every wash released

Wanting advice on how I can make my dudes into 13th company space wolves.

>>50644076

Rusty weapons would just be Typhus Corrosion > Drybrush Ryza Rust, right?

>>50644079
>super fast melee army
That loses to every single one of their equivalents.

>just don't run Berzerkers
Don't run their only unit that is actually half-decent in melee?

>>50644002

if you are too poor do buy the actual codex, don't bitch over the free ones.

>>50644109
I've bought the epubs you dipshit. The illegal free PDFs offer better quality.

>>50644109
What program should I use for Epubs?

>>50644039

its the news

>I2
>melee race

>>50644057
I dunno man, they did change the Rubric entry a bit and deliberately decided to keep the points the same.

>>50644057
Rubric Marines and Scarab Occult Terminators just got new datasheets that altered wargear (both optional and base). There was nothing stopping them from dropping 30 points off that cost of a base Rubricae squad, or letting both/either squad sorcerers take the all important Spell Familiar.

Tzeentch discipline being dog shit and the fact that you can only spend so many points on Sorcerers before your list just doesn't have enough of anything else are also significant problems with the Thousand Sons.

When a new codex hits, it will likely remove the Spell Familiar, completely gutting Thousand Sons.

>>50644055
Death Guard and Emperor's Children are pretty good. World Eaters will be similar to GSC in that it will be fairly swingy depending on how many squads can get across the table turn 1. Alpha Legion are cute, but a handful of infiltrating CSM squads don't amount to much. Black Legion gets to pretend they have Drop Pods, Word Bearers get to pretend they're playing the good Chaos codex, Word Bearers might as well just play Iron Hands. Night Lords might be the best bet if you just want to play unaligned generic CSM.

>>50644105

>Don't run their only unit that is actually half-decent in melee?

OK, so you haven't read Traitor Legions at all. Might wanna consider not having very strong opinions about shit you don't know, senpai.

>>50644118

If you are too dumb to use epubs, don't buy them in the future senpai.

I can only lead you too water

>>50644105

It doesn't matter if they can beat other melee units it matters that they can move very fast and beat other ObSec choices in combat.

Also I'm assuming you've not had a chance to read Legions yet regarding how good regular CSM with MoK are in the WE formation are. So they basically become beserkers but cheaper and shootier while still just as good in combat and fearless.

>>50644057
>Thousand Sons are only bad because of point costs
Except Traitor Legions and Wrath of Magnus included updated Dataslates for Rubrics and the new termies. If they were going to make them cheaper, that was their chance.

>>50644020
Fuck Orks.

Seriously, they are such an awful faction I don't know why they are still in the game. They're silly and incompetent, maybe that was ok back when 40k was less serious but the fluff has moved on these days, there is no more room for Orks.

Remove Orks from the game, phase them out in favour of a more deserving army, stop featuring them in campaign books or anything.
Orks need to be removed from the game.

>>50644020
>1
No.
>2
Rolled into waagh.
>3
Boyz drop to BS1 and get double+1 shots with any ranged weapons. Gitz and grots are BS3.
>4
Sure.
>5
Okay.
>6
Too much with all the other changes you've proposed.
>7
Okay.
>8
HQs that don't use an FOC slot, up to 5 per CAD.
>9
Didn't they already?
>10
Might as well make them fearless until their next turn. Then they can take another round of close combat before killing themselves.
>11 and 12
Artificer armour/storm shield relics? I guess so. 40 points each.

>>50644146
No matter what program you use, there will be rendering errors with epubs. Readium overlaps letters for instance in the latest traitor legions release.

>>50644131
Think about it. DG and WE were all turned into Plagues and Zerkers-lite respectively, making the actual units useless. For what reason would they do this, if not because the units would be buffed next codex?

>>50644105

>Don't run their only unit that is actually half-decent in melee
>What are Traitor Legions MoK spiky marines with VotLW

>>50644105
Point for point, baseline CSM are pretty good in melee. Sure, they lose to more elite options from other books, but they're baseline infantry. Unfortunately, there aren't really any better non-character melee legionnaires in the book.

>>50644105

So in Legion - for 17 PPM vs. a Zerk at 19 PPM you get a marine with:

Bolter, BP, CCW
Fearless, Furious Charge, VotLW
ObSec

I.E. a better Berzerker for cheaper that gets to move 2D6 before the start of the game that doesn't count as scout thus possibly allowing for a 1st turn charge and easily allowing for turn 2 charges into ObSec units.

>>50644136
Not an argument faggot. WS5 with Maelstrom of Gore is the only good combination unless you want to get shot at for 2 turns by Riptides and still miss with half of your attacks.

>>50644171
That would be solid logic. If those units were unique to one Legion. And not available to every single Renegade army/Black Legion/etc.

>>50644166

Look, we are right back around to just buy the physical copy then.

no problems with readium for me

>>50644171
Because the Plague Marine and Khorne Berzerker entries are extraneous. Trying to have Marks and Cults be different things was a mistake. It makes sense for Thousand Sons, since they're so different, and the Mark of Tzeentch really needs to find something to do other than fuck with Invulnerable saves.

How should I run a Slaanesh Chaos Lord, armor-wise?
PA, Terminator or PA+Steed?

I bet the people who say Orks can't have BS3 because fluff are the exact same people who defend Tau's recent giant titan robot suits and close combat despite fluff saying otherwise.

>>50644222
What's the rest of your army like?

A bike Lord with Bike Cabal and a Bike Squad could be a pretty decent T5 4+ FNP deathstar.

Basically

>bikes
>gotta go fast
>cocaine

>>50644237
Orks should go back to being WS3/BS3 and with Furious Charge replaced with big grins.

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>No Celestin
>No Repressor
>No rule section for Acts of Faith

SoB got one new model and lost a special character. Basically nothing changed. I can live with that.

Hope nids and ork get some love soon. Since SoB just got a pity fuck.

Chaos Bikers are generally regarded as one of their better units, so I assume many of you run them.

Does anyone use alternate models for them? The GW kit seems a bit naff, especially if you're taking a large number of them.

>>50644266
Don't forget the new formation is trash.

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Rate me.

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>>50644166
>Readium overlaps letters for instance in the latest traitor legions release
No?

>>50644149
No it does matter, WE are all about melee supremacy in the fluff, they aren't Orks god damnit.

You miss the fact that a 2d6 non-scout will never replace a Rhino, you NEED that +3 and Fleet if you really wish to get a charge without being shot to pieces.

>>50644153
>implying they ever change point costs in non-codex books
Newfag much?

>>50644179
This is precisely my problem with the book.

>>50644197
2d6 +6 won't be enough for a first turn charge even if you got a 12. You'd still probably end up eating 2 rounds of shooting and give your oponent a chance to kite you, while Zerkers get the same 2d6 with +3 charge range AND fleet, and hit much more reliably.

>>50644248
I was thinking of making the Kacophoni, but now that you mention it having him go around with a bike squad in a warband doesn't sound bad

>>50644286
I haven't seen it. Mind sharing?

>>50644266

the acts of faith are probably in the unit descriptions, since they said its practically a remake of their current codex.

I hope they don't touch nids for awhile, otherwise they will get the new edition fuckover.

>>50644302
I really wish it was 6+D6. 2d6 is just so unreliable to build an army around.

The rest is nice, though.

>>50644266
>No Repressor
It's FW model and rules.
>No Celestin
This sucks.

>>50644334

plz no

>World Eater Butcherhorde Spawn
>32 PPM
>average turn 1 threat range of 28"
>5.5 S5 attacks on the charge
Can any of the other options even hope to compete? Spam as many as possible and you can pretty reliably lock the entire enemy army in CC turn 1. Throw in a couple Daemon Weapon armed Juggerlords to open hard targets, maybe a couple allied Cyclopia Sorcerers for utility.

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>>50644300
Yes

>>50644266
nth for NO RAZORBACKS

>>50644201
I'd agree, but all of the cult variants are stronger, and have access to formations like MoG and Kakophoni which clearly set them apart from their "lite" versions.

>>50644339
Agreed, I don't like how the game relies so much on formations now.

>>50644302

You seem to really care about the fluff - I don't care at all. I care that I can use WE to sweep ObSec choices. I don't fucking care - in the slightest - if I'm a 'melee supremacy' army, I care about getting new tools to take help me win.

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>>50644359
LITERALLY UNREADABLE

>>50644372
Worst kind of player identified.

>>50644353
Alpha legion. You can infiltrate an extremely shooty force in range of their best dudes with a cultist tarpit between.

>>50644372
I don't care about you not caring.

>>50644322

My usual list skeleton is:
2 Flyrants, 2tl Devourers with Brainleech worms, Electroshock Grubs

2-3 Mawlocs w/ Adrenal Glands

Some Zoanthropes + Venomthropes

Lots of Genestealer MSU

Main opponents are Forgeworld loving IG and Blood Angels

>>50644362
Fuck didn't notice. I hope they kept the Psybolt. My Chimera Heavy Bolter Gunboats of psykers needed those.

>>50644372
Not everyone is a powergaming faggot.

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>>50644359
nope

>>50644302

>Muh melee supremacy

Shut the fuck up. You've been tossing on about this shit for the past three generals.

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>>50644359

no problem for me

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Anybody know of any good canon lore that includes genestealer cults? I just read the codex and want to know more.

>>50644399
We also lost our LRR with psyflame and psybolt. Was it overpriced? Yes. Was it hilarious when you glanced a fucking Predator with a flamer? Yes.

>>50644166
Because the various reader/writer programs are maturing so they end up with fucked compatibility
Allegedly GW writers use Kobo for their epubs

>>50644413
Ciaphas Cain fights them a lot.

>>50644388
>an extremely shooty force
I don't know if I'd call a handful of Plasma Guns without ready access to rerolls an "extremely shooty force."

Alpha Legion builds that do well are going to be focused on drowning the enemy in outflanking, exponentially increasing Cultists. The handful of CSM lurking in trees and ruins will just be for holding objectives.

The lack of reliable IC infiltration is a bit of a deal-breaker.

>>50644134
>Alpha Legion are cute, but a handful of infiltrating CSM squads don't amount to much.

Alpha legions main strength is the sheer volume of special weapon available to them. seeing as chosen are both infiltrating troops. You can happily bring 10+ of both plasma and melta. combined with the seer volume of cultist (esp in the decurion), means you can end up with a very powerful force

their deamon weapon is quite fun on DPs as well, with an averge of 14 attacks (if you get off warp time) . The only truly terrible thing about AL is their 2+ relic, which provides realistically no other bonus, as is 25 points

>>50644395

why don't you use the superior malanthrope anon?

>>50644166

For me readium splits a bottom part of a page to the next page

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>>50644376
In some cases, yes. Anyways, PDFs don't have this problem. They are superior.

>"Cool, Traitor Legions is coming out soon! Maybe I'll start that Death Guard army."
>Death Guard are the new FotM

Oh boy, I get to look like every other bandwagoning chucklefuck until the next good codex comes out.

>>50644431
>your troops can all infiltrate
>but not your Lords or Sorcerors :^)

>>50644072
>worst melee faction

>army-wide Furious Charge, Fearless, and re-roll Charge distances
>Maelstrom of Gore grants Fleet and +3" to charges

They're not AMAZING, but they're pretty far from bad.

Also, Chosen/Terminator squads armed with Power Mauls hit at S7 on the charge at initiative. Just saying.

>>50644438
Poorfaggotry mostly. Lack of Forgeword bucks.
Also, I don't run many venomthropes or run them that often.

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>>50644154
>pic related

>>50644237
ALL Orks weapons just should have more shots to them. Seems like the more fluffy and fitting fix to me, Orks are all about rolling buckets of dice after all.

>>50644334
That Leviathan is in desperate need of a toilet break.

>>50644439
Wait nevermind. It looks fine when I have the ToC open

>>50644222
I run mine either as a Jump Lord or a standard Chaos Lord. Bikes are for faggots.

I say, as I ride my motorcycle every day.

>>50644412
>>50644407
Interesting. I suspect it's because the epub format uses actual fonts bundled on your computer to render text.

Which creates the obvious compatibility issue if your epub uses non standard fonts.

Again, PDFs become superior because they just function as an image.

>>50644461

ah ok, I converted one out of the hive tyrant model and got into a group order to get the FW one.

>>50644477
Fuck more shots I want the ones I roll to actually matter.

Give Orks rerolls to 1s and 2s only and that is perfect.

>>50644488

did you play around with the settings at all?

>>50644411
>s-shut u-up! I'm tired of being consistently BTFO!
no

>>50644459
They're now good at GETTING INTO melee, but 4 attacks, FC and Fearless is nothing compared to Death Company and mounted Furfags.

So the Alpha Legion decurion gives them the same buff to cultist revival as the cultist formation. Does it say if this stacks/doesn't stack anywhere? It seems odd if it DIDN'T because the only place you can get cultists in the decurion is from that formation.

>>50644507
Only zoom, to confirm the issue existed at all levels.

Otherwise this is a vanilla install of readium.

>>50644523
It stacks. Whenever a cultist dies, you roll 2d6. For each 4+, you create an identical unit to the unit that died, which then enters ongoing reserves.

>>50644395
Recently, I've experimented with giving the Flyrants Boneswords and lash whips, which seem decidedly worse than the tl Devs

>>50644427
Really ? Because all the new epubs glitch like a fucking bitch on my kobo E-reader. Like, handfull of random words from random pages scattered across the screen with the background image in a tiny size in a random location.

>>50644458
Lord and sorcerers hold no plasma guns, nobody wants then in the infiltrate party anyway.

>>50644499
Sounds like you choose the wrong army anon. If you want quality firepower pick ... almost anything but orks really.

>>50644523
It specifically states that all units in an Insurgency Force are affected by both the IF and their original detachment rules. So yes, it stacks.

>>50644387
>>50644405
Wanting to finally be able to win with your Khorne CSM for the first time in years is a very understandable desire. As a Thousand Sons player, I hope all of my legion-bros have fun with their new detachments.

>>50644458
You'd think they'd be pretty good at sneaking. They could've at least given them some extra tactical ability if they weren't going to let them sneak. I guess it at least lets the Havocs and Bikers feel special.

>>50644459
S7 AP4 isn't that amazing. S6 was already ID'ing T3 and wounding MEQ's/TEQ's on 2's. It gives you a bit more tank-busting ability, but I'd rather just take a Fist of some variety and be done with it.

>>50644454
Death Guard are good, but they aren't Daemons/Grav-spam Gladius/Eldar tier good. They're like Necron-tier. Sure, they're tough, but their offensive output is still grav-less marine tier. They also pay a fair amount across the army for that increased toughness.

>>50644432
Chosen spam is extremely expensive and will have issues with going second and going against enemies with enough Ignores Cover shooting to root them out.

>>50644518

>They're now good at GETTING INTO melee, but 4 attacks, FC and Fearless is nothing compared to Death Company and mounted Furfags

Learn to play the game? It's no one else's fault that you keep trying to fight shit you shouldn't. You're making the poor choice to attempt to fight units that are better than you rather than slowing them by feeding them while you focus on winning the actual game. It isn't about fighting each other in the middle, its about objectives, bonus points, etc.

>>50644561
>>50644547
They can get some nice shooty relics, though. And plasma Chosen need the buffs.

>>50644558
>>50644544
Alright. Someone at my local store said it was just a reroll but I couldn't find anything in the text to support that either.

>Magnus is hugely overcosted!

I've been hearing this on and off, are people just trolling?

>>50644581
Nah, his cost is pretty justified.

>>50644547
>Sounds like you choose the wrong army anon. If you want quality firepower pick ... almost anything but orks really.

Twin-linked fluff is the epitome of Ork firepower and yet we're not allowed it because Orks aren't allowed anything good because fluff?

>>50644581

he is pretty much the only appropriately costed model for the thousands sons

>>50644576
That's because there is nothing stating it's just a reroll. Tell them that, since the unit is affected by both rules, you're resolving one formation's rule, then the other, and they just happen to do the same thing.

>>50644454

This >>50644561. Death Guard are good, but they aren't so good as to attract true WAACfaggots. Plus there are a bunch of strong options in Traitor Legions between DG/EC/WE/AL/IW which will diffuse the people excited for Chaos Space Marines across a couple different forces.

>>50644581
Some people think he's overcosted and some think he's undercosted. Probably means hes in a reasonable spot.

>>50644597

careful anon, they may give orks twin linked everything, but make you bs 1 to 'balance' it.

>>50644649
Thats fine, that makes us effectively BS3.

>>50644616

I really like Iron Warriors - I think they may be a sleeper hit in the book.

>>50644597
It's more the point costs that fuck us over.
Why do Orks have such expensive wargear and vehicles when they're literally just piles of scrap?
Why do some codexes have 'rare, impossible to produce' super heavies so cheap you can fit them in to 500 point lists?

>>50644581
He's not Eldar level of value-for-points, so people are always gonna claim he's overcosted.

>>50644095
Yep.

>>50644597
i would like all orks gun to have 1 more shot.
nakes the same as twin linked exept dont need to rerrol the rolls, also fluffy since they mostly shoot without ever releasing the trigger or aiming

>>50644638

He's an abnormally tough FMC, that means you have to list cater to stand a reasonable chance of killing him. Were he just jump, it'd be easier to work out what a fair cost could be, but as is you can either deal with him or you can't.

>>50644663
>It's more the point costs that fuck us over.
Only on about 3 units, of which I would class Flash Gitz, Nob Bikers, and Deff Dreads.

Doesn't matter how many of something you have if its BS2, S3, Ld7, and 6+.

>>50644561

>They also pay a fair amount across the army for that increased toughness.

Seriously. Everyone bandwagoning DG are going to be really surprised when they realize their standard 10-man footslogging CSM squad is gonna be 200+ pts.

T5, FNP, Fearless and Relentless on a troop choice is obviously great, but you definitely need to pay for it.

>>50644656
No. 1 - (5/6 * 5/6) is 11/36 which is effectively the same as the 1/3 chance of BS 2. On the other hand with would make Orks really good at snap firing.

>>50644561
Read the whole post chain. It's not about wanting or not to win, it's about wanting your army to be good at what it's supossed to be doing in the fluff. You can't have that and be underpowered at the same time.

>>50644571
Nice strawman faggot, no one is complaining about losing to anything. But keep projecting like an autistic little shit.

They should NOT be weaker than those things in the first place. Zerkers eat Death Company for breakfast in TH, it should be reflected in the game. I compare Zerker stats and special rules to their loyalist equivalents and just get fucking depressed.

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>It's Christmas time
>Games-Kikeshop isn't having a sale

fuck those guys, seriously. Everyone else does sales around this time of year..

>>50644660

you will probably see a lot of them, just because a lot of 3.5 players have them.

>>50644699
>i would like all orks gun to have 1 more shot.

Lootas are a prime example of why this is still shit.

Taking a ten man unit of Lootas shooting Max shots, they still only do 10 initial hits. And thats out of 30 shots. That pretty much the best result, a single hit from each guy...

This means that Orks are forced to field more of stuff not for its overwhelming power, but to try and make up for a units shooting at its worst.

>>50644266

Since Valyks are in the same book, does that mean I can fill Valyks with repentia and rain chainsaws from the heavens like the God emperor intended?

daemon princes in a rehati war sect use the CSM daemon prince stuff rather than daemons right?

>>50644704
Reduce the cost of power klaws, burna boyz, battle wagons, kans, gorka and morkanauts, attack squigs, kill saws, mega nobz, kustom force fields, shokk attack guns and a bunch of units/wargear I'm forgetting.

>>50644715

You do understand that the tabletop very rarely faithfully reflects the fluff right? Your argument seems to be 'I want Berzerkers to be the best combat unit in the game' and it isn't going to happen. Stop focusing on that and focus on the fact that we got new tools to be competitive and win games.

>>50644581
Magnus is awkward. He's priced like a titan, and he has the offensive output to match. Before he activates, he's actually kinda squishy for the price tag. Then he takes off and he will die.

If there's a tournament winning list to be made with Thousand Sons (and there almost certainly is), it's going to be Magnus+3 Daemon Princes or Magnus+3 Scarab Occult+2 Baledrakes.

>>50644747
Yup.

How viable would a Magnus + 9 DPs of Tzeentch with wings, ML3 and spell familiars list be?

>>50644733

It's almost as if you've not been around very long.

>>50644738

Yeah - I just really like their silly haywire hat artifact.

>>50644561
>Chosen
fortunate reliable ap3 with ignore cover, is basically restricted to tau. But i take your point: at 33ppm plasma chosen are very expensive.

not too sure how powerful outflanking is, never really done it much, how good is outflanking chosen/cultists

>>50644759

You realise you can start the game swooping, right?

>>50644759

people can safely start him off the table, and have him come in on turn 2 because its damn near impossible to be table if you have a few units of horrors, then he shows up flying and starts blasting away..

>>50644759
Most likely Magnus + Daemon Princes formations for the flying circus 2.0 summoning in more daemons left, right and center whilst raining down psychic powers.

Alright lads, i want to get a LOAD of cheap cultists, for alpha reasons. how can i do this very cheaply?

>>50644787

Search "Dark Vengence Cultists" on ebay.

>>50644777
No, you can't. You have to wait til your movement phase to declare that you are swooping.

>>50644709
Eh, I'm not sure why you'd do 10-man squads. Just do the same MSU spam that every competitive marine build relies upon. You'll be playing the same "Battle Company for Paupers" that we've been playing since Traitor's Hate, just with really tough dudes inside the Rhinos.

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Thoughts?

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2016/12/11/coming-this-january-armoured-assault/

I imagine they will be about 40-50 bucks

>>50644787
Me too, but I'd like less chaotic looking cultists but not the abortions that are cadian guard.

So i wanted to start an elite footslogging army of die hard bastards, do the deathguard rules make my idea of an army mostly made of infantry and walkers viable?


(also i do really want to modify a contemptor with nurgle stuff all over it)

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Step 1 of my WE/IW joint army from leftover CSM models I own or can convert!

Iron Warriors
CAD

HQ: Chaos Lord w/ Fleshmetal Exoskeleton, Power Maul, Meltabombs, Sigil of Corruption, Bike = 160

Troops: 2x2 Obliterators = 280

Heavy Support: 5x Havocs w/ 4x Autocannons = 115
Heavy Support: 5x Havocs w/ 4x Lascannons = 155
Heavy Support: Infernal Relic Predator w/ Plasma Destroyer, Heavy Bolter sponsons and Malefic Ammunition = 155

865

>tfw being masochistic, 10 AobR monopose snapfist marines to convert into fucking havocs and a bike to scratchbuild

>>50644020
>ORKS
>1. An Initiative increase across the board. Boyz are now I3, Nobz are now I4, and Warbosses are now I5.
Boyz are cannon fodder they should stay I2. Maybe give them a bump during a Waaagh!
>2. Army-wide Furious Charge.
The units that need it have it already. Remember boyez are cannon fodder.
>3. A Ballistic Skill increase across the board. Boyz are now BS3, Nobz are now BS4, and Warbosses are now BS5.
No, orks have shit dexterity. Give the army more gretchen options. For example grot tanks. Grot mand gun upgrades for vehicles.
>4. Choppas are now AP4. Big Choppas are now AP3.
Maybe, i'd need to see it play tested.
>5. A Toughness increase across the board. Boyz are now T4, Nobz are now T5, and Warbosses are now T6.
Maybe, i'd need to see it play tested.
>6. A Leadership increase across the board. Boyz are now LD8, Nobz are now LD9, and Warbosses are now LD10.
Bring back fearless for large units.
>7. Army-wide Feel No Pain 6+. This can be improved with Wargear and Painboyz up to a maximum of 4+.
No, make Pain Boys work like meks where you can take one for every HQ choice.
>8. Painboyz and Mekboyz are Elite choices. You may take up to 3 of each type as a single Elites choice, and you may distribute them as Independent Characters.
See #7
>9. Mekboyz now have access to Kustom Force Fields. A Kustom Force Field grants a 4+ Cover Save to all models completely within 18 inches, including vehicles.
Yes
>10. A Waaaaagh may be called once per game, and grants all Orks in your army Fearless for that turn. Calling a Waaaaagh also allows all Orks in your army the ability to reroll their Charge distance for that turn.
This could also work
>11. Characters now have access to non-Mega Armour wargear that grants a 2+ armour save, 1 per army.
Sounds ok
>12. Characters now have access to non-Mega Armour wargear that grants a 3+ invulnerable save, 1 per army.
Maybe, i'd need to see it play tested.

Does anybody have a good online resource for looking at old 40K models? I keep seeing pictures that seem to be out of some sort of catalogue in black and white, that would be excellent.
I'm trying to get my hands on as many old Chaos pieces as possible, for variety's sake.

>>50644767
That's like 3.5k points.

>>50644816
Weird.

I already bought the armored claw so I could have this for my army.

>>50644839
Alternatively I could just build some fun fortifications and use my AobR marines to man the big guns. Saves me a lot of trouble and I get to make some terrain.

>>50644758
>Necrons are tough in the crunch
>Eldar are fast in the crunch
>Marines are mobile and versatile in the crunch
>IG is spammy and shooty in the crunch
>You do understand that the tabletop very rarely faithfully reflects the fluff right?
I don't want them to be the best because they aren't, but they should at least be an even match for non-TEQ melee units.

>>50644088
Bumping for answer

>>50644816
Skyhammers are cool
Rhino and Trukk boxes are meh
Dire Avenger Skyblade is pretty sweet
Armored Fist seems useful
Tervigon bundle is SHIT
Necron Ark and Deldar Skysplinter are neato
Pathfinder bundle is shit

>>50644843

The collector's catalogue is in the Mega in the OP.

>>50644786
I actually don't think that build will have enough Warp Charge to summon a lot and let Magnus really let loose with his Witchfires. The Rehati is at ~1580 alone, and that's only 14 Warp Charge. Magnus will routinely eat up the vast majority of those to pop all of his good Witchfires. I think a more traditional Tzeentch Daemons army that just allies him in to act as a big psychic hammer will be the better option.

>>50644778
Yeah, Oracular Disc will provide a decent way to try to keep him safe from army capable of blasting him to death turn 1.

>>50644769
Hunter's Eye+Grav and/or Libby Conclave+Grav and/or Pinion+Grav will all cause problems for them, as will any army willing and able to assault you before you shoot. It'll do okay, but I think those Chosen are just too expensive and ultimately limited on the table.

>>50644839
You could split up those obliterators into 4 squads of 1 for more flexability. They also need MoN if they are still allowed to take it

>>50644818
>>50644797
yeah, less mutant chaos lads more rebelling guardsmen. the gene stealer guys look good, are they cheap?probs not.

What were the timetable for sisters returning it was February right?

>>50644968
Shut the fuck up. Nobody cares about your meme faction.

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>>50644020
will you stop posting this shit in every general?

>>50644968
Yup, February.

>>50644816
$50 seems like a good bet. At least for the Armored Fist. The Armored Claw is $55 and the GSC conversion sprue add a $5 premium to the LRBT kit.

>>50644993
>only other talk in this thread is orks and chaos

are you some type of double nigger?

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>>50644884

>>50644936

no marks for IW, not good for obliterators, very sad!

>>50644936
No they aren't and you have a good point. 4x1 might be quite good.

OK SO! 10 AobR marines. Here are my choices (assuming I can take the Strongholds of Chaos formation considering it's just an extra. I'm unsure if that's allowed outside of the Decurion.

>Convert 8 of them into heavy weapons guys. This will be fucking painful
>Don't convert shit, build 2 fortifications with all the guns 2 5-man squads could operate
>Build 5 Chaos Rapier Batteries and use 2 marines each to crew them

>>50644088
Unless you're doing pre-heresy, you're a massive fag and this is bait

>>50645047
Gotta be another way without spending $120 a squad.

>three riptides in a 1850 list.

It's fluffy!

Anyone have fun ideas for themed missions revolving around Tzeentch or Thousand Sons?

>>50645096
>How do I run an all wulfen army without any wulfen?
Fuck outta here

>>50645094
I want to do pre-heresy

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>>50644062
>What's the easiest way to paint Nurgle marines?

This guy's recipe is really simple and the effect is just AWESOME. I recommend you check it out.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/222864.page

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>>50645118
For those too lazy to click the link

The recipe:

Spray Gray (99% of the time you should!)
LIGHT basecoat of PP traitor green
Wash with 50 50 Devlan Mud and Sepia
Highlight several times with traitor green, with more and more flesh added as you go.
Metals are chainmail, use very light, very thin amounts of paint, and paint on all the rust a few layers per spot.
The rust is Reapers Harvest Brown triad.

pic related is the effect

>>50644047
>bs3 in second editoin.

(You) are the newfag.

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>>50645139
Oh, and if you can't find the Traitor Green just use Vallejo Green Grey like I did.

pic related are my boys

>>50645161
Every single bolt on that rhino has been painted.

I salute you

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>>50645160
>second edition
>good
m88, (you)r tastes are shit

>>50645160
Every stat was different in 2e, the mechanics were different, the points value standards were different, it was a wholly different game.

3e and onward have been basically the same core ruleset, so anything that's been unchanged since then should be kept faithful.

>>50645033
Weird, the sentinels all cost the same, regardless of whether or not it comes with the upgrade frame. Russ is $5.50 more expensive.

I suspect Armoured Claw price of price of £35/$55 to be most accurate. That's a fair good deal for a Rhino and sum Muhreenz, since those have been on my purchase list for a while.

>>50645099
You pretend to be a member of the Thousand Sons. You try to do things. Your opponent pretends to be Tzeentch. He tells you that you can definitely to things, but he's ball-tapping you the entire time.

>>50645161
>vindicator dozer mounts without the blade
>vindicator top plate without covering the hole at the front

4/10

>>50644299
replace one unit of guns with traktor kannonz. lose a bike or two.

since tankbustas still only throw one meltabomb a turn, your are still going to get shit on by any good army.

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>>50645217
>not giving your every rhino the vindicator extra armor

step up senpai

>>50645099
If he doesn't table you in Turn 1, you perform the "destroy watch with hammer but then watch appears unharmed" magic trick.

Only the watch in question is his favourite miniature and you're shit at magic.

>>50644449

That seems like its on purpose. Cant go having the alpha legions secrets spill out, now can we.

>>50644127
Recycle Bin

>>50645217
>>50645234
but seriously though, I just had an already glued vindicator lying around and couldn't find the front gun and the dozer blade so I just went "fuck it" and made it into a rhino

>>50644826
Yes

Warband with havocs, helbrutes and bikers and a shit load of marines+chosen. welcome to the Death-guard

Ignore plague marines they are dead. Long live the basic relentless fnp marine!

>>50644127
READIUM
E
A
D
I
U
M

how are there people who dont know about this at this point?

>>50644993
Oh no I asked an innocent question... get the axe

>>50644127
It needs to be epub3 compatbile. Try Readium/Kobo.

Rumors state that Lion El'Jonson is the nest plastic Primarch, and the next Warzone will focus on the Dark Angel's and the Fallen. Cypher rumored to feature as well.

>>50644968
Yes.

>>50645195
There is no GSC Sentinel. None of them have an upgrade frame.

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>>50645234


I think he's right you know, the top plate would look much better if you filled in those 3 gaps, or maybe even filed it down so that it continued from the front glacis at a matching angle. Is the bit in red a hole as well?

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>>50644816

>tfw you play IG but not cadians

every IG release is suffering

I really wish there was a stream-lined visual of what each of the legions got/what their respective restrictions were so I could get to theory crafting chaos superfriends formations and units.

E.G. 1k Sons daemon princes get massive benefits just for legion association, Black legion raptors could potentially deep strike and assault first turn but you'd need to take a full decurion etc.

>>50645282
Yup.

>>50644968

too bad its not happening

>muh 99% rumor people

they back tracking so fast it hurts

>>50645309
How do you mean? each legion has a pretty simple set up, outlined in the book.

>>50645309
>1k Sons daemon princes get massive benefits just for legion association
....such as??

>>50645317
Yea dude, do you work at GW or something?

>>50645317
On what? Sisters for February, and it's NOT February yet.

So no one is wrong yet.

>>50644062
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1dMTyx3jF0c

>>50645309
>1k Sons daemon princes get massive benefits just for legion association
I wish.

>>50645317
Literally no one is backtracking and there's nothing to contradict it happening.

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>>50645205
>>50645243
These both sound wonderful, thank you.

What's the best use for kasrkins? Stand ins for scions, or grenadier vets?

>>50645294
I know, but at the time I really needed an extra rhino and was low on both time and green stuff so I just went with it.
I'll propably make a small plate with skulls or something and glue it onto the gap later.

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Thinking about getting some Armored Sentinels w/ plasma cannons (really, why run anything else with that BS).

But what makes them better than a Leman Russ Executioner?

if I play salamanders are blood angels going to be different enough? I want to run the Christmas Colors side by side as allies

>>50645363

Yes

>>50645309
Legions who might want to field a decurion, the bonuses are worth it / they have good cores

>Black legion
>Night lords
>Death guard
>EC
>World eaters
>Alphas

Legions who don't give a fuck, CAD4LIFE CAD TIL I DIE BABY
>Iron warriors
>Alphas
>1ksons
>Word bearers

>>50645294
thats not my rhino but damn you guys are picky. It looks ace

>>50645374
Nothing. The only thing Sentinels have going for them are looking cool.

>>50645374
>But what makes them better than a Leman Russ Executioner?

Who said they are better than a LR executioner?

>>50645282
And who should be the DA opponent? The campaign books always have at least two factions in them

>>50645330
>>50645339
Well the base legion benefit is that if you're affected by a blessing you get +1 to your invuln. If you roll your 1k Sons DP on ectomancy and get shield you have a 1 WC 2++ rerollable save. That's pretty fucking good as far as even reg. princes of Tzeentch go with the impossible robe.


>>50645328
Yeah but keeping track of which can/can't take marks and sorting decurion benefits from legion benefits can make it a little confusing

>>50645380
>Iron warriors
Losing out on Stubborn is a terrible idea.

>>50645397

CSM, probably.

Do you think it would be okay to use thousand sons rubrics as chosen and use them in alpha legion formation?

>>50644561
>Death Guard are good, but they aren't completely broken therefore they suck
Even Nurgle finds you disgusting

>>50645362
As a followup, if you ever find yourself close to winning, scream "FLESHCHANGE" at the top of your lungs and then do an LD50 dose of Krokodil.

>>50645420
Yes and No.

>>50645405
>Yeah but keeping track of which can/can't take marks and sorting decurion benefits from legion benefits can make it a little confusing

really? guess i am a super man or something

in terms of marks its easy

>No gods no masters, no marks
Alphas
Iron mens
night ladz
>marks if you want them
word bears
>one type of mark only
DG
TS
eaters
children

>>50645383
thank you :D

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r8 me?

>>50645446
Sexually confused/10

>>50645440
You forgot Black Legion.

How's that keeping track of who can take what going for ya?

>>50645379
Is that a yes to scions, or veterans in carapace? Or both?

>>50645380
>listing alpha legion twice
If you did that on purpose to confuse people then well done.

>>50645458
>implying BL are even interesting enough to consider

>>50645446
Never take Tyranid Genestealers. Grab a pair of Mucolids and ally in a First Curse Formation from Genestealer Cults.

>>50645390
>>50645393

So they're on par? I did a pro-con sort of thing.

+more hull points
+can't be chewed up in melee as easily
+faster
+move through cover
-weaker armor
-less hull points
-upgrades are pricier because you have to buy them three times

On the whole I do like the model, though. It just seems to be doing the same thing as the Russ.

>>50645446
...is this a still a meme? I remember people posting their list in this format a while ago.

Is it really so difficult to write it down? We really don't need the pictures.

The list itself is.....okay I guess? Depends on who you're playing.

>>50645460

Either or man. Though the kasrkin are equipped with hot shot lasguns so it'll look weird to treat them like regular lasguns.

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How bad is it, /tg/?

>>50645309
>not being the change you want to see

you could make it yourself like so:

>legion icon

>legion benefits

>decurion benefits

that should work

>>50645473
Black legion actual legion benefits are pretty whatever. Hatred everything is great but your assault units are still garbage unless you spring for the decurion and get that sweet first turn deep striking raptor talon.

>>50645428
Sounds like a good idea. What about if I'm close to losing? Do I turn myself into dust or something?

>>50645482
It's a website that tracks the point costs for you, and it's in the OP. Resources in the OP aren't memes.

>>50645425
That's a pretty huge departure from what I actually wrote.

>>50645420
As long as they're WYSIWYG, sure.

>>50645405
>if you get this one specific spell with your two dice, in a discipline that is otherwise fairly mediocre for that caster, you can get a thing that is more easily and reliably arrived at through other means
Wow, so benefit, much massive.

Bumping up a 4++ thanks to your Warp Speed/Iron Arm is nifty, but it's not enough to make up for the massive tax in Marks of Tzeentch that it's going to cost you.

>>50645406
>Stubborn mattering when your army is suicidal Oblits/Mutis raptors, vehicles, daemon engines, both engine formations Oblit cults backed up by Warsmiths, etc
>Not taking advantage of troop oblits/mutilators
>Wanting to squeeze a warband into every game.

The Decu is lame, only take it if you're taking Fist of the Gods and multiple Vindicators for the reroll. Stubborn means nothing when everyone is ld10

>>50645501
naa, just blaim the ultra marines

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>>50645334
>>50645336
>>50645344


Maybe back tracking is too strong a word for you guys, but when suddenly their is now no eta

>>50645489

>mixing havoc weapons

NO ANON
BAD ANON

NEVER MIX HEAVY WEAPON SQUADS.

>>50645501
No, you flip the table over and run away. You spend the next 10,000 days periodically inconveniencing your opponent at home in ways that seem serious but fail to ever seriously impact his life.

>>50645480
The Russ is better and it's not close.

>>50645518
So all missiles or all autocannons, you think?

>>50645487
That's what I was thinking, I wish there were actual models for vets with carapace.

I'll have to search ebay for another squad of kasrkins so I can make a command squad for the kasrkins if i'm using them as scions.

>>50645489

Don't mix heavy weapons in havoc squads, and maybe something else than the two terminator lords, put them on a bike instead and wreck some face

>>50645540
auto cannons generally, the extra shot will serve you over the +1 str

>>50645517
>"should be more on the way"
>no eta
It's the Eldar Jetbikes all over again. She (or her source) has seen the new plastic Sisters, but corporate is deciding to sit on them for the time being. I'd be they're waiting to see what sells in this most recent release before deciding what else to redo in plastic.

>>50645096
GID GUD with conversions then and make your own form space wolves

>>50645509
I don't think you're actually thinking about the statistical reality of rolling up something frighteningly useful for a daemon prince on ectomancy still. Ghost storm/soul switch/infernal claws/daemonshriek and yes maybe even coruscating blaze, could get routine usage from a daemon prince with a spell familiar.

also
>talking specifically about superfriends units
>hurr durr gonna have to pay a lot in mark taxes!

Step up senpai

>>50645528
Sounds like a plan.
What do I do with all this dust though?

>>50645540
Squads can't naturally split their fire, and the game's rules tend towards one model's shots not doing anything. You need volume of fire, and you need to avoid having part of your squad sitting on it's ass while the rest of the squad does something useful.

NEVER mix your heavy weapons.

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>>50645476
Better? Dropped my Zoeys too, GS cult has much better psychic powers so I doubled down on the First Curses.

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>>50645551
>>50645548
>>50645571

So, more like this?

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>>50645446
>>50645476
Here, I fixed it for you.

>>50645610
That version works too for sure, probably even better than the one I posted here >>50645629

>>50645517

There are no sob models coming out this year

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>>50645077
Please halp

>>50645648

Other than the canoness yes, and the February rumors came from that person, so there's that too.

>>50645565
>Ghost storm on a unit that flies
>Soul Switch on a unit that flies
>Infernal Claws on a unit that could have gone for Iron Arm/Warp Speed
>frighteningly useful
Uh-huh. Daemonshriek is good, but I'll roll on Heretech if I'm in a situation where I really want it.

We're talking about a Daemon Prince. At the absolute least, you'll be paying 20 points in Mark of Tzeentch for Cultists in an Allied Detachment.

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Any hope for this list or is it doomed to get slaughtered? New to Nids and this feels strong using the codex but not sure how it would fare on the table.

>>50644302
>No it does matter, WE are all about melee supremacy in the fluff, they aren't Orks god damnit.

When will the WE are gods of melee in fluff meme never ends , they are below most armies event in the fluff.

Also the fact that you can assault shit without +3 but every other player of every other faction can do that just proves that you dont know how to play.

>>50645680

The Imperial Agents codex rumor explicitly says there wont be any models for the codex coming out this year, that includes sob

The canoness was more of a limited edition special miniature taken from the famous ilustration

>>50644222
neither of those
the problem is T4 which means insta-dead by S8+
only bikes mitigate that by makin them T5

Can anyone help me build a nice Space Marine list that doesnt include bikes and grav spam?

I'm actually looking for at least two lists, one for small games and another one for bigger ones.

>>50645698

so you are arguing my point now?

>>50644745
you have to be seeiouslt retardes to not understamd why 1 additional shot on a 6 point ork is much better than twinlink or +1BS. back to midlleschool please

>>50645698
Except it wasn't a limited edition.

And February isn't this year.

>>50645720
seriously retarded* :^)

>>50645689

depends on your local meta, so I cannot say for sure.

rupture cannon on the tyrannofex generally not great though

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So I played a game against my 'nid friend yesterday with the new World Eaters rules. We basically went all melee and the fight was the most fun I've had in 40k in a while. My Maelstrom of Gore managed to kill lots of Gaunts, but they just kept respawning so we were eternally locked in combat. The whole game was close until my Daemon Prince took down the Swarmlord in one on one combat. The Genestealers proved themselves capable of wiping out entire Marine squads in one assault phase and Kharn killed seven of his own Bezerkers. All in all a good fluffy fight.

What battles have you guys had recently?

>>50644561
>S7 AP4 isn't that amazing. S6 was already ID'ing T3 and wounding MEQ's/TEQ's on 2's. It gives you a bit more tank-busting ability, but I'd rather just take a Fist of some variety and be done with it.

Against MC's and Walkers, that Initiative boost is really, really worth it. Doesn't matter that you're hitting at S10 if you're dead before you can even strike back.

Obviously, it's not amazing, but I have found that people consistently underestimate/undervalue power mauls.

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>>50645720
Hmmmm

>>50645786
Mate I haven't played a game in about two years.

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Is there a pdf of the new codex available anywhere?

For the Chaos Warband detachment in Traitor Legions, are Hellbrutes or Havocs more desired?

>>50645786

Wych cult vs Cult of speed

very fun game where not one armor save was attempted.

and at the end, was my succubus that held the line and won the game, by getting slay the warlord

>>50645786
I ran a 40k vs 30k army yesterday.

My opponent ran a new, and vicious, trick; he took Vindicators and gave them Machine spirits.

Then we rolled Dawn of War deployment. He put his Vindicators right in the middle of his deployment zone.

My previously developed strategy of using bullgryns to shield for my trying-em-for-the-first-time Medusa gun carriages wouldn't hold a candle to that kind of firepower, so I adopted a risky tactic; I split my forces. I put my medusas and the bullgryns preotecting them in one corner, and everything else in the other, using the range to force his vindicators to expose their side armor to at least one target.

It worked better than expected; turn one he moved his vindicators towards my medusas, then decided at the last minute to shoot at my leman russes instead and pivoted to aim at them, without re-measuring the range.

Between this misplay and my own firepower, the Vindicators never fired a shot.

>>50645850
>pdf
no

>>50645829

are you attempting to use math to support your argument anon?

>>50645862
what about an epub

>>50645851

Hellbrutes are cheap as shit

Havocs are footslogging regular marines with heavy weapons

Chaos has tons of synergy with heavy weapons, meaning it has many units that fill many roles that carry a heavy weapon as well, meaning you can build your army with these varied units without need of a single heavy weapon choice.

For example rhinos, defilers, hellbrutes etc... can all carry good heavy weapons. And the hellbrute can pack a flamer as well

Does anyone have that picture of the SoB terminator armor, I need it for reasons

>>50644714
>On the other hand with would make Orks really good at snap firing.

Hey, I'd buy that. Orks never suffer any penalty from Snap-Firing - because they are ALWAYS Snap-Firing.

Army-wide shit BS (BS1 or 2, with 3 being extremely rare) but always using your full BS when Snap-Firing would be pretty reasonable and could occasionally make for some brutal Overwatch if you can buff them somehow.

>>50644047
Orks need more dakka, not more BS. more BS isn't orky. Maybe army wide twin-linked?

>>50645868
>Trying

>>50645786
Monthly apocalypse event with uni group (pushed forward for winter break).

Brought a full Ahriman's Exile formation and just sprinkled them throughout the other Chaos faction players' units. Had more Mastery Levels than the other 8 players combined.

>>50645885
So... It doesn't matter?

>>50645891

How can they make orks better? They suck at everything and have no in-game rules identity.

inb4 buffs, because playing a shit army full of buffs is utter shit

Maybe if they got a respawning ability like the nids?

>>50645903

So hellbrutes + other things in your army, not havocs

For example, a defiler or other demon engines

>>50645879
>epub

scroll up anon

>>50645786
>killing seven of your own Berzerkers
>not pleasing Khorne by killing one more for a perfect 8.

>>50645909
>Maybe if they got a respawning ability like the nids?

So glad my S3 guy came back and now has to foot slog up the board!

We need some form of neutered twin-linked shooting, the phase is completely dead to us.

We need more melee presence either in the form of more weapons or sticking in combat far longer.

We need less penalties for doing what we're meant to be doing.

We don't need a single fucking turn Waaagh! when every army gets it multiple times per game.

We need to be able to run and charge for fuck sake, we're Orks.

>>50645885
>Chaos has tons of synergy with heavy weapons
>For example rhinos, defilers...can all carry good heavy weapons
Are you just extremely ignorant or shitposting?

>>50645909
double all wounds

double all shooting

except grot guns

>>50645928
Imperial Agents isn't in the mega

>>50645940
>We don't need a single fucking turn Waaagh! when every army gets it multiple times per game.
Orks do it every turn in their detachment, and that's how everybody else gets to do it as well.

Not saying I disagree with you in general, but you morons need to stop including shit that detracts from your argument.

>>50645940

Maybe with crazy buffs each turn or perhaps with OP attacks on a random roll of dice?

Like all the warp charges tzeench gets but explained in an orky fashion.

I also think GW needs to add specialist troops to orks. Units that are explicitly made to deal with a certain faction.

>>50645909
3 things i think would make them better:

1 old mob rule of leadership equals number of guys in the squad, 11+ gives fearless.

2 they get +2 initiative on the charge, this makes them a lot better in cc but also makes them have/want to always charge in, like orks would

3 and the old mop up rule, where a falling back unit gets absorbed into another unit and comes back around agai .

>>50645967

too soon, check back later

>>50645967
Nobody scans anymore. An epub will show up after the official release. Imperial Agents doesn't come out till next Saturday.

>>50645964

Same for Space Marines desu.

Termies get 3 wounds

>>50645980
You mean our "benefit" that requires 1500 points of useless units that don't reap shit from the Waagh only turn, with the benefits of the formation being able to be completely taken out of the equation when you kill 1 guy?

Oh yes, comparable to Run shoot run of eldar and tau which disappears when the etheral dies or whatever.

>>50645982
>I also think GW needs to add specialist troops to orks. Units that are explicitly made to deal with a certain faction
That is definitely not a Pandora's Box that you want to open. You already have aspect boyz.

>>50646001
>>>out

>>50645263
Uhm alright, granted that i dont know shit about CSM, whats the difference beetween the post supplement marine under a death guard CAD and a plague marine?

>>50645028
could I get the original post where it was said?

>>50645786
My Admech supported by some Inquisition against Renegades Unending Host.
Ended with 400-something kills to 43, I got tabled at the end of Turn 6 when his Daemon Knight killed my Dominus and invisible Knight Warden with absurdly lucky rolls (2 6s To Hit) and stomps after I charged him and reduced him to 1hp, then my Dominus whiffed all 5 Haywire attacks.

Model of the game has to be my 10 pt Inquisition psyker (RIP him, not in Imperial Agents) who used psychic shriek to force 5 20-man infantry squads to run straight back off the board after Outflanking Respawn (They rolled LD5).

My Eversor nearly pulled off T2 Slay the Warlord but his Demagogue made a stupid number of 5++ saves. Was fun to use, though.

Next time, I won't use CAD and Skit Maniple, it will probably be a WarConvo against that 2+ respawn.

>>50645988
>1 old mob rule of leadership equals number of guys in the squad, 11+ gives fearless.

Nostalgia is the only thing that makes this seem good, and it only fucking benefits shit boys. New mob rule is miles better it just needs fine tuning.

>2 they get +2 initiative on the charge, this makes them a lot better in cc but also makes them have/want to always charge in, like orks would

Absolutely.

>3 and the old mop up rule, where a falling back unit gets absorbed into another unit and comes back around agai .

Crap.

>>50645967
oh sorry I thought you ment the Traitor Legions one

>>50645940
>4ppm boys
>2 ppm 4+
>Twin linked in shoots boys
>power weapons, or variations (ap3 big chopas, or rending)
this would go a long way to help

>>50646015

Then expand on their lore.

Because right now orks are just the funny joking army that's lol so random and has weapons that shoot red lightning and they shout waaaaagh.

None of their identifiable characteristics are reflected or can be seen in the tabletop. They suck in a very bad way, they're boring to play and play against.

File: Astra Militarum - 200pts.jpg (47KB, 900x325px) Image search: [Google]

47KB, 900x325px

Is kill team a good way to learn to play 40k?

Would this unit be decent at all?

>>50646044
>>50645940
How about a rule that means if they win combat, they count as having chraged the next turn: means they can really build up momentum

>>50646050
speaking of which, can anyone recommend any good program/app for reading epub codexes?

I tried to open it on my tablet in 3 different programs and it's almost unreadable

Is it just me, or are haemonculus covens really really good?

>>50645786
A 3000 points game Space Wolves (my army) and Ultramarine vs World Bearers and Alpha Legion (plus Arhiman and 5 rubrics because the AL player really likes the Arhiman model and wanted to play it)
Except for the WB neither army was really constructed in a competitive way. For example the UM player had terminators in a Land Raider, no centurions and, I think, a single grav, while I used Arjac's Shieldbros aka termies in a LR, just with a couple cool, if not really strong enough to balance the point cost of the LR, rules, a Stormfang and a single unit of TWC, that I tried to outflank with Harald to see how it worked by itself, really bad

A pretty fun game, except for my Grey Hunters melta drop pod doing literally nothing

The most hilarious part of the game was the last turn, when the WB had transformed their summoning Daemon Prince into a D-thirster and I was able to assault it with both TWC and Arjac's termies. Result of it? Absolutely nothing except two wounds on the thirster. We both threw awful dices to damage and awesome to save

>>50646011
The Ork FBD is actually pretty equivalent in terms of units/cost required to all the other factions' FBD's. It's benefits are also okay as far as FBD benefits go. The issues are that Ork units themselves are shit.

The FBD making Mob Rule even worse is pretty retarded, though. It's quite clear that nobody at GW really knows what to do with Orks or even how the current codex actually works.

>>50646080
same problem

File: peanutbutternurgletime.jpg (97KB, 891x1369px) Image search: [Google]

97KB, 891x1369px

Weeeee, time for Death Guard. I haven't played these guys in more than a decade. None of my old models are around. I do wish I still had some 2nd. ed. Plague Marines.

>>50646080
Readium, a chrome app, is the only decent one. But there will still be glaring flaws with rendering. It will be mostly readable though.

Is there a canon Space Canada?

>>50646062

All of that would get rekt fast by any team with careful planning behind it.

A single meltagun can wreck that team

File: laughinggrots.jpg (400KB, 1182x576px) Image search: [Google]

400KB, 1182x576px

>>50646098
We have 0 customisation in what we can take.

The aux choices we take don't have any additional special rules.

We're forced to take complete shit to get complete shit in return.

It really is not comparable in the slightest.

>>50646058
I don't really see how that's a follow-up to what you said and I replied to.

The Ork issue is that the core of the army is fundamentally broken. They need to fix the foundation first, not add more random gubbins. Make it so that Mob Rule doesn't cause units to crumble. Make it so that Orks can actually make it across the table and into CC. Make it so that Orks have more answers to mid-to-high-tier opposing melee units.

You guys talking about fixing Orks are welcome to check out my attempt:

Bit ly/Orks7ePDF

It's better than GW's interns' weekend project that was their 7th ed codex, but to be fair, any of us could eat a Beast Arises novel and shit a better codex.

One of the things I thought about doing was raising Boyz to S4, but replacing FC with Hammer of Wrath since it doesn't help with initiative. They'd need a price increase to 7. Also, I'd consider giving up the 'Ere We Go! initiative boost with HoW @ S4. Nobz would get to keep both FC & HoW.