/btg/ Battletech General!

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>>50633123
PART TWO!: -

Field Manual Comstar.PDF
http://www.mediafire.com/file/ja3z2n1goe12623/Field_Manual_Comstar.PDF
8604 - The Spider and the Wolf
https://www.mediafire.com/?3d9brfrkj9vnhka
http://www.mediafire.com/file/ivqhzog2wyoegxo/Battletech_35011_-_Aerotech_2_Revised.pdf
hexpacks 2&3:
http://www.mediafire.com/file/3o59kirzzz6znac/BattleTech_Hexpacks.7z
also introbox stuff:
http://www.mediafire.com/file/l22yrlkk9buzuzl/BattleTech_Intro_Box_Set.7z
https://www.scribd.com/doc/23569748/35014-Historical-War-of-3039
Mechwarrior 5: Mercenaries is coming, set during the Third Succession War.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gz8Y1V8gy1A&feature=youtu.be

Plus Butte Hold haha

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>Not playing Minecraft on an industrial mech scale
Get on out level.

>>50633123
>>50633144
>>50633258
These are surprisingly comfy looking

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How do you like your coffee, /btg/?

>>50633582
Like my women: nonexistent

im sad now.

>>50633582
like all the 4chan memes
BLACK

>>50633582
I just usually go up for the offer of 'coffee' and skip straight to the sex. I really hate coffee and tea, but I know an invitation to bump and grind until sparks fly when I hear one.

>>50633582
with bailey's and Four Roses

>>50633582
With a dram of the finest trump brand whisky. Im not even a trunihit supporter, I wrote in for linciln osis. Its just good trump brand whisky

>>50633582
Like my Blakist women: smoking hot, Terran-grown, and faintly radioactive

>>50633123
I wish Myomer from Battletech existed in our world, it'd make building robot limbs so much easier. A plastic that contracts when put in an electrical current, is near 100% efficient, and lasts thousands of years of continual operation.

>>50634420
>Using a futuristic version of myomer for penis implants...
I see this being a thing for making BBC

>>50634458
keep those manei domini hands off our pure non robot women

>>50634420

Fuck building robots, man. You'd be able to make prosthesis for people who lost or were born without body parts, and everyone could be Adam Jensen.

>>50634420
>explodes when you splash a little petrol on it

>>50635591
>pouring petrol on your robot limbs
What are you, a carsexual?

>>50633123
>>50633144
>>50633258
Speaking of industrialmechs, I remember some of the early dark age lore saying that a lot of battlemechs were actually *converted* into industrialmechs.
Maybe we should do a design challenge? Like industrial conversions of common mechs

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>>50635734
m-maybe

>>50635754
Dammit, the Canopians are posting again.

>>50633582
Can't stomach the shit. Literally. I chew through cola like an MG in rapid-fire mode though. >>50635763
Dat truck-fucker is an Elsie, bro.

Why did you pick the faction(s) you did to main? If you main a faction, that is.

Me, I started out FWL because I thought their fluff was interesting. But after a few years of garbage mechs and no good tanks I went over to Davion. Haven't regretted it, even with the current fluff situation. Lots of great mechs to pick from.

>>50636258
PHONECOMPANYFOREVER

TUKAYYIDBESTDAYOFMYLIFE

CLANSGOHOME

>>50636258
>maining factions in Battletech

You are missing 70% of the fun if you don't play multiple factions

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>>50635749
In Macross 7 they re-purposed a mess of old mechs / destroids into construction equipment.
>My Archer drills will pierce the heavens!

>>50636258
I started when I was a kid through The Crescent Hawk's Inception with being a Steiner guy, but when the Fed Com Civil War happened I felt so upset I went Fed Suns all the way.
I also do mercs from time to time, but I don't limit myself. I will gladly play any other faction if I am to role play the bad guys in a scenario. My favorite villain roles are Dracs and Clans. But then again, I was the type to love playing Nod with friends in Command & Conquer just because.

>>50633582
>coffee
>not double cocoa

>>50636258
I 'main' taurians (though I definitely play mercs more often). What got me was the fact that I fucking love westerns and periphery 2e was my first real battletech lore book; the Colonial Marshals and general westernness hooked me completely.
My other 'main' for a long time was the FWL, because FM:FWL was also one of my early purchases and they also seemed cool, especially the Knights Of The Inner Sphere and Regulan Hussars
This was in like 2003 or so? I didn't know anything about post-99 lore or the DA, so needless to say, getting into the wider lore later was a bit sad and disappointing

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>>50636258
As stated elsewhere, I'm a foreverGM so I kinda play a bit of everything. Each faction has its own advantages: Dracs let me do whacky shit (yes I have a Panther company, why do you ask?), Lyrans let me play like an utter bozo using ultra-heavy troops, with Davions I can take really lightweight forces and play a very tight tactical game, and so on.

As a PC I like weirdo factions, which also means I like dead ones 99% of the time. I play a lot of mercs, have some Blood Spirits (I like protomechs and second-liners, what can I say?), and I have a force of Santander's Killers because space pirates are awesome. It mostly comes down to liking the unit choices and tactical options provided by a force. Basically it's some combination of interesting force >limitations< (like pirates using PAF shitters) and interesting fluff or color schemes.

>>50636258
Mercs because of flexibility. But to make things interesting the origins of the unit started in the Periphery, ending up to become quite successful.

>>50633582

Straight black, usually. I do use the thin mint (the girl scout cookies) creamer sometimes.

>>50638444
Funny, I just usually use the girl scout troop leader instead.

>>50636258
FWL because I like range games and units that need to work together.

Unfortunately I eventually figured out that Battletech doesn't really support either of those well, the FWL gets shit on or forgotten about, and that I like elite pilots.

So now I mostly play Hell's Horses.

>>50638662
>range games
>not supported well
do you even play the range brackets
hint: the secret to LGRs is to put the target in your medium bracket but to stay in their long bracket

do the same thing with SNPPCs, but it's playing the "sit at 9 hexes" game so you're in short but they're in med/long

>>50638750
>>50638662
>range games are supported he says
>while talking about medium range and nine hexes

Yeah, I want to shoot people when they're 23 hexes away, not six.

The problem is that it's virtually impossible to stop anyone who wants to get close to you from doing so.

>>50636258
Lyrans because I could be Social General. Seriously, the finer points of tactics are lost on me. I just want to play with my mini robots and shoot other mini robots, I don't give a rats ass if I win or lose.

>>50639529
Im a fwl guy, but this is me as well

>>50636258
I picked Clan Jade Falcon because I was an impressionable young grade schooler when that cartoon came out.

Clan Wolf has to be a close second tho. Would've originally gone Smoke Jaguar had I not heard they got wiped to extinction.

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New to battletech goys with the starter kit coming soonish
Should I pick a faction to use (and paint my mechs) or should I stay something like a mercenary company?
Wouldnt mind being a pirate/bandit
>Pic unrelated

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>>50640476
ded

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>>50640708

>>50640761
Settle down freebirth. That booty is only for coupling with those of genetic worth. You acknowledge this quiaff?

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>>50640965
neg star colonel, I cannot comply. the ancient urges are too strong

>>50641075
I commend your bravery freeborn, but you stand little chance against her in the circle of equals. However I can not rightly stand in the way of one so willing to strive for glory against the odds. Good luck Mechwarrior.

>>50640507
Until you get a faction or two you like, you could paint them in more neutral schemes like forest, desert, arctic or what have you. You could always put those Fed Sun logos on later (because I know you will join the best team sooner or later.)

Whatever happened to the Grand Titan, anyways? Is it still being produced in the DA?

>>50641400

AFAICT the line was destroyed in the Jihad and it was never restored to production. Objectives: FWL lists four machines in production there with the company trying to figure out where to go next.

What's your favorite model of Wolverine?

I like the -6M. The simple but effective nature of it makes me pick it over the -6R every time.

>>50642203
The -6K. I like the extra armour and the laser fit, and the lack of jumpiness doesn't bother me.

>>50641400
The line was wrecked when Keystone got taken away from the Blakists in the late-3070's. We don't know if they ever made it again. It wasn't one of the 4 lines brought back online (Phoenix Stinger, Thunderbolt, Battlemaster, and Jackal) in the 3080's.

Unfortunately, the Wolves hold Keystone as of the late DA, as well as Kalidasa, Stewart, and a ton of other key FWL industrial worlds.

Erik Feraru in TRO:3150 apparently burned most of Earthwerks Keystone to the ground with old school infernos loaded in his mech to deny it to the wolves all while killing the better part of two wolf stars of mechs. They were so impressed, when they finally captured him, they bumped him right back from bondsman to mechwarrior and slapped him in a garrison cluster.

It also seems the wolves have magically gotten the Battlemaster line back online at least to start cranking out their mixtech monster. Not to mention the Tomahawk II. That doesn't exactly square with all the FM:3145 comments about them being short on technicians and labor, and leaving almost all of their manufacturing machinery behind in their old OZ. Not to mention the force deployment where they only have 1.2 Clusters of Omnis in their entire Touman.

>>50642277
The whole "Wolves slapping locals into garrison clusters" thing will come back to haunt them, right? It just seems stupid to be consequence free.

>>50642400
Considering it's almost 80% of their paper strength at this point and the reports of the era say the locals have no interest in being Clanners, I sure hope so.

I have 2 request:
a mech with LBX10, hand for punching, JJ and maybe a backup energy weapon (basically a mini Victor, but assaults are nice too)
an fun or reliable AC2 mech, don't care if those guns are normal, ultra, or LBX

You guys ever get into BT fanfic?

https://fanfiction.net/s/110569/1/

>>50642783
https://m.fanfiction.net/s/110569/1/Blue-Skye-Dreams

Other link didn't seem to be working

>>50642400

Fuck only knows.

For all the talk about the Dark Age being a move to sweep away all the dangling plot threads and make things more cohesive they were probably worse at it than FASA, which really only left the mystery of Morgan's killer and the Wolverines unclear.

In the Dark Age alone you get Bannon, the Freeminders, what's happening with the Home Clans, the Wolves, the Blood Avatar thing, the HPG plague...

I would lay at least even odds of the problem being ignored. And not because of lolwulffiat, but just because it's what they do every other time.

>>50642831
Was it more likely that Loki actually killed Morgan or was it ROM?
I can't think of any better options.

Also I think the mystery of the jumpship tracking Task Force Serpent to be equally frustrating in the lack of answers. It's clear with their 1000 light jumpships and that jumpship gun the Republic got working that WoB was really into KF stuff.

So after reading up most of the plot for BT (except jihad as it seemed retarded), is the dark ages as expanded as the other eras?

>>50642746
For the first: Royal Shadow Hawk (2Hb), Snake, Icarus II and Hatchetman 5S/6S. The Shad being my preferred of the bunch.

For the second, I find old school Blackjacks are always nice.

>>50642746
>an fun or reliable AC2 mech, don't care if those guns are normal, ultra, or LBX

BJ-1 Blackjack. Decent armor, air mobile, packing 4 MLs to trash anything that gets too close and a pair of AC2s. Only drawback is that it's slow for a medium mech.

what's the deal with the Shadow Hawk 2D?

>>50643103
>what's the deal with the Shadow Hawk 2D?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_V2sBURgUBI

>>50643117
I was thinking that too.

What's the deal with Aerotech food?

Hey, /btg/, what is the best resource if I want to make my own maps for battletech? Is HMMap good enough to pirate, or should I go for something else?

>>50642746
Enforcer 5D is another good choice. At least if it has a hand actuator. I really can't remember at the moment.

>>50643390
It doesn't. Only Enforcer with a hand actuator is the 7D, the DA one with the torso mounted cockpit.

>>50636258
Main:
Wolf, FedSuns

Secondary:
Bear/Rasalhague, Coyote, Lyran, Oriente, Trinity Worlds, Merc

Past:
Terran Hegemony

>>50643841
>Clan Wolf
>picking a subfaction of a House too
literally worst kind of player

>>50643342
>Hey, /btg/, what is the best resource if I want to make my own maps for battletech? Is HMMap good enough to pirate, or should I go for something else?
HMMap is the best thing rick rasley ever turned out, and is still the best battletech mapping program

>>50643980
Anon's just throwing the lapdogs a bone.

What was the final tally on how many people Victor Steiner Davion boned?
Wasn't it in the fifties or something?

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>>50630642
It makes sense. I've lost my taste for SPA and tech bonuses, myself, but I understand wanting to improve and individualize units, especially over the course of a campaign.

Sorry I couldn't get back to you yesterday. Followup game design questions:

Is there a downside to disallowing tech or SPA bonuses from stacking, or to changing how TMM works in 2d6 (rescaling it, capping it, etc)?

Switching to a bigger die does create space for more tech and SPAs, but if new tech and SPAs keep getting made, won't that space fill up again and put us right back where we are now?

A side effect of adding space to the top and bottom of the die curve is that everything in the middle (decisions about range, terrain and heat from units with few tech or SPA bonuses) have correspondingly less effect on the outcome of their rolls. So:
-Are you okay with mid-speed units getting less out of their defensive movement modifiers?
-Would you increase some kinds of modifiers to scale with the new die range--for instance, raise short/medium/long range modifiers to +0/+3/+6?

>>50644763
two, one out of politics (omi) and one who had friendzoned him then gave in out of pity (isis)

manlets...

>>50644763
I don't even remember if he made it to 10. Fifty sounds right as a total count for stackpole protagonists, though

>>50642895
There's also the Mauler -3R: 3/5/3, twin LBX10 and LRM 15, small laser on the head, but it has no hands
Pretty nice, weren't for the lack of CASE somehow

>>50639258
A bit late, but that's what initiative is for. You move your things that you don't give a shit about bracketing first, and your braketingwhores last. If you have two or three bracketmechs then you'll get at least one working right even if the other guy decides to dedicate his turn to fucking your brackets.

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>>50642203
>What's your favorite model of Wolverine?
I'm a bit of a grog, but you can't deny how goddamned sexy the -9M is. The -9K and -8C aren't bad loadouts either if you're running a c3 lance.

>>50642746
>an fun or reliable AC2 mech, don't care if those guns are normal, ultra, or LBX
If you're down with RACs, the Davions slap a few onto Wolverines in the Jihad. Backed up with decent armor, pulses and six-packs, so it's not incompetent in close combat, although they're not really the best design out there. If you're just looking for lulz, the Wobbies also put together an Annihilator with like seven of the damned things.

Other than that, it's pretty much Mauler or Blackjack.

As far as your other request, >>50642895
has the right of it. You could also try the Centurion or Wolf Trap, although those give up one hand to the cannon.

>>50643103
>what's the deal with the Shadow Hawk 2D?
The Davions used to have a Mech called the Swordsman. It sucked less than the -2D. Then the line got trashed and they went "fuck it" and slapped the same guns on the Shad, and damned if patty things like "armor" or "maneuverability" got in the way.
This is, of course, a retcon, but it makes more sense than "Uh... our designers caught the retarded?"

>>50642783
>>50642795
>it's a Mechwarrior gets bondsman'd by the clans, fucks a bunch of people and becomes a warrior again episode
Seriously, is there any battletech fanfiction that ISN'T that?

>>50646390
what more can we ask for, really?

>>50646488
A story about a man and his mech
He loves to pilot it, stomping around, punching, shooting , and doing things like he himself were a giant, getting happy with a good performance, sad when it gets heavily damaged
It's written like a children's tale
the title? "Mac and his King Crab"

>>50646299
>The Davions used to have a Mech called the Swordsman
The Swordsman is a fucking sweet mech and needs a mini ASAP.

>>50646390
Welll, there's that one series about an aerospace pilot (!) who gets with an AI WarShip, which is pretty good.
There's several variations on the theme of faction wank, ranging from drakensis and his many variations on
>hanse davion teams up with X to fuck the Capcon even worse
All the way to MA and his maximum scorpion shit. Then there's JA baker, who has produced some funny but badly in need of a proofreader comedy stuff.

>>50646740
When playing Successor States is there any reason not to play Davion? Or even Steiner I guess?

>>50646940
Steiner stronk, deal with it faggots.

>>50646740
>drakensis
What the fuck? He does battletech? I only knew him to do weird avatar fanfic
Small fuckin world, eh

>>50646940

Because you like playing a faction that's interesting in more ways than "we won big in grogtech days".

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>>50646599
I agree wholeheartedly.

>>50646940
>When playing Successor States is there any reason not to play Davion? Or even Steiner I guess?
Yeah. Not being a min-maxing twink.

Less-flippantly, if you're playing with a historical gamer mindset, and building scenarios that go beyond "go2woods, apply gauss directly to the forehead", any faction and era can be fun to play. Battletech was created by, and caters to, historicals guys more than the tournament clique. As such, some of the "sides" are unbalanced. Adding in TacOps rules helps balance that, as does getting away from all-mech-all-the-time gameplay; one of Davion's key weaknesses is their lack of anti-vehicle and anti-infantry firepower, which doesn't matter in the slightest in an all-'Mech game. Likewise, most of the shit the Liaos get up to (night raids, minefields, artillery, guerillas and irregulars) aren't supported in intro or TW-level play, which unnaturally weakens them. There's also the fact that most people don't actually play Davion or FedCom forces fluffily, and just snag the biggest and best units from the TROs by the handful. By that metric, the Liaos (who have virtually no assault manufacturing for YEARS, and favor the AC/20 when they do) and Dracs (who have a lot of overpriced turds in that bracket, plus optimizing all their Heavies for speed instead of firepower) get fucked. The FWL has solid units but nobody pays attention to them, so it's kind of a wash there.

As stated upthread, I play pirates >specifically< because I like the challenge. It lets me use batshit insane, non-optimal customs, or fuck around with Primitives, technicals, and shitty vees. Meanwhile the social general across the table from me is synthesizing pure NaCl by the tonne wasting Gauss shots on mechanized infantry because it's the only thing he ever has LoS to for more than ten seconds. I like there to be an element of >risk< to my games, so if I do something stupid it hurts.

<cont>

>>50646575
I'd read it.

But I'd also read the gratuitous clansmut too.

>>50646740
>an aerospace pilot (!) who gets with an AI WarShip
man and robot waifu is the best ship of all

>>50647277
What solid units does the FWL have? I thought they got shit like the Dracs.

>>50645947
It's not about "How can I shoot him at 9 hexes effectively" but "I don't want them to get to 9 hexes to begin with"

And there is literally nothing you can do to stop people from getting close. Even mines are only semi-effective. BattleTech is ruled by short-ranged shooting, because everything gets better the closer you are. For example, even LRMs have "the sweet spot" at 7 hexes where they're most likely to hit. Same with Gauss Rifles or anything else with a min range.

Part of the reason ERML boats are so effective is because keeping people out of 8 hexes or so is virtually impossible.

>tfw you play Smoke Jaguars and Ghost Bears but your gf plays Wolves and Nova Cats

>>50647850
ha ha time for HIGH IMPACT SEXUAL VIOLENCE

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>>50647277
As a ForeverGM, I play a LOT of OPFOR. I did back in the military too; I did a detachment as a Red-team trainer for boarding parties, as well as playing OPFOR in a couple of Harpoon games with the junior officers. Playing a force that's designed to lose a stand-up fight provides some interesting tactical challenges. Do I send in a suicide team to knock out the objective? Do I go for maximum drama with the PCs rather than the tactical goal? What special rules will make this scenario more fun for all of the players? Am I role-playing or going for a specific "feel" for the fight?

It's kind of freeing, in a way, to try to lose with maximum style points rather than obliterate the opposition. Achieving your mission in the teeth of brutal opposition is way more rewarding than a cakewalk, and that's true of both the PCs and the GM. We still tell stories about the time my Mad Dog pilot took down a Davion Guards Assault Lance before being gunned down by a Griffin on a Hail Mary kick - but that diversion gave the OPFOR time to retreat with the VIP they'd kidnapped..

It's all about the scenario play and campaigns, is what I'm saying. Any game gets boring after a few dozen tournament-style slugfests.

If you want to dip your toes, I suggest hitting up the scenario-building chapter of Total Warfare, and incorporating Forced Withdrawal and/or Morale into your games. If you wanna go whole-hog, roll up a couple companies with Xotl's RATs and play a few games trying to do the best you can with >what you have<. You might find out you like the way something new plays..

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>>50647798
The Awesome is one of their signature 'Mechs. Their Unseen updates are some of the best in the game, and they get boatloads of Omnis later on. They have the luxury of not being right on the Clan front and also not desperately XIN SHENGing their way out of a brutal gangbang for twenty years. In the Invasion, they develop the Wraith (one of the nastiest Mediums ever created), have access to the Solaris 'Mechs, and use a number of interesting Heavies and Assaults. Until they develop the LGR, they have a fondness for interlocking lasers and LRMs with the LB-10X, which may not be as brutal on the headcapping front as the FedSuns shit but certainly out-shines the "SHS and ERPPC" thing the Combine has going. Dig into the MUL and record sheets a bit (especially 3085:Project Phoenix) and I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.

>>50647817
>And there is literally nothing you can do to stop people from getting close.
Well, not in lance-on-lance against jumpers using slow-ass 'Mechs. But you can fuck with their movement pretty hardcore in terrain-heavy maps in larger games, and initiative sinking is a thing for a reason. You can't stop everything from closing all the time, but picking fast units on your part can help. So does sending in something like a Nightsky to buttfuck them while you pull back - this isn't D&D, you >can< shoot into close combat and most opponents would rather choke up on an easy target than deal with your backfield.

>>50647850
Play Republic of the Sphere then

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>>50647277
>>50648028
>>50648309
<cont>
This is waaay more than I planned on writing, but whatever. I'm high as balls on Ritalin and there's not much on my plate.

Anyway.
>>50647798
One of the places the FWL really starts to shine is in the Civil War, when they get some really goddamned nasty heavy cavalry units, and perfect a few of the earlier designs. The OTL-8M is a near-perfect TSM heacapper/brawler, they tack an HPPC onto the Hermes, give the Albatross the Gauss it always wanted, and generally unfuck all their bad designs just in time to go down the crapper in the Jihad. Don't forget their Blakie Lend-Lease either, some of that shit is evil.

On the vehicle front the Mariks rarely have the >best< designs, but they have >good< ones. And a lot of them. They also have Qwickscell's largest facility, so when all else fails it can be LB-5X Vedette time.

>>50646390
I remember a star wars one as well, oddly enough.

I have two design challenges for anyone interested. Both come from looking at the Marik made Wolverine 6M.

Make a Succession Wars Marik variant (both called 2M here) of the Griffin and of the Shadow Hawk, since they build both.
Hard mode: something besides a "PPC shortage" refit for the Griffin.

>>50648309
>You can't stop everything from closing all the time, but picking fast units on your part can help.

A major issue with trying to fight effectively at range is that you have to sit still to get better shots. So if you're shooting at an opponent who is trying to get close at range 20, for example, your mods might be...

Your shot: 4(pilot)+4(range)+2(TMM)+1(Woods)
His shot: 4(pilot)+4(range)+2(running)+1(Woods)

You're exactly the same, but if you move at all, you're worse off, because he doesn't care but it's something you need to land.

>So does sending in something like a Nightsky to buttfuck them while you pull back...most opponents would rather choke up on an easy target than deal with your backfield.

My experience is that this is just throwing away BV. It's better to just unload what you can at range and then fight as a group at short-range instead of feeding the enemy a mech at a time while your range units ineffectually try to shoot while running away.

>>50648706
Link? That sounds weird and I kinda want to read it

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>>50648716
>Hard mode: something besides a "PPC shortage" refit for the Griffin.
Damn, and here I was gonna tack a Blazer onto it.

SHD-2M: Drop 2 heat sinks. Downgrade the AC/5 to an AC/2 and bump the LRM and SRM up to a -10 and a -4, respectively. Still lets you flak with it, and keeps the same long-range firepower but substantially upgrades its close-in capability. Also, it's not a very taxing upgrade.

GRF-2M:
Honestly, I'd still just drop the PPC for an LL and use the tonnage to give it a -15 with the same two tons of ammo. Gives it a typical Marik range profile, removes the minimum range problem, and simplifies ammo logistics. It's basically a pocket Awesome at that point anyway.

>>50648861
A google search didn't turn it up.
I'm gonna have to dig for it.

>>50648850
>>50648309
This discussion reminded me that I wanted to try and get some input from the real veterans here - how do you play, in the specific, tactical sense?

I'm trying to get better at the game, but a lot of the time the more "clever" tactics seem to totally fall flat compared to just sitting in the woods.

>>50648948
Thanks buddy. I haven't had my fix of bad star wars fanfic in a while, since the guy who reviewed it disappeared from the general

>>50649008
The counter to "sit in the woods" is smoke ammo or an incendiary of some sort lobbed into the woods (pretty sure there's incendiary LRMs). Alternately, artillery.

>>50648716
Shad-2M: AC5+ammo for LL, LRM-5 to 10, SRM-2 to 4.
Griffin-2M (I had already made this as a -1M): PPC to LL for one ton armor and one SHS

>>50649008
>I'm trying to get better at the game, but a lot of the time the more "clever" tactics seem to totally fall flat compared to just sitting in the woods.

Play with more units, on larger maps, with mixed units and additional non-TW-rules. That way whatever plan you got doesn't fold just because somebody took a gauss to the head and you actually got options.

>>50649155
>Alternately, artillery.
Isn't that basically Plan B for everything?

>>50648914
I didn't know noogies were a valid form of close combat per zellbrigen

>>50649008
Learn mixed unit tactics and find an environment you really thrive in. Seriously, people underestimate infantry and vehicles all the time.

There's plenty of crappy vehicles, but many of the very cheap ones, like the Savannah Master or Galleon are fast as hell. Use them to flank your opponents. Makes your opponents think which is a bigger priority: shooting the heavy guns facing them head-on and letting their backsides get chewed up, or turn around to face the threat and risk getting shot hard in the back.

Have spotters call in artillery. Doesn't have to be full-on Arrow IV or Long Tom, just indirect LRM fire. Running Swarm ammo indirect, especially in chokepoints, can sew a lot of havoc.

Learn LOS rules and have fun with them. Make your opponent chase you into an ambush. Have anti-mek infantry waiting in woods, or chase your opponent into said traps. Use Thunder munitions to lay out minefields.

>>50648590
What are their good vehicles? When I think of good vees I usually think "Lyran".

>>50642881

I think it's pretty much certain that whoever was shadowing Serpent was Morgan's killer. Just not so clear who that was.

They made a big song and dance about tracking the fleet through hyperspace but the more reasonable explanation is that they just had Serpent's route and were following it, getting caught once in the process by jumping in before Serpent had left by mistake.

And all the Houses had a way of getting that information. I kind of wonder if it wasn't the Capellans given how everything was going Just As Planned for them at the time and eliminating Morgan removes *the* biggest threat to them after Victor himself.

>>50642883

The DA has a reasonable amount of information about it, but a lot of that comes from a novel series of highly variable writing quality with plots that make very little sense.

>>50646940

Depends on whether you're more into fluff or force selection.

The Suns *clearly* has the best gear, a situation that persists from the SW era to the Dark Age, so if you want an advantage right off the bat they're the ones to go for. They also get the best military in terms of available tech (their most neglected units literally have better upgrade rates than the most elite and well-supplied of other factions) and thanks to Codex Creep their units also have some of the best special abilities. They are also, in most eras, the faction with the best overall skill rates.

>>50648716

SHD: Remove A/C, add LL, ML, 2 JJs, 2 HS.
GRF: Remove LRM-10, add 2 SRM-4s, 2 tons ammo, 1 ML.

>>50648914
Not too sure about the Shad (maybe because aversion to AC/2) but I actually like that Griffin.

>>50649155
Those both work. The Shad is predicable but not bad. Something I'd see a provincial unit do maybe since I'm sure it'd be harder for them to get PPCs.

>>50649296
>GRF: Remove LRM-10, add 2 SRM-4s, 2 tons ammo, 1 ML.
That variant would definitely help my problems with the machine.

>>50649259
>>50649211
I appreciate that advice, but for right now I want to focus on gitting gud with mechs before I expand.

>>50649259
Huh, didn't know swarm worked indirect.

>>50649543

Pretty much. The armour is OK, it has full jump, and it already has 12 HS so you can run and fire the PPC without heat buildup.

What it doesn't have is anything to do at close range, especially with the minimums on both the PPC and the LRM.

So, SRMs that each hit roughly as hard as the LRM you lose, with two tons of ammo so you can shoot the enemy with normal missiles or set the fuckers on fire with Infernos. And an ML because why not.

Could also go with one SRM-6 and two MLs for the same mass but I like paired fours and ML battery refits are a bit overdone. YMMV.

>>50649731
I cannot tell you how rare it is for me to be in a position with the standard Griffin and get both a good PPC strike and get the LRMs to hit. It usually becomes a one-gun soldier for me. Again, I like that variant.

>>50649318
I used the /2 to keep the plinking role and keep the Refit level down. Plus, it wouldn't be a Shad if it didn't suck at least a little

>>50649692
Any LRM munition can be used for indirect fire, just with a few caveats, like Artemis ammo having no effect (so no bonuses) if fired in such a way.

Paging Xotl, will the drunken bear please report to the irc to so that I can bug him about fluff.

>>50649731
>Not always hotloading your LRM's and disengaging your PPC field inhibitors at close range

It's like you don't even Grog Harder.

>>50650472

Not wanting to accidentally explode yourself is a perfectly valid tactical choice.

>>50650634
It's no more than carrying infernos and actually riding the heat curve a bit. If the PPC goes up, you might lose the arm. If the LRM gets hit and detonates, it's still less bad than the bin getting hit.

The real risk in play is losing the PPC because of the feedback. You have to really want those numbers at point blank to choose to do that over taking the minimum penalty.

>>50650745

The LRM is in the same torso as the two ammo bins. You can get a sympathetic detonation.

It is also possible for the PPC to go off then daisy chain the LRM, which daisy chains at least one ammo bin.

It makes every weapon slot on board explosive, in an environment where there is no CASE.

I really don't see many upsides here. Pulling it on something like an Archer or Awesome where you might really need to fire the big guns in close at some point is one thing but this is a 5/8/5 mover intended to fight in the 6-12 hex range.

>>50650840
>You can get a sympathetic detonation.
Only if the LRM is TAC'd or you're down to internal structure. Doesn't change much at all, especially because by the time you've lost that much armor, you've probably emptied a bin so it's not like a 100% chance a torso crit will set off anything. Interestingly, I've never once had a hotloaded rack go up.

The PPC like I said is a close in move where you need the numbers bad. You can engage or disengage the fields every round, so it's just a pocket option for if you absolutely need that extra -3 at point blank. It's only explosive the one round you use it.

>>50649259
Drillsons, Pegasii, and the Scarborough trio are my go to units for that sort of thing. Yeah, they hover units that can get shotgunned to hell, but they're pretty cheap spotters with high movements.

>>50648716
GRF: Remove the LRMs for a LL and two extra SHS
SHD: Swap the AC for a LL, upgrade the SRM to a -4, add two JJs, a second ML and a SHS

>>50651587
Drillsons are mean. They're tied with Maxims for my preferred hover units. Good speed, decent armor, and a hell of a punch for such a light tank.

But seriously. A GAL-100 punches at pretty close to the same weight as a Spider of the same era, for about 1/10th the cost. In a stand-up fight with the same they'll get torn apart, but if you use their strengths to their advantage, you can get away with a lot.

>>50648914
>>50649296
I think I'm going with that AC/2 Shad (on second thought I like the plinking notion) and that Griffin with the SRMs. Look great to me for my Marik force.

Thanks /btg/.

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"The design featured... twin Gauss Rifles in the torsos fired through the dorsal barrel..."

What? How the shit does that work?

>>50652553
It's Clantech, I ain't gotta explain shit.

>>50652553
>FASA art checking

>>50652606
Yeah but even without the art, 2 rifles in a torse firing out of one barrel on top doesn't quite make sense.

>>50652664
Designed by the same guy who put the dorsal AC/5 on the marauder.

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>>50652553
>2 rounds, 1 barrel

>>50652664
>>50652553

This comes to me like 4th-hand, but from what I understand, the TRO 3055 project had a LOT of art issues during the production of the book. Stuff like "artists only getting fluff and not stats", "art redrawn for units at the last second", and most importantly, "stats re-written after the art was done."

It is entirely within reason - again, as I understand it - for the original Stone Rhino to have been something like a triple-guass design and the art was commissioned on that basis, and then it was re-statted. Or what we think of as the the Stone Rhino art was intended for something else entirely (something that was cut from the book) and was used at the last second. The art was clearly intended to have been used in general, since it appears on the cover, but given FASA's production cycle issues throughout its lifetime, I'm like 95% sure the Stone Rhino art was never meant to match up with the statline.

>>50652737
wat

>>50633582
black, unless i have baileys to put in it. I'm also a big fan of green tea, drink that stuff all the time.

>>50652553
>>50652757

The fluff about the dorsal mount firing for both GRs is also not present anywhere in the fluff for the design in any of the TRs.

Honestly I suspect it was a triple LPL design at some point but then they went with 3 JJs instead.

>>50652592
>Sheer contempt for Freeborn is harnessed to propel solidified hatred directly out of the pilot's eye sockets

>>50653244
I'm not allowed to play Wars of Reavings games after I loaded up a bunch of SRM carriers with slow acting viral plague missiles on Strana Mechty. Oh and killed off five Bloodhouses in the Bears alone.

>>50653271
You say that like it's a bad thing.

>>50653325
I put the "OH GOD MY SKIN IS MELTING PLEASE HELpbb blurgle" in "War Crimes", really. It didn't help that the end of the Reavings in my game ended up looking like some horrific mashup of Tiberian Sun and the Siege of Vraks Forge World books.

The Genecaste are real, and they have silicoids. FLEE FOR YOUR MISBEGOTTEN LIVES

>>50653271
>Bears
I'm sure I'm not the only one here who feels this way, but I don't like them. They're just so annoyingly boring, from fluff to unit selection.

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>>50653616
no you're wrong

>>50653616
I don't really find them boring, but their Warships make them a protagonist faction. Main reason I offed the bloodlines was because one of the other players was ballyhooing about Jake Kabrinski, so I took the chance to wipe out as many bloodhouses at an annual Ghost Bear conclave as possible.

>>50643342
>>50643992
Anyone have a link to this?

>>50653376
>and they have silicoids

Say what?

Why are regular clan pilots 4/5?

>>50654203
Sorry, Visceroids. The crazy goo monsters from Tiberian Sun. I've been playing some MoO2 this weekend and got the names flipped.

>>50654241
They aren't, they're 3/4

>>50647817
What are you talking about? Most people boat long ranged weapons because you can start shooting at 20+ hexes and they only get more accurate as the enemy closes in. Boating shorter ranged weapons generally gets you chewed up while you footslog your way into 4 hex range while the enemy is sitting pretty in partial cover or woods.

Oh and then you run into the guy who's response to you getting close is to jump or walk backwards 5 hexes.

>>50654241

They aren't? Clan Regulars are 3/4.

However, the base BV given for units is with a 4/5 pilot at the helm so unless you pay to upgrade them that's what you get.

>>50654298
>>50654305
But CA says that regular clan pilots are 4/5

>>50654408

Then he is wrong.

>>50654408
>Inferring that genetically superior Clan Mechwarriors are equal to disgusting common Freeborn Mechwarriors

>>50654408
Fluffwise they are indeed about the same as their Inner Sphere counterparts. Mechanically? Likely 3/4. I'd call it 4/5 depending on the era and position.

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Battletech makes me depressed because I love it and haven't really found people to share my love with since MW:DA. Will battletech ever be that big again?

>>50654506
The tabletop most likely not. Unless saw someone can work out a model production and distribution license with GW. Then it would have a chance of being huge.

It is making a recurrence in vidya though, as we have an actual BTech game coming, and MW5:Mercs was just announced and a tech/engine/promo demo shown.

>>50654506
It may be. There was a small uptick of interest with MechAssault and with the failed MechWarrior 5 (now MWO). With both HBS' BattleTech game and PGI's MW5 (if any good, and if it comes out), we may very well see. Especially with HBS' game, as that's basically a videogame adaptation of the boardgame from what I've seen.

>>50654305
>>50654408

Goddammit, the word Regular is being thrown around poorly and it's confusing the issue.

The baseline, most common troop in the Inner Sphere is called "regular", and they have a 4/5 statline.

The baseline, most common troop in the Clans is called "regular", and they have a 3/4 statline.

According to BV, it *doesn't matter* whether you're "regular" as per the IS definition, or "regular" as per the Clan definition. If you're 4/5, you pay X points of BV. If you're 3/4, you pay Y points of BV.

Yes, that means that - in fluffy play - almost *all* Clan MechWarriors should have to pay the BV cost for being a 3/4 pilot. They are "regular". Yes, that means that on top of paying the premium BV cost for ClanTech, you ALSO have to pay the cost of making your pilots 3/4. Yes, that means that if you are playing Clans "correctly" with almost entirely Clan Regular pilots, you will likely be facing a 2500 BV Inner Sphere Mech with a 1450 BV Clan Mech (+38% for the pilot, generally +20%[roughly] for ClanTech).

BV is not "fair", and has no relation to making the implied "gameplay" in the fluff actually function. BV works just fine when balancing Clan v Clan, or IS v IS. It shafts the Clans quite hard when playing IS v Clans. It is, in fact, the WORST balancing system in the history of the game, except for literally every other system that has been published in the history of the game.

>>50654506

Only if it releases in blister boxes and comes pre-painted with far better sculpts. Bascially, if BT becomes Xwing, then there's a chance. Otherwise, no. The days of complex wargames are coming to a close, and anything that takes more than 90 minutes to play or comes unassembled or unpainted will fade away like a distant memory. Like tears...in the rain.

>>50654743
>Like tears...in the rain.

The people we would need to attract to the hobby to make it thrive wouldn't get that reference. Which is part of the problem I guess.

Sooner or later we old farts are going to have to ride off into the sunset.

>>50654484
>>50654743
Shit and I mean Aerospace pilots, not Mech pilots. I'm not sure who in the IRC asked that, but I want to clarify.

>>50654484
...

Ever since the rules and fluff for Clan pilots has existed they've specified that what the Clans see as Regular the IS sees as Veteran.

The charts have always been one level better than the IS for skill ranks and they get like a +2 bonus when using random skill rolls too.

Then on top of that once you look at the FM entries the average Clan cluster is Veteran-rated for them, which in turn means the typical Clanner is actually a 2/3 pilot.

>>50654790
>The people we would need to attract to the hobby to make it thrive wouldn't get that reference. Which is part of the problem I guess.

Correct. And equally as importantly, the people who are young enough to get that reference are much, MUCH less likely to be interested in complex "hobby" games at all. And they're even less likely to be interested in a game that is almost never "pretty" to look at (hexmaps vs terrain).

It may be the muscle relaxers, but no, I genuinely don't have any hope for the game lasting another 30 years. I'll be thrilled if we can manage another 15...but without any more movement on the plotline for fear of alienating the few fans they have left, I'm not even betting on making it another 15 years. CGL may go on, but the supply of new products will slowly dwindle into a yawning oblivion and all Randall's memory of BattleTech shall be forgotten and lost.

The only thing which could save BattleTech - a complete reboot and reimagining along modern game-design sensibilities - would also kill it. Because it would no longer be recognizable as BattleTech at all.

>>50654820

Then the Clan "Regular" skill is 4/4, but again most Clan units are rated Veteran for skill in their FMs so actually 3/3 or better.

Under the original rule set Clan pilots were strictly better than their IS counterparts and got rules to reflect that. In subsequent publications and fluff that has been overturned because lolclanners.

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>>50654743

>>50654871
Well to be fair as I have often heard BTech is a story not a setting. And like all good stories it eventually has to come to an end. All we can really hope is that it ends well and in a dignified manner.

Whatever comes next ultimately doesn't matter. Though a fresh re-imagining for modern sensibilities and technological advancements is possible.

The old must make way for the new, otherwise you have stagnation. Better to see it go out guns blazing with its head held up high than languish in rot and ruin.

We may be at a point where we have to choose edge. The outcome is almost certain, but imagine the victory.

>>50654871
>but no, I genuinely don't have any hope for the game lasting another 30 years
I mean, fuck, name a fucking single RPG OR wargame franchise aside from battletech that's made it this far with this little rules changes. battletech is a fucking miracle
already making it this far, another 30 years would be beyond insanity. Hell, 15 more would probably be the best run anything of it's breed has ever managed

>>50654976
>I mean, fuck, name a fucking single RPG OR wargame franchise aside from battletech that's made it this far with this little rules changes.
Palladium, easy. But that's one detroit madman's empire of dirt, it's not really the same as battletech

>>50654743
>>50654684
Yeah, when I said battletech I meant the universe, not just the wargame. I'd like to be able to just talk about the houses and merc groups with people IRL, maybe do some rpg action. I think Electric Entertainment has the license to make a movie. But the problem is they suck.

>>50654871
>It may be the muscle relaxers, but no, I genuinely don't have any hope for the game lasting another 30 years.

I find it hilarious the fact that you get more productive and your language gets more eloquent when you're on drugs. What happened?

>>50650191
Yeah but I thought Swarm worked like Artemis, lost the benefit.

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>>50655486
>I find it hilarious the fact that you get more productive and your language gets more eloquent when you're on drugs. What happened?
As someone else with severe, chronic pain? Honestly, you would not fucking believe how much brainpower goes into masking that shit enough to function. When I'm stoned, I may not be able to drive or go out and do things as well, but the drugs clear out a big chunk of the fog that's covering my brain. Imagine having a sadistic two-year-old (but I repeat myself) stabbing you in the knees with a pencil. Forever. Now imagine what that would do to your ability to be coherent.

>>50654301
>Most people boat long ranged weapons because you can start shooting at 20+ hexes and they only get more accurate as the enemy closes in

This is my whole point - You get a few shots at ranges past 12 or so, but the chances of doing anything are virtually nil as I showed in >>50648850. Unless you've got cLPLs or something, I guess.

This is just my experience, but unless you can bring T-Aug, combat WILL get to point blank range. And I want to shoot the other guy when he's at 25 hexes, not use my LGR as a slightly-longer-medium-range weapon. Or have LRM-boats trying to keep people at 7 hexes instead of actually being used as a fucking LONG RANGE MISSILE.

>>50655617
Nope. I checked the rules after the posting, there's no note of that in Tacops. Unless there's someone giving a ruling elsewhere?

Rounds like Artemis and Semi-Guided would lose their benefits from outside influences (Artemis IV and TAG, respectively), but the Swarm system is inherent to the rounds. The rules even say they function like a normal LRM round with the following exceptions, and no mention of indirect fire.

Hell, you can use Thunder LRMs for laying indirect minefields.

>>50654743
>Bascially, if BT becomes Xwing, then there's a chance. Otherwise, no. The days of complex wargames are coming to a close

Good thing there's Alpha Strike, then.

Let's be honest, BT is a tremendous pain in the ass to actually play unless you've been playing for decades, and even then it's damn slow.

>>50655752
You're probably right, I'm just a newbie and it make sense on the surface that Artemis and Streak would both lose the benefit of guidance when fired indirectly.

>>50655486
>What happened?

Be fair. The last time I was really posting while on drugs or simulacra of same was in winter of 2015 when I was recuperating from surgery.

Irrespective of such irrelevant facts, I teach a German Longsword (HEMA) class on Sunday mornings. As today was out last meeting before the advent (heh) of the holidays, I basically scrapped the lesson plan and we just faffed around with sparring, mostly using nylon synthetic wasters. Our space supports two pairs of fighters simultaneously (two 30'x30' squares, with a 10' corrior between them), with two judges watching each fighting pair and making sure to call them out if they leave the space or if there's a safety hazard.

In this case, the owner of the space wanted to talk to me about when we'd be back in the new year, so I left my space where I was talking with some people and crossed between the fighting squares to get over to him. One of the fighting pairs (unbeknownst to me) came charging across the mat from by rear-right quarter. Since no judge "hold" warning came, I paid no attention. Suddenly I took a *hard* sword hit to by back under my shoulder blade; as I wasn't fighting, I had no protective gear on.

As it happened, the fighters had exploded into a fast pass towards me and the attacker has "target lock" on the other fighter and didn't notice me. He launched an attack which the target voided away (dodged) and the blow landed directly. Why was there no call from the *safety judges*?

They were showing each other shit on their phones over in the corner of the fighting square, paying less attention to the fight than I would if I were to be passing a drunken, benuded, Taurian singing jaunty show tunes whilst on fire.

So my back is severely bruised and largely seized up when I went outside in the cold. Hence, today's indulgence in Tizanidine. Tomorrow, there will be judges likely looking to regain the positions they just lost.

>>50655762
Yeah, gotta agree. Alpha strike lets you put companies on the table and wrap it up in a couple of hours, standard BT can take twice that for lance on lance. I just find the AS gameplay much more satisfying due to the ability to, say, have a Fire lance behind a Line lance with a Strike lance covering the flank. Where to get that out of BT is an 8-hour or more game.

>>50655762
>Let's be honest, BT is a tremendous pain in the ass to actually play unless you've been playing for decades, and even then it's damn slow.

And then some asshole wants to get Infantry involved.

>>50655853
Yeah, when you get vets like CA and muninn instantly quitting a MM game when someone shows up with infantry like happened the other day, you know that shit is way too much of a headache.

>>50654871
I think Battletech will die as a company-controlled entity/IP in the next decade, if not sooner. Fans, however, will plod along, and we'll see them split up and drift into groups, each with their own tabernacle of most holy rules and homebrew bashes to best flesh out their little niche of the timeline. It'll exist as a sort of "underground" thing till someone gets the bright idea of re-releasing the game under a new name with new-ish rules, streamlined to be someplace between AS and CBT, and it either ropes in enough of the remaining fanbase to work or dies and becomes another niche of the Battletech experience.

I'd imagine a Kickstarter with some good rules and a decent premise/pitch would work out. What I'd do is distro the rules for free, then have a KS where pledges fund things like hardback/softcover rulebooks, and cardboard standies, and all that, then as the pledges go up, you get things like map packs and minis and all that. Basically "show us with money how much cool shit you want".

>>50655762
>>50655848


And like he was extremely clear in saying, it's ot Battletech. The detail is the draw. It's not unreasonable to say that the detail makes Battletech 'Battletech'.

You can't have a fast-playing, modern-style tabletop game with lots of detail. Can't be done (AR glasses from shadowrun notwithstanding).

Therefore, a fast-playing, modern-style tabletop game cannot really be Battletech.

And certainly, Alpha Strike is not anything even remotely resembling genuine/real/good Battletech. It strips out everything that really matters for the sake of playability, and if it must be the flagship game for the franchise, then Battletech is truly dead.

>>50655762
>Let's be honest, BT is a tremendous pain in the ass to actually play unless you've been playing for decades, and even then it's damn slow.
Battalion games in three hours, though any more and I edge towards Battleforce. Especially if it's a Star League era game, because who can remember whether Archer 79 or 34 moved?

>>50655871
I quit because (A) that guy said he had never played with infantry before, (B) had like 4 Arrow IV trucks, and (C) thought infantry worked like they did in Warhammer 40k. Not that infantry aren't a pain in the ass, but we all had mechs geared for fighting mechs, not chasing down 8 hexes worth of infantry platoons.

>>50655882
>It strips out everything that really matters for the sake of playability, and if it must be the flagship game for the franchise, then Battletech is truly dead.
This.

>>50655874
Fuck it, just get the /btg/ namefags to do it. They're twice as expert on the game design saide as anyone at CGL.

>>50655871
>>50655909
Infantry ARE fun, but I agree that it is really something you need to let people know of ahead of time that you plan on using.

Unless you all agree to a any potential comers sort of deal.

>>50655958
This might be closer than you think to the truth of how things pan out, depending on where they all are in 5 years with regards to the game.

>>50655882
>Bascially, if BT becomes Xwing, then there's a chance.
AS is BT becoming Xwing.

>Alpha Strike is not anything even remotely resembling genuine/real/good Battletech. It strips out everything that really matters for the sake of playability, and if it must be the flagship game for the franchise, then Battletech is truly dead.

It's not OG Battletech, sure. Personally I think it's pretty good on its own. And even if it's the flagship, the plot will go on.

>>50655909
>Battalion games in three hours

Unless you put them all in gun lines on open boards and the first turn of fire removes a company, you're either full of shit or such a freak outlier that it's the same thing.

>>50655882
>It strips out everything that really matters for the sake of playability,

People say this, but pretty much every BT game is just meaningless weapon spam until something blows up. Sure, that one time your urbie DFA'd an Atlas was sweet...but the last time that happened was in the 80s.

>>50656026
You can do battalion games on MegaMek in three hours if you really put your nose to it, I bet. Tabletop? I'm doubtful myself.

>>50655958
>>50655977
I am no one, but if I make my money I promise to come back and fund this.

/tg/ gave me many things over the year, besides just a fetish for elf slaves that I can never decide what to do with, so I must give back.

>>50656043
Well, time to get the IRC crew together for a battalion game.

>>50656042
I had an Urbie DFA a Centurion a few years ago. I also had a Wasp 1L TAC a cherry Thud on the first firing phase of a game around the same time. Cool shit can still happen.

>>50655909
To clarify on AS, not that it isn't fun, but I have a very hard time feeling like I'm playing the fully absurd experience I'm used to with the original game. AS doesn't have the ability to have a line of mechs pick up their own blown off arms (6 mechs) and go to town on one another with the stumps. Also, since I'm really into accountantech, that tracking doesn't feel like it's there for post game play.

>>50656026
Freak outlier. I'll admit that the three hour Battalion scale game involved nukes, but I've got 4 players who are pretty well versed on rules, so turns go by quickly, and companies pick a mech at a time to kill.

>>50656042
>but the last time that happened was in the 80s.

Pretty clearly so was the last time you played.

>>50655958
I know Muninn is going slowly with the TRO project, but he hasn't really made any fuckups like the previous TRO did. Seems like he has what it takes to just keep slogging til things happen. If he can get the rest to help (and two are already with him) I think good things might happen.

>>50656069
>I had an Urbie DFA a Centurion a few years ago
>a few years ago

I think that was kinda the guys point, lol.

>>50656105
>80s
>a few years ago
I guess? I mean I get the facetiousness of it in retrospect, I suppose. I'm a bit tired.

>>50656105
>like the previous TRO did

By which I meant that other fan TRO that had plagiarized art, lost lots of money, paid for incomplete translations, etc.

Also, partly, the fact that he's going so slowly because he seems to be considering everything to the point of obsessiveness is in its own way encouraging. I don't really see him doing "shovelware" like TtS

>>50656125
>>50656069
>>50656089
If anything BT is "overbalanced" - cool shit is penalized heavily to keep it from being OP, which just makes people not want to do it.

Also, melee weapons are kinda shit when compared to kicks and punches, so mechs with lances and swords are baller as fuck but only taken when you're being suboptimal for lulz.

You know what's really funny? If Clickytech got a rerelease tomorrow, it would make this thread blow up with with people interested in BattleTech.

Suck shit, grogs.

>>50654743
>Only if it releases in blister boxes and comes pre-painted with far better sculpts. Bascially, if BT becomes Xwing, then there's a chance.
the thing is, a decent X-wing style battletech game would be fucking amazing, exactly what battletech needs.
literally all it has to do is avoid the failings of MWDA (era dependent on fluff that alienates the existing base, random boosters) and otherwise imitate X-wing, and it would be amazing, especially with MW5:M and HBSMW on the way, plus MWO.
it could be so goddamn good

>>50656342
I have to admit that I would be interested in playing something like that. It would be a good gateway into proper BTech too.

Hook them on the X-Wing style game, get them interested in the lore, introduce them to either AS or BTech proper. Possibly see if the MW RPG can get a resurgence.

>>50656417
>>50656342
And of course make sure the first one is free if possible.

Which could be an Urbie.

>>50656303
OH NO NEW PEOPLE WHO WANT TO PLAY THE HOBBY. How would I ever be able to go on?

I'd be annoyed if CGL decided to dump the entire game line otherwise, but I've got my books, and I'd buy what newer products interested me to mine for ideas, and I'd at least try the game.

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>>50656303
My body is ready.

>>50656462
How did Clickytech even work, anyways?

>>50656479
Other than some impossibly stuck infantry that you couldn't click without a tool it was fun. I remember if i flew to a new city I knew I could look online to play at a local store during my stay. All sorts of comic shops and stuff was running events. You could buy the boosters even at electronics boutique and other video game stores.

There was some serious cheese at times, and it doesn't offer all of what classic offers (the heat wheel for mechs has 6 clicks, the damage wheel of a mech has 18 clicks) but it was fun.

>>50656546
What's the short version of how it works? Never played a clix game.

>>50656598
Clicking the damage wheel decreases your mechs effectiveness (generally). Depending on the mech and the faction it may decrease in different ways. Your movement might drop off more significantly than damage youre able to deal. Your ability to hit others and the ease to hit you will also change as you click the wheel. Gaining heat can also augment your damage and movement.

Put your figure on the battle fiend. There's a small dot in the center of his base and a firing arc drawn on the base. Use those, the stats your wheel show, the stats on wheel of your target. If you do enough damage to a unit it shows death on its wheel.

Destroy their shit or at least destroy more BV (also printed on the base) of their shit than they did of yours before time is up.

>>50643992
>>50653644
This isn't in the mediafire files?

>>50646390

>is presently working on a fic story about a merc company doing a raid on a Drac planet, Wolves show up, they all figure "Fuck clanners" and team up, no fucking involved and no pro-clanner bullshit

>>50657041
>>50643992
>>50653644
Here ya go, the best I could find. There isn't any updated torrents on the usual sources I go to, so I dug up this. It has the mech, aero and battle armor designers, but the map maker is in there as well.
Heavy Metal Archive (OLD)
http://www.mediafire.com/file/8so68gbw3yga4cb/2016-12-11_HeavyMetal-Archive-OLD.rar

>>50657712

>Wolves
>Raiding a Drac planet

The fuck?

>>50656447
You are not a grog, you cool

>>50657931
nice

thank you!

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I dont think we're allowed to rag on gundams for being made of paper anymore, guys.

Paging Xotl to the Errata-phone.
.
-Mobile Field Bases. On p. 150 of StratOps, it lists a crew requirement of 5 per MFB and says to check the rules on p. 330 of TM. But MFBs are on p. 330 of TacOps, not the Tech Manual. TacOps also says DropShips and larger vessels can't have them any way. Either the restriction needs to be overturned (I don't see what the big deal with a MFB on a spaceship is, so that would be my vote) or the entry for MFBs needs to be removed.

-Repair Bays. On p. 334 of TacOps it specifies that JumpShips and WarShips can only have one repair bay each, and that a facing for the bay must be designated. But then the Naga (Caspar II Control Ship) in JHS: Terra on p. 179 has 9 repair bays, none of which have a facing designated and all of which are located in repair bays. The Newgrange Yardship on p. 123 of JHS: 3076 also allocates its repair bay to a cargo bay with no allocated facing, and the Faslane (which, admittedly, hasn't appeared since the very old Explorer Corps SB) also has its repair bay in a cargo slot.

Since I doubt they want to go fucking around with record sheets I suggest the TacOps rules just get changed to making everything allocate their repair facilities to cargo bays.

>>50658438
That's from a Gundam where guns just don't work against mobile suits though. That's hardly indicative of the series as a whole.

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>>50658438
But they do have such weak necks though.

>>50658609

>and all of which are located in repair bays

Cargo bays, I mean.

>>50655835
>Tomorrow, there will be judges likely looking to reattach the genitals they just lost.
I think I FTFY. Fuck's sake, does *no-one* take their responsibilities seriously in the age of the smartphone!?

>>50658438
That's what you get when a unit specifically equipped with anti-beam armour (which is the primary purpose of the Nano-Laminar armour used on Mobile Suits in this setting) gets hit with a beam weapon.
Still some damage, but the machine remains functional.

The farming community a fair bit behind him (and which he jumped in front of) not so much.

Got a fair bunch of people who didn't quite realise that quite upset, tho.

>>50658784

Man, I can't even get my students to memorise their god damn nine times tables because their mobiles can do that for them.

Even though there's the fucking trick with your hands to work with and they only have to go to 9*10.

Thinking about what the world will look like in another 30 years when they start moving into positions of power is frankly terrifying.

>>50653644
Looks otherwise

>>50659131
Double wrong

Whats it like to be so wrong all the time?

>>50659259
You tell me

>>50659259
>>50659287
Either just couple or get in the circle of equals already.

>>50657931
Question: In the map maker section, there is a set of "NewMaps" in one of the sub-archives. They are listed from 2 though 7. I seem to recall someone saying a couple of the map sets are missing from the mediafire files. Are these it?

>>50659307
Why not both?

>>50655807
Technically no Streak system can load anything BUT Streak rounds. Artemis systems can load anything their normal launcher can -- they just don't get the effects of the Artemis system unless the missiles are also Artemis enabled. Likewise, normal missiles don't work with a Narc system -- only Narc-capable missiles do.

Streaks pay for their lack of tactical flexibility with their all-or-none mindset. There's no more succeeding on a hit only to watch 1 of your 6 missiles impact the target, wasting the heat and ammo for a pitiful amount of damage.

>>50654891
where does it say that the typical clan ASF pilot is 4/4?

>>50655970
Infantry are less time consuming than mechs can be. Anyone ever played on a megamekNET campaign server before? Most of the people there will take ages per turn because they are calculating ranges from every square to make sure that all their mechs are in their optimum weapon bands while staying out of your optimum bands while ALSO having the optimum movement mods. Some people calculate this for several turns at once to make sure that their follow up turns don't leave them in a bad position. One round can easily take half an hour or more.

Infantry is pretty much a no brainer. Either they stand still and shoot field guns which takes literally seconds to do in MM or they move 3 hexes and shoot some shitty rifles at a mech that is probably 3 hexes away. Most of the time, the jump infantry wont get to shoot anything because they will be too far away. You dont have to worry about facing or terrain mods with jump infantry and since the weapons are so short range you can eyeball ranges.

You dont even need to kill every single infantry unit in the game either because you can easily set MM to declare a victory if a certain % of a player's force is lost.

>>50661053
They were probably talking about the tabletop then. And all that tracking.

>>50660942
I know that 4/4 goes back to the BT Compendium.

TW puts it at 4/5 though.

>>50660942

What >>50661121 said. Herb put in a pretty concerted effort to sabotage the skill level of the Clans in general, decades of fluff and rules be damned.

>>50654243
They actually made a new MOO remake. Going to give it a shot next weekend to see if it holds up to the originals.

>>50652606
>>50652757
>>50653114
Text and stats originally submitted to FASA are here: www.battletechuniverse.org/hpguplink/viewtopic.php?t=14132
The thread has a few follow-up comments from the writer too.

>>50652553
Think of it as an Ultra Gauss Rifle, with two separate banks of capacitors.

>>50661983
It's not sabotage, you butthurt furry. The decline in the Clan-Inner Sphere gap began during the Clan Invasion, and was pretty much done by the Great Refusal. When the Clans first invaded they were able to use trinaries to defeat entire regiments, and by the Great Refusal Inner Sphere companies were defeating binaries. The gap closed in skill. Get over it.

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>>50656141
>considering everything to the point of obsessiveness
On that note: were the TRO entries going to sort weapons by location? I think sorting by BV (not counting add-ons or non-weapons) would be easier to read.

>>50662419

The skill gap never closed. The troops used in the Great Refusal were the most elite of every nation involved and all came up short on a one-for-one basis against the Clans aside from the St. Ives Compact who had Kai.

Yes, the Great Refusal happens. No, things do not scale directly from there.

Not that this matters when what we're discussing is the ASF phenotype going from bona fide improvements over the IS in skill from old rules. Especially since their higher piloting skill and G-tolerance rules let them exploit their movement more, which was a key element in the old rules for Aero stuff before firing arcs changed and it became more advantageous to just Brickfighter your way through everything.

And the explicit reason given when I asked the writers about the change was that Marthe Pryde said so in Grave Covenant, completely ignoring the fact that she was mocking that idiot Asa Taney, the novels where Clan pilots outperform those of the IS, and the previous iterations of the rules where Clan pilots were flat-out better.

And Elementals also succumb to that retardation.

And the MW3/AToW rules extensively sabotage Clan characters, to the point it's easier to generate skilled IS characters than skilled Clan ones now.

The *tech* gap between the Clans and IS closed rapidly. The skill gap never did.

>>50662419

The <equipment> gap was what closed you mongloid, and the engagement you mention is very explicitly a bunch of veteran (3/4 average) and elite (2/3 average) formations taking on Clan formations.

Better equipment+top 10% of the IS MechWarrior population = can defeat Clan formations when having a 20% numerical advantage.

Inner Sphere Warriors still default to 4/5 and Clan Warriors still default to 3/4. That fluff has never changed and has never been retconned. In fact, it's still true in the RPG as well; Clan Trueborn MechWarrior packages start you off as (the BT equivalent of) 1-point better in both Piloting and Gunnery.

It's just that the BV rules don't <force> you to pay for 3/4 skills whenever you've got a Clan Mechwarrior. Which they should. Any time you have a frontline Clan force, the minimum required G/P scores should be 3/4.

The reason the rules don't force you to do it all the time is that it's still possible to have secondline/freeborn Clan forces, which since they're canonically measureably worse pilots than the frontline forces they can be 4/5.

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post a pic that sums up the FedCom alliance

>>50663039

I can't this is a blue board.

Otherwise I would try to find a a weebum or .gif Germanic-looking type getting assfucked and handing everything they own over to the assfucker before being beaten black and blue and laughed at.

>>50663020

>It's just that the BV rules don't <force> you to pay for 3/4 skills whenever you've got a Clan Mechwarrior. Which they should. Any time you have a frontline Clan force, the minimum required G/P scores should be 3/4.

I'm not so sure about this. The way BV already works on Clan machines forces Clan players towards a playstyle that gets ranted about *a lot* in these threads, and making them pay more for pilots would pretty much enshrine it as the only viable choice if you didn't want to lose the game before the first roll of the dice.

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>>50663039

>>50663163
>The way BV already works on Clan machines forces Clan players towards a playstyle

Then that is a problem with BV. The purpose of rules is to allow players to play a game that is reasonably representative of the fluff (or the actual history, in the case of a historical wargame, which BT practically is anyway).

If the rules don't allow that, then they are bad rules.

The old rules that simply gave Clanners a free 3/4 pilot were better, because they allowed more "historically" accurate results to happen.

>>50663278

Yeah, but battle value, like any proper balancing system, needs to just account for how good a force is on the field; it needs to be setting agnostic. Fluff considerations can't enter into it, or you might as well say that Steiners historically field heavier forces and so the fact that assault mechs cost more BV is forcing them to play unrealistically and so the system is bad.

Piloting Skill BV is definitely overpriced, however. Dropping the cost on that would help players field more accurate Clan forces, by making it more representative of its actual value. But that's a balance issue first, and a fluff issue second.

>>50633123
new to battletech, is this game sold in europe ?

>>50663510
I think the real issue is that skill BV charges you on things unrelated to the skill. A 0/5 in a CGR-1A1 is not much more threatening than a 10/5 in same Charger because all that is improved is five small lasers. Wow.
Despite that, being a better shot causes a surcharge on all the bits of the mech that have nothing to do with being a better shot.
The same goes for piloting skill.

I've run simulations (admittedly just throwing the megamek bots at each other) and 25k bv of 3/4s loses to 25k bv of 4/5s ever damn time no matter what I put them in.

>>50663557
I know for certain it was sold in Germany as some of their translations show up from time to time with edited art (see: Tales of the Black Widow cover.)
Ral Partha should still sell miniatures and some sourcebooks.
http://www.ralparthaeurope.co.uk/shop/battletech-c-1/miniatures-c-1_3/mechs-c-1_3_4/
Check the catalyst web site, but we warned, I think their ordering system is not good from what I have heard.

>>50663557
Hell yes. Finland reporting, I just checked and there's a shitload of BT stuff for sale at my FLGS and/or on its webshop. Even the intro box (which was, however, listed as "uncertain availability"), was listed, price 66 E-bills.

Man, the Axman looks brutal, the -2N is basically a super Catapult, and that irks me a little because I have to wait the Jihad for a simple upgrade of my mechfu the -C1

>>50663772
C1 is an extremely efficient brawler for it's time. Why fuck with a good thing?

>>50663768
Torille!

>>50663278
>>50663510

The problem here is the BattleTech is BOTH a historical wargame (essentially), and a tournament wargame.

>The purpose of rules is to allow players to play a game that is reasonably representative of the fluff.
is a historical wargamer's mindset.

>battle value... needs to just account for how good a force is on the field; it needs to be setting agnostic.
is a tournament gamer's mindset.

The two are - in practice - mutually exclusive, and BattleTech is trying to be both simultaneously. It's probably worth mentioning that the BV tournament rules for BattleTech are exactly that: balancing rules for TOURNAMENTS.

If you're trying to get "historical" results out of them, it's not going to work. But they shouldn't be used for "historical" conflicts in the first place, which is where most people seem to go wrong.

In a pickup or a tourney game, with no other special rules in play, the game is setting agnostic. The fluff doesn't matter, and so make all the 4/5 frontline Clanner pilots you want. In a historical (or historical-inspired) game, you shouldn't be using BV anyway because it's not made to balance that, so feel free to make the Clanner pilots correct and matching the fluff.

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>>50663772
Are you talking about the Catapult-C1b?

>>50663815
CASE and maybe DHS would be appreciated, I don't ask for more

>>50655739
Optional rules are your friend. Look for stuff about bracing or aimed fire

I'm having a hard time picking a faction. I got the intro box set as an early Christmas present and have been reading up on the five great houses.

How did you pick your favorite factions? The Liao seem sneaky, the Steiner seem all assault all the time (makes me think of Tiger tanks), etc. It's hard to pick.

>>50664614
I went burd so I could use WoB kit post-Jihad.

>>50664614
If you like all of the styles or parts of all, you can always pick a third party faction, like Mercenaries or Periphery.

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>>50664903
Or combine the two, for periphery mercs.

>>50661053
I do what they do, in terms of ranges and next-turn setup, but I can do in in about a minute per mech, often faster.

Helps that I look at the board and plan out my overall movement. Can always change later, but it's really, really helpful to have an idea of where you want to go and where you can stop along the way.

>>50664614
Don't ask us. We're mostly GM's not tourney players so we play everybody. Double extra dose of FWL because it's the best place to run low level RPG campaigns in most eras.

>>50640708

Speaking of, was there a site to look at all those photoshop faction pinups we had going on.

>>50664277
You just keep suggesting wallpaper to put over the glaring structural fault.

>>50665309

I am sorry, but what you're describing isn't really a fault, it's a feature. Get to the middle of the board and pick up an opponent's severed limb and beat them to death with it. That was the original intent for playstyle, and that's the paradigm the rules were designed around. Long-range combat was never really supposed to be something to completely rely on.

I actually would like to theorize about changing some stuff around, though. Think about swapping long and short ranges on some weapons, so that LRMs had a +0 from 15-21 hexes and a +4 underneath 7 hexes. Same for PPCs. Maybe lasers (being light-speed weapons) just get a +2 at <all> ranges. Autocannons stay as-is. I wonder what that would do to the game paradigm.

So is it true?

Do none of the writers or designers of Battletech really have any intention of advancing the storyline from the quagmire of perpetual circlejerks that is the 3025 era?

>>50665963

If I read between the lines correctly Ben H Rome leave CGL because of grognard pandering. His book was postponed so many times he thought it would never be released and even Campaign Companion was affected by it (it was supposed to feature a short story about Julian Davion that was removed from the final book)

So I believe we can blame Mr. Porch and Mr. I-Forgive-Mr-Porch-cuz-imma-Mormon

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>>50665897
>I actually would like to theorize about changing some stuff around, though

Actually, here.

Like all long-term BattleTech players, I tend to futz around with rules revisions to make the game more like what I'd like to see. Those of you who remember the NEAutocannon discussions, this is the rules revision that followed that discussion.

Basically, if I ran the zoo (and could start BT over again), this is the current example of how it'd look at the 3025-era weapon table. It's been more complicated (rapid-fire ACs, PPCs and lasers add heat to the target), but all of that in practice makes the game harder to play and harder to recognize, so this is about smoothing the balance between weapon types and making sure all weapons have a niche. Also, about trying to ensure there's no one "perfect" weapon (looks hard at medium lasers).

>>50665963
IlClan has mentioned a few times as being released next year. So no, unless that book winds up being completely gutted of all timeline advancement stuff (no indication of that has been given).

>>50666329
I think they're just getting the grog money while they get their new box ready for launch with the new shimmyseens.

It's silly to think they won't advance the timeline at all when the people in charge wrote the vast majority of the original late Dark Age material.

>>50665963
>designers of Battletech really have any intention of advancing the storyline

I'm sure they have the *intention* of doing so. They're just terrified to do it.

The Battletech franchise operates on a shockingly low and shoestring budget as it is, and almost all of the contact that the producers actually have through their fanbase is through the OF or Facebook/BattleChats. Given the way the fanbase skews in those mediums, they're under the impression that a huge proportion of their fanbase is Davion-leaning, 3025-forever grogs.

It's then an *understandable* reaction on their part to pander to the portion of the fanbase they know that exists. Due to previous storyline issues, they know that when they make a game storyling decision that hurts one or more factions, a portion of the fanbase leaves and stops spending money. The fanbase - as TPTB see it - has deteriorated so far that the TPTB are terrified of losing ANY of their fanbase, and least of all what seems to them to be the largest portion.

Hence, 3025 circlejerks for the immediate and the foreseeable future. Or until there's a leadership change at the dev level that is OK with the risk.

>>50658784
>does *no-one* take their responsibilities seriously in the age of the smartphone

No. They don't. Also, as of today, smartphones are banned from the salle. They can be on the table outside where people can hear them ring (through a door portal), but they are not allowed in the fighting area (unless you're filming a fight). As expected, people are pitching an absolute shitfit.

>>50666228
I'm not sure about the PPC having those brackets; I think it might be better off like the autocannon, but with a large medium range bracket and relatively little long range (like maybe long range is 16-18)

>>50666228
the big issue I see here is that LRMs would end up getting fucked over in the 60s and later as everything gets more mobile, because it gets easy to get in the long range bracket and generate high TMMs at the same time while blasting with short range weapons

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Wait a minute, where is the Anzu miniature? Hasn't this thing been out awhile?

>>50665897
What you're talking about is what the Minimum Range penalties were basically designed to do. To encourage players to use weapons at the ranges they were intended. Rushing in to engage at point-blank with LRMs and PPCs are not what those weapons are for.

And leading into what >>50666228 is saying:
You could get a close effect without rewriting all of the weapons range charts by spiking the
Minimum Range modifier from +3 to +4 or even +6. Make it a 'Hail Mary' type of modifier -- the type of play you do if you're desperate or caught with your pants down.

But if you really are going to do it, I'd change the names from Short/Medium/Long to something like 'Optimal'/'Suboptimal'/'Not Optimal' to avoid confusion.

Can someone explain melee weapons to me? I get that they have the rule of cool behind them, but they seem kind of shit? If I'm going to spend all these tons on a weapon, shouldn't it be better than a kick?

>>50667712
They're garbage and kicks are better. Sorry bro.

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>>50667712

The only thing that makes them decent at all is the unofficial "melee weapons hit on punch table" rule, and that they can potentially hit the head even not using that rule. Other than that, no, they're not better.

>>50667712
Mostly worse than just using kicks, with a few exceptions (hatchet+TSM Spider is my favorite custom, becomes even more fun when the hatchet gets a head hit location)

>>50666395
I used to teach Karate, and while banning smartphones is definitely a great idea, I don't think you're completely blameless. I'm sure you know fights get chaotic. Even if the judge had been on point, you still might have gotten whacked up by a zealous fighter.

As I was taught, and in turn taught my students: unless you are involved with the fight, there is absolutely no reason to step inside a ring.

If someone can be a bro and help me out, I need screencaps of the Nova Cat RATs from the Clan invasion era. Maybe from the Revival trials pdf or Era Report 3052 if it has them.

>>50667712

Hatchets and stuff have an option to take a to-hit penalty and roll on the Punch chart. That's pretty significant, since it means anything that hits for 12+ damage can instantly kill the enemy.

They also don't cause you to check to see if you fall over when you miss, for the most part.

There are a few that are designed to suck (eg, Retractable Blades) but for the most part they're worth using.

Try putting a Mace on a TSM-equipped 80-tonner some time. You can hit a 6/9 movement curve and hit people over the head with 40 damage physicals from the Mace, shit is surreal.

>>50667877
>here is absolutely no reason to step inside a ring.

He didn't. Go read the post again.

There was a wide strip between the two rings, and he was crossing the room walking through that. The fighters left the ring because the judges weren't there to call a stop and that's why he got hit from behind.

Judoka here. He did absolutely nothing wrong. It's 99% on the judges for fucking off, and 1% on the fighters for not realizing they were leaving the sparring area.

>>50667712
Well, they usually have easier to-hit numbers.

>>50667712
Yeah, the problem is that kicks are too easy to hit with. They should be raised in difficulty a bit.

>>50668663

Kick difficulty is fine, as are punches.

It's the other trade-offs that make the decision.

More damage in one place but risks of falling over if you fail with kicks, or two chances to hit with less damage, no chance to fall over, and the possibility (depending on mass) of decapitating the enemy.

And that's before you get into situations like maybe being behind a Hunchback or other similarly thin-skinned opponent with juicy torso ammo slots you might be able to crit out.

>>50667712
I've been giving every mech with a hand weapon the extended torso twist quirk (as part of the tonnage spent), so it makes it worthwhile to have them.

Ok since a lot of the newer stuff seems to be centered in 3025, and I never played that era, I have some questions about it.

For starters, what was mech production for each of the main factions like?

I know some of the original fluff was retconned, but like what were each of the Houses building?

Off the bat I can guess:
>Kurita - Panthers and Dragons
>Davion - Enforcers, JagerMechs, BattleMasters
>Liao - Vindicators, Ravens, Cataphrachts, Urbies
>Steiner - Zeuses, Commandos, Banshees
>Marik - Awesomes and Trebuchets

>>50669167
>For starters, what was mech production for each of the main factions like?
Bugs, bugs everywhere.

>>50669167

I don't think the Raven would be really in mass production at that time period.

>>50666076

As a newbie to this thread I must ask what the meaning of constant references to porches and Mormons mean.

>>50669167

Your list is mostly accurate but there are some to add and some to subtract. There is more but I don't remember them all off-hand.

Dracs: Phoenix Hawk, Wolverine, Archer, Charger, Atlas.
Davion: Valkyrie, Centurion, Dervish, Rifleman, Victor.
Steiner: Wolfhound, Hatchetman, Griffin, Crusader, Thunderbolt, Flashman, Warhammer, Highlander, Atlas.
Marik: Spider, Hermes, Hermes II, Wolverine, Orion.

The BattleMaster is always strongly associated with the Suns but isn't made there. It's made in the FWL and Lyran Commonwealth, with them and the Dracs having more than anyone else. The Suns is actually called out as having less than anyone else, even the CapCon.

>>50669167
Handy dandy spreadsheet time

>LC: All Bugs, Commando, Firestarter, Vulcan, Hatchetman (brand spanking new at the time so rare), Phawk, Chameleon, Griffin, Rifleman, Crusader, Thunderbolt, Archer, Warhammer, Marauder, Flashman downgrade (3039 retcon), Zeus, Battlemaster, Stalker, Longbow, Banshee, Atlas
>DC: Panther, Phawk K, Dragon, Grand Dragon (brand new so rare), Quickdraw, Charger, Atlas, Stinger LAM, also possible Archer factory in old Rasalhague
>FS: Locust, Wasp, Hornet downgrade (3039 retcon), Valkyrie, Phawk, Centurion, Enforcer, Dervish, Griffin, Wolverine, Rifleman, Jagermech, Marauder, Victor, Longbow, Atlas (Quentin), Marauder II (goonsclusive)
>CC:Locust, Stinger, Raven (prototype so rare), Vindicator, Wolverine, Rifleman, Thunderbolt, Cataphract, Victor, Highlander downgrade (3039 retcon)
>FWL:All Bugs, Flea, Spider, Cicada, Hermes II, Vulcan, Hunchback, Trebuchet, Griffin, Shadowhawk, Wolverine M, Quickdraw, Rifleman, Crusader, Thunderbolt, Archer, Warhammer, Guillotine downgrade (3039 retcon), Marauder, Orion, Awesome, Goliath, Battlemaster, Stalker

Boy, that took a bit longer to type than I expected. Feel free to throw most of the goofy retcons out, like the Highlander, Flashman, Guillotine etc.

>>50669269

Loren L. Coleman embezzled somewhere upwards of 750, 000 from CGL during the early days of the company. One place the money is suspected to have gone is the renovations being performed on his house. The figure got leaked because one of the other company owners put out the info graphics used in the meeting to discuss it.

This was forgiven by Randall Bills, who owned the company, because Loren is a close friend of his and Randall at least is a Mormon so felt he had to. I forget whether Coleman is or not too.

The impact was mostly felt immediately on the Shadowrun side of things where some staff quit outright over it and one staff member who was an accountant for her real job was asked to audit the books. When she finished that and came back saying she didn't want to work with a company that was going to keep the embezzler due to ethical concerns she was told to fuck off.

The BT side wasn't hit as badly at the time because most of them are/were friends with Coleman.

In a real way, CGL never recovered from the theft. They could have done a lot more with that operating capital, especially for things like Leviathans.

Don't forget Marik does Thug life too.

>>50669521
That TRO:3039 entry is one of the worst ever.

"Hey guys, you know how we hoard all our PPC production for Warhammers and Awesomes, so much that our Marauders have Large Lasers?"
"Yeah?"
"Apparently we actually have a giant stash of Warhammer PPC's that we can use to make more Thugs a year than Ronin makes Warhammers."

>>50669604

I still think the Catapult one is worse.

"So we need to give the Dracs something else with PPCs. I vote we put in a Warhammer line somewhere, they have their own variant and it seems like they'd love that shit."
"No, give them a Catapult facility."
"Why, the Catapult is really tied to the CapCon, if we're putting a new factory in for it somewhere shouldn't it be there?"
"Dracs have a Catapult variant. MIKE DROP BITCHES!"

*Flounces out of planning meeting.*

>>50668752
The issue with kick/punch balance is that a huge number of mechs have good weapons in their arms or lack hand/arm bits. These both simplify the kick/punch decision to "No fucking duh" instead of the interesting question it should be.

>>50669400
Steiner was building Highlanders? Wasn't Liao too?
And I think Thunderbolts go to the Mariks as well.

>>50670160
Steiner was not. They had the original factory that got smoked. It was Hollis on Corey making them for Liao.

Really dumb retcon in any case, especially when you consider the Northwind Highlander novel where the guy is piloting one of the first Highlanders made in centuries in the mid-3050's. One of the best moments in the book is the enemy commander driving a Warhammer that dates back to the 1st Succession War, and the warbook in his machine's DI is able to identify the Highlander when none of the newer mechs in his force can but he has no fucking clue what it is.

>captcha Locanda Colemore
kek

File: 2496384.jpg (62KB, 600x476px) Image search: [Google]

62KB, 600x476px

So how often does your units fight in the snow? Have you been in extreme weather conditions where the ambient temperature lowered your mech's heat levels?

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189KB, 886x546px

>>50670334
I don't do different temperature much, or wind or storms. Even different times of day fucks up things something serious. Spotlight quirk is actually super valuable there.

I've fought on airless moons before though. It's absolutely crazy. You move so much faster because of the low gravity but breach checks, breach checks everywhere.

>>50669498
The Suns weren't producing the BattleMaster, Awesome or Trebuchet?
And didn't the Marauder II become available after the 4th Succession War?

>>50670160
T-bolts and Riflemen and Crusaders and Phoenix Hawks.

>>50669498
Damn, Marik has like the best mech production spread of all.

>>50670297

Steiner gets a retconned Star Corps damaged facility on Son Hoa in TR 3039 which is returned to full production status not long after that.

AFAIK the Son Hoa facility is the first to resume Highlander production. It's listed as such in HB: HS.

According to HB: HL, the Corey facility only manufactures the Huron Warrior and Catapult. It only had the ability to make spare parts for the Highlander, but lost that by the end of the 4th SW.

>>50670500
Suns didn't produce any of that stuff at all. The Battlemaster is only famous with them because Hanse Davion drove one. But so did Teddy Kurita and the Snakes didn't make them either.

That list is also 3025. Post 4th war would be 3029+ which is a little different. By say the War of 3039, Dracs would have converted their Charger line to the Hatamoto Chi, added the Daboku, Quinton would have changed hands, Liao loses pretty much all their production except Keystone and Sian and a few other things.

>>50670571
Son Hoa doesn't come back online in any capacity until the mid-3030's and only refits. They don't make new machines from scratch until the original manufacture date in 3057.

>According to HB: HL, the Corey facility only manufactures the Huron Warrior and Catapult. It only had the ability to make spare parts for the Highlander, but lost that by the end of the 4th SW.

Read the actual TRO:3039 entry. They made functional machines from trashed salvage under license until the 4th War when the Fedsuns took Corey and the license was revoked.

>>50670500

>The Suns weren't producing the BattleMaster, Awesome or Trebuchet?

Nope. Everyone has some of those in that era but the Suns doesn't build any.

As I said before, everyone thinks the Suns builds the Battlemaster or has lots of them but it's only associated with them due to Hanse having one. Assaults in general are very rare in the Suns and they have the smallest contingent of BLRs going.

>>50666228
I'm a fan of this, except I would make the AC/10 9 tons and 4 heat, and actually extend the range of the AC/20 a little bit, and make it 15 tons to mirror the Gauss Rifle. Say, 3/7/11? I'd also give the AC/2 30 shots, so it's 15 for specialty ammo. Easier to grok.

I assume SRM ammo is the same as it already is? Or would we change them to all pack 100 missiles per ton, or as close to it as possible (so 16 shots for the SRM6)?

>>50670570
They do. It's just offset by really low numbers of production for a number of their lines. Stuff like the Vulcan is basically garage shop level, and the Regulan Marauders and Warhammers aren't much better. The stuff you get in quantity is places like the famous super complexes on Kalidasa.

>>50667561
>Short/Medium/Long to something like 'Optimal'/'Suboptimal'/'Not Optimal'
Oh wow, this is a really cool way of thinking about it. I'd play BT with this kind of range bracketing/modifier system.

>>50670500

>And didn't the Marauder II become available after the 4th Succession War?

Thorny issue.

The MUL lists it as being pretty much a Dragoons exclusive and shared only with other companies they like until at lest Project Phoenix.

But we also have fluff for the Suns getting some almost from the start, and hijacking entire production runs during the FCCW.

So whatever floats your boat.

>>50670636

OTOH, saying they "built" Highlanders is a pretty big stretch. Repaired and returned to service, sure, actually had a production line for it? Not really.

Approaching bump limit
New thread
>>50670739

>>50670744
>OTOH, saying they "built" Highlanders is a pretty big stretch. Repaired and returned to service, sure, actually had a production line for it? Not really.

>"involving rebuilding destroyed chassis almost from scratch"

That's a direct quote from the thing. Don't get me wrong, I think almost all that stuff is completely retarded and messes with too much of the rest of canon to be used seriously.

>>50669701
The Drac factory is a 3039 retcon, the Catapult-K2 was not, having been a variant mentioned in the original TRO3025. It would make sense to give the Caps something, given their being known for a' mech that was produced for all of three years in the 2500s - so they did, in XTRO:Primitives 4. In the Xanthos write-up it's mentioned that after the Xanthos prototype was rejected and the SLDF contract for Catapults ran out, Hollis produced Catapults under the table and sold them outside the Terran Hegemony, explaining at last why the 'mech was even still around in the 31st century.

Hollis industries factory still got blowed up in the early stages of 1SW though, taking with it the Caps BattleMaster and Catapult production.

>>50671032

>The Drac factory is a 3039 retcon, the Catapult-K2 was not, having been a variant mentioned in the original TRO3025.

I know. I'm saying that if you're going to put the Catapult back into production anywhere the logical place to do it is the CapCon.

If you want to give the Dracs another double PPC design the logical choice is the Warhammer, especially since they never get a line for it ever despite having Warhammer refits and their numbers of Warhammers absolutely dwarfing their numbers of the Catapult.

>>50671146
They actually did get a Warhammer line in the First Succession War sourcebook - Amalgamated Sword and Steel makes them. It doesn't say where they made them, or what happened to the factory, but my guess is it got blown up in the First War with everything else.

>>50671188

It has to have been destroyed because it's never mentioned again. Certainly isn't listed in any 3rd/4th War source and the Dracs don't even get a Warhammer line in HB: HK.

But boy howdy, we'd better give them a factory for an obscure refit on a very rare 'Mech.