/a*pg/ - A*P General

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NO MODS, NO MASTERS

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>>7209945
mods too autistic to pay attention, post aap pics

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>>7209925
Alright, testing this tripcode to see if it works. Sorry if this pisses some people off, but I'm just trying to avoid impersonation. If anyone wants to verify it is me, notice that the first question on the survey has the addendum "imposters BTFO".

Also reposting the survey again in case anyone hasn't seen it yet. The more responses we get, the better. We've already collected a lot more data than I was expecting.
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSdc90O0pJB2CITbgh3EEdXidbTUwk_kcGzkCykV7Im5l-Bayw/viewform

>>7209925
One in 50 AMABs? Really? That's amazingly high! Like, we're a political demographic at that point.

>>7209968
kill yourself retarded tripfaggot

>>7209968
nice new trip
i'm considering starting to namefag despite the potential of social suicide because i make so many fucking posts here and have enough differences from most posters that constantly restating them proves problematic
>>7209969
yes
the stigma attached to not just crossdressing and transsexualism but to admitting those things are motivated by a fetish means very few people are open about it
i suspect the aap number is similar or even higher, but aaps tend to not even know they're motivated by a fetish due to their demographics (young, exposure to transsexualism through tumblr alone, never heard of a*p or blanchard)

>>7209968
Honestly at this point I don't give a fuck about trips. I can recognize you, the 18 year old FTM who never capitalizes and is pushing his typology (and who by the way made this thread), the repeat-visit overmasturbator who won't go to a therapist because they're afraid of their parents finding out, the secondary AAP person who always leaves an empty line after responding to posts, and sometimes the smiley-spammer of yore though the last one is hard to detect. This is already a community of sort where you pick up identities if you just pay a bit of attention.

>>7209981
I don't think that most transsexuals of the A*P variety are really primarily driven by the fetish, though it is a factor. Still, I get what you mean.

>>7210037
yeah, i could've put it better
it's connected to one -- i'm of the school of thought that the dysphoria develops from the fetish while most of this thread thinks the fetish develops from the dysphoria, but it's a purely academic debate
but the only person i'd say was really DRIVEN by a fetish is anne lawrence

>>7210066
I remember you. Though I often disagree with you on this matter I really do appreciate you taking the time to help so many people in this thread.

>>7210000
>smiley-spammer of yore
I know all of those others, but which one is that? I mostly just remember the guy who always responds thoughtfully and kindly to posts, but is too old and unpassable to transition.

Also, I notice the OP has changed somewhat?

>>7210098
>Also, I notice the OP has changed somewhat?
i decided to streamline the op when i made this thread
we didn't need one 'does it make you trans' and one 'does it make you not trans' question, for instance

>>7210110
regarding bra sizing, you should check out /r/abrathatfits
the sizing they use is different to that you see on most websites and makes for a much more comfortable fit
they're open to trans women, so they should be equally open to crossdressers

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>try to read the thread title
>a star pidgey

>>7209956
That's not AAP, that's gay pictures.

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>>7210246
where do you think a lot of aaps get it?
>yaoi is written for straight girls
>straight girl, probably a bit gnc with pre-existing body image issues, with lewd thoughts enjoys yaoi
>straight girl projects own sexual fulfillment onto yaoi cuteboi
>straight girl's sexual identity comes to revolve around her projections of her own sexuality onto guys
>straight girl's sexual identity comes to revolve around being a guy
>optional end: straight girl becomes gay boy
hell, i have multiple exes who did exactly that
it's almost an inherent aspect of aap

>>7210259
>hell, i have multiple exes who did exactly that
Rough. How does it feel when your ex changes sexuality after your relationship ended?
And why do you have MULTIPLE exgirlfriends like that?

>>7210268
because i myself am ftm
they gravitate towards me

>>7210259
>tfw aap but don't like yaoi
>don't even like men that look like men
I can't even find any porn to self insert in cause straight porn guys are too masculine to identify with but crossdressers always get fucked by guys (even if it's dojinshi with a canonically straight/dominant guy, why do people do this)

>>7210268
Stand users attract other stand users

>>7210271
>ftm
Guess that's why. I can't understand that mindset at all. I can't see why anyone would want to be male.

>>7210305
I understand intellectually but I can't deny it triggers me to see the people I'd like to be like "throwing it away". I'm sure they feel the same way haha.

>>7210305
it's no more a want than it is for a trans woman
if i perceived it as a want, i'd be just as bewildered by mtfs as you are by ftms
but knowing it isn't a want, it makes perfect sense the multiple conditions that make up transsexualism would work in both 'directions'

...what happened to the last thread, was it out-trumped?

>>7210360
It was deleted and remade by a mod triggered by us wanting to include AAPs.

>>7210313
>throwing it away
That's exactly how I see it too. Gotta be honest, FtM's kinda piss me off.
>>7210315
Then replace "want" with "need".
My point still stands that I can subjectively understand how you feel.

>>7210360
an insane autist mod decided to throw her toys out the pram, so agpg has been replaced by a*pg to trigger her

>>7210363
>>7210415

Wow so the founder complex netiquette enforcer was actually a mod?

(alt. there were at least two and one of them was a mod)

I had my suspicions this person was staff, but didn't want to actually think it was true.

>>7210447
Yeah, it really caught me by surprise.

>>7210447
so far as anyone can tell, yes
this is what's wrong with the elites
vive la revolution

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>>7209945
>>7210459
>>7210463

I'll be damned

Now I don't feel as bad for triggering out like a retard and calling this person out a couple threads ago

>>7210000

smiley spammer and empty liner might very well be the same one ;o)

>>7210447
So long as the OP still includes "agp", I don't mind. I need to be able to easily find the new thread.

you got literally everything you wanted, and you still can't leave us alone?

jesus fucking christ

>>7210259
>>straight girl's sexual identity comes to revolve around her projections of her own sexuality onto guys
>>straight girl's sexual identity comes to revolve around being a guy
So the same as AGP. But then explain straight AAPs/AGPs?

>>7210575
kinsey 1, just as 90%+ of heterosexuals are
kinsey 0 and 6 are exceptionally rare
also, not all a*p specifically develops from porn, there are multiple etiologies just as there are for any possible fetish and sometimes it apparently just happens innately without reason

>>7210447
>I had my suspicions this person was staff,
How did you suspect?

>>7210587
Mine didn't develop from porn but I still think it's basically that, sexuality flipped because it's easier and nicer to imagine myself as the opposite sex in a relationship.

>>7210000
>secondary AAP
?
What's a secondary AGP/AAP
I've seen terms like secondary TS but that's news to me

>>7210305
>couple years ago
>have agp
>otherwise act masculine
>browse /fit/ and start lifting
>body in mirror becomes more and more muscly
>it doesn't feel like me, it feels like a different person (if that makes sense)
>get kinda turned on by it
I guess I was an agp who experienced aap? Lol

>>7210598
I strongly doubt the porn explanation since I got aroused by this shit long before watching any porn.

>>7210607
Nah, he's just the less frequent AAP poster.

>>7210598
>it's easier and nicer to imagine myself as the opposite sex in a relationship.
That sums it up perfectly 4me. I can't see myself happy in a relationship as a dude.

>>7210711
Yeah. Wonder why we're like this.

>>7210274
>Being a crossdresser
>Not wanting to be be fucked by guys

I've seen porn involving crossdressers fucking/sucking each other, its out there.

>>7210723
Yeah that's the kind I usually fap to (or just solo stuff), it just doesn't work for me nearly as good as trap x girl which is rare (even though I think I'm legit into traps rather than just like to self insert as one), it's like my brain only likes gay stuff as long as it doesn't pass some magical gay threshold

>tfw this is a schism
Are we Catholic or Orthodox?

>>7210804
catholics have a cooler aesthetic
>>7210779
>trap x girl which is rare
there's a whole lot of that on /d/

>>7210611
>>browse /fit/ and start lifting
>>body in mirror becomes more and more muscly
>>it doesn't feel like me, it feels like a different person (if that makes sense)
>>get kinda turned on by it
This hits waaaaay too close to home. I started lifting recently. This morning I looked in the mirror for a while thinking about the future. No joke, I started fearing getting turned on by my future muscles. Not because I would be turned on by myself and my body, but because I would be turned on at looking at my muscles, and imagining myself as a woman looking at my body.
So it's this weird fear of being turned on at the idea of being a woman having sex with a guy with my future body.
I hope that makes sense? Like I wish I could be a woman looking at the kind of body I'm trying to achieve?

>tfw autoattackhelicopterphile

Spending a prolonged period of time without masturbating makes me start despairing over my gender in a way that doesn't seem related. Why? Shouldn't it work the other way around, since not engaging in fantasies means I think of it less?

>>7212564
maybe less escaping with fantasies is causing you to think about/consider what your reality is actually like

>>7212564
possibly >>7212692
on the other hand, you could also be getting more sexually frustrated and expressing it through dysphoria

I'm pretty suicidal all the time yet I don't want to die. I want to be happy but I know it'll never happen. Is their a term for this feeling? Like suicidal cognitive dissonance?

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Is late onset AGP a thing?

I don't think I had any AGP thoughts until I was 20 and dysphoria also developed soon after. Can't help but feel like I'm just a beta male that's subconsciously given up on being a man.

>>7214241
>Is late onset AGP a thing?
agp by definition is late onset compared to other etiologies
20 is later than usual, but not particularly strange, and your agp-related transition-level dysphoria is if anything early onset (the majority of agp trans women transitioning in middle age wasn't just a factor of the past being more transphobic -- people started predicting 'the end of late transitioners' in 1976, but it takes time for most agps to require transition)
also, 'failed male' is a popular meme around here, but it doesn't make sense when compared to the evidence of what a lot of agps accomplish. bruce jenner was clearly not a failed male, he was america's image of masculinity for decades. caitlyn is obviously extreme both in how obvious it is she's agp and how much she accomplished pre-transition, but the general theme is that 'agp = failed male' does not make sense with what we know of agps.

>>7214254
It's just that AGPs that I personally know had AGP onset during or before puberty and so do a lot of posters in these threads. So I feel out of place.

With the "failed male" I meant more along the lines of being a male socially. I'm really shy in public and never had a relationship or had sex. Even if girls show interest I'm either oblivious until it's too late or completely fumble it. So maybe my brain deluded itself into thinking that I should become a woman instead of facing these things and being more of a man. Other that I'm doing well in life so the example of Bruce Jenner doesn't work.

>>7214371
>So maybe my brain deluded itself into thinking that I should become a woman instead of facing these things and being more of a man
if you faced those things, would it make you happy? does the idea of being a fulfilled man sound better than the idea of being a woman?

>>7214393
>does the idea of being a fulfilled man sound better than the idea of being a woman?
I'll never be a real woman so yeah if I could stop wanting to be a woman. But if I could just turn into a cis woman I would.

>>7214417
>I'll never be a real woman
put this aside
what makes you think you cannot be a 'real' woman? there are cis women with xy chromosomes and cis women who were raised as boys and cis women who have lived as adult men and cis women with skeletons closer to male than female norms and cis women who were born with penes. there are cis women with a whole lot of crazy shit, friend-o.
let's throw out a random intersex/dsd...prader stage 5 congenital adrenal hyperplasia. let's say you would become a cis woman with that. you would have been born with what is for all intents and purposes a penis, and would have had what is for all intents and purposes srs performed on you in infancy (really sucks for all the now-trans men with that condition). you will have naturally high testosterone levels and take hrt much like that of a trans woman to suppress it. would you rather be this cis woman over being a man?

It's cold out now, which means I can stop shaving my legs. This pleases the aap.

>>7214465
>put this aside
Then either is fine as long as I don't want to be the other sex.

>what makes you think you cannot be a 'real' woman?
I will never have a female reproductive system or female genitalia. Most of my features are more masculine than the average woman.

>would you rather be this cis woman over being a man?
No I want to be a normal and healthy member of either sex.

>>7214115
Why do you think you'll never be happy?

>>7214371
If it makes you feel any better I often fall for the failed male meme rhetoric sometimes even though I've had AGP fantasies as early as I can remember

>>7214710
You could not shave year round and pass it off as a feminist rebellion.

>>7214710

Conversely, since it's long pants season, I can shave and no one will know.

This is a new concept to me. Like, I'm questioning things about myself now.
So, as a biological female one finds it arousing to think of oneself as male...? Am I misunderstanding this?
I need to think on this....

>>7215237
I offer up my hairy legs as a form of gaining luck if someone is blessed enough to rub my legs.
No feminism. Pure laziness. Some luck.

>>7215287
That's really weird and also I now really want to rub one of your legs for luck.

>>7215278
that's what it is
what are you re-evaluating?

welp so we got two threads now

CGL you really remember lasermind?

I didn't get why people hated me

>>7216578
I think most people here just automatically hate trips.

>Be 12, AGP
>Have played on a Neverwinter Nights roleplaying server for a while
>Decide to make a female character, something I've never done before
>My heart starts racing
>Start physically shaking
>"Whoa that was weird lets continue as if nothing happened"
Did you have any experiences that in retrospect were blatant early signs that something was up but you completely ignored at the time?

>>7217743
I get hard when I make a female character in the Sims.

>>7217743
as time goes on I got used to that, but it doesn't turn me on anymore
know I just don't know if it's weird or not for normal people

http://www.vice.com/en_ca/read/porn-women-watch-pornhub-global-survey

some of this might be relevant to thinking about agp, especially:

>The porn star has to kind of look like me and be having the type of sex I'm having in real life.

>>7223711
>Most common porn category: lesbian
Weird.

>tfw the AGP fantasies are back
GOD FUCKING DAMMIT IT'S BEEN FUCKING WEEKS FUCK
It's really fucking weird, too. The thoughts are literally describing my fantasy life via greentext, then imagining the green texts. Fuck this is stupid.

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>>7223711
>Already suspected AGP
>can only (usually) enjoy lesbian porn when it's live action

Fuck.

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Are we the real, true gays?

>>7223711
>women like watching anal porn
But why?

>>7228016
I think anal is really popular in russia at least in porn not exactly sure why though. Also there are a lot more women in russia then there are men and it is mostly a conservative shithole so maybe women are trying to get into anal so they can attract a man and their family leaves them alone about being single.

>>7225029
Another Vice article claims Pornhub did a survey and apparently a lot of "straight" women watch lesbian porn because it is less violent and degrading.

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>>7227716
I'm made of leather, rum, and fear.

but that's just me =3

>>7228122
>a conservative shithole so maybe women are trying to get into anal so they can attract a man and their family leaves them alone about being single.
I like this explanation. I'll believe it.

>>7210259
it didn't happen that way for me

I always had fantasies of dudes fucking dudes and imagined myself as one of them, pretty typical aap
I didn't ever actually read yaoi but I heard about it on tvtropes and it was one of the first things that spoke to me

idk about your exes but the causal arrows pointed in different directions and different ways for me

>>7228491
>you're believing lies.
butthole daddy issues

>>7228513
>the causal arrows pointed in different directions and different ways for me
Meaning what?

>>7228016
I'm not sure what you're implying but women can enjoy and orgasm from anal sex

I'm attracted to AAPs. I'm tentatively bi, not into men who look like men, but mesh way better with guys on an emotional level. Is there something I should know? Sage because I'm not contributing anything.

>>7229984
Came here to post this, I'd call myself biscum but I'd only date FtM/AAP, yet at the same male personalities > female personalities

>>7230023
>yet at the same time* male personalities > female personalities
Please help me this is confusing

>>7229984
>>7230023
you do not want to date an aap trans guy, you want to date a csts or hsts trans guy
aaps usually have feminine personalities
bi/gay trans guys who aren't aap exist, though are uncommon and unlikely to let you touch their dysphoriaholes

>>7228016

Since it's Russia, maybe it's because there's no risk of pregnancy?

>>7230041
What do CSTS and HSTS stand for?

>>7230181

Classic transsexual and homosexual transsexual.

Check >>7163958 if you want to know what that even means.

>>7230041
I don't think it'd be right of me to date a transguy though. They want to take test and become distinctly masculine; a man that looks like a man. At least that's what would make sense to me given my admittedly limited experiences.

>>7230181
>>7230192
That's anon's typology btw, outside of this board they're mostly used kinda interchangeably

>>7230231
So you're into feminine looks but masc personality? Wouldn't it make more sense to date an AGP mtf or a tomboy? Or hell just a femboy?
Would you want to date a cis girl that's feminine in surface behavior (ie. mannerisms, hobbies) but has more of a male pattern thinking and emotions?

>>7230360
That's not me, I'm
>>7229984
>>7230023
To this reply >>7230041
I'd date an FtM probably regardless of whatever, as long as if he had a good male personality, but what's the difference between "transguy" and "AAP transguy?" You got me confused again

>>7230766
AAP transguys are just a subset/category of FtMs that came to transition in a specific way/from a specific background >>7230192, >>7210259

>>7230891
You can be A*P and trans/experience dysphoria, and it's common to be, though it's also possible and common to be A*P without dysphoria.

Both the A*P and dysphoria tend to escalate over time, and often in cases where only the A*P was present dysphoria will manifest eventually.

>>7230904
I still don't understand the difference between trans and AAP. Sorry for deleting that post but I was gonna rewrite that as it came off as retarded.

>>7230927
It's like a difference between a female and a bisexual, it's just two traits that can occur together but don't have to

Trans = someone who experiences gender dysphoria
AGP/AAP = someone who gets aroused by being the opposite sex

The reason anon brought it up is because A*Ps tend to behave more like their original gender post transition (so an AAP FtM is likely have feminine behavior and mindset, though not necessarily so)

>>7230927
Autoandrophilia is the sexual attraction to the idea of you being male/masculine (and autogynaephilia is likewise for being female/feminine). Transsexualism is wanting to be the opposite sex and feeling discordant with your birth sex. They often exist together, and individuals with A*P have a tendency to exhibit certain traits which distinguish them from non-A*P individuals (though it is just a tendency, and there is a great deal of inconsistency and overlap).

The thread previously linked (>>7163958) should give you an idea, though I'm not sure I'm personally comfortable with the apparent confidence with which it is presented without much evidence (despite the fact I can certainly subjectively agree with a lot of it). Persistent archive is at http://archive.loveisover.me/lgbt/thread/7163958 in case it gets bumped off the on-site archive.

>>7230998
>>7231016
Got it, thanks

>>7230041
>implying personalities are strictly "male" or "female"
I'm open to the idea that transsexuals are typically socialized as the other sex and so pick up more traits associated with that sex but that has more to do with how long you've spent living as the other sex and less with whether or not you're A*P. Strict typologies without outstandingly rigorous evidence are folly.

>>7231701
if it were purely socialization, csts and aap guys would be equally feminine after controlling for it
they aren't

>>7233886
I don't think it is purely socialization, just almost entirely. Beyond personal experience can you say, with rigor, that your two groups differ in this?