Please explain.

>>83439425
Animation in Japan is like slave labor.

one is actually animated

>>83439425
Animators in america get a living wage.

>>83439425
Every episode of Family Guy costs
2 M I L L I O N
M
I
L
L
I
O
N

Animation isn't difficult. I don't understand why Americans are so bad at it.

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>>83439444
The other is animated as well.

>>83439425
>east vs west thread: /co/ edition

>>83439458
Disney sucks up all the good American animators, leaving only bottom of the barrel for other networks.

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>>83439458

>>83439458
Current American animation is lazy corner cutting.
The golden age of animation in America is legit.

>>83439425
AT is animated at 24 fps, anime at 8 to 12 max. You surprised it costs almost exactly twice as much?

>>83439425
Japanese voice actors are a diamond dozen.

Japanese animators are in a doggy dog world.

Cut off the voice acting cost and the difference shrinks.

>>83439458
90% of static images with flapping mouths does barely counts as animation, anon.

>>83439425
>It's another "east vs west animation thread that will undoubtedly get a million replies even though both sides have their highs and lows and are respectable in their own right" episode.

Japanese animation staff are underpaid and work abusive hours.

>>83439465
Oh baby.

>>83439491
lol

>>83439491
It's easier to draw.

>>83439458
I thought they were animated in korea or something

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>>83439503
But that's also wrong, anon.

>>83439437
/thread

Almost all the voice actors from AT are celebrities. That should also be considered.

>>83439519
No it's not.

>>83439504
Pretty sure the mods and janitors who work at these times are far more chilled than the mods we will see in 12 hours time...

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>>83439425
Animation is cheap in japan because animators are cheap.

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This, but with yellow-skinned people.

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>>83439491
>AT is animated at 24 fps, anime at 8 to 12 max.

Yeah. Those extra frames are "totally" worth it.

>>83439449
>>83439437
I've seen it said that you'll make the same amount working at McDonalds in Japan as you would working in an animation studio.

>>83439425
It's no surprise it's that cheap considering all characters are clones with the same face and body type moving at 2 fps.

>>83439528
Yes, it is.

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>>83439502
You joking m8?

Japanese Voice acting is way bigger than it is in America, they still get the majority of the money.
Hell, there are people who follow their favorite va's instead of writers or directors and shit.

>>83439503
motion tweening in flash barely counts as animation as well, buddy

>>83439528
It really is.

>>83439425
American Animators have better contracts, Anime is done more cheaply and cut a lot of corners (Granted, they do it well and efficiently), and most of all...

If you look PAST the hard number you'd know that it's more expensive to live in America than it is in Japan. They have a lower minim living wage. (Example; it's 5% cheaper to live in Tokyo than it is to live in New York)

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>>83439531
>/co/ moderation
>working

>>83439425
The difference is American animators want more money, but with none of the love of passion for the job that Japanese animators have.

>>83439444
>>83439551
Man this excuse is worse every year, you do realize one of the most popular cartoons right now is PPG and they all look exactly the same, and it's still animated worse.

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Why can't western animation do anime right?

>>83439538
>24 fps
Remember this whenever some faggot makes you wait to load a 60fps vid on Youtube just to get decent picture quality in fullscreen.

>>83439425
American Producers get paid more.

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>>83439503

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>>83439551
Que?

>>83439567
Which would cost more? Getting a Japanese va to do a guest voice in a western cartoon or getting a western Va to do a guest voice in a Japanese cartoon?

>>83439567
And they're paid mainly from music sales.

The vast majority are quasi-amateurs.

>>83439596
But why do they do less while getting paid more?

>>83439597
>that choppy low fps movement

Ugh...gross.

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>>83439593
>implying American Sailor Moon wouldn't have just been outsourced back to Japan if it got picked up anyway.

>>83439624
The Patriarchy.

>>83439593
This is why I never watched western action cartoons. The animators can't draw.

>>83439523
>>83439465
I'm gonna assume that's fro Kyoanus, i.e the only studio in Japan that actually animates, but wastes all of it's potential on moeshit.

>>83439503
>implying the character is facing forward
>implying characters aren't conveniently covering their mouths
>implying the camera isn't watching from 500 yards away so that characters are tiny blobs
>implying the camera isn't focusing on some random static artsy object nearby while characters talk
It's like you don't even watch real anime.

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>>83439652
>when Murrica does it, it's great but when Japan does the same thing, it's bad

U-huh.

>>83439624
Wouldn't you?

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>>83439677
This is going to be funny. Think of one and then google it to see if it was actually animated in Japan.

Protip: It was. They all were.

>>83439678
Nah, that was Production IG.

>>83439678
>Production I.G. is now KyoAni

Anon pls.

>>83439680
There's good and bad japanese animation, just like there's good and bad american animation.

Do we seriously need to have this thread everyday?

>>83439680
>console plebs versus PC master race

>>83439533
Is this accurate?

Why are animators so underpaid? Is anybody trying to fix this?

>>83439700
>Korea is now Japan

>>83439597
>people keep posting this one webm as a counterargument to anime having static animation
>the fight still looks choppy and boring.

I know there must be better examples to cherry-pic.

>>83439437
But so is american too. They just outsources from korea.

>>83439728
I mean i guess it depends on what year we're talking about

>American animation vs Japanese animation
>they're actually both animated in Korea

>>83439465
>>83439425
what anime is this

>>83439732
You missed all the gifs before it?

I bet you don't even know what Kabaneri is.

>>83439734
The difference is Japan cares about what they're animating.

>>83439678
>Moeshit
So you are one of those "i watch mature anime for mature people like myself".
Fuck off

>>83439723
Because animators are the entertainment equivalent of manual labor. There's a lot of them, they work hard, and they're at the lowest point of the food chain so they're paid shit and can't really say anything or they'll just lose their jobs to koreans. Though there are korean animators that are surprisingly good at their job.

>>83439752
>Korean animation versus Korean animation

>>83439618
Cost more hard-number wise? The American because, as I stated in >>83439577
Americans have higher living requirement wages. Percentage to living wage-wise? Probably the Japanese person, because Disney/CN/Nick can shell out the cash big time.

>>83439680
The one below has smoother animation, though. Also, it's 3D so why even compare?

>>83439732
Tell me better fights in american cartoons then?

>>83439761
i dont even watch anime as much as i watch cartoons, but people cant seriously be thinking modern cartoons have superior animation to modern anime can they?

someone tell me its bait.

>>83439798
>people cant seriously be thinking modern cartoons have superior animation to modern anime

I accept your concession.

>>83439774
North Korean studios never work with Japanese studios so far.

>>83439761
That Attack on Titian ripoff that is actually supposed to be decent and looks realy nice in images? Don't worry, I will watch it at some point when it is dubbed.

>>83439771
And you're one of those waifufags
No you fuck off

>>83439680
The one on the bottom actually has about twice the frame rate of the one on top.

Here, in case you can't tell just by looking: gfycat[dot and by the way fuck you spam-detector-bot]com/IncompatibleHeftyBullfrog and use the frame-by-frame control on the bottom.

>>83439771
And you are one of those "I watch only the shallowest crap japan has to offer and anyone who disagrees with me is a tryhard who takes himself too seriously"
Fuck off to /a/.

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>>83439660
This is bait.
We all know that Korea makes both American and Japanese animations.


Ladies and Gentlemen of /co/, we should embrace our new Korean Overlords.

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>>83439732

Things in real life don't move with perfect fluidity.

>>83439844
Thank you
keep fighting the good fight

>>83439851
Anime isn't real, anon.

>>83439837
Yes and? I dont take anime seriously so i can enjoy stuff like K-on or Yuru Yuri.
And i just like cute girls.

>>83439798
Of course not, but obvious bait thread warrants obvious bait responses.

>>83439454
where does the rest of the money go then? macfarlane's pocket?

>>83439489
I want to fuck Maruko

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>>83439769
>Japan cares about what they're animating
>Probably only thinks this due to weeaboo tendencies of thinking Japan is awesome and honorbru
>Not realizing that both sides have an equal amount of dudes who are either Money-grubbing don't-give-a-shitters OR actually care for their work
>Also implying people like Faust, Craig, Sug, Disney, Barbera, Don Mother Fucking Bluth, and Chuck Jones didn't care for their work

>>83439860
>And?
And you have no opinion in an animation thread

Go be brain-dead in /a/

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>>83439798
You're probably just going to find people like OP on both sides cherry picking the best from one to compare to the worst of the other.

I for, for one, do think that western animation at its best is better than anime at its best but that on average anime is probably more consistently higher quality. Western animation has hit some seriously low lows in recent years that are dragging people's overall perception down.

>>83439523
That's not very well animated and a poor representation of belly dancing

>>83439425
nigga dont be comparing trash to Gargantia
Thats just rude
its like holding a piece of dogshit up to the Mona Lisa

>>83439844
Then tell me what i should watch? I dont every moe show but i did enjoy K-on, Tamako market and Lucky star.

>>83439873
Your Autism is showing.

>>83439866
Exactly that.

Does anyone think he does Family Guy because he's an artist with an amazing new vision to share with the world?

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>>83439825
>>83439863
oh, alright.

you had me for a second.

>>83439851
post more madoka webms pls

>>83439848
You do fucking know that american sailor moon pilot isn't from 2015 right?

>>83439860
I am fine if you are proud of having shit taste.

>>83439758
Gargantia on the Verdurous Planet
a 10/10 anime

>>83439873
They're in the wrong business if they're trying to be money grubbing with anime.

>>83439879
This is just east vs west thread with for some reason /co/ cares about so much.

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>>83439723
>Is this accurate?
No. That chart is full of shit. For instance, the voice actor one is compared against the A-list ones who tend to have income as singers as well.

>>83439908
Well i do like stuff like Mushishi and patlabor.

>>83439841
You do realize that the one at the bottom plagiarized the one above, right?

>>83439917
Because by far and large most of the world's biggest franchises and industry in animation ia in both the west and the east

>>83439894
Watch whatever you want. I watch retarded shows too, I just don't watch moeshit because I think it's boring, but if that's your cup of tea, go ahead.

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>>83439891
As opposed to this abortion of a scene with a butterface old hag?

Anon pls.

>>83439597
Do you really want to bring up a movie when talking about American Vs Japanese animation?

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>>83439896
At least have the decency to point out what's autistic buddy pal friendo. I had the courtesy to do so. Please don't let "Japan iz Best" thoughts taint your argument and find real evidence to support the bullshit claim

>>83439933
But why it is always vs? Cant people just say they favorites from both sides

>>83439873
>Faust

Barneyfriends know where to go.

>>83439929
I think we're talking about animation here though. Mushi-shi is hardly even animated. It's basically a series of still images that look great but don't actually require animation. Nobody really moves and every other shot is 20 seconds of a featureless mountain.

>>83439936
Well i do agree they are not best what japan can do but i guess it is ecapism one the reasons why i enjoy them.

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>>83439948
Keep moving that goalpost.

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>>83439955
So we're just going to neglect her work on original PPG, Dexter's Lab, Foster's Home, KND, MLP (whether you agree or not on how good it is, it is 'at least' a solid cartoon), and Wonder over Yonder?

>>83439968
Well patlabor or something. I dont really give a shit about animation really.

>>83439975
The thing is that you can compare movie to movie and TV to TV. You can not compare movie to TV, and when it comes to movies Japan are not as good as the west in terms of animation

>>83439896
back to /a/ fag

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>>83439987
Going to add one to further rub it in for you.>>83439955
Just found this out.
Iron Giant.

>>83439987
>her work

Fosters and PPG were McCracken's. Dexter was Tatarkovski's. She was part of the staff and she was sleeping with one of the creators.

>>83440020
>Iron Giant.
>she was part of the staff
>it's "her work"

Are you fucking serious?

>>83440006
But 2D animation movies are dead. Atleast in there that is still a live.

>>83439975
I think the point he was making is that if we're not just talking about TV animation than America kicks Japan in their tiny dicks and does it with stuff that's actually animated here. It's not even a discussion worth having. America wins. Period.

>>83440006
>when it comes to movies Japan are not as good as the west in terms of animation

Are you honestly going to compare Frozen to one of the Ghibli Classics?

>>83440021
>thinking 'her work' implies that she singlehandedly created the show.

I know those were headed by others, but she did have her work put into them. Fucking nit picking when you can't argue.

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>obvious bait thread
>People fall for it

>>83440033
So Japan can't even beat the dead

>>83439899
No one thought that, just like no one thought that about the simpsons. It doesn't mean that he should keep making abortion after abortion.

There is a time to stop and family guy's is now, so is the simpsons.

>>83440036
>America kicks Japan in their tiny dicks and does it with stuff that's actually animated here.
>3D animation
>comparable to anime

Pffft.

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>>83440036
Pardon?

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>>83439425
I both types of animation,so i don't care.

>>83440036
You're boring. At least post webms if you're going to be such an embarrassment to shitposting.

>>83440081
''like'' i can't type for shit.

>>83440033
Yeah in the same way that American stop motion feature films are better than Japanese ones because Japanese ones don't exist. What an asinine point to fall back on.

>>83440053
Well i guess. But i enjoy anime more and watch it more because there is more things i enjoy than what west has. Oh and anime tiddies.

>>83440098
Here's your (You)
>>>/wsg/1067068
bask in it.

>>83440145
>can't even follow instructions
Pathetic.

>>83440158
>can't even follow a link
I just keep feeding you don't I?

>>83440075
Shadows cost a lot of money. And those artists in hollywood all deserve six figure incomes for making basic shapes and such.

honnestly, the art industry in USA is horribly overpriced and it is literally get paied by mass fortunes working on a shit show with a cal arts degree, or suffer and work for dirty furry money so you can eat.

>>83440171
>confirming inability to follow instructions
>b-b-but you're the shitposter, not meeeeee
Learn to read, you stupid piece of shit.

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>>83440182
>Shadows cost a lot of money

?

>>83440207
I mean havent you noticed the intricate shadows on homer and bart? That costs a lot of money to do, just like with family man when they have a big budget production. That's how you know they put a lot of effort into it.

>>83440235
I just assumed those were algorithmically generated like the rest of the show these days.

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Just because anime is cheaper to produce doesn't mean it's better. They tend to cut corners like motherfuckers alot of the time.

>>83440235
>family man

?

>>83440052
Because the very topic just incenses /co/ so easily

You make a west vs east thread on /a/ and it dies in a matter of minutes because the argument has no weight

You make a east vs west thread on /co/ and it can bait for hours because /co/ can't get over the fact there has never been a western-animated action TV series that isn't aimed at children

>>83439771
moefags should be killed

>>83439437

Boom. Next people will ask why comics take a month to be made and not a chapter a week.

>>83440268
>there has never been a western-animated action TV series that isn't aimed at children

But Dragon Ball Z was aimed at children. So what?

>>83440259
Unrelated question but why the hell does japanese TV always need to display the time in the corner?

>>83439894
You should gouge your eyes out because all of those are trash

If you can watch them without killing yourself then there is something severely wrong with your brain

>>83439594
Encoding quality is irrelevant to FPS, unless you're dropping frames from a 60fps source
Going from 24 to 72 fps just means adding a keyframe every 2 and doubling the amount of tween frames, unless the movement is extremely fast it's not going to impact quality and it'll only be perceived as an improvement if you're working your keyframes to adapt to the faster framerate

>>83440279
>implying Japanese animators can still do this
>implying if they make this today, those ships won't be all CG

>>83440283
Sunday Morning Japanese TV. Otherwise, there's no time on the corner.

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>>83440279
>>83440296

>>83440273
Why do you care what people watch? I dont watch just moeshit but i dont see it a problem like most of /co/ does.

>>83440338
>most of /co/
I guarantee you 99% of us can't even muster an opinion about it either way.

>>83440287
I like cute girls. And what do you watch?

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>>83440365
Watch the orange blob show

>>83440359
But why do see it as problem? Or something like fanservice? It keeps normalfags away from anime and manga.

>>83440375
But what about anime? I can see why some people dont like those shows but i enjoy them.

>>83439678
You have to understand that animators animate to animate moeshit in the first place.

>>83439567
Is this like those faggots that follow writers instead of characters

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>>83440404
orange blob

>>83439851
I don't remember this scene is it from the 1st or 2nd movie I only saw the 3rd and the main series

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>>83439948
Bring it, /co/.

>>83440507
Who is this cum commander?

>>83440482

Loli pussy ban-daid.

>>83440507
Bad example, mate.

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Oooo are we shitposting?

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>>83440558
>>83440533
>>83440482
These three are a fucking terrible. I can't tell what point you're trying to make.

>>83440579
But that is best example what can japan can do. Tits

>>83440259
>Comparing Toei to anything
Toei's the most dirtcheap you can get with anime.

>>83440595
Hey monogatari was pretty good.

>>83440602
I was under the assumption this was an animation thread, my bad.

>>83440327
Read the title

>>83440579
>Why isn't she sticking her arms out to the sides and having them oscillate like sine waves?

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>>83440610
Are you accusing us of cherry picking examples? In this thread? Well I never.

>>83439425
USA has higher standard of living and pay grade. It's only that cheap because a lot of the animation grunt work is shipped over seas.

>>83439866
They get a lot of voice actors to do like one or 2 times per episode. They'll bring in Jennifer Tilley or Adam West for a 3 second joke and pay them a full wage

>>83440614
I haven't seen it. Is it the one with the 2fps trash tornado or the one with the cgi rectangles sliding around?

>>83440616
Well they animate best tits.

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For all the 90% fucking retarded cliche homeschool bullshit slice of life anime, I still wish the western animation industry would learn a couple things from it.

I don't care so much about the animation (although that is a benefit)- more that I wish there were more 'mature' cartoons. And not the "LOL beer and the word fuck, am I right?" stuff we get now.

I was honestly hoping that LoK would have some of that- and it did to some extent, but it really killed it for me when I started noticing in Season 3 when they couldn't even use the word "Death", even when it was very obviously the word to be used in whatever sentence they were saying. At one point the villain goes on a speech about taking life and he literally says:
>And without it (air)... There is no life.. There is only...
And then he says "darkness". If you're gonna say darkness then why not just make the analogy about light instead of life at that point?

>>83440671
There is alot seasons for it. Start with bakemonogatari.

>>83440595
>I-It's t-terrible
>can't describe why

>>83440680
What is people problem with slife of life genre? It has pretty good shows overall.

>>83440506
ALWAYS

>>83440695
>posting one of the worst things.

>>83440691
If that's the show with the snail ghost loli then fuck you. I tried that and it was slower than a freeza fight.

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>>83440695
Shitty rotoscoping aside, why the hell are those potato chips wrapped in individual packages?

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>>83439425
AT does not cost that much, Frederator's show are cheaply made.
>>83439437
Not for every studio.
>>83439454
No they don't, only the ones that use external IPs and the music heavy episodes.
>>83439491
AT is 12FPS at best, most anime is 4 to 8FPS on average.
>>83439507
Not every studio is like this.
>>83439521
They were.
>>83439828
Documented really.
>>83439866
IP licensing & royalties to other companies IP.
>>83440259
Thats from The Philippines.
>>83440602
No, this is Japan at their best.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-ji8Oo5q3o

>>83440695
Do they really put every chip in a minor bag in Japan?

>>83440725
Well i enjoyed it but i do see it if some people cant like it. Atleast it has actually pretty good MC who isnt faggot.

>>83440610
They were not cheap originally.
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2maki2
They were not cheap enough to do that movie 100% so Akom was bought in to lower down the cost.
>>83440665
Also IP licensing.

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I like cartoons and anime.

Fight me.

>>83440759
I like too but i watch anime more. I spent most of my time here or watching anime.

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>>83440705
The first 2 are just CGI attempts at approximating animation and they couldn't even be fucked to wrap a texture correctly. The most impressive part is the dust clouds I guess but I don't know if you've ever animated an explosion or dust cloud. They are extraordinarily easy so that's not exactly a big point in their favor. The backgrounds look like--what the fuck am I doing? Why am I wasting my time on this?

Feel free to chug whatever glorious nippon shit you want. If you can't tell solid animation fundamentals when you see them, if you can't tell programmatic shading apart from hand drawn art, and if you can't tell interpolation from actual animation then I encourage you to reevaluate why you ever thought this board was a good place for you.

This applies to all of you.

>>83440506
>>>/a/

>>83440506
Does anybody know what the original anime is in the trailer? Or did they just animate this trailer specifically for this shit post? And don't say it's Makoto Shinkai's new movie cause it's obviously not.

>>83440506
Threadly reminder that you should stop posting that because it's a thing.

https://www.fictionpress.com/s/3206139/1/

>>83439652
>implying you wouldn't cream your pants if your favorites were animated fighting like that

>>83440827
Even Kei tai finds way in /co/

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>>83440506
A boy falls in love with a girl.

Unable to confess, he is gifted by a deus ex machina with the girl's phone number. Never minding the strange area code, he immediately calls her, and is overjoyed to find out that she has a crush on him as well.

But, the next day, when he recounts the previous day's confessions to the girl, she only looks at him with a perplexed expression. After some investigation, he finds out that the girl he called is not the same girl he fell in love with. In fact, she doesn't exist in this universe at all. She is the girl's alternate universe counterpart, who has fallen in love with the MC's own AU self, who too is blissfully unaware of her crush.

Hijinks ensue as the two strike up a deal to give each other their darkest, most private secrets in order to equip the other with the weapons they need to conquer the heart of their other selves. While the two chase their respective loved ones, DRAMA ensues as they begin to fall in love with each other instead and question the NATURE of LOVE.

OP: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ycfdfinG_P8
ED1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXDNGS9V4Us
ED2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4DyTjrruVo
PV: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JcVGDV67L-g
EP 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_rz1bluG_k

>>83440506
That's a terrible example. You can count on one hand the number of good animation found in that clip (the swimming part and maybe the part where she's traipsing with her friend).

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Please explain.

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>>83439437
this

>>83440506

FINDS A WAY

>>83440958
royalties

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>>83440961
damn
kek

>>83440958
A handful of otaku from Japan are willing to pay top dollar/yen for harem hijinks while LOTR will still get billions more with that price by bulk patronage from the entire fucking world.

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>>83440705
He doesn't need to describe why it's because it's obvious. The first two examples are mostly CGI with barely any 2D animation so they're bad examples. This one >>83440557 is a better example.

>>83439844
Truth.

>>83440958
Oh yes, i remember monogatari being released on cinemas all around the world....

>>83440727
They're not potato chips, those are rice crackers.

>>83440984
I need more dumb idols in my life.

>>83440727
Rice crackers are individually wrapped.

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>>83439425
The East is just better.

Not even joking. Or meme-ing here. I may prefer some Western animation/cartoons but, overall, the level of quality in Japan is just higher than in the US. The approach towards animation in the East is just as high.

I can only think of only a handful of shows in the West that approached anime in terms of technical artistry. The Boondocks. Invader Zim. Avatar (Both Aang and Korra). And arguably, Star Vs. and Gravity Falls. I haven't seen Steven Universe but I heard it pretty good.

Everything else is capeshit, but even capeshit fails to compare to what the West can do

The easiest way to determine the difference - how many more webms/gifs can you post form /a/ as opposed to those from /co/?

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>>83440961

>>83440443
This is from the last movie, numbnuts.

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The main problem with cartoons, and comics for the most part, is that the styles are just so ugly.

Another issue is that we aren't comparing the peaks of either medium.

If you want to really put up the best Anime vs Cartoons, you'd need to put up Pinocchio next to some God-tier 80s/90s animated feature like Akira.

Cartoons and anime are mostly just schlock meant to entertain kiddies with a few outstanding exceptions.

Manga, and to a lesser extent comics, is the superior medium, because it's so varied in both subject matter and art style.

>>83441088
TV animation. West BTFO Japan when it comes to cinematic animation. Miyazaki is the only one that came close, but still no cigar.

And Miyazaki is retired.

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>>83439425
When /a/ capeshit is better than any /co/ capeshit, you know somethings wrong

>>83440984
How strangely adorable, where can I watch this?

>>83441088
Western animation from the 30s to 40s beats anything from anime.

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>>83439425
>>83439465
>>83439523
>From the same episode

Please explain.

>>83441106
Pretty much this. Who in the west gives a shit about TV animation besides children and nerds like us.
Theatrical releases, on the other hand, are another story. Another, billion dollar story.

>>83440506
>Katawa Shoujo
>Keit-ai

Why hasn't /co/ produced any quality OC?

>>83441100
>If you want to really put up the best Anime vs Cartoons, you'd need to put up Pinocchio next to some God-tier 80s/90s animated feature like Akira.
And Pinocchio easily comes out on top.

>>83441133
This was such a terrible show.

>>83441106
>West BTFO Japan when it comes to cinematic animation

Okay I can buy this, but how many western cinematic adaptations, can you name, thats NOT

- Disney
- about a fairytale
- about capeshit
- made for a G to PG audience
- and most important of all, was not animated by Ralph Bakshgi

The best /co/ movie I can think of, that isn't limtied by above, was Lascars. And that wasn't that big.

In contrast, Japan is famous for Ghost in the Shell and Akira. The fact that Hollywood wants to adapt Ghost in the Shell, and had adapted Blamm!, suggests that there is some recognition for the East.

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>>83441143
>>Keit-ai

>>83439425
Animation is better here, the art is better detailed over there.

>>83441134
Anon, plz.

Not everything is Fleischer Superman:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjdnCC6n4xk

>>83441170
What about Don Bluth?

>>83441190
I should have specified Don Bluth and Ralph Bakshi

But then again - how much of Bluth's stuff was NOT for kids G to PG audience? I can only think of Dragon's Lair. Which is mostly a game and thus, is more /v/ than /co/

>>83441170
>moving the goalpost so far to avoid billion dollar BTFO

Really, nigga?

>>83441189
I prefer early Disney and Looney Tunes to be honest.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4jlZoBGQeE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kk-Xw_aIePo

>>83441212
Ok then.

>>83441143
>Keit-ai
>quality OC

It's like saying Baneposting is quality OC.

>>83441219
It doesn't change the fact.

Why would Hollywood care so much about making a live-action Ghost in the Shell, if that movie did NOT make a billion dollars?

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>>83441232
Baneposting is far and away better than anything /co/ has ever done, which by my recollection is fucking nothing

>>83439504
What's the point of this post? Pointing out that we're civilly discussing a topic without discourse?

Claymation > everything else.

is /a/ as obsessed with comparing anime to cartoons as /co/ is

>>83441134
True but those kinda only western cartoons i still enjoy.

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>>83441226
And thats all kids stuff. Might as well throw in Hanna Barbara cartoons and Tom & Jerry. Its all the same shit.

Like, I have yet to see a Western animated show as good as Cowboy Bebop. Or Haibane Renmei. Or hell, even One Punch Man.

Or Season 1 of pic related. And her movie

>>83441284
Yes, but Japanese claymation, or western claymation?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BR4bKHlhmjk

>>83441100
I hope pic related is not your example of superiority of manga because Franken Fran was unreadable edgy garbage.

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>>83441312
How about Nurse Hitomi? She's pretty kawaii and much better.

Also she's one of the best /a/ cyclopses right now. She's like a mixture of Iris and Ruby from Ruby Gloom. She's also like Leela, but in a more comfy setting

>>83441251
I hope it fails. I dont want to normalfags to ruin anime with "diversity".

>>83441285
No. You dont see these kinda threads really never.

>>83441298
Those cartoons were made for movie going ADULTS, they were just clean because of strict Hay's Office codes at the times which made them kid friendly as well.

Also Tiny Toons & Animaniacs put those shows to shame.

>Tom & Jerry
Hanna Barbara did those before they did TV cartoons.

>>83441298
So what it they're from family-friendly shows? It has no bearing on the quality of the animation. A lot of those cartoons have amazing character animation that's way more expressive than anything you'd find in anime. The best of them are good enough to the point where you can get the gist of the scenario through their body language and facial expressions alone, the character animation is just that good.

>>83441285
We redirect any and all attempts back to /co/ where it belongs.

>>83441339
No idea. Doesn't look like my cup of tea. I went in Franken Fran expecting medical horror, and got a mediocre dark comedy

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>>83441232

>>83440313
You know, that still doesn't explain why they do it.

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>>83441342
I also want it to fail

But Ghost in the Shell, imho, is the example of an adult western animated movie that just haven't made in the US. Okay, maybe there's Titan AE (except that I haven't seen it) But it seems to be that, even if an animated movie in the West makes a billion dollars, and wins the Oscar, its less because of the inherent goodness of said movie, and more because of the brand name, and budget that goes with it.

It is possible to argue that the art style and character design is more nuanced to the East but, I seriously wish they took a more adult approach to animation instead of relegating it just to "things only kids and families watch". But sadly, thats the world we live in.

>>83441368
>A lot of those cartoons have amazing character animation

Prove it. Post some.

>The best of them are good enough to the point where you can get the gist of the scenario through their body language and facial expressions alone, the character animation is just that good.

Again, prove it. People are posting gifs/webms from /a/, step it up.

>It has no bearing on the quality of the animation

And yes it does. Because, if you think that a show only has to be made for children and thus, you could make any show and get away with it, some form of laziness will happen. Look at Johnny Test and the recent Powerpuff Girls reboot for examples

>>83441143
Katawa Shoujo is /v/.

>>83441356
huh
seems kind of telling

>>83441419
http://anime.stackexchange.com/questions/4019/why-do-airing-shows-have-times-listed-beyond-a-24-hour-clock

>>83440984
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXIXpz4sMlM

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>>83441381
Give it a try. Nurse Hitomi has some fun medical humour and occasional horror. But mostly humour

>>83441421
>Prove it. Post some.
Mate, I just posted some. You can have a channel's worth if you want, there's lots of western animator reels in there. Try Milt Kahl's video for starters, he's pretty much a western Hiroyuki Okiura in terms of technical ability. Lots of top-notch draftsmanship.

https://www.youtube.com/user/ibcfable/videos

>>83439734
>But so is american too. They just outsources from korea.
They don't, but there's a union of animators that demands they get fair pay.

This is also why most shows are cancelled at the third season, because the union demands also require a huge pay increase after the third season.

Anime's biggest failing is females.
Both creators and characters, because they all suck.

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>>83441312
The shit taste is strong with thee

>>83441465
>Hiroyuki Okiura
Bob McKimson & Yoshinobu Michihata also say hi as well.

>>83439567
>executive producer isn't even reaching six figures

What the fuck, Japan?

Why not just watch both? Watching shit you enjoy seems better than getting angry that other people enjoy different shit, but maybe that's just a naive thought.

>>83441465
*yawn*

All 1930s to 1940s stuff. And besides you didn't put it into a webm/gif

And yeah, I get your point, It is arguably animated better. But ahs ANYTHING in the wesbt been this well animated as something from the 1930s to 1940s? ANYTHING?

Give the East some credit - they put what expressiveness they can into their work with the technology they access now. I don't see that in Western animation thats NOT cinematic. And even the cinematic stuff is usually limited, or restricted to 3D.

I mean, look at this >>83441456 . It reminds of the stuff Bakshi did in Fire & Ice

>>83441473
Rough Draft gets payed 18,000-21,000 won a hour however, I think thats fare.

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>>83441479
>He says, somehow ignoring FMA


Oh no, such stiff Western Competition, like Kate Leth and Rebeca Sugar.

Truly, Grorious Nipponese Women cannot compare to such virtuose

>>83441531
FMA is badly-written overdramatic garbage.
>implying competition
>implying females don't just suck in general
There's a reason all the great writers are male. The West only has an advantage of having less of them.

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>>83441298
>And thats all kids stuff.
>I have yet to see a Western animated show as good as Cowboy Bebop. Or Haibane Renmei. Or hell, even One Punch Man.
Are you serious?

>>83441421
>Again, prove it. People are posting gifs/webms from /a/, step it up.
Most of them are bad examples, anon.

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>>83441111
Quadruples of truth

>>83441555
>badly written

so you prefer capeshit with superman vs kryptonite man

or are you into stuff like ppg with its memes and "girl power"

just want to know what high standard of writing you're comparing shit to

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>>83441555
>implying females don't just suck in general
If you think that, then why in the flying did you bring it up as a point solely against Japan, especially when retarded gender politics have invaded the West more fully than in the East?

What was your plan?

>>83441520
>*yawn*
As expected of /co/mblr

>>83441111
This thread ended in quads.

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>>83441564
Yeah I'm serious brah. Fight me

>Most of them are bad examples, anon.

Top kek. Also yours is a pretty bad example. I don't see how what you posted is better than anything from /a/.

>>83441432
They dont give a shit really.

>>83441586
A mediocrity like Philip K. Dick is better than any woman creator. Shit, the best female writers can't even be on par with a hack like Stephen King.
>>83441595
Because, like I said, there's too damn many of them. Western fiction is mostly, fortunately, male-dominated.

>>83439896

Says the weaboo waste of human life

>>83441479
Nah fuck you. Tomboys are the best archetype in anime and i dont want realistic women in anime.

When will /co/ learn to do animation, start an animation studio, and make western 2D animation great again?

>>83439851
Have you never looked at real life?

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>>83441633
>Western fiction is mostly, fortunately, male-dominated
But they're all fucking Nu-Males, you twit.

The retarded Gender Politics don't exist in Nihon, they just make content

>>83441677
>The retarded Gender Politics don't exist in Nihon

looks like you missed yurikuma

>>83441644
We don't need any women in anime, they all suck.
There's a reason Texhnolyze is so great and a bitch in the fox mask is its biggest flaw.

>>83441677
>But they're all fucking Nu-Males,
Yeah, like Conan The Barbarian, Goon, Shadow, Hellboy or hell, any 80s action flick hero if we don't just talk comics.

>>83440506
We only have this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Fxls1XrcJc

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>>83441655
It will never happen.

Hell, there are already a lot of independent aniamtors out there, trying to push for more adult-oriented animation/ideas that push the technical boundaries. Thing is, the corporations aren't buying it. The money is not there, and the market is not like Japan.

Unless there's a societal change for more people to want the kind of stuff Japan produces, then there could be a change. But its not gonna happen.

The best we can do, is just stockpile, and enjoy it. Japan's future doesn't look good, and there most likely will not be another Bakshi. Or Bluth.

Yeah I'm jaded. But I really doubt we can have great adult-oriented animation in the mainstream again.

>>83441692
>>>/r9k/

>>83441520
Honestly, I think America's golden age of 2D animation is long gone. Disney's 2D renaissance in the late 80s/90s had some decent stuff (I'm a fan of Glen Keane's work) but they don't come close to the classics.

>Give the East some credit - they put what expressiveness they can into their work with the technology they access now.
I like Japanese animation was well, but it's not about technology. Anime works with limited animation due to time and monetary constraints, and they're comfortable with that. This ability to make the most out of limited animation is what gives anime a lot more standout animation in TV cartoons than their western counterparts. Western cartoons have 10,000 drawings per episode on average, but there's very little interesting animation to speak of in most shows. Sure they're animated, but it's merely functional more often than not. An anime episode with the same drawing count is more likely to handle their allocation better by choosing which scenes to focus resources on- that allows for bursts of great animation compared to a steady flow of mediocrity.

>>83441703
You posted the wrong video, let me fix it for you
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2a3MduZ1feI

>>83439567
>>83439533
>we're supposed to be impressed by this when top American voice actors make that much money within a couple episodes
Holy fuck you guys are delusional

>>83440965
> the rest of the episode is people standing still flapping their mouth

>>83439465
They put all of the money into small scenes for waifufaggots and then botch the rest. Anime isn't that great, kid.

>>83441705
I wouldn't want to watch what's in your gif either. I wouldn't even care much about classic-style western cartoons.

Anime has appeal because it's so extreme, not only in style but in subject matter. And it doesn't take itself too seriously, unlike what westerners like to do.

>>83441655
When Keit-ai finds a way.

>>83439465
>>83439523
>>83441139
/a/ being disingenuous like usual.
>here's one of the best scenes from this entire show, which they put a ton of effort into so they could use it as promotional material
>now compare it to some crap I cherrypicked from some unimportant scene in the western cartoon
>don't you see how much better anime is?

>>83441677
I'm not a Nu-Male, I'm a Classic-Male.
>>83441705
>and there most likely will not be another Bakshi. Or Bluth.
I'm here.

>>83441722
>american
>top voice actors

>>83441134
We are talking about the current situation

>>83441809
>best scenes from the entire show

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=562CUJ8Ki8Y

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>>83441757
Bruh, I may be fighting for the /a/ side of the argument ehre, but I really advise that you check out what Bakshi and Bluth did.

Especially Bakshi. Bakshi is the closest I can think of an /a/-direction style animator in the West. he took the medium pretty seriously. And he trained people like Bruce Timm.

>>83441739
And western cartoons are?

>>83441809
Too bad modern western animation is so abysmal that you can't find anything that compares to those anime clips, even if you pick enough cherries to feed all african children.

>>83441809
Dude /a/ isnt here. Most of the /a/ knows this.