Final Fantasy LXIV

Not just the cut-scenes, I think the music might have sounded worse too.

I dunno, the game looks like shit so I think it would have been at home on the n64. The cinemas are laughably bad too so they could have been cut.

Was 7 just on PSX because the N64 couldn't hold all the data?

I think if 7 was released even without the FMVs on the N64, it would've been "hype", and a lot of people would've bought it. It would be less of a meme, but it would be a meme nonetheless. You'd have more Nintendo manchildren who love the shit out of it, and probably more girls.

>>3474038
I don't see how it could be worse.

>>3474031
FF7 used the CD space to its advantage by doing tons of FMVs and a large amount of backgrounds. A cart based version would have 0 FMVs at the minimum, and might not fit all backgrounds on a cart either, unless we are talking about the last gen 64MByte carts.

It would be possible and it would have better 3d graphics and framerate, but that would be it.

You can't really take the FMV's out of FF7, the game would lose practically everything cinematic it has going. At a stretch it could have taken the RE2 approach and used shorter, jerkier videos but the PS1 was definitely the right fit.

>>3474049
I wouldn't worry about that. FF7 doesn't have a story. It has plot. Barely.

>>3474040
>Was 7 just on PSX because the N64 couldn't hold all the data?
It's also more because it would've been too expensive to purchase the amount of memory needed for the cartridge, which would directly affect its MSRP as well. Their late SFC games especially suffered from this, with Gun Hazard originally retailing for around the yen equivalent of $114.00 or so.

Cutscenes and audio

N64 audio was pretty bad

>>3474109

I'm talking about the presentation more than anything, those moments that the FMV and in-game graphics merge, the camera pans out, an FMV is used as a background, that sort of thing. Take that away and it just kind of looks like any other video game.

File: 1439711427735.jpg (257KB, 600x709px) Image search: [Google]

257KB, 600x709px

The PSX was -the- console for JRPG's back then. I can't imagine a world where Final Fantasy VII was an N64 game.

>>3474038
>I think the music might have sounded worse too.

Final Fantasy VII's music barely sounded better than SNES so I very much doubt that. Literally low quality sequenced MIDI crap. The compositions are good, yes. But it's technically not very great.

>N64 audio was pretty bad

Nah. Mostly just Nintendo games since they weren't very ambitious. It was good if you know the right games. Definitely not worse than FFVII technically. And I'm not talking about the massive 64 MB cartridges, I'm talking about the smaller ones.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJedMdqTEyo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VuQSKUTe89g

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E7azlVRKe08

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vYhUmWX0ME

Now if you want to go a bit higher to 32 MB cartridges

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ewFnCWyXyEk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Y0RwyI8j8k

Or up to 64 MB...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1YRGbfufHG8

>>3474210
>Final Fantasy VII's music barely sounded better than SNES

Yeah but the SNES sounded like this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WoBn04lcNmo

>>3474216
DESU aside from the fuzzy SNES quality, I reckon FFVI has equal or more sophisticated instrumentation than FFVII for the most part.

>all these contrarian nintendo faggots grasping for straws.

nintendo just doesn't go graphix, bro. super mario 3d world literally looks like an n64 game and that is a recent game.

>>3474229
>nintendo just doesn't go graphix, bro.
Who says anything about graphics though?

>>3474210
>Literally low quality sequenced MIDI crap

>retard played the PC version only

>>3474248
why would I argue with you when you're being purposefully retarded? kill yourself faggot.

>>3474256
>why would I argue with you when you're being purposefully retarded?
Likewise. If you read the thread the recent conversation above was more about the compositions of the game from a technical standpoint.

>>3474229
You literally don't know anything about videogames if you think the PS had graphics as good as N64 ones.

>>3474251
I was talking about the PS1 version.

Granted it's not "MIDI" but it's still sequenced music.

>>3474040
>I don't see how it could be worse.
The n64 is inferior in the sound department with the older PSX allowing for more and better quality sound.

>>3474324
Are you retarded? All game music that's not redbook audio in the 90s was sequenced. The n64 didn't even have a dedicated sound processing unit which limited it's sound quality which combined with lack of space for good samples lead to simplistic compositions.

>>3474216
Sounds a bit like this at the start.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C382wc4StOw

>>3474371
The SNES and PSX sound chips were designed by the same man.

>>3474373
I just meant the tune.

>>3474324
It actually is MIDI, Uematsu has said in interviews that he was able to compose it all in MIDI because the PSX was able to use the format. The PC version is note for note the same, just the acutal synthesis was different depending on the sound card. Also the PSX was able to do that vocal sample shit in One Winged Angel.

>>3474342
>The n64 didn't even have a dedicated sound processing unit which limited it's sound quality

I think you're the one who is retarded. A sound chip is nothing but a dumb DSP that specializes in a few audio algorithms. If you execute the exact same algorithms in software, there's no difference in sound quality.

What the N64 did was even better than that. It had a microcode programmable vector and scalar unit that could be set to decode any algorithm you wanted. Granted, the exact same chip processed graphics, but it's perfectly suited to audio processing as well.

That's why the N64 could decode things like MP3 and Dolby Surround while the PS1 was stuck decoding the ancient ADPCM algorithm that was baked into its sound chip.

>you said that? you're retarded
>no, you're retarded, retard

Excellent discussing ability you motherfucking faggets.

File: edgy-edgesworth.jpg (92KB, 1024x678px) Image search: [Google]

92KB, 1024x678px

>>3474031
To actually answer the first question: Yes, as long as the PS didn't exist to begin with. It didn't create the age of accessory eye candy that would drive the industry, but it did help it snowball out of control

>>3474446
Man, that's one big phallic object on display.

What did they mean by that?

>>3474446
>possibly the greatest game ever made

>literally the one time where advertisers weren't lying

CD is a meme. You don't need that much space for gaming. Should've just stuck with carts.

>>3474559
Carts are a meme. Too little space for games of growling complexity. Glad they went with CDs thereafter.

>>3474647
>>>/v/

And stay there, faggotron.

>>3474470
> only on PlayStation

But it *was* lying

>>3474659
Touche'

>>3474647
>growling complexity

my goodness, this does not sound safe to me

>>3474451
sometimes a cannon is just a cannon, sigmund

>>3474031
The game's music was entirely MIDI being pumped through a custom Yamaha soft-synth. There might be some overhead with that, but it's certainly not a problem from a space consideration.

We all know that FF7 looks like it had three art departments working on the game that didn't communicate with each other. If the Playstation version was never conceived, FMV would be out of the question so you probably wouldn't have several sets of models to depict the same character in different situations. Battle models on the map might have been a possibility, even if that meant fewer NPCs on screen, or a tighter view.

The cutscenes would have to be done in-engine, like in Ocarina of Time. As for the backgrounds, there were simply too many to consider pre-rendered images. Read up on the development of Crash Bandicoot's visibility pre-calculations. An on-rails camera is really the only way to do it.

Square could absolutely have preserved the mechanics and content of the game, and its story. It just would have looked different. There'd be a lot less texturing.

>>3474736
>As for the backgrounds, there were simply too many to consider pre-rendered images

I don't think so. You can just compress them like Resident Evil 2 did. And if you aren't gonna bother with FMV, you won't even need a 64 MB cartridge to do it.

>>3474752
Wasn't RE2 pretty much technowizardry for the time, though?

Quest 64 became famous, despite being shit, because it was the only RPG on the N64.

You're asking if the most popular RPG on a system full of RPGs would be bigger if it had an entire console to itself.

>>3474790
well it's hard to say that there wouldn't have been more RPGs on N64 if Square had stayed with Nintendo as a developer.

>>3474776
Yes, the consensus is it was indeed sorcery.

>>3474776
Angel Studios were a tiny company though. If Squaresoft wanted FFVII to fit on N64 they could have fucking done it.

Of course they were more interested in making movies so they'd never part with their precious FMVs.

>>3474040
>Was 7 just on PSX because the N64 couldn't hold all the data?

It was probably that and cost to release stuff on carts as opposed to discs, how easy it is to code for one console opposed to another, and a lot of companies just being sick of Nintendo's policies gravitating towards Sony.

>>3474109
Fuck off back to >>>/tv/ and take your shit memes with you.

>>3474332
More, maybe, better, not necessarily. The N64 didn't have an audio chip per se but you could use the rsp chip and devote it all to audio if you wanted, so theorically you could have many more audio channels than the PSX if you sacrificed video. (Cartridge size and memory bandwidth limits woulld still apply tho)

>>3476015
The "audio takes power out of the graphics" thing is massively overblown. RSP is never the bottleneck. It's arguably the fastest thing in the system. Graphic processing by RSP will always be limited by how fast RDP can output it. The rest of RSP's power can safely be devoted to a lot of audio processing.

>>3476021
Actually I should have read the thread before posting as this anon
>>3474413
explained it a millon times better.
Also thanks for the details on the rdp and rsp and how they are balanced for graphics.

>>3474332
And both have shit audio compared to Saturn's amazing 32-channel SPU.

>>3476028
It would be a good chip if it could work with any form of compressed audio. Since it can't it chokes the shit out of the Saturn's 512 KB of audio RAM, while the PS1 can store more things into its own 512 KB.

That's why PS1 multiplats tend to have inferior up-pitched sound in Saturn. Cause they ran out of Saturn audio RAM.

File: cmexy.jpg (13KB, 218x265px) Image search: [Google]

13KB, 218x265px

>>3476028
>Saturn's amazing

>>3474031
Considering that the PSX absolutely dominated the market relative to the N64, the primary reason was probably just to reach the largest user base...

File: autismo.jpg (179KB, 1503x661px) Image search: [Google]

179KB, 1503x661px

>>3476039
>le "Sega can't have good audio" meme

>>3476037
Wasn't the saturn SPU designed to be the ultimate FM synth, using samples as operators (so, being able to be used as a sample sequencer as well), and being very flexible at chaining them?
Did it actually have any oscillator or did you always need a sample (like, at least a sine wave sample) to make it sound?

>>3476043
It had a crap load of features and it would have been a great chip for a PC that had a lot of RAM.

Like most things with Saturn hardware though, it was poorly conceived for practical purpose though.

>>3476046
I want the guy who is almost done with the VideoCDcart-to-SDcard thing to release it so people start fucking with the system. I'm sure something amazing can come out of exploring the possible uses of the Saturn's not very sensible hardware (and maybe few actually end up being videogames).
In the video he also had some program to interface with the sound chip and it looked sick.
As you said it would have been a great PC sound card for composers, I never thought of it. I don't think it ever came to their heads, but if it did they would have had to deal with only being abe to use it properly using their own hardware, and dealing with sound blaster/adlib/early directx for the rest of the software.

Someone autistic enough here should strip all the FMVs out of FF7 and report the size of the discs.

>>3476054
it's already been done, it's like 128 MB

>>3474031
FFVII would not have been the same experience if it was missing the soundtrack and cut scenes.
yes, if it was on n64 you would lose both

File: cartus.jpg (210KB, 1353x909px) Image search: [Google]

210KB, 1353x909px

>>3476139
>yes, if it was on n64 you would lose both

>>3474040
If somehow square soft had the algorithm that Angel Studios developed to port RE2 to the N64 maybe we could have an 1 cart FFVII game.

>>3476141
Good job posting a game that had FMV's removed, dingas.

>>3477974
Did you even play it? They weren't removed, just lowered quality, but it runs in a fucking cartdridge!

>>3477993
N64 port is missing the Ada cutscene and replaced some FMVs with still shots.

>>3474049
>the game would lose practically everything cinematic it has going.

Good. If I wanted a cinematic experience I'd go to the fucking cinema.

>>3474406
>It actually is MIDI

It uses PCM sequenced music, but it's not real MIDI, but a format that was converted from it. Now if you write the custom software to play the files, then even the Genesis can do MIDI (and I'm fairly sure that devkits like GEMS actually did convert MIDI to a format more suitable for the console).

The only console that could actually take MIDI directly was the Saturn to the best of my knowledge, the communication port on it had MIDI connections to it, with a simple passive converter you can hook up any keyboard. At least one game did use that function.


>>3474413
>That's why the N64 could decode things like MP3 and Dolby Surround

MP3 on the N64 was used for the speech in Conker and I think nothing else; there it needed very, very low bitrate to sound good enough, and that means it has extremely low computational cost. Low enough that the PS1 could've done it as well. Sure, it would've taken power from the main CPU, but that's not much different than how the N64 does it, right?

Dolby Surround is a matrixed format that you can bake into any prerecoded stereo stream, that the PS1 has an entire discs worth of space to use.

>>3474736
>being pumped through a custom Yamaha soft-synth.

Yamaha made the Saturn chip. The Playstation one was a Sony in-house chip developed by Kutaragi, basically the same as the SNES chip just more powerful.

>>3476028
>And both have shit audio compared to Saturn's amazing 32-channel SPU.

PSX has a better sound chip than the Saturn, the ADPCM compression save a lot of memory on it, so it could use better samples all the time. Saturn had two advantages: extremely powerful FM capabilities (you can link any of the 32 channels together as FM operators), and more RAM (so it could store less-often used samples outside the audio memory, and stream them in as needed).

>>3476046
>Like most things with Saturn hardware though, it was poorly conceived for practical purpose though.

The sound chip was done by Yamaha though, and its only fault is literally the low amount of memory. Also you can stream externally encoded audio to it (even the BIOS jingle on the Saturn is ADPCM), and the chip has digital input and midi input/output mapped on the actual cart pins.
The biggest fault with the Saturn was that it died early, with most of its potential untapped.

>>3476052
>I want the guy who is almost done with the VideoCDcart-to-SDcard thing to release it so people start fucking with the system.

You already have various other dev carts available if you want to fuck with the system, and the sourcecode to the VCD-USB system is also public (and it'll work with USB only, no sd cards). Oh and you have Rhea as an SD loader.

>>3476084
>it's already been done, it's like 128 MB

Bet you that it stores everything uncompressed, though. Compress everything properly and you can shave a crap ton off of that. RE2 did that, and they got 2 CDs down to 64MByte.

>>3476139
Nah, if anything, it would be the sound that would stay the same. FMVs would be replaced, but that's not a big deal.

>>3478020
>very, very low bitrate to sound good enough, and that means it has extremely low computational cost

Even low bit rate MP3 decoding would be prescribed minimum system requirement of like a 66mhz 486 on PC.

>Low enough that the PS1 could've done it as well. Sure, it would've taken power from the main CPU, but that's not much different than how the N64 does it, right?

Well, except for the three times higher performance on the N64's CPU. It's also possible (though unsure) that Rare might have run MP3 decoding on RSP, freeing the CPU of having to do it. That option is not available for the PS1 and GTE respectively.

>Dolby Surround is a matrixed format that you can bake into any prerecoded stereo stream

It still requires matrix decoding to center and surround channels. N64 could do that on RSP, while the PS1 would have to put it on the CPU (GTE wouldn't accept it). I don't think it needs stating that both system's CPUs are not well particularly well suited to matrix crunching.

>>3478034
>extremely powerful FM capabilities (you can link any of the 32 channels together as FM operators)

Extremely powerful is a stretch. You get 8 FM channels with 4 operators each, which is like what the Genesis had.

*

I agree with your other points