VGC Discussion General

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Apologize.

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>>30896056
APOLOGIZE

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>>30895973

>Not a single UB or legend on first place

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Who jobbed harder, him or the frog?

lol what the fuck is drampa doing there? go back to your mountain, drampa

Well I think we can safely say that this VGC is already looking a good ten times more interesting than the last tournament.

>>30895973
>no Celesteela
Is the meme over?

>>30896146
>muh but the meta points you towards UBs and Tapus

metafags btfo once again

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>>30896281
Big tournaments maybe. But premier challenges are still healthy.

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>gastrodon used fissure
>it missed

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>>30896146
>>30896281
>>30896281
>>30896320
>>30896323

>European tournament
>boring "everyone uses the same stall team" shitshow

>US tournament
>retards trying to make meme mons work

As an yuropoor, I have to say that US streamings are more fun to watch desu

>>30896323
they fell for the tapu meme instead of building a team with a clear strategy

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>>30896336

Another picture to add to my Smug Bonnie folder.

Thanks, anon.

>>30896323
I've always wondered why no one's tried to pair up a Raichu with tapu koko yet. I know some people don't like Alolan Raichu, but you'd think SOMEONE would try to make it work.

http://pokemonaustralia.com/australian-vgc17-usage-stats-december-week-2/

Straya's usage stats for top cut is out, boys.

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>>30896386

>>30895973
It's funny cause taunt completely shutdowns the top team

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>>30896386
Cannington

>>30896418
doesn't mimikyu carry a mental herb?

>>30896418
but no one uses taunt in vgc 2017
that's why I have successfully used a pyukumuku in my team

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>>30896386
dandenong

What's the typical set on Z Water Araquadnid?

>>30896435
Not really, usually they'll have z-Destiny bond so a free switch is guaranteed after it sets trick room

>>30896440
True which is why it currently has the success it has

Is there any way to make Wailord work?

>>30896494
trick room instructed water spouts

>>30896494
build it as bulky as you can, and use fissure on everything

>>30896517
Go away Gary

>>30895973
How come no one's using Celesteela anymore?

>>30895973
Why does this only show top 6? 4-6th place aren't actually any better than 7th and 8th.

>>30897068
>>30896352

>>30896128
>b-but he's slow
>has hueg damage and one of the single best movepools of any mon in the series
But he can't do everything so he's shit??

>>30896281
outside of fucking everyone using eviolite porygon 2 and then alolan muk to counter it, I agree.

t. smogonfag

>>30897209
>machop used low kick

just kidding I like the old cloud

>>30897222
Knock Off Poison Touch A Muk is really good desu
It doesn't help that he literally only fears shakydirt and fucks fairies in the mouth

>>30897109
4th is.

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>drampa switches in

>>30896380
I love running it vs Koko but never thought to run Koko alongside it...

>>30895973
>only team without a porygon 2 in last place

Clearly fairy types raped fighting types more that dragon types.

>>30896446
>Alolan Muk has the highest usage

Nice

>>30897294
dark/poison is a ridiculously good typing

>>30896323
Just wait until they introduce Heatran, Landorus-T et al.

>>30897254
really though where is 7th and 8th place?

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>>30897391
fuck, I keep forgetting that it's going to happen eventually

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>>30895973
does someone know when it's the next streamed event?

doesn't matter if it's an official stream or not

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>>30897407
did some searching on google and found this

http://www.trainertower.com/san-jose-regionals-vgc-2017/

>>30897407
why not look in the pastebing of the OP?

>>30897391
Honestly I really wouldn't mind just...not ever having those back. Just have gen 3 and SuMo be the VGC.

>>30895973
Wait is Golduck good now?!

>>30898346
it literally did nothing in the matches it was used, even with swift swim.

>>30898346
what other swift swimmer are you gonna run?

>>30896380
Tons of people have run it.

The problem is they keep getting blown the fuck out because they don't build around it.

>>30898346
>third place
More like Bronzuck lol

>>30898436
not running a rain team on top of that I'm guessing? Or at least not taking advantage of a guaranteed paralysis that is the z move, or choice specs, or... fuck there's a lot of things you could do for alolan raichu.

>>30898346
it's the only viable swift swimmer in VGC and can do decent damage with rain-boosted hydro pump and z-water. swift swim lets it outspeed everything in the tier and take out frail threats, but it really struggles against gastrodon and araquanid. Plus if any other weather gets up it's instantly trash. I don't think it has the damage output to really compete with other sweepers, but rain has literally nothing else besides Thunder koko.

>>30898346
Cloud Nine, mostly

>>30895973
Can someone tell me more about that goodra??

What set did it run?

How do I get into competitive?

I've played since release of Ruby but never got into competitive, always just a shiny fag

>>30898570
http://www.smogon.com/smog/issue7/vgc

Smogon is a good place to start.
I recommend just building a team around a pokemon you like for starters.

Stick with a theme and you should do ok. just be prepared to lose and learn.

I was able to hit top 5 in the US on battle spot and 1500 on pokemon showdown with a VGC primape team, which isnt too bad

>>30898536
it was AV with power whip/dragon pulse/flamethrower/sludge bomb. one of the last 2 moves may have been thunderbolt.
power whip is basically JUST for gastrodon but it also benefits off sap sipper if you can find an opportunity.
>>30898570
look at the pastebin in the OP

>>30898621
Wow, that seems impressive

Is now a good time to get into competitive Pokemon? Is the meta fun right now?
thanks for the link

>>30898178
>All these Tapus
>The only person who didn't use a Tapu got 1st place
Based Gavin

>>30898649
I've been having a fun time, its actually the first season I've done the VGC format.

just play shit loads of matches on showdown. as you play more you'll start to get a feeling for what moves you pokemon can take, what the can kill in one hit and what they can outspeed and counter. Those are the things that help you win!

Also once you REALLY start playing a lot of matches you'll be able to better evaluate your opponents team which is what helps you pick the 4 pokemon you should use ;)

Can I ask something about the previous VGCs? Was the reason of Mega Charizard Y not being widely used through VGC15 because it's essentially a poor man's Gardevoir and MegaMence does its job way better?

>>30898728
Landorus-T

>>30898728
Charizard was very common, and it's not really comparable to Gardevoir or Salamence

If anything hurt Charizard it was Heatran and Landorus being everywhere and it couldn't fit all its good moves at once

>>30898728
Probably because landorus thundurus everywhere. I tried making gyarados work, but always had problems with those.

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It's been over a month, why are there still no PGL usage stats

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>>30899209
fucking this

>>30899115
>>30899118
>>30899126
Really? I've been told that Gardevoir does ZardY's job way better in not being only a wallbreaker but also a stallbreaker and having a dual STAB it can put to use. Meanwhile Salamence got Aerilate and its mixed set is more potent than ZardY's special only set.
And, well, Mega Kangaskhan, Mega Salamence and Mega Gardevoir were the three most used Pokemon during VGC.

Then again, the shitload of Heatrans and Landorus does make it difficult for Zard Y to make a move.

>>30899524
>stallbreaker
Not even a thing in VGC, you want something dead, you double target

>>30898728
charizard needed a lot of support to properly work but if you managed to you had the strongest special nuke in the game. I used it semi-casually and had some good results, sadly vgc15 was pretty much a solved game.

>>30895973
Do we know if Enosh's tapu fini was calm or bold?

>>30899924
But how is Mega Gardevoir not the strongest special nuke? It's got Pixelate Hyper Voice, a slightly better special Atk stat than Zard Y and it can make better use of its other typing (Psyshock), meanwhile ZardY's best Flying-type attack is Air Slash and it sucks.

I keep seeing arcanine being used but it's been mostly bulky snarls and special attacking moves. Is there a specific reason why nobody is investing in physical? I'm assuming recoil moves? Also what's the usual build for this VGC arcanine?

>>30900068
Sun

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>>30900071
I'ma assume people are going to give you either bad answers or no answers, so here's something to use as an initial template from data before you start eving your arcanine in a more specific way for your team.

While its from smogon, its from their vgc 2017 ladder. Pretty similar, if you as me.

Running special koko is basically the same thing as running physical fini

What's Gavin's full team stats? I tried recreating it but I'm trash and failed

Any news on when Z Parting shot will be fixed? I wanna try running a Persian on my trick room team with it.

>>30900770
I would assume when they update Bank.

>>30900068
you never took a 252 modest ovverheat in the sun, didn't you?

>>30898621
>VGC primape team, which isnt too bad
Nothing surprising about that, it's the fastest Defiant user available right now.

>>30900068
Move BP makes a huge amount of difference.

The jump in damage between a 108BP move which gets a 25% damage penalty being spread and a 130BP single attack is night and day.

>>30900387
>someone ran rain dish pelliper
>someone ran keen eye pelliper
>someone ran marvel scale milotic
>someone ran white smoke torkoal
>someone ran anger point krookodile

god damn

>>30901009
I thought the modern builds of Zard Y keep it below the 100 EVs for SpA, considering the current situation is kinder to a bulkier Zard.

Overheat would still wreck shit though.

>>30901107
True, but isn't Overheat like a last resort attack?

What natures should I go after for UBs?

Alternatively

Should I just inject?

>>30901206
>What natures should I go after for UBs?
Choose the best one for each UB

http://pastebin.com/ijVeDaSn

Tried recreating Gavin's team because I like Mimikyu Drampa and Araquanid a lot, but having trouble getting it perfect

>>30898514
Rain is a hell of a lot more useful than that, my friend.

Pelipper is a madman now, nuff said. Shiinotic and Parasect can both make use of their Rain-friendly abilities to engage in some Spore shenanigans, with the former having lots of fun new moves and the latter able to dick teams around with Rage Powder.

Not to mention more involved strategies, like Instructing Scalds off of Tapu Fini for that delicious chance to burn two enemies in one turn. Even better if you've got Trick Room up. Rain is really versatile this year. Swift Swim is babby's first Rain strategy.

>>30897290
RIP

>>30901310
>Tapu Fini
>Burn

>>30901393
>tapu fini comes in
>another tapu comes in and replaces misty terrain with other terrain

is it that hard to imagine a situation like that, anon?

>>30901149
>True, but isn't Overheat like a last resort attack?
Even if it is, in the end you're +1 Pokemon even if it is crippled and which goes away if you can find a opportunity to switch.

>>30897334
Imagine if we had Alolan Wheezing... and it still knew levitate.

>>30901149
if you use it right you trade a switch for a KO.

>>30901310
>like Instructing Scalds off of Tapu Fini for that delicious chance to burn two enemies in one turn
There are many things I can think of Instructing with Fini and a weakass Scald off the least offensively threatening Tapu is not one of them. If you're going to go for that kinda gimmick you better be going for the KO or crippling the opponent.

>Shiinotic
That thing has no place at all in this meta with those stats and everything running a Fairy killer in fear of Tapu's. Even for just Grass/Fairy you have Whimsicott and Bulu who are more useful.
Rain's real strength comes from that it is every bit as versatile as Sun or Sand due to the number of things you can do.

>>30901564
>tfw my only fairy kill move is poison jab from garchomp

shit mang

How's Ninetails Gastrodon Arcanine sound as a core?

>>30901710
fuck off

What are some ways to build Silvally?

>>30901999
If multi-attack wasn't a physical move, I'd say a mixed attacker or something, but since it IS a physical move, go with that.

I really wish z-crystals worked on it like they do for arceus.

>>30901999
Pivot, Suicide or special attacker.

>>30896323
Because its terrain puts its special attack on par with Mewtwo's.

I don't know what I want to build. There's a lot of options but none of my favorite Pokémon are meta.

I guess that's what I should expect when rock ghost and dark are my favorite types

>>30902948
Alolan Muk is amazing, as is Alolan Marowak. And Mimikyu can do work too.

Also Gigalith is actually good now too.

>>30902991
Yeah but none of those are something you build teams around. They're tech choices. Though gigalith might work.

Hi, how stupid/meme is this Golduck?

Golduck @ Choice Specs
Ability: Cloud Nine
Level: 50
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 1 Atk
- Ice Beam
- Scald
- Psychic
- Hidden Power [Steel]

The point is to be able to stop weather, and then kill each weather setter, so pelipper, ninetails, gigalith, and torkoal. (other parts of my team have electric coverage for the pelipper) Should I just drop this for something else?

Is my boi gigalith actually good now? I know he has sandstorm but is that really enough to make up for his shallow move pool and terrible typing/speed tier?

>>30903108
He outslows all the weather setters except Torkoal, so that's good

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>>30898299
I like my Heatran

Rockium Z Gigalith is the way to go, yeah?

>>30898514
What about Kingdra?

>>30903324
Not in the Alola dex

>>30903088
i'm pretty sure you won't get any KO with that.

>>30895973
I missed the stream and only managed to see that meme Mimikyu with curse.
What did other people carry?

>>30895973
Enosh the Second confirmed to be his real name?

Damn I wanted Fini to win.

What set was Drampa rocking?

>>30896056
I ran weakness policy Fini since a week after release

>>30903497
Something something my hyper voice deals a truckload of damage

>>30903088
Ninetales outspeeds you and isn't KOd through Aurora Veil
Torkoal will still get a few eruptions since it's usually run with Oranguru (or Lilligant, in which case you'll have to pick which you target and which destroys you)
Gigalith would probably be a similar situation to Torkoal

In fairness, the possibility of enabling your swift swim will scare off a lot of rain users, but the weather setters aren't so common or so similar that you need one Pokémon to counter all of them.

>>30903088
This is a horrible idea. If you want to use Golduck, go swift swim. If you want to use cloud nine, use Drampa. Or put literally anything else in this slot.

>>30896352
But the London tournament was pretty damn diverse too

>>30903497
Hyper Voice, Draco Meteor and Flamethrower IIRC.
Last move was probably protect, thunderbolt, ice beam or energy ball.

>>30903584
Was more curious about EV and nature, it was probably rocking Hyper Voice, Draco Meteor/Pulse, Roost, and Hurricane

>>30903606
>>30903620
Thank you, may just change it for drampa or a better water type

>>30903497
draco meteor, flamethrower, energy ball, and protect I believe. Maybe ice beam over flamethrower. I remember being surprised that it didn't have hyper voice.

>>30903649
Derf yeah this is more likely, forgetting it's doubles

>>30903665
You're welcome, it's always smart to get a second opinion. Golduck isn't terrible if it has rain support, it can outspeed and OHKO things that threaten it like Tapu Koko if it packs Hydro Vortex. Water seems to be a pretty good offensive type this season, probably why Gastrodon is rising in use. I really wish we could use Kingdra this year.

The Jew got BTFO

USA USA USA

http://pastebin.com/PjsDcRsT

here's gavin's team

https://twitter.com/komvgc/status/810954095326478336

>>30904223
i highly doubt those are the spreads he used tho

>>30904269
read the tweet

>>30904223
No wonder he didn't use Mimikyu the whole tournament, that set is trash.

>>30896128
Im sorry drampa. You deserve better then box 3

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>>30895973
Is that a fucking PELIPPER?

>>30904504
I see you've come out from under your rock

What are the viable natures of Arcanine? I feel like there are a lot. You can go Modest or Adamant probably, or Jolly or Timid, or even Bold/etc.

>>30903606
Ninetales can't get aurora veil up fwiw. Still a shit cloud nine mon use Gramps.

>>30904504
Nice of you to come out from your rock

>>30904504
epic rock meme

http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/official-smogon-vgc-17-tournament-sign-ups-read-op-carefully.3590186/

Why do so many people use Porygon2? Isn't it outclassed by Chansey?

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>>30904803

>>30904504
Back to smogon with all the retards.

>>30904803
My guess is it might have something to do with one of the z-conversions.

>>30904844
fucking newfags

>>30904844
Why are there so many people falling for this Z-Conversion meme on goddamn Porygon2? Have you literally just started playing the game today or something?

>>30904891
No I just never actually used a porygon of any kind. I have less of an idea than the guy confused as to why they weren't using chansey.

>>30904891
They're playing Porygon-Z on the simulator with made-up rules instead of the real game with decent rules.

>my favorite UB Kartana is super versatile and prevalent
Fuck yes, love that little paper cutie.

>>30904803
What is TR setting with bretty good bulky, and a good movepool, also the extra plus of getting SpA buff from download (is just a plus not a big deal)

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>>30905084
>versatile
>you can choose between AV and sash

>>30905067
Except no person ever who has ever played the game even once in there life would use Porygon2 for anything other than Eviolite memes. Eviolite should be the most common sense answer when newfags see Porygon2. PorygonZ is the offensive one that would actually WANT Z-Conversion boosts

>>30905197
I think he got the fragile speedsters mixed and meant to say Pheromosa.

>>30905067
Well explain how it differs, then, dickknob.

>>30905208
why does everyone mess their, there and they're up? come on man.

Other than that. You said it yourself, everyone who has ever played the GAME.

There's a lot of faggots that never bought any of them and just ran the simulator, hence why they don't how much of a pain is to evolve all three Porygons, reason why we can distinguish them apart. Whereas people who only play the SIMULATOR always but always confuse some basic shit like that.

>inb4 PkHex related thing
I do use it. It saves a lot of time, but I use it to play the game rather than that thing where rules are determined by some corrupted council.

>>30905280
One is a final evolution, one is not. Do you even own the game? Which was the last pokemon game you ever bought? Jesus. I can't believe there are retards that doesn't get why Z-Conversion is not the best option on Porygon2.

Pretty new to VGC, any recomends?

Togedemaru @ Air Balloon
Ability: Lightning Rod
Level: 50
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Nuzzle
- Zing Zap
- Fake Out
- Spiky Shield

Pelipper @ Damp Rock
Ability: Drizzle
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Protect
- Hurricane
- Scald
- Tailwind

Scizor @ Life Orb
Ability: Swarm
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Swords Dance
- U-turn
- Bullet Punch
- Quick Attack

Goodra @ Leftovers
Ability: Hydration
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dragon Pulse
- Ice Beam
- Sludge Wave
- Thunder

I usually open with toge + pelipper to get a fake out and tailwind combo, paralyzing everything after and trying to snatch as many whirwinds as possible, scizor is in there since its such an obvious choice in rain teams and goodra is bulk and coverage.

>>30905528
i just noticed my scizor had swarm all along, this explains quite alot ffs

>>30905528
go for it

>>30905528
Other than the Swarm you just noticed, some general recommendations.

Run the calculator to know how much of the 252/252 stuff you really need. Specialized spreads are way more important in VGC than singles.

Togedemaru isn't meant to be a damage dealer but to be as annoying as possible. 252 Atk is a bit too much. Who are you aiming for with this? If it's no one, then consider that. Also, Encore is quite a nice move against stalling moves. Not 100% needed but a nice recommendation.

I don't see Quick Attack to be a nice choice with Scizor, whereas U-Turn would benefit from some speed investment. These are the moves with questions marks on my eyes. If you find someone that can heavily damage Scizor but you can outspeed, like say Marowak, then U-Turn is a nice idea. If you don't find someone, or if you find the move too situational, then it's better to get Bug Bite and Technician bonus. I didn't test Scizor too much still, but I tried Thief / Feint on him, and judging from your set, I think you'll like Feint.

My two cents there. Who are you considering as 5/6th pokemon?

>>30905710
thanks for the tips m8. Ye Quick Attack was more of a filler, ill def try feint!

Will also reconsider ev spread on togedemaru, shall i keep the speed for the nuzzles?

I dont know what to use as last pokes. kind of why i posted in the first place :)

>>30899209
I've been checking as well. It's looking like it won't be updated till after the season is over.

>>30905710
Scizor can't get bug bite without tutors.

>>30905528
Use sludge bomb on goodra, not sludge wave. Also probably protect on it and scizor. And if you really want to run scizor, you'll want a tapu that isn't lele, to get rid of psychic terrain. Bulu would be good since you'd probably have trouble with bulky waters otherwise.

>>30895973
Seriously if you don't have a Trick Room team yourself how are you supposed to beat the one that got 1st place?
>Inb4 muh taunt and fake out.
That only delays your inevitable loss.

>>30905912
Phase the P2 out

>>30905837
Ouch, forgot this. Guess that's one of the reasons I didn't try it yet (I really miss Knock Off on him).
>>30905779
Yes, keep the speed on Maru. That ball's main job is to be annoying and being 252 Speed on it is the way to go since you don't want to lose against other Togedemarus, although if you feel you won't face a lot of them, check the speed tier list and adjust properly.

>>30905912
go faster than the TR, agility alolachu in electric terrain, get off two agilities and that trick room wont mean shit.

I can't build teams without Marowak and Magnezone anymore. Fucking Koko is everywhere.

>>30906276
kek

Dewpider? Isn't dewpider a sack of shit?

>>30906582
You mean Araquanid? No, it is definitely not a sack of shit.

>>30898178

>Butterfree

What the actual fuck?

>>30906772
And it wasn't a meme.

>>30906582
Stop trusting /vp/'s shit judgment, a big special wall that hits like a truck and can't get burned isn't shit.

>>30906582
Back to smogon.

>>30905912
You run at least two pokémon that run good under trick room as usual.
Arash for example won solely because he could shit all over the opponent's trick room with his own Amoongus.

>>30904223
>Those trash sets

How the hell did he got so far

>>30896323
>healthy diversity
>porygon2 everywhere

>>30895973
Respect for gavin michels

I'm not sure how any sane human can look at the usage stats between VGC and smogon and say "yup, VGC is definitely better than smogon"

>>30907348
Then go back to your place and enjoy your 200+ turns of stallfest. Don't worry about potential sweepers or wallbreakers, they'll get banned sooner or later :^)

>>30907348

Chess is a game where you play with the exact same team as the enemy, every single game. It has been around for centuries. According to you, Chess is a bad game because you can't choose how many queens and pawns you have on your side and "everyone is just the same man look at these usage statistics of the pawns >:( it's all the same x_X how could anybody think this is a better game than smogon OU!!!!! wow fuck this"

once again proving that smogon kids have autism

>>30907348
They do though, dubs means gimmicks will actually work sometimes and anything that's a serious threat can usually be focused down and killed instead of steamrolling your team

>>30908018
Shitty comparison, the rules of chess require both players to have the same pieces, Pokemon doesn't.

>>30898667
I was just about to post exactly this. What a fucking badass.

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>>30907348
>thinking Smogon Singles OU is better in any way

>>30908379
smogon UU is the best

>>30908417
I know, right? One of my favorite things to do with my UU team is to lead with my Absol and mega evolve right away, then the inevitable set ups get launched back to my opponent because for some reason almost no one ever remembers that mega absol has magic bounce.

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>>30896128
>Been using Drampa since day 1 because I was determined to use my favorite mon this gen
>Ruining people with him since they have no idea what to expect from him since no one's been using him
>mfw silly grandpa dragon better dragon than the psuedo dragon this gen
>mfw 1st place Drampa finally getting the representation he deserves

Holy fuck I love this little old man dragon so much I'm so happy Anons you have no idea.

>>30907348
Right now based on usage stats OU has 47 pokemon above the OU cutoff (3.41%) and VGC2017 has 46
http://www.smogon.com/stats/2016-11/gen7vgc2017-0.txt
http://www.smogon.com/stats/2016-11/ou-0.txt
VGC2015 ended up with a similar amount above 3.41% and this was reflected in tournaments if you don't cherrypick worlds top 8

>>30901290
>liquidation & waterfall on Waterium Araquanid
Why? I use liquidation/scald in case I need a burn or if I'm against something physically bulky. I get that Araquanid with Waterfall can work in Trick Room sets but even then it feels like you're wasting a moveslot

http://pastebin.com/bHKLZq2d

Rate my team.

>>30908057
The point is that even when you have the "same team" as someone else, battle tactics still make the game interesting enough to be played for millennia. I don't really understand the whinging about usage stats. If you don't ever want to see the same character used twice in a tournament then go play tekken.

>>30908945
I haven't read it but your team is shit

>>30909119
its not my team, im just saying it is

Can someone explain how people build their Celesteela?
I see good options for both defensive and offensive, but is one type of set particularly better than the other? Wondering specifically about the careful, heavy slam, leech seed, protect, x set.

>>30897391
You can't catch them in Sun and Moon, so we've got at least until the next game without them.

>>30905332
I think he's asking how using Z conversion on Showdown is different from using Z conversion on the cartridge.

>>30895973
Any more beast porygons?

>>30906887
>hits like a truck

you keep saying this, yet on stream all it ever did was lunge for negligible damage or use a z-move that would have knocked out anyay. I never saw this thing take out more than a quarter of anything's health outside of using a z-move

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>>30895973
>No Tapu/UB/Legendary cancer on the winning team
Fucking based.

>>30895973
>Four tapu koko in top 6
When are we going to admit that thing is massively overrated?

>>30904463
Is there a VGC Mimikyu set that isn't trash? I love the little guy, but its ability becomes a lot less powerful when double targetting is an option.

>>30910108
I love how he just overpowered Tapu Koko into submission. Not even a Marowak.

>>30895973
Wait
>no garchomp
>no celesteela
>one marowak
huh

>>30910284

Maybe some kind of destiny bond meme

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Why is he so based?

>>30908740
I love gramps too, glad that he's actually viable with cloud nine.

>>30910322
American memes.

Same drill as 2015, bring in all the memes, get buttblasted at worlds, complain about japanese favoritism.

>>30910284
It's fast, immune to fake out, and gets taunt, so it has a niche as one of the few things that would have been able to shut down Gavin's team

>>30908945
Is Z-Trick Room + Sleep Powder actually any good? The only people I've seen trying to use it have been retarded.

>>30910051
It's almost water bubble only works with water moves and they used lunge to lower the opponent's attack

>>30901501
i dont see how a ice type with levitate is that good

http://pastebin.com/5cfcqHAr
Rate team pls

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http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/official-smogon-vgc-17-tournament-sign-ups-read-op-carefully.3590186/page-16

Join fast because only the first 60% or so gets to actually partecipate. Does't matter if your team isn't ready yet.

>>30915273
>smogon
>vgc
You wat

>>30914964
252 252 spreads are shit 80% of the time since only pokémon that will die in one hit or pokémon like Mence that need to hit hard but also must win any speed tie use them.

Bonemerang is better on Marowak, a single target ground move is really worth it, specially since there's grassy terrain this time around.

I've seen people using curse on Muk, I guess it's good on trick room teams but I personally prefer shadow sneak to pickup dying shit like Tapu Koko that otherwise will play around you and manage to hit you at least one more time with a potential KO.

Araquanid usually dies in three hits, stockpile isn't good for it, specially since leech life only gets used when liquidation is resisted.

Enjoy missing with Fireblast in crucial moments.

>>30915285
They want to enter the business, and since Nugget Bridge is trying its hardest to kill itself I feel they'll be able to.

>>30896361
I'm guessing you also believe in the new toy thing.

>>30895973
>drampa + rest or leftovers = free sp.att boost

>>30915273
>VGC tournament
>playable on showdown
Smogon please

>>30915392
Own Tempo is better

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does someone know when it's the next streamed event?

doesn't matter if it's in another language or if it's not official.

>>30915273
Just signed in, thanks for the tip Chaika. I was gonna put it off for later.

Where did they say that though?

>>30916228
>Note that Smogon's hosting rules require most tournaments to accept the first 62.5% of players that sign up, and then randomize the remainder of the players, so if you posted before someone that got in and you didn't, this is the most likely reason why.

In tournament rules, it's not explicited in the page itself so they might accept everyone, but you never know.

How many of you would be willing to participate in a /vp/ VGC online tournament?

>>30916317
Thanks again, I better give it all a proper read just in case.

>>30916321
Are you the guy who was talking about that the other day? Because if so, sure.

>>30916331
no I'm not that guy
did we already talked about it? I missed it

So appearantly my friend introduced the possibility of having a digital copy of S+M along with a physical at the same time, and using a team with bogus stats on the digital copy while your legal yet seemingly identical team you use for hack checking is on your physical copy. Is this actually a thing or is he being a worrywart? And another thing, correct me on the rules but are digital game copies even VGC legal? How would they hack check them?

>>30916627
>So appearantly my friend introduced the possibility of having a digital copy of S+M along with a physical at the same time, and using a team with bogus stats on the digital copy while your legal yet seemingly identical team you use for hack checking is on your physical copy. Is this actually a thing or is he being a worrywart?
Sounds needlessly complicated. Just pack an extra 3DS without any homebrew if you are that paranoid about it.

> And another thing, correct me on the rules but are digital game copies even VGC legal?
Of course they are.

>How would they hack check them?
If your team enters in Battle Spot then you are good to go.

>>30909664
>what is poke transfer
>what is pkhex

>>30916627
>>30916652
it's actually posible
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WvK6xE-Bgh8

>>30916321
When friendly tournaments go up it might be neat to hold those frequently

>>30916657
When the pokébank appears all it's going to change is some pokémon obtaining egg moves they couldn't get before. The rules themselves won't change.

You need to wait for VGC2018 and hope the rules include bank pokémon. Which will probably happen since that's the pattern. I still hope they tell Lando-T to fuck off this time around and ban pseudos overall. Yeah I hate Lando-T that much.

>>30916688
>I still hope they tell Lando-T
That's a possibility as long as they keep the cross rule and the next games don't include every single remaining pokemon.

>>30916652
Every tourney I've been to asks you to remove your game and they will hack check it on thier 3ds, usually because thier 3ds is hooked up to the wifi. I can't remember how regionals did it, I think it was the same? I certainly don't remember anyone accessing the Internet on my 3ds.
>>30916660
Watching it now. But to clarify my point, I understand it CAN BE done, but I wanted to know if it is something that people are doing recently? Have there been any instances of someone getting caught, etc.
Primary reason is I'm trying to get a friend into VGC, but he's less than willing right now because he's concerned for this possibility of competitors cheating and getting away scott free.
If anyone here has friends that play pokemon and you've tried to introduce them to VGC, I'm sure you understand the difficilty.

>>30916726
How does that work with digital copies?

>>30916726
>Watching it now. But to clarify my point, I understand it CAN BE done, but I wanted to know if it is something that people are doing recently? Have there been any instances of someone getting caught, etc.
We know of the possibility, that's why there's such a huge shitstorm right now.

>Primary reason is I'm trying to get a friend into VGC, but he's less than willing right now because he's concerned for this possibility of competitors cheating and getting away scott free.
Then tell him to stop being a little bitch and to inform himself. If he notices something odd and he knows the judge is ignorant he can just tell the judge "Hey bro make sure to also check the digital game because this and that". It's not that hard.

>>30916740
How about you watch the damn video bub? >>30916660

>>30916657
still need them with the new simbol, gen 6 star is useless

>>30916765
>gen 6 star is useless
not quite, pentagon still works for battlespot, just not VGC battlespot.
So we'll get a decent idea of what VGC18 or whatever looks like in advance

>>30916785
No, it doesn't. Unless you consider free battles as "Battlespot". All the ranked ladders need the + marking.

>>30898465
Underrated

>>30916726
>but he's less than willing right now because he's concerned for this possibility of competitors cheating and getting away scott free.


All they're doing is skipping the breeding process, their pokémon can't have illegal stats or movesets. You can bitch about all you want about their method of aquiring pokémon, but in battle they're fighting fair and square.

>>30916660
Side note for something he adressed in the video, but all my locals since vgc 15 have been using paper teamsheets. That said if you goof up and put wrong info down, I don't think that's something I can sympathize with.

>>30916830
https://3ds.pokemon-gl.com/support/2/en/manual/manual_battle/basic-rules/

>>30916858
Anyone with half a brain says "Well fuck, sucks to be you but c'mon how can't you write your team down properly?". All the people whining about it are entitled top players who think that the ground they step on is sacred.

I mean, there was a guy who wrote fucking Porygon and forgot the 2. How do you even fuck up that badly? It's just a damn single number.

>>30916838
Nono, that's not the issue. Hell, I'll even gen some pokemon upon occasion. Picture this-
You have 2 copies of the same game, with the same pokemon and movesets for each battleborn in both these games. The difference is game B had a team where each Pokemon's stats are higher than legal, say +50 in all stats. They use the digital/physical copies to fool people into thinking they are playing the legal team when in reality they are playing with the illegal team, and nobody knows game B with the illegal team even exists.

>>30916891
Sorry, battle box, not battle born. Thank god VGC doesn't have the player base size that Battleborn does.

>>30916891
Of course, they can just fucking look at your 3ds home menu, see that you have a digital copy and quickly check it and see if it has a locked battlebox.

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What are some good natures for Klefki?

>>30916891
They can't do that either because the game has a legality check, it's a shitty one and doesn't even check the ball sure, but it will block pokémon with illegal stats.

>>30916943
Adamant.

>>30916944
The game doesn't check that when doing IR battles.

>>30916943
Lax

>>30908379
Singles is bad l0l
OU is also kinda bland, but that's more of a "this is meta" type thing that nearly every game has.

>>30916944
I didn't know this but if >>30916952 says then it still is possible, since vgc tournaments do infared.

>>30898410
Poliwrath?

>>30904756
this looks interesting but the idea of committing to always be available for a months-long tournament may be a bit too much.

>>30915273
>signups not even opened for 24 hours
>already nearing 500 signups
Dear god

>>30905912
have a faster fake out user and taunt. Then you have 3 turns to kill the fucking duck.

>>30916660
Ok so after watching this I'm quite confused that he adressed it as a problem but I never heard at any time when it happened, he only mentioned about the people who miswrote on teamsheets and screenpeeking. So I'm just as confused before, has there been evidence of this occuring? I mean real talk, there are some autistic mother fucker who play this game, and I wouldn't put it past a handful of them to pull something like this.
Secondly, he mentioned there are a handful of ways to not be able to detect the hack, and there's a simpler way without even getting into it- for menuhax you can program what button you hold on startup to get into menuhax. While they are busy holding select, nobody would think to hold one of the Dpad directions that I put on customized (granted I wouldn't bring a hacked 3ds to battle in the first place, mind you).
Tbh I'm worried this would happen to me becauae I'm not a walking calculator- I wouldn't be able to remember every number crunch for every match up on my team. Common ones, sure, but not every. I build defense to take a jolly Xmon, but what if Xmon is Adamant instead? That might kill me, I don't remember the calcs for it. What if he has a choice band? Etc. It won't stop me from playing, definitely not, but it does worry me the possibility exists.

when do you think the HA starters will be released (if they ever will)?

>>30898410
kingdra?

>>30917102
The wonders of money.

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>>30917102
>>30917443
>All those people with newly made accounts
90% of the people on this are total shitters who probably have never touched VGC ever in their life and are signing up just because of the prizing. Nothing to worry about in the long term. I feel sorry for the organizers though.

>>30917360
probably an event in the next game

So, Arcanine is my favorite pokemon. And I see it is getting some VGC competitive play.

I heard it is mainly run as a support.

What kind of pokes are good for it to support?
What builds/items are mainly run on it?

>>30895973
Gavin Michael's team actually looks like an in game team, Im glad it prevailed over Topu and UB cancer

How do I use the water spider?

>>30895973

>The only one without a Tapu Cancer or UB is the one who won

Maybe there is hope for VGC after all

>>30917608
>tapu cancer
Surley he's not that bad.

Will Zheng win worlds someday?

>>30917464
Assuming that
>the signup rate remains constant for the rest of today
>it halves tomorrow, halves again the day after tomorrow then stays constant for the rest of the week
There will be 2291 players in the tournament.

>>30917626
I bet my right ball that his little brother will win Worlds in Masters before he does.

>>30917626
Brenden Zheng will when he reaches masters next year.

>>30917646
>>30917647
I wonder how it must feel to get cucked by your younger brother.

>>30916321
I would for sure.

>>30908886
In case of Disable/Cursed Body memes I imagine.

Would a set like
>shadow ball
>sludge bomb
>Destiny bond
>protect
Work on a Gengar with Ghostium Z?

>>30917812
Why don't you try it first faggot? Do you ask your mommy permission for everything you do before trying it too or something?

>>30917608
Sometimes I miss chalk just for the fuck it triggers retards like you

>>30917258

If people have done it, it must have been subtle changes such as a few exchanged EVs to make OHKOs have a less of a chance. One can easily tell if a move or a nature is changed but like 16 EVs into Defense to turn a 90% OHKO chance to a 75% OKHO change is a lot harder to detect.

>>30917520
Mostly any pokémon that isn't Politoed or weak to water/EQ goes well with him.
He's a "debuffer" kind of support so what you're doing with Arcanine is crippling the opponent with Intimidate, Snarl and WoW.
Due to that it's a very versatile mon, feel free to experiment.

>>30895973
I want to make Z-Splash Swift Swim Poliwrath work. I assume that I should throw a Drizzle Pelipper in the team to help set up rain.

I was also thinking of throwing a Evolite Charjabug and an Alolan Raichu onto the team since Thunder never misses in Rain and Charjabug boosts partner pokemon Sp.ATk by 30%.

Can't think of another 2 pokemon to fit onto this team though.

>>30917045
>>30916952
I played at a local tournament this weekend and you need to download the VGC rules to play, after that you select the rules and the game will check if your party respects them, on top of that it removes nicknames from your pokémon. Now I'm not sure if the check also controls illegal stats, but it had some sort of check at the very least.
If you have two 3DSs you can easily manually check.

>>30917464
I made a smogon account on 2014 and literally never posted anything till now since there isn't much to discuss about VGC on their forums aside new people wanting a team check.

https://3ds.pokemon-gl.com/information/aab73d59-31f9-435c-a34b-2f571bcb447b

>>30918083
>you need to download the VGC rules to play
what do you mean by download exactly?

>>30918191
http://www.serebii.net/sunmoon/downloadrules.shtml

This way once you partecipate in a tourney you are able to select said rules.

>>30918149
neat

>>30917405
Kingdra is not part of the Alola Pokedex.

>>30908740
I just got wonder traded a perfect IV (except atk) w a calm nature last night. was already looking up builds but now I'm really into it. I looooooveeeee roost/recover on bulky homies

Best nature for Silvally? I doubt I'll use it, but if I'm gonna get a couple from S&M, they might as well have good natures. I've heard its special movepool is better, but that mixed one I saw that ran Grass Multi-Attack and Ice Beam seemed kind of cool, so would Naive be the best all-around one? Maybe Jolly for the other one for explosion memes.

>>30918051
Use something that can deal with gastrodon and alolan raichu or Lanturn, or anything that has an inmunity to your stabs. Lastly, anything with lighting rod to help your little pelipper. Can also just go full meta with koko and a-raichu (at least consider koko, terrain helps you).

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>>30919502
well what I'm planning on so far is:

Z-Splash Swift Swim Poliwrath
Drizzle Pelipper
Alolan Raichu
Charjabug

so you're saying I should aim to get some sort of Grass pokemon or at least a Grass type attack? Tapu KoKo would be nice but it'd be a 3rd electric type. I feel like I'm too attached to the idea of "evolite charjabug" for some reason but it sounds good

I'm mulling over which hidden power I want on my Lele, fire or ground. I'm leaning towards ground to deal with Heatran's eventual return. In the meantime, the only Steel type around right now that Lele has to worry about is Celesteela, and T-bolt hits that harder than HP fire. Although I guess there's Kartana, but Psychic OHKOs it unless it's AV.

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>>30919546

Poliwrath @Normalium-Z - Swift Swim
252atk/252hp/4speed(?)
Splash (Z-Splash is +3 attack)
Waterfall (STAB + Rain boost damage)
Brick Break/Wake Up Slap (I'm clueless about a good Fighting move)
Earthquake (Covers Electric weakness)

Pelipper @Damp Rock(?) - Drizzle
252sp.atk/252sp.def/4hp
Hurricane
Hydro Pump/Scald
U-Turn
Roost(?)

This is the one I'm confused about but giving your partner 30+ more Sp.Atk sounds good.
Charjabug@Evolite - Battery
252 defense/252 Sp.defense/4hp
Toxic(Figured if this thing is supposed to be bulky, give it a poison to counter other walls? I don't know.)
Iron Defense
Protect
Light Screen/Dig/Volt Switch

Thats all I got for right now, I dont have an idea of how to build my Alolan-Raichu currently but I'm using my limited knowledge of team building to figure this out

>>30919546
>>30920345
I'd give the water z-stone instead, an almost sure 1HKO is better imo. This way you get a protect slot. EQ isn't worth it for him, go for poison jab, that's the literally only thing it has over Golduck in the first place.

Damp Rock doesn't matter, most of the time the game finishes before rain goes out, and if it doesn't, chances are you're in a weather war or switched Pelipper once already. Give it focus sash, and instead of roost give it tailwind.

Anytime I fight against a charjabug I plain ignore it since it can't really do anything aside being a minor nuisance, so the match becomes a 2 vs 1. Once I'm done I plain kill the poor dude.

>>30920345
These are pretty bad. I recommend reading beginner stuff about VGC and/or watching some videos before trying to build your own team (Aaron Zheng/Cybertron has a video up on his youtube channel about vgc'17 teambuilding, for example, and periodically uploads videos of his battles on battle spot which are a good way to understand how vgc plays in general).

But regardless, your idea isn't bad. Your sets just need a lot of fixing.

Your Poliwrath most likely needs more speed than that. Go to trainertower and look for the current speed tiers, then calculate how much EVs an adamant Poliwrath needs to outspeed whatever threat it needs to kill (there should be speed calculators somewhere). Give it Protect instead of EQ and it should be good to go.

Your Pelipper set is just... not good. Protect and Tailwind instead of U-turn and Roost, give it a sash to ensure Tailwind always goes up and it should be fine. EVs could be better, but if you're just starting out it's fine to go for 252/252. You'll learn how to make better sets with time.

I'd get rid of Charjabug and just add Koko, especially if you're going for A-Raichu. Trainertower has sample movesets for both of them, too.

>>30895973
>Hariyama
It feels great to see the big guy get some love.

>Watch a Cybertron video
>Opp sends out A-Golem against Gyarados
>It Returns
>"What? That's weird but fine"
>Returns again
>"Oh"

Unsubbed.

>>30920345
>>30920779
there are actually links in the OP, even the aaron video

>>30916952
It does if you select any ruleset that isn't "unrestricted".

>>30920712
>>30920779
>>30920845

guys plz no bully ;_;

but thank you though, I'll fiddle around with stuff and actually look more into these things. I've flirted with the idea of getting into VGC stuff since Black/White 2 but this is the first time I'm actually at a decent starting point for all this.

I don't know why I'm so obsessed with making Z-Splash Poliwrath work, I don't even think its that good, its just something that caught my imagination for some reason, same with Charjabug

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>>30921025

I'm >>30920845 and I wasn't actually bullying, it's just that nobody ever reads the pastebin in the OP.

Anyway, go for it if you like Poliwrath, it's a cool mon, and if there's a format where you can make shitmons work, it sure is VGC 2017. Who knows, maybe VGC 2018 is full of genies.

Also, I think Damp Rock is pretty useless in doubles, I preffer Sitrus Berry for Pelipper. If you want to, I can tell you the exact set I use for it.

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I'm curious what the snorlax did on this team???
Does anyone know?

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>>30921174
Haha don't worry man, the "plz no bully ;_;" was a joke, its hard to joke in this day and age of ironic memes and what not.

I'll check those resources, I'm determined to make a shitmon or 2 work. I'm taking them to Worlds and I'll be satisfied knowing I got them there, even if we lost in the first round or whatever

>>30921217
to worlds? do you madman have enough championship points already or what?

>>30921215
Belly Drum with Gluttony and a Figy Berry I suppose.

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>>30921306
I havent even BEGUN to do VGC, I'm still making my first team. These are all just the lofty goals of a, as you say, madman.

>24 fucking pages

>>30904803

Unlike Chansey, it can actually hit worth a damn and eat a physical attack or two.

>>30908740

What is run on Drampfa anyway?

im struggling to figure out whether to go modest or timid on Lele.

I'm leaning towards modest as a bulkier spread with life orb can take a few hits and 1/2hko most things, but then has to worry about getting out-sped. On the other hand, timid scarf Lele out-speeds most things which helps score certain two hit 2kos that it shares with modest, but then struggles to secure kills on certain targets, most notably Porygon-2.

>>30921460
of what?

>>30921359
I guess you will try all these crazy ideas on showdown first, right?

and then, are you breeding them, or injecting them?

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>>30921653
yeah, I'm fiddling around with Showdown VGC 2017, and I'm currently breeding my Swift Swim Poliwag(Wrath) in my copy of Sun.

What's the nature/EV spread on that Drampa?

Let's keep VGC alive in /vp/, bros

>>30922364
>>30922364
>>30922364
>>30922364
>>30922364
>>30922364

>>30896330
at least the orders are different...