Competitive Viability Thread?

Decidueye will be PU, fuck off.

Even if primarina has uber tier stats pure disgust will keep people from using it.

>>29569787
>implying smogon nerds give a fuck
the Forces of nature say hi

Deidueye - RU
Incineroar - UU
Primaruna - OU

>>29569745

Decidueye - PU
Incineroar - RU
Primarina - OU

Tsareena - OU, if it has great stats, I can see it floating a tier higher.
Toucanpek - OU, shitty designs are usually the ones that are competitively viable.
Salandit/Salandit2 - OU

Tapu Koko - OU
Tapu Lele - OU
Tapu Fini - OU
Tapu Bulu - PU

Incineroar is at least UU or BL its got a very offensive typing

Owl will most likely be RU because it probably wont get much stab moves considering its dramatic type change.

Primarina is for sure going to OU

>>29569771
>damaging Block
>PU
nice meme, it will be UU at worst

>>29569787
Genies.

>>29569745
Lunala definitely won't be in Ubers.

>>29569821
The genies have better designs then primashit

>>29569813
Tapu fini is more like uu since its ability is pretty redundant

Salandit2 is NU its ability is useless unless its a tank which looking at its frail design is most likely not the case

Toucan is PU skill link is useless with no stab moves and its just normal flying

This thread is going to be filled with idiots that know the basics of competitive play at best isn't it? Filled with meme sets and disappointment come November 18th.

>>29569832
No
>>29569820
No its typing has been horrible and it wont get any useful ghost moves or grass moves. RU at best

>>29569813
>Tsareena
>OU or higher
>Insinuating a mono grass physical attacker will be anything higher than RU

>>29569874
Its new movenis broken though. Definetly BL

>>29569787

Wow. What a very valid and logical reason.

I use Pokemon that are generally accepted as ugly and are not fan favorites purely because of their viability (e.g., Garbodor, Landorus, and etc.) and rekt my opponents with them.

>>29569826

Quite so. Poor Lunala. Wasted opportunity. I guess they didn't want another Xerneas.

>>29569867
> it wont get any useful ghost moves or grass moves.
Mind leaking the rest of the game for us then if you know so much about it?

And what fucking moves do you expect it to get if it doesn't get any useful of its 2 STAB types?

>>29569745
I think Primarina will be UU unless it does get Aurora Veil. Its typing is great, but starters usually get awkward stat distributions to make them easy to use in game, and there are better walls currently in OU (though Primarina will most likely be useful in this tier as well)

Decidueye depends entirely on its stats distribution (and maybe its HA). Grass/Ghost is an OK typing, but if it isn't fast and it doesn't hit hard enough there won't be much it can do. My guess for it is RU/UU

Incineroar will most likely be low UU or RU. As much as I like it, it's typing is not that great, and the only thing it really has going for it is that it's a physical attacker that can't get burned, which again other pokemon do better already.

>>29569867
>it wont get any useful ghost moves or grass moves.
Shadow Sneak, Shadow Claw, Phantom Force, Shadow Ball, Leaf Blade and Leaf Storm all fit the design.

>>29569856
>being immune to status is redundant
Did you only read the first half of what Misty Terrain does?

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>>29569813
>Tapu Lele not Ubers

i have a feeling salandit will be ou. looks speedy and the offensive typing and ability could patch the holes in many a team. i am thinking it could be like a new jolteon, kinda. although, i guess heliolisk is already the new jolteon....

whatever. i feel that salandit will be ou and actually used in ubers to hit threats like dialga and steel-arceus.

Lunala-OU
>typing and ability are just fine, not uber
Solgaeyyoeo-OU
>same as lunala; could be metagross replacement
Decidueye-UU
>typing is fine, but previous grass-ghost mons are stuck in nu and below so ???
Primarina-OU
>mad god-like typing
Bruxish-OU
>expecting it to be slowbro that's immune to priority
Persian-OU
>ugly but two amazing abilities; need to see stats
Muk-UU or RU
>amazing typing but we need stats
Toucan-PU
>normal/flying?
Zygarde new forms-Uber
>I think his attack that grounds flying types is op but we'll see
Greninja-OU
>without protean, greninja is literally a mega with items but no ability. i think people will be able to handle him this time

>>29569867
>Grass/Ghost being a horrible typing and Thousand Ghost Waves being a horrible move
please kys Primarinafag.

>>29569858
The party has just begun, you idiot. No need to be such a negative faggot.

>>29569895
This much I agree. Trop Kick + Queenly Majesty have huge potential.

Let's talk about Pyukumuku tho? People are already planning how to use it.

>>29569909
It weakens dragon moves despite tapu fini being immune to dragon all together

>>29569867
>its typing has been horrible
Yeah on Trevenant and Gourgeist maybe. But you don't see people calling Bug/Steel a bad type because it's on Wormadam, Durant, and Escavalier, do you?

kys

>>29569858
Yup
Fucking knew it. No one in this thread knows anything about competitive Pokemon.

>>29569745
Incineroar looks like a decent wallbreaker, it will probably be UU.

Primarina has an awesome typing, depending on stats it could easily be OU.

No idea on decidueye.

>>29569813
>Physical mono grass
>OU

What the fuck did you smoke.

"Popplimaid is OU"
What is this meme? IIt'l only be OU if it gets Serene Grace, but that hasn't been confirmed yet

>>29569903
Ghost owl with its imunities and traping abilities make it more suited for a utility role. If it gets defog it would instantly be OU

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>>29569904
Its going to be a special attacker. It has no need for phantom force you fucking idiot.

>>29569937
This. Typing doesn't affect that much unless in extreme cases of bad types.

Stats and movepools are the most important

>>29569858
>>29569945

Okay VGC polices. You can leave now if you think you're better than us.

>>29569935
And also makes you immune to status which is the part that you don't seem to understand. Literally no one cares about the dragon weakening aspect of it.

>>29569956
>signature move is physical

>>29569973
Not very helpful now that thunderwave got nerfed

>>29569956
It's signature move is physical. Either Decidueye is a physical attacker or mixed. But not special

>>29569979
>>29569997
Its definetly going to be special its a ghost and an owl for godsake gf has been known to fuck things like this up in the past.

>>29569951
Fairy/water is great both offensively and defensively, it just needs a decent spread and a basic movepool to shine.
No need for a broken ability like Serene Grace, Swift Swim could be decent enough.

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Keep this debate coming. I love when /vp/ brainstorms and argues over frivolous matter.

>>29570011
Except we've pretty much only seen the Rowlet line use physical moves.

Hey >>29569951

This is your answer: >>29570019

Get educated sis.

>>29570011
Sure buddy, but don't spam threads with your anger once the games come out and it ends up being physical.

>>29569867
>Grass/Ghost
>shit
Stay under 1300 forever

>>29570023
wtf are you saying? speak english for fucks sake. Stop trying to sound smart dude it just makes you look stupid. No one cares if you know fancy words

>>29570011
>it's ghost and an owl
Your point?

>>29569990
>never has to worry about being Scald burned, making it the perfect Keldeo counter
>never has to worry about Toxic
>if it gets Calm Mind it will basically be Clefable 2.0
B-B-But Thunder Wave got nerfed so being immune to status isn't important anymore!
This place is retarded.

>>29570033
>Air slash

>>29570056
I'm not trying to sound smart.

Frivolous is a pretty common word especially in law school. We spew this word out in a daily basis.

You're the stupid one here.

>>29570079
>one move means it will be Special or mixed

>>29570072
Not to mention thunder wave's nerf didn't take away full paralysis. So it's not as good, but the most annoying aspect is still there

>>29569745
These are some of my guesses.

Decidueye- UU. Amazing signature move and good typing.

Incineroar- UU. Fixes everything wrong wth Houndoom, and will probably get good moves.

Primarina- OU. Bulky Water/Fairy.

Toucan- RU. Pikipek has absurd attack for where it is, and Skill Link. Toucan is probably better than Cinccino.

Vikavolt- UU. High special attack and likely high speed. I can see it being better than Galvantula only lacking in Sticky Web.

Gumshoos- NU. Strong Jaw Hypet Fang sounds good, but I don't see it higher unless they give it some absurd attack stat.

Lycanroc-D- RU. Accelerock is good, but Rock is a bad typing and I don't see it faring too well.

Lycanroc-M- NU. Unless it's crazy strong. Not having Accelerock stings it.

Mimikyu- RU. Bad stats, but a good thing and ability. Movepool will determine where it ends up.

Bewear- BL2. It'll probably have an insane attack stat that gets it banned from RU, and a typing or bulk to back it up unlike Rampardos.

Minior- RU. Shell Smash + White Herb Acrobatics (and Stone Edge) sounds really good on paper, but I feel like bad stats and a mediocre typing will drag it down.

Drampa- RU, no question. Calcs prove it has around 125 special attack at least. So those Draco Meteors plus Fire Blast with specs and Sap Sipper will solidify a good place in the tier.

Tapu Koko- OU. Auto-Electric Terrain is amazing. Unless it turns out to be a physical attacker, in which case I'll say UU.

Tapu Lele- OU. Psychic Terrain completely turns the old meta on its head, and makes it immune to Burrito Punch.

Tapu Bulu- BL. God, this thing sounds annoying on paper. Leftovers + Grassy Terrain + Wood Hammer + Play Rough already sounds like cancer. If not for its typing, anyway.

Tapu Fini- OU. Water/Fairy that can't be statused and protects your team from Draco Meteor and Outrage. Might even be banned, honestly.

Magearna- BL. Scarf Soul Heart also sounds really good, but I can't see it getting past Chansey.

>>29570056
>doesn't know the meaning of a certain word

REEEEE MUH BELOW AVERAGE IQ STOP USING WORDS I DO NOT KNOW YOU SOUND STUPID

Pathetic

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>>29570079
Hence why I said "pretty much" and not "only"

>>29570072
Doesnt need to worry about scald when its a special attacker

Besides, speed is most important in pokemon

>>29569990
>Yeah, it halves speed now instead of quartering it, TWave is useless now!
Said no-one ever

>>29570111
do we already know Mimikyu and Drampa's stats?

>>29570132
>Doesnt need to worry about scald when its a special attacker
Special attackers don't like their health getting chipped away every turn.

>Besides, speed is most important in pokemon
>this is what sub-1100 shitters ACTUALLY believe

>>29570011

>Source: my ass

all the starters will be OU

>>29570293
Honestly I think this is likely. IIncineroar is the only one I'm not sure will be OU, but a good wallbreaker is always helpful

>Thread goes to shit because of 2 autistic faggots who don't even know what they're talking about
Good job /vp/

>>29570293
I think they'll all be at least UU. They're definitely going to be usable in OU though.

>>29570293
Primarina will be UU. Tapu Fini will outclass it as a bulky Water/Fairy.

Decidueye- Bl
Inceneroar-UU
Primarina-OU
Lycanrock-BL(Sun) RU(moon)
Tsareena-UU (only if it has good attack and speed and decent movepool) RU otherwise and a niche in ou with queenly majesty
Minior-UU
Mimikyu-UU
Salandit2-OU because corrosion

Let's be real here, Smogon will ban anything fun.

>Tapu Koko
OU, maybe, Ubers if it has a good enough movepool.

>Tapu Lele
Probably UU or BL, with some OU usage. I see it being in a similar boat to Zapdos.

>Tapu Fini
Most likely UU

>Tapu Bulu
I can see it being OU or BL and going on obnoxious balance teams. Grass Terrain healing it every turn would get really annoying.

>Minior
BL2. It's not as good as Mega Aerodactyl but probably too strong for RU.

>Lycanroc. Daytime will be UU with some OU usage. Nightime will be RU or NU most likely. That shitty ability and not having accelerock are really bad for it. IT will compete for slots with base form Aerodactyl.

>Toucan
Rotting in PU with its friends Unfezant and Pigeot.

>Decidueye
I could see it going to UU since it traps and kills Suicune. It'll find a niche slaying bulky water types and ruining stall and balance. Could go to BL.

>Incineroar
Most likely BL2 or RU.

>Primarena
UU for sure, it gels well with the tier's bulky water fixation and supports all those Dragon Dance users with that double screen move.

>Bewear
Most likely RU, maybe BL2. It goes good on bulky offense and Alomomola, the star of the tier, protects it from fire moves. Throw a ghost or fairy in for fighting weakness and you have a defensive core.

>Solalgeo
Ubers, possibly OU considering it has such crappy offensive typing

>Lunala
Possibly OU, I could see a Black-Kyurem thing going on with it. Terrible typing with a good ability. Remember, Baby-Hoopa is only slightly worse that Unbound Hoopa, attack-wise. The min thing holding t back is being Quadruple Weak to the best attack in the game (Knock Off). If Lunala is slower than Bisharp it will definitely be safe for OU. Pursuit Trappers seriously limit its usage as well, especially with Tyranitar on so many teams, so it might not even be able to switch in and out to soak up hits well. IF it stays Ubers, it will easily be one of the shitty ones nobody uses like Reshiram and Bug-Arceus.

>>29570393
Corrosion is only important on Stall teams. Salandit will be good because it's a Fairy counter that doesn't get walled by Steel types.

>>29570388
in that case it would be BL not UU

>>29570406
Lunala's only weaknesses are redundant types, and it has Multiscale to fix it. It'll basically be Mewtwo with an additional STAB.

>>29570406
>Tapu Fini
>UU
Fini is absurd.
>580 BST
>Water/Fairy
>auto Safeguard for five turns
>completely neuters Latios, Latias, and M-Sableye just by existing
It's going straight to the top of OU.

>>29569813
>Tapu Bulu
>PU
what the hell are you smoking

>>29569745
Decidueye UU
Incineroar RU
Primarina OU
Tsareena RU
Lunaala OU
Solgaleo Ubers
A-Raticate PU
A-Persian UU
A-Exeggcutor OU

>>29569813
Is this a bait post? There's so much wrong with your shitty predictions I don't know where to begin.

>>29570111
I think Bulu's gonna be bulky as fuck and rely on healing himself to make him full on stall cancer.
He's already been seen using Horn Drain, tack that on with Grassy Terrain and Leftovers and you have one hell of a wall that fucks up earthquake and similar.
He's probably gonna be a nightmare to deal with in doubles too.

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>mfw the four Tapu + Heatran + Skarmory can be considered a perfectly viable team

>>29569990
>poison
>sleep
>burn

All horrible things to have. Is confusion considered a status cause if so then great.

>>29570056
Frivolous is middle school spelling tier. Read a fuckin book.

>>29570567
God dammit you're right. And I feel like it may be somewhat common

I love Decidueye as much as anyone else but these OU predictions are a little much.

Grass/Ghost is better than Grass/Flying but still pretty shitty. Spirit Shackle is really cool but depending on his stats and other popular mons in the meta he may not be able to get much use out of it really.

>>29570593
Hes still in middle school

>>29570567
6-0'd by landorus-I probably.

>>29570193
>Special attackers don't like their health getting chipped away every turn.

Hence why burn immunity is good. It's like you're not even reading.

>>29569970
I'm not even VGC. This thread is just filled with competitive meme posters and complete idiots in general
>"Hue hue! Le 4x weakness. Typing is the most important aspect of competitive"
>"Something is instantly OU because of things it may have"
>"Incineroar will be a fast mixed attacker and Primarina will get my maymay Serene Grace Scald and will be Ubers"

>>29569937
Even then; Trevenant, Escavalier and Durant are pretty good Pokemon. Not OU material but they're definitely not garbage.

It's a shame about Wormadam though. I used Mothim in my X Bug/Flying Mono Challenge run and him and Vivillion were my MVPs.

>>29570543
Tapu Bulu @ Leftovers
Grassy Surge
252 HP/252 Sp.Def/4 Def
Impish Nature
-Woodhamner
-Protect
-Play Rough/Fairy Double Edge (if it happens)
-Thunder Wave
y/n?

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Hard to say with just a design but being a anchor and potential for good typing in a mix of water/ghost/steel I itbmight might be a good wall.
>>29570393
Mimikyu-UU
Thinking the same. I feel like it will have enough to fill some kind of niche but still not enough to compete in OU.

>>29570637
Too bad he's Uber.

>>29570646
>reading comprehension
Follow the conversation retard.

>>29570660
Actually Substitute would be good on this

basically another Gliscor with Grassy Terrain Woodhammer instead of SD Earthquake

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>>29569813

>>29570686
He will be unbanned starting next gen.

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>>29570567
>Bulu + Heatran cores

I take back what I said about Bulu being BL. That shits going straight to OU.

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>>29569813
>Tsareena OU
>Topu Bulu PU

you're a funny guy

>>29570734
only after transfer bubo

>>29569802

Some of us unironically like the Oni design and love the beast form.

It's a freaking cloud tiger, it's very hard to hate that design.

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>>29570744
>Heatran gets 50% resistance to Ground moves and a heal
>Bulu and Heatran cover each other's weaknesses
BROKEN
R
O
K
E
N

>>29570465
It won't have Mewtwo's speed or movepool. With all the Z-Crystals they're going to be careful about who gets what coverage moves. It might only get, like, Signal Beam and Dark Pulse for Coverage, maybe Thunderbolt if its lucky. Might not even learn Roost/Recover.

>>29570427
UU loves Bulky water types. The entire tier is filled with them.

>>29570744
And then both get their asses torn apart by CB Ttar and fireblast lo Garchomp.

LO Garchomp still ohkos offensive heatran with terrain on.

>>29570862
But what can Chomp do to Bulu, even with Fireblast?

>>29570567
>Salandit2 with HP Ground

>>29569745
>Decidueye
BL2 if the trapping move is the only thing it gets, UU if it has more strong moves, OU if it has a good HA and strong moves. Maybe good too in VGC
>Incineroar
UU, if it has good HA then BL or maybe even OU. Viable in VGC
>Primarina
I'd say UU for this one, but will definitely see some usage in OU. Probably a great support in VGC
>Tseerena
UU, good ability and move, but being mono grass is suffering so it's probably doomed to have mediocre stats. May be useful in VGC
>Tapu Koko
OU. Top threat in VGC
>Tapu Lele
UU. Maybe this year's Cresselia in VGC with strong psychic attacks and a terrain on top of bulk.
>Tapu Fini
Same as Primarina
>Tapu Bulu
UU, maybe decent in VGC
>Salandit2
if fast and decently strong, UU, also viable in VGC with all the fairies
>Pikipek3
RU or UU depending on SkillLink moves and typing
>Lunala
bad in Ubers, could still be too strong for OU
>Solgaleo
most likely a Xerneas counter so it'll be useful.

>>29570853
It's been shown to be faster than Gengar.

It gets near perfect coverage with Moonblast.

Its ability means it only has 2 2x weaknesses which are offensively redundant types.

>>29570126
Go back to Valla, Azura!

>>29570862
And then people start running AV Bulu with Horn Leech to stop Garchomp.

>>29570880
Unless you invest in spdef Garchomp fireblast hits like two trucks.

I run mix chomp and this thing neuters Amoongus and Tangrowth defensive cores. Tapu Bulu will need 110 hp and 90 spdef to survive a switch in on Garchomp fireblast after lefties and terrain recovery.

Dont underestimate an unstabbed 220*1.3 nuke even if it comes from 55 spatk.

>>29569895
Did they release a BP on that yet? Because Mystical Fire didn't break Delphox, and it has Will-O-Wisp to ruin the other attacking stat too.

>>29569937
>Gourgeist will never be decent

Is a usable special attack stat too much to ask for? Or at least a Flash Fire HA.

>>29570936
See >>29570924

Also see >>29570567

AV Bulu can tank it and fight back with Play Rough. Or you can just go to Fini and fuck it up.

Tapu are meta-changing.

>>29570887
>automatic Safeguard
>not OU
>immunity to priority for your team
>not OU
>giving your entire team a resistance to Ground and passive healing
>not OU
>2 2x weaknesses and 680 BST sweeper stats
>not Uber
>damaging Block
>BL2

>>29570924
And then you lose double recovery and are only able to switch in once.

You are sacrificing a lot for a passive matchup that only fares well against stall. That team still loses to sand offense badly so even if it adapts to lo Garchomp it won't really get far.

I rather use an offensive core of lo Tornadus T, lefties glare serperior and trap Tran over a 2 man defensive backbone of grass/fairy+steel/fairy.

Alola forms:
Exeggutor- RU-UU maybe OU if it gets harvest or chlorophyll as a hidden ability
Persian-NU or RU
Sanslash RU
Ninetales UU
Muk-UU
Raichu-uu maybe OU if koko is available but ou in doubles
Marowak RU-UU may have a niche for ou

>>29569979

>What is Greninja?

>>29570862
So put something to counter those on your team

Heatran and Bulu won't be bad just because they're countered by 2 mons

>>29570960
I'm quite certain the Tapus will be good in OU, but I don't think all of them will make the usage cut, therefore staying in UU.
>damagin block
that's pretty good, but if it doesn't have anything else to back it up I can't expect it'll be used a whole lot.
>Lunala
It depends on stat distribution really. It's ability is great, it'll most likely have Moon Blast and Moonlight, which is all the coverage it needs and a recovery move to keep the multiscale (though hopefully it gets a better recovery move), but if for some reason it ends up not offensive then it's kinda fucked

>>29570960
The thing with terrains is that it also gives those benefits to your opponent, so they're kind of risky to use. Of course, unless they changed this for gen 7.

>>29571032
They changed that in gen 7

>>29570987
Single recovery + AV is still really good. The only major sand offense user that would really be able to break through Bulu would be Tornadus-T. And that's not even getting into the rest of what could be on your team.

Heatran + Bulu still sounds really strong despite one or two unfavorable match ups. You haven't convinced me otherwise.

>>29571067
Weather does too, and it still sees a lot of usage.

>>29571067
So you build your team so that you benefit from the terrain more than the opponent does. Don't use Ground moves on a Bulu team (unless you have another Tapu), don't use much status on a Lele team, etc

>>29571113
>Lele team
*Fini team

>>29571113
If its offensive stats are mixed, then Bulu could rum a mixed offensive set with Earthpower (LAND Guardian) since Grassy Terrain doesn't affect Earthpower.

>>29571085
>The only major sand offense user that would really be able to break through Bulu would be Tornadus-T
what is excadrill you retard

its fairy type

At least priority wars are over. Now we can return to a gen 4 like era of battles

>>29569820
>blocked by a shitty typing that is weak to 70% of types
>blocked by a low damage attack
Epic Showderp meme!

Smogon tiers are decided by a very complex system. You can't just make guesses based on looks and maybe an ability, we have to see how the pokemon interacts with the old system and the other new pokemon.

>fanfic metagems
>canon
>meme metas with no item clause and other whimsical clauses

top lel

>>29571193
>Switch out to a counter
>opponent can't switch and you got chip damage off

>>29571194
>a very complex system
muh 5 dimensional yugioh mindgames

ebin

>>29570936
You have to remember that LO Garchomp is by no means the most used set. It's pretty niche in comparison to, say, TankChomp. So LO Chimp would have to get a ton more usage just to break through Heatran + Bulu, and it would end up sacrificing from potentially better and usable sets.

>>29571221
>>29571209
>>>/b/

Tapus will be banned from smogon to ubers like greninja

>>29571212
Please explain this epic new meme.

>>29571165
>switch into Skarmory
>tank Iron Head
k

Excadrill more like Excrementdrill

>>29571192
Nah this going to be WEATHER WARS 2.0 now with 50% less priority

>>29571227
t. smogon underage tier leader of hysteriacl ban proposals

Stay on topic, Smogon hasn't been influential or reliable since the end of Gen 4.

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It's really hard to say without knowing the stats and other details.

For example, if Alolan Muk got Recover as an egg move, it could be really solid. Otherwise it'll probably fare poorly much to my dismay, it's one of my Gen VII favorites.

>>29570960
>Lunaala Uber
Not happening unless they make it tanky.
Mega mom can solo it. And you all think as if the multiscale works even if not 100% HP

>>29571238
Your opponent can't switch out when it's blocked, so you can swich out to a counter and either kill them, get a free hit on the switch in, or get switch advantage.

Spirit Shackle will be good because it can also trap things that Decidueye can beat while doing damage.

>>29571275
so talk about which mons will be viable in VGC instead of shitposting

Latefag here, is the owl been confirmed ghost/grass? On what source?

>rock head tyranteum is gonna be ou
>mega altaria is going to be broken
>serperior king if ou
>grass/ghost tree and cocumber solid ou stall
>delphox is actually very good if
>dude gyaravire is still alive
>mega sableye is super hard to stop

Oh boy, here we go again with /vp/'s greatest memes!

>>29571332
Yes, Decidueye is Grass/Ghost

>>29571342
Don't forget MSalamence being utter shit because the pokémon site said it incresed its defense and MSlowbro too because it lost regenerator.

>most posts just assume everything will be OU or UU at worst

Wow, this board really is just filled with 1250 players

>>29571342
>Mega sableye is super hard to stop

The saddest thing is that people used to actually believe this and wanted to move him in ubers some months ago. I don't know if they actually managed to do it.

>>29571306
Dude, it's an offensive Block, i you switch out and send a new mon the block effect also disappears. Even Mean Look cannot be passed anymore since a bunch of gens.

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>There are retards who genuinely think Decidoo-doo will be viable, even going far enough to think that it will be better than the other two starters

>>29569909
>nature power becomes moonblast

all these people saying incineroar will be RU

Did you forget it's thought to be the fastest of the three? Fast with an offensive typing like fire/dark will be great, certainly will be higher than the tier SNEASEL is in

>>29571032
Overexposed

Remember when /vp/ thought:
>Zard Y would be shit because Sneaky Pebbles and nerfed weather
>Zard X shit because it still took SA damage from Stealth rock
>Mega Sableye would be UU at best
>Mega Gallade would be complete garbage
>Mega Swampert would be Uber
>Mega Salamence and Mega Metagross were nothing special

>>29571371
That was like a few days ago my dude

>>29571509
Being the fastest won't matter if they're all kinda slow in the first place. The problem I see is that it'll have to carve out a niche with Infernape, Entei, Mega Houndoom, Darmanitan, Rotom-H. Hell, Mega Houndoom is in BL2.

>>29571557
Remember when /vp/ got it's shit kicked in by a Honchkrow

>>29571557
Didn't Gallade end up mostly redundant because of Medicham and Lopunny?

>>29571585
If it has max speed 350 or higher there is no way it could be below UU

>>29571557
>/vp/ is 1 person

>>29571585
If its signature move has 90ish BP it can be a wall breaker, that would be the niche.
Even with 80BP it could pass as long Knock Off isn't avaible as a tutor in SM.

>>29570880
Poison Jab

>>29571623
It still wasn't complete garbage

>>29571585
Seeing that the official website calls Decidueye astonishingly fast, I doubt it's going to be slow. I wouldn't be surprised if they ended up giving it a base speed of 120.

>>29571659
So you're going to put Fireblast and Poison Jab at the same time on Garchomp just because of a chance of finding a Bulu and Heatran combo?

I don't know about you, but that kinda tells me that Bulu+Heatran are a good treat afterall and can find their spot in OU.

>>29571624
>faster than infernape
I don't really see this happening

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>>29570619
Spirit shackle sucks. It's just a block that traps ghosts. If it were auto set like arena trap or shadow tag it would be good. But no way it's getting shadow tag as an ha because it would make his whole move redundant. Or would gamefreak?

Who else thinks Minior will be a complete shitmon? There's a ton of Shell Smashers around and most of them are garbage. The gimmick sounds good on paper, but I have a feeling it'll be easy to play around.

>>29571636
>/vp/ isn't one person

>>29571706
I'm just answering his question. He just said other than fireblast what can Garchomp do to bulu and my answer is poison jab. I never said put fireblast and poision jab together.

>>29569745
Reasoning; it seems like you're just a denialfag that wanted a quardaped cat

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>>29570744
>Bulu - Heatran - Bulky Water

I know what I'm going to try first

>>29569923

Box Legends are going to be Uber, because they're gonna have busted stats and a movepool that makes Clefable look like a monograss

The only box legends in history that wasn't uber was Suicune and Kyurem-B, and the only reason Kyurem-B isn't Uber because Kyurems physical movepool is shit so it's forced to go mixed all the time. If Kyurem-B got icicle crash, it'd easily be Uber.

>>29571597

What's the story behind this?

>>29571743
Uh, SS trapps anyone that switches in that's not immune, not just Ghost type. It's still not completly reliable since once you switch, your opponent can as well, but it can be usefull if used properly.

>>29571743
Spirit Shackle just needs to be as strong as Shadow Claw to be worth using. It might not be great, but it does prevent your opponent from double switching which makes prediction easier.

>>29570079
>leafage

>>29571785
Brennan Williams was taking on challengers in pokemon so /vp/ thought it would be fun to kick his shit around. He swept everyone's teams with a moxie Honchkrow.

https://archive.nyafuu.org/vp/thread/17251000/

>>29571775
Lunaala is going to cry if it's sent to Ubers

>>29571822
Since a lot of moves in pokemon are copypased with a new paint job, there's a good reason to assume SS has the same BP as Thousand Arrows.

My safe guesses at least:

>Lunala
Seems to be a mid ground between Lugia and Yveltal, probably slightly more specially oriented. Unless Confined Hoopa offensive stats and 100-110 speed I can see it OU, looks like a andatory Calm Mind user rather than Nasty Plot. I think it may learn Will o Wisp too.

>Solgaleo
OU/Ubers, unlike Metagross it is given it can also learn non STAB Fire attacks and Will O Wisp, so it may turn into a mixed offensive or phys/spec mono attacker, might learn Morning Sun too, basically a slightly more offensive Jirachi. Beside Calm Mind I can see it gaining Work Up too. Type wise it's pretty easy to revenge kill or play 50/50s with, better than Lunala defensively however.

>Magearna
OU/UU, it honestly looks more defensive compared to Meloetta and Mega Diancie, who knows about the eventual alternate form but seems as always something with equal stats spreads except Speed. I see it as a very annoying stall core member rather than choiced or full offensive mon.

>Decidueye
It's a Grass type. And a Ghost one.
Never mix them together because they end being shitty physically or easily to get around specially. Best wishes for it is being a Nasty Plot user rather than SD. Physical Grass and Ghosts are a joke unless new good attacks he signature attack ain't gonna help that much. UU/RU. Gengar and Aegislash do exist and who knows what the UBs will be like.

>Primarina
Shitty homo furbait got am awesome type to compense he shit design, Keldeo and Azumarill of Alola able to be versatile in every aspect and probably even as support and cleric too, OU/UU depending on Wish and Moonlight, but even then it's easy to slap in stall with other mons support and synergy. Scald and Moonblast etc, it's an Azumarill / Milotic / Samurott stats chimera, considering how Azumarill can be also run valid stall sets with its type. May run surprise coverage sets too.

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>>29569745
Wimpod2 - NU
Bewear - UU
Decidueye - OU
Incineroar - UU
Primarina - UU
Pikipek3 - PU
Tapu Lele - OU
Ultra Beasts - AG
Solgaleo - Uber
Lunala - Uber

>Incineroar
Awful type competitively speaking, better than Delphox at least.
Any reason to run it over Mega Zard or Darmanitan or Arcanine or Entei? Unless Sucker Punch it seems to be mediocre, it only would have the benefit of Sword Dance and Knock Off im addition to Sucker Punch, things Bisharp already does.

>Greninja and Greninja Ash
They always belonged to OU just like Deoxys-S and D (UU even) or Aegislash.
These are my guesses excluding the eventual HAs. It can run a better versatile and gimmick fueled Protean set or rely on powered up Water Shuriken, and a more speedy and physical spread. If you use it full special you might consider the Ash form with Hydro Pump or Ice Beam / Shuriken / Dark Pulse and Grass Knot or U-Turn or whatever.

Decidueye - RU or UU
Incineroar - RU or UU
Primarina - UU or OU

>>29571935
>why run incineroar over megazard, darmanitan, entei

because it's fucking fast and doesn't require a megastone

>>29571623
/vp/ thought it wasn't going to leave RU and that Inner Focus would somehow make it WORSE than base Gallade.

>>29571156
>Bulu won't have base 103+ speed and ice punch

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>>29571719
pic related is faster than gengar

>>29571280
Please get both drain punch and sucker punch and make them accessible to regular muk!

>>29571719
cat lines are always fast, it's possible

>>29571822
There is a lot of assuming being done to believe it does any damage

>>29571935
Fire/Dark and hopefully Fighting coverage gives Incineroar a lot to play with. You hit a lot of relevant shit SA and everything else not Azumarill or Altaria neutrally. It'd be a solid mon if it had good stats and a non-retarded movepool, and that's without taking the HA into consideration.

>Tapu Lele
>Tapu Koku
>Tapu Fini
>Tapu Bulu
All fucking OU maerial and easily viable supports in Ubers too, glad they did redeem the terrains. They do compense thw weaknesses, buff offensive stats and things that usually remove them, prevent statuses and on a tapu of all this they also all have great versatile types to furtherly compense eventual flaws.

Easy as fuck to put on both offensive and defensive stall teams and even easier to create overpowered cores around while spamming dual STAB and spreading status around. Even the Z moves in a buffed Super Fang form can make the difference and nerf opponents cores since unlike with the type gems you can use the crystal when it is needed the most.

They are indeed the new genies.

Not to forget that every gen introduces new buffs to past gen Pokemon and new breeding chains too beside TMs compatibilities. Expect an actual rich metagame this time perhaps.

But yeah, don't rate or predict them by only considering the Alolan regional dex or Gen 7 Pokemon only. The viabilities of Pokemon can be easily shuffled through gens.

>>29572171
>Spirit Shackle is a Ghost-type physical move that only Decidueye can learn

>>29572202
Sauce? It's not serebii. Pokemon's site or something?

>>29572171
You LITERALLY see it kill a Raichu in the trailer with that attack...

>>29571876
>there's a good reason to assume SS has the same BP as Thousand Arrows.
Not likely, Thousand Waves* is a legendary move, those tend to be stronger than usual. I'd say Spirit Shackle is like 70 at the very best, which is alright considering it's effect. My bet is 60, but I wish it goes higher

>>29572304
It's on the Pokemon official site. Did you seriously not check it?

>>29571754

Rock/Flying is an amazing STAB combination. It'll be RU at the very worst.

>>29572318
So post the trailer as sauce
>i've seen the trailer
>ass, you, and me

The Tapus will be the new Genies of healthy metagame. It's a real shame I like their designs because the sheer cancer they bring to the table will make me hate their guts.

>Decidueye
BL2 ot UU

>Incineroar
RU if it isnt fast, BL or even OU if it is

>Primarina
BL or OU as an option over Topu Fini. Remember that Fini, which great, can't fish for Scald burns like every other Water-type

>Topus
All OU. The next genies, although not as dominant due to the symetrical nature of their abilities.

>Wimpod2
UU

>Cover Legendaries
Uber

>Silvally
OU for a while but will get suspected due to muh unpredictability

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>>29572347
>Its 60 BP
>It gets Technician as its HA

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Persian - 363 max speed
Weavile - 383 max speed
Liepard - 342 max speed and prankster
meowstic - 337 max speed and prankster
pyroar - 342 max speed
espeon (most feline eeveelution by far) - 350 max speed

the only cat mons who aren't fast are delcatty, which has the lowest base stat total of all fully evolved pokemon, and luxray, who is garbage in general

litten was also confirmed the fastest of the base starters

I'm not saying it will be top tier OU, but if it gets weavile tier speed, or even persian tier speed it very well could be

but it's certainly not being put into the same tier as sneasel

>>29571935
>>29571935
Deoxys Defense, maybe, could be fair in OU, but Speed form is bullshit good. I think it might even be better than Deoxys-N. It's a pain to revenge kill and revenge kills well itself, and sets hazards (both spikes and stealth rock) AND you can slap specs on it to make it a sweeper. Hell, it has enough bulk that hyou can put Recover on it and make it a fast tank like Talonflame and use it as a stallbreaker with Taunt. Deoxys Speed is busted to hell.

I'll agree with you that Aegislash and Greninja shouldn't have been banned, though.

>>29571995
>it's fast so is good
So is Mega Sceptile but Mega Venusaur is still better. And many other examples.
The two megas gain both either a good type or ability that not only buffs and extends their movepools but also supports he rest of he team and with one DD or the legendary button spam they can make multiple holes among opp's team, Darmanitan and Zard Y are common examples, Zard X can run bulky sets or mixed, Arcanine can be even support and as Zard X has more longevity.

Beside the Sucker Punch and Knock Off so far it can use a Z move that also requires an item of one use.

A thing I'd like to know about those Z crystals is if some Pokemon cannot use them and if they are only limited to STAB. Will a Tentacruel for example be able to use a Grass type Z attack with Giga Drain or Ice one with Ice Beam?

>>29572050
Fire types are not fast. Infernape (108) is the fastest after smogonbird and a mega (Mega Houndoom)

>>29572415
>A thing I'd like to know about those Z crystals is if some Pokemon cannot use them and if they are only limited to STAB. Will a Tentacruel for example be able to use a Grass type Z attack with Giga Drain or Ice one with Ice Beam?
You can use them with any move. Exeggutor used the Normal Type Z move in a trailer.

>>29572318
After watching the trailer it was used on a ghost Oricoro and Fire tiger used darkest lariat on a Raichu. However, pokemondb's website lists it as a physical move. Watching the arrow land in front of the Oricoro and explode I could believe it to be physical or at least damaging. I'm no dataminer though.

>>29572464
Pokemondb lists it as physical because the official site says it's physical

>>29572171
you hear the super effective noise when it hits ghost type Oricorio

>>29572360
I have this feeling it'll just be way too easy to abuse. Oh, you smashed? Your offenses still aren't that good, time to Whirlwind. Or it's complete Taunt bait because of terrible offenses before its ability comes into play.

>>29572415
Mega Sceptile and Mega Venusaur do completely different things you retard. If Luchalitten is fast and has a decet attacm stat then it will have an edge over Darmanitan and Zard-X/Y (who require a megastonr while Incineroar doesn't).

Note I'm not saying that Incineroar is gonna be better than those Pokemon, but that Incineroar wouldn't be completely outclassed by them if it had a high speed.

Primarina: BL
Incineroar: UU
Decidueye: BL2

Tapu Koku: UU
Tapu Lele: BL
Tapu Fini: OU
Tapu Bulu: OU

Lycanrock S: RU
Lycanrock M: NU

Gumshoos: NU
Minior: RU
Mudsdale: BL2
Tsareena: UU
Bruxish: NU
Pyukumuku: NU
Mimikyu: PU

A. Raticate: NU
A. Exeggutor: UU
A. Persian: NU
A. Marowak: RU
A. Ninetales: RU
A. Sandslash: PU

>>29572415
generally fast pokemon with high offenses and an offensive typing are UU or higher

look at weavile compared to mamoswine

look at greninja compared to kecleon

look at klefki compared to every other screen setter ever

look at crobat, who has completely medicre offenses, and is physically oriented despite having mostly special coverage (giga drain, heat wave, sludge bomb) which is UU

>>29571924
>Pikipek3
>PU
Impossible, the damned thing has skill link and Pikipeks attack is high for first stage mon out of three.

It'll be a better Cincinno.

>>29569901
>implying it won't get spooky skulk

>>29572369
>>29572409
>Incineroar OU
Just because you like the starter doesn't mean it's going to be OU no matter what. And it's definitely not as fast as quadrupedal cats

>>29571764
Bulu-Heatran-CroCune?

>>29572508
>not completely outclassed
a new code for it's good in nu under a sub and behind screens?
The ammount of impact those listed Pokemon can put compared to Incineroar still puts them on a much better place, you use a mega stone...and? I don't see the problem here.

Venusaur can be also used offensively anon, not a super fast Pokemon but it can be used like this even as mega and Synthesis. Except it lives longer.

>>29572687
Just because you dont like a starter doesn't mean it wont br OU

If it is a fast, decently strong attacker it has a chance to be OU especially if it gets Fighting coverage which is not unlikely

>>29572687
>Weavile

>>29572438
you left out smogonbird's speed stat (126) in favor of infernape's why?

also rapidash, charizard, typhlosion, simisear, delphox, blaziken, entei, pyroar, ninetales, darmanitan are all decently fast

>>29572547
Agreed on everything except few starters and tapus.
But mostly on how they would look in the current meta and given info, stats wise and movepool wise including old mons things may change dramatically.

>>29572739
We live in a world where 100-105 speed isn't as good as it used to be.

>>29570853
Yeah, Lunala definitely won't get a recovery move. Moonlight? Psssh why would it get that?

>>29570056
Not one of those words is fancy you fucking donkey.

>>29572702
I was thinking the same thing, although Tapu Koku and Fini might make it a bit harder to Rest up

>>29572713
>bulky attackers are now comparable to revenge killers

I never said Mega Venusaur is only defensive. They're still not comparable and you're daft if you think they are.

Also there isn't a problem with having to use a Mega Stone, but not having to use one to be viable is very nice because it allows you to use a different mega like Diancie or Medicham.

Also how the fuck does not being outclassed fit in the same boat as "good in nu under a sub and behind screens?"? Are you retarded?

>>29572725
>Just because you dont like a starter doesn't mean it wont br OU
3/18 starters are OU/Ubers and that's because of their overpowered HA (speed boost, contrary and protean). While I speak with facts, you are only theorycrafting with the thought of it being OU. The chances are it's getting a 100-105 speed.
>>29572726
>Weavile
>small, frail but agile cat vs muh gains wrestler
Starter stats are usually badly optimized compared to the rest of Pokemon

>>29570111
>Drampa could have 125 SpAtk
Sign me up !

>>29572957
Hence why I said in my post "if its fast it might be BL or even OU" which could happen since its the fastest of the three according to Littens stats vs the others.

>>29571557
>>Mega Salamence ... [was] nothing special
I actually don't remember /vp/ ever thinking that. General consensus was that it was going to be banned on reveal, the only question was if it would get a suspect test or a quickban.
I don't know if anyone predicted it being the second-best Mega in 6v6 singles, but we knew it was going to fuck shit up.

>>29573025
>fastest of the three according to Littens stats vs the others.
It has more to do with the other 2 being slow

>>29572547
I don't think something with a free sub could be PU.

>>29573111
I'm hoping this is not the case but also realize that its a posibility.

also nice trips

Hopefully they NERF the shit out of Knock Off.

Fuck that move...

>>29571913
Lunala is faster than Gengar, and Magearna has Fairy-type Draco Meteor + Special Moxie only even better outside of Singles + the statistical best defensive type combination in the game. Just saying.

Why is everyone ignoring STAB Chip Away?

IS HERE : http://pokemongoforfree.ga/

>>29573235
If anything, I expect it to be more like Sacred Sword. And people are ignoring it because Dark already has too many good moves to run. Why use it when there's potentially Knock Off, Sucker Punch and Pursuit?

>>29573262
I figured being anti-stall was enough.

>>29573305
From what I know, not a lot of mons actually try to boost their defense aside from Bulk Up users. At best, you just beat the meme Sigilyph set consistently.

>>29573305
Stall doesn't run Defense boosts because switching is important to the playstyle

>>29572917
Maybe Mega Swampert? I don't think it's surviving Grass attacks anyways and the passive recovery would be great for it.

>>29570011
>Its definetly going to be special its a ghost and an owl
>owl

Owls are birds of prey. They are very well adapted hunters. There is no reason to assume that it is special.

>yfw you realize Tapu Fini beats both Keldeo and Manaphy's most cancerous sets

>>29570072
Well if it's setting up Calm Minds then it's probably planning on staying in and If terrain abilities are like weather abilities then it will be suseptible to status in 5 turns.

>>29573489
5 turns is a lot of time.

>>29573416
Not unless you dont plan on using Earthquake.

I could see something like Milotic or Empoleon working through

>>29573111

Litten's minimum base speed is at likely at least 60(1 below Chimchar), but it might have 70 speed or above(on par with Froakie and Treecko).

>>29573541
Yeah, but Empoleon isn't as good in other terrains. My idea was that M-Swampert would be the Rain Dance set and use Earthquake for coverage against the other Tapus.

>>29573597
Ah, I see what you're going for now. That could probably work as well. I'm honestly excited to try multiple variations of Bulu Tran + Bulky Water

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>>29572367
>tfw the next vgc will be "mega mom, mega mence, landorus, thundurus, and the two better tapus: the ride, the experience"

>>29570574
Misty Terrain blocks confusion now.
>With Misty Surge, the field will be turned into Misty Terrain when Tapu Fini appears in battle, halving the damage taken by Pokémon on the ground from Dragon-type moves and preventing them from being afflicted with status conditions or confusion.

Both box legends will be Ubers
Lunala will do better in Ubers than Solgaleo

>>29573821
>Lunala will do better in Ubers than Solgaleo
I too suspect this. Ghost STAB is already better than what Solgaleo offers.

>>29571032
A mixed attacker :^)

>caring about smogon tiers and rules
>actually following smogon rules

What's it like being brainwashed and unable to think for yourself?

>>29571379
Once your new mon is in yes, the effect drops and they can switch. But if you hit an incoming Pokémon with Shackle, you can switch to a counter when they were lob bot be able to double switch he out until the end of that the turn.

>>29573926
Smogon is easily the best format for 6v6 singles though

>But muh evasion and sleep spam is balanced!!!!!!!!

>>29573926
>not playing both VGC and Smogon
>not also playing casually with friends

topu keku anon

>>29573926
I don't play smogon, but using their tiers as reference is a good way to argue about the viability of something.

>>29573926
Verlisify pls go

>>29572725
OU is a meta created by ~150 non-shitmons competing against each other to be the best possible slot on a team. A Fire/Dark typing is a pretty bad start due it having poor resists and even worse weaknesses. Even with insane Atk and Spe (we're talking in the 120 each realm), it still has to have a movepool and good HA to back it up to compete in a meta full of Megas and Legendaries, and even then, it simply won't have the bulk to do anything but switch in on weak resists, and be pretty limited to the revenge killer role. It'd probably be outclassed by Weavile just on the basis that Ice is a better Revenge Killer typing than Fire. If it's any slower and bulkier, it simply won't have a niche at all.

Incineroar will be UU at best unless its got an absolutely busted HA.

>>29569997

> Sceptile exists

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>>29574066
what if it gets adaptability?

>>29574101
What if it gets Hueg Powa

>>29574066
Fire / Dark is fantasic offensively though, and the act that it cant be burned already gives it a niche against Weavile assuming it has similar speed. That, alongside the fact its not unlikely that it will get a good fighting move tells me that it will be at least BL and maybe even OU.

All of this is assumig a good apeed stat, obviously. It'll probably be RU/BL2 if it has 100-105 speed which is also very likely.

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>>29574151
what if it gets huge adaptability?

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You KO their Huge Power Azumaril and they switch in this guy what do you do.

Also it has fling so it could get poison heal and fling it's toxic orb

I think that some pokemon will be viable in competitive and some wont

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>>29574258
get this fucking hothead out of here

>>29574275
Crooked needle hothead

>>29574240
It only works for allies
AkA doubles

>>29572823
To be fair, Lunatone, a literal moon rock, doesn't get Moonlight. A giant mantis and even a dragonfly strong enough to out right lift people can't get fly, but a flightless, wingless bird can. Gamefreak sometimes makes some batshit decisions

>>29574240
or inherit speed boost w/ power up punch

Friendly reminder that Litten is the fastest starter. Owlfags are doomed before it even began.

>>29574344
ew nevermind

>>29569745
Decidueye - NU
Incineroar - Ubers
Primarina - PU

>>29573461
I think he was basing it on Noctowl when one line does not make a pattern

>>29574101
At 120 Atk/Spe, Adaptability + Sucker Punch would likely be enough to push it into OU viability.

>>29574198
Ice/Dark is still better than Fire/Dark in that Rkiller role because Ice simply hits so many key typings for SE damage. Fire/Dark is still good, but it's not killing Genies or Dragons, and isn't really any harder to wall either. Incineroar needs to pretty much be perfect in every way (insane stat distro, good movepool, broken HA) to get to the OU line.

>>29569745
>Pokemon you hate: OU
>Pokemon you love: NU

Decidueye with
>Ghost Arrow that traps
>Toxic
>Roost
>Leech Seed

OU

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>>29574381
>this level of logic
It's shit like this that let's me know you don't even know how this game works including faggots like >>29574392

Stay cucked forever.

>>29574372
Power Up Punch was confirmed via Datamines to no longer be a TM

Presumably to neuter Mega Kanga as much as possible when it eventually is allowed back in

>>29574435
Alright, that's fair enough. I do think that it could be OU with good speed and an ability, but I do realize at that point I would be moving the goal post.

>>29573700
There's also Bulu + Mega Charizard X

>>29570056
t. Trump supporting retard with a tiny dick

Sorry that's redundant. Lemme rephrase:

t. retard

>>29574456
It's not a good set when Gogoat of all things can counter it

>>29574526
That also sounds disgustingly good.
>there are people who actuallu think Bulu wont be OU

>>29574533
>Gogoat counters Toxic
Did you even think before you posted?

>>29572547
Move Mimikyu up to NU and I would agree.

>>29569867
I could see him getting some cool offensive utilities. He could easily get roost, being the majority of his line is birb type. Wil o wisp very possible too.

If he has an infernape spread, which I think is pretty likely, these support options would be a bit limited but robinroot could end up being very versitile.

Decidueye - UU. It'll get Sniper as its HA, not good enough unless it gets some super retarded minmax stats which also isn't happening since its a starter.

Incineroar - Totally up in the air. I have no idea what kind of HA it will get. It's a terrible candidate for guts because it's fire type and has to use toxic orb. It's not going to be a good no guard user because it's weak to stone edge and neither Dark nor Fire get any good low acc high damage moves. Torracat's stat distro suggests it will be bulky though which makes me inclined to say it's going to be UU or lower since fire/dark is a horrible defensive typing.

Primarina - OU if it gets Serene Grace or Pixilate as many have suggested and has a respectable stat distro that give it some bulk. The typing alone is very good. Might have to compete with Tapu Fini and end up in BL.

Toucan - OU if it keeps Pikipek's stat distro and ability and ends up with a BST similar to other full evo birds. IIRC someone did the math and found that it'd have like 130 attack and over 100 speed, with skill link and a signature flying 5 hit move it would be absolutely obscene despite its very low defenses. It will probably get bullet seed as well for dealing with bulky waters/rock types.

Gumshoos - UU or RU. Stakeout is a pretty good ability but its BST and distro won't support it well enough to make it OU.

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>>29574452
That's the way it always ends up being, isn't it?

>>29574549
Well, it could be good if the other Tapus aren't common. I'm pretty sure terrain control will be an important part of gen 7 just because of how strong their effects can be and how good the Tapus will probably be. I think a lot of teams will carry a Tapu Fini just to counter Grassy Terrain.

>>29574533
How does Gogoat counter it? You trap it and Toxic it.

>>29574565
>>29574708
Whoops I am retarded. I was completely sure Gogoat was normal/grass, not just grass

>>29574565
Anyone who thinks that his signature move will actually be particularly good or a reason for using him in high tier play is an idiot. Shadow Tag/Arena Trap/Magnet Pull trapping are good because there is no opportunity for counterplay, you switch in and BOOM, they're stuck.

With the owl you have to resolve a turn to trap and since switching has higher priority than anything, it will be retardedly easy to switch to a counter. This is why the only pokemon that EVER used mean look were perish trappers, and M-Gengar basically cucked all other perish trappers out of a job in every meta where he's permitted with the infinitely superior shadow tag.

You could literally run that same set with mean look instead of spirit shackle and either horn leech or rest+harvest chesto on Trevenant. I wonder why nobody fucking does it? Maybe because it's shit?

>>29574733
That... doesn't change anything. It would still get trapped and die to Toxic.

>>29574771
Never mind, now I'm the one being retarded.

>>29574754
It's due to being a damaging mean look. Unless they switch to a normal type, it will at worst do some damage and potentially break a focus sash while preventing them from switching the sane turn you do

>>29574754
Spirit Shackle does damage

it'll be useful for the same reason that Volt Switch is useful on fast mons - it gives you switch advantage.

>>29571193
>5/18 = 7/10
huh, today i learned something

>>29574754
I'm screencapping this autism for the future collage.

>>29574076
leaf blade was special in gen 3

>>29574754
Spirit Shackle does damage you inbred retard. Nobody wants to switch in, take a hit, and be at their opponent's mercy for the next matchup.

It's a special kind of muhmentum move.

>>29569745
>haven't really played since 2014
>tiers are literally the same
>the same fucking strats for almost 7 years

>>29575132
Buddy, its not 2021 here yet

Go back to your own timeline before you-know-what happens

>>29575222
I'm saying things haven't really changed since DP besides mega.

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>>29569745
>Decidueye - OU

>>29575287
0 Atk Decidueye Leaf Bade vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Filter Mega Aggron: 1396-1644 (405.8 - 477.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO

People legitimately believe Solgaleo and Lunaala will be OU lmao

>>29575242
Tbh, most of the big DP threats have dropped down to UU. A lot of DP Ubers are mid-high tier OUs now.

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>>29574452
As much as I hate the Toucan's guts, I have a big feeling it would hit like a truck. It might have a better movepool than Talonflame too. Gamefreak loves making the shittiest of designs top tier competitively.

>tfw Crabrawler won't be anything more than RU

>>29571342
>>serperior king if ou
It's not the king of OU, but it's still A- in the viability ranking

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>>29576229
I feel you, anon. My favorites will probably end up UU at best.

>>29574815
Grass/Ghost being shit was never a secret.

>>29576229
actually, who am i kidding, it'll be lucky if it's anywhere above BL4

>>29576229
>>29577114
Should be nice in Little Cup though.

>>29571342
Add
>Incineroar is going to have 120+ Spe! And it will be OU!