/civ4xg/ - Strategy/4X General

>>175806418
>no spider
Shit OP/10

Took the liberty of removing "- D.I.C.E. Summit 2016 - Civilization 25th Anniversary Panel : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h65FXaJHbhE" from the OP because it's a pain to let it in.

Fuck, my post got cut off.
>>175806421
Mean to continue to say that fighting them and my old rivals who joined in on the fun was the only time in Stellaris that I fought a long term war.
Where production was what ultimately mattered.
Not one doomfleet vs another doomfleet deciding the entire war unless you're so far ahead you can just shit another two hundred battleships out of your ass in parallel production.

>>175806421
Yeah, your first game is always special in your own imperfection. Trying your hardest, even unconsciously cheesing the game just to survive while you make mistakes left and right - that's a really special feeling.

5th for suddenly being the bad guy even though I did LITERALLY nothing wrong.

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>>175806418
>OP is RTS for some reason

>At least it's a good RTS

>floating mass
>floating mass with T3 production everywhere
>floating mass with T2 extractors
WHAT THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH YOU

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>>175806557
My bad, have your daily spider.

>>175806887

>being a backseat gamer
>ruining gaming communiites by demanding perfection instead just lol'ing at the noob and seeing how they grow

You are the cancer wrong with video games, especially strategy games. kys.

>>175806668
Oh, you needed to be next door to your friendly empire if you want them to Feddie up with you? I didn't know that...

Then again, there was this really militarist expansionist Hive Mind in between us (which is one of the reasons we got along so well), so there was really no free space to make a bridge between us without warring it.

>>175806772
Was more how the end game challenge shaped up to be fought, more than just the specifics of the first game. The only issues of it being played at launch were lacking research, ship designs and actually using sectors. None of which really shaped the game. If I was properly efficient not much would have changed.

First games are memorable but not always that good. Not even always the most memorable in general. For example, I'd played most factions in Endless Legend before I played the Broken Lords.

Then I played the Broken Lords.

Let's say in a hypothetical 4x game you have the ability to really up the culture/luxury of a single system in your empire, or maybe a few to a limited degree. A sort of high happiness/culture playstyle.

What should be the benefit of doing this? Should it make some sort of hyper productive population, or some kind of special bonus, or just help qualify for a victory condition?

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>>175806418
> Walls
> Transports
> Cybran T2 PD
> air pad
> T3 shipyard
> Generators on forward positions
> No Mass storage
> Floating mass
> No radar
> No engis
> Unclaimed shipwrecks
> Stealth towers

>>175807449
>minmaxing when the game is already won

>>175807118
I'm not taking his fun away from him, merely lacking comprehension of how fun can be had that way.
The 4xgen should be able to empathize more than most, the screenshot captures the late game of civ games where you're committed to ending the game but you're just fucking mashing the end turn button because there is nothing else to do. It feels like work at that point.

I'm not saying he should be capitalizing on his naval dominance(as he has t3 naval factories up uncontested it obviously isn't an issue), or pushing with cybran's cheap t4 or telesniping or something like I automatically assume the game should only be played as multiplayer ladder is.

It's just that floating resources in such a situation without showing us anything is just so bland and uninteresting.
They could be spamming meme units, they could get a good screencap of the nuke they just fired, or how good their tower defense is.
But it's just a screencap of the game being played poorly in a specific way that I just can't see anyone enjoying.

>>175807736
Not everyone remembers to take screenshots in the middle of action. If you have some, feel free to post them.

>>175807254
Ah, I;ve known that feel for too long now. That's why I've put off starting Stellaris until just a month ago. I know how games are nowadays - shit at the start, but """"promising"""". Well promising doesn't cut it anymore, and I want a full game experience on my first playthrough. And boy was I pleased. Fully modded stellaris 1.5 as my first game. Very nice indeed. There are still some major bugs this long after launch, as you can expect from a Paradox game, but the mod community is actually impressively active in that they even make fixes or workarounds that no problem seems to be insurmountable.

I highly recommend my approach to everyone, so you can save yourselves the ~1 year of heartache of having a game with great -potential- squandered because it was released too early, as well as maximize your initial enjoyment (and total) of the game as a whole.

>>175807425
Concentrated decadence would stimulate most economies surrounding it.

Distant Worlds' resource system I can see being the best example.
Your dozens of mining colonies and hundreds of mining stations are a lot more valuable when one planetary metropolis is buying -THAT- MUCH STUFF.

Unfortunately happiness and population and hard currency are all attached together as the most bland, empty and abusable part of the game in actual Distant Worlds.

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>be relaxing in my empire just researching and chill
>suddenly fanatical purifiers declare war on me
>defend myself and protect my galaxy by wiping them out
>somehow I'M the bad guy

>>175807620
If you consider that group participation trophy to be a """""victory""""" then don't ever talk about about losing.

>>175808000
That's fine, but if you do forget I don't see why you would try and fill the void with poor screenshots instead.

>>175808257
>"if you don't play MY way, you're shit"
Lol okay.

>>175808242
It's how you wipe them out.
If you have "good" ethics, you should've shot them full of cuck enclave holes.

> tell Anon to git gud by pointing all the things he's doing wrong
> Suddenly I'M the bad guy

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>>175808242
>expecting a game made by swedes to be good
I can think some fanatical purifiers on earth that people wont even consider removing, even while their own cities burn

>a guy whines about a boring screenshot
>tell him to post a better one
>"omg i can't believe you just said that!!!"
>somehow I'M the bad guy

>>175808484
The thing is they do consider it.
But they consider the fire too small.

All the meme immigration is never going to be a history defining problem.
It isn't the sort of thing that the patriotic brownos actually think it is where they can suddenly appear as 51% of the population.
It'll just get worse and worse until people do eventually decide to deal with it. And little will have been lost before that point is reached.

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>>175808539
You're dealing with two different people there my dude.

> spitroast Anon for posting RTS in a 4x general
> Sitbg

>>175808971
>didn't even bother reading the OP
It's sad to see how that general went to shit the moment /gsg/'s rejects arrived.

>>175808325
What, you mean something like Rebel Galaxy? Freelancer? The X games?

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>They want to rework how borders work so you only start with one system, then build a frontier outpost over a system to claim it. THEN colonize it or whatever
>They want Hyperlanes to be the default FTL then have other types to be research. Wormholes overhauled to sling shotting you across the entire galaxy.

Thoughts?

>>175809201
>Thoughts?
I'm getting a refund.

>>175809201
imo they should stop fiddling the base game mechanics and release these things as mods, so people can use them *if they want to*.

The only things they should release as mandatory updates are bugfixes.

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Cybrans are classy as fuck, but they're also really shitty. Their Hive building makes them really good at turtling, but Supreme Commander is really good at avoiding turtling.

>>175808941
>shittypaintedit.png

>>175809201
Tedious and miserable.

>>175809353

Developer intended experience >>> shitty player desires.

Players will gladly keep old, bad, outdated mechanics when a clearly superior one exists due to nostalgia or simply stupidity. The developers know the game a lot better then you do and can make a much better experience then you ever could. You should only consider modding after literally thousands of hours of handcrafted content you've experienced, and even that should be just to keep things fresh.

>>175809353
Or steal the game options menu they're using in half their current games.

>>175809953
So this is what a fundamentally wrong opinion looks like. We should archive it so that future generations can study it and learn from its mistakes.

>>175809953
Im not sure if your joking or not but this is paradox. The same developers that released hoI4 without a functioning AI because they think people play that game multiplayer exclusively. EU4 has continued to recive updates that are focused towards a better multiplayer experience I dont trust those swedes.

>>175809201
Kind of dumb desu.
Frontier outposts are for grabbing space resources. Planets are for pops and ports. Each has their place and don't need to be homogenized.

>>175809201
Latter is an improvement as long as you can still work with just one without penalty.
Hyperlane is the most generic, but jump drives are kinda the direct successor to warp drives and wormhole makes sense for similar late game crisis evoking shenanigans.
The change wouldn't affect the game much.

Most of the time I discussed borders and their impact in Stellaris was before launch. It would be different, if better I'm not sure. But a big change that isn't really necessary.

But yeah as somebody else said, they have a lot more to fix before changing anything else.

Though again changing the drives like that would be low effort which is fine.

>>175809643
Whatever helps you sleep at night.

>>175809416
You've got it entirely backwards.
I'm basing this mostly off FAF balance but that is still built on the base game without altering anything like the different buildings available.
Cybran is an aggressive faction. UEF is the turtle faction.
UEF have a T3 point defense. Cybran T2 point defense is the worst in the game.

The hive isn't really for turtling, but for booming. The two are related but quite different.
You'll build hives in team games where you're protected by others. If it's a 1v1 or something, even if you play defensive, other eco options have more priority. And your best defense is building units.

Playing defensively does actually have the advantage in supcom.

You can't hide in a corner and turtle that way, because the enemy will dominate you with that much more map control.
But if you have an only reasonably smaller control of the map than your opponent, and they push on you, you can easily have the advantage.

Reclaim is incredibly important.
If you attack the enemy and your attack fails, you just gave the enemy a fuckton of a free mass.
They can then boom with it and win with the extra luxury harass/assassin units they can afford while their defense line still holds.

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>>175810178
what do you mean frind
denying forced integration would be intolerant

>>175809201

>people complain that the game becomes tedious at the end
>make early game slower to compensate

>>175810636
>Now nobody will see how tedious the end game is because they will never finish the early game!
>Sven you are genius!

>>175810636
Really roasting my almonds M83.

>>175809201
default going to hyperlanes isn't too bad, as long as you can turn off the fucking hyperlane grid. that's seriously the only reason I won't use it

requiring a frontier outpost is ridiculous, though

How is the new MoO?

Does anyone else play with the AI Combat computers mod?

L-Missile/Kinetic arty destroyers are extremely OP with max thrusters, afterburners and the 100-distance hit and run computer.

>>175811681
I do just because it lets me actually use battleships as walls instead of ineffective artillery.

>>175811909
I use it to keep my carriers out of trouble, so I can equip them with nothing but enough power to keep the lights on, keeping the costs down by avoiding any weapons/shields/armor.

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>>175806418
>thinking I wouldn't notice the spider
pssh... too easy...

>>175812069
>And now, to celebrate our fifth sphere of expansion and our complete dominion over yet another sapient species, to the esteemed admirals of our imperial fleet, I present to you, our latest carrier design!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Uxk70BjH68

>>175812502
lol

>>175812069
I ran a three-class fleet with mostly flak battleships, plasma 60-range cruisers and L kinetic destroyers.

It's amazing how few losses you suffer when the enemy's trying to bring down battleships first instead of last.

>>175812656
Does flak actually shoot missiles? I've tried running flak before but I noticed that missiles kept blasting through my screens anyway.

I've only really seen proper Point Defense and Fighters shoot down missiles. Never flak.

>>175813756
I don't tend to see explosive damage in combat reports, even when I'm fighting enemies with missiles, so I assume it's working.

>Cybrex precursor
>Complete the quest 2230
>Ruined ringworld right next to my capitol
Holy shit this is fuckin great only slightly dampened by the fact next patch I could had repaired this oh well still breedy gud.

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Should future 4x games feature memetic victory conditions?

>>175816072
That's already Civ's culture victory.

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I just lost the game , or won it not sure

Started invading an enemy planet and sending fleets somewhere when the
"THIS IS THE MESSAGE THAT SAYS HOW YOU WON" thing popped up

all planets , pops are missing and there are no buildings in the planets I used to live in and my empire is no longer in the contact list or as a Enemy of neighbor empires

anyone had this happen before ?

>>175816396
Yeah It's a pretty common bug, no idea what triggers it.

FUN FACT:
Everything in this game is completely deterministic.
Try saving the game right before a space battle for example, then let it happen and don't issue any commands.
Reload the game, don't touch anything again. It will happen exactly the same every time. All the evasion rolls and such are not rolled on the moment, they are completely deterministic.
Just like the real universe if you could save and load.

>>175816396
"Total Victory" war goal completely eliminates an empire. Don't know how to get it normally.

>>175816396
Your empire contracted a severe disease that insta-kills your people and spreads at the speed of light.

>>175816634
>>175816615

The war was far from being over though
i had +14 war score or something like that

well , time to go for food and start another

>>175816631
That's just the rng seed, I bet. Try this instead:

Save the game before a space battle. Note how it ends. Reload/ Let the game run for a short time like a month while you fiddle around with your empire or something. Try again.

>>175816775
>spreads at the speed of light
then it would take years to go between systems you dip

>>175816814
Actually, the disease spread to anon, and then, when he zoomed out to view his entire empire, spread back inside into every one of his worlds at the speed of light all at the same time..

>>175816631
>Just like the real universe
We wish.

>>175816396
It happened to me after I invaded a certain planet. Seems like some bugged planets cause it, because after I reloaded the save before I invaded the planet, and stopped myself from invading it, I didn't get the bug.

>>175817519

are you using mods ? i was using the spider armies from the mod that adds more modifiers to planets

dont know if the planet i was invading had a modifier or not

Someone give me a decent name for a megastructure ascension path finisher.

I'm jury-rigging Master Builder to be a fourth path opener, then adding a finisher that increases speed/reduces cost by ~50% of what Master Builder gives - but also removes the restriction on simultaneous megastructure construction.

>>175817889
Starchitect

>>175817858
It actually happened on a planet that had the modifier from Colonisable Home Systems.
But then a few wars later I invaded some planets with the same modifier without any problems, so not exactly sure. Still deleted the mod, just in case.

>>175809201
You're fucking with me.

These ideas are TERRIBLE.

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>tfw can't think of an interesting bio for my fanatic spiritualist crusaders so i just write down "Have you heard the good news?"

Is Distant Worlds very difficult to learn? I want something that is in-between Stellaris and Aurora 4x.

Why the fuck is it so expensive?!?!?!?!

Wiz has posted a page of patch notes on his twitter. What do you guys think of things so far?

>>175818431
Automate everything except taxes.

Set taxes as low as possible.

You have now won Distant Worlds.

>>175818431
You can put everything on auto/ask your permission. So you can learn slowly or you can have some fun and put like everything on auto and just focus on like building and war. The main cons are the logistical part of the game are a near nightmare and main pro is you can have a fleet of star destroyers. Just pirate.

>>175818596
why didn't you link them

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>>175819023
Sorry, I thought I did.

>>175819161
>human traits are a 'balance' change
>makes them even shittier than before
It's not like it makes them any more or less realistic than they were before, since we've met zero actual aliens to compare ourselves to.

>>175819504
Just let the swedes indulge in their self-hatred. We can always just create our own human species anyway.

>>175819161
>Can now terraform inhabitable planets
Thank god.
>Warp nerf
Damn
>World shaper ascension unlocks atmosphere manipulation
Is that implying I cant get that tech without that perk? If so terraforming got nerfed a bit.
>Master builder buff
Sweet
>Planetary survey corps nerf
Kind of upsetting but it was crazy overpowered so ok.
Overall ok doesnt seem to address some of the real problems of the games but some nice quality of life changes.

>>175819161

>Make PSC even more mandatory as your third Unity expenditure but less penalizing as the game goes on

That's aight

>Ironman now saves quarterly instead of monthly

God bless

>>175819504
Adaptive makes sense at least since humans have shown to flourish in preety much any conditions only the artic really eludes us. The main problem is there is no real reason for humans in game to not be able to settle preety much every planet in the game that anyone else could. I mean we can colonize continent ones but not savanna planets? We fuckin came from terrain like that. Still your right we have nothing to compare to for all we know all other alien life is way way way better at adapting to any conditions then us and for all we know humans are fuckin strongmen of the galaxy and should be considered strong Earth is actually on the highest point gravity can be and have complex life develop we are pretty sure.

>>175819161
>warp nerfed
but why?
>humans nerfed
Why even bother?

I started a game with 6 Advanced start AI on a huge galaxy with 5 FEs. So far the Unbidden showed up and the weakest NPC empire smashed their portal within the year of spawning. There's still the Abberant to deal with but wow that was underwhelming.

>>175819961
How are humans nerfed?

>>175820445
Adaptive is pretty shitty when you won't hit the happiness limits early and terraforming becomes dirt cheap.

Wasteful makes you have less minerals forever.

>>175820612
Adaptive is even less useful now that you can terraform inhabited planets.

>>175819957
>>175819504
Humans lost Quick Learner because of 2016 and Trump being elected. That's the reason they gave during the stream.

>>175809201

To be honest I actually though you needed to have a border over a world to colonize it first anyway. I think it's a better system but it needs something like Endless space being able to send out probes or maybe Egalitarian empire's can claim a territory then sell it off to other empire's like habitable worlds, or make habitats a more early game tech.

In fact I wonder of there's a mod that let's you build really shitty, like 2-4 size habitats, near to the early gane that could be upgraded later. I actually don't know how size works with habitats now because I never get that far.

>>175819504
>minmaxing your traits on a RP-oriented race
wew

Charisma/Repugnant won't affect happiness anymore, only empire relations?

Lame.

>>175820723
I might actually drop the game if they make colonization any more of a chore.

How would we get enough influence to expand?

It would slow the game to a fucking crawl.

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>>175820785
Not like that part of the trait ever mattered anyways.

>>175820708
>Swedes

>>175820860

Maybe outposts that don't expand beyond a single system will be a thing with less influence costs?

Maybe build outpost, colonize, tear down outpost? Maybe more habitable planets? I just hope they put a bit more thought in it before they release it, since a lot of people are unhappy as is.

[spoilers]Mods will fix itď [/spoiler]

>>175820785
It makes sense in that it was worthless or one free point respectively.

But the hilarious part is moving it from a system with some interaction and importance, to another flat modifier in the weakest part of the game.

>>175820860
Obviously if they make it so you need to shit out frontier outposts they would make them less expensive.

>>175821035
>>175821061
I really don't want this change. I like the idea of my empire exerting influence over the galaxy after taking a planet; I hate the idea of having to send a satellite to 'claim' a world.

What if the AI plants satellites all over your territory and prevents you from settling new worlds?

>>175821207
I actually don't like the idea of "hard" borders. I much prefer something like I can do this or that whenever I want, what are you gonna do about it?

And then they war you for colonizing that planet right beside their homeworld.

If they really don't want me colonizing territory they claim, they better back it up with guns.

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>>175819161
If you need to claim territory with an outpost to colonize a planet then how did the Commonwealth of Man colonize a planet back in 2100? Checkmate swedes.

>>175820763
Humans could have Very Strong because our planet is nearly too large to leave with chemical propulsion. They could have Weak because the average alien species is a heavy worlder that achieves spaceflight with more exotic tech.

They could have Quick Learner, Slow Learner, Adaptive, Nonadaptive, Nomadic, Sedentary, whatever the fuck you want and it would still make sense, since what an 'average' alien looks like is up to them.

So this is Paradox actually going back and saying 'you know what, we now think that if you play humans you aren't going to be RPing travellers that learn quickly, you're going to be RPing decadent cockroaches'.

And that's filed under Balance.

>>175821327
>mfw CoM is hard coded not to start with a planet but a frontier outpost only
Your move, anon.

>>175821421
>if you pick militarist humans you instantly lose the game
I wish I couldn't believe this.

>>175816072

victory conditions were a mistake

>>175821770
There should be a meter which measures the player's overall happiness level. The victory condition would be any time in the game that it is completely filled up.

>>175821886
yeah good job asshole let's just make the game unwinnable for me

>>175822126
git gud

>>175810636
Well the two are unrelated and the early game does end too fast.

Why arent carriers considered good? Ive seen mine do worlds of good but people seem to dismiss them.

>>175823487
I never leave home without mine either.

>>175823487
Because theyre not

>>175823487
Carriers wreck ships with no point defenses. All AIs will stack lots of point defenses on all their ships as soon as they have the technology.

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Is this description at least tolerable?

Also not sure on the balance, this + Master Builders will stop you going Psionic/Bio/Robot ascensions but sums to +75% speed and -50% cost for megastructures.

>>175824060
Just not having any forced memes inserted in it makes it at least a 7/10.

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That wormhole event was really ebin.

>>175823991
Explains why they did so well against the unbidden.

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Going to play as these fags with the Playable Primitive + Dynamic Borders mods, thoughts?

>>175825043
Tell us how the AI reacts to the dynamic borders. I can't imagine them actually managing that new mechanic well at all.

>>175825043
What does dynamic borders do?

>>175825571
You have to have ships in-order to have a system in your borders, cuts planet border extension by 75%, a mod to fix how borders work and prevent doomstacking

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WE

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>>175825571
Ships control borders more than planets, shared borders are infinitely more common

>>175825669
>prevents doomstacking
Really now

>>175826052
Whats to stop me from putting a single corvette on every sector? And how does the AI handle it? I feel like they wouldnt do it and just be pathetic to the player.

>>175826097
Well, in order to have GROSS borders, you need to spread your army

>>175826124
It becomes a shared sector, lots of border friction, etc. Also, I manages to build mining stations, so I think it's working

Just like in real life, you'd piss off a lot of people if you tried to control the entire galaxy.

Also, I think you need 3 corvettes (or 1 construction/science) ship

>>175826214
I understand were its coming from but I feel like its easily abusable.

>>175826283
It could be interesting in multiplayer but AI is too stupid to abuse

>>175826214
How does it behave if you're just traversing your ships inside an allied nation's territory (like to help them fight off the Unbidden or something)?

Time to fall for the hyperlane only meme

wish me luck lads

>>175826532
Automatic shared borders

>>175826706
Hmm... At first glance it sounds wierd, but when I think about a litlle, that border friction malus you get from generating a shared boeder from your fleet can be a stand in for tension caused by your armada's cutting through someone else's territory... I might have to try it for myself.

>>175826860
>Where do 800 cruisers sit?
>Wherever they want

>>175826137
all that does is force you to have a bigger fleet

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>Genius Maniac
sweet.

>>175826965

>not havin a bigga fleet anyway

look at dis grot an laff, lads

>>175819161
>humans are now adaptive, nomadic, and wasteful

Given that humans are a starting race for most people, is dealing with consumer goods really what you want new players to be dealing with?

Wiz was a mistake desu senpai

Hello 4X General. I have a question: Is the Age of Wonders series a 4X or just a turn-based strategy? I mean it probably just belongs here in general but I'm just curious.

>>175827458

>4X General

This is /stelg/ m8

How broken would multiple megastructures per system be?

>>175827617
Broken enough that TALL gameplay would finally be viable.

>>175827617

Not very?

>habitats already can
>ringworlds technically are but are sun based so can't be, if they were planet orbiting instead then it'd be busted but funny as fuck
>same for dyson spheres, sun based so 1 only
>sentry array is pointless to have more than 1 of

That leaves you with the science nexus, which is OK but really no different than building a load of them spread out or in 1 system.

>>175827458
If not exactly fitting the description it is certainly close enough for the distinction to not matter.

>>175827617
Which? Ringworld and Dyson Sphere are mutually exclusive for obvious reasons.

Slapping one of the other megastructures in a system with them wouldn't matter much.

>>175827714
Imagine. The Dyson Ringworld.

A partially constructed Dyson Sphere which has just small enough slits to shine light upon the haitable sections of the ring world. Think of the possibilities.

>>175827709
>>175827714
Technically you could engineer a shittier Dyson Sphere with gaps in the middle that shine sunlight and simulate a night/day cycle as the structures rotate.

>>175828020
Yeah I guess, but as you say that'd really have to be it's own third thing rather than just slapping them together.

>>175827942

You could just stop half way then. Just make a dyson frame and use the leftover materials to build a bootleg ringworld.

>>175828170
We can call it the Huawei Sphere

can you build ring worlds in inhabited systems

like can I fuck up my home world by building a ring world there

>>175828510
Not without mods.

>>175828541
gay

do you know of a mod that allows it?

>>175828596
I don't, but I can tell you how to add it to an existing mod.

I have no idea if the game supports it without crashing though.

>>175809953
This desu, armchair devs playing along at home think thy can solve game issues with their own suggestions are wrong and should know it.

>>175828724
Get back to work, Wiz.

What the fuck happened.
I started playing stelaris and left during 1.4 and then when I just booted it up it is now 1.6 and everything is different. Would not be such a problem if I could find a proper changelog

>>175829019

fuck off you time travelling cunt

>>175829019
Don't worry; what was shall be.

How can we utilize oil to create a faster than light ship to escape the aliens that will eventually enslave us?

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Insert thinking emoji here

>>175827942
Or you could just live on the fucking sphere.

>playing a hyperlane only game with my friend who's new to the game
>spawn almost inside a fallen empire, but there's one hyperlane open to me
>the problem is, this fallen empire is militant isolationist
>can't fucking expand ANYWHERE without him getting mad, so tell them to fuck off after my 5th frontier outpost is dismantled
>it's at -455 opinion but still hasn't declared war
>but friend gets rekt by harvesters so we restart anyway
I don't mind spawning next to an isolationist FE but goddamn Paradox needs to fix them. They kept going nuts about border extrusion even when I built frontier outposts a fucking long distance away.

I want to make my own 4x game. Where should I start?

How do I get good in Stellaris? I always lag behind AIs.

>>175829961
You either lose a lot of habitable space building it close or make the whole project much more mass-intensive by building an entire sphere out to some insane radius.

So which guardian is the hardest and has the best rewards? I think the enigmatic fortress wins in both.

>>175831276
Energy shields, artificial gravity and other magical spells exist, im sure we could figure out a way around it.

>>175831373
Yeah, but building them separately means you can have your ring with its equatorial gravity at whatever radius you want for size and then your sphere at whatever radius you can shrink it to for energy collection.

So what is the difference between 4x and grand stratergy?

>>175831316
The battle part wasn't too bad for me but I guess going into the shutdown phase blind would cause trouble

>>175831684
The necessary autism.

>>175831684
According to /gsg/? Set in the real world is vaguly historical and generally must be made by paradox but ive seen post stuff like RotK and not get yelled at. 4x is everything sid meiers strat wise. Technically both civ and EU are both 4x and grand strat go figure.

>>175831884
EU4 isn't a 4X, if you don't have random new world, It's a 3X :$)

>>175831884
What about total wars games? does /gsg/ sperg out about them being posted?

>>175832105
A long long time ago 4x gsgs and twg were all one general.
>>175832094
>eXplore, eXpand, eXploit, and eXterminate
You do all 3 of those in Eu4 and dont say cause you IRL know what the world is doesnt mean you dont explore.

>>175832174
>and dont say cause you IRL know what the world is doesnt mean you dont explore.

You don't explore because you know where all the empires are and resources as well

>>175832446
>EU4
>Explore america
>Hey look this province made tobacco this game and that one fish and holy shit that one gold
>Hey look the quzbec tribe is a major regional power this game
>Civ5
>Explore map
>Hey look my area has marble this game and over there is gold
>Hey look France is a major regional power this game.
Really the only major difference is how much you know about your region at the start.

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>>175832552
>>Explore america
>Explore map
You heard it here first lads, America is the same as the entire world.

>>175832762
Scuse me sir
>Explore America
>Explore Africa
>Explore Asia
>Explore Oceiana
The fact that I only know about 1/20th of the map at game start instead of 1/40th means totally different things. In fact depending on your start you could know LESS of the map then a civ start. And EU4 still meets all prereques you explore every game you exploit every game you most certainly expand only exterminate isnt guaranteed and youd have to really really go out of your way to not do that.

>>175832552
You want sugar? You go to Caribbeans, and you'll always get sugar, always. There are many regions like that but EU4 makes me feel disgusted and I haven't played EU3 for a long time


>Hey look the quzbec tribe is a major regional power this game

Shit doesn't happen if you don't put lucky nations on random

Fucks like you who turned EU from a grand-strat to a 4X are cancer

What makes a grand strategy is that the game tries to convert historical devices into game mechanics instead of the other way around, fucking mana-tier distractions fucked Paradox up

>>175832895
Actually while it is very likey there is a small chance you get nothing but fish and you havent played many games if you havent seen an indian tribe become strong by chance hell the incans unite about half the games these days. And your missing the point im simply arguing that both games fit into both. Look heres a list of 4x games

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_4X_video_games
As you can see ALL EUs are in it

>>175827458
> Is the Age of Wonders series a 4X or just a turn-based strategy?
First AoW definitely isn't, 2 and 3 could be considered 4x

>>175810234
>I'm basing this mostly off FAF balance
Yeah, but FAF changes the T2 tanks and points defenses to make them less sensitive to terrain, so they're a lot better than in FA.

>>175812454
And I thought that using SupCom would get everyone's attention.

>>175832174
Genres are way more than just their acronyms.
If you're just gonna determine what games are 4x based on
>eXplore, eXpand, eXploit, and eXterminate
then every single base building RTS game is a 4x. Also a lot of open world RPGs would also fit in.

>>175833042
Any fuckwit can edit a wikipedia article

>>175833439
I arue that no civ game is 4x since I can know exactly what the map is if I use a specific seed or a premade map or I can choose to start at a date were I know what the map looks like so no exploration. Not really sure what you want at this point your just covering your ears and saying what ever. No im not saying EU4 should be posted here but it is in the spirt of most of what makes 4x 4x. You could argue that a game is only 4x if its got the sid miers name in front of it. And there are games talked about on this general less 4x then EU4.

>>175833665
Because we also accept city-builder and RTS.

>>175833702
I remember when there was a RTS general.

>>175833720
It died, just like cbg or the Banished General. That's why we accepted refugees here, before Civ6 and Stellaris came out.

>>175833439
RTS is more 4X than EU

>>175833439
Maybe even Sacrifice.

>>175833319
Regardless, the factional differences remain constant.

>>175834039
But FAF makes the T2 PD and T2 tank a bit less shitty.

>>175834104
I got you the first time family.
I depart for sleep now.

>>175833471
[citation needed]

>>175833665
>No im not saying EU4 should be posted here but it is in the spirt of most of what makes 4x 4x.
It's not, since it lacks both the exploration and extermination aspects. And don't confuse extermination with general war/conquering in EU4.

How long until Adams?

>>175834216
There is a button to quite literately exterminate native people in a province and you can genocide entire races in EU4. I feel that qualifies for extermination hell alot more then Civ 5. And I feel I already went over exploration adequately but even if you are ultra super stubborn random new world.. Never thought ide see the day ide argue for EU4 but hey one of the big complaints on gsg is EU4 is to 4x so here I am

>>175830576
I'm making one in Unity but it really depends on what languages you know. Unity can be a pain if you don't know js as c# is kind of dodgy.

>>175834373
Gsg is literally retarded is they think that EU4 is 4x.

Is there any meta start for Stellaris?

>>175834408
Kinnda funny you say that since 4x didnt want stellaris thinking it was to "grand strat" while gsg didnt want it for being to "4x". See how lines can blur wow isnt that neat.

>>175834373
native people are irrelevant, population isn't represented after the colony forms and keeping and integrating them only gives you a slight buff to the province, and it's less than one click of mana.
They are otherwise only psuedo-rebel generators.
As for genociding entire races, unless you mean wiping over them with your culture(which certainly isn't genocide), there is no such thing.

>>175834458
Probably, but /gsg/ proved numerous time that they're retarded, therefore they're wrong by default.

>>175834593
>Litterly exterminating a people is less extermination then say civ 5 were you cant exterminate anything
Really fires my neurons.
>>175834623
This place is also retarded hell it was part of gsg for a good while. Hell all of /v/ and 4chan for that matter is retarded and should be disregarded. Could you name a source I can pull up that will sacrifice all needs.

>>175834706
That place was a lot better before Utopia released. Now, it's all about "teehee I'm purging lel aren't i provocative" and "lalala rate my edgy species".

>>175834706
raze city button

>>175834784
Raze colony button.

>>175834373
>There is a button to quite literately exterminate native people in a province and you can genocide entire races in EU4.
That's not what extermination in 4x means.
Extermination means that one of legit or main goals of winning the game is exterminating every opponent and win the game by being the only one left. That is simply is either impossible without cheating in most historical grand strategy games, or require playing specific countries and using exploits or very cheesy strats. But at the end of the day, those games are definitely not designed or balanced around conquering the entire planet (in fact, most of them have various mechanisms that discourage or heavily penalize constant warfare and conquest), while actual 4x games are or should be.

>>175834373
>you can genocide entire races in EU4
There are ayyys in EU4?

>>175834939
No that would be other species.

Jesus, Rimworld pisses me off.
>be a colonist
>be hungry
>decide to go eat something
>there are strawberries and corn
>pick the corn
>start eating it directly instead of sitting at a table
>get mood maluses for eating raw corn and eating without a table
>while he could have picked strawberries and just moved his fat ass to the dining room
YOU RETARD DESERVE TO DIE

I found a sort of work around to broken unbidden. If they just stop and start to sit around sent a corvette to their portal the AI will recall everyone to kill it then go back to eating planets. Now if only I knew why they got stuck in the first place.

>>175834450
I suppose a nebulae with large starting planets with good modifiers. A nearby enclave always helps too.

>>175835401
What's good about nebular?

>>175834779
Purge posting has been there from the start.
It's actually has quietened down.
Besides, only a tiny fraction of it is "huehue aren't I edgy and politically subversive". I imagine you're just needlessly sensitive to the mere mention of it for some fucking reason.

>>175835642
Improved chance for science and strategic resources.

>>175835802
Yeah. Because we went from none at all to fucking everywhere.
Of course I'm sensitive to stupidity.

>>175835902
>Sensitive to stupidity
>4chan
What your saying doesnt quite add up how are you even alive?

>>175835902
If you're going to claim purge posting was rare Pre-Utopia then just admit you've only started posting here after Utopia released.

>>175835993
>your
Okay, ESL.

>>175836036
You forgot to point out I forgot to add the ' to doesnt if your gonna critique someones grammar on an anonymous message board at least put some effort into it for god sake.

>>175836132
Okay, ESL.

>>175836164
Maybe we should purge all the ESLs.

>>175836256
That sounds like a good idea.

>>175836256
Just from 4chan, or more broadly?

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>>175835017

>>175836368
There's worse.
I just told a colonist to cut some stones to make bricks. That moron, instead of going to the garbage dump that was filled with chunks, decided to go pick a new chunk that was lying next to that explosive gerbil. He came back dying, only to get punched in the face because he stacked Annoying Voice and Creepy Breathing and died like a bitch.

Gonna savescum the fuck out of it.

Patchnotes, fags
https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?threads/stellaris-dev-diary-71-the-adams-update-part-2.1019086/

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So the new dev diary is out, with full patch notes on 1.6. Adams will be out next Thuesday the 9th of may at the one year anniversary of stellaris.

https://forum.paradoxplaza com/forum/index.php?threads/stellaris-dev-diary-71-the-adams-update-part-2.1019086/

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Hey check this out :

https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?threads/stellaris-dev-diary-71-the-adams-update-part-2.1019086/

>>175835394
Oh and another thing that unbreaks them. If you notice all of them AFKing with most being in thier portal sector find one of the outliers and destroy that fleet. That also unbreaks them.

>* Extradimensionals now turn planets barren after destroying colonies
Really?

>>175836989
Deal with it nerd. Letting them rampage should fuck things up.

>* Increased warp wind-down time
F-fine! I preferred hypermemes anyway!

New patch is shit, you literally can't refute this.

>>175837427
> Sector AI should no longer build over Alien Pets and Betharian Stone with buildings that can't make use of them

>>175837482
THank fuck

>>175837404
Wormholes still on top!

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>Nerfed military stations as if they weren't shit already.
>Terraforming made even more common.
>Master Builders doesn't have cost reduction, making it an even more shitty choice.
Welp

>>175838126
They buffed military stations sperglord.

>>175838126
To be fair you still need master builder if you want to build megastructures in a somewhat sane amount of time.

say i want to buy 8 copies of civ 6 because im a good goy
whats the most efficient way of doing that

>>175838198
They also got nerfed you autismo.

>Boosted the damage output, shield hit points and hull points of military stations and frontier outposts substantially
Buff

>Increased the distance at which military stations have to be built from each other
Nerf

>Ships caught in FTL magnets no longer warp in right on top of a station, but rather near it
Buff?

>>175838562
They are going to be instantly destroyed by the Doomstack snared, so the changes are pointless.

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>tfw to intelegent to play anything but Pre-FTL/Primitive starts

>Removed influence cost from Fleet Academy spaceport module
Nice

>>175838896
FUCKING GOOD
that shit is a killer having to rebuild shit all the time and building when taking over shit all the time

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>>175806418
So /cbg/ has a ghetto in thread, right? I'm wondering what sort of intersection would fix my problem here. Not very good at traffic management; I do have traffic manager if that matters.

>>175816072
>what is cultural victory

>>175839167
I'd say to build a second bridge, but that would be too expensive.

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>>175839356
I'm swimming in money and kind of already have a second bridge, though in a different place. The problem is that there are too many cars for the roundabout to handle.

>>175839292
Did you really take nine hours to make the same post as the first reply?

>>175839450
Then encourage mass transport like buses or train.

Probably not subway.

>>175839570
You think I'm not already working on that? I just want a four-road intersection with a higher throughput than a roundabout.

>>175839450
then use more roundabouts. Duh.

>>175839743
I'll round your fucking ass about, you cheeky asshole.

>>175839450
The simple answer is that your intersection is servicing way too much.

It's servicing the bridge.
It's servicing the highway.
It's servicing local traffic that just wants to make a simple turn.

An intersection shouldn't be handling 3 major traffic flows at the same time. Break that shit up.

>>175839962
OK, that sounds like solid advice, I'll try and move the highway entrance somewhere else. Thanks.

How the fuck do I cleanse a planet without then losing it to neutral space that neighbours then come and steal off me? Why can't I remain in control of the planet and fill it with my own race?

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Ya know maybe if the AI helped the unbidden wouldnt had eaten half the galaxy. I actually let them rampage for awile till the reached me. Also why is the AI so bad at fighting the crisis and why does the crisis break every 10 seconds? The damn unbidden kept AFKing for years till I tried to unbreak them only for them to break 2 seconds later.

>>175840904
> Galaxy unifying under a common threat
> Implying they wouldn't bicker for decades over who gets to build the ships, who pays for them, and porking money 9001 different ways because MUH DISTRICT MUH CONSTITUENTS.

This is why overbloated federations like the EU are absolute trash and doomed to catastrophe.

>>175841125
>Aliens invade
>The EU bicker over funding the army to stop them
>Russia and China stay out of it hoping to pounce on whoever leaves a moment of weakness to save the Earth
>USA and its vassal UK stop the alien at insurmountably cost.
Guess that fits my game enough.

>>175836818
* Ironman autosaving is now quarterly instead of monthly
Why?

>>175841430
Because they can't into split thread saving.

* Removed weapons from Mining and Research stations
Fucking why.
It was not enough damage to matter anyway.

>Boosted the damage output, shield hit points and hull points of military stations and frontier outposts substantially
>military stations
that's nice I guess
>frontier outposts
fuck yeah

>>175841676
Probably so that they don't attack ships on their own.

>>175841815
Oh yeah. Keeps them out of combat I guess maybe.

>>175841676
> eeewiuwiu
> Science vessel lost
> eewiuwiu eewiuwieu
> Science vessel science vessel science vessel lost

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So yep this is a hugbox of doom. You would think the AI would try to fight each other if they have that much border tension but guess not.

>>175841676
Typical Paradix.

Instead of giving us the OPTION of arming them even more or remove weapons - remove because lol its 2017..

>>175842148
How is arming them more preferable? They will never be able to stand up to a single corvette unless you overpower them to be fortresses of their own. This was probably done to take them out of combat entirely unless specifically targeted by an enemy fleet.

>>175842908
Because arming them enough would at least force AI to commit some forces to destroy them ?

Or maybe some of us want to have the OPTION of arming them and not arbitraily be denied the option ?

>>175843025
Im ok with the option because to many times I had my transports wander near one and get stuck in combat with something that cant even penetrate the shields. I see were you are coming from but if it really bugs you enough toss down some forts near them.

>>175843025
Mining station defenses literally don't matter after the first handful of corvettes are built.

On the other hand mining stations are the eternal MVP with more racked up scientist kills than any other force in the galaxy.

Removing a huge annoyance is well worth the non price.

>>175843151
Arming and shielding transports should also be an option.
Like in Aurora.

So I guess I'm turning the end-game crises off, then? They've fucking made them twice as difficult to defeat.

>can't design mining stations
>can't put level 5 shields and shield caps on them

>>175843209
But you can shield transports. It's also free.

>>175843185
>thx paradox for removing another thing from your games and not giving me an option to decide for myself

Paradicks target at its finest.

>>175843285
But you cant arm them, you cant make an assault dropship carrier that is at least capable of defeating some corvettes deep inside enemy lines during a raid etc.

>>175843375
I get were you are coming from but please think about what you are saying. You want transports to be weak corvettes so what they get 1 weapon? At best this would hold off like a single corvette and even then you would want to retreat cause the troops are way more valuable then any form of combat ship or you make transports as good as corvettes in which case why build corvettes. Just leave them unarmed youd be mad to send them anywere undefended and if they did see combat the best choice would be run and even with weapons they wouldnt get through the shield. The only very minor practacle use would be using them to snipe some mining stations while waiting for bombardment to finish but why not use corvettes.

>>175843375
Anon. Removing bad choices from the game is what a good dev does. Lay off the salt.

> How do I kill corvettes
Protip: Try bringing corvettes.

>>175843578
>You want transports to be weak corvettes so what they get 1 weapon?

No, i want fully designable ships without retarded slot limitations.

>>175843590
Good goy... i mean anon.
Everything Paradicks remove from their games is bad and its a good move.
Now pay full price for a game that has less and less features every update.

>>175843761
If you want fully designable ships why not play galciv III or II?

>>175842148
They did it so your fleets don't engage every mining station whilst you're trying to rush them across enemy space.

And so that enemy mining stations don't engage your troop ships/logistic vessels following your fleet and delay them until you send some military vessels to free them.

>>175843761
In what reality ever in history have transport ships had any real weaponry? At best you could argue they should get a point defense thing. Like think about the audacity.
>Hey bro lets make our transports more heavly armed then BBs
>Why put troops on? I mean all we would do is increase cost
The only real other option is to trash transports completely and go with the more realistic choice of just making capitols carry around troops. I to would like to custom make ships but really nigga? Super armed transports? At best an expensive pointless novilty.

>Corporate Dominion no longer requires Egalitarian.

FINALLY!

>Nothing about a faster robot/droid/synth construction time, or about assimilating other species into your synth empire.

FUCK YOU.

>>175843960
>Nothing about a faster robot/droid/synth construction time
And I remember them saying on one of the streams that synth ascension will reduce build time in 1.6

>>175843906
>They did it so your fleets don't engage every mining station whilst you're trying to rush them across enemy space.

Again typical Paradix cutting corners - instead of giving players control during combat and some ability to designate targets - they remove weapons so i wont auto engage anything... fucking brilliant.

>>175843895
>GalCiv III

Nigguh plz, i have Aurora 4x - GC III can kiss my ass.

>>175843936
When in history have we had military spacecrafts ?

>The only real other option is to trash transports completely and go with the more realistic choice of just making capitols carry around troops. I to would like to custom make ships but really nigga? Super armed transports? At best an expensive pointless novilty.>>

Or you know simple warship with additional option of transporting and dropping troops.
Or simple transport/minig outpost who wont fall to anything with a gun because mighty god aka Paradicks said you cant give weapons to you instalations.
In a world of Pirates, hostile empires and space creatures..
Brilliant.

>>175819942
>Ironman now saves quarterly instead of monthly

wew now I have to endure less save lag spikes late game

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Stream is starting. A mod highlight stream.

https://www.twitch tv/paradoxinteractive

Do you guys think Unity generation is too high currently?
It's only 2277 and I've already unlocked 21 points.
I wanted to unlock ringworlds but I don't have the mega-engineering tech yet.
So now I'm just sitting on my free perk waiting for that tech.
Likewise I'm also still missing Droids and Gene tailoring, and I don't have enough perk slots left to get both megastructures -and- cyborg/psy ascension.

>>175844149
Maybe that's covered under the changes they made to pop growth in general?

> * Replaced Growth Time modifier effect with Growth Speed and rebalanced related values.

We can hope, anyway.

> * You can now build stations in systems where you share borders with another empire.

Cool.

> * Rulers now gain experience and level up from ruling. Heirs gain experience at a reduced rate under Imperial authority.

Very cool.

> * Robots that are under construction no longer cost maintenance.

Definitely needed that one.

> * The cost of species modification projects is now based on the difference between the traits at the start and end of modification, rather than on the sum of the trait cost.

FUCK.

>>175844251
Im not even sure if your trolling at this point but ill give it one last try. Why would you make heavily armed transports OUTSIDE OF NOVILITY? Same with mining stations. Have you ever made a fort in stellaris? Like really think for 2 seconds they suck even a top tier fortress will melt and at best you can have like 5 and they are good for a stall of like 2 months in a miracle situation. I get what you want more freedom and thats nice and all but the freedom you are asking for is novelty at best there are a million problems with the game that needs to be fixed more then a patch note saying
>Hey ya you can now but X tier weapons on transports.
And thats not even dealing with how the AI would handle custom shit like that. But please illumante to me what your fleet of transports which have a fleet strength of 1k will do against even a single cruiser? Whats that you are gonna make the transports stronger? Well then why front that cost on the transports when it would be better spent on better military craft. Either you are trolling or have never played stellaris.

>>175844501
Oh, and Philosopher King is working, now.

> * Fixed Philsopher King civic not applying to your starting ruler.

Nice typo there, Paradox.

>>175843960
>>Corporate Dominion no longer requires Egalitarian.

SLAVING GUILDS, MINING GUILDS, CORPORATE DOMINION HERE I COME!

>>175843761
There are so many reasons your idea is wrong and you are wrong. Don't go into game design any time soon... kid... try listing them all before you get schooled.

>$20 for a dlc
when will the swedish jews put it on sale

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>>175844574
>Why would you make heavily armed transports OUTSIDE OF NOVILITY?

So i wont have to babysit them and dodge every nickel corvette/fighter/FAC ?

Oh sorry, i forgot that im talking to a retarded Paradicks fanboy who will clap anytime he is getting assrammed and denied features that were present in previous patches.

>Aurora 4x lets you arm everything you want/need
>Distant Worlds let you arm everything you want/need
>Stellaris prevents you from arming things that are prime targets in war/every pirate raid ever
>hurr durr its a good thing i cant arm my valueable instalations now !!!

Fucking retards everywhere..

>>175841995
cannot even see the border between humans and blorg, fucking paradox, add more colors

>>175845231
Ok paradox added guns to transports. Oh no its the AI death fleet come to shit fuck your transports what do you do? You can right click a fleet on your transports to follow them around and for the final time I know you want more freedom but its novelty there are more important things to fix then a feature no one will use not even you. But please go on call me more names thats winning your argument.

>>175845369
>Oh no its the AI death fleet come to shit fuck your transports what do you do?

Are you illiterate or just retarded ?
What part of " I want to arm ( or at least have to option to decide to arm or not ) my transports/mining bases/research station/etc so they wont fall easy victim to every 30yo Corvette that comes near them" is unclear to you ?

>>175845517
Has this ever happened to you ever? Honest. The AI always takes the same route into your system same with the occasional reinforcement the AI does not send hit and run squads after your mining depots. Your ideas are novel but pointless so long as every game comes down to both people making giant deathfleet no 150 strength mining depot is gonna do anything to that.

>>175845517
The only unclear part of your shitty argument is where you git gud

>>175845369
not that guy but your argument is retarded, the IA can perfectly calculate and intercept your transports even if you rmb them to follow a fleet, they need to add special slots for ground troops and other things on ships and remove transports alltogether.

> * Added country_robot_build_speed_mult modifier.

Does this mean robots/droids/synths will build more quickly?

>>175845908
Im honestly shocked people have problems with this I thought the guy was fucking with me. If you keep your transport in neutral space the AI ignores it if you can do that keep it a little behind your deathball if it looks the AI is gonna attack it then the transports are bait. Never knew people had problems with this.

>>175845945
Yeah, looks like they just forgot to put it in the patchnotes.

>>175845945
Apparently Wiz said in the stream that the various Synth ascension points will increase construction time, but without the ability to assimilate conquered pops into your synth empire, Bio is still better.

>>175845945
Might just be mod support, they do that sometimes.

So how do you beat Unbidden and Swarm now that they're 2x stronger?

Does charismatic from multiple species stack?

>>175846186
Maybe someone will finally take Defender of the Galaxy.

>>175846186
You pray that they don't spawn in your territory, then you rush them and pray that FEs won't awaken and rekt your shit before you can stop the crisis.

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>>175846186
By letting them grind up against the AI and

ahahahahahahaha sorry I couldn't.

>>175845657
Many times.

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>happiness buildings replaced with more shitty unity

# Buildings
* Symbol of Unity building and related technology have been removed from the game
* Artist Monument no longer affects happiness or unity as a modifier, but instead has its unity ouput increased from 3 to 10
* Champion of the People trait effect on happiness reduced from +10% to +5%
* Inward Perfection civic effect on citizen happiness removed
* Peace Festivals edict effect on happiness replaced with +30% food
* Paradise Dome building effect on happiness reduced from +10% to +5%
* Dragon Monument building effect on happiness replaced with 15 unity output
* Dragon Shrine building effect on happiness replaced with 15 unity output
* Stellarite Trophy building effect on happiness replaced with 15 unity output
* Cultural Center habitat building effect on happiness reduced from +10% to +5%
* Cultural Center habitat building unity output increased from 3 to 4
* Loop Institute building effect on happiness reduced from +10% to +5%
* Loop Institute building society output increased from 4 to 8
* Omega Alignment building physics output increased from 8 to 10
* Clinics now produce society research instead of food

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>>175846960
Blame min max faggots for that.

>>175846960
You don't want your people to be too happy, do you?

>>175846960
It's too easy to stack without utopian welfare, only egalitarian societies can have true happiness.

>>175846960
>* Clinics now produce society research instead of food
Do we really need more society research buildings?

>>175847256
Of course, it's the most useful tech tree, isn't it!

>>175847238
Swedish cucks strike again.

>>175847256
Don't you want that sweet Transgenic Crops XIX?

>>175846960
To be fair its already pretty easy to get max or near max happiness. Of course without mods you already complete all traditions by about 2400ish.

>>175847238
>

>>175847238
Do you still have to be a xenocuck if you want to be egalitarian? Iirc they promised to fix it.

>>175847346
They need to make something with fucking unity after completing the traditions because now the leviathan buildings are fucking useless.

>>175847448
They should also fix how authoritarian and xeonphile interact.
Of course I have fucking xeno slaves, I also have slaves of my main species but you aren't crying about those are you, you swedish bitch.

>>175847467
Ya its a little redundant honestly it means youll reach ultra late game eariler which means the game will be over sooner. I wonder what paradoxes end game is with all of this. Just a quick rant I really want something to do after the crisis. As it stands assuming it doesnt break theres nothing to do after the crisis except slog through and conquer everyone thats left the endgame needs a serious overhall.

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>>175846960
>>175847346
>>175847467
>People complain about traditions being easy to fill and Unity being useless after that.
>Increase the need for Unity.
>Then remplace all the happiness with more Unity bonus so it literally doesn't change shit.
For some reason I suspect Paradox games don't go beyond 2300

>>175847645
Of course they don't. And they only play multiplayer with each other as well.

>>175834458
The defining feature of 4X isn't just the 4X, it's symmetry.
4X can't be assymmetrical, players have to have level playing starts. They can play by wildly different rules like in Endless Legend, but they can't start with ten more cities.
If everyone in EU4 started with one province it still wouldn't be a 4X because Europe exists

>>175847645
As the other guy said paradox had a wikedly distorted vision on their games at this point due to multiplayer I seriously doubt they ever play past the crisis and thats if they even make it to it. Honestly would be so hard to have some sort of repeating tradition like with the techs?
>>175847738
M8 I made that post 5 hours ago to show that EU4 is 4x in the loosest terms and to start something in a very dead thread let it rest you missed your chance.

>>175806887
>>175807736
>>175808302
If you had actually looked at OP you would have noticed that south just got rekt by a strategic nuke. Red probably had most of his mass going in that until he launched it

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So, I just got Utopia (haven't been able to play for a month or so because of reasons). On a scale of 1 to Paradox, how crushed will my hopes be when I dive in?

>>175847862
>and thats if they even make it to it.
Considering the whole "Unbidden spawn 99% of the time", I honestly believe either play with Crysis off, or their games don't reach that stage.

>>175847942
Pretty close to paradox.