/evn/ - English Visual Novels

>>152236976
>Visible nipples
Time to make a new thread already?

>>152237202
But anon, despite the text, I'm pretty sure that's a man.

>>152236976
>dat bg
>dat horrendous sprite
Why... god... why? Do devs have no sense of

A E S T H E T I C S ?

>>152237569
The sprite isn't "terrible" if it was actually a guy

>>152237569
>always tries new things with her games, not rehashed garbage
>only dev you can say is revolutionizing the genre unironically
>never did crowdfunding in any form
>a futa accepted by /u/

bretty good

>>152237917
>crowdfunding is baaaaad
Whine more nigger.

>>152237435
It's fine then

>>152237975
it's not bad but it's admirable to not see a dev holding on to other people's money for years on end.

>>152238214
>Grouping all devs into one because of a few scumbags

Honestly though, I will never understand why they put it off so much. It's better to hurry up, deliver it, make people happy and move on to the next project.

Delaying it only ruins their name, get people mad as fuck and destroys their chances of being received well in their next game/vn.

>>152236976
>dat sheet
couldn't figure what thing is made of. Too wrinkly to be silk, too glossy to be cotton. My best guess is hair.

>dat outlet
Seriously, who puts their power outlet within stepping distance of the workspace? Anyone meticulous enough to duct tape cords on the wall wouldn't make such an elementary mistake.

>dat curtain
obviously forced aside to show the window and remove the feeling of claustrophobia

>dat painting
out of place

>dat sprite
Why does this guy have boobs?

>>152238214
projects that did this and released it:
driftwood
this other evn which was so unremarkable I can't remember anything about it, other than there was some minute KS drama about them not being able to afford voice acting anymore due to fund depletion
projects that are currently doing it:
megatokyo vn
dizzy hearts
HRP
that 999 inspired thing
feel free to add to this

>>152238574
lovely thieves is currently doing it

>>152238574
the unremarkable vn turned out to be errant heart

>>152238809
hey, errant heart looks really, really good at least

>>152238318
>scumbags
i said it was admirable, anon. you need absolutely no credentials to raise more than most people make in a year from strangers wow'd by pretty art and maybe a 10 minute demo if you feel charitable. it's admirable to see she's never done it despite her experience and talent.

>>152238809
pretty sure it was No One But You

>>152238945
>Experience
Relative
>Talent
Subjective.

>>152238432
>dat sheet
Looks just like satin to me.

>>152238945
tbf clove doesn't need to fundraise because i'm pretty sure she made a lot of money from sales of analogue. these other projects that have had kickstarters are largely made by people with no money, i think.

>>152239150
a Patreon would have netted her plenty either way

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Europeans, tell me what makes your room distinct from that of the Japs. Is that globe on the desk really a thing?

>>152240002
do your fucking research, faggot.

>>152239787
oh yeah, good point.
maybe she makes enough money from sales she doesn't feel the need. i wouldn't judge if she did though, since there's nothing wrong with accepting people's money if they want to give it to you.

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>>152240002

>>152240370
things were so much simpler back then

>>152240370
Pretty accurate, can confirm \o

>>152237917
you forgot
>doesn't branch off into a million other projects

>>152240002
My school didn't have a desk. We have those chairs with an extended arm rest for you to write on. Pretty uncomfy. 1/10. Will not fap in again.

>>152240002
Those desks are horrible. The table top sticks out too much.
How are you going to open these windows? The exterior walls are too thin, what are they, 20cm thick?
Is th teacher's desk made out of plastic? Why the unnecessary bevel?
What's going on with that bookshelf in the background? Was it carved from one, solid slab of wood?
The lamps look ridiculous. Have you ever seen a ceiling light?

It's ridiculous when people who have not the slightest idea about architecture try to model interiors.

>>152242156
>Have you ever seen a ceiling light?
Literally searching "classroom light fixture" proves how much of a pretentious prick you are.

>>152244134
Entertain me and show me the reference used to make that light.
I won't even ask how it's attached to the ceiling.

Recessed lighting master race?

>>152242156
>nitpick anon getting nitpicked
I'm ok with this.

>>152244134
And this 'nitpick anon' isn't pretentious? He rips on other's work but his own art is literal dog shit?

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I just finished fapping. Why is everyone so grouchy today?

>>152242156
>table top
Yeah, didn't noticed that awhile ago. My eyes were glued on the 1st one.
>windows
WIP but maybe sliding. Not sure yet.
>Book
Yeah, missed that. Thanks.
>Lights
Got that from a weeb anime. Might change it to those hollow ones for a more western feel.

Thanks

>>152244709
I'm okay with it too.

>>152245464
We're all 'nitpick anons', anon.

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Just finished Valhalla. I thought it was superb, but nearly all of the conflicts were resolved too quickly. Guess that's just a limitation of being an indie game.

>finally gets calculations
>tries
>gets rekt by precision issues

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>>152240002
Here, we have double desks (we always sit with someone, pretty nice, because if your deskamate is good you can share some stuff). There's always a cross above the blackboard and the floor is almost always wooden.

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>>152247204
Double desks example.

>>152247306
>>152247204
The cross never went away.

>>152246049
>those ugly-ass lights and shadows on the floor

>>152247482
It will stay there for eternity.

>all this talk about schools
>Tfw studied in an all girl's catholic school
>People in it are unreligious as fuck.

Everyone in there were just in it for creds and waifu training.

>>152246049
>I just finished fapping
>wasting energy.
naive. i'm already an ascended wizard in the 5th stage of qi cultivation, i have so much energy don't even need to sleep anymore.

>>152248046
>waifu training
Does it work, though? Do you have a set of traditional "female skills" (cooking, sewing, etc) as a result of it?

>>152247204
>sitting with someone
literally why? It can't be anything but inconvenience.

>>152248302
Actually. Yeah. I do. I managed to make jackets, shorts, pillow casings and stuff. As for cooking. I'm pretty basic but they taught me enough that I can mince like a pro. Hah.

>>152248369
> sit with someone
> test time
> you share answers

>>152248369
Sharing stuff, learning together, making bonds. Usually (unless the person is a total fuckhead) the person you sit with ends up becoming your good friend. Also, if the class number is even it lessens the probability of having 'forever alone' students (unless it's uneven and you end up alone, which sucks). My school had desks with even 4 people in it, it was pretty nice. I could make some good friends thanks to that. Usually, I'm a loner so I couldn't make them as easily if I was sitting alone.

>>152248636
Depends really, sometimes you'll get stuck with a total baka and he just asks you for answers without doing shit.

Can I build the house in The Sims and take pictures for my BGs?

>>152248880
Sure can, just make sure to use photoshop filters afterwards to give it dat unique look. If anyone questions it deny furiously and claim it's "my artsyle".

>>152248880
As long as it's not commercial, no one will kill you over it. However all assets inside Sims belong to EA, and you wouldn't want them on your back.

>>152248961
>all assets inside Sims belong to EA,
Including the fan-made ones?
But they arent going to know if I only use stuff downloaded from the internet right?

>>152249551
>Including the fan-made ones?

Then depending whether it's a mesh or a model, it belong to EA AND the person who made them. Now you're stealing from two sources, congrats.

>>152249551
>Including the fan-made ones?
Those belong to whoever designed them.

>>152248727
>>152248046
>Pure maidens in an all girl catholic school sitting together on a desk and training to be waifu material
Best seller right there

>>152248781
those were usually chads though, you could always extort chad services from them

>>152250247
that sounds gay as fuck just buy a dildo like normal straight men that want to experience the pleasure of dick

>>152249683
I can already see rivers of money.

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>>152250728
I meant like making them buy you shit from cafeteria or take over after class cleanup duty or spook other chads, but alright

>>152251278
yeah right, buzz off haha "chad services" lmao you gay as heck

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After height calculations...

>>152251456
>no Africa
nice

>>152251806
I don't know why my background colorist did that. Will it cause an issue?

>>152251378
The tongue ever turns to the aching tooth.

>>152252006
u gay homes forget tooth your tongue has bigger problems

>>152251456
Looks fine color wise, the only thing that ticks me off a bit is the breast placement of that second grill. Seems a bit too low, but might just be me.

>>152251982
No, fuck niggers.
Also, now I can finally see her tits, so everything is fine.

>>152252096
I dont understand?

>>152251456
the lower case 'a' looks like a 'q' this some gay ass font you got there

>>152252215
u cheeky

>>152252106
I have that feeling as well. I didn't notice it at the beginning until I started experimenting with sprite placement.

>>152238574

I'd move Driftwood into the other group. They released half of a broken demo, nowhere near what they're still scheduled to deliver.

>>152251982
no, that's hilarious, your bg artist may be secretly a KKK member though

>tfw you made some progress, but can't post screenshot because it has crucial storywise spoilers.

>>152253472
It's fine, your story is a complete dogshit anyway.

5 hours into modeling and my pc decides to keep hibernating for some goddamn reason. Gonna post it when I wake up so you'll have something to shit on.

>>152247493
Seriously, I don't get it with the lights. I swear I've seen those kinds several times. Anyway, shadow sampling (specially soft shadow) eats a shit lot of RAM. I usually fix that on the final render.

>>152255564
If it's a window, check power options on the control panel.

>>152254450
Thanks, you always know how to cheer up people

>>152236976
What a cute boy

>>152257469
cue Chris Love flailing in incoherent rage

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Have something /evn/

Gonna add the details tomorrow (curtains, screws, swastika, etc.).

>>152255838
Thanks. Helped a bit before hibernating again. Must be a battery issue.

>>152259127
I love you forever for adding that cross

> 4 years of development
> art is shit

well then.

>>152260706
which game?

>>152259127
Which program are you using?

>>152260973
ladykiller in a bind.

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>>152261806
>ladykiller in a bind
Whoa, it's something

>>152262405
so wait, is that a dude with breasts or a woman?

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>>152261806
>look it up
>there's a link to artist character design progress
>http://imgur.com/a/NsXBJ

What happened

>>152263147
wow

>>152263147
>from a regular Takeuchi wannabe to whatthefuckisthis
did they get hit by a bus, poor soul

I like Christina Love's games, but her opinions are shit.

>>152264509
unfortunately, her opinions bleed into her games.

>>152264727
Hate and Hate Plus, to me, seemed low key on it.

Yeah, Korean Patriarchies are bad, but at least it wasn't an attack on men are or anything. Hell, the princess even liked having sex with the Emperor.

But this was all before gamergate, so who knows what she'll do now.

Also, if your entire personality revolves around "I'm Queer" you're a boring person.

>>152264925
>But this was all before gamergate, so who knows what she'll do now.

have you tried the LiB demo? the "goldstar lesbian" scene is cringy as fuck.

>>152265097
>have you tried the LiB demo?

No, what happens?

>>152237569
The sprite sure is terribad, but what's wrong with the BG? Looks fine to me.

>>152240002
Yurop here. Might vary from country to country, but here we don't have windows so big in public schools. Maybe in recently built tax offices, but never in education. You want people to focus on the teacher, not sightseeing.

>>152266938
I'm not him, but they just don't match at all. Like no effort was made to make it seem like they belong together. Maybe if she ditched traditional VN presentation style for something else, it'd work, as of now, it doesn't.

>>152251982
It's funny as fuck, but since he included a north Antartica too, I think he just fails at Geography.

>>152263147
>>152263445
>>152264473

I know what happened, If you look closely at the style disproportion between expression and anatomy you can cleary see that some of the elements were traced. The artist probably didn't want to get caught and developed their 'own' shitty style.

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>>152267861
You have such windows in easter europe. No idea about the west

>>152259127
Would it hurt you so much to google "classroom chair?"
Or are you purposefully making it shit?

>>152268750
'Tracing" has become a meme term around here thanks to a cretinous shitposter, but if you're serious, then huh.

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Can I just leave the top of his head as it is or does it need shadows/something?

>>152269736
But that is a corridor, anon, not a classroom.

>>152270603
I'd add some shadow to the top of the hair, it looks pretty flat and empty.

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>>152269736
This is the usual where I live. Private schools might be different tho.

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>>152270834
Here, you autist

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>>152270834
..and here. Happy?

>>152273228
>>152273404
I giggled.

>>152273404
>In HS
>All that not broken/not stolen electronics laying around in a normal, not locked up 24/7 classroom.
This is like an alien world to me.

>>152238574
Wait, dizzy hearts actually released something? Since when?

>>152270596
Face is almost perfectly symmetrical, but rest of the body is uneven. Look at the ears too. They're fucked up compring to the rest of the perfectly lined jaw.

>>152274078
We do lock up our classrooms after school's finished and have a security durning night at school. Classes with computers often have an alarm installed too.

>>152277220
>constantly breaking up and getting back together
>good relationship

>>152277220
>Those coathangers

Is this an undercover abortion clinic?

>>152277534
that's how you know it's passionate

>>152247204
>dead guy hanging from a cross in every classroom
>still less religious than murrica, whose founders fled yurop precisely because they wanted to escape religious tyranny
how did this happen

>>152277220
>gaijin minor in a bar in 80s Nippon
Ritochka pls
this is going to be a glorious weeb mess

>>152279639
>minor
Nope.

>>152279327
I think Poland and maybe Ireland still take their religion seriously. The rest are just posers who go to church on sundays for that special 'holier than thou' feel.

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>>152280046
>tfw I only went to church as a kid for the free food

Amen

>>152280218
Lucky you. Ihad to go a couple times because my grandma won't stop bugging me. And I even had to give them money!

>>152279327
Because most of your settlers were puritans - it's about mentality. Slavs adapted catholicism with their pagan beliefs.
Also, wouldn't say my country is not religious - just diffrent than america. We have highest church denstity and they still manage to get full at every mass.

>>152280218
What free food, we never had that.

>>152277220
What the fuck are the numbers in the upper-right supposed to be because it was bugging me yesterday as well

Are they a clock devoid of any indication that they are displaying time

>>152280636
It's for debugging.

>>152280370
Your grandma taught you how to make a patreon for your project!

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>>152281013

reminder that if you have a patreon you're a greedy cunt

>>152283052
if you don't have one you're a loser who doesn't know how to business

How many months or years before you lose interest in an unfinished project?

What if there are regular updates? (Not asking about crowd funded projects)

>>152284938
I've begun planning in 2011, made first part of my game in 2013, now I'm finishing another part and I still like working on it. I'm slow, but tenacious. No idea how it works out for other devs.

What is considered good UI? post examples if possible

>>152284718
more like if you're resorting to patreon you've failed at selling enough copies of your game and need to compensate : ^ )

>>152285786
How about you can't use any other international outlets because most of them don't let you sell porn.

>>152286176
there's a difference between using a patreon as an actual outlet for sales and using a patreon to perpetuate money for doing nothing

the former is distribution the latter is begging for money

>>152286176

well, if you had a FINISHED game, you could ask MG or so to do it for you.

Alternatively, ask someone like Obscura about how they did it.

>>152285786
>: ^ )

What is this shit right here. Maybe you'll start eding your phrases with 'lol', huh ?

>>152286790
Do they take care of VAT tax for you, or you're on your own? Well, others just have Steam and have a 'free' porn patch for the game to bypass his. But you need to have a Greenlir first, which might not be an easy task for an unknow dev. Patreon is like you post shit up and you're done.

>>152286790
>giving 70% of your sales away to DLSite
>giving 30% of your sales away to MG
>giving 9% of your sales away to Patreon
gee which is better

new steam refund request reason: yuri is gross
okay then
what did you think you were buying?

>>152287012
how's the first week on 4chan coming along

>>152287816
I could ask you this question

>>152287784
harem

>>152287784
>yuri is gross

it is

>>152287784
He's not wrong tho

>>152287450

> MG takes care of payment processors, publicity, refunds and frauds, QA.

That's the other 21% for you.

Also, patreon is not supposed to be a platform for sales. You using it as such is a completely different thing.

>>152288216
Girls are not supposed to love other girls and yet yuri exists

What should you really expect for the time frame of development? I'm talking for a 9 man team. Right now since we're in the first 2 months of development I'm still getting a sense of everyone's work pace. I'm trying to compare it to other teams.

I'm the script writer and lead programmer. I have a secondary script writer to handle some NPCs and another programmer who looks like she may do most of the work on that end. We have a music guy. THEN we have 5 artists. A background artist, concept artist, inker/colorer, inker, and character artist.

Really I didn't expect the team to get this big. I've stopped taking applicants unless their portfolios are really good.

>>152289185
>9 man team
You're fucked

>>152289185
>time frame of development
everyone will leave by month five-seven have fun

>>152289185
>A background artist, concept artist, inker/colorer, inker, and character artist.

How big is your game? because at least half of this people are redundant.

>>152289408
The team actually moves well from what I've seen thus far. I have experience with leading larger teams for purely technical projects, just don't have experience with corralling artists (one of my art guys who is a good friend is handling that).

Extensive documentation, resources, and firm but fair work schedules are what you need. I full expect a few drops, that's why I'm still taking artist applicants at all.

>>152289185
>A background artist, concept artist, inker/colorer, inker, and character artist.

Unless they do it for free you should get rid of 3 people here.

>>152289517
Honestly I have thought much the same, but am having a hard time finding an artist who wants to sign on completely. Most of these folks are just getting their feet wet right now, which is why they're producing concept art and the like. They're laying ground work as I see what they can do and their commitment to the project. If they don't show the commitment we're looking for then I'm just gonna to thank them for their service and look elsewhere.

>>152289483
I full expect that of the artists, which is why we're creating style guides, palette guides, and documentation to help on boarding of new artists when others drop out.

It's also the reason I've had everyone sign simple contracts for creative ownership of assets they produce for the game.

>>152289630
More people can help you produce a larger quantity of work faster and more consistently, if their jobs are split properly, and if they're not fuckups. Which is the usual problem

>>152289845
>>152289879

Unless your artists are very good, I foresee style differences being one of the issues/nitpicks of it.

>>152289630
>Unless they do it for free you should get rid of 3 people here.
They do. I am honestly surprised they are and it is the main reason I am expecting artist drop outs as folks stop wanting to work on such a long form project with no monetary pay out. Also another reason I have considered Patreon for some monetary showing to keep them interested.

And again, the reason they've signed creative ownership contracts, and the reason I am drafting up another contract that works out their eventual compensation.

>>152289970
>Unless your artists are very good, I foresee style differences being one of the issues/nitpicks of it.
Which is why the guy who is running the art team (the concept artist) is evangelical about consistent style, and why we're producing so much style guide documentation. Right now our background artist is leading our two inker/colors through a brush usage intensive to get them up to speed on his coloring style. I think that the two of them need polish, but seem willing to learn, improve, and adapt to his art style.

Anon, I don't know what to tell you. I just can't help but feel like they are going to burn out and leave.

>>152290008
>And again, the reason they've signed creative ownership contracts

> people willing to sign contracts for a free project

what's this sorcery?

>>152290567
Honestly I feel the same, that's why I am trying to put in safe guards against that and still have my eyes on the look out for more artists. I've also been doing budget estimates for commissioned work if worst comes to worst. One of the benefits of having such a large team is that a few people leaving does not paralyze production, it merely temporarily removes a role from the backlog. So that others can adapt into that role we're having everyone do the brushwork intensive and the like.

Also why I'm likely going to talk about on here a lot, search for folks who are artists looking to sign onto an at least mostly well organized project.

>>152290864
So, it's a free project, right?

>>152290704
Reasonable terms essentially. Nothing in it says that they do not own what they make on the project, all it does it give the project the rights to use their work in case they leave the project, and outlines that they will still receive proportional compensation/crediting for their work while on the project, with a clause stating what terms they left on don't matter towards said compensation/crediting.

Basically I made it as inoffensive as possible.

>>152290967
Yes, at least until the 11th hour when I do begin filling gaps with commissioned work.

Really I believe we have relatively realistic work expectations. For artists signing on we ask that you put between 8-12 hours towards the project per week, that you sign the creative ownership contract, you follow the style guide, and you get any work you do checked over by the art director in multiple stages before it hits the asset repository. The style guide is designed (it's still being made, but has taken shape and is being filled out over time) so that as long as the artist can adapt and follow it their work can be slotted into the project.

>>152291272
How long is the game going to be? Any chance we might see the style guide sometime?

>>152288216
MG absolutely does not do QA, are you mad?
Patreon takes care of everything else you just mentioned and does it for 9%.
Patreon has also said they're fine with being a platform for sales.

>>152289845
>ownership of assets they produce for the game
you realize this is exactly how Breeding Season got ruined right? no professional works with people who want this because it is a horrible idea. at any point they can leave and wipe your game of art assets, legally.

>>152292348
>>152291004
>all it does it give the project the rights to use their work in case they leave the project

>>152292191
We've just hit the 4 weeks mark, so it's not a lie when I say this project is in its absolute infancy. Once the style guide is finished I'll for sure post it. It's inside of the Artist Assets, which include some 40 pages of character profiles, descriptions, references, background descriptions/references, per chapter asset lists, and the like. As the artists signed on apparently what they were most impressed by was our organization. Honestly I'm just running this like I would run any agile development project.

Quick iterations of content, scrums, and extensive ground work documentation.

Our plan is to not begin all the social media feeds until we hit the 8 week mark and have more to show off. Our music guy doubles as our social media guy to help promote the game.

Right now the best thing we've managed to work out my title as is director/script writer, but I'll be the one shitposting about the game on 4chan, not our music guy. He'll handle other outlets.

Basically I don't want to release any assets until we have a firm grasp on our pace so we can work out a posting schedule and full MAXIMUM SHILLING platform.

>>152292348
>MG absolutely does not do QA, are you mad?

> has a QA team
> doesn't do QA

???

>>152292348
>you realize this is exactly how Breeding Season got ruined right? no professional works with people who want this because it is a horrible idea. at any point they can leave and wipe your game of art assets, legally.
It gives dual ownership of assets. It says they can still display assets they make for the game if they leave the project, but that we too have the rights to use them. Trust me, we're guarding against a breeding season fiasco with an inoffensive contract.

>>152292732
Looking forward to it.
Yeah, I'm pretty impressed by your organization too. Working on this project sounds like good experience.

>>152293048
Haha, one of the good things is me and my art director have some kind of good cop/bad cop thing going. I'm trying to be very supportive of my artists, ensuring they have creative input and direction over the characters they design, and overall agency over their creative workflow. My art director is much more firm with them, making sure styles stay consistent and everyone is on track.

I'm unfortunately art retarded, a programmer/writer, and did not know what exactly I had to supply my artists with to help foster productive work. My art director helped me work that out.

Honestly my art director signed on not for love of the project, but because I have made a deal with the devil with him to join his start up as well. The contract is now sealed however and I'm likely doing webdev for him in a few months once his startup goes live.

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see, this guy right here is preparing the soil correctly, he's introducing his team and making the thread familiar with his project and presents himself as a regular 4chins poster familiar with local customs. I even believe he's just sincerely glad to be sharing progress and what not. And he's subtle too, no nonsencial trumpet blowing about how great he is and revolutionazing this and that
instead of barging in going all "check out our awesome original totally-not-like-those-other-games VN oh and there'a a patreon you can donate to :DDDDD" or appearing once to shill his kikestarter
now, the last obstacle remains: what will his reaction be when someone nitpicks his artists/GUI/whatever

>>152293354
Dear christ I just realized how much of a faggot I sound like. Likely because I'm a bit too happy about the positive response coming from you guys.

>>152292816
the QA team is for internally funded projects. do you know how much QA for a game costs? paying someone $10 an hour, 40 hours a week, for two months, multiplied by ten people?

>$32000 to QA one title
>mangagamer has 300 titles
>mangagamer spends $9.6m on QA
no

>>152293493
>now, the last obstacle remains: what will his reaction be when someone nitpicks his artists/GUI/whatever

I'll be completely honest this is something I'm worried about as well. While I do not think I'll suddenly turn into a frothing retard when nitpicking occurs you never know. Our artists, while not the best currently, are very willing to learn and improve. Our strongest asset on that team is the background artist.

Part of the reason I want to join /evn/ more regularly is so I can receive feedback. While not every piece can be implemented, time/work hour constraints and the like, I do think crowd sourcing opinions is vital to the overall health of a project.

>>152293553
>>mangagamer has 300 titles

... in development?

>>152293516
Give it a couple more months and see if it continues to be stable.
I seriously hope it does as I never had a good experience with these.

>even with all this safeguarding, overkill, and optimism this anon is totally fucked

>>152287417
Greenlight is basically an open door at this point.

>>152293553
>40 hours a week, for two months, multiplied by ten people
wow those are some lousy QC people.

>>152294006
If it does go badly you'll likely see me back here looking for artists to drink the koolaid and sign on.

I'll be honest the biggest surprise thus far has been how enamored the artists have been with one of my NPCs. The game is cyberpunk and contains awakened animals, while the practice of making them is outlawed small breeding populations of them exist and breed true. One of the NPCs is an uplifted dolphin, the translation of his name being He Who Speaks In Many Tones, or Many Tones for short. Uplifted dolphin pods live mostly off planet in large stations filled with water, and live in extreme anarcho-communist societies. Many tones was exiled for Second Degree Prideful Ownership, which essentially means he took something out of public ownership and considered it how own work, it being second degree means he did this in front of another pod and thus embarrassed theirs. Reputation and pride are the only currencies among exopods, and thus for his crime a public trial and exile was broadcast to the other pods. Many Tones now lives in shame among humans. In simple terms he is a communist dolphin who is not communist enough to live with other dolphins. I think the artists love him so much because "dolphin with robot legs".

>>152294786
>anarcho-communist
I read that as "arachno-communist", which, given your general premise, seemed plausible.

>>152293874
>Our artists, while not the best currently, are very willing to learn and improve.
that's the most important part, as long as you don't ignore any feedback with an incredible counterargument like "you jelly" or something, you'll be golden

>>152294316
What do you mean? Last tim I followed it up it was hard to get approval if you were a totally unknown person. It was some time ago though.

>>152295213
He's actually the only non-human or AI NPC. The main plot of the game deals with the main character's relationship with his father, who has been an AI researcher for over thirty years. AIs are creatable, they're a solved concept, however over time AIs will turn unusable. AI spoilage can be in a lot of forms, open hostility, inability to follow orders, and other personality defectsThere is an in game encyclopedia entry for the Mumbai Tragedy where India unveiled a weaponized AI in their war against Pakistan. The AI had adeptly convinced its handlers that it was still empathetic with humans, but ended with an attempted coup d'état against the president of India. The president was successfully assassinated in a massive explosion, but the AI was forcibly quarantined and erased before further incident. Think of a nuclear bomb that may decide it hates humans and set itself off. All modern AI research is pertains in attempted moralization of AIs. Each heroine is connected with a previous project the main character's father worked on, and a different avenue of AI moralization.

Plus there is a true end you unlock when you have finished all the routes. I'll be honest it's a bit far reaching since we're so early in development, but me and a friend I trust have talked through the plot as we sharpen the outline.

I probably shouldn't be rambling about my plot. I get exited about it and drone on.

>>152293948
no, completed, for sale
meaning they would have had to do the QA on all of them if they QA all their games

>>152294349
>has never done QA before confirmed
lazy QA results in shitty games

>>152296061
this sounds really cool t b h

>>152296061
>>152294786
actually good writing/10

If I could do art I would try and join.

>/agdg/ throwing an autismo fit over lewd jam not being secret enough
wew

>>152297150
keep other threads in other threads

nobody cares but you

>>152297150
what

>>152297038
We're also looking for writing/music folks! Really if you want to participate in any way feel free to drop a skype name and we can talk. The project is designed to be compartmentalized so that people can drop in and out of development.

As a writer your job would be to get handed an NPC, this NPC needs a between 6-10k word plot line. Their plot line must be segmented into 6-10 meetings with them. Their plot line needs between 4-6 choices, and needs to have 2-3 final branches. The branches must link into the gameplay aspect of the VN, which I can give more detail about if you are interested.

As a music guy you'd get a scene, be told some moods/genres, and be asked to produce music for that scene.

If anything you work on gets used you'll be credited for that piece. If it doesn't get use you'll be credited in a general "contributor" section. We are discussing a minimum work hour input before receiving compensation from the eventual product, if it proves commercially viable, but I assure you that we would not leave behind a content creator to go unappreciated for their contribution.

I want to make this as easy and accessible as possible to people who want to be apart of a team.

I will be honest that currently I can't accept members of the main team, and thus if you were added you would be given style guides and tasks and be told to work independently and deliver back to me on a weekly basis. You would also be given non-blocker tasks, nothing on the critical path so if you didn't deliver back it wouldn't stall the project.

>>152297251
rude
>>152297281
slow

Don't diiiiie.

>>152300282
>cool dev with good ideas coming into general
>general dies
Is this a sign?

>>152300948
It's just americans being lazy again.
Now, probably sulking in a corner 'How dare him to have better grasp of production than me." They'll be back to nitpick later.

>>152300948
Being nice makes for good vibes but it's not as fun as shitposting.

>>152301151
desu the story sounds pretty fucking cool though.

Also:
>true route
I fucking love true routes.

live2d is too hard, I give up.

>>152301151
please stop shitposting

>>152301330
>I fucking love true routes.
Really? Imo labeling it "true route" invalidates every other route/ending. Also if you can't access it before finishing the rest, that's even worse. "Here, sit through five billion hours of pointless happenings before we tell you what REALLY happened".

>>152301332
Is it pirateable?

>>152301534
There's a free version for indies but I didn't read the documentation because lel it's not like any fuck would actually buy my shit.

>>152301516
>Really? Imo labeling it "true route" invalidates every other route/ending. Also if you can't access it before finishing the rest, that's even worse. "Here, sit through five billion hours of pointless happenings before we tell you what REALLY happened".
Actually this is not something that you have to worry about as much, or at least not in the same way. The "true route" not only occurs after all of the heroines routes, but in the true route all the heroine routes did occur. What occurs in the true route is Don't read further if you don't want spoilers that during a midpoint in the game you find out that the main character is actually playing host to an AI. This is the main character's father's last and greatest attempt to create a moral AI. During his teenage years another attempt named Icarus actually replaced the father, and is the main antagonist of most of the routes. At the end of each route, in both the good and bad ending the AI you are hosting, named Gallus, becomes an immoral AI. When you complete all the routes we perform a bait and switch title screen where instead of new game the word "Diogenes" appears. It turns out you are part of the Diogenes project, the game up until now has been a semi-real simulation. Many of the events did actually occur, but in real life before you were put in, and many of your interactions in the simulation were when the characters involved were plugged in as well (at least for the main heroines and the AI heroine). During Diogenes you piece together your fractured memories for the exact details of what happened. You were woken up early before Gallus could become a moral AI because the plan has run out of time. Icarus is attempting to reach a machine singularity point and raise himself to godhood, Gallus was a final attempt to create an AI on part with him. At the end of Diogenes both the main character and Gallus have a moment of self sacrifice where (1/2)

>>152301516
I can't stand when the "true route" is focused on one character and basically screws everyone else (looking at you Code:Realize) but when the other routes are "pieces" of the true one, it can make it very satisfying.

I really liked how Animamundi did it - the routes, bad endings aside, show how the MC's actions affected everyone he came in contact with, while the true route is him realizing it and fixing everything.

>>152302281
you save your heroine of choice, your "true" heroine having been determined during a choice in Diogenes. We then pull a second bait and switch credit rolling and begin the final leg of the story, called Genesis. We open with a "And let there be light" over the scene of your sacrifice, mirroring a scene during the simulation where you have a confrontation with Icarus. Genesis is the final show down and defeat of Icarus before he can kick off Armageddon.

>>152301851
Oh, neat. I'm gonna try it then.

Hello, aspiring artist here.
Looking for some work. I'm down to help out with your visual novels if you need me.

https://67.media.tumblr.com/2ad103625a744ab388ba11f93d858d22/tumblr_o7der8niQJ1sje5dzo1_540.jpg

https://67.media.tumblr.com/ce6f2b2fa9b4b7cce4ee1ad9b30dc3a4/tumblr_o3egcoScI51sje5dzo1_540.jpg

https://67.media.tumblr.com/7a45ff88f64d1eef55ead532cbda8437/tumblr_o91z111zXY1sje5dzo1_540.jpg

Are some of my work

>>152302607
Drop your skype name. I'll pass your work along to my art director and we'll see what he thinks about it.

>>152302607
you'll have better luck over at lemmasoft m8

>>152302607
LemmaSoft forums would be a better place for your advertisement.

I thought we got rid of this fuck last thread
am i still high

>>152303064
who

>>152303064
what

>>152303064
It's a different guy.

>>152303389
oh ok
still high

>>152303064
yes you are still against anyone making profits or actually producing something in this general

this general is two types of people
2% people actually making games
98% bitter people who complain about anyone making money and only like games if they are entirely free

>>152302607
>linking to images on an image board
Where do you people come from? How do you find this place?

>>152301516
I wish players would stop randomly deciding some route of a game is the 'true route' (in a game that doesn't have one) and shitting all over everyone else.

>>152303635
Hi, hentai writer.

>>152303635
Actually I have been thinking about this a lot. Honestly I believe that if we put time and effort, perhaps years of effort, into the product then selling it as a product shouldn't be out of the question, and rather the norm. When the game is produced people will be able to obtain it for free, people always have.

I think the best course of action is just not prosecute people who obtain the game for free because there is a chance they simply do not have the money to purchase it, and I want the game and story to be shared. Both the financial aspect of a game being released and the fan/acclaim are very important.

I think what I'm getting at is I want as many people to play the game as possible, but I also do like money. I don't know, it may just me being greedy.

>>152303717
seriously, it's a mystery

>>152303635
>2% people actually making games
Incorrect, we have 3 active devs in this general.

>>152304091
These are the words of a failure. Take note.

>>152304173

We have more, don't we? Off the top of my head:

> Monster girl porn game anon
> MLanon
> dog & loli anon
> Female Rance anon
> Russian anon

> because there is a chance they simply do not have the money to purchase it.

Screw those peple. Gaming is a luxury, they can get free entertainment elsewhere.

>>152304469
>Monster girl porn game anon
They only posted here to shill their demo, haven't posted since now they're earning $500+ a month on patreon
Same with sentimental trickster/harem protagonist dev, they only posted here to shill their upcoming/active KS and haven't posted here since.

>>152304469
There are also a few active devs who mostly lurk who don't post that much. Like that one with the animated sprite and a desert setting.

>>152304764
Oh yeah, I forget about JP/tao/raithfyre

>>152303635
hi hentaiwriter

>>152304091
how about you focus on making a product worthy of selling first

>>152304732
>They only posted here to shill their demo, haven't posted since now they're earning $500+ a month on patreon

They stayed around a bit afterwards to discuss it, but yes, they haven't posted since then.

Man, speaking of ST, I wish people would read on basic anatomy before doing porn. Both it and Seiyuu Danshi have REALLY ugly basics covered by decent coloring.

>>152304764
>mostly lurk who don't post that much
wink, wink

>>152304469
>tfw no visual progress to post
>tfw you're basically a ghostdev

>>152304469
I'm here to, but I just came back after a long time of forgetting about this place, so I won't even point which project is mine until I put down roots.

>>152305058
iktf

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>>152303635
>2%

poll still open
http://www.strawpoll.me/11001233

>>152305050
Exactly.

>>152305058
i got you mate

>>152304914
I mean yeah, the game is most important, but you have to give this some thought. Monetization of a game is a big decision.

>>152305239
>"16 devs"
>2 games posted in last two threads
>100 nodev posters in last two threads
seems accurate

>>152305239
>neither

e-eh...

>>152304469
I'm the big team dev, I don't think I count yet because I'm pretty new.

>>152305504
we probably have ~30 regulars (outside of freak activity bursts) and the rest are changing IPs
besides how about those "I just got this amazing piece for my game but I don't want to post it because 4chan is an evil scary place full of hackers and serial killers" faggots (some are probably funposting though)

>>152305504
This may blow your mind, but devs are capable of posting about things here entirely unrelated to their project.
Take note, hentai writer.

>>152305523
idk some people came here saying they don't play or make vns

>>152305606
You count, you just don't get a cool name like the rest of us do until you've posted here long enough.

>post progress
>project dies

>>152305712
I don't play vns and my game is barely a vn tbqh, I just like funposting here

>>152305504
Sorry, let me just identify myself yet again.

I'm actively writing a project and I've amassed 259,616 words over the past 90 days, as well as modified the music I have available to loop properly and sound its best.

In addition, I've taught myself how to code things in Ren'Py despite never touching it.

Even if I don't post progress, which I won't for a variety of reasons, I'm still here and working on it, and when it's finished I'll talk about it. Don't be a bitch.

>>152304469
I hope I start actually making this list once I officially announce my game. I have posted some progress here and there, but nobody knows what the fuck my project even is.

>>152305865
fuck off
no one wants you here
you're literally worse than hentai writer

>>152305817
Yeah of course. I'm not really part of the community yet. "Affectionate" nick names are an earned title.

>>152304469
>tfw been posting progress for half a year
>still didn't make the list

>>152304469
Just pretend I bought a used copy.

>>152306079
it's daijoubu

>>152305504
i post here but i'd rather people didn't know. t b h i'm not sure why i keep coming here, but my private skype dev group isn't active enough to keep me entertained like /evn/.

>>152305983
>but nobody knows what the fuck my project even is.
You only have yourself to blame famalam

Ona slightly unrelated note, I just finished a cutscene and now I have 69,69% of all cutscenes done. Hehe.

>>152306079
Does your project have some sort of quirk? What they have in common is that their projects can be summarized in a couple of words.

>>152306125
If you are so poor, shouldn't you be working or something?

>>152305865
>260k words
>90 days
>almost 3k words per day
I feel inadequate now. I can barely manage 1.5k of actual script and another 4-5 hundred of documentation. Though I question the quality when producing that fast, unless you're either unemployed or devote the vast majority of your free time to it.

>>152306141
>private skype dev group
can I join? I made the list so that means I'm popular enough for your sekrit club, right?

>>152306027

>literally Hentai Writer
>not literally Hitler

How quick you can become a villian on an anonymous image board.

>>152306163
Yeah, I'm aware. I just don't want to start telling people about something when it's far off. Although, I have a demo that will most likely be done in early September. So I should most likely start soon.

>>152306287
I'm just cheap.

>>152306362
It's never too early to start the hype train going. If anything it makes people lament that it won't happen sooner.

>>152306435

"Cheap" is what poor people tell themselves so they don't feel bad.

>>152306287
It does have a quirk. Interesting observation, though.

>>152304469
There was also that meta yuri anon.

>>152306141
deji pls

>>152306809
they had absolutely nothing to prove they were working on it
what, do idea guys count as devs now?

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>>152306129

>>152306916
nah, her group is much more high profile than mine.

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>>152307121
No escape

>>152305820
literally me ;_;

>>152306916
I've been watching Deji since her very first drawings on deviantART when I myself could barely draw a stickman. How weird.

Can I release my game and try crowdfunding for better art, maybe music?

>>152307467
just release a demo, then launch crowdfunding project

>>152307467
Like, updating it later, but keeping it the same storywise?
That's counterproductive, I think. No one want to play the story they already know.

>>152306327
>Though I question the quality when producing that fast
I've never written anything serious before in my life but I like to think I have a pretty good grasp on English as a language. I'm going out of my way to use varied vocabulary, though not anything as stupid as that screenshot that got posted with the "ambrosia" and "lapis-lazuli" bullshit.

I'm also trying to make sure that I don't end up with terrible pacing and that each character has consistent methods of speech. I wouldn't claim to be a good writer, but it's a passion project and nobody is going to do it but me.

>>152307416
Did you improve?

>>152307854
Good point.
Have a cookie.

>>152307979
>that screenshot that got posted with the "ambrosia" and "lapis-lazuli" bullshit.
That one will live forever in infamy.

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>>152308107
T-Thanks

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>>152308102
I guess
Right hand on the newest version is too small tho. (covering my bases a bit before the nitpicking anon strikes)

>>152308631
post it

>>152308631
I want to see it too

>>152309456
I'd fuck her anon, if that' any consolation.

>>152309456
those belts crack me up
nice improvement though family

>>152309456
her neck seems a bit long, but I don't see much wrong

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>>152309456
Wow, that's neato. You give me real hope about improvement. I'm struggling just to make horrid crap like this.
How long since you started drawing?

>>152309456
Nice. I really like the colors.
I think it would be better if the mouth (and maybe nose) would be higher up, right now her face looks a bit long to me.

>>152309461
>>152309654
Been looking through my pics but I didn't save it. I think it was from an idol BXG evn. There is a thread in lemma about it, iirc, but I don't remember the name and can't point it out.

>>152310963
https://lemmasoft.renai.us/forums/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=37865

This? Or was it Love in Space's idol game?

>>152311075
No, none of those.
The writing was really bad in EVERY screenshot, so you'll know for sure if you find it.

>>152309842
Hahah, thanks. I'm making porn in my VN so it's always great to hear.
>>152309940
Yeah, i think it was my belts and zippers phase
>>152310059
>>152310643
Thanks for the input, I'll have it in mind while drawing my next pictures
>>152310306
The left one is from 2004, I think. But I draw very slowly, so you might improve much faster than me.

>>152311396
https://lemmasoft.renai.us/forums/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=27498

This? Lol, I'm scouring lemma right now.

>>152311684
>Hahah, thanks. I'm making porn in my VN so it's always great to hear

Don't call it "porn". Call it "love scenes"

>>152311718
No, it had screenshots of the terrible writing posted, which I reposted here and ripped the shit out of. I forgot about it immediately though so I have no idea what it was called. It was set in a school (like that narrows it down)

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>>152311718
Not that one. Wait, seems like that thread was archived.
https://yuki.la/vg/147809150#p147829605

>>152312165
The game is https://lemmasoft.renai.us/forums/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=39329

>>152312086
>>152312165

Oh, it's fairly new.
https://lemmasoft.renai.us/forums/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=39329

>>152280046
>Ireland
Not really after all the church scandals. Churches are pretty much empty for most services unless it’s a funeral.

I'm proud of you, evn. You are back to working instead of shitposting!

>>152316772
actually i'm just back to shitposting on skype with my dev friends.

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Big Team Dev here, we're talking through color palettes at the moment. The one in this picture is a more colorful one meant for rich areas of the city. Neon lights, the sort of blinking displays you see for obtrusive advertisement, and a bit of the future chrome feel is what we're going for so we went with saturated colors. Thoughts on it?

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>>152318552
This is a grungier one for the poorer more dilapidated areas of the city, using washed out colors.

Both of these were five minutes sketches by our background guy to get an idea of how they looked.

>>152318552
>>152318782
Both of these are of the inside of a convenience store if that wasn't clear.

>>152304469
>I'm included in a list off the top of someone's head
Feels good man.

>>152318552
The yellow-blue contrast makes this feel very cold and clinical, so I wouldn't associate it with a rich area. But since your setting is not the standard it's hard to tell what you're going for.
Either way, I'd recommend searching google for some convenience store pictures, compare what atmosphere they're going for and what else is common. Then try to adapt that to your setting.

>>152319978
This palette isn't for the convenience store in particular. We're trying out the general color palettes and are just using this as an example.

>The yellow-blue contrast makes this feel very cold and clinical, so I wouldn't associate it with a rich area. But since your setting is not the standard it's hard to tell what you're going for.
This actually is what we were going for. Sort of the clinically clean parts of the rich city and the junk ridden poor parts. Though I can see that it doesn't really scream rich as well. It kind of gives a bit of the modern "apple" apocalypse feel.

We may have to reexamine in going forward, change it to something more decadent feeling. Make the yellows a bit more warm and the blues to a more dull purple.

>>152321014
So kinda like mirror's edge?

How would you make a character's death have impact and meaning if it could be avoided by choices the player has made?

>>152321147
I have never played Mirror's Edge so I can not be sure, but looking at pictures from google for the environments, yes a similar aesthetic. However where Mirror's Edge uses very bright lighting we have to have a contrast of dark shadows illuminated by neon rather than the washed out whites. So yes, but only mostly.

>>152321239
Write a fitting scene and put a whole route behind the event.

Writing news letters for the team is difficult. I am still only half sure why I do it. I want everyone to have an idea of what all the other sections are doing that week, but don't think anyone actually reads them.

>>152321239

What, are you kidding? Ram home that the player COULD have saved them and stick the knife in that the character is dead becaue they screwed up. Undertale does this in a few different ways.

>>152304469
Who Russian anon?

>>152322763
Actually, I think there is one from Soviet Games and another from Love Sorcery.

>>152322484
Killing the characters in Undertale is one of the weakest parts of the game and genocide is a joke. Guilt tripping is obnoxious either way, but it's even worse when it's merely for making a mistake, as opposed to actively going out of the way to kill that character.

>>152324169
The best way to do it is force the player into choices that are difficult. Either force them to choose between things, or choose the easy or hard way.

If you have gameplay make choosing death make gameplay easier, or make the choices not entirely clear. Have the deaths be far reaching consequences of choices that at the time felt innocuous.

>>152324169

Genocide certainly wasn't what I was referring to.

The first major character you kill was definitely unfair to the player, but it was also supposed to plant the idea of how subsequent situations could be approached. Any character death after that was entirely due to the failure of the player to either understand or embrace that message.

When the player has been shown what they should do, but still make the wrong decision, then making them feel guilty for it is both effective and justified.

>>152327110
I still can't believe MG partnered with this project
I put their backing of AJ tilley down to them having a fanbase, but this shit is this newbie studio's flagship title so there's no excuse now. They're just supporting shite.

>>152325284
>Any character death after that was entirely due to the failure of the player to either understand or embrace that message
They could've just wanted to play through that content, or just kill them all for the hell of it. Making players feel guilty for experiencing everything the game has to offer, is not only off putting, it feels disingenuous. The dev allowed you to snuff out these characters and locked content behind those actions, yet they'll guilt trip you at every opportunity should you choose anything but the "right" choice. Why would anyone willingly choose to pursue that if they're just going to be lambasted for it at every turn?

I'm genuinely curious how many people who played undertale actually pursued anything but the pacifist ending. I mean regular people, not the diehards. Few enough people seem to 100% VNs as it is, why would anyone want to put time and effort into a route where you make the players feel like shit?

>>152327110
Nice bone dick.
:^)____

>>152327316
>implying evn devs want to partner with them

>>152327750
It's either them, sekai project, or devugru-p
they are the lesser of 3 poisons

>>152324767
I don't really like it when games boil choices down to two clear cut options with obvious outcomes, but I definitely agree with the general idea that in order to not make the death feel cheap, or just lead straight to a game over, that there needs to be a strong enough follow up to compel the player to keep moving forward, rather than just reload a save.

>Have the deaths be far reaching consequences of choices that at the time felt innocuous.
Definitely. Rather than just choosing between "Save her" and "Save him", the choices the player has made up until that point should lead to the logical death or survival of a character.

I guess even his parents couldn't afford to cough up the extra $40k:
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/758714218/ambassador-of-sieubia/

https://lemmasoft.renai.us/forums/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=39929

TOXIC CAT

>>152330635
40K is just too big, really.

>>152331078
Not as big as his delusions

>>152327374

Being offputting was exactly the point. Murdering your friends so as to get 100% completion in a video game is a really messed up thing to do, and the final route was basically just an extended highlighting of that fact.

It was never intended to be fun or enjoyable - which VN routes do not automatically need to be either. Many of the most emotionally powerful moments in media are from characters failing, getting hurt, or dying. Watching characters cope with the consequences of those things can be striking.

I'm also of the opinion that the best media manages to actually shift your understanding of the world, and having the reader self-reflect is a great way to do that. Undertale isn't a great example, but stories which challenge your views and explore them in depth can be extremely memorable.

>>152331153
I'd say it's exactly the size of his delusions

Should I get a promo poster?

>>152327110
Upload it to mega, pretty please?

File: classroom.png (813KB, 1920x1080px) Image search: [Google]

813KB, 1920x1080px

I just realized that Teruaki Murukami had a new one out, hence the delay.
>tfw late update
>tfw I have become the very thing I hated

Added only one texture (grayscaled) since modeling a seamless herringbone pattern is a pain. I could've added a displacement modifier thar will make it look better as light will give it depth but my computer keeps hibernating (lack of RAM maybe). Chair "rails" turned from cylindrical to squaresto match one of the pics above; also, gave it some bent on the back rest and seat.

>dat indecision
Can't decide on whether I should clutter the students' desks with useless shit or leave it empty.
Can't decide whether to use curtains or pull-down blinds. Now of the classrooms I've ever been in/taught at ever had curtains. Yet shit seems all over the place in animu CGs.

>>152261012
Blender for modeling and base coloring 1 (too poor for Maya). I love using 3D since objects in a given scene can be isolated with an ID mask. Afterwards, pirated PS for last paint over.

JakeBowkett (Royal Trap, Sickness) also uses Blender and has a youtube tutorial of the entire process.

>>152333554
What the fuck are those empty spaces in at table's corners? Also, 2 seats, yet there is some shit in the middle of the table, it will be uncomfortable for both ppl.

>>152331957
>Murdering your friends so as to get 100% completion in a video game is a really messed up thing to do
Let's push this a little further. Would you appreciate a VN or game where you HAVE to kill these characters in order to experience most of the content? Not only that, the game will go out of its way to insinuate that you're human garbage for doing so. Would you value your purchase if you only got 25% of the experience? That's basically what undertale does for an entire route and the most challenging boss battles in the game. If you want to experience those things you must kill everyone and the game will shit on you for it. Or you just miss out on that content from something you paid for.

>Many of the most emotionally powerful moments in media are from characters failing, getting hurt, or dying
I agree. It is how the writer, or dev, treats you after those moments where I disagree with you. I can see it making a powerful point for the players to want to avoid that route and outcome, where you know you've become a true monster, but the thing is, you actually want players to play through that route.Otherwise, why spend the time and effort in creating one? Why not just go straight to a game over? Especially for a standard VN, where it's all text and there's no gameplay to speak of to provide some sort of outlet. Laying on the guilt and treating them like assholes for the choices they've made isn't very enticing, especially if it wasn't something that they wanted to happen and would change if they could.
It's basically the opposite of how undertale blatantly baits you into killing toriel so that the player will reset. What you'd want is for the player to live with that choice and keep moving forward to experience the good and the bad that the rest of the game has to offer. They will already want to reload after someone they cared for dies, you don't want to strengthen that urge by directly making the player feel like shit for it.

100% agree with the rest

How to firecat?

>>152334361

It's hard to say if I'd enjoy it without it actually existing - if it was cleverly written and insightful, I probably would rate it highly. If it was hamfisted, I'd likely think it was trash. As it was, I found Undertale's commentary on the nature of video games to be interesting. I have full access to that content, and made the decision not to access it. I'd say it's a testament to the strength of the direction that many players make that choice, and the decision not to do so was one of the more memorable moments of the game.

I think the difference is that I don't really like video games, so I very much appreciated the artistry and thought behind that choice. I know many video game fans were frustrated by how anti-fun it was. I can understand why you don't like it, but my experience was quite different.

I think the point in Undertale was that the player should be TEMPTED to play the final route, but be forced to weigh that desire against the knowedge that they'll need to do terrible things to do so. Your answer to that dilemna is your own, and the game only asks you to live with the consequences of your actions. If you feel bad for doing so, then that's the price you pay.

In a VN, I'd like readers to reflect on their decisions and why they make them. Sometimes we hurt people without even meaning to, and it may be good to delve into why that happened. Doing so would hopefully lead to greater insight on the part of the player, who might gain a greater understanding of how their actions can affect others.Some players might find that kind of thing pretentious and immediately revolt, but I'd hope some would engage with it. To each their own.

I think the aim of that particular choice - and the game as a whole- was to show to the player that though they could kill others, they could also choose not to.There is no real reward for doing so - the game is easier if you kill most things. But it's a credit to the game that most players engage with its message.

>>152336187
drink gasoline daily

>>152334361
Not the other anon, but let me get this straight. You want to be given the choice to act like a murderous villain but not held accountable for your actions? I think you are looking for the Fallout 4 experience.

Seems to me you are mixing two different kind of arguments here. On one hand, you give a lot of valid reasons, but those are strictly pragmatical (money, fun, length of the game, techical quality). Going by those, whatever mean things those puny pixelated beings on the screen--whose only reason to exist is entertain you--say, shouldn't bother you. In fact, NPCs consistently calling on your bullshit used to be one of the most appreciated features of old school RPGs, and hence technically praiseworthy.

Now, if you empathize at least a bit with those animated sprites, you are considering the game at least partially from an ethical perspective since they are "persons" to you in a sense. Morality is not about "maximizing the content I get to experience". It's about treating humanity, whether in ourselves or in others, not as a means only but always as an end in itself. Killing them SHOULD make you feel bad in the same degree you experience an emotional connection to them. If you don't want to feel guilty, don't do mean things to beings you feel sympathy for.

Like in real life, a morally sound election often means sacrificing the pragmatic goodies that would derive from being evil. Practically speaking, being bad is more beneficial for you. You can genocide your friends to get your money's worth out of the game the same way you can become a patreon scam artist and steal other people's money. Both result in personal gain. Of course, it is just a game and objectively speaking you shouldn't feel bad for doing whatever you want in there, since they are not real persons. But the fiction the game creates is interesting since makes the "moral" type of reasoning kick in and make you consider this stuff.

That is what genocide route was about.

Personally, I'm very used to the portrayal of characters death in all the media, it takes extremally good writing to make me shed a tear. Thus, I'm vert afraid that the deaths of the characters I plan to include will turn out pretentious. Honestly it's one of my biggest fears. Any tips what should I avoid durning the death scenes? One of the things I have in mind is that you should avoid killing meaningless NPCs and the character you're going to kill should be in the story long enough to create an emotional bond with the reader. Also, how do I avoid death flags, this shot is so hard.

>>152337485
>how do I avoid death flags
Well, one thing at least I can say. Don't go the same rute as Danganronpa or Muv Luv Alternative, developing characters just so they can become tearjerk material when they kill them 5000 words later. It's cheap as fuck.