Remember to do all your vidya programming in C.

>>387474319
Python is better.

>>387474319

Which one

There's C, Objective C, C++

>>387474513
>he forgot C#

Fuck off back to /g/ faggots

>>387474513
++

>>387474423
elaborate

Rust
Gotta support those wynen and LGBT goy

>>387474513
Holy desu

engine programming maybe
gameplay programming in c++ would have an even faster turnover rate than it has now if that was somehow possible

I use Ruby

>>387474730
Don't do anything in C++. ANYTHING.

What is the best site to learn programming?

>>387474638
Python is a lot cleaner, easier to read, and it is much easier to test your builds since it is an interpreted language.

>>387474881
https://www.codecademy.com/learn/learn-python

>>387474881
glad you asked

boards.4chan.org/g/dpt

>>387474513
If this is serious and you are making a hobby game I'd go with C# + Monogame. Nice framework but it doesn't do everything for you so you'll actually learn something unlike shit like Unity.

>>387474945
i've seen four million line codebases in python and i'd take forty million lines of c++ any day
c++ just scales like nothing else at absurd codebase sizes, and that's pretty much every single AAA game

>>387474423
what engines use python?

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Remember to do all your vidya programming in Javascript.

I'm learning C#, sorry mate

>>387475051
Okay, sure. But nobody here is making four million line codebases. And Python is just a good language to start with anyway. Much easier to learn C++ from Python than the other way around.

The Nintendo Gamecube.

>>387475162
You joke but the sad thing is people try all the time to make javascript work for games. You'd be better off learning fucking ActionScript/Flash than JS.

I only know java and C++

>c++
>native
>can be used to make game engine from scratch
>can be used as web service backend
>can be used to program microcontrollers and shit
>can be used to create your own OS
>modular
>no meme framework
So what's your excuse to not using c++?

Reminder that there is objectively no reason to ever use C++ over C.

>>387475175
wrong, python assumes you're not a retard, which people who are starting to program definitely are

>>387475329
I don't take a cannon to hunt rabbits

>>387475329
I'm not exaggerating when I say this: C++ is the worst thing to happen to programming.

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>tfw everyone you meet online seems to be some sort of IT guy/Programmer now who's been doing it since they were 2 years old
>tfw too stupid to bother playing catchup and make something useful or a game

It's okay, maybe being the idea guy isn't so bad in the end.

>>387475457
guis exist so you're wrong

I use gamemaker language

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>>387475329
Not much reason to use it over C. There's about as many instances where C is superior to C++ as there is vice versa.

>>387475283
explain notch

What about if I'm using GML?

>>387474881
/g/ has it's own wiki about crossdressing coding

>>387474319
You'll never finish if you make your own engine.

>>387475787
link?

>>387474423
Not for games you retard. Games are pushing hardware to their limits and it's contributing a lot to advancements in hardware, there's zero reason to use very high level programming languages here.

>>387474319
No thanks i use lua

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>>387476008
wiki.installgentoo.com

Remember to crossdress.

>>387476165
Thanks

>>387476165
What the fuck is this and how is it /g/ related.

https://wiki.installgentoo.com/index.php/Electronic_cigarettes

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>>387474319
yeah sure let's make glitchy unfinished messes all by ourselves from the ground up, that'll go REAL well
or you could just use an engine and gitgud at optimizing with it so that you don't have to do 10x the work for worse payoff so that you can brag on malaysian painting forums how l33t you are

>>387476439
because /g/ is a weird fucking place.

>>387476439
gee is the technology board. electronic cigarettes are technology.

>>387475052
Blender

>>387475558
That's fine for learning the bare basics of programming, but learn a big boy language as soon as you can.

>>387474870
why

>>387476087
You are obviously not a master programmer like me and you know nothing.

>>387475283
ActionScript is a dialect of JavaScript.

>>387475662
Minecraft was written in Java. Java and JavaScript are two completely unrelated languages.

what engine uses C/C++?
i feel like unreal is a bit of an overkill i just want to do simple 2D games

>>387475461
Its never too late, programming is mostly self taught anyway.

I haven't touched a language in years but I start on a 10 course/three semester trade program this fall for software engineering that includes game design. Definitely do able.

>>387477723
Just about every popular engine is C/C++.

Yes, even Unity.

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>>387474664

>>387478091
But Unity is based on C#.

>>387475175
>It's much easier to move from an interpreted language to a compiled language than vice versa
that's just silly. The entire point of interpreted languages is to ask less work of the programmer but to get the same amount of productivity. Programming in a compiled language like anything in the C family encompasses everything there is to programming in interpreted languages and then more. Learning an interpreted language when you already know something like C++ doesn't really require you to learn anything new that's substantial to programming as a whole whereas going the other way means you suddenly have to start learning about proper memory management or even stuff like what a build system is (obfuscation is kinda similar for JS but it doesn't really count considering it's not a core aspect of the language)

>>387475461
Don't be a dingus. Even an idea guy needs to know how to build a game, at least at an abstract level, otherwise you'll consistently fail to clearly communicate your ideas. And you don't need to be a programming expert to know roughly how something should be coded.

>>387478174
Unity exposes .NET access. Internally it's C/C++ and closed source.

>>387475283
>You'd be better off learning[...]
That's just it. People don't like learning.

>>387475461
Just pick any language. Whichever it is, everyone will hate you for it and claim theirs is better.

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>>387475602
>that pic

that was a pretty good joke

>>387478361
I must be thinking about just the actual editor then. I know there's some part of it that's built primarily from c#.

>>387479431
Yeah the unity editor is mostly written in C# according to: http://answers.unity3d.com/questions/9675/is-unity-engine-written-in-monoc-or-c.html

How do i use a dissembler?

>>387479616
I think that's actually to page I got my info from. Cool.

>>387476461
>Unreal 4 and Unity
>Optimized
>Create an Object in Unreal 4
>It's a fucking virtual base class that inherits from another class

Holy shit, how dense are engineers

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>I chose C as my first language

>>387479736
That pic doesn't fit. Seems more appropriate if you said Assembly. C isn't that bad.

>>387477161
Because it leads you down the wrong path when you think in C++, and it's hard to break out of years later.

>>387479736
you did good. I chose python and now I hate having to transition to c; I'm too spoiled now

>>387479736
It doesn't really matter which language you pick up first. Each and every language has its quirks. Once you understand the basics of programming you can really transition to any other language without hassle. Sure it's a hassle to learn a language that doesn't support X or Y, but at least you can focus on that instead of the basics.

>>387479736
good choice my friend

>>387479679
Too many people have fallen for the OOP meme. Nobody cares/realises how easy it is to make things a nightmare for CPU caching using C++.

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>>387479736
>tfw

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>>387479736
>tfw there are people that seriously find the concept of pointers confusing

>>387474423
Not for performance it's not.

t. Python/C# coder for a tech company.

>>387476929
Daily reminder that Blender is written in C++, not Python

>>387480156
>mfw people complain about pointer, signalling other languages lack of pointers as a plus

THEY ARE IN
THE
ASSEMBLY

>>387480156
I find value vs reference types far more confusing than pointers

>>387480315
That's because nobody fucking explains that shit right. Passing by value makes a copy of the variable and stores it in memory on the stack. Reference just says "The data is stored *here* in the existing memory" and gives a pointer to it which you can use to access the value by "de-referencing" it, which means to treat the variable as the value at the memory it points to, and not a pointer.

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>Not coding in assembly
Whats your excuse anon?

>>387480567
>not literally writing directly to your hard drive with a magnetized needle
Fucking pleb.

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>>387479837
It is when you come from being an artfag

>>387480056
That is one of my issues, there isn't a more accessible way of teaching the basics of programming

>>387479984
>>387480082
>>387480154
Give me your strength mates

>>387480216
You only care for performance where it's needed. Civ4 uses python extensively, SupCom uses lua a lot.

>>387480627
Pretty sure Emacs can do that.

>>387480639
Well yeah, but guess where it doesn't use it? The core engine and renderer. It's fine to plug in for easy modding and shit, but it's not useful for serious engine work.

>>387480546
The side effect of this is that you can't store classes on the stack like you can in C++

Since there seem to be a lot of programmers here, I want to ask.
I know basic levels of programming, and I want to patch games. Mainly for translation, what's the easiest way for me to learn how to do this?

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What does /v/ think of YandereDev's coding?

>>387480983
if it works, it works

>>387480983
Reminds me of my old teacher's coding. Stressed spacing on us.

>>387474423
>using python for games
kill yourself

>>387480821
I expect that's going to vary significantly between games.

>>387480983
What is that float doing
What does it mean

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>>387480983

if(knows_about_switch_and_case){
make_readable_code();
}else{
fuck_up(this.my_shit);
}

>>387481760
It's pointless; it'll be converted to a float anyway
If he really wanted a float literal he should have done 6.0f

>>387481760
type casting, you do that when you want to turn one type of variable into another as long as they are compatible

say you have an integer but your function only accepts float, you write (float)my_int

>>387480983
Someone fix this so I can be proud of /v/.

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>>387479736

Approved! See pic.

>>387482107
its really not hard to fix, just tedious, all those labels and strings for instance, he couldve stored those in a hash map, not to mention the obvious and badly needed switch case, he couldve declared a float f= (float)6 variable so he doesnt have to write "(float)6" six trillion times


not the most DRY code

>>387482107
Presumably you'd just loop through an array of 'witnessed' bools and see if any elements are true. That'd take about two lines.

>>387482107
At the very least "Witnessed" should be an enum, to avoid expensive string comparisons.

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>>387480821
There's a lot of different skills involved with translation patches, at the least you'll need a decent knowledge of low-level concepts.
The best case scenario I can think of for an untranslated game is one that loads dialog and other text from one or multiple easily reversed archive files; in that situation, all you would need to do is reverse engineer the format and write a tool to dump and repack the files. It's never that simple, though. Commonly, you'll have to do stuff like using a debugger to examine the game's disassembly to understand how it encrypts data, and replacing dialog and other strings embedded in the executable (which often involves finding workarounds in the case that the new string is longer than the original.) Sometimes, if life particularly wants to shit on you, you'll run into cases where you have to rework/rewrite entire sections of the game's assembly, with converting vertically drawn Japanese text to horizontal being a prime example.
If you want advice on where to start, I'd advise at least having a decent understanding of C (or C++) as well as knowledge of how what you write in them translates into when compiled, which is more or less a tie-in for understanding assembly. If you're just starting at this point, I'd recommend reading up a bit on assembly concepts such as the stack, registers, common instructions, etc, then writing extremely basic programs and setting your compiler to output assembly and comparing what you wrote to what you got. As for reverse engineering and learning how to use a debugger, I think the Reversing with Lena tutorials still hold up.

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>>387480983
>Yanderedev
His name's EvaXephon.

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>>387482364
>an array
>not bit masking

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>>387482708
>assembly was a required course back when I was in uni
>mfw all the other students in the course complaining about it being required because LOLCOMPILERZ

If you're serious about starting to program, try Python, start any tutorial, pick a starter book on a library, whatever, and stick with it until you have a decent grasp on data structures and logic. Then work on making a couple simple application or game like rock paper scissors to work on your ability to problem solve. From there, move into a lower level language like either C, C# or Java and repeat the process.

>If you're serious about starting to program
I would advise anybody who really wants to learn programming, to start with Delphi.

>>387482708
okay thank you

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Sinks are technology.
Post some nice sinks.

>tfw too stupid for memory management

I need a garbage collector to hold my hand otherwise my game will have memory leaks all over the place.

>tfw never bothered to learn to program until I was 17
>only know HTML

Fuck what language should I learn next I want to not look computer illiterate in front of everyone?

>>387483313
Not sure how bit masking would be useful there but ok.

>>387484137
Bad news bro, HTML isn't a programming language so you still haven't learnt to program. Learn theory then pick up the syntax of whatever languages the faggots you want to impress use.

>>387484137
>HTML
>language

>>387482718
>YandereDev has low self esteem and plays Gaia
Why am I not surprised?

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>>387484290
Would Python be the best place to start after theory?

>>387484434
You learn a language alongside the theory usually. But yes, Python is easy on beginners and has a couple real life applications.

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>>387484543
Thanks for the help anon. After I learn this I can justify my long hours on the computer better.

>>387484131
You don't need memory management.
It's a big fucking meme that people have taught other to use New and Delete 1000+ times every single frame.
Doesn't help that the languages like Java and C++ back that ideal up.

You don't even need a garbage collector. It's redundant.

You use pre-allocated memory.
For example at the start of the level, you know the data, you know it's not going to exceed 2MB, so preallocate that and move through the memory accordingly.

Always think, "Do I really need to be calling New here?", always.
You're more than likely never going to have more than 64 of this one type of enemy in this one level for example.
So make a array and fill it with structures.
And then you don't need to use new, because you're COUNTING the active enemies against max enemies which you declared already when you defined the structure.

So you don't need smart points and this this garbage.
We can say,

struct Enemy { //data }
Enemy enemies[MAX_ENEMIES];

for(int i = 0; i < numberOfActiveEnemies; ++i) { renderEnemies(enemies[i]); }

>>387475052
EVE Online is written in Python I believe.

>>387475052
Panda3D

>>387474319
Nobody here will make an AAA tier game so its not like you need a low level language for maximum efficiency (that will be rendered null due to your less than stellar programming skills anyways)

>>387484838
The worst thing is when somebody learns C++ after Java and thinks they have to use new every time they make an object.

>>387474319
I want to learn programming to make vidya from scratch in the far future
What language should I learn? What's a good resource to learn, such as a site or a good book to read?

>>387484434
You should learn a harder language, it'll let you learn other ones more easily. Python is very convenient and beginner friendly - hides some intricacies from you.

>>387485039
Learn Fortran and Cobol. They're the real game programming languages that they keep secret to make the best games.

http://www.coboloncogs.org has all the info you need.

>>387485039
learn Python because it's cute and easy.
Then learn C.

>>387485106
What use would harder languages help me with if I don't seek to create a game?

t. coding normie

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>>387479736
>Started with C
>Mostly use Assembly outside of work now because of cheat engine

>>387485106
I think Python is fine for a while for beginners, I'll agree that it's best to switch when you have a decent grasp, but Python lets you start doing your own thing a bit faster since it doesn't shove strange stuff in your face like "public static void main" that you won't start understanding until a bit later on.

Most people I knew who failed CS 101 were just people who lost motivation and didn't bother experimenting later on.

>>387485437
>Most people I knew who failed CS 101
I must have had an easy CS class because I can literally not comprehend how you would fail a CS.
The instructor tells you exactly what you need to know to complete the assignments, almost to the point of just being able to copy-paste the lecture code to complete the homework.

>>387485634
not the guy you replied to but I had to do tutoring for my intro CS class and I had to explain what a for loop is to a (college-age) kid, no exaggeration, 15+ times over the course of a semester. Some people just blatantly ignore what you or any professor tell them.

>>387485634
Plenty of people take CS because they think it's the "I like computers" course and are in over their heads.

I always enjoy seeing or hearing the comments about people wanting to make games but say they hate math.

>>387485802
it's always a little heartbreaking how every other faggot off the street thinks it's their passion to make video games, but part of me also takes a smug satisfaction in their dreams being shattered

>>387485901
Different anon here, I knew a guy who started a games programming degree because he liked World of Warcraft. He was not technically minded in the slightest. At that point I had already failed out of university to be a full-time drug addict and I ended up doing most of his programming homework for him. There are advantages to being autistic and raised by a very angry computer engineer.

>>387485263
Knowledge.

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>>387486187
Good enough anon.

>>387485634
>>387485723
I think programming requires a "click", that most people, regardless of how smart they are, don't have until they actually try to program something that isn't the work that the school/online tutorial gives. Until the click, people will be very hesitant to try anything out with programming because they have no idea what is even possible, or how the computer will respond to what they give it.

Personally, I would go to labs and have a hard time thinking basic stuff through my head, but once I tried actually trying things out myself and learning tricks on how to solve problems, solutions started to come naturally.

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>>387485901
>want to make video games for a living
>know my dreams will most likely be shattered

I feel like im missing something in my understanding of computers, and someone here knows how to plug the hole
So I imagine an upside down pyramid, with the apex point just two difference frequencies of binary. Then we have the binary compiler directly above that, and each layer getting fatter and fatter above that until we reach the C compiler.
But what is inbetween? What is decimal and hexadecimal? Where do the logic gates fit in? How do we get from the binary compiler to something low level?

>>387486357
Split the difference; do something else for a living, and make vidya for fun.

is this /v/ /aggydaggy/

Anyone looking to learn programming should stay away from languages like Python and Java. They hide too much from the programmer for """safety""" reasons. Pick up the "For Dummies" book on C and just go from there. It literally tells you how to start from setting up a compiler to opening a text editor. Real basic shit. Move onto a neater language like C++ if you need the features (you'll know when by then).
Look at the source code for Doom and Commander Keen and get a feel for how well written code looks, and start tinkering with it. Change a variable, remove a function, change the order of stuff, and just see what happens.
Just have fun. Use Google or >>>/g/dpt/ if you need help.

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>>387486423
Are you talking about this shit?

>>387486423
Can you program in any language at all? If so read The Elements of Computing Systems. It goes into how to build an extremely basic computer from logic gates, how to write an assembler, how to write a compiler, and how to write an OS. It's a 101 text so it is really basic.

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>>387486639
>Can you program in any language at all? If so read The Elements of Computing Systems.
No i cannot, because I didn't understand these basics i figured I should before actually attempting to learn anything further
thanks for the suggestion I will read that
>>387486592
thats pretty much it, thank you
I had the misunderstanding that assembly wasn't human readable and i thought machine code was binary

>>387486934
It's a bad book to pick up if you don't know how to program yet. Honestly most people learn how to program at least a bit before going into the details of how computers work. I'd try getting to a level of basic competency before picking up Elements.

>>387486541
C is too old to learn, just learn C++11 / C++14
then move on to C# for easier work

C# is godlike and I love it for devving my gameu

>>387487272
>C is too old to learn

no real reason to use C, it has poor support for modern graphics APIs like directX10 or above, or vulkan

>>387487272
c# is ugly and full of hacks

>>387487272
C will never be too old to learn, in performance critical areas (embedded systems, games, etc), assembly, C and to some extent C++ are the first to use.

"Modern C++" is a meme

C# requires way too much effort to achieve cross-platform support.

>>387486934
>i thought machine code was binary
Well, it is, it's just written in hex. Not much of a difference really.

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>>387479736
>mainframe assembler was my first programming language

>>387485802
What type of math does game development actually require? I'd like to think I'm pretty good at math but I'm still a bit scared. Especially if it's geometry, I really fucking suck at that.

>>387488963
You can do plenty with simple algebra and trigonometry for 2d title. Gets a bit more involved if you get to the third dimension.

>>387488963
As long as you're not making a 3D engine, you don't need to do super complex math. But you will want a solid grasp and understanding of trig, linear algebra, algebra and some other (series, some random bits. If you are gonna go to school, they will teach this crap to you when it becomes relevant.

>>387482202
Wasn't that coded in Assembly?

God, I'd kill myself if I had to make a game in Assembly.

>>387487374
>VulkanOpenGL written in C

What are you saying son

>do all programming in C
>spend 10 years making a simple 2d graphics game
>can't play it for more than 30 seconds without crashing

>>387475329
Because I use Rust.

Just a little information for you new developers out here.

A real programmer can make a game in any language he wants with reasonable efficiency, these people saying what you should or shouldn't use are people who don't do this for a living.

While it would take a longer to make a game from scratch in pure C, it's completely doable. However, C++, C#, or any other language is acceptable for a game.

The only exception might be an engine with very intensive graphics, you probably wouldn't want to use something such as python for something like that, but even then you should be able to create an engine that operates within at least a tolerable threshold of efficiency if you know what you're doing and use the right tools.

>>387491310
The problem is that a lot of the time your using little libraries for windowing and input and textures and all that.

But then later on you realise having 10 or more sprites on screen destroys the frame rate.