I knew the resemblance to Žižek wasn't a coincidence.

>>81715681
>you shee Rey sniiiif ideaology ish trash de ligh shied ish ass bad ass the dark shide. We mush redistribute the glowy bacteria to those who haff none. My fadda wash a rich capitalist that had too much force. He became evil. He shud have gave some to JarJar.

>>81715681
Based Mark tbqh

>>81716615
What the fuck are you even doing?

>Lukes whole arc was being hope incarnate
>Throw it all out for the sequels

Terrible

>>81716934
He's typing like Zizzy.

>>81716934
fucking you're mom in her as

>>81716934
*sniff* Ideology

>>81717005
No, he's proving that he hasn't read shit, and has only seen Zizek on tha tubes.....he's (lamely) making fun of a lisp, which is some quality comedy, hoo boy.

>>81716934
>What the fuck are you even doing?

Pure ideology.

>>81715681
>lesbianrey
they need to be gassed

>>81715681
>repeat a cycle of boom and bust
>the repetitive cycle is """wrong""" and needs to change
Why are these people so fucking retarded.

>>81718127
because they're 12 year olds

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>>81715681
BARISS WAS RIGHT

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mc-jLWyxZjI

>>81717460
>>81716934
Nothing is more disgusting than humorless marxists whining about laughter directed at their sacred cows.

>>81718127
The funniest shit is they're one of the biggest catalysts for ideological boom-bust cycles. The neo-nationalist movements wouldn't be gaining any ground at all if there weren't widespread infestations of marxist faggots at the moment and these people are incapable of seeing their own extremism is the vehicle behind the dynamic they're trying to resist.

Self-fulfilling extremists are hilarious.

It's like a riddle, it rhymes

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>anarcho marxist

>>81719921
That shit would be side-orbiting if it weren't for the fact so many tards openly see nothing wrong with putting those two words together.

>>81719173
>whining about laughter directed at their sacred cows
Would be funny if it was in any way accurate. To anyone who knows more than just a little than the surface-level about Marx or Zizek, it just comes off as a cheap joke using an old stereotype about Marxists that just falls flat on its face. I mean I'm not saying you can't make jokes, there is plenty of material out there to poke fun at, but this isn't funny its just lazy humor
>neo-nationalist movements wouldn't be gaining any ground at all if there weren't widespread infestations of marxist faggots at the moment and these people are incapable of seeing their own extremism is the vehicle behind the dynamic they're trying to resist
I don't know about you, but it makes more sense to blame it on the people who actually run this society to only work for them for the rise of any "extremists". I wish there had been a point in time where Marxist faggots were so infested that they were actually able to determine the course of human society. Maybe then you can blame them, if we ever got to the point we are now. But so far its been about 3 decades since the Soviets fell and Marxists have little to do with the shitstorm we're in. The only thing the left has going for them is culture war bullshit, but that stuff is a worthless distraction from real politics.

>>81720366
>so far its been about 3 decades since the Soviets fell and Marxists have little to do with the shitstorm we're in
Important point, stormfags. Need any more halp?

>>81715681
>anarcho-Marxist
Zizek is a Stalinist though.

>>81716934
You have to go back.

>>81716615
i like zizek and this was pretty funny

>>81720954
Try to grow up, son.

>>81720054

It's an actual ideology but it's not Zizek's ideology.

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Mods delete another zizek thred, but leave all the pedo garbage. I luv this place!

>>81720366
Faggots talk about being redpill, but THIS guys has his shit together

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>Twins, one male, one female
>Just like Luke and Leia
>The female "discovers" the Force at a place that becomes known as the "Force Tree"
>The female twin founds the Jedi Order
>The male twin is evil and kills the female.
>Before she dies she makes a prophecy that she will return as The One
>Meanwhile Darth Sidious creates Anakin Skywalker to be a false prophet / golem type creation
>The Jedi are fooled into thinking he's The One
>The Jedi only realize their mistake too late.
>Anakin destroys almost all the Jedi
>Luke tries to redeem his evil father who literally slaughtered children.
>Rey is born and she is the perfect reincarnation of The One. Flawless in every way.
>She finds Luke Skywalker, who now just like his evil father, wants to destroy the Jedi Order

Rey will stop Luke's plans, restore order to the galaxy, and will destroy the dark side. She will also bring about the rise of the new Jedi order as predicted by Supreme Leader Snoke in TFA.

The entire Star Wars saga is about how women are good and men are evil.

The women are all leaders (Padme, Leia, Rey, Mon Mothma)

The men are all drawn to the dark side (Anakin, Palpatine, Snoke, Kylo)

>>81720366
And that distraction is the only thing most self-styled marxists seem to care about anymore. Marxist infiltration of the greater leftwing and liberal spaces has allowed their retarded ideas to flourish and has given birth to the conflation of liberal or left-of-center views with full on marxist bullshit. Just look at the utterly atrocious state of Western higher education at the moment.

No, I will blame the marxists, because they've taken their shitty ideas and made them even worse by marrying them to immutable concepts like gender and race and then sold those shitty ideas to a bunch of well-meaning fools as the brand new version of an enlightened and humanistic morality. It's nothing but a secular religion with its own stifling dogmas and behaviors now. And it's that kind of thinking that has given us through all the cultural relativistic bullshit that is inherent to it the problem of a hard right resurgence.

>>81720897
An important point that ignores marxists didn't just get raptured away after the USSR fell. They didn't lose their prominent positions in public universities or find themselves subject to new restrictions on their political freedoms. If anything the USSR collapsing made people more forgiving to the ideas of marxists and less vigilant against the rot they bring.

>>81721086
>mon mothma
c'mon

>>81721128
>i dont know what marxism is: the post

>>81716615
*tugs robes*

>>81721129
Literally the leader of the rebellion and one of the most important characters in the entire saga

>>81721191
>Disagreement with my political religion is equal to not understanding it
It'd say I'm surprised, but that would be a lie. The left, especially the harder left, loves to insinuate sympathy for its views are synonymous with being educated on the concept altogether. I guess that's why they have such a hard time dealing with educated people saying no to their points or why they constantly remind people to educate themselves as if doing so will mean coming around to an agreement.

>>81716995
Fuck you're right

Why do marxists still exist?

They all need to be thrown out of helicopters.

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zizek is the biggest pseudo-intellectual of our time

>>81721128
>couldn't get into uni because MARXISTS!!!!!
>can't get job because MARXISTS!!!!!
>no gf because MARXISTS!!!!!
>world falling apart 30 years after soviet fall because MARXISTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Huh, really makes you think.
Did MARXISTS put chemicals into jet fuel, too?? D-did MARXISTS make building 7 collapse??? WAS OBAMA BORN TO MARXISTS?????????????

>>81715681
His acting is pure garbage. Its not him who makes star wars so popular, its the setting. Go rewatch them, you'll see what i mean

A few fags worship him on tv like crazy now that hes trying to be relevant again through pandering to liberals

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>>81721332
MARXISTS DID IT!

>>81721476
wow, you sure p*wned him

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>>81721332
He's right though. You have no idea what marxism is. Marxism was more popular in "left wing" circles 30 years ago. All this cringey SJW became popular after the decline of the Soviet Union when leftist were embarassed to be associated with failed nation and belived that the ideology had been completely defeated. The modern SJW is a centrist with extremely reactionary views on race and gender. The racial and gender based view of history is anti-marxist in nature. Marxist reduce all social relationships to material economic systems. SJWs reduce all relationships to cultural bullshit in a similar manner to groups on the right. Marxism is an ideology has been pruged from contemporary politics.

>>81715681
>anarcho-marxist
Why such retarded people always live in wealthiest countries of the world?

>>81721379
out of spite and rebelling against their parents

>>81721616
>SJWs reduce all relationships to cultural bullshit
Wow, perhaps one might even call it.... "CULTURAL" MARXISM? !!? ?

>>81721530
MARXISTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

>>81721476
No. Marxists popularize racial, ethnic, and gender-borne strife and call it social justice. They use institutions with moral clout to push their bullshit until said institutions are poisoned beyond repair. Public universities and large media conglomerates, as an example, wouldn't be suffering from a massive delegitimization campaign gaining ground every day if they hadn't been infiltrated by well-meaning fools who "wanted to change the world," instructed by repackaged marxist claptrap.

>>81721616
Bullshit. The people teaching critical race/gender theories and the like use marxist foundations to build their ideology up, only instead of focusing on class they conflate and tie that concept to issues of race and gender. You can pull the "no true marxist," game all you want, but the fact is they use that ideology as the bedrock of their worldview. That fact isn't going anywhere just because they take the ideas to one bullshit tier higher than regular marxists do.

>>81721616
North deserves an ice pick through his skull just like his hero.

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>>81721747
>The people teaching critical race/gender theories and the like use marxist foundations to build their ideology up, only instead of focusing on class they conflate and tie that concept to issues of race and gender. You can pull the "no true marxist," game all you want, but the fact is they use that ideology as the bedrock of their worldview

This. As much as "TRUE Marxists" attempt to differentiate themselves from "idpol-infested SJWs" there's really little difference, since many of those same SJWs hate capitalism with as much fervour as your standard ChapoTrapHouse listening urban basement-revolutionary

Even "if" their main gripe with capitalism is really that it's just another conspiracy by the Patriarchy/Whitey/Breeders to keep them down

Hamill looks nothing like Zizek aside from having a beard.

But god knows if you're going to force a meme this is the easiest place to do it, so by all means continue.

>>81720366
>. I wish there had been a point in time where Marxist faggots were so infested that they were actually able to determine the course of human society


You have academia.

>>81719921
>>81720054
isn't the ideology about using anarchy to destroy the current system and from that system rebuilding a Marxist society?

It's not really as ridiculous as it sounds

>>81721889
Are you fucking kidding me, anon? Since when - ever - has an academic made policy decisions IN ANY COUNTRY ON THE EARTH???????
You FUCKING MORON.

>>81721530

you're on 4chan idiot you can swear without self-censoring

>>81721727
You could but it would be a misnomer. It has nothing to do with traditional marxism. Which reduces all of history to class relationships and economics. There is no room for race and gender based views of history in marxism.
>>81721795
t.stalinist
>>81721747
Marxist didn't popularize those theories. As I said in my previous post. Those theories only gained popularity when Marxists no longer had enough influence to stop that cancer from spreading. SjJW types have existed since the Victorian era. Marxists use to keep them from making every left wing group about their gay pet issues. Marxists and other far leftists were pruged from unions and left wing groups during the 50s. They were pruged from academia in the 70s. When critical theory and post modernism really took off.

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>>81721086
Rey is born and she is the perfect reincarnation of The One. Flawless in every way.

>Flawless in every way.

>Flawless

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>>81721956
>The institution through which practically every person in a first world country that wants a career in politics, white collar occupations, etc has no impact whatsoever on the political behaviour of those that pass through its doors

>>81716995
>>81721343
Things don't always work out in life, ours or in their universe. Stick to kids shit if you want sunshine and rainbows

Fucking idiot whining about marxists - useful idiots are everywhere.....working for their masters like loyal dogs...lovin' the lash....licking the hand that beats it...

>>81722010
>There is no room for race and gender based views of history in marxism.

...except for everything Marx, Engels, etc wrote about the nature of the family, and what black Marxists wrote about the relationships between racism and capitalism...

>>81721128
If they care about culture war bullshit more than political economy, then they are more likely to be liberals who are distracting themselves from the fact that their system is falling apart around them and need some scapegoat other to push the blame elsewhere. I mean this on both left and right. I can deal with small doses of bs racism, sexism, feminism, nationalism, etc, but if you're more preoccupied with that crap, in the sense of the mass media culture war circus than real issues that affect how people are living, then imo you're not a real political player, just a useful idiot for someone else, much less an actual Marxist.

>>81722010
This guy knows his shit - come on, fagets: throw something else at him so he can school you.

>>81721943
No, that's just Marxism. Anarchy is used to remove power from a central system/government. Marxism is the opposite since it centralizes power in the goverment.

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>>81721747
You're talking about intersectionality, which has been sorely missing from conflict-based analysis for practically the last century. Critical theory contains not only the racial and gender-based "strife" that you argue is "bullshit," but the Frankfurt School which is really just the attempt to bridge Marx's analysis of class and the economy as the superstructure of society with an eye towards culture (hence the bogeyman "cultural marxism" which doesn't really mean anything in academic discourse let alone outside of internet forums). Race and gender as social constructs cannot be destroyed until class is, and that is what the so-called radical left fails to grasp. The point of all this upheaval is not to rise POC and women as the new overlords of society, but the destruction of the social antagonisms which make systemic oppression a fundamental feature of society.

Even if the scary SJW's got everything on their wishlist, it would be pointless without the radical shift necessary for those achievements i.e. the destruction of the state capitalist machine. Anything else would be false consciousness in service of the very system which now threatens to quite literally destroy the entire earth in the pursuit of fucking profit.

>>81721943
It's ridiculous because most people who call themselves anarcho-marxists are just communists looking for a taller, darker peacock plume to stick in their activist hat and differentiate themselves from all the other young idealistic reds.

And from that reality there comes an inherent contradiction in that these people as communists call for a dictatorship of the proletariat and since nothing larger than a local commune can exist politically without some kind of hierarchal government the efforts essential result in a massive empowerment of a central bureaucratic state making the moniker "anarcho-" anywhere in the title fucking hilarious.

As an aside, it's rather amusing watching anarchists act as if communists and marxists are their friends given every time they've tried to enact some kind of legitimate political goal, they were exploited by reds and then later devoured by them.

>>81715681
So between this image and that video of that girl getting punched by that manlet, /tv/ is basically telling me to never go to college because getting a degree and expanding my world view is what "they" want me to do

When the fuck did this place turn into a conspiracy filled shit hole?

>>81722031
OH, now yer goalpost shiftin'.....back pedalling like a little cuckboi....so, suddenly, academia doesn't exert direct influence, but oh so subtle indirect influence.
Huh. Neat.
But anon: surely a politician's wife has more influence over him than what school he went to? Surely his business interests have more influence? His friends? His desires?
Gee wiz: it kinda looks like there's a LOT more influencing a politician than just where he went to school...
You ought to be better at this, son, if you expect to play with tha big bois.

If the Jedi Order was so flawed then how come they managed to survive for over a millennia? The length for which their order was around for obviously doesn't make them a failure. Sidious was just too powerful that he crumbled everything.

Why are y'all discussing some old and busted real world ideology in a star wars thread?

>>81722074
What? Marx laid the ideological groundwork for most of that critical theory/pomo shit

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Critical_theory

It's just more of the same tedious leftist hair-splitting (i.e. "Well actually if a person disagrees with me on one point then he's not a TRUE marxist/socialist/anarchist") to disavow any association with the disagreeable actions of similar groups

>No TRUE Marxist...

>>81722165
/tv/ is telling you to save your money because it doesn't expand your worldview anymore than getting a job out of high school can.

>>81722068
moar goalpost shiftin' - cool!

>>81722165
>that girl getting punched by that manlet
Source?

>>81721128
>their prominent positions in public universities or find themselves subject to new restrictions on their political freedoms
I mean, I know there are some Marxist professors and orgs on some campuses, but they are by and large the minority, much less so influential to run most universities. The most influence they have is among those organizing protests on campus, and even my university doesn't have any Marxist groups. What country do you live in anon? Here in the USA, Marxists have never had such a hold on University administration and professorships, if any at all. I can only imagine they're so entrenched in former Eastern bloc countries

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>ip being raped by disney
>writers claiming empire was nazi white supremacists
>the bad CGI stand ins for long dead actors
>cant just replace with a new actor, need to replicate the reanimated corpse in all its stilted creepy glory
>wont hold up in 10 years
>muh china audience pandering
>muh feminist quips
>muh token black guy
>public TV series quality acting
>all the apologetic acceptance of the worst written villain in star wars history
>blatant pandering to cancerous RLM crowd and that faggot's whining criticism

>>81722068
All of which had little to do with the modern SJW view on race and gender. They understood that racism and sexism were a product of materials causes. Not white men being evil and wanting to dominate people.

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>>81721943
>isn't the ideology about using anarchy to destroy the current system and from that system rebuilding a Marxist society?

I like this person.

>>81722226
Don't wreck his ideology, anon - he needs to believe his crap! It gives him meaning.

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The only 'flaw' with the light side is that apparently 500 of their Jedi in the temple were no match for One Sith and a thousand clone troopers

>>81722279
Anakin is the strongest ever

>>81722031
important political careers are decided at birth, nothing to do with the merit of going through academia

>>81716995
Isn't that basically Obi-wan though? An old hero who's become downtrodden, leaving it to the plucky youngster to rekindle hope?

>>81722069
Oh no they're marxists, they're just racist or bigoted ones who want to tie in your disdain for capitalism with the groups they want to be acceptable targets. Elitist marxists who focus on economic issues can whine about the cultural fools all they want, but they're not going away nor are they changing the reasons for their political philosophies.

>>81722125
I don't care. They misappropriate your ideas for their own nefarious ends and for their own myopic purposes, but they're still your ideas that have shown to be absolutely deleterious to any society that took them serious enough to please any self-styled marxist.

>>81722226
You're blind then. Marxist professors who celebrate political violence teach classes entitled "The Problem of Whiteness," with administrator support at public universities in the American Midwest. On the west coast, you have middle-school teachers leading antifa cults in violent riots to shut down controversial public speakers.

>They understood that racism and sexism were a product of materials causes. Not white men being evil and wanting to dominate people.

And that's what most of the literature that those SJWs read also claim - i.e. "Since the society you were raised in is institutionally racist for material reasons, therefore as a white person you unconsciously benefit from this system, and are therefore racist".

Ultimately Marxists and SJWs come from the same ultimate radical impulse to violently overthrow society as it is now for the possibily of a Utopian future, the only difference is the reasons for why society as it is sucks

>>81722222
what a waste

>>81721827
>their main gripe with capitalism is really that it's just another conspiracy by the Patriarchy/Whitey/Breeders
Its not an "even if", that's a big problem in my book. They don't take it seriously, they just see capitalism as another add-on to their culture war struggle.

>>81722279
Sith are generally leagues more powerful than their Jedi counterparts until you get to the upper echelons of the Jedi Order.

>>81722031
>actually biting such obvious bait
How fucking new are you?

>>81722192
if you knew what critical theory and post-modernism stood for, you'd realize they're not the same in any way

>>81722354
>they just see capitalism as another add-on to their culture war struggle.

And? They still oppose "capitalism" (often through a Marxist lense) even if they just think it's all a giant conspiracy by snobbish WASPs to stop gays from fucking in the streets or trannies from using female restrooms

>>81722410
And that's one of the biggest problems those ideas have. Unless you navel gaze your way into a classroom where you can study the minute differences and distinctions they're going to bleed together for the majority of the opposition who wants nothing to do with them and the stupid followers of said ideas who get them third hand off social media "activists."

If your ideas are so damn vulnerable to misunderstanding that people who claim to study them can't agree on anything what hope do the politically enfranchised laymen have?

Ultimately the argument of who is and isn't a "true" Marxist is pretty meaningless, considering that every school of Marxist thought after Marx carked it thinks that every other school of thought got everything wrong about Marxist theory and solutions to achieving socialism

>>81722125
>Race and gender as social constructs cannot be destroyed until class is

>i.e. the destruction of the state capitalist machine

>but the destruction of the social antagonisms which make systemic oppression a fundamental feature of society.

with you fags it always boils down to "destruction" or the "abolishment of" lefties are agent's of destruction and dis-order in which nothing can be made from.

Pure Marxists cannot ever from anything of structure or sensible order hence they needed a guy like Lenin to actually make it into something with form and it failed miserably.

>of the very system which now threatens to quite literally destroy the entire earth in the pursuit of fucking profit.

that's literally what you want to do though fucking destroy everything so you can instill your crazy fucking beliefs Jesus fuck

>>81722202
You're probably baiting but I know there are idiots on /tv/ who actually believe this

>>81722192
It doesn't make it Marxist. Karl Marx was influenced by hegelian. That doesn't retroactively make Hegelian a Marxists. Hitler as most people know as influenced by Nietzsche. Nietzsche was not Nazi nor would he have supported the ideology. SJWs simply use Marxist language to push reactionary views on race and gender. In order to protect their own economic privilege and get the masses to picker with one another for their own gain. If an ideology reduces human relationships to cultural stuff and not class. It's no longer Marxism because class is central to the philosophy.

>gays
>SJW
>Pro communism
>USSR had a law against gay people
>USSR had a law against unemployed people
Why are they so retarded?

>>81722511
>USSR was communist
Why are they so retarded?

>>81722538
>IT DOESNT COUNT BAHAHAHA
Ok.
Lets wait for robots to make real communism.

>>81720913
He's a Lacanian-Hegelian Communist.

Major influences are Walter Benjamin, G.K. Chesterton, and Theodore Adorno.

He ran for office in Slovenia on the ticket of a modernized liberal party, after losing (and more or less making jest of the whole political machine) he became disillusioned with Western Liberalism and stated his admiration for Marxist vision of Common Space and Common Problems.

He's a philosopher trained in the field of psychoanalysis, nothing more.

>>81722183
Doesn't matter how long you survive for. When the rot sets in like it had by the time of Palpatine's rise, it led to their easy manipulation and failure

>>81722510
i luv this anon.

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>>81722538
>not even the political system created by revolutionaries that lived and breathed Marx' works and risked life and limb to overthrow the government and eventually achieve a truly socialist society couldn't make things work out

So "Marx was right, unfortunately every successful revolutionary that adhered to his works was utterly incompetent"?

Is that like how "the German people failed Nazism"

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>>81721747
Actually, critics of Marxists are the proponents of what you are calling social justice. Marxist criticism of social institutions is largely gender and race blind.

You are right that a lot of contemporary critical theory references Marxism, but these references exist largely to point out the perceived flaws of Marxism. These people are as much Marxists as anybody else that cites Marxists in order to criticize them are. If an NrX person for instance cites Althusser to explain why they think that the concept of the State Apparatus is bullshit, are they by some transitive property suddenly a Marxist too because their own proposed system has been contextualized with a reference to Marxism?

>>81722620
>Marx was right, unfortunately every successful revolutionary that adhered to his works was utterly incompetent
Reeee, it isn't me who wrote fantasy system which can't work in real life, it is you!!!!11

>>81722622
>Marxist criticism of social institutions is largely gender and race blind.

Except actual Marxists pretty much agree with everything your standard SJW does (i.e. #BlackLivesMatter, white privilege, etc), they just think that said SJW isn't going far enough and addressing the "real" problem of capitalism

>>81722620
>>81722538
Sorry guys, I must have missed the history class where the state was abolished in the Soviet Union

>>81722264
Based antagonist. Only thing Red Lotus did wrong was failing to capture Korra when she was young.

>>81722507
Oh, anon: this is a Zizek thread - the only worldview, or ideology, you'll get from a university is another false one; or, not false, but true only from a certain point of view. EVERY organization that inculcates a mindset is filling your head with biased ideologies that you must teach yourself to look past.

>>81722481
>conflates Leninism with Marxism
Good job, kiddo! Let us know when you're up to speed...

>>81722673
>What is a transitional state

At the end of the day you pretty much have to concede that either it's ultimately an unworkable ideology, or that those that adhere to it and are successful are either power-hungry sociopaths out to enrich themselves or just too incompetent to make the system successful enough to transition to "real" socialism

>>81722078
>Marxism is the opposite since it centralizes power in the goverment
You couldn't make it more obvious that you've never read Marx or even have the faintest idea of what he wrote about.

>>81722339
>therefore as a white person you unconsciously benefit from this system, and are therefore racist".
This is not Marxist. Please point to a Marxist work that actually says something like this, otherwise I can't take you seriously

>>81722706
I didn't say they were the same.

>>81722404
My bait is strong - fuck you, faggot.

>>81722668
Nope:
http//www.wsws.org/en/articles/2016/11/08/roll-n08.html
http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2016/07/23/gree-j23.html
TV related
http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2017/03/28/geto-m28.html

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>>81722668
Real Marxists will also have views that overlap with neoliberals, liberals, neocons, and isolationists from time to time. That doesn't make any of those ideologies Marxist. I don't get what you're trying to say.

>>81722032
gay

>>81722758
The "material causes" of "white privilege/institutional racism" etc essentially boil down to "Racism exists because capitalists want to divide the working-class against each other". It's never as simple as "Oh geez i dunno, white people just decided one day they hated blacks lmao"

>>81722725
>are either power-hungry sociopaths out to enrich themselves or just too incompetent
You do realize you just described every politician in every country of the world, of all political stripes - lefties, righties, and centrists are all either sociopaths, incompetent, or both.

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>Marxist apologists on /tv/
Not surprising anymore.

>>81722762
No, you conveniently switched terms in mid-thought - pathetic, anon. You should get some rest.

>>81715681

A FUCKING TREE

>>81722457
>damn vulnerable to misunderstanding that people who claim to study them can't agree
It is you who is misunderstanding anon. And the only reason we're even talking about either is because you brought up those terms when you clearly don't understand them. I know you're trying to do a connect the dots with Cultural Marxism, post-modernism and critical theory based off some shitty youtube video or /pol/, but if you're gonna make an argument, actually try to debate the substance instead of throwing out boogeyman words you misunderstood and then blaming your boogeyman for you misunderstanding them.

>>81722889
Are you trying to say that Lenin wasn't a Marxist or didn't believe in Marxist ideology? Because that's literally not true at all.

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>>81722869
They ain't the apologists, anon - haven't you been paying attention?
Oh, you're just a buttflustered stormfag who can't go toe-to-toe with a simple-minded marxist cuck, amirite?

>>81722589
Accurate, and for that more than likely, underrated post

>>81722825
not him but real Marxists are the most extreme left before it turns into the extreme right, that's pretty much it unless Marxists are so much on the left they can't even agree what to define themselves as lmao

>>81722868
He did, but here's the thing: you need some kind of hierarchal government for anything larger than a local community to function and since self-styled Marxist revolutions all end up trying to nationalize society the end result is trusting those politicians implicitly with ultimate control. Politicians suck regardless, but empowering them to be the vanguard of societal transformation and then expecting an honest transition to a classless society when they already completely control everything is beyond naive.

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>>81722944
No, I'm actually saying that Marxism and Leninism are two different systems, a fact of which you are clearly not aware. Like, at all. Do you even politics, brah?

>>81722995
horseshoe theory is retarded, take a lap

>>81723021
Are you gonna say that you're b8ing next? because again I literally never said they were the same systems

>>81722995
Hey, we finally reached the point where we are forced to realize that extremism on either side results in THE SAME SHIT. Can we move forward from this point, or just continue to fling shit at each other??

>>81722919
I wasn't the guy you were arguing with, I was pointing out those ideas are prone to misunderstandings from all walks of life, including those who claim to study them. Not everyone responding to your crap is the same person anon.

>>81722997
So yer saying that any power/control system must have checks and balances to power? How novel! How insightful! And you say that, without checks and balances, people will exploit their privileges for maximal self-interest?
So, you're saying we need TWO or more bodies with ultimate control in order to ensure fairness?

>>81723060
both are actually the exact opposite however the means by which you reach such endgames are the same, pure destruction

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>>81723055
Look how stupid this poor fool is!
0/10 faget
>inb4 i was just pretending to be dumb lol

>>81715681
>that semen demon on the left
Muh dick is aching

>>81723169
>every ideology wants to utterly destroy everything
Now we're getting somewhere....

>>81723228
no one takes you seriously, and no one thinks this is funny - why you do it?

>>81720897
"Classical Marxism" as a vehicle for "social justice" and their dreamed world republic has indeed been abandoned. But this has already happened since the 70s, and merely reached completion when the union collapsed.

Nearly ever academic/sophist/political guru involved with driving the modern "left-liberal" movement is an ex-marxist who thinks globalization is the better vehicle for marxism's lofty end goals. Hence why you can note the peculiar trend of big business and big capital largely funding the left nowadays, as they currently have convergent goals. (free movement of labour, goods, finance and the erasure of nationalism as a check on power).

A good example is Barosso, former head of the EU. A decidedly liberal organization, yet he used to be a card-carrying commie.

>>81723266
Speak for yourself. Who says it was a joke anyway? He's cute

>>81723152
Passive aggression is pathetic anon, especially on the internet. If the point is politicians are generally bad, then an ideology that gives them incredible power and then just expects them to work towards undoing all of that power is beyond naive.

>>81723271
It's also why you can actually find so called communists morphing into Randian objectivists the moment those powerful globalist corporations start discriminating in their favor.

>>81723271
So, we've finally killed the 'marxist' bogeyman - excellent! And now we have a new menace: GLOBALISM.
Can we lay off poor Marx now and attack the real villains?

>>81722944
Lenin was a Marxist, but Russia was far from ready for a Socialist Revolution. You need to have a fully industrialized, developed country before the revolution for it to work out, not a semi-feudal shithole that just got wrecked from World War I. Lenin did the best he could with the situation he was dealt with and tried to focus on developing Russia's industrial capacity. This makeshift method is Leninism, and as far as I'm concerned its only good for developing third world countries. By the time the Soviets had grown their industrial capacity and dealt with World War II, the Party Bureacracy had developed into almost a semi-class of their own that would look out for its own interests and eventually sell out as soon as they were given the opportunity as we saw with all the selling of the state Industries after the Soviet Union fell. Given the hand that was dealt to him, I don't detest Lenin, even though I think his program is wrong for what most Commies are trying to achieve. Who I detest the most from that period were the weak-minded, traitorous, perfidious Social Democrats who pledged they would organize a general strike in the occasion of War and then went ahead to vote in favor of World War I anyways. In my eyes, those are the true scumbags, responsible for such huge bloodshed and disaster for humanity

>>81723310
>>81723310
Feeling the need to say that about a picture that's been in public domain for 40 years just reeks of a desperate need for attention. Lonely, anon? Need a good dinkin'?? Do you have a pretty mouth???

>>81719173
That's not what the image means when talking about boom and bust.

You are silly.

>>81723370
Marx is still a fag though.

>>81723419
I know what it means, and the cyclical rise and fall of generational politics follows a similar pattern of actions and counter-actions. That's why the post said "ideological boom-bust cycles." The qualifier is important.

>>81723271
>Barosso
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jos%C3%A9_Manuel_Barroso#Early_political_career
Says here he joined the Maoists because it was one of the only two student orgs, resisting the government and then as soon as that was over, he joined the center-right party in 1980 and has been that way ever since

>>81722032
>Stick to kids shit

Star Wars IS kids shit

>>81722510
Keep up the good fight brother. /tv/ is /leftypol/ territory now.

>>81723610
You mean reddit. The faggots polluting this board come from reddit.

>>81723610
I haven't posted there in like 6 months. To many reddit fags and sjws were there last time. It's a pain arguing with them.

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Make a franchise based on the battle between good and evil. Then throw it all in the trash because you are out of ideas.

>>81723872
>Waaaah disney doesn't change anything, they play it too safe and won't do anything interesting with the franchise
>waaaaah they changed things my childhood is literally ruined

>>81724051
They didn't change anything though. They actually just copy pasted and made it shallower thematically.

>>81724183
Moving away from a dichotomy of good vs evil isn't a big change?

>>81724216
Prequels already started doing that anyways

>>81723872
>Make a franchise based on the battle between good and evil

Except there was nothing deep about the original Star Wars films, they only arose because Lucas wanted to make a homage to Buck-Rogers-style space operas

>>81724284
in >>81723872 you made it out to be a new thing.

>>81724304
People who say things like "space operas" or "flash gordon serials" are just parroting things that everybody has heard before. You're barely making a coherent point, the qoute you pulled doesn't imply anon thinks Star Wars is deep. You just wanted to say "space operas" to feel smart.

>>81715681
>anarcho Marxist
This is what talking in platitudes does to people

>>81724216
How does stuff like turning stormtroopers into Roman saluting gestapo accomplish that again?

>>81724325
That's not me. I'm a different poster. Sorry for the confusion, tripfag

>>81724622
You should use a tripcode so it is easier to follow who is who.

>>81724614
Fuck do I know, >>81723872 this guy seems to think they've done that though.

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>>81715681

>>81721411
>zizek is the biggest pseudo-intellectual of our time
don't you mean anita sarkeesian?

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>>81715681

>>81722165
>he thinks college expands people's worldviews and doesn't just sell the same one everywhere

kys selves whites

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ywsSInVMF8

>>81715681
>luke is such a bland personality free character anyone can project any dumb personality traits onto him

sad!

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I'm sorry but this guy is a joke.

>>81727423
He is a good source of chuckles
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rzXPyCY7jbs

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>>81722750
Firstly you haven't given any argument. Probably because you're too stupid to do so?

Secondly here's why you're wrong:
>"Proletarians and Communists", the second section... ends by outlining a set of short-term demands—among them a progressive income tax; abolition of inheritances and private property; free public education; nationalisation of the means of transport and communication; centralisation of credit via a national bank; expansion of publicly owned etc.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Communist_Manifesto

Emphasis on the words "nationalisation" and "centralisation".

You're welcome. Next time read a fucking book. And don't be such a fucking dumbass.

#OWNED

>>81728907
I saw one of his videos where he said it is good to punch yourself like in fight club and all I can say is I hope he does it a lot

>>81716934
kek

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>>81715681
>episode 6
>gang saves galaxy
>gang is together and happy
>everyone happy for return of jedi order
>force ghosts just chillin with luke now
>republic making a return

>episode 7
>republic shrekt and galaxy is shit as ever
>old gang does nothing of value
>old gang is split up with ruined relationships
>no force ghosts to be seen

>episode 8
>two thirds of gang are dead
>jedi order needs destroying
>no force ghosts to be seen
>luke probably still do nothing of value

Are Disney the EA of movies?

>>81716995
>What are trade negotiations?

>>81718058
>being this triggered by a nickname
Go back to your safe space, nigger.

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>>81729293
>comments i don't like need to leave! REEEEEEEE!
You realise you're asking for the very definition of a safe space right?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Faggot

>>81718412
She actually was.

>>81729249
EA made the last battlefront which was an abortion

>>81721128
>their shitty ideas
I'm not a marxist, but I find a lot of ideas or consequences of marxist or post-marxist thinking actually to be a consequence of or in the lines of traditions of the ideals of the Age of European Enlightenment. So I'm curious what you consider alternatives to theirs. Social darwinism?

>>81722069
I agree with you. This is a much needed differentiation here and in this discourse in general. Actual marxist ideology is a tank that needs to be cleaned from the inside. Otherwise there will only be argument and missunderstanding because of the idiot that shouts the loudest. Same with feminism and what not. Uninformd radicalism and it's agents needs to be fought and marginalized.

>>81729337
>You realise you're asking for the very definition of a safe space right?
I'm not. I'm just telling the guy and you to go fuck off.
Dipshit.

>>81729094
>>81729110

>lefti content in thread
>actually intelligent conversation and coherent sentences occurs and not just droning on in dumb "am-I-rite-guyz" memes
>nu right replies with ad homs and meme pictures and ill informed notions about how marxism and communism are the same

Really makes you think

>>81729860
Because for all intents and purposes there isn't any practical or political difference to any group that isn't either of those two things. The only time a distinction is worth discussing is when hard leftists inevitably start cannibalizing one another after their glorious revolution.

You can sit in an ivory tower and complain about all the rubes who totally don't understand your specific ideology of choice, but at the end of the day nobody who opposes those ideas in any measurable quantity is going to care anymore than someone left-of-center is going to care about the distinctions between someone being an acolyte of Strasser versus one of Mussolini.

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>>81729755
HAHAHA you don't even know the meaning of the phrase "safe space"!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

>>81729860
>my post provides textual evidence
>all you can do is use meme arrows instead of actually providing an argument against what I said

Are you seriously this fucking dumb?

>>81729989
This is very true, you are absolutely right.

But even worse is the fact that these leftists think "you don't understand true socialism! WAH WAH WAH WAH WAH WAH!" is an argument.

It isn't an argument, of course. They are deliberately avoiding having to make an argument presumably because they have no argument.

>>81715681
>marxist
>knowing things
This post is a joke, right?

>>81730093
You are inferring that marxism is the same as communism. You don't know shit and don't deserve an actual reply.

>>81717460
>*schniffe*

>>81715681

What would you rather have him look like? I bet he looks like a trainwreck without the beard.

>>81730117
It isn't an argument, it's a reason as to why you're unfit to argue.

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>>81730499
Translation:
>i don't have any arguments
Got it, chump

>>81730622
You don't have any arguments

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Socialist cucks BTFO

>>81730622
Unfortunately for you, you don't get to decide that and if the minute differences outsiders don't care to recognize between two similar ideologies causes you to shut down like that the only person losing the argument is you.

Not even that anon, but you've got to realize how fucking childish this looks. Stated beliefs and all their infinitely complex permutations are a world of difference to tangible goals that end up accomplished whenever those ideas are put into practice and for all intents and purposes Marxism and Communism don't have much of a difference in their real life applications. Again, do you expect Strasserites, Mussolinifags, or Hitlerdindunuffins to stomp their feet because you won't recognize the differences inherent to their flavors of facism?

Why the fuck do you expect the same when it comes to the multitudes of schizophrenic leftwing ideologies? What gives you the arrogance to bitch about people being "disqualified," from an argument because they don't care about the minutiae of slightly different political philosophies? Explain it to him instead of playing this pathetically passive-aggressive "educate yourself!" nonsense for once.

>anarco-Marxist

That's a redundancy.

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>>81730909
Very, very good post. You are exactly right. They're literally just avoiding having to defend their position through cowardice.

If you want to convince somebody in an argument then the onus is on you to explain yourself. And if you don't want to convince somebody, then okay, give up, and the other person will continue believing what they want to believe.

>>81730961
I assume you mean tautology, but I'm pretty sure Marxism is authoritarian, is it not? Since Marx wanted everything to be centralised and nationalised (i.e. put in the hands of the government).

>>81730961
And a contradiction in that self-styled Marxist countries rapidly devolve into statist hell-holes most of the time.

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>>81731148
I notice that the leftists haven't responded. Wow. Really makes me think.

Good thread. Wrong board though.

>>81729543
So no reply here?
Hmmm...

>>81730961
>>81731082
I don't know what books you guys read, but they sure as fuck don't talk about marxism. Go read up on it before you talk about it.
And before you ask, no, I'm not doing your homework for you.

>>81718412
That's true but please consider the fact that Sheev is a fucking faggot scumbag.

>>81731876
It's not marxism because the belief cited by the nu-marxists is just one component/belief of marxism when marxism, and similarly any other ideology, is composed of many philosophical facets that are typically associated together.

The anon is not asking you to refute marxism, as many anons are trying to deflect this specific corruption of ONE FACET of the marxist ideology(inspired by a marxist interpretation does equate to holding a "marxist" view because the idea came from one marxist idea out of many), but instead interpret and thus better understand this asset of marxism that has been corrupted.

We understand it's not marxism because it's a collection of beliefs that are supposed to work together. But obviously the people who hold at least one marxist belief still consider themselves to be marxists. Just explain that one specific corrupted theory instead of deflecting. It's just the easy way out to state an obvious answer.

>>81731776
That's probably because what today counts as right wing ideology is essentially anti-Enlightenment and regressive reactionary thought as a reaction to an ever increasing complexity and interconnectedness in the world out there.

>>81732393
No, what counts as right wing is everything the hard left opposes. I voted for Obama twice and was a monkey's nut hair from becoming a communist myself until it dawned on me that a few of my stances were getting me tossed out of circles I agreed with 80%+ of the time. That was just a few years ago.

If you're wondering why nobody gives a shit when you point out white supremacists, it's because leftwing faggots have used to that describe things as innocuous as a white majority country with no intention on "fixing that."

And no, the ideologies of the 19th and 20th centuries are direct results of the Enlightenment. Unless you can find me people advocating for feudalistic baronies and powerful monarchies I'd refrain from just throwing "anti-goodthings!" at your rhetorical enemies.

>>81715681
>tumblr
>lesbianrey
>carrie fisher icon

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This is the most wordy thread I think I've ever been in but I read through all of it.

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>>81731677
You're right. Hope I don't get banned for not being on topic but everyone else is doing it, so...

>>81731876
Translation
>i have no argument
Why don't you just admit it?

You are stupid and you don't have any argument to defend your position.

And I find this very, very, VERY funny.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

8 YEARS

8 YEARS OF TRUMP

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Holy shit this is the most reddit thread i've read in months, we only need the upvote system and we're set.

>>81732393
> what today counts as right wing ideology is essentially anti-Enlightenment and regressive reactionary thought as a reaction to an ever increasing complexity and interconnectedness in the world
The biggest non-argument to have ever existed

Good to know that you don't have any arguments to defend your position

>anti-Enlightenment
Well given that the right-wing currently stands up for scientific truth (for example, the fact that males and females are biologically different), how do you square that one, cuz?

The left is off in cloud cuckoo land, completely disregarding scientific truths.

>>81733025
Thank God we don't have that though. On 4chan people can actually debate their ideas. On Reddit, anything that the hivemind doesn't like gets downvoted until it is invisible.

Yeah 4chan is still a bit of a circlejerk but it's a lot less faggoty than Leddit.

>>81733083
All fair and good points, desu

>>81732976
Sorry, my friend, but not everybody has too much time to educate idiots online. I come here for movies and to not use my brain for a change, for you it seems to be the opposite, judging by what you put out.

The simple rule for 4chan argument is that the person with less of a life wins. So yeah, enjoy your triumph on the site's dumbest board, shitposter.

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>>81733163
Thanks mang.

One of the biggest memes on the left is that the right-wing is stupid. And it's a funny meme, because they are really hurting themselves with that belief.

The reason being that they vastly underestimate the intellectual prowess of the right.

>>81733280
>i have no arguments
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Leftist cucks BLOWN THE FUCK OUT

Actually the person who wins is the person who demonstrates the value of their belief through rational argument. There's nowhere to hide here, buddy. And since you have not defended your position with rational argument, you have conceded the argument. Therefore, I have won this argument.

Are you really going to give up that easily?

>>81733324
You're trying much too hard.

>>81733324
Thank's for making it obvious that you're just one raging samefagging person btw.

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>>81720366
pure autishm

>>81733083
Neither party represents science very well because of scientific issues that have been subject to contention as they are politicized and often philosophically ambiguous.
See: abortion, anthropogenic climate change, racial crime, gun laws, various other policies.

>>81733324
>One of the biggest memes on the left is that the right-wing is stupid. And it's a funny meme, because they are really hurting themselves with that belief.
True, I agree.

>>81733083
>the right-wing currently stands up for scientific truth (for example, the fact that males and females are biologically different), how do you square that one, cuz?

by pointing at your overdeveloped and sandy vagina

>>81733526
Lol

>>81721086
>Meanwhile Darth Sidious creates Anakin Skywalker to be a false prophet / golem type creation

If Palpatine was the creator of Anakin (solving the muh virgin birth riddle) that would okay, I would be okay with that.

>The Jedi are fooled into thinking he's The One

Literally only Obi Wan thinks this though.

>Anakin destroys almost all the Jedi

That was all the clone troopers. Anakin just killed some kids, then got rekt by Obi Wan.

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>>81733378
>>81733445
Neither of these are arguments.

Do socialists not have any arguments for their position then? Shame.

>>81733508
I agree those topics are contested by scientists. I would also say that each party has some science on their side regarding their perspective on these issues. They obviously choose the science that backs up their desired position.

But on biological sex, for one thing, the right-wing has science on its side. People on the left right now are claiming that biological sex doesn't exist, or that it isn't binary. The weight of scientific evidence and opinion disagrees with these assessments. Science has of course recognised intersex conditions. But they are very rare. They are found in about 0.3% of births. Sex in humans is still considered to be binary because 99.7% of people are very clearly and discernibly either male or female.

>>81733511
Also of course they are using it as an excuse to not have to defend their positions with arguments. Presumably because they don't have any. Or they're too stupid to express them coherently.

>>81733526
I'm male. Anyway, good to know you don't have an argument.

>>81733558
Guessing you don't have any argument either?

>>81733842
So I'm guessing the vagina joke went over your head then

>>81734049
I think the joke is "ur a girl lol" but is it more sophisticated than this? If so then yes it has gone over my head; please do explain.

>>81722125
Not one sentence without a leftshit buzzword. You're essentially speaking a different language. the only way you're able to convince yourself that your shit makes sense is that you've crafted an entire language around it, to wall it off from regular language where someone could call you out on obvious contradictions.

>"cultural marxism" which doesn't really mean anything in academic discourse

Cultural marxism is a term coined to describe the very academics you're referring to, so no shit, they don't use that term themselves. That would be like KKK members calling each other racist (and meaning it as an insult).

>Race and gender as social constructs cannot be destroyed until class is

Race and sex are not social constructs. "Gender" is though and it has an expiration date coming up. And your insane ramblings are like rays of light making it expire faster. Please use the word as often as you can so people's association of it with insanity is strengthened.

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>>81734236
Very good post

>>81732976
>>81733842
There are plenty of arguments in this thread that goes in details on what marxism is about, you're an idiot who came late to the party going "muh 8 years" as if it was in any way significant and claims the right has science in its size when trump (who i assume you endorse) is openly a climate change denier.

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>>81734472
Real scientists deny climate change as well. Plenty of real scientists know that climate change "research" is full of foregone conclusions and manipulated data.

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>>81734472
>there are arguments elsewhere!
That isn't an argument. If you want to defend your position then you have to provide some argument. "There are arguments elsewhere!" isn't an argument.

>claims climate science is a settled issue with no room for debate whatsoever
That's not very scientific. Science respects healthy debate, based upon observable evidence. Dogma has no place in science.

The climate is still a debated issue for two reasons. One, none of us know, with certainty, what the effects of global warming will be in the future; how quickly these negative effects might come about. Two, even if we DID know with absolute certainty (which we don't), there is still an open question of how we should act. E.g. how much the West should try and cut emissions by, when other countries in the world aren't cutting their emissions nearly as much, and when there are no real penalties that can be imposed on those countries if they don't cut their emissions.

My point about science was that on the issue of biological sex, and not only this but also biologically-founded differences between men and women (e.g. men being more interested in systems, and thus technical jobs such as engineering, IT, stuff like this, due to higher levels of testosterone in men, which have been found to produce this "masculine" pattern of interest), the right has science on its side.

The left seems to believe in some sort of tabula rasa (blank slate) theory when it comes to gender differences. But science shows us that such a theory is false. There are biologically-founded differences in the patterns of interest of males and females.

>>81734847
>There are biologically-founded differences in the patterns of interest of males and females.
Ok, so how about transsexuals or hermaphrodites then? How are their interest patterns being evaluated in these studies? >inb4 noone cares
I'm genuinely asking here and also pretty appreciative if you could give a source for that.

>>81734236
I dont know why im doing this but; yiu can't try to argue when you first doesnt understand simple sentences in their form :
>"cultural marxism" which doesn't really mean anything in academic discourse
What is said here is that marxism is an ideology on itself and you can't try to criticise it by mixing it with a term used by conservatives wanting to diminish any form of socialism. What you call cultural marxism is a boogey man for a group you can simply call, social justoce warrior, who are desillusioned young trying to fight anpther boogeyman, the "patriarchy". That weren't part of this debate.
>Race and gender as social constructs cannot be destroyed until class is
Here you dismisss what the anon implies in that if sjw believe race and gender are social construct (in truth it is the social classes of race and gender that are economicaly created), then their errors are to aim at the destruction of those construction without attacking the capitalistic reasons that created oppression onto these class, hence if their focus aren't in a reform to the economic system but primarily in the destruction of our understanding of those classe, they aren't marxist ideology.

I will justify my weak rethoric by bad translation from my native language. So please by considerate

>>81734762
There is a consensus for a reason, don't try to paint climate change as if the world is burning or freezing, there is a real scientific opinion over. What you see in your picture is how scientist has to fight climate sceptic but you conveniently won't read any article about how corrupt institue will try to dillute the debate without backing their saying by scientific theories. You'll have to try harder to refute a scientific claim than cherrypicking a few emails discussing the subject.

>>81734847
Fuck. Forst the climate change debate isnt on what it will do primary, it's on what has changed now, you can't mixed all the thing, there os no wcientific evidence on what will happen, only what has been done. Two, i don't see how you can claim that the left don't believe in sexes, which is wrong, i will argue that there is a movement to the acceptance of transexual (that i don't personnaly tolerate to a point) but nowhere will you see scientific evidence that male and female are the same. On the status of habits of male and female, no sane person will deny that male and female arent prone to some activity, the debate isn't that more men are in science and more female in social care or that one isn't better than the other in whatever field, it's more that no sex has to be confine to one role but more that both sex can participate in whatever activity traditionaly seen as exclusively to one sex. You can argue that you will find more men scientist but ypu can't say that there can't be women scientist.

>>81718412
She was right, but I don't see what she was expecting to accomplish with a bomb attack.

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>>81722228
Sick of it.

>>81734847
On the point of science, i want to ask you(and him >>81734762); if some fags claims that sex and gender aren't real and they deny the biological fact that are supposed to be basic stuff to learn, would you try to educate them ? When you educate them and they start crying at oppression and simply dismiss those facts as old science that were misinterpreted, would you still consider them worthy of any reflection ? Personnaly i will simply stop interracting with them.
On the climate thing that is the same thing i see, scientist compile complex data and complete observation that isn't light reading and for the majority of which you have to have advanced knowledge of science to be able to interpret them, when for many years they try to explain things and they are refuted by simple minds who ask how can the climate change if it snows in their region, i can understand why they won't want to interact whit people who clearly won't represent the data correctly.

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>>81734995
>I'm genuinely asking here and also pretty appreciative if you could give a source for that.
Sure. Simon Baron-Cohen is one guy who has looked into this. He's a Professor of Developmental Psychopathology (that means the development of psychological disorders) at the University of Cambridge. Also he's the cousin of Borat / Ali G (Sacha Baron-Cohen).

He did an experiment on children, first measuring their testosterone levels in the womb. On their first day of life (so, before any socialisation), he showed these babies a mechanical object and a face. The babies with the higher prenatal levels of testosterone spent more time looking at the mechanical object. Those with lower levels spent more time looking at the face. This was true whether the baby was male or female, which is how we realised that testosterone was responsible. But the male babies, on average, produced twice as much testosterone in the womb. So the male babies tended to look at the mechanical object much more than the face.

He then studied these children as they grew older. Higher levels of prenatal testosterone were found to be associated with the following traits:
>Less eye contact
>Taking longer to develop social skills
>Taking longer to learn language
>Having more difficulty empathising with others
>Showing a greater interest in understanding systems

Another reason he realised it was testosterone causing these things is because female babies which had unusually high levels of testosterone displayed the same patterns of behaviour.

If you want to watch Prof. Baron-Cohen talk about this, then watch this video from 22:20 (his section is about three minutes long): https://youtu.be/tiJVJ5QRRUE?t=22m20s

I'll answer the bits about transsexuals and hermaphrodites in another post, bear with me.

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>>81719921
>>81721674
>>81724454
>>81720054
Anarchism is an inherently left wing political philosophy. It literally means the abolition of hierarchy. If anything, anarcho-capitalism is more of an oxymoron since hierarchy is a fundamental tenant of the philosophy. The state is also necessary to enforce private property rights.

>>81736394
>>Less eye contact
>>Taking longer to develop social skills
>>Taking longer to learn language
>>Having more difficulty empathising with others
>>Showing a greater interest in understanding systems
So.... Do testosterone and autism correlate??

>>81736523
Remarking on the fact anarchism is contradictory to communism even though the former is the stated end goal of the latter due to the means of transition the ideology calls for (dictatorship of the proletariat which in all practical sense means a powerful government) does not equate to an argument that anarcho-capitalism is any better.

The red-blacks are as self-contradictory and deluded as the yellow-blacks are. Anarchism as a political ideology in general is a total pipe dream that wouldn't work for anything larger than a small local community.

>>81736523
All of what you post is only correct on a superfluous level though; namely when you don't know much about anarchy or anarcho-capitalism. Anarchy doesn't per se mean the abolition of hierarchy, an anarchist can well decide to accept authority of an expert if he wants to.
Anarcho-capitalism, like anarchy aims roughly for the abolition of the state and for a maximization of personal freedom.

AND SHO ON AND SHO FORCE

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>>81734995
Continued from this: >>81736394
>how about transsexuals or hermaphrodites then?
Well hermaphrodites are people who have slightly confused physical morphology, and/or non-standard chromosomes outside of the normal XX/XY binary. These days these people are usually referred to as "intersex".

For intersex people, it will depend on their condition. Klinefelter syndrome is one form of intersex: it is people born with XXY chromosomes. They are often thought as "male" because they have penises. But the extra X chromosome causes low testosterone levels, as well as the development of some breast tissue (moobs, you might call them).

Then of course you can have women who have unusually high levels of testosterone - this is called hyperandrogenism. Caster Semenya (pic), the South African female runner, is an example of this. She has very high T levels, so she's very strong athletically (because more T allows you to build more muscle).

So yeah the answer to "what about hermaphrodites" is the same as the answer for normal males and females. It's a question of hormones.

>Transsexuals
Well, transsexuals are people who have chosen to undergo "sex reassignment surgery" (I don't want to call it this, because you can't actually change your chromosomal sex. But that's what it's usually called)

They could be people who are perfectly healthy and normal, with healthy and normal levels of hormones for their sex, who just choose to undertake this surgery.

If they feel they "are in the wrong body", then this could be for numerous reasons: perhaps they have atypical hormone levels for their sex, perhaps there are sociological/psychological/family/environmental factors at play (e.g. abuse, bullying, etc.). Both genetics and your environment (and the activities that you participate in) will affect your hormone levels. And if your hormone levels are atypical for your sex, then you might feel like you are different to other members of your sex.

Hope this helps.

>>81736548
Actually that wouldn't be surprising. People have posited before that one of the differences between men and women is the tendency of men to exist on behavioral extremes (positive and negative) while women inhabit more of a stable center between the two.

>>81736657
Nah. Anarchism is the ultimate endgame of ideal democracy.

>>81736394
>>81736548
>So.... Do testosterone and autism correlate??
Well what the anon conveniently left out is that his works are primarily on autism children, so unironically it may be..:
"Baron-Cohen's work in systemising-empathising led him to investigate whether higher levels of fetal testosterone explain the increased prevalence of autism spectrum disorders among males;[16] his theory is known as the "extreme male brain" theory of autism."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_Baron-Cohen

>>81736701
Ideal yes. Ideals don't often or even usually survive in the real world full of circumstances political philosophers fail to even contemplate. You and I both know that would never work with the way human nature does presently.

>>81736721
LOL

>>81735767
>there os no wcientific evidence on what will happen
Well that's my point. The left says "science is settled! Climate change is happening! And we're all going to be underwater before long! That's a fact!"

But really scientists don't know exactly what these timescales are, which is why we should have debate about this.

>i don't see how you can claim that the left don't believe in sexes, which is wrong
Some of them do. They believe that biological sex is a sliding scale, rather than a binary. They focus on the existence of intersex (non-male and non-female) people. Yes those people exist, but they're about 0.3% of births. Most people fall into the male and female categorisations. So science still considers human sex to be binary.

> On the status of habits of male and female, no sane person will deny that male and female arent prone to some activity, the debate isn't that more men are in science and more female in social care or that one isn't better than the other in whatever field, it's more that no sex has to be confine to one role but more that both sex can participate in whatever activity traditionaly seen as exclusively to one sex
There are some people on the left (not everybody on the left, but some) that say that there are no biological reasons why you find more men in science than women. But science shows this to be wrong.

>You can argue that you will find more men scientist but ypu can't say that there can't be women scientist.
I agree that there have been female scientists, like Marie Curie. Whether we should permit women into science is, of course, a completely different question from the biological differences between men and women.

>>81718412
>ywn see Ahsoka x Barris scissoring

>>81736759
>muh human nature
everytime

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>>81715681

>>81736332
>On the point of science, i want to ask you(and him >>81734762); if some fags claims that sex and gender aren't real and they deny the biological fact that are supposed to be basic stuff to learn, would you try to educate them ? When you educate them and they start crying at oppression and simply dismiss those facts as old science that were misinterpreted, would you still consider them worthy of any reflection ? Personnaly i will simply stop interracting with them.
Sometimes I try. It depends if I can be bothered. If they want to believe things that I think are false, then whatever. Their loss.

>On the climate thing that is the same thing i see, scientist compile complex data and complete observation that isn't light reading and for the majority of which you have to have advanced knowledge of science to be able to interpret them, when for many years they try to explain things and they are refuted by simple minds who ask how can the climate change if it snows in their region, i can understand why they won't want to interact whit people who clearly won't represent the data correctly.
That's a fair point, I will admit that. I am not necessarily denying that anthropogenic climate change is happening. Personally I haven't read enough to be an expert on the subject.

I think that humans may well be contributing to climate change (and yes, many scientists obviously think we are, which is strong evidence to suggest that anthropogenic climate change is, to an extent, real).

How much we are contributing to this change, though, is still an open question in my mind. But again I guess I haven't looked into it massively.

And also, regardless of the facts, the political question of what we should do still exists. Should we be killing some of our industries, just because they produce CO2? The economics have to be balanced against the environmental concerns, in my opinion.

>>81736548
Yes. Baron-Cohen's primary research area is autism. He has noted that autism is much more common in males, and is associated with high prenatal levels of testosterone.

>>81736700
Indeed.

>>81736721
>conveniently left out
Because it was irrelevant to the point I was making. Of course I have read about the extreme male brain theory; I just didn't think it was relevant to my point about the differences about men and women.

>>81736394
>>81736693
I want to add a quote from one of the biggest critics of baron-cohen, for the sake of argumentation.
"Claims that by nature men orient to objects and women orient to people are not new (see Maccoby &
Jacklin, 1974, for a review of older claims and Browne, 2002, and Pinker, 2002, for recent statements), but Con-
nellan et al.’s (2000) experiment seems to have given them compelling support. The experiment is unusual, however, in three respects. First, it stands alone. It is customary, in infant research, to replicate key findings and assemble
multiple experiments in support of any claim. No replication of Connellan et al.’s experiment has been published, however, and no unpublished replications are mentioned in Baron-Cohen’s (2003, 2005a) discussions of their finding. The lack of replication is particularly curious, because a large, older literature suggests that male and female infants are equally interested in people and objects (Maccoby & Jacklin, 1974). Numerous experiments in the 1960s compared infants’ visual attention to faces versus inanimate patterns. One study, for example, assessed infants’ visual attention to a live person in a free play setting at one and three months and assessed their visual attention to pictures of faces and inanimate displays in a controlled setting at the latter age (Moss & Robson, 1968). Male and female infants looked equally at the live person at both ages. At three months, all infants looked longer at the face than the inanimate display, and this preference was greater for the male infants. These findings, like others from more recent research (see Rochat, 2001, for a review), provide no evidence that male infants are more focused on objects and female infants are more focused on people from birth onward."
https://software.rc.fas.harvard.edu/lds/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/spelke2005.pdf

>>81737047
It is when your argument is that biological difference in male and female determining their interest in activities are scientificaly supported when all there exist for the moment are a couple of study where the more important is a single experience with no reproduction. I'm not saying it isn't interesting, but it is far than scientificaly supported.

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>anarcho-marxist
disgusting

I'm hoping Luke will be a centrist in the next movie.

>>81737135
Well whatever paper that is, it's pure bollocks.

Males and females are biologically different and it's due to hormones. Males produce testosterone because we have testicles. Testosterone has well-documented effects: development of muscle, aggressive behaviour, etc.

Adult males produce TWENTY TIMES as much testosterone as females. TWENTY TIMES. That's a lot. Our metabolism of it is also about twice as fast, which means that our blood levels are about seven to eight times higher than in women.

>On average, in adult males, levels of testosterone are about 7–8 times as great as in adult females.[7] As the metabolic consumption of testosterone in males is greater, the daily production is about 20 times greater in men.[8][9]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Testosterone

Essentially that paper you quoted is just saying "OH BUT MAYBE BARON-COHEN IS WRONG", but it's not giving me any argument, or any evidence to suggest that males and females are blank slates, without hormonal differences.

The hormonal differences between males and females are incredibly well-documented, and so are the effects of hormones. So I'm going to believe Baron-Cohen, instead of the ideological cunt that you have quoted.

>>81737277
It is scientifically supported actually. You are trying to discredit his study but you're not providing any sort of solid reasons why it is wrong. You're also not providing any solid evidence to support the opposite case; the blank slate theory.

Faggot. Go be a fucking faggot somewhere else. Here's a suggestion: >>>/lgbt/

>>81721244
You could say the same about admiral ackbar for Christ sakes

>>81715681
Well the Jews took over Star Wars and the Jews created communism.

>>81736848
I'm left-leaning in politics and i heard those shit about sex from liberals and it makes me cringe, but in my environment i'm more surounded by people who find transexuals as having some sort of mental problems and it is in that way that they have to be understood, the problem is when transexuals don't want to be seen as mentaly unstable and they can find groups of people who will tolerate their mentality without questioning the reality of things, that those people have problems living in their body. What i want to say is that stupid opinions can't represent any ideology if they have no merits, i will accept that the left created a bad image of itself to the point i don't recognize myself as such, but i can say the same to right wingers. On refugee for exemple i don't accept the racist reason against it, but i can see clearly that there are economics obstacles to importing foreigner on countries where people already have troubles making a living of their own. My point is that any party will actracts a lot of people leaning extremly over one ideology on the basis of their personnal beliefs, but we can't mixed those personnal feelings with what an ideology is supposed to represent, that's how the left can be seen as sjw and the right as a bunch of racist, those are false, personnaly i see the left being more socialist and the right being more capitalist. And for the sake of argumentation, we have to keep those central points as important to those ideals.

>>81736949
Well your idea of climate change is more close to the scientific concensus, the problem is that what we could do and what is proposed are politicals opinions that aren't that much inspired from scientific facts. The reality is that we may be contributing, but not as much as the media would want to make people believe. The more important point isn't to make industries go extinct, but how can we advance as a society knowing how the climate can change (again, it's not as much as the media want us to thinks), here is the real chalenge and we should know it is not an easy debate, but we shouldn't fall to the lies used by politicians to instill fear in the population. You don't have to deny climate change but you don't have to exagerate it either

Why does leftypol worship some fat ugly retarded movie reviewer?

>>81735513
>What you see in your picture is how scientist has to fight climate sceptic

That picture was chock full of evidence that climate cultists tamper with evidence to fake a trend that isn't there. Their models NEVER successfully predict anything, so they have to fake it. The "consensus" is bought and paid for. Scientists who go against it are blacklisted from the community.

>>81737376
I'm not trying to discredit his study, i'm saying that one study isn't a complete understanding of how one theory can work. I quote a rebutal just for argumenting here : >>81737135 , and you said it's pure bollocks when it is supported by many studies too. I'm not saying male and female are not different, don't play dumb, i'm saying that you can't define preference in activity between sex with one experience as simple as having a baby choose an object. Telling that there is more at play in the difference between male and female than what they recognize when they are babies isn't the same as saying male and female are not different. You have evidence in the paper, there are sources for what is claimed here, you can't say there is no argument when there are years of study beind it. You understood what you wanted, you understand the difference in level of hormones between sex, but how is it played in behavioral pattern is more complex than one experience can show.

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>>81717460

>>81738403
>>81738434
What's nido.org and why did you feel the need to take it out of the name of your image.

>>81736887
Well, it'll keep getting repeated if you plan on advocating for ideologies that do nothing but push hopeless ideals and what ifs with no possibility of functioning in the real world.

>>81738386
I responded to that paper you quoted here: >>81737331

>You understood what you wanted
I understood what the science shows, actually.

>>81737944
Fair enough. Not an irrational post.

>>81738138
There just isn't really much sensible debate about the issue. Maybe I should watch that new Al Gore movie, even though I hate that cunt.

>>81721086
this actually sounds pretty good, but disney will probably shit out some ray is someones daughter plot twist shit.

>>81722032
You lack of self awareness is disconcerting.
But also, pretty fun.

>>81722032
Kid stuff.. like SW.
I can barely express with words the amount of contempt I feel for you right now.

>>81738771
Holy fuck, autist.

>>81716995
At least that's something new for the character, what they did with han with putting him back to exactly the same place he was at the beginning was far worse.

>>81740137
What?

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>>81716934
>>81717460

get the fuck back to leftypol

>>81740137
>A-autist!!

>>81740504
Kill yourself.

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>>81740840
No. Faggot. :^)

>>81722410
>post-modernism stood for,

Yeah because it's so easy to pinpoint what postmodernists actually stand for...

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>>81721836
>Hamill looks nothing like Zizek

>>81721086
What a fucking shit idea that would ruin anakins character and make his entire redemption story pointless.

>>81741695
Sounds like Disney, alright

>>81731876
>I'm not doing your homework for you.

I fucking hate this shit, surely if you are arguing against someone an implicit assumption is that the other person is ignoring facts or ignorant to facts that you have and are hence trying to persuade them. Saying this is just saying "I can't be bothered to actually argue my point".

>>81723539
>>81739611
Lucas' Star Wars (especially the prequels) is kids shit. The new stuff is manchild shit. There's a difference

>>81741817
This is not the point that was made.
Can't tell if autism or moving the goalpost.

>>81738198
uneducated retards

>>81731876
The final state of a marxist society is communism, which is inherently stateless. Why you need to apply the "anarcho-" tag to something that is already stateless?

>but I'm pretty sure Marxism is authoritarian, is it not? Since Marx wanted everything to be centralised and nationalised (i.e. put in the hands of the government).
Marx essentially described how he thought that society would "evolve." To put it simply, the next step after capitalism is class-revolt leading to socialism (which is statist), and eventually everybody sees how awesome everything is and state-control becomes unnecessary, leading to communism.

>>81742133
>Marx essentially described how he thought that society would "evolve." To put it simply, the next step after capitalism is class-revolt leading to socialism (which is statist), and eventually everybody sees how awesome everything is and state-control becomes unnecessary, leading to communism.

AHAH did anone ever believed in this bullshit?

>>81715681
>tfw your name has the letter ž in it

>>81741916
The sequels are more "mature" than the prequels and OT, even if just a little. Therefor, you can expect darker themes and character arcs, deaths of iconic characters, etc. If you want the good guys to prevail all the time, watch shows and movies geared directly to kids.

>>81742133
who is marx anyway? he was some worthless "fundie" who never worked a day in his life and was supported by his rich friends/family. just like today. just like barney sandals

all "intellectuals" must die

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>it's not REAL marxism!

>>81721827
>Ahuviya Harel

Oh fuck, I'd forgotten about him.

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This is your higher education on Marxism

>>81742133
Interesting. Why did that last part never happen in any of the statist socialist countries then?

>>81735767
>On the status of habits of male and female, no sane person will deny that male and female arent prone to some activity, the debate isn't that more men are in science and more female in social care or that one isn't better than the other in whatever field, it's more that no sex has to be confine to one role but more that both sex can participate in whatever activity traditionaly seen as exclusively to one sex. You can argue that you will find more men scientist but ypu can't say that there can't be women scientist.

There has been a very real and very pernicious push towards equity in academia which is predicated on the idea that if you remove all social barriers men and women will make the same choices.

>>81736700
>Actually that wouldn't be surprising. People have posited before that one of the differences between men and women is the tendency of men to exist on behavioral extremes (positive and negative) while women inhabit more of a stable center between the two.

This would be completely consistent with what we observe in other species in regard to male and female dimorphism.

>>81736394
>High amounts of test is bad for you goy
>(((Baron-Cohen)))

>>81743541
>High amounts of test is bad for you goy

HOW THE FUCK did you get that from what I said?

Testosterone is the male sex hormone, so obviously if you're male, it's good to have lots of it

How fucking dense are you?

>>81736949
>The economics have to be balanced against the environmental concerns, in my opinion.
They are so far imbalanced we have an 8th continent of trash

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>>81742769
No that's your higher education on neoliberalism. I guarantee you they love to consume Starbucks, Apple, and other capitalist products without considering the workers

>>81721827
>that picture
i laugh everytiem. please post the one where Stalin is smiling/laughing at Hitler despairing over modern neonazi failures.

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reminder that marx is literally /our guy/

>>81736332
See this is my issue. Fags like you want to make false equivalencies about science, when being transgender or whatever only affects that person and is no trouble for anyone else, when climate change could lead to more resource shortages and severely worsen the refugee crisis, and potentially affect the survival of the human race. This is why you don't get lost in cultural war bullshit. You're too busy being contrarian to the other side to stop, think and prioritize what's important. Personally I don't think politics is about science or rationality or whatever you try to circlejerk your side being about. Its about achieving common interests beneficial to you and whatever group you subscribe to. I'd rather people be completely selfish about this rather than LARP about being the defender of so and so tradition or doctrine that you probably half understand at best