Warhammer 40,000/40k general

First for imperial guard

>>53650949
People are gonna need lots of mortar proxies.

Second for scything talons granting multiple attacks.

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First for nids. Does anyone else think that a trygon and a tunneled squad of genestealers looks fun as fuck or am i an idiot?

>>53651014
a trygon and tunneled anything looks fun as fuck. even pyrovores.

I've found power levels to be a fun way to throw together games in a pinch with people that you know aren't complete assholes.

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Nevar forgetting

>>53651086
>some literally who thinks he can answer rules questions
I'll wait for the FAQ

I need barb wire decoration, any good ones to check out?

>>53651114
>Literally who
>Head of the development team

>>53651072
I'm currently getting the impression that power is legitimately better for balance reasons than points because it avoids the often dumb or otherwise nonsensical wargear pricing. Stuff that would be overcosted trash is suddenly much more competitive.

>>53651008
What's up with this mortar meme?

>>53651136
>40k streams awhile back
>rules writers dont even know marines cant charge out of rhinos

How many special weapons can a cultist blob take now? Still 1 per 10?

>>53651155
And so he changed the rules to make the game fit his version of reality.

>>53651152
Mortars are dirt cheap in new edition. You can have I think 3 full squads for the price of 1 Wyvern

>>53651155
>rules writers aren't infected with the cancer that was the meta
>somehow a bad thing

This is the beginning of a golden age, rejoice faggot.

>>53651030
troops only bubbo

>>53651155
he had almost certainly been playing more of what became 8th edition in playtesting than 7th or before, to be fair

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>activate nova reactor on Riptide
>allocate the mortal wound to a nearby drone
Pic related, that's what I imagine what would happen.

>>53651114
>>53651136
God could directly tell some people what to do, and they would still look for instruction from the bible

>>53651233
read the rule again.

>>53651251
BUT GUIS, THIS ONE WORD IS SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT! CLEARLY THIS IMPLIES <MAJOR MECHANICS CHANGE>!

>>53651228
They were playing 7th, they just decided to ignore the fact you can't charge after disembarking because 7th was the edition of never being able to charge if you do anything at all and it was fucking shit.

How do you guys feel about Deff Dreadz, Mek Gunz, and Stormboyz?

I know Mek Gunz saw a lot of use last edition. Dreadz and Stormboyz are better r-right?

Are the Primaris any good? A friend wants the DG of the started box and wants me to get the loyalist marines.

How do allies work now? Will I be able to use Primaris, Deathwatch and Grey Knights in the same army? And maybe Eldars combined with any of those?

>>53651009
Pretty sure they don't.

>>53651301
Not eldar no. but you can ally all imperial units in the same detachment if you want.

>>53651295
Stormboyz should be great, jump infantry are buff this edition

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>>53651008
I have 6 from two old battleforces. Going to need 12 more. Good thing is, mortars are easy-as-pie to make since they're essentially an angled tube stuck in the ground.

Having said that, heavy bolters are 3 points more expensive so realistically, I'll probably field a Spearhead HWS platoon with maybe 4 mortar squads and 2 heavy bolter squads.

180 points plus hq.

cheaper than a fucking russ.

>>53651301
To combine units, they need to share a <faction>

All imperium units belong to the imperium faction, so can be allied at will.

You'd have to take a seperate detachment for the eldar, so you might loose on command points, maybe.

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Criticism?

How does the harpy perform? Wondering if it should be swapped out with something else

reposting here:

Looking at the Imperial Psykers...

do Wyrdvane Psykers have any use? I mean, their minimum squad costs 24 points and they cast on a 1d6+1. 1d6+2 if they have 6 or more (48+ points).


A Primaris is 50 points with his stick and casts on 2d6. And knows 2 powers.


Astropaths at 15 (laspistol) seem like great Elites slot occupiers though. They don't Smite well BUT they're great at babysitting shooty IG squads - divination means whoever the squad is shooting at doesn't get cover AND it can give the squad +1 sv with Psychic Barrier.

They seem like a must-have for shooty guard.

>>53651127
Make your own. Twist two strands of safety wire together and wrap it around a sharpie

>>53651301
You can combine any faction together with the Wu Tang Clan maneuver. It works by RAW don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

NEW CHAOS MARINES WHEN?

Also I noticed how it was said that the Primaris marine numbers have dwindled since the Indomitus Crusade, does that mean no more Primaris or that they'll just make more lore wise?

>>53651295
I fielded 2 Deff Dreads in my first game of 8th ed and they were awesome. They rip things down in melee.

Guard are the new WAAC faction, you can see guard players have the exact same we're-so-unbeatable smugness that made everyone hate tau players last edition.
>it's fair and balanced that we basically ignore morale, shoot more than anyone, and ignore petty concerns like armour, cover, & LOS that other armies have to deal with
>what? no, our army isn't undercosted, it's fluffy that my mortar costs less than a skitarii ranger for three times the firepower on average
>oh, and it's unfair that we so many command points, we should get more special rules, like our entire army firing the maximum number of shots from variable profile weapons, to make up for having more rerolls than everybody else
I would bet up to 10, no 15, internet points that most of the tau players selling their armies will buy into guard.

>>53651387
Good luck getting a game if you do this, WAACfag.

>>53651415
Expensive though

>>53651408
>NEW CHAOS MARINES WHEN?
Never, unless you're a Cult Legion.

>does that mean no more Primaris or that they'll just make more lore wise?
That was just the first batch. They mentioned that Primaris are faster and easier to make than manlets so all future marines will be Primaris.

>>53651343
>>53651008

People always laughed when I said I like mortar teams. How I always wanted to use them despite how "shit" they were.
Well, now who's laughing.
Still not me, since I want either Tempestus Scions to have access to Mortars and Snipers, or for Forgeworld to put out rules for Elysian Drop Troops


Completely unrelated, but does anyone have the Onager Dunecrawler profile by chance?

>>53651251
>god
>doesn't even know his own rules
>puts out the worst books that fail to do what they set out to do
I think I'd find a new religion.

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>>53651365
Why do all of these look the same?

>>53651419
It's like you don't remember the SIGAFH. LasPlas squads everywhere, 4plas command squads, etc.

It's a cycle.

>>53651419
They won't buy guard because they're expensive and are too high in number. People who are actually WAAC buy the best least model count armies, ala grey knights of old and riptide wing.

>>53651443
Because I'm the one posting all of those lists because nobody ever fucking replies to them.
I post for criticism and get none.

>>53651419
I'm just glad stormtroopers aren't crap anymore.

Ironically, Guard was WAAC in 5th, which is why I went towards stormtroopers.

I'm kinda liking the power system, it gets rid of these min max unit selections and adds cool wargear to battles that no one would ever actually pay points for.

>>53651428
Stay mad queer, my alliance is fluffy.

>>53651435
>faster to make than manlets
Neat, so are all original members getting replaced? I also heard that marinelets are able to be upgraded into Primaris through some sort of process. Is that true?

>>53651419
>most of the tau players selling their armies will buy into tyranids.

Ftfy

>>53651419
Funny you say that. Because no one has asked about buying my IG shit in the three days I've had it posted.

>>53651469
Hard to criticize when no one has really played 8th yet

>>53651443
Nids confirmed for monobuild

>>53651475
*Love blooms on the battlefield*

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R8 my autism

>>53651486
I don't understand mathhammer, my list looked alot worse before and I luckily got some help half a week ago but help's gone apparently.

>>53651510
>tau
10/10

>>53651510

neat.

>>53651476
>Neat, so are all original members getting replaced? I also heard that marinelets are able to be upgraded into Primaris through some sort of process. Is that true?
They don't even need to really. The old marines will eventually die and be replaced. It's probably not cost-efficient to upgrade the 5'10" Astartes. I predict they'll upgrade a few notable characters when they replace the shitty finecast models like Dante or Cato.

>>53651506
I wouldn't say that they're monobuild but require an army much like that if not exactly to compete with S tier armies like guard and necrons.

So with Girlyman talking to Big E and finding out what he did, does this mean the traitor legions were right, even if for the wrong reasons? Should the loyalists have turned as well?

>>53651510
>camp desk while enemy caps objectives
ok

>>53651518
It looks pretty good, no obvious poor choices.

Unless you're looking for someone to give you the best meta list, which isn't knowable yet, you should play some games with it and see where the weakness lies.

>>53651515
I thought the problem was that you needed more elite slots. And now you can't fill 6 of them?

>>53651510
What's the advantage of the ADL over more tidewall sections, out of interest?

>>53651510
Deepstrike/10

Would play against.

>>53651546
Yeah humanity's best choice is to join chaos and become spikey demonsluts.
Absolutely.
Great thinking, Anon. Excellent.

>>53651551
I'll be playing a majority of my games against a lychguard star with Deceiver, Obyron, crypteks and deathmarks so I'm unsure how it would perform. As far as I know the list doesn't have much to deal with a lychbrick which is why the harpy may be necessary to get lucky with a strafing bomb on a cryptek

>>53651443
I'm unconvinced that tervigons are actually valuable in a game above 1000 points. They're only going to reinforce 40 gaunts max, they don't do much else and aren't good fighters themselves.

I'm new to 40k and have a question regarding 8th- so GSC has this rule that they can take an IG unit. Does this mean the neophyte hybrid squad that is IG with GSC heads is using the the IG rules for guardsmen or the neophyte hybrid rules with the mining stuff?

Can someone clarify that <Dynasty> rule for necrons? I assume its the same idea as Marines' chapter rule but are there any specific dynasty only models or rules currently? The explanation page in the leak is pretty blurry

Nth for BRRRRRRRT taurox
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zhv71M5xXJY

>>53651546
>does this mean the traitor legions were right, even if for the wrong reasons?
About what? The Emperor being a liar has always been true. He hid the existence of Chaos to weaken them.

>Should the loyalists have turned as well?
For what reason would they do that you retard?

>>53651419
The damage output per point of mortars and vanguard are comparable, but on a less durable platform and at much lower range.

There's always... canticles.

>>53651510
>tfw I have no Idea what Tau play like anymore
Has it really been that long?

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>>53651454
SIGAFH, nids and orks being really good again, we have come back around full circle to 2nd ed army power.

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>>53651559
Tidewalls are now open-topped transports (T6 W10 4+) and can thus be destroyed. They also have a 10-man transport capacity. Aegis Line simply gives +1 to cover if your models are behind it from the shooter's position.

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>>53651570
>not making Chaos submit to your will
It's like you forget the whole point of Abbadon. Chaos is the direct result of mankinds true nature, man deserves chaos as his gods, and the chaos gods need man to survive. It's a symbiosis. But to take that power and use it to your will to reign supreme of the universe. Only through chaos can man gain true power over all.

>>53651366
No. Wyrdvane are bad.

>>53651623
Ah, so everything in your "castle" gets the benefit of the ADL's cover? I getcha now.

>>53651624
>the whole point of Abbadon.
...to be the biggest jobber in the universe?

Be honest, does anyone really think armless the harmless is a good villain?

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So what's your thought on proxies? Would they prevent you from playing a game with someone?

I ask because I managed to snag the smaller of the Dreamforge Leviathan's during their recent sale. Was planning on using it as an Imperial Knight proxy - I know it's smaller (by about an inch and a half), but I figure if I base it properly and make sure it reaches the same height as the traditional Knight, it shouldn't be an issue. There will be conversion work as well, but for $39 I really couldn't pass up on it.

>>53651435
I found it odd that there was no mention of older marines turned into primaris.

>>53651155
>rules writers change the game to fit the more fun way they play it
Based rules writers

>>53650949
>First for imperial guard

I'm going to be using the Heavy detachment

I'm looking at a 1500 list that has a Stormlord with 4 Lascannon Sponsons and 6 heavy weapon teams. Probably going to do a mix of 3 Heavy Bolter Teams and 3 Lascannon teams. Rest of points will go into Tempestus Scions and I think Commissar Yarrick will be the HQ.

Captcha: Chinese Residence

>>53651574
I think they're good at being a bullet sponge and force your opponents hand fucking up their target prioritization. They have alot of early game front line to deal with in terms of genestealers, trygon and termagants with devourers in addition to a meaty back line.

>>53651454
What is this SIGAFH please educate me great old one

>>53651624
Failbaddon is a fucking loser and if someone thinks they can somehow take over Chaos from the inside, they are retarded and being manipulated by chaos itself.

>>53651646
Because he's constantly been trying to control chaos and refuses to be a direct slave, actually barking commands at the chaos gods rather than the other way around. As a result his crusades fail due to their sabotage

>>53651624
>Chaos is the direct result of mankinds true nature
Chaos took its current form during the War in Heaven eons before humanity ever existed.

>the chaos gods need man to survive
Untrue. They exist is multiple universes and infinite realities. They don't need humanity.

>>53651646
Well, you've got people saying Archaon is a good villain now despite being staggeringly dull and one dimensional, so yes, I'm sure they do.

>>53651148
Fucking stop with this meme.
Power levels will never be relevant outside of casual narrative stuff, and even then, most people still won't use it.

>>53651652
Baby you can do whatever you want.

>>53651671
The chaos gods didn't gain actual sentience until humanity came along. The only one that gained sentience without humans was Slaanesh

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Ohh boy. Time to strip 106 metal Tallarn.

>>53651641
Basically, yeah.

>>53651170
zero

>>53651663
Shooty Imperial Guard Army From Hell

>>53651684
>delusional pointcucks
PFFHAHA
Have fun with your dead format, cocksucker. Power is the new default

>>53651546
>So with Girlyman talking to Big E and finding out what he did, does this mean the traitor legions were right, even if for the wrong reasons?
Probably not.
I doubt Big E would be dense enough to tell Emp. jr-er, Lord Guilliman EVERYTHING since Rowboat already left him for dead once before.

I can imagine the hilarity of Guilliman trying to save Magnus' soul (because if anyone deserves redemption, it's Magnus the Red), and Big E telling him, "You want to save Magnus' soul from the Ruinous Powers huh? Well then you'll have to travel the Warp and find the Ork gods of Gork and Mork to get that big red fool's soul back from Tzeentch."

Guilliman would probably think that's the most insane/ridiculous idea ever, but he's also determined/boneheaded enough to try something like that. And then he'll learn everything Emps did and all the other shit going on for the past 10,000 years when he finally meets Gork n' Mork.

>>53651703
That sounds awesome. Can't wait to shoot back at it.

>>53651684
Who kick your fucking cage? Let people play the way they want and quit your incessant shitting up the board whenever levels are mentioned

>>53651699
How to strip metal models
>Put them in any model carrying case
>Lift the case a few inches off the ground, then gently place it back down
>The models have now been stripped back to bare metal
In other words metal models are shit

>>53651699
Make sure you use Super Clean and wear gloves while scrubbing

>>53651657
>paying 700 points for a glorified open-topped transport which hits on 5+ and causes everything in it to hit on 5+
The only baneblade i feel is possibly worth it is the Shadowsword, and only at 2k with enough bubblewrap to make it never have to move. It's flat murder to whatever you point it at.

>>53651387
>It works by RAW don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

You should read the RAW before you shit this out, each factions keyword specifically pertaining to their style of organization and is referenced in each races entry.

Craftworld Wutang isnt, Clan Wutang, isnt Warband Wutang, isnt Chapter Wutang, Isnt Dynasty Wutang.

You can argue to troll all you want but its written clear as day in the start of every army entry, its just you choosing to ignore it or bad reading comprehension.

>>53651295
>Deff Dreadz
Ehhh... they seem like they could be okay, but they are pretty expensive for what they can do. Hard to say exactly without doing the math.
>Mek Gunz
Mostly overcosted garbage. Look at Big Gunz if you want cheap, effective artillery.
>Stormboyz
These are looking like a great choice all-around.

Today's game, starting soon on Twitch: Dark Angels vs Thousand Sons.

Place your bets

>>53651646
>...to be the biggest jobber in the universe?
Last I checked the Armless Wonder hasn't jobbed to Orks and died a "death from 40,000 choppa strikes" like the Swarmlord did on Octaria recently (sure, Swarmy regenerated, but still he lost to random Ork boyz for Warp's sake).

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I was playing at my local game store the other night with a friend and we both are a bit rusty since it was the first time in about two years that i have played. We both somewhat remembered 5th edition so we played that and i even had the old black and white rulebooks and had a pretty good time. He played CSM and i played my Imperial Fists.

What really grinds my fucking gears is when some other rando walks up and watches our game, and starts "correcting" our game. We explained to that autist that we werent playing the newest editions, but he continually complained about our lists, rules, rolls, and everything else under the sun. He insisted that the new edition (8th i guess) was superior, and how stupid we were for playing older editions, and how we must be too retarded to learn the new rules. He told me that im stupid for not playing a list with the new primaris marines.

Why the fuck does this game attract the retard anal retentive fags that have to suck GW cock at all times? Why cant we play whatever version of the game we want? Who cares if primaris are coming out, or chaos is changing? Its like everyone has forgotten tbat this is a fucking game. Play it to enjoy it seems to no lo,ger be the primary purpose of a game.

>>53651729
>>53651387
Please no wutang arguments

>>53651419
Most people that play WAAC armies play with lower count armies, and at this moment the most WAAC list possible with the Guard is really expensive and need a lot of work to Paint/convert.

>>53651737
I really wanted to watch the Custodes one but missed it, anyone see it? How'd it go?
If TSons have Magnus, they win
if not, Homo Angels

>>53651737
FOR CHAAAAAAAOOOOOOOOOOSSSSSSSS

>>53651749
There is no argument read the start of the army entry's.

>>53651583
it means you can build your list using both the GSC list and the Guard's list. It doesn't mean you can mix the entries of those lists.

>>53651673
Archaon has basically lost all motivation.
He was going to destroy to the world, he successful destroyed the world but then everyone got transported to new worlds.
Now what? Fight Sigmar endlessly it seems.

>>53651731
>Deff Dreadz
It's not bad, but it's far from the best option Orks have
>Mek Gunz
We've been through this last night, bubblechukka and smasha are not bad
>Stormboyz
they're great, but miss out on the +1A from large unit size that boyz get.

Ork bikers or deffcopters? I like both

>>53651387
>It works by RAW don't let anyone tell you otherwise.
So does re-rolling your opponent's dice with the command re-roll stratagem, but it will still be FAQ'd to fix the writer's mistake.

>>53651737
I bet on both banding together to raid Fenris.

>>53651729
Show me where it says that anything is added to a keyword inside or outside of the bracket. It's not <Sept Wu Tang Clan> and <Chapter Wu Tang Clan> it's just <Wu Tang Clan> and <Wu Tang Clan>

Seriously show me... oh wait you can't because you're talking out of your ass. We're talking out to the official rules not your headcanon homebrew nonsense.

>>53651737
>Prediction
TSons kill more points of DA than they lose themselves but lose on objectives.

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>>53651699
Tell me - do you Mukaali?

>>53651769
It already was, actually. I don't have the screencap but the lead dev mentioned it.

>>53651729
Wrong, if you read the named character's entries (Let's use Lysander as an example) it doesn't say "Chapter: Imperial Fists" it just says "Imperial Fists". So if you were to make a WuTang chapter, it wouldn't be "Chapter: WuTang" it would just be "WuTang" and so you'd be free to build a detachment with any unit with the WuTang keyword.

>>53651755
Guard brought full tank list, got rolled by the Custodes. IG player clearly did not realize that this was Hordes Edition

>>53651782
You're the kind of grognard that runs Pun Pun in DnD, aren't you.

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S14.

I guess that solves my earlier question about a strength cap.

>still only does max 6 damage per shot

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>>53651387

>>53651586
Every faction has tags like that, but no one (maybe SM?) have rules for them, outside a couple named characters.

General belief is that they'll come with the dedicated codexes.

>>53651769
Speculating on Future FAQs is irrelevant and also presumptuous. Not only is your FAQ not part of the current RAW, but how do you know that the rule writers didn't intend for players to make special snowflake septs and space marine chapters and ork clans that would all work together?

Would Ork Stormboyz do well against things like jetbikes because of the new Fly rules?

>>53651755
Guard brought full tank list, got rolled by the Custodes. IG player clearly did not realize that this was Hordes Edition
>>53651766
koptas

>>53651583
All of the limited list of guard stuff found in the gsc section itself is fully gsc and not what the rule is referring to. You can use those without restrictioon in your gsc. What blood brothers lets you do is take a separate detachment of astra militarum using any of the AM unit you want from the full Index Imperium 2 list.

>>53651819
Yes

>>53651810
The Shadowsword is s16 2d6 damage

>>53651813
You can call me a cheater all you want but using the rules as they are written will never be cheating.

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>>53651813
As an Ork git who flipped between casual/tryhard back in the day, this pic amuses me so much.

>>53651823
>>53651762
awesome, thanks for the help!

>>53651789
No. I've got a dozen of the old horsey Tallarn rough riders.

>>53651684
I thought this too and then I looked at what a clusterfuck of nonsense the points values are, particularly when it comes to wargear.

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>>53651757
So what side are you supporting?

>>53651819
Do jetbikes have the fly rule? Keywords don't mean anything unless a rule mentions it. Look at the actual jet units and you will see they all have special rules about how they move and fight.

>>53651834
>i will never get games: the post

>>53651724
>metal models are shit
Either a delusional warmachine or malifaux player, I can't tell which

>>53651855
>it doesn't work that way!
>okay it does work that way b-but you'll never get any games!
I'm loving every laugh.

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>>53651834
>literally you this very instant

Do Primarins have anything of value to offer a Deathwatch force?

>>53651724
Metal models suck for big things, but I love them for 28mm troopers. Especially single piece ones like the 2nd ed. Guard.

>>53651831
jesus.

i really should pay more attention to my army's superheavies.

Are LoW just plain part of the game now and not optional?

>>53651888
Epic /pol/ meme my pepe!
When's the raid?!

>>53651849
BLOOD AND MADNESS

>>53651861
I don't know if anyone told you this but GW updated most of their line to plastic and resin a long time ago.

>>53651891
Not yet really. Maybe Interceptors.

>>53651660
They're really just an extremely expensive composite distraction carnifex. Neither the tervigon or the gaunts are likely to accomplish very much (tge gaunts may kill some infantry and the tervigon may kill some character if one is dumb enough to charge it without having the ability to kill it in one round of combat).

>>53651888
>screeching because you can't accept reality
Anti-WTC are deluded if they can't see how that perfectly describes them.

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>>53651900
>mfw the autistic screeching continues

>>53651900
>being this autistic

>>53651902
>I don't know if anyone told you this but GW updated most of their line to plastic and resin a long time ago.
I'm pretty sure the Sisters of Battle players would like a word with you about that claim...

>>53651897
Yes, there are detachments for LoW.

>>53651900
Hello 1d4ddit!

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>>53651419

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>>53651846
>>53651789
reptilian mounts rock

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>>53651789
>Not charging horrific Daemons, and nightmarish Xenos with man's greatest comrade

I want to start collecting and painting an IG/AM mechanized army. Nothing but vehicles with only a few basic troops to hold objectives.

I'm not a WAAC player, and I play mostly casual games or local non-GW tournies.

That said, I'd like to win at least half the time I play. What are the odds of a mechanized Guard army being able to do so in 8th?

>>53651912
It'd take more than a couple turns to kill though, they take root on an objective and are a pain to remove

>>53651922
Current Factions

Space Marines (6 different flavors and counting)
Imperial Guard
Eldar
Dark Eldar
Clown Eldar
Orks
Tau
Chaos demons
Chaos Space Marines
Mechanicus
Inquisition
Necrons
Sisters of Battle

Only one of those forces is entirely metal so yes, GW has updated most of their product line to plastic and resin.

>>53651718
>>53651847
I'm not mad that you want to use power levels, I'm warning you that you shouldn't get used to the idea because you'll never find a game if your list is based on it. Points will be the default. You'll only get a power level game if you agree to it beforehand, and most people WILL want to use points, despite the memes.

>>53651954
You are going to win about half the time you play with any army that is constructed intelligently in 8th edition.

>>53651699
>Metal
Acetone. It will also disolve superglue.
>plastic
90-100% isopropyl alcohol

There's no good reason to fuck around with cleaning products, they all perform worse than alcohol or acetone.

>>53651897
>Are LoW just plain part of the game now and not optional?

They've been a part of the game since 7e
>(Introduced in 6e, via expansion book)

>>53651958
between the faction getting genuinely good rules and celestine being successful and well received there's actually a good chance they will finally redo the basic sister infantry line in the next year or two

>>53651959
That's funny because I've already played 3 games at power level 50.

>>53651974
Super Clean is the best my dude

>>53651959
Fair enough. Thats the reason ill be making all my lists with points, then quickly adding up levels to make sure i can play either

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So is 8th officially the worst written edition?

Because some of this shit is fucking comical.

>no limit on number of Celestines per army
>Warp Talons with 3 attacks

Who fucking wrote this shit.

>>53651954
not bad, I'd say. The Hellhound family is still lethal. Taurox Prime shits out cheap dakka. Chimeras are okay. Russes have lost their teeth but are arguablye tougher. The arty units are still very killy.

Can I mix heavy weapons in HWS now?

>>53651974
Does Isopropyl damage plastic at all? I want to strip down my push fit deathwing and redo them but I was so shit at painting when I started the hobby that they will probably need to bathe in alcohol for a week.

>>53651746
Im new to the hobby and likely having to play at the store doesnt sit well with me. That example is one of the reasons it would be bothersome.

The GWs ive seen are all shops first and tables second. Idk how ill handle playing there with random people walking in and out, hustling around to grab something off the wall.

Hopefully i meet some cool dudes and move on to a club setting where id be much more comfortable and could concentrate on the game and banter.

>>53651999
What a waste of digits with this retarded bait

>>53651958
>Only one of those forces is entirely metal so yes, GW has updated most of their product line to plastic and resin.
Far enough. Still, you'd think they would've updated that last faction with some plastic models for the basic troops or something by now.

>>53651983
Not even an SoB player, and I really hope this happens. Give the bolter bitches something to be happy about for once.

>>53651745
I haven't read the latest fluff
nids lods at octaria? lmao

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>>53651999
>dedicated melee units can't be good at melee
get fucked

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>>53651999

>>53651999
Nah. The edition (you) like most is the worst ever written.

>>53651999
Hive Fleet <Ultramarines> is my favourite example so far.

>>53651959
>no one will use this far simpler system that allows for fluffier battles

Nah, I see both being used frequently.

>>53652011
No, not at all.

>>53651974
I thought brake fluid was the best for plastic?

>>53651985
Maybe people will use them a little just to get used to the game at first, but I 100% guarantee that the overwhelming majority of people will want to play using points.

>>53651999
>3 attack warp talons
>bad

>>53651999
Sniper drones dont have "Sniper".
Half of the flyers aren't "Fly"ers.

Not just badly written, badly designed.

>>53652007
Yup

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>>53651999
Wasted trips

>>53652040
What are you guaranteeing it with? Put up for shut up, you couldn't be more wrong.

>>53651999
>minor oversights in the most balanced edition

Yeah, so much worse than flyers, IG Tank spam, and eldar/necron basic transport spam.

>>53652017
I mean GW has done or not done a lot of stupid shit. But if the last year or so are any indication they are pulling their shit together so they will hopefully realize that sisters are one of the things that need to be done. But they've still got a lot of past mistakes they need to clean up so don't be surprised if Sisters get pushed to the back of the to do list.

>>53651999
It's funny that the FAQs will be bigger than the rulebook

>>53651999
oh no, a couple of obvious typos in an edition they're going to actively errata with online rules dumps! whatever will we do?!

also if you think 7e is so great you can always go play horus heresy since they're stuck with it. inferno was fabulously well written, I'm sure you'll love it!

>>53652068
I never said 7e was great, but at least it was spellchecked.

>>53652029
>people will use this marginally simpler system that allows for extremely imbalanced battles
I promise you it won't be used much, especially once the list building programs are updated.

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>>53651652
I use that one as a dreadknight proxy as they're virtually the same size. Fantastic model. Pain in the ass to assemble though but once you do it's never coming apart again.

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>>53651999
>twinlinked guns are now just double the shots!
>this model has a single gun now btw, some t'au katana cut it in two pieces

>>53652068
>obvious typos
Yeah, they were obvious, that's kind of the problem.

It suggests that none of this shit was proofread, and kind of sheds doubt on the idea that any of this was actually playtested.

>>53652056
Alright anon, but don't say I didn't warn you when you can't find a power level game with anyone but retards and children in 2-3 months.

>>53652088
Double shots to represent both guns firing at the target.

>>53652076
Points are balanced desu!

>IG mortars

Power level is balanced fine, but it assumes you take all the fixins.

>>53651727
...Why would it hit on a 5+?

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>countless options
>big trakk
>...
>well, guess we're not very good at counting!
>well ork am I rite ladz?
>is funny because orks are le retard meme npc race

>>53651922
They're due to be squatted, they're not even a real army in 8th.

Which titantic tonk do you like best?

>>53652096
So nothing then? So your guarantee is as worthless as your opinion?

Good to know.

Okay. I've been playing 8th and loving it, it mostly seems too good to be true Except that some factions have lost some of their flavor. So of course I know GW is going to immediately screw it up when the first codex drops, but I'm wondering how they will do it.

Personally I think they're going to bring back ridiculous formations. There's probably a lot of butt hurt space marine players that are feeling the loss of their drop pods and SM will likely be the first or second to get a codex so I can very easily imagine a formation which gives free drop pods or something fucked up like that. And it will only get more ridiculous from there.

How do you think they're going to ruin the first decent thing they've created in a long time?

>>53652098
Yeah but can't you see, it only has an single ion rifle!

>>53651985
I didn't know MWG producers were allowed on 4chan. Does your Mormon daddy know you're on here?

>>53652101
According to the design team, it's an average of a model with full gear and no gear. So about half upgrades per model.

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2000 points of Thousand Sons

Supreme Command Detachment

Magnus the Red (1) - 415pts
1 Magnus the Red

Ahriman (1) - 166pts
1 Ahriman on Disc of Tzeentch

Exalted Sorcerer on Disc of Tzeentch (1) - 135pts
1 Exalted Sorcerer: Inferno bolt pistol,Force stave

Exalted Sorcerer on Disc of Tzeentch (1) - 135pts
1 Exalted Sorcerer: Inferno bolt pistol,Force stave

Scarab Occult Terminators (5) - 395pts
1 Scarab Occult Sorcerer: Inferno combi-bolter,Force stave
4 Scarab Occult Terminator: Heavy warpflamer,Power sword,Hellfyre missile rack

Rubric Marines (10) - 267pts
1 Aspiring Sorcerer: Psyker: Smite,Force stave,Warpflame pistol
2 Rubric Marine: Boltgun,Soulreaper cannon
7 Rubric Marine: Boltgun,Inferno boltgun

Rubric Marines (10) - 267pts
1 Aspiring Sorcerer: Psyker: Smite,Force stave,Warpflame pistol
2 Rubric Marine: Boltgun,Soulreaper cannon
7 Rubric Marine: Boltgun,Inferno boltgun

Tzaangors (10) - 80pts
1 Twistbray: Autopistol and chainsword
1 Tzaangor: Autopistol and chainsword,Icon of Flame
8 Tzaangor: Autopistol and chainsword

Tzaangors (10) - 70pts
1 Twistbray: Autopistol and chainsword
9 Tzaangor: Autopistol and chainsword

Tzaangors (10) - 70pts
1 Twistbray: Autopistol and chainsword
9 Tzaangor: Autopistol and chainsword

> Twistbray leads 9 Tzaangors
> Aspiring Sorcerer leads 9 Rubrics
> Magnus leads 9 units
> mfw

>>53652003
Pretty much this.
Artillery actually got cheaper though, while most tanks jumped in price.

Mostly tanks would work I think. With some conscripts to block charges, you should be able to scoot and shoot to start away from most of the opponents nastiest stuff.

An all tank army will probably play a lot like an all Knight Amy. You'll win a lot of the opponent isn't ready for it.

>>53652110
>points being the standard is an opinion
Dude how fucking new are you?

>>53652104
Because it is not exempt from the moving and firing heavy weapons rules.

>>53652112
First Space Marine codex will reduce their points to the point where Marines are taking nearly as many models as regular armies.

>>53652105
>ugh, fuck GW for making my army considerably better

>>53652085
Is that my nigga Lok top left?

>>53652112
I'm guessing free, unbalanced special rules or free unit formations.

>>53652130
Sorry I don't respond to worthless people

Made a Deldar list, focused on Covens. Please rate and comment:

>Haemonculus
>Splinter Pistol
>Electrocorrosive Whip
= 83 points

>5 Wracks
>Scissorhand on Acothyst
>Ossefactor
= 75 points


>5 Wracks
>Scissorhand on Acothyst
>Ossefactor
= 75 points

>Venom
>2 Splinter Cannons
= 95 points


>Venom
>2 Splinter Cannons
= 95 points

>6 Grotesques
>base equipment
= 240 points

>Cronos
>Syphon
>Tentacles
= 102 points

>Talos
>2 Macro-scalpels
>2 Haywire Blasters
= 120 points

>5 Scourges
>3 Blasters
>2 Shardcarbines
= 115 points

= 1000 points all in all

The Haywire Blasters on the Talos are mainly there because they're cheap, as I'm not paying 50 points for two heat lances, one of which will statistically miss anyway and the Blasters on the Scourges (which I'll convert to look more Coven-y) are there because they're cheap and effective and with deep strike and 14" movement 18" range should damn well be enough

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>>53652120
I'll be honest, I just see a flying clay shooting target.

Guess I'm not Xenos enough.

>>53651365
Add another swarmlord.

>>53652112
Well, chapter tactics are conspicuously absent which means chapters that don't have characters don't exist until they do (cough, Iron Hands).

So... they'll probably bring chapter tactics back in some form and fuck it all up. That said, they really need SOME reason to play anything other than Ultramarines because right now codex marines have never been more blue.

>>53651419
Hold the fuck on! I said I wondered if we wouldn't get some crazy powerful bonuses with a correspondingly high CP cost, then threw out an example off the top of my head.

I did NOT say we Should have it, or need to have it.

>Ignore Moral
Snipers
S N I P E R S

Grab some scouts and watch the infantry melt!

>>53651148

It isn't, power levels are demonstrably trash.

In the very first battle we did we used 50 power each and yet my Tyranids had about 200 points more stuff then his CSM army. Power isn't accurate enough to make fights fair. It's literally just something for Drunkhammer.

>>53652136
Oh shit that's awful. I was considering making my 2nd army a superheavy detachment of baneblade + variants but damn.

>>53652101
>Power level is balanced fine, but it assumes you take all the fixins
It's literally not. There was an interview with the developers where they explained that it assumes you've taken middling upgrades.
It's inherently imbalanced by its very nature.
And points will always have issues, but at least it makes an attempt to be balanced, and they intend to tweak them as time goes on.
Points have always been and always will be the standard.

>>53652022
>I haven't read the latest fluff
>nids lods at octaria? lmao
Waaaagh!! Ghazghkull supplement has Ghazzy showing up at Octaria (after Swarmlord arrived there according to 5e nid codex) with his entire zog off fleet in tow (take your 'Shadow in the Warp' power and choke on it Hive Mind!), lands on Octaria with his OP Ork-tech reinforcements to give the local boyz a hand, going down there personally to see things through.

Then some smart-ass Malwoc decides it's a great idea to try and swallow 'Ork Jesus' whole, resulting in Ghazghkull clawing his way out of the zoggin' thing's stomach like a boss. Said display of epic badassery sends Orks into a massive slaughter-spree that murders the fuck out of every non-Ork on (and in orbit) around Octaria proper for awhile. Swarmy gets no mention in the book (he doesn't even cross paths with Thraka), but considering the fact it's pretty specific that there are no nids left on the planet for a period of time before Hive Fleet Leviathan throws MULTIPLE TENDRILS at the planet for OCTARIA: ROUND 2! implies Swarmy got killed off in that first round.

>>53652122
>implying I'm not Matt

Y'all guard players are so happy with your mortars but the truth is any heavy weapon that does the same job as a lasgun is never going to be that good.

>>53652157
Swarmlord is unique anon, for good reason

Do you have any other suggestions?

>>53652154
So, by that reasoning, you've just admitted that my opinion is valid.
Power level autists confirmed for retarded.

>>53652172
Yesss! Good goy! You have to bring several hundreds of points of lasgun targets so that you can maybe take out that 30p model! Such a good trade!

>>53652085
Yeah, actually it was your pic that sent me to the site when they were having the sale. I get that it's smaller than an Imperial Knight, but I think with proper conversion it should work nicely. And yeah, I was reading over the instructions on their site, and it looks complicated, but workable. I like the use of screws, too, it's a good idea for a kit like that.

>>53652136
I think the transport capacity is best not for actually trasporting things anywhere, but instead for sitting protecting 9 heavy weapon teams.

>>53652130
Points will be standard (if not mandatory) for the sort of autists that spend their time discussing 40k on the internet. Power will be standard for normalfags and kids that just want to play toy soldiers.

>>53652175
Said rule is -1 to hit if you moved and other than that everything fires normally. It's literally nothing

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>TFW I realised my morkanauts klaw now has a secondary attack that gives it 12 str 8 ap -2 attacks
And having 4+saves on most my vehicles is awesome, especially since it was mostly armor 10 and 12 before anyways

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>>53651854
>Do jetbikes have the fly rule?
Yes, meaning jump units can charge them.

>>53652180
In most units the average would balance out between models who can't or don't take upgrades via limitations and those who do.

In units like Company Vets who can go full hog and run 5 combis, not quite as much.

That said, it's reasonably balanced. It's not matched play, but if I want a quick pick up game, it seems pretty good for quick throw downs.

>>53652007
And it has a use because they can all target different things.

>>53652047
>Half of the flyers aren't "Fly"ers.
It appears all FMC, Jet, Jump, and Fliers in 7e gained the "FLY" keyword. Which is fine by me.

>What are some examples of units that you think shouldn't have FLY?

>>53652198
Sorry I don't respond to worthless people.

>>53652211
Or you can take Killa Kans and overall they're way better for the same points.

>>53652187
Lasguns can't kill enemy units behind LOS blocking terrain 48'' away.

>>53652124
They really didn't make any effort at all with that power shit, did they?

>you have the option to take a bunch of spannas with kustom mega sluggas and killsaws in your unit of lootas, so we'll charge you half the price of those. Crisis suits get charged half the price of their upgrades, because it's possible to run them with just a burst cannon.
>Everyone gets treated the same, totally fair, just like the new cover rules ;^)

>>53652231
we are living in a world where killa kans are good

this is strange

>>53652012
Going to the store is a great way to meet people, but it can be hard because everyone there already knows each other. I was new 6 months ago and now everyone knows me, but we're not really friends, I just show up here and there. Everyone else hangs out after the store.

>>53652217
>"Yes they have the fly rule"
>Post pic without the fly rule
Well you sure showed me. Read my first post again.

>>53652105
Probably will appear in Chapter Approved.

>>53652207
No, points will be the standard for anyone who isn't brand new to the game, and even the newbies will be move over to points once they're tired of being stuck at the kiddie table.
Why are you so dead set on using an objectively worse system, anyway?

>>53652217
>Yes, meaning jump units can charge them.
Like just about everyone else? FLY doesn't prevent being charged.

>>53652187
Mortars always have been and always will be the best Heavy Weapon choice for Guard.

>>53651782
Each races entry establishes what their keyword stands for in the KEYWORDS entry.

>The entry under it, ill use <REGIMENT> it says

"When you include such a unit in your army you must nominate what <REGIMENT> it is from."

if you include a unit you simply replace the keyword with your chosen <REGIMENT>

All the faction entries standardize what their keyword actually means under the KEYWORD entry and the faction specific entry under it further states multiple times the assigned keyword you give it, is a stand in for the faction keyword.

The one i used was <REGIMENT> but each factions keyword is self contained, even if you change it for flavor as is said clear as day in the first two entrys for every army <KEYWORD> and the one after it.

So you could play <CADIANS> or <TALLARN>, but if you wanted a mixed regiment army of both that lets buffs cross over you just instead assign it its default meaning, <REGIMENT> for IG, <SEPT> for TAU.

You need two separate armies to WAAC allie, and you need to actually read the big scary text blocks if ya wana get away with it.

Possibly multiple times, possibly slowly and out loud.

>>53651724
It's so funny that I can't stop crying.

Does anyone know what colors the Rynn's World PDF is?

>>53652230
>Doubling down on being retarded
Okay, anon. Thanks for the giggle.

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>>53650922
Have tyranids received as much of a buff as orks or is it jobbing as usual?

>>53652248
not only good, mathematically the best unit in the ork codex except for boys

>>53652271
Sorry I don't respond to worthless people.

>>53652275
Yes

>>53652267
Like Cadians, but with a crimson fist.

40k containment board when?

>>53652105
But they do make a looted vehicle model. It's called a leman russ, fire prism, land raider, hammerhead gunship etc.

Are they just dumb?

>>53651624
>But to take that power and use it to your will to reign supreme of the universe
so like how Emps stole the Chaos Gods' shit

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>>53651724
ok you got me

>>53652256
I'm not - I'm an autist discussing 40K on the internet. But I've met normalfags, and most of them will be much happier using numbers 20 times smaller and not looking through tables and adding up numbers.

>>53652240
According to some dorks on Dakka each level of power is around 20 points or so, so despite the fact that things were calculated using the same math, total costs are different thus the final power for units are different.

>>53652252
They have the fly keyword you dumb shit.

>>53652275
>as much of a buff as Orks

Well since Orks have been nerfed hard, no. Tyranids are actually good now.

>>53652262
>You then simply replace the <Chapter> keyword in every instance on that unit's data sheet with the name of your chosen chapter.
Again, it's not "Chapter: WuTang" it's just "Wutang"

>>53652286
They've received a similar buff or they're still shit?

>>53652279
they are a crazy steal for 51pts+whatever gun you give them.

i think stormboyz are probably better though.

>>53652262
<KEYWORDS> are just subfactions anyways and I wouldn't even rely on them to be the word you can use to ally things.

>>53652291
its called autistic wargaming forums

but they banned all discussion of 8th due to it causing shitstorms, so all the autismals came flooding here

>>53652291
You're in one.

>>53652260
Silly anon, that's not how you spell autocannons!

To be fair I'm just messing. I don't want to buy 2 kits of mortars when I already have wyverns for more durability and basilisks for more power. Even if they're less point efficient I'm not a complete WAACfag so I'm not really concerned.

That and the mortar model is eh.

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>>53650922

Can someone fucking explain something to me?

The Indomitus campaign was suppose to open a new story line in 40k 8th edition but with the Dark Imperium book that BL recently released the campaign has been going on for 100 years and is nearly at an end when the Plague Wars break out in Ultramar???

wtf is going on? The Indomitus campaign is already nearly over? Can anyone who read the book shed some light?

>>53652324
It sounds like orks have very effective mob rules though?

>>53652201
Hundreds? Scouts cost 15 ppm and hit on threes. You shouldn't need more than a single five man squad to pop a commissar.

>>53652180

Carnifex. 6 power. 145 points.
fex, scything tail, bio plasma, tox sacs, stranglethorn cannon, monstrous crushing claws


Carnifex. 6 power. 83 points.
fex, mace tail, 2x twin devourers.

>>53652284
Anon, you're just embarrassing yourself at this point. Quit while you're behind.
>>53652312
I'm in a fairly active area, we have monthly tournaments with dozens of players, and not a single person has once even mentioned power level on normiebook.
I just don't see it happening, especially once army building apps are updated.

>>53652349
Are you fucking incapable of playing a match set 100 years ago? Use your brain.

>>53652332
Nids were buffed.

>>53652324
>Orks have been nerfed hard
nice b8

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>>53652297
>But they do make a looted vehicle model. It's called a leman russ, fire prism, land raider, hammerhead gunship etc.
I like you. Youz a funny git!

>>53652349
>The Indomitus campaign was suppose to open a new story line in 40k 8th edition but with the Dark Imperium book that BL recently released the campaign has been going on for 100 years and is nearly at an end when the Plague Wars break out in Ultramar???
>wtf is going on? The Indomitus campaign is already nearly over? Can anyone who read the book shed some light?
My guess on the 100 year jump: Warp-fuckery with the timeline caused by the Great Rift.

>>53652347
Mortar model looks shit this is true, but it makes enemies roll a lot of dice, which makes enemies fall over.

Autocannons are good though. Unless I was up against Armour 14 Autos and Mortars are all I ever took.

>>53652316
Keywords are not rules. Keywords tell you how certain models interact with other rules. Having the "fly" keyword doesn't automatically give you any rules. Jesus Christ how stupid are you? Look at any jetbike unit, then look at something like a Stormraven, the stormraven has actual specific rules for how it moves and how it can only be charged by certain units, the jetbike does not.

Read the fucking rulebook before you come here with your asinine bullshit. I thought 8E was supposed to simplify the game and yet there's still retards like you out there that just don't understand.

>>53652185
fucking kek that's amazing
so tyranids just get their arses kicked in the fluff constantly again despite being one of the top tier races now

>>53652350
He must be the kind of Ork player who doesn't run two 30 boy mobs side-by-side with intermixed special weapons

>>53652349
The Crusade is over, Guilliman does not see it much of a success since it only unites the Imperium. Xenos, Chaos, Traitor still out there.

>>53652350
Same as every army, everyone has a way to ignore morale, that doesn't make up for Ork units going up in price way more than everyone elses, especially when Orks were already one of the lowest tier armies.

>>53652349
It beat all the chaos, so it's almost over.

>>53652203
You know they do have a larger version right? I'm not sure how it stacks up to knight height but it may work better.

>>53652349
Warp travel alone takes years and guilliman has been to baal and back while fighting on numerous fronts

>>53652150
Yeah, but I'm using two of him as fancy priests to buff the crusaders protecting the inquisitor.

>>53652361
Sorry I don't respond to worthless people.

>>53652390
Hell, even running trukk spam with 12 strong boyz mobs I'm still stoked at how much better the orks are this edition.

>>53652379
What are the stats on 8th ed mortars?

>>53651251

Guilliman could directly tell other Space Marines what to do, and they'd still chafe if it wasn't specifically outlined in the Codex Astartes, the book he wrote.

>>53652381
Not exactly true. Having the FLY keyword does give you two special interactions with normal rules, as per the rulebook:
>can ignore models and terrain while moving
>can fall back and shoot in the same turn
That's it, none of that "can't be charged" shit. That's Airborne and it's not a keyword.

>>53652125
That's a hot way to live.

Fyi, from games I've played so far, warpflamers are totally rad now, especially at forcing wounds on single model targets.

>>53652379
Someone mathed it, mortars basically are more efficient than autocannons unless the target is tougher than MEQ.

I'm not worried because they actually match up with heavy bolters pretty well (minus the range and LoS) and heavy bolters are standard in the entire guard motor pool. So basically to deal with infantry I bring tanks (y'all can shit on the Leman Russ all you like but it will give it's points in marines a very hard time) and to deal with tanks j bring infantry.

Or I use rank fire. Which is just grand.

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So after testing out the Admech a little in simulations, they seem to have traded one set of flavour for another. They've lost their tides of fluffy rules (RIP) and interlocking bonuses, but now they're very good indeed at pointing at one thing in particular and making it not be there anymore. 3 Reroll Ones Dunecrawlers do 1.5 wounds to Rowboat Girlyman and 10.5 to a Land Raider on average, with a fair bit of variance due to shot numbers and enemy saves throttling big chunks of damage behind them.

On average the Min damage 3 thing bumps the average D from 3.5 to 4, by the way.

Take 3 Dunecrawlers, two Domini and a couple Sniper Ranger squads and I can practically see enemy cohesion falling apart of its own free will.

My personal plan is 3 Neutronagers, the mandatory Domini and two 5-Ranger 2 Arquebus squads forming the backline and pushing up with several single Dragoons now they're a little tougher to pester and force Fall Back on enemy shooty as a few full squads of Vanguard with a few plasma calivers close in to clean up hordes, backed with a single squad of five Infiltrators to fill gaps where needed.
At higher points drop in some Kastelans, Cawl for rerolls and probably some Kataphron Destroyers for elite clearance, and maybe a Knight at really big games. Also want to try a Ranger Alpha Primus using the Vindicare rules, but he's just an addon.
What would be the best Knight to back Admech? Mine is fully magentized, so I can pick.

Anyone who's had game experience with them know how basic Skitarii guns do against hordes now? I know they lost their absolute superiority, but can they still do the job against stuff like Gants and Boyz? Because I was facing a lot of Gants and Boyz even in 7th, god knows how many now.

>>53652335
>My friend has been wanting to do a gretchen only army with grots kans and big guns for quite awhile and wanting me to help him.
Oh boy this could get crazy now

>>53652426
Heavy d6 s4 ap- D1. They can fire out of LoS. The thing that makes them good is that they're cheaper than dirt now, a mortar HWS is like 24 points.

>>53652382
Tyranids are the NPC race, more news at eleven. Maybe one day they'll get the Imperial Guard and be considered an actual faction after years of being everyone's bitch. But not yet.

>>53652429
True I overlooked that.

>>53652248
They are? What makes them good now?

>>53652407
I did a bit of looking around before I bought it, the larger version is a full 2 inches taller than the Knight - it's almost Warhound Titan sized. I figured it'd be better to have it be a bit smaller and get it to the right height, than to plop a Warhound-sized mech on the table and say "Behold, my Knight Titan! It's actually in cover here, trust me!"

That said, I almost bought one anyways, as it was almost 70% off for those few days.

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>>53652145
Bullshit. Orks haven't improved at all.

>but no initiative

Go fuck yourself. Orks could always manage in close combat. The problem was that getting into close combat when your army is as vulnerable to shooting as orks was always a struggle. Now we're even more vulnerable, but also slow as well, our shooting has been nerfed to fuck and to top it off we have retards like you repeating this 'orks are fine' shit all over the place.

>everyone else got nerfed too, so it's totes fair

How did marines get nerfed? Bolters now give orks a 6+ save, while before they would almost always have 4+ or 5+ from cover (we won't get even the feeble cover bonus to get to 5+ because you have to be totally on the terrain to qualify and you can't take cover behind units anymore). Heavy bolters give no save at all, while before they gave 4+ or 5+ and they can move and shoot. Flamers used to do D3 overwatch hits, now it's D6. Basic marine used to be 14 points, now 13 and he's twice as tough against shoota shots with the new cover rules. The most common unit in the game is better than ever, so no, not everything got nerfed.

>>53652446
As a guard player you have no idea how jealous I am of the neutroncrawler right now. Do you know what OUR tank destroyer does? It's a shitty meltagun!

Gonna do a havoc squad with either missile launchers or lascannons for some ranged antitank. Which should I go for?
Lascannons are straight up better than kraks, but MLs are flexible and can be used as anti-horde as well if needed.
Or just go for 2 of each?

>>53652462
When it comes to just normal 10man infantry, what's the ideal HW and special to take if all you're interested in is sitting on objectives?

>>53652487
Not only are Orks better, but they are very possibly high or top tier now. Quit your bitching and learn your army, it's embarrassing for other Ork players.

>>53652492
It's cheap though. All our shit is cheap at the cost of mediocre guns all around

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>>53652208
>33% reduction in firepower for a unit which is already questionably priced
>nothing

>>53652470
FYI, the non-faction keywords that have core rule implications are Infantry (terrain rules), Fly (movement and fall back), Transport (duh) and Character (target selection). Everything else is just a fancy datasheet ornament without a special rule to interact with it.

>>53652506
I'm biased, but autocannon. It's good against everything.

With every other heavy weapon you have one or two units you can't really use it against. Not so the autocannon.

>>53652231
Not really. They are tougher and better at shooting, but not tough or shooty enough to beat other armies' shooty units. And they suck in close combat, which is basically the only way orks can win anymore.

>>53652523
Vanquisher is nowhere near cheap enough to be worth it.

>>53652506
Probably the Heavy Bolter, as it's a bit more consistent than the mortar and has the AP and Strength to kill infantry good for cheap.

>>53652017
>Not even an SoB player, and I really hope this happens. Give the bolter bitches something to be happy about for once.

As an SoB player fuck plastic infantry. Give me plastic Penitent Engines, plastic Repressors, maybe a new vehicle that's just for Sisters like a flyer, skimmer, or walker or something. Give us back our named characters. Give us NEW named characters. I want to field a Cardinal in Terminator armour or something like that. I want a mob of frateris militia being driven to insane acts of violence by priests. I want an even dumber looking version of the Exorcist that has some kind of holy cannon instead of missiles this time. Something new and interesting, because I have a shit ton of infantry already.

Our infantry models are fine. The newer GW model kits tend to come pretty expensive anyway, so by the time plastic Sisters are ready to go they'll probably cost about the same as the old white metal ones anyway.

>>53652506
I'm a sucker for Mortars, but I've been using them since 6e.

My boards have enough LOS terrain that they can camp out of LOS and shoot no worries

>>53652563
It's incredible how Vanquishers have never been worth it. Even now that single-shot high-damage weapon are becoming top tier, the Vanquisher is still shit.

>>53652563
BS3 Vanquishers I definitely agree to.

A Tank Commander or Pask Vanquisher is actually useful versus certain armies - but it's depending on whether or not you know what the opponent is bringing to the table beforehand

>>53652533
How do infantry interact with terrain?
I mean the real question here is, can a land raider technically drive vertically up a wall or is that an infantry only thing?

>>53652506
Heavy bolter or Autocannon. Those are both really flexible. Personally I'd use the Heavy Bolter since it's cheaper by almost half. For the price of an Autocannon you get a heavy Bolter and a Plasma Gun. Pretty sure those together have more potential damage against a variety of models.

I personally don't care for the Autocannon this edition. If it was 10 points or 12 I might consider it, but it's too expensive for what it can do. Shame I have 3 Autocannons glued and finished. I don't really want to use them.

>>53652578
>shitsters of basshole fetish retard crying

Fuck off nobody gives a shit

>>53652597
>the real question here is, can a land raider technically drive vertically up a wall or is that an infantry only thing?

No. It's covered.

Long story short
>You need Fly or be an Infantry to climb buildings.

>>53652523
I'm sorry, but you clearly haven't crunched the numbers: the dunecrawler is 143 points with the N-lazier and Cognis stubber. A vanquisher is 132+25+8=165 points.

We're tougher, but we get no invuln saves and the vanquisher's damage output is pitiful. Also BS3

So I've played some 8th and the thing I'm trying to nail down rules wise is save modifiers. Can saves stack past a 2+? (Like scarab terminators in cover against an ap -3, 1 damage weapon. Is their armor save 3+ or 5+?).

And then, can saves be reduced past 6? I just saw pox walkers are 7+, which looks like they only get a save in cover. (So 7+ would be the be - save)

>>53652492
It is the only real AT option we have, though. We can't just glue meltas into regular units like you can, not without decent Arc Rifles anymore. I guess we have to overcharge Calivers and hope.

I will say that Arquebus Rangers will do a really good job killing those 4W No Invuln/Low Invuln characters everyone seems to have for buff purposes, that seems to be their job now. Also can target anything, really, although they'll be a bit shit at it, since 6s To Wound toss a Mortal in there plus normal damage, making them SuperGauss. Sure, they won't be oneshotting Land Raiders like the Neutronager or a lucky Railgun team, but they might shave the last wound after an unlucky Damage roll or something.

>>53652382
>so tyranids just get their arses kicked in the fluff constantly again despite being one of the top tier races now
I think this proves what everyone already knew:

When you want something stomped good an' proppa, you throw Orks at the problem until it stops moving. Only guy who knows how to really fight Orks proppa is Ol' One Eye Yarrick, and that's because he knows how the greenskins think better than anyone.

ON A RELATED NOTE:

Does anyone else think that if the Great Rift does pull the entire galaxy into the Warp, the only winners will be Gork, Mork, and Khorne? I'm starting to think whoever thought causing such a big Warp tear or destroying the Pylons around the Eye of Terror might not have been the best idea...
Unless this is Khorne's version of "Just as planned!" which would be amusing if nothing else.

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Listen up maggots!
Here's some math for you guardfags to chew on:

A Wyvern costs 93 pts nad puts out an average of 14 Str 4 shots at BS 4+ rerolling to wound

A Taurox Prime with Taurox Gatling Cannon and 2 Hotshot Velley Guns costs 96 pts
It puts out 28 Str 4 shots at BS 3+

11 Mortar HWTs cost 99 pts
They put out an average of 38.5 Str 4 shots at BS 4+

Now the Taurox averages 18.67 hits, the mortars 19.25 hits, Wyverns are completely outclassed by these two
Mortars put out .58 hits more than the Taurox, however the Taurox has the slight advantage of having 5.34 of his hits done at AP-2

In the end for the same amount of points they output practically the same amount of firepower so wich is better? That's for you to decide.

Taurox
++doesn't take up important FOC slots
++VERY fast truck running at incredibly hihg speed
++reasonably tanky
+can transport dudes
-range is meh
--model looks like shit

Mortars
++lotsa cheap dudes
++can fire out of LoS
++can be issued orders
+decent range
-lotsa dudes to buy, build and paint
--fragile units
--they take a fuckload of Heavy Support slots