/5eg/ Fifth Edition General:

>>53077888
>What are some things you would want to change in 5e?
>What are some things that irk you in this edition?

Classes.

They shouldn't exist.
They should be replaced by a pointbuy.

>>53077911
>>>/gurps/

>>53077911
>(You)

>>53077911
>>53077914
>>53077916
A modular point-purchase class feature system might be an idea.
The only downside is you'd need to have spellcasting features cost more.

>>53077888
>What are some things you would want to change in 5e?

All martials getting maneouvers.
Monks getting a d10 Hp die.
Bards being reduced to a d6 die cause a full caster has no right being a d8 class.

>What are some things that irk you in this edition?

Lack of thought put into making classes.

Bards are strictly the best casters because they get to steal spells from other spell lists.

Wizard get a free of cost metamagic and free low level spells as one of thei later features while Sorcerrers can go fuck them selves with only learning metamagic they didn't pick at lvl 2.

Repostin
Would like any ideas, also, this is in roll20, thinking of using those witcher 3 maps for the battle maps.


My party just finished white plume mountain. The barb is going to refuse to give up blackrazor.

They were sent to retrieve these weapons because they are prone to causing trouble by the commander of the military force in neverwinter. They were offered basically a mundane wish, anything they could want.

How should I approach this, they are going to deliver wave and whelm but refuse to give blackrazor.

They will be in the middle of neverwinter so I'm thinking of creating an escape from LA esque thing.

File: Screen Shot 2017-05-05 at 15.45.19.png (1MB, 1020x767px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 1020x767px

Got caught in the end of the last thread.

Expansion to >>53073900

Ongoing work for >>53075873 (You)

The map for the Myst Tower now resembles this picture.

The rules are:

>The whole tower is a labyrinth.
>The gates are perfectly black (impenetrable shadow, but intangible) so they can't see into the next room.
>Every time someone passes through a door, they come into the new room from a different side from the one they'd expect.
>Top door sends them right. Left door sends them up. Bottom door sends them left. Right door sends them down.
>Each room contains a map showing where they are, but not how they got there.
>When they enter a cell, they enter it as if they'd intended to head in that direction - i.e. if they go through the left door of the previous cell, they'll come in through the bottom door of the cell above.
>Travelling through two of the same door in a row (from their perspective) sends them back to the start, i.e. turning left, then turning left again
>At the start, they'll see their past selves just finishing disappearing through the first door.
>Every time they revisit a cell after they've seen their past selves, they have a 1/20 chance of encountering themselves. Every time they return to the start, the chance increases by 1/20.
>The selves they encounter will always attack.

The map notes:
>Return sends players back to ENTRY
>Locations: Cave, Camp, Throne are all silent visions of what's occurring in those locations at that time
>Crying Child is a location the party haven't visited yet, with a crying child they can't interact with but providing a hook for a sidequest
>Mosaic is artwork that explains the purpose of the towers to give them an insight into the plot
>Target is where they find the artifact that completes the tower
>The Future Chosen is a vision of where their current plot choices will end up, in the worst possible way
>Home...? is a vision of the land they've been abducted from

Does this seem like a complete dungeon or is it lacking?

>>53077888
>What are some things that irk you in this edition?
The only thing that truly irks me is that they won't expand existing class options like Fighting Styles or Maneuvers or whatever. Any time you provide a modular ability the point is to provide more options down the road.

At first, it looked like the would (mariner style/tunnel fighter) but it seems like they plan on abandoning that - and it was probably because of screeching autists in the feedback.

>>53077911
I wish they would get rid of classes and just do feature trees and levels. Each level you pick a feature, some come in bundles.

>>53077998
>Each level you pick a feature, some come in bundles.
Makes me think of Fallout: New Vegas' feature system at the start, where you could pick things that were both advantageous and a weakness, like getting raised perception while wearing glasses but reduced without.

I'd like that.

>>53077998
>At first, it looked like the would (mariner style/tunnel fighter) but it seems like they plan on abandoning that - and it was probably because of screeching autists in the feedback.

Can't have martials getting to close to those precious caster classes in terms of utility anon.

You start with a standard array and point buy. All feats are available and so is multi classing. Post your most OP build.

I don't have any complaints really. If I wanted to play something that didn't revolve around classes I wouldn't play D&D.

I wish they kept with the unearthed arcana weekly though that made my Mondays enjoyable.

>>53078044
Somewhat agree on the arcana, my only hope is they take a closer look at some of the classes/subclasses that actually need help now.

>>53078070
I'd like to see some more love for sorcerer. The two choices in the players hand book are appalling. Dragon from a story perspective almost guarantees edge lord players or self important characters and wild magic is really weak.

File: Ass.png (31KB, 659x255px) Image search: [Google]

31KB, 659x255px

How are these guys able to sell this?
They approved by WotC?

>>53078106
There's some playtest shit that's pretty sweet. I'm rolling up a "Earth element" origin sorcerer for my next game.

>>53078134
Yeah, earth and storm are decent. Nothing much besides those two.

>>53078134
Earths only fault is that they need to spend their action to use their unarmoured feature.

Tough luck when you get surprised.

>Hobgoblins have litters of kids, most of which are actual goblins
>In their society, goblins are largely subservient to Hobgoblins, who use them as infantry in battles or laborers
>Goblins breed true with each other, also in litters, but there's a small chance that a goblin pairing will produce a bugbear
>Bugbear pairings produce Goblins,as well, but with a higher chance of Bugbear kids
Is this too complicated/lopsided?

>>53078273
I feel bad for the goblin mother giving birth to a bugbear.

I doubt your players will really have the need for this information, and I believe bugbears are quite rare unless a goblin is just pumping out babies

>>53078273
Why exactly do you need a complex and detailed system for goblin breeding?

>>53078106
They definitely need something, also Wot4E either needs an overhaul or to tell people to just use the 3rd party one made since it's actually playable.

>>53078273
Just use slaadi

>>53078113
Probably either not making enough to try legal action against, or they're based out of US so it'd become a nightmare to try and prosecute/sue over.

>>53078171
Yeah I agree

But I was under the impression that once it's up, it's up forever until you take it down or go to sleep (or get KOd)

>>53078342
Yeah.
Just remember to activate it each time you finish a rest.

This was probably done to nerf the class a bit cause it has CON based AC.

>>53078106
They should just remove the Sorcerer and Warlock altogether. They are basically Wizard with a gimmick and Wizard with an edge.

>>53077888
Get rid of the tieflign and the dragonborn. And since we're already getting rid of dead weight, remove the Ranger entirely.

>>53078409
Remove dragonborn and gnomes instead.

>>53078394
Might aswell since a couple of the UAs are already making the "play a wizard" meme becoming more of a reality.

>>53078308
Touche. I have a player who loves fluff,but I suck at worldbuilding

>>53078306
I was thinking about potential countries for a setting, but I think I'm going too far down the rabbit hole
This isn't even for a political intrigue game

>>53078324
Frog people, right? I forgot they existed

>>53078409
Remove every race but humans, and make races subclasses

>>53078432
Damn Gnomes. Yes. This. Fucking gnomes.

>>53078394
Warlock works A LOT different than any other class, it's the most unique design of this edition

>>53078451
If you want to throw in fluff go for it, just remember to not make it too complicated or you are gonna burn yourself out

>>53078453
Remove the "halves". Half-fucking races are shit, make no sense and should never exist. Plus, they're always half-human, making it even less criative and just boring.

>>53077969
Fucking awesome, stealing

>>53078510
Half-orcs are a vestige of an older time, and should not exist. Orcs should be a PC race.

>>53078394
Warlocks are nothing like wizards or any other class for that matter. They don't even technically have the Spellcasting class feature

>>53077961
>Bards being reduced to a d6 die cause a full caster has no right being a d8 class.
So sorcerer should also get knocked down to a d6?

Same thing.

Can you use Lethal Strike with Bestial Claws?
Or Knock Back/Brute Strike for that matter.

Soul Knives and Hone the Blade doesn't seem like nearly enough damage to make it worth sacrificing two disciplines, have anyone had any success with one?
also, is hone the blade supposed to stack with augmented weapon?

>>53078536
Cool, I'll take that as a vote of confidence!

>>53078580
Sorcerrer is allread a d6 class.

>>53078580
>So sorcerer should also get knocked down to a d6?
>knocked down to a d6
do you even play 5e

>>53078605
>Soul Knives and Hone the Blade isn't worth it
But you can kill for psi points, and there's only a handful of really great disciplines

While we're on the subject of warlocks, I find it ironic that at the height of D&D popularity (which I would say is AD&D and 2nd Ed) there was massive public outcry about D&D encouraging Satan worship, when in reality the core game didn't have anything of the sort and in fact had Paladins as paragons of goodness.

Nowadays with this latest edition your alter ego can literally be a Devil-worshipping freak who is also literally part demon themselves (Tiefling) and nobody seems to care anymore.

>>53078545
Already a PC race nerd

>>53078640
Then the animu happened, anon. Satan is now the coolest guy in town, and having horns give you the right kind of edge.

>>53078655
I think he means a core race, as OP was asking what would you change in the rules

>>53078639
>But you can kill for psi points
stuff like this is pretty unreliable, specially in a big table like mine, when you have no certainty on getting the last hit on stuff.

>>53078640
I don't think people are as bible thumping as nowadays. Cause the people are supposed to bible thump were the kids of those assholes and they aren't gonna give a shit.

>>53077911
The problem is that point buy requires at least some semblance of balance. Magic would need to be ABSURDLY, OUTRAGEOUSLY cheap for a point buy system to enable the current magic system and class designs. Unless you made some sort of sub-system where you can't get magic unless you specialize on it, which would beat the point of using point buy and just make for less elegant character progression

>>53078673
Kill rats or farm animals

>>53078667
So rerelease the player's handbook?

>>53078712
kek

>>53078580
They're already a d6 tho

>>53077961
I think spell stealing isn't that strong cause it's only at later levels save for life bards.

And d6 classes have shield, and all the damaging spells, they don't only have two of them they have fireball lighting bolt conjure elementals and more.

And they don't do any damage except a crossbow, vicious mockery is nice unless they have half a decent wisdom score

>>53078394
They should just remove every class except cleric, fighter, rogue, wizard. Barbarians are fighters with anger issues, bards are rogues that pickpocketed the wizard's spellbook, druids are hippy clerics, paladins are clerics with a stick up their ass, monks are weaboo rogues, rangers are fighters with a dissociative disorder, sorcerers are wizards that never went to school, and warlocks are wizards that sucked off someone else for magic. Actually, we don't even needs classes either. Everyone just plays commoners. You'll get an extra Hit Die, an ability score improvement, and a increase to your proficiency bonus every once in a while, maybe, I don't know, what do you want?

3.5 question but w/e

Do 3rd books work with 3.5 or do they need to be converted? Books like Deities and Demigods didn't get a 3.5 version, I presume that's because there was no need, is that correct?

pls respond

File: mindflayer_knight_by_halycon450-da4haa9.jpg (881KB, 1100x2075px) Image search: [Google]

881KB, 1100x2075px

>>53078432
remove
gnomes
>>53078409
remove tieflings


>>53077888
make illithids core pc races.

>>53078819
>Asking the players what they want.

They don't know what they want. No chance will make everyone happy.

>>53078819
>maybe, I don't know, what do you want?
To remove the Sorcerer and Warlock altogether. Are you dense? I wrote it on my post.

>>53078409
But I'm playing a ranger right now and having fun

Any DMs put Guards and Wards in dungeons/towers/whatever? How do you keep tack of the wrong turns he players take?

>>53077888
>What are some things you would want to change in 5e?
>What are some things that irk you in this edition?
Sorcerers are going the right track with new bloodlines but still feel like "discount wizards with a consolation prize added on". Warlocks don't need regular spellcasting when they could be designed entirely around cantrips and rituals. They need more and more interesting invocations. Medium armor proficiency should come standard with bladelock. All Wizards really need is to have some of their powers balanced out (Conjuration I'm looking at you).

Fighters don't really need to be their own thing, when pretty much every Fighter can be re-written as something else and suddenly gain supernatural feats and/or spellcasting. Battlemaster actions should be something anyone can work with presuming they've got weapons and armor to be proficient in, and more classes can have Combat Styles to reflect how they approach combat as martial/hybrid classes. Some of the archetypes that turn Fighter into a Warlord by another name are a better step towards saving the class, though, and we should encourage that focus on turning Fighter into "battlefield commander who gives support buffs and whatnot" if we're going to keep it.

D&D needs to stop pretending it can be used as a low fantasy game. In D&D it's pretty clear a setting grown organically from the mechanics, especially in 5E, would essentially require people in any civilization advanced enough to equate to Iron Age Earth social complexity to either be or have regular access to low-level magic users, as society would invariably form around the people who can cure injuries by patting you on the shoulder, fix and maintain basic equipment flaws literally all day without issue, clean water for drinking, et cetera. The only way we can really resolve this is to seriously cripple the spell list, and not just in the sensible "maybe remove the spells that let you be a fucking god" method.

File: image.jpg (274KB, 830x1220px) Image search: [Google]

274KB, 830x1220px

Level 10 character died, kinda feel like rolling a land Druid because I've never really seen one. Looking over its shit, it just seems like a bad Wizard though?

Can anyone sell the class to me? Conjure Fey seems like a redeeming quality but Warlock gets it as well.

>>53078850
Yes you are. It's of course the least class ever played in every tasble in the history of DnD (even Wizards admited it), and you wouldn't notice if it was just a Fighter archetype, but, yeah. Ranger.

>>53078835
Are you ohueli tam?

Illithids are too ayylmao, too powerful, and too prone to be grabbed by the head by evil Elder Brain to be core

>>53078608
>>53078536
>>53077969

Work continues!

With the Myst Tower complete, four towers remain:

>Iron Tower - no theme at current
>Shadow Tower - no theme at current
>Stone Tower - heavy on traps
>Sun Tower - central puzzle of increasing complexity, needs more material

Looking for ideas for further puzzle/trap themes, or things I can add to existing ones. All ideas welcome.

>>53078841
Yes, but what will you name your commoner?

File: autism.png (104KB, 266x253px) Image search: [Google]

104KB, 266x253px

>>53078866
>We can find Breastplace, Half-Plate and Full Plate selling on every major town
>Gunpowder do not exist
>MFW

>>53078874
Yeah. Game should be just caster(wo)man and fighter(wo)man with a bunch of archetypes because I don't like some of the classes and them being in the game severely makes the game worse for me

>>53078866
I know I could probably do that "have you tried not playing D&D" meme and I've played a number of other systems, but the as-is of 5E is a step in the right direction and can be adjusted to be even moreso.

D&D is, and has pretty much always been, great as a "high action heroic fantasy about exceptional lads mucking about in the business of evil bastards" game. Magic is all over D&D and it cripples itself by not letting warriors have access to it, and it cripples gameplay variety by making all magic Vancian or pseudo-Vancian spellcasting, when entirely different magic systems could be used based on how your character uses magic.

We have the tools to make this out of the existing models of D&D. Look at a 3.5 game with Tome of Battle and Psionics classes as the running standard, with maybe a few mid-tier, comparable Vancians thrown into the mix plus the 3.5 Warlock. You get four entire systems of magic this way, with distinct playstyles for each. We could have that in 5E (or perhaps 6E by the time this would be done) by making a few different ways to approach magic and just making a few different classes for each which use each method to a different end.

>>53078961
I don't even know what are you trying to come up with here, but yes. The Ranger is the shit. Read the UA. It's pretty much stated on the opening paragrapher.

>>53078625
>>53078621
They get +1 HP which makes them exactly equal to a d8.

File: 1486848818078.jpg (22KB, 351x351px) Image search: [Google]

22KB, 351x351px

>DM: You walk into a 30 by 30 ft. room
>What's in it?
>DM: I don't know you'll have to look around roll investigation

>>53078987
And while you're at it, roll to make sure you remember how to breathe.

>>53078874
>It's of course the least class ever played in every tasble in the history of DnD (even Wizards admited it), and you wouldn't notice if it was just a Fighter archetype, but, yeah. Ranger.
Least popular class in 5e is Druid

>>53078044
Completely agree, D&D is all about classes. I think it helps to root things a bit forcing you to make a semi-believable character that has had to devote their life to their trade. Not everyone can be a Dovakin edgelord that's a master of archery, magic, and swords at the same time.

>>53078873
Druids get some solid abilities and can use them to their full potential. They make solid conjurers with conjure animals conjure elemental and conjure fey. The expanded spells lots are fair at least and great at best. Wild shape brings a ton of usage to the table from becoming a stealth scout to a sudden surge of health in emergencies. Later on flying beasts like giant eagle are good, can carry you and another character around. The later abilities are also great, spells in wild shape help a lot, imagine giant eagle flying around castin storm of vengeance. Timeless body gives your character fluff, an elf may live 10,000 years with it. And unlimited wild shapes is perfect.

>>53078987
The ability to realize you are in a 30 x 30 room with a glance makes me in awe.
I's like being able to tell the feets on a sphere when you cast an AoE.
Or know that you have disadvantage on a ranged attack based in nothing but sight alone.

>DM: you wake up
>I go outside
>DM: People start to laugh at you because you are naked

>>53079004
He should be. He was a deity on 3.5, and mundane on 4th. All the expectations of the class are gone. And the Ranger is still so bad and poorly made, they dedicated an entire UA to try and fix him.

>>53079001
Don't forget to roll for spontaneous combustion.

>>53078909
If guns existed everyone would use guns and if everyone were using guns it wouldn't be fun.

Started running sunless citadel, ended when the party came across Meepo.

Any tips for running the rest of the adventure? We just kinda started it on a whim.

>>53078982
>They get +1 HP which makes them exactly equal to a d8.

Only 2 archetypes do.

Dragon Sorcerrer which was originally meant to be a Melee Subclass.

And Stone Sorcerrer which is a Melee Subclass.

>>53079040
And an acrobatics check to see if you can remain balanced while standing on two feet.

File: 1484235367305.png (17KB, 640x773px) Image search: [Google]

17KB, 640x773px

>>53078829
>31 people in the thread and nobody answers my question

>>53079037
https://dnd.wizards.com/articles/features/dd-survey-results-summary

>>53079022
If a DM does that you should ask to roll dick size, which for those who don't know, is 2d4+1 for medium size.

>>53078580
>d6
>implying sorcerer is even a half caster

Is there a resource that tells me what the Tarot equivalents of the Deck of Many Things are (That doesn't include the suits, i.e: Swords, Wands, Cups, Coins/Pentacles? Obviously you have Flames/The Devil, Death/Skull, but some are more difficult than others. I just wanna use the basic 22 tarot cards

>>53079059
no one knows because no one played 3.0

>>53079058
But before you can get your balance, you have to make Constitution check to remain conscious. You've been awake for an couple hours afterall.

>>53079062
>Paladins
>5th
I'm ok with this.

>>53079104
They must have done if it was bad enough to warrant a .5

>>53079062
>most popular races are the 4 most powerful races + dragonborn
>most popular classes are the most generic 4 classes + paladin

>>53079135
>aarokocra least popular
>implying elves and dwarves are good
and I bet most use non v. human

>>53079150
I think aarokocra is least popular because it honestly looks unfair at first glance

>>53078640
>the height of D&D popularity was 2nd edition

No, that was the height of its public infamy. D&D is more popular today than it ever was in 2nd edition. For all their flaws, WotC have marketed it much better than TSR ever did.

>>53079011

Do you recommend any particular Land type? Grassland and Underdark look neat, my group has a lot of martials.
Multiclassing a no go?

>>53079120
you got me there. that said, I imagine enough people played it for them to realise it's broken, but not enough that a lot of D&D players would have general knowledge about it, or if they did, have forgotten it.

nonetheless, you're in a 5e thread, ask reddit or go to a pathfinder or 3.5 thread

>>53079175
Desert

File: IMG_1423.jpg (89KB, 468x246px) Image search: [Google]

89KB, 468x246px

>>53079088
OH JESUS NO!!!!

DO NOT USE THE DECK OF MANY THINGS UNLESS YOU ARE INTENTIOALLY TRYING TO RUIN YOUR CAMPAIGN!!!

>>53079181
alri I'll ask the pathfinder thread, I just presumed everyone here has played other editions

>>53079200
>people unironically think this
dude, I've run it before just with a deck of normal playing cards. You just tweak it a little, and stack the deck. simple card tricks can make your players draw what you want them to draw

>>53078667
It's in Volo's guide so technically it is already a published race.

>>53079175
Grassland is your best bet, multiclassing is bad in general, but if I had to pick one, ranger would be my pick. Two into Ranger to get your fighting style and all that.

Pass without trace will make you loved and adored by anyone in heavy armor.

>>53079205
a lot of us have, I come from 3.5, still haven't run (but have played in) 5e yet. just, as i say, so few people played or want to remember 3.0, this is the last place you wanna look

>>53078885
>stone tower

Puzzle theme should be turning the whole place upside down like in Majora's Mask.

>>53079200
I once had my players pull from the Deck in character creation. That the catgirl ranger picked donjon was all I remembered.

>>53079114
Not so fast, you forgot to roll to see if this is the timeline where events led to your character being born and in this dungeon at this exact moment.

Are there any dismemberment rules out there?

>>53079088

There's probably a better resource, but the 3.5 DMG definitely told you the equivalents. So you know you can check there at least.

>>53078971
Completely different magic systems sounds cool to people that have played it a ton but it scares off new players.

One of the reasons I like 5e is the streamlining of these things that has made it more approachable for newbies and let me bring friends in without it being overwhelming.

>>53078971
5e tried cutting out alot of the extra to be more streamlined and appeal to newer players, so of course the options are gonna be restricted.

>>53079289
There's an Injury table on page 272 of the DMG.

>>53079327
I for one don't mind that, because there's still plenty of options to be had.

>>53078971
>D&D is, and has pretty much always been, great as a "high action heroic fantasy about exceptional lads mucking about in the business of evil bastards" game. Magic is all over D&D and it cripples itself by not letting warriors have access to it, and it cripples gameplay variety by making all magic Vancian or pseudo-Vancian spellcasting, when entirely different magic systems could be used based on how your character uses magic.
You know 4e solved all that

>>53079271
Not to mention, when dealing with the intricacies of causality, you gotta roll for time duplicate. What? Of course that's how time works. You see this is why you have me as a DM and not Jerry, who couldn't even infer that the grappling rules called for a Constitution check to resist ejaculation when being manhandled by a mindflayer. No, this isn't my magical realm (not yet), now ROLL!

>>53079290
Yeah they do, but as I said, I don't want the suits in there, I just want the Major Arcana

File: DragonbornKnight2.jpg (216KB, 640x786px) Image search: [Google]

216KB, 640x786px

>>53079062
>>53079135
>dragonborn in the top 5 despite fairly shitty racials
You know I'm kinda glad people are liking them, maybe if they're popular enough WotC will bring back muh Arkhosia and shit
Though half-orcs not making the top 5 hurts my soul

>>53079416
I just wish the nature of dragon sorcerer and storm herald barbarian didn't encourage you to AVOID matching your dragonborn bloodline with your storm type or dragon sorcery bloodline

>>53079119
>The paladin just squeaked by the warlock to capture fifth place.
You know people were actually just playing both at the same time. Pallylock is best class.
>>53079435
I was surprised they didn't offer some feat to encourage synergy in the racial feat UA they had. They had more than enough examples to draw from 4e.

>>53077888
The monstrosity type irks me. It's vague, inconsistent and encourages lazy monster design.

Winged cats and winged snakes are a beast, but griffons and owlbears are a monstrosity. Crag cats are beasts with spell turning and nondetection.

Being a monstrosity implies an unnatural abomination that druids hate, but includes the goodly centaurs who are in touch with nature. This is add odds with medieval bestiaries, which did not segregate the weirdo critters as being unnatural. They thought the bonnacon shooting flaming poo was 100% natural.

Many monstrosities have a place in the fantasy ecology. They usually aren't bizarre one-offs that cannot reproduce conventionally.

I want to remove the monstrosity type or at least severely restrict what goes into it. The existing monstrosities may be shuffled into other the types.

Druid wild shaping balance is trivially solved but limiting them to a pre-approved list or using generic statistics like in the playtest. Why the hell did they remove the generic stats from the playtest?!

>>53079062
>Races human at the top

No surprise there for a couple reasons, especially if the DM let's people play variant.

Goliath at the top of extra is not surprising because of a) their stats are pretty decent and b)Travis is the best player on CR

>Classes fighter at the top

Slightly surprised to not only see fighter at the top but also wizard that low since according to 5eg it's the end all be all class. Then again it could be people using it as a base for MC or alot of Macgyver fighters are running around.

File: Illithid.pdf (2MB, 1x1px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 1x1px

>>53078881
>ohueli tam
who?

i'm just mind flayer anon, and well yeah, i know. i just wanted the playable option in volo's given all the lore they dropped on them, chances are they are never going to touch them again in 5e as they already did.

i don't really think power is their problem, not even brain availability, but the elder brain interference and racial paranoia. it's hard being a sane adventurer illithid and not be absolutely paranoid of gith attacks, being so exposed in possibly the surface and without thralls.

>>53079491
Big guys with big weapons is a very popular concept, and a lot of people don't bother to learn the spellcasting rules

>>53079489
>Why the hell did they remove the generic stats from the playtest?!
Like every decision made after the playtest, it was because gragnard screamed "not muh dnd"

>>53079491
Wizard is hard, fighter is simple. Many people playing 4e are new and can't be arsed to memorize 20+ spells and figure out how to wreck every encounter in two turns. They just wanna whack things.

>>53075641
>Well, you have scouting down, but scouting is something that a familiar or something could do anyway.So you're not really optimized in terms of roles you fill.
I never once complained about damage. I don't care to be competitive in damage. I know the two fighters aren't as keen on DnD mechanics so I didn't want to make a character that did more damage than them. And even if I made the most optimized ranger for damage I would at most be getting 1d8 more damage per round while missing out on disguise self, rope trick, and some other stuff. Also I tried to take sharpshooter on multiple occasions and was shot down each time. The first time was that the DM thought it was OP. The second time the DM gave us a bonus feat for something where I tried to take sharpshooter and the warlock (who took a feat for 20ft flight speed) said that sharpshooter wouldn't be in the spirit of things because everyone except the warlock took not so great feats.

>Then, aside from having a half-assed combat role, the 'scout' role as I said before isn't worth so much.
The ranger has class features and the skill points that lead them in that direction. Without them they're just a worse fighter.

>Firstly, I'm not so sure advantage+disadvantage would be +10, but it's not that simple
In extreme scenarios it comes out to be +8 or +10. Really it's the whole disadvantage thing makes them only have a 25% chance to roll an 11 or higher and advantage has a 75% to roll an 11 or higher. It's damn near auto success unless the opposing Perception score is huge.

>It also only giving advantage on HIDE checks.
Didn't notice that.

>So presumably your DM is giving the guy far too much shit they don't deserve, like wizard's main utility - vast ritual casting, along with extra stealth.
The DM is just trying to make sure the player has fun.

>>53079062
>Most pupular class/race combo is Human Fighter.

The Male Human Fighter meme is real and laughing at Half-Tiefling-Half-Aasimar Pal-sorc-lock meme builds.

>>53079502
Hey, you did add the talent!
Nice.

>>53079519
>>53079543

Yeah that sounds about right

>>53079491
Dominating with magic has a lot less "impact" than dominating with big meaty hits, even if you're doing so much more, it always "feels" like you're doing less as a wizard

Reminder that PAM, Crossbow Expert, Sharpshooter, GWM and war caster are badly designed feats

>>53079585
I bet most popular fighter archetype is Champion

>>53079585
Varely.
But a standard party seems to be 4 humans and a something else.

>>53079585
The funnest characters I've ever played were male human fighters, but mostly because I've had DMs crack down hard on spellcasters and nonhuman races (one hypocritically complained that humans and martials were boring).

>>53079630
feats were a mistake

>>53079054
So?

Bards have several melee oriented subclasses.

Got more straws to pull out?

>>53079630
>I hate players having any choice beyond level 3

>>53079660
Choice is fine. Feat tax isn't

>>53077961
Bards need the d8 to fill the jack of all trades master of none role.

>>53079668
The choice then becomes "when do you take the feat"

still a choice, especially in regards to GWM and sharpshooter, where the extra accuracy of an ASI vs the power boost of the feat matters the most

File: CasterMerlinStage1.png (426KB, 990x750px) Image search: [Google]

426KB, 990x750px

What's the best way to recreate this nigga? Tiefling diviner wizard?

>>53079239
There's actually a sand trap in there already... I could make an hourglass theme.

>>53079690
Ask pfg they know all about making weeb characters.

>>53079630
Badly designed how?

Are there any 5e conversions for DSP psionics, path of war, akashic mysteries, or DDS spheres of power, spheres of might? I want to reduce caster supremacy by forcing casters to specialize and give martials more utility. It fits better with my campaign setting too. Thanks!

>>53079723
I think he's literally asking how to make Merlin, not just the Fate incarnation of him

And I mean, Merlin's not really a D&D type wizard. His only "feat" coincidentally can only be explained via True Polymorph

>>53079630
The idea of having weapon feats and stuff like 'actor' alongside each other was a bad idea entirely. It's not bad to have 'Oh, you can improve combat instead of out of combat' sometimes but it's kinda bad when you kind of need it to be competitive as a martial.

Will you take compulsory weapon feats, or perish like a dog?

>>53079690
I don't know weeb face that well, care saying who that is

File: 1493400615245.jpg (5KB, 201x201px) Image search: [Google]

5KB, 201x201px

>>53079767
With the information I was presented by him my answer doesn't change, especially with the
>Tiefling diviner

>>53079767
Honestly no mythological wizard is a D&D type wizard. The system is poorly suited for portraying them. Perhaps warlocks fit better.

>>53079800
>>53079767
>>53079807
Merlin. Half-incubus/human who sees the future. Same Merlin from the legends.

>>53079792
i have yet to make a martial with any weapon feats, I've done just fine.

>>53079807
Post-christianization Merlin was implied to be the antichrist, born to a raped nun from either a incubus or Satan himself, and then cleansed from evil by being baptized

Before that it was either a faerie or him literally having no father

File: 1412311870336.gif (75KB, 1200x1200px) Image search: [Google]

75KB, 1200x1200px

>>53079684
>Bards need the d8 to fill the jack of all trades master of none role.
>Bards
>Master of none

>>53079836
Then another martial picks one and now does x2 the damage you can dish out

>>53079876
That phrase is not actually supposed to be negative, people just always cut the ending
>often times better than a master of one

>>53079896
Are they suddenly racing to see who can do more damage or something?

>>53079831
>>53079856
I recall the legends vaguely, wasn't sure if anime has made some random change, next time try using something other than anime makes some people have a knee jerk reaction because of pfg shitposting from time to time.

Personally I'd make the whole half incubus thing a side note in back story play a human since that's normally the way he is described, or you could try and get your DM to work with either letting you reskin the tiefling as a human for this instance or play a half elf but say half tiefling.

>>53079896
as a matter of fact, i was in a game, i was an EDK, another player archer fighter with Sharpshooter. We simply had different roles, he did the damage, I soaked the damage. I still put out plenty of hurt, but with my crowd control ability and AC in the mid 20's, i gave him the opportunity to do so.

It's not all about the numbers, anon.

Anyone have DDAL06-01?

>>53079836
A barbarian who uses a rapier and shield can outdamage a barbarian who uses a greatsword and no feats simply by taking levels in rogue, and considering that barbarians have some pretty shitty levels after level 5 that'd be pretty stupid if it weren't for the fact that strength barbarians can use feats like GWM and PAM.

Without sentinel, it's harder to defend teammates.
Fighter has a load of ASIs yet only needs one or two stats and really doesn't do much aside from deal damage so it'd be a shame to downplay their role and not get the damn weapon feats.
Monk is squishy, and relies on mobile to get out of melee combat after punching to keep themself safe from attacks.


But in all cases, it would be better if these classes didn't actually have to spend feats for these things that're practically essential for balance, whereas casters don't need those at all.

File: Merlin_official.jpg (762KB, 2000x2000px) Image search: [Google]

762KB, 2000x2000px

>>53079935
Next time I'll just use this one instead.

I figured either half-elf, elf reskinned as a human, or tiefling/homebrew would be required to fit the half-incubus part. I'm more concerned about the class that fits him best. Merlin was a sorcerer and a wizard if I recall correctly. Lore Master sorcerer would be a better fit, but there's no way to really make an oracle without dipping into Diviner.

>>53079927
Bards can literally be better Rangers than Rangers, better thieves than Rogues, and better casters than Sorcerers, at the same time. And be as good as the barbarian at grappling on top of it.

>>53079984
Like I said the half-elf as a base and simply talk to he DM making sure he knows it's half tiefling instead would be the easiest route.

As for school that's what it'd come down to either going diviner and picking up spells to fit the myth better. If your going to be hardcore like another anon last night making a Witcher and only taking Witcher like spells as an EK then MCing would be a must to fit.

>just realized sorcs get Polymorph but not True Polymorph
/5eg/ was right. Sorc is just shitty wizard. I accept this now.

>>53080058
Seems like that's the only choice I have left. MCing.

>>53080064
Dragon sorcerers will never get to permanently transform into real dragons.

>>53079416

Oh shit, a Dragonborn with a proper closed helmet. Been looking for one of those forever.

Thanks Anon.

What was the reasoning behind d8 monks with standard ASIs? Did the 3.5 crowd campaign for them to stay shitty during the playtest like they did with fighters or does WotC hate the class?

>>53080064
Yeah, they really fuck over their spell selection.
It doesn't really make sense that they limit their spell list so much, in my opinion. Not at all.

They would be just as balanced if they had the same list because they must choose fewer spells overall. The benefits they gain in metamagic would be balanced by the sheer utility and versatility that a wizard can offer. To to mention, wizard subclasses often have much more to offer the wizard than the sorcerers' does.

>>53079984
To expand on >>53080058 could start off as a sorcerer to show the whole "born with magic" theme then mc into wizard to better show the Oracle side.

>>53079987
>Better thieves than Rogues

How? Isn't expertise in the right skills the best they can grab, but even then Rogues should have an edge on Dexterity, unless the Bard is ignoring their spell casting.

>Muh spells can make me more effective
Arcane Trickster.

>>53080087
Sad part is, this is still one of the best versions of monk.

File: latest[1].jpg (25KB, 323x454px) Image search: [Google]

25KB, 323x454px

>Miss a session
>Come back and find out the DM gave the sharpshooter fighter a bow that shoots 2 arrows at once per attack

>>53080113
I'm not sure if this applies to actual 2e, but monks in Baldur's Gate 2 were dynamite.

>>53080079
Unfortunately yes, it's a really cool concept now that I think about it and realize it isn't the anime version. I just wish my players would try and get this creative with making characters.

Have a personal grudge against anime inspired characters because as a forever DM they are the worst players I've had. May not be true for all but that's what I've dealt with.

>>53080087
Give monk one more ASI and they're fixed.
They're decent tier if you only stick to their mandatory ASIs and pick a race that benefits the stats they need.

If you give them another ASI they can get a little bit more versatility, or remain decent tier and let them pick a non-standard "monk race."

>>53079987
Getting to cast conjure barrage doesn't make you a better ranger. Grappling is usesless. They make better thieves if they pump Dex instead of charisma. You can't do metamagic bullshit and you can only have so many spells from other classes.

Beards are good at faking they are other classes but nothing more. You won't get advantage on strength checks you won't get archery fighting style.

Bards are great at doing a quarter of what another class does really well, but when it comes down to it they are just copies, and I'd rather have a barbarian grappling than a d8 light armor half elf trying to shove a troll prone.

File: 1492649783192.gif (844KB, 268x278px) Image search: [Google]

844KB, 268x278px

>>53080122

>>53080103
better spell selection and more uses of said spells, can easily out rogue the rogue with invisibility, pass without trace, charm spells, etc

>Arcane Trickster.
I've played arcane trickster, you just don't have enough spells. 2-4 level 1 spells, 2-3 level 2, 2-3 level 3 and 1 level 4 vs The Bard, with his more spells per day, known, and from whatever spell list he fucking wants.

> and I'd rather have a barbarian grappling than a d8 light armor half elf trying to shove a troll prone.
Bard casts Grease/Hold Person. Suck it, Barbarian!

>>53080103
>Arcane Trickster.
Nice 4th level spells.

>>53080096
That was my thought too.

It sucks because I really like the flavor of a WM sorc, but the actual class chassis is just... Shit.

>>53080141
T. Gilgamesh

>>53080141
I think what he meant was that bards are better archers than rangers are.

They get swift quiver (and animate objects) twice as fast as rangers (not that rangers get animate objects, but there's that one anon that always mentions it).
It's part of why I wish bards had been given more magical secrets but they'd been made into half-casters.

>>53080113
>implying 4e monks weren't the shit
psionic monks 4lyfe

File: Merlin.jpg (695KB, 2000x2627px) Image search: [Google]

695KB, 2000x2627px

>>53080132
It is a cool concept, it just becomes a little hard to do in game mechanics without going full min-max to try and make it not only work and fit the legend/lore but to also be strong and fun.

I was actually inspired by the anime version, since it is 95% based off the real legend. I base a lot of my characters off video game, anime, or other media characters. My DMs jokingly call me weeb but it generally turns out that they enjoy putting me into the spotlight.
I must be doing something right.

>>53080217
i admit 4e monks were great, but most shitlords here wont even accept 4e as an example, thus i left it out.

File: 1471974157227.gif (875KB, 500x281px) Image search: [Google]

875KB, 500x281px

>>53080173
>>53080178
>No expertise in Thieves' Tools
>No sneak attacks
>Have to burn spell slots to get advantage

Nice try, bards.

Your entire strategy breaks down in an anti-magic zone or against something that can counterspell. At least an arcane trickster can do stuff without their magic. They can also get reliable advantage without burning spell slots.

>>53080217
The best 4e monks are 4e fighter/ranger hybrids

Or maybe that's just because what I like about the D&D monk is just having more attacks than everyone else and burying people in punches

>>53080243
One of the reasons I can't stand Fate is how inconsistent it is with its treatment of legends. You get ones which are actually cool and have clever references to the originals, and then you have medusa the super hot purple haired girl in BDSM gear

>>53080087
ITT: Faggots who think monk should be hard to kill in melee and complain that they can't avoid getting hurt when they work perfectly fine as a skirmisher.

Though, that said, rogue should have been the skirmisher and monk should have had more things like patient defence except without losing damage and a stunning strike every time they use it.

>>53078829
They might need minor conversions due to certain feats and mechanics being changed, but unless there exists an updated version you can go right ahead and use the 3.0 shit.

>>53080284
Who summons pegasus by stabbing her own neck, clearly referencing the birth of Pegasus in greek mythology which is not a well known part of her myth

>>53080281
You mean like the 4e monk, one of the few melee classes to get burst attacks at will?

>>53080203
Swift quiver doesn't make you a better archer. +2 to attack rolls, colossus slayer and horde breaker, damage on proficiency bonus, and advantage on first round of combat is what makes rangers good archers. Four shots means the bard just miss more with their eh attack bonus, and the d8+Dex is adorable, Rangers do more damage even at the same level as a swift quiver bard, are more reliable to hit, and don't need to pump charisma.

If anything a bard NEEDS swift quiver to stay relevant in archery. Which just ends if the ranger gets that too

>>53080289
My version of drunken master uses patient defense offensively. If an enemy attacks and misses them they can use their reaction to make a opportunity attack, or spend a ki point to flurry them.

File: Gorgonboss.png (423KB, 600x455px) Image search: [Google]

423KB, 600x455px

>>53080284
They've gotten a bit better with legend/lore stuff in Fate Grand Order. Especially since they started adding in other classes like Avenger.

>>53080293
Thanks mate

>>53080243
Ahh well then if they stayed close to the legend then I guess it isn't too terrible. Also it takes a certain person to make such characters work, I have not run into them yet good luck.

>>53080317
Also no single-target multiattacks and no minor action attacks

4e monks are great at controlling enemies with their great minion-killer abilities and multitude of debuff powers, but they fail at beatdown. Great against crowds, shit against single targets

>>53080363
Thanks m8, good luck to you too. Maybe someday you'll find someone like me who doesn't just try and make something 1:1 because gets inspired, adopting it and making it their own thing.

>>53080324
>take one or two levels of fighter
>problem completely solved
>can still swift quiver more or just animate their arrows

If you're prioritizing archery as a bard you don't need to pump cha as much either. It's like a ranger's wis.

I appreciate your defense of rangers. But it's pretty laughable that you're comparing them to bards which are arguably one of the best classes in 5e.

>>53080386
So they're all great jackie chans, but poor bruce lees?

>>53080289
They're boring stun guns

>>53080428
pretty much, if you want to Bruce Lee, you need to hybrid fighter and ranger to get powerful unarmed strikes and multiattacks but still having access to the monk unarmed strike feature via a multiclass feat

>>53080431
Yes, but they have to be in melee to stun.

>>53080440
fighter just needs to use the brawler archetype and take the monk MC. made a glorious wrasslin' bloodknight that way

Damn do I miss grappling being awesome...

>>53080480
That is how you make a Zangief, not how you make Fei-long

>>53080503
But how do I make a wimp lo?

>>53080397
If you have to resort to multiclassing to get bards to work as well as Rangers with a bow then they aren't REALLY that good at archery huh?

And even if you did take 2 levels in fighter to counter that, a Bard10/Fighter2, a level 12 Ranger has sharpshooter, and volley. Which makes total attacks, assuming perfect scenario, is 25 targets, so 26 attacks with horde breaker, and we can make it easier for you and say there is only four targets and two are standing next to each other.

Oh wait that's 5 attacks with advantage with fighting style with proficiency bonus damage...

Good at faking they are good, when actually not.

>>53080508
You roll 3d6 down the line.

>>53080508
in 4e?

Bladesinger

File: 1485918631282.gif (382KB, 400x263px) Image search: [Google]

382KB, 400x263px

>>53080122

>>53080480
Grappling is still potentially quite great in a game where fights are more interesting

But grappling is really mostly barbarogue territory.

>>53080509
>volley and horde breaker ever relevant
It's a nice fantasy to live in.

By the way, the multiclassing isn't necessary. Having 2 less on their attack isn't as big a deal as you think by level 10.
The point is that rangers are not the optimal archers.

>>53080509
Honestly anon do you actually play this game?
I'm not trying to sound smug.
I've just never been in a campaign where the DM elects to use a ton of enemies where their deaths would even matter. If they exist they could just as easily be fireballed more reliably, or any other AoE.

Also focus fire in this game is much more important than spreading your attacks across multiple enemies. HP bloat is still kind of a thing, so it's better to lay a ton into one enemy so that they can no longer put their action to use against you in the ever present action economy war.

>>53080509
>so 26 attacks with horde breaker
Too bad you run out of arrows before then without swift quiver.

>>53080701
As if anyone bothers tracking that shit

>>53080727
>cheating
I mean if you're okay with it.
Might as well give the fighter infinite javelins.

File: chillin_pbear.jpg (72KB, 800x600px) Image search: [Google]

72KB, 800x600px

Look, it is good that Bards are a solid class, but that doesn't mean that we need to do the Caster/Martial penis measuring contest.

If the bard is trying to be another class, they are spending a bunch of resources that could be spent elsewhere.

They can keep up with their pretend class, but then they aren't being a bard.

>>53080609
It's quite cute that you rely on swift quiver concentration holding up, but alright I'll debate you still.

And I'm sorry are you saying a 10% increase in chance to hit is not good? And what about advantage, twice as likely to crit? And bonus proficiency damage?

Lets do some math here. Even if a ranger hits once, d8+5+4+d8 for hunter's Mark, that's average 18 damage. I hope you hit three times with your shots cause if not he can out damage you with a single shot. And if I just whisper sharpshooter in there, that's average 28 damage per arrow.

I hope for your sake that horde breaker isn't gonna cut it cause that's 84 average damage at level 10.

>>53080744
They can pretend to be other classes and still be great bards too.

>>53080654
Oh do you only play with DMs that throw 1 monster a time into you? That's fine still, colossus slayer solves that problem.

>>53080739
Bolts, arrows, and sling bullets are those things DMs expect you to be carrying a shit ton around if you make a ranged martial build. So they probably don't even care.

Javelins, throwing axes, and similarly big shit like that they will track simply because they're rather big

>>53080701
Why would you have anything less than 60 arrows when you have volley?

>>53080772
>Spending all their expertise on stealth, perception, investigation in order to pretend rogue
>Still lack expertise in thieves' tools
>Bard-anon, we face several life-sentences in Giant Court, you are our only hope!
>Gosh, that Swift Quiver is looking pretty good now that I only have proficiency in my social skills and I didn't max out Charisma.

A class that focuses on its role will always out do someone who hopes to multi-roll. A Bard is just the one that can reliably pull out a second place finish.

>>53080807
How many quivers have you got on hand?

>>53080866
3. Each hip, and one on the back.

>>53080800

"These aren't javalins, their just arrows I like to throw around"

File: original.jpg.20.jpg (110KB, 600x760px) Image search: [Google]

110KB, 600x760px

Would you prefer playing with jaded, experienced players or enthusiastic amateurs?

>>53080866
20 arrows weighs only one pound so yeah what this guys says: >>53080881

>>53080861
>Spending all their expertise on stealth, perception, investigation
But these are objectively some of the best things to spend expertise on.

this bard apologist lmao

>>53080889

enthusiastic amateurs all day every day

>>53080889
Good mix always.

Amateurs strive to be better when they're playing with experienced players, jaded players (usually) lighten up around newer players.

>>53080893
For a dungeon crawl.

>>53080881
You're forgetting that you can have two on the back, one slung over each shoulder.

>>53080787
No, I'm not saying that at all.
But what I am saying is that it's quite common to throw maybe 4 or 5 enemies that have sizeable HP pools and it's more optimal to throw your attacks into a single enemy, so volley isn't *that* useful. And even when it is you must rely on enemy placement for it to pop off well too.
Colossus slayer pops off once a turn, at best. But it's much more useful than horde breaker, typically.

>>53080889
>enthusiastic amateurs

I don't want to spend 10 min listening about the latest net-build the jaded guys are thinking about.

>>53080893
>But these are objectively some of the best things to spend expertise on.
And then you get screwed over by the social encounter because people were expecting you to be an actual bard.

>>53080923
No, just generally. Moreover, anything that helps you not die is going to be more valuable. You can afford a failed persuasion check here and there. A failed stealth or perception check can kill you.

>>53080910
I really don't even like bards that much.
They are just mechanically very good.

>>53080861
>A Bard is just the one that can reliably pull out a second place finish.
That's nothing to scoff at all though. You have so much versatility offered to you in a game where that is a very good thing to have.

>>53080927
These are the enthusiastic amateurs, anon.

>>53080981
You still have proficiency in social skills and likely have a high CHA modifier so you're still doing perfectly fine.

File: 1492508845329.jpg (42KB, 600x405px) Image search: [Google]

42KB, 600x405px

Okay /tg/ I need some advice.

>Playing West Marches campaign, with an island hopping twist. Make it well known that I expect people to die and that the world is a pretty dangerous place.

>Players are dropped on first island without a boat and there is a Gorgon roaming around fucking shit up.

>Sessions go by, level up some, and eventually they make their way to the Gorgon's home turf (which they weren't aware of at the time).

>They actively engage it with a level 1 dude, pair of level 2, a level 3 wizard, and a level 3 Moon Druid.

>Through a bunch of astounding critical hits, they manage to take down the Gorgon with only the level 1 getting petrified (Moon druid wrecked it hard and Wizard went full burst)

>Now they are pretty full of themselves thinking that they can overcome any challenge.

What should I throw at them to bring them back to reality?

>>53080996
>That's nothing to scoff at
No one is saying that Bard's can't cover for another role.

Bard-anon is claiming they can be better.

>>53080889
Since I'm fairly new as well, the latter. Roleplay oriented players are ideal, but hopefully they also take the time to learn the rules where it pertains to their class.
I'm playing a martial and have a better grasp on spellcasting than our Wizard. They're great to game with, though.

>>53081016
Dragon. An adult.

>>53080925
Melee enemies like to gang up on melee PCs, meaning they are gonna be next to each other. If there are four enemies and one barbarian up front they can't not be within 5 feet of each other.

The enemies aren't going to be spaced out in different areas unless they are ranged, and if they are ranged then they are behind cover, with an AC Bonus or worse. That +2 attack bonus is gonna be needed, but since you don't have that you NEED swift quiver for the higher chance to hit, and you will only hit one or two times. Where with ranger you can get the +2 and advantage.

I don't know why you think two extra attacks are better than all these bonuses, they really aren't. Oh! And bards don't even have proficiency in longbows, so you are stuck to wood elf.

>>53081016
Have a king or something of the sort recruit them for something important after hearing of their exploits. Don't immediately burst their bubble, but make it clear that they're in over their heads

>>53080996
no, I meant the other guy underplaying how retarded good bards are

>>53081016
Why are there levels all over the place?

>>53081016
>>53081043
It is a West Marches campaign, so locating a dragon's lair early on is not a bad idea. Just get out of there alive and come back once you level up.

>>53081016
Have them find another gorgon, but it gets decimated by what they really fight next.

>>53080988
So can a failed deception/persuasion roll.

>>53081076
Basically sessions are drop-in depending on who's available, and I'm using a token based level system, where each session equates to a single token. The token cost of leveling rises as levels get higher.

>>53077888
How mich damage would a falling whale do? As a druid if I cast jump on myself, then wildshape into a whale and land on some enemies what would be the appropriate damage rolls to make? The average killer whale weighs about five tons, but the impact would be spread over a wide area which gives my calculations some problems as the square footage of a killer whale is not readily avaliable online. Have any of you ever tried something like this? Also how can I pull this in my campaign without the gm calling bullshit?

>>53081103
>tokens
Why not just use experience points?

>>53080767
I'm not gonna argue against your white room scenario where you have advantage and you're specifically going up against your favored enemies.

Point is bards make fantastic archers for very little trade off (none) in their bardiness.
You can shoot arrows pretty good for a class archetype based around shooting arrows, happy?
Meanwhile bard has spell slots to burn if they choose, access to a spell you won't get until 7 more levels, greater invisibility, can take your hunters mark if they want (dunno why they would though, it's shit).

If a bard wanted to be really cheesy in this white-room scenario, let's just dimension door 400 ft away and swift quiver pelt from afar so we don't need to worry about losing that concentration.

It's all meaningless outside of actual gameplay. So once again, the point is bards make great archers (arguably better than rangers) because they have great versatility and are full casters.

>>53081072
>>53081027
Getting mixed signals here

>>53081097
Not in a general sense. You have to be in a very specific situation for a failed persuasion check to lead directly to a fight. As in, you were already doing something illegal or in a dangerous area. In which case, had you simply not been seen doing whatever it is you were doing or noticed an enemy approaching in advance, you could have avoided the persuasion/deception check entirely.

>>53081125
It's just way easier to track based on the number of people I'm DMing for. If it were a more traditional campaign, I would be using EXP, but I want to put some more value on the exploration aspect just as well as combat.

>>53081119
Turning into a whale would be waaaay beyond wild shape. There's a CR limit and the only statted whales are beyond it

Also, you'd turn your campaign into a fucking cartoon and there's no way the GM would allow it

>>53081152
One of those is Bard-anon.

Guess which one.

Is the Samurai UA any good?

File: cyc-lops.jpg (67KB, 800x600px) Image search: [Google]

67KB, 800x600px

>>53081154
>Social skills have no use in a monster filled hole in the ground.

>>53081044
Valor bards do have proficiency with longbows.
Don't rangers only get advantage on the first round of combat IF they go first before the person they're attacking?
Sharpshooter ignores cover so that's irrelevant.
Most enemy AC's don't exceed 20, and they usually hover around 17 or 18. +9 to hit as a bard with swift quiver means you have higher than a 50% chance to hit with each attack and you can make 4 attacks. Big guys often have lower ACs and also have more HP, so you can usually reliably take the sharpshooter penalty for each shot against those guys and pop out a pretty heafty amount of damage.
It really does depend on what kind of enemy you're up against though, right? If they're intelligent they should be looking to fuck up the guy who's shooting them from afar with pointed sticks if you don't have a caster (they're always target number 1).

Still, all this is silly when you should really just be animating your quiver full of arrows with animate objects if you're a bard.

>>53081119
Level 9 Moon Druid who has seen a killer whale before.

Action cast jump, move ten feet forward and jump 20 feet up. Bonus action wild shape, fall on a huge size area.

Enemies have a Dex save to dodge 4d10 damage, improvised damage in DMG says that's as close as I can think of.

You are now prone, so enemies have advantage on attacks and you have disadvantage on your bite attack. You can't be standing because you don't have legs.

Seems fair, you are casting a level 2 spell using a wild shape, which is your main damage dealing resource. Then you are a fish out of water until you swap back.

>>53081182
But I'm bard anon.

>>53081247
9 times out 10, they won't. It still doesn't matter because if you're talking with something, it knows you are there, which automatically increases the risk over simply avoiding being seen.

>>53081180
>>53081256
Oh wait, I forgot about Moon Druids

>>53081260
We are all Bard-anon on this blessed day.

>this week on /5eg/ a ranger struggles to claim relevancy among the classes

File: 1487334040354.jpg (12KB, 424x394px) Image search: [Google]

12KB, 424x394px

>One player wants to avoid combat with social rolls
>Other player wants to start shit
What the fuck do I do

>>53081135
But a great archer isn't made by casting spells it's by being able to hit and kill creatures from range with attack rolls and spells that make it more deadly.

Bards don't have the bonuses that rangers get and I will say bards are pretty good but I'd always prefer a ranger to have the bow than the bard.

>>53081291
Have the enemy not attack the guy who wants to do diplomacy if he passes his checks

>>53081291
Let them play out.
If it ever really gets out of hand the guy that wants to avoid conflict may one day decide not to back up the ally in the fight they could have avoided.
That player/character might learn their lesson.

>>53081305
Don't forget they can also take banashing smite from paladins.
Also don't fall for the hunters mark meme. You have much better spells.

>>53081305
Until someone comes into melee with you then you're fucked.

>>53081224
Fighting Spirit is good.

Everything else is shit, except for Strength for Death which is extremely good, but comes way too late to matter to 99.9999% of players.

>>53081328
Same if you are a bard

>>53081119
Wouldn't all the enemies pierce through your flesh because of the sheer force concentrated on a relatively small area? (Their heads/weapons?)

File: 5e booklet.pdf (970KB, 1x1px) Image search: [Google]

970KB, 1x1px

So I made this since most of my group are beginners and I didn't want to intimidate them with the giant rule books.

Also it requires the Actual PHB to look up abilities and spells, but is good for concise rules and some home-brew additions to backgrounds and equipment.

>>53081355
>greater invisibility
>teleports away
>cutting words (if lore)

Best part of valor bard is you can greater invisibility and take a weapon shot all in one turn if you want.

File: a699ce4b45e8ed7ebd7da5c741b497c8.jpg (1MB, 1684x2560px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 1684x2560px

>>53081266
>It knows you are there
>Doesn't know who you are

Better keep it that way.

Does Yawning Portal use exp or milestones?

>>53081410
neither. Doesn't post it.

Is War Caster worth taking even if I'm not going to be frontlining?

I'm making a wizard, and I have a variant human feat that I'm not totally sure what to do with

>>53081390
At level 14 they can Bonus action hide, for near constant advantage and keeping their spell concentration up.

>>53079088
Sounds like you're talking about a Tarokka deck
http://dnd.wizards.com/products/tabletop-games/rpg-products/tarokka-deck
CoS has a rundown of the cards descriptions, the deck itself has rules to how games can be played with it.

File: 9641886-Portrait-of-young-happy-smiling-man-drinking-coffee-outdoors-Stock-Photo.jpg (98KB, 866x1300px) Image search: [Google]

98KB, 866x1300px

>All this salt about Bard vs Ranger
>Rogue and Barbarian have snuck out the back.

>>53081448
Tough is a fine choice if you're really boring.
Or resilient or lucky.

If they made a revised ranger perhaps they can also make revised subclasses.
I want my fixed champion. And don't anybody post that homebrew that just has you rolling a bunch of fucking dice, if I wanted that I'd be playing battlemaster.

>>53081448
Just don't go variant human then

>>53081386
I like the idea anon. Sadly I've met players who refuse to read more than 3 pages. It'd be interesting to see how much information you could remove and still have it be useful.

>>53081448
What is your character's back story? Try picking something that fits with it.

>>53081448
Wouldn't be terrible for the advantage on con checks, spell sniper would be another decent one.

>>53081448
Alert is a good choice for anyone

>>53079048
I disagree. Look at the Musketeers. They're fucking named after guns but they mostly sword fight. Same with Age of sail stories. There are guns, but they're used for a singular great effect. The bread and butter is still the melee.

File: IMG_1422.jpg (98KB, 736x999px) Image search: [Google]

98KB, 736x999px

>>53081664
Listen to this guy. A D&D setting with early firearms can still be fun. Some very reasonable stats for guns of that period are in the DMG. The Three Musketeers and Conquistadors were a thing.

>>53081567
If you hate thinking so much, why not be a barbarian?

One of my players plays a Half Orc berserker babarian (I know that its not that good).

I want to give him a magical axe at level 8, which will be his tribes heirloom. It will probably be his only magic weapon, so it should be powerful for the remaining adventure.

What would be a cool magical axe to give him, which could maybe somewhat make up for the fact that he plays a berserker?

>>53081747
a berserker axe.

>>53081016
Fey.

Fuck with them and knock them down a peg.

>>53081746
Because I don't want being triggered to be my defining ability.

>>53081747
Well if you want it to last the adventure I'd make an axe that can get better as they level up. Either through defeating stronger enemies, completing certain trials or find missing bits like a gem or some shit from the axe.

Using player characters as villains/npcs after they have died in the current campaign

Y/n

>>53081422
Actually I think it assumes exp because it says "characters can expect to hit this level, then this level, etc."
It also makes note in sunless citadel about how killing certain kobolds will award no exp.

File: 1492119069308.jpg (41KB, 600x416px) Image search: [Google]

41KB, 600x416px

>>53081820
Could've fooled us you seem pretty triggered by having to roll dice to actually do things other than the very basics.

>>53081449
Assuming there's a place to hide. You also have to make sure you roll well enough. And it's only advantage on the first attack.
An invisible character always has advantage.

>>53081784
Well I don't want to fuck him even more

>>53081857
It's OotA, so the adventure will go to level 15-16. I thought about an axe that would give him additional benefits while raging, so it would scale with his level automatically.

How powerful would an effect be that makes him recover one level of exhaustion at short rests?

>>53079684
A class that gets expertise and full casting isn't a master of none.

>>53081882
You have really low standards for what counts as triggering.
Keep that up and soon enough the word will have no meaning.

>>53081872
Yes if you have a good reason why they're back from the dead.

>>53081897
Well it would not only push for more short rests, which could help any martials or warlock in the party, but also make it so he's just frenzy raging every fight.

>>53081873
So if it uses exp what are the basics about assigning exp?

It's just whatever defeated enemies' exp is listed as added up then divided by number of party members, right?
How about for things like disarming traps and other minor successes? Should I just make a call as a DM?

>rangers worse at magic than bard archers
>rangers worse at fighting with a bow than archer fighters

Rangers can never win.

>>53081926
We do have a Warlock in the party. But right now he doesn't really use his frenzy often, so I thought about making it more appealing.

The question is if it is too strong.

>>53081945
Does the playtest Ranger remedy any of this?

>>53081906
Says the man who equates barbarian rage to being triggered.

Potthisiskettle.png

>>53081872
I had two fiend warlocks in the party early on, then one of them died and another had his player leave. They became the big bads of the entire campaign, with the dead one coming back as a conniving imp under his patron and the other serving as a general for hell's invasion of the material plane.

>>53080280
anti-magic zone is an 8th level spell and how many times have you actually seen it used
you know what's a lot lower level and a lot more common, that can shut down a rogue or fighter even harder than anti-magic zone shuts down a mage? hold person and hypnotic pattern

>>53081945
Rangers shouldn't even exist.
Seriously what's even the point?

>>53081958
Not exactly, but it's marginally better against favored enemies now.
And beast master is pretty good but that's because you basically get to control 1.5 characters.

File: donny.jpg (59KB, 250x250px) Image search: [Google]

59KB, 250x250px

>>53081961
The connection there seems pretty clear to me.

>>53081952
Well you'll have to consider if the group will go along with his short rest after ever fight if possible because then your Warlock is now going to be more comfortable using spell slots adding to damage and he'll be doing an extra attack himself.

It has the potential but it all depends on how your players are and if you'll put pressure on them to not let them always take advantage of it.

>>53080787
not him but do you have brain damage
for real dude wtf

>>53080280
That's why valor bard does pretty well and they sustain their ability to buff really well even if you somehow end up in an anti-magic zone, because inspiration doesn't care about any of that anti-magic field bullshit.

>>53082002
The berserker player is honestly not someone who would abuse this.

The party generally tends to take short rests depending on their remaining ressources, and not spaming everything they got because they know that they could take short rests if that makes sense.

>>53081999
>I only know of one type of rage therefore all are the same

Sometimes when people rage they become an emotional mess like Tumblrians, sometimes it focuses someone to push harder, sometimes they bottle that shit up then take revenge at the opportune time(your pic), other times it manifests as a burst of violence.

To see only one then equate that to all is pretty telling especially with being triggered about having to roll more dice.

>>53082109
Nah man they just couldn't say it explicitly like with half-orcs.
You see, all barbarian societies in D&D are rape-based, so everyone who lives in one is deeply emotionally scarred.

>>53082052
Well if you trust your players to not overly abuse it then I don't see a problem. Just know what it is you're giving them to work with in the long run.

>>53082137
Maybe I put the effect on a charge system just to make sure?

>>53082136
Sounds like lazy DMing to me that restricts PCs but makes predictable encounters when ever interacting with said societies.

So in other words depends on the setting

>>53082155
Definitely wouldn't hurt, how many encounters do you have your players do in a single adventuring day?

How does it make any sense to multiclass into barbarian? Do you go live with some for a while or what?

>>53081577
I honestly think this is as concise as it can get without omitting more than I have or straight up changing core facets.

>>53082255
DM uses one of his epic and unpredictable plot hooks of targeting a player's family or NPC they are close to.

>>53082255
I mean, it's a class which is just an abstraction of a type of archetype. You don't have to be an actual tribesman.

You could just act like a barbarian in how you fight. You just go into a state of extreme anger and focus when you fight.

>>53082241
I generally do less random encounters, so not that many while traveling.

I tend to have more encounters when they enter dungeons and the like. But it can vary very much.

>>53082255
Make a character with anger issues who only later on learns to channel it into his combat style. Think Belkar in OotS if you read that.

>>53082299
Well then think of how many encounters you run in each situation on average and try and make a balance between the two.

>>53082255
>find ancient bone amulet in a tomb in the forest
>glows faintly when you and only you touch it
>dream of angry naked men raiding and pillaging, your great-great-great-great grandma specificaly, on your next long rest
>WE