/osrg/ OSR General

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>Here by
*Here be

http://johnwickpresents.com/updates/the-worst-adventure-of-all-times/

Claiming to be an old-school player, yet how can it be none of these assholes have ever heard of a ten-foot pole?

>>52740442
>yet how can it be none of these assholes have ever heard of a ten-foot pole?
Of course I know! You can turn a profit selling10-foot ladders back as poles. /s

>>52740442
That's the worst thing I've read in years. Please don't post that here ever again.

Linking my own post in the last thread in case Anon who asked missed it: >>52739064

>>52740332
I bid $4.50 on your module OP

Why hasn't /osrg/ made a dungeon together yet?

>>52740332
Alright anons, what are your top five favorite adventure modules printed by TSR and why?

>>52740442
Never heard something sound so made up.
"So this one left there stuff and went in, then this one left his stuff and went in, and then this one left his stuff and went in. Then I dropped my d20 like a mic"
Right.
I agree with >>52740561 never post that again.

>>52740442
>My first TPK
>It said, “An Adventure for Character Levels 10-14.” I had players with characters level 10-14.
kek

>>52740583
Ty anon, I'm reading it atm. I recall someone posting a 'corrected' version but this seems complete enough to me.

>>52740694
let's do thissss

>>52740694
>>52740738
Right.

Dungeon premise: a small hut wherein a kindly old grandmother lives, turns out to be surprisingly spacy with enough room for all manner of weird creatures to live in the walls, the basements, the cupboards, and the attics. They have alliances and rivalries and feuds, but no one touches the grandmother because she's the only one that brings in the groceries.

The grandmother has no idea any of them exist, and refuses to believe it.

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Earlier this morning, I woke up then laid back down. In my state of semi-sleep I actually came with some rules.

>Magical Martial Arts
Any Wizard (and only wizards because I dunno autism or dedication) may choose to consume a prepared spell to empower his body rather that cast that spell. The wizard receives +N to hit, +N to damage, and improves his AC by N, where N is the spell's level. This effect can activated without using an action and lasts until the Wizard's action in the next round. While under the effect of Magical Martial Arts, a wizard can't cast any spells. Most wizards only use Magical Martial Arts when using spells would either be too dangerous (a fireball in a 5-ft wide corridor with an enemy right in your face) or they prove useless (that meteor swarm is a lot less useful when it turns out you're not fighting a white dragon but rather a an albino red dragon).

>>52740705
In no order:

>Adam's Wrath
This is entirely because the dungeon site where Adam and his Flesh Golem buddies lurk is dripping with flavor.

>Web of Illusions
The temple itself is just 2 cool 4 school and the illusions are really fun.

>B4
It's got weird, it's got loot, it's got factions. It can also be expanded into a meagadungeon.

>Caermor (Dragon? Magazine)
Damn creepy low-level investigative adventure with devils and cults.

>Plundering Poppoff (Dungeon Magazine)
A nice little smash-and-grab adventure that can serve as a set-up for future shenanigans.

>>52740705
>G1
M I L I E U

>S3
Best S-series module, great concept, good execution, clever alien artifacts designed to fuck over careless players in funny ways, bonus assrage from MUH TOLKIEN ONLY stooges.

>B4
Do I really need to explain what's good about The Lost City?

>I6
It's just really *competent*, t bh. "Okay, make Dracula as a D&D module" is an almost parodically flat prompt and it seems like that adventure would be shit, but it actually isn't -- even though it's really close to just being I6: Frickin' Dracula.

>WG6
There's an enormous ape. What do you want from me?

>>52740924
> * Magazine
Is there a compilation of the best stuff from those mags?

>>52740810
but where them goblins at??

>>52740810
Interesting,
This is because it is the failing trans-dimensional travel pod of a long dead alien, if you enter through the front door it is a normal hut, but if one enters through a hidden portal from the cellar, then it will seem as if you have shrunk down to an inch high, and the grandmother has become monolithic. This bizarre effect allows you to access the rest of the pod, which stretches on for miles (or a couple of feet for the grandmother)

>>52740810
can grandma be a hill giant?

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>>52740924
>Magical Martial Arts
Not exactly what you describe, but the Mystic of Nog kit ties up spells known in exchange for martial powers.

>>52740810
>>52741039
>grandma is half-ogress but nice one
>however her house applies with a parallel dimension where her house is 100x times larger
>the monsters in the walls, the basements, the cupboards, and the attics all seem to be miniature versions
>1' monster in dimension = 5" in normal reality
>PCs get shrunk
>they must survive and find a way back to normal reality

>>52734578
No, sadly. They are really adverse to the whole thing. They were mad about the lethality and the only other survivor besides me was angry that the DM was "railroading us" for three sessions only for us to die in the first combat.
By the way does 18 Dex with scale mail and shield, actually give me a 1 AC in AD&D? We're playing 1st ed. It just seems too low, and I am used to heavy armor & dex being rather incompatible.

>>52741384
-4 AC from 18 DEX, -4 from scale mail, -1 from shield. The math checks out.

And yeah, AD&D understands that heavy armor doesn't turn you into a slow lug. High DEX and a good armor work well together.

Anyway, it's a shame your friends weren't into it.

>>52741384
>By the way does 18 Dex with scale mail and shield, actually give me a 1 AC in AD&D?
Yes. High Dex is brutal in AD&D. One of the reasons a lot of us tend to prefer the lower modifiers from Basic or even the practically-don't-matter stats from LBB OD&D.

>>52741384
Woops, meant to reply to:
>>52734635

>>52740442
>I said something I don’t quite remember and he called me a “wanna be community theater actor.”

>>52741437
>Anyway, it's a shame your friends weren't into it.

Yeah one of them was getting salty over the people in town being greedy fucks and ripping us off, which the DM played very well.

Then we get to the tower, kill the frogs, go inside the keep part with the courtyard and run into a spider, which our druid charmed. Also the half-orc fighter had a horse (not even a warhorse) which the DM allowed to fight anyway. Even with that, 9 bandits just about killed us all. However, due to having a 1 AC I did not get hit at all. Probably helps that the DM let us roll six times for each attribute and keep the highest on 3d6, so I ended up with Str 16 Int 14 Dex 18 Con 14 Wis 17 Cha 12. Everyone else had similar scores.

>>52741692 c >>52735487

>>52740987
Clearly the goblins live in the walls. They've been shrunk too.

>>52741107
>>however her house applies with a parallel dimension where her house is 100x times larger
Elaborate on this, I don't really get it.

>>52741021
Good hidden lore, let's have hints of that be put incredibly far into the dungeon.

>>52740810
So what are the factions of creatures? There should definitely be rats. And goblins. What else?

>>52741738
>What else?

Ravens right outside the window. When the dimensional fuckery is going on, they too can be massive and dangerous.

>>52741735
Yeah he was sick of it too. There were 6 people: the GM, his youngest brother and me (who were the only two survivors), my other friend and his brother, and my friend's dad. Out of all of them, only my friend's dad wanted to reroll. And he was the one who got one-shotted. The youngest brother of the DM survived and was grudgingly willing to continue. We'll see what happens next week. Most of them just wanted to "try" AD&D.... I actually wanted to play it (because I am foreverDM, partly, but also because I love old school rules, or at least a lot of aspects of them).

I did get to play my friend's basic D&D homebrew, I was the only player but I ran four characters through a world where skeletons and zombies were super-tough and even a 1st level necromancer gave us trouble. He ripped a lot from AD&D and even 3.5 (the game had no skills but it did have feats that gave minor effects), we started at 0 level, the initiative system was a weird experiment. I enjoyed it quite a bit but it was almost too extreme. AD&D is the right mix of lethal but still heroic later on. Whereas Pathfinder.... it just feels like no one ever dies, and the damage scale is so unbalanced. That is actually my favorite part about AD&D: I could use a throwing axe without gimping myself because I'm not using fucking Power Attack / Deadly Aim / Vital Strike, and still being inferior to the spellcaster.

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Working on another project and ended up burning a lot of time stocking a megadungeon. Figured I'd turn the fruit of my work into a fat fucking table or two.

http://www.occultesque.com/2017/04/stocking-dungeon-monster-activities.html

>tfw you think people are running with your idea but then you realize that you were ninja'd and they're following someone else's ideas

o-oh

Anyway
>giant ravens (pteradon stats)
>giant mice (dire wolf stats)
>granny is vaguely aware of her "little helpers" and loves soiled plates on a special table
>the shrunk creatures gather any food from here

>>52741692
>the DM let us roll six times for each attribute and keep the highest on 3d6
spurdoofdisbelief.jpg

Gimme decent rules for armor/weapon durability.

Right now:
*a crit causes the target's armor (or shield) to save or lose 1 AC.
*weapons don't break unless you force them (sword used as crowbar, etc) - roll its damage die and a 1 means it broke.

>>52742079
idk how you guys can write d100 tables but fuck man I love your shit

>>52742130
The 1d100 content is like, legit low-effort if it wasn't obvious.

If I were serious about putting these in a legit publication, I'd do the 1d100 like I normally do and then trim it down to the ones I think are the top 20. A lot of them are shitty, jokey or out of place for a specific situation. It's still fun to write them, though.

>>52742106
I thought we were going with all ideas so far?

Anyway, should we generate a map in donjon for all this? It'll make the whole thing easier to keep track of.

>>52742130
Traps/hazards that specifically break armor notwithstanding, I handwave maintenance into downtime expenses.

I need ideas for interesting traps and rooms for an Into the Odd dungeon.

>>52740598
I love iod. I'm raising your bid to 5 Yankee dollars.

Can we get back to Spelljammer? I think they would make some awe inspiring movies. I also said the movie studios would never, ever in a million years use the vulture in a Spider-Man movie so what do I know?

>>52742187
A shrine maiden (male) who serves Pelor-sama. But her male nature is actually an illusion and in reality he is an evil high priest (female) of Nerull-sama!

>>52742363
>Can we get back to Spelljammer?

Wouldn't make for all that great a dungeon crawl, though, would it?

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>>52742160
Alright, so this is what's in the hole in the wall that the players will (most likely) enter first.

What's in the rooms, /osrg/?

>>52742547
You would be /Amazed/ how many abandoned-and-then-inhabited-by-monsters tunnel filled asteroids carved into the likeness of giant dwarven heads there are in Wildspace.

>>52742630
#1: Skeleton of a wizard whose adventure ended here. His tiny spellbook ended up as a prop for a dollhouse the granny is building for her grandchildren. His flesh is nearly untouched: a few mice made the mistake of having a bite and ended up developing strange and unsettling mutations.

Still has a few silver pieces and tiny spell components in his pocket.

I'm using the WFRP book Renegade Crowns to flesh out my borderland. Orcs, monsters, and undead menaces fit just fine as is, but what will I replace Chaos with?

>>52742630
>22. Giant mouse nest
>filled with straw, scraps of paper, droppings, and the bones of unlucky humanoids
>Monsters: 3 giant mice (dire wolves), 1 weremouse (werewolf). If encounter during the daytime there's an 80% chance per individual that it is asleep
>tactic: the weremouse will order the giant mice to attack any intruders, focusing on obvious warriors first. Once it believes that a target has been tenderized it will order the mice to change targets while it kills and eats the first victim. If a mouse has not gotten its fill it may pursue intruders to room 17 or 18. It will go no further unless the weremouse commands it.

>>52742697
>what will I replace Chaos with?
Genies
Demons
Devils
WIZARDS!

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>>52742697
>what will I replace Chaos with?
A lack of sensitivity for the finer shades of morality.

>>52742697
Chaos as written by Moorcock.

>>52741738
Mason jars of preserved homunculi, labled after the strange fruits they were reduced and extracted from. The jars can be opened and the creatures inside given commands that they follows with malevolent literal mindedness.

>Urchin Custard, a wet dripping thing that giggles and sticks.
>Skull Candy, a grinning face with tiny legs, agreeing with you sweetly.
>Peach, Plum, Pear, three fey with insectoid features and bad manners.
>Black Meat, a twisted wretch with needy hands eager to strangle.
>Memory Jelly, the quivering mass of opaque forms that remains familiar but wrong.
>Humour Pickle, eyeballs that bounce and roll as a mass of judgemental stares.

>>52742547
Oh I'm sorry. I didn't mean in regards to your matters at hand, sorry about that.

I wish there was enough content to justify a sj thread every day. Ship to ship combat in this setting was wonky but fun. Also, neogi and The Unhuman Wars were great for mining adventure hooks and ideas.

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>>52743221
There was some Pirate Campaign discussion last thread.
You should have brought it up then.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
SJ is essentially just fantasy Age of Sail.

>>52743221
>>52743263
I'm always up for talk of Spelljammer, but, I currently have nothing to talk about it for.
But, talking space piracy, I have been setting up a campaign for when my group's current one ends in the distant future. The Neogi are currently replaced with warhammer Chaos Dwarves. I am going to love this.

>>52742900
>Chaos as written by Anderson.

FTFY

>>52743263
>SJ is essentially just fantasy Age of Sail.
That's what makes it boring.

>>52743658
>That's what makes it boring.
Shut your neogi whore mouth grounder.

>>52743186
Neat as heck, but where are they? Are they in the kitchen or have the factions taken one of each as their leader?

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>>52742079
>Dungeon Upkeep

I lol'd. Do you have any d100 low-level dungeon encounter tables? I need one.

>>52743983
Sadly, no. I run LotFP (where I make up weird monsters) and 5e where I mostly use either the 5e MM or old D&D MMs.

All of the xDx tables I've written are on that site. Excluding some of the joke stuff I've done on request for this thread.

>>52743263
Yeah I should have but we were just getting to the Jeff Grubb & Zeb Cook parts, anon.

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>>52740332
I made it on a really big monitor, so it seemed readable at the time.
Now that I'm on my phone, I have to zoom in /really/ far to read it.

Is the text on the images readable with no zoom on a typical monitor?

>>52743838
I imagine them in the darker recesses of the pantry, pressing against their glass. Like they really want out. The local factions know about them, but have already learned not to use them. Players probably aren't as wise, or are more clever in their instructions than a bunch of goblins living under a stove armoured in pots and pans.

>>52744421
>Is the text on the images readable with no zoom on a typical monitor?
>2434x1175

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>>52744421
lol who cares

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>>52744581
The text that overlaps the pictures.

Anons? Quick query: after TSR went under, one of the guys who worked on Planescape released two online website-splatbooks that expanded on lore for the Bariaur race; the Complete Book of Bariaur and the Book of Bariaur Belief. Some anon in another thread kindly converted them from Scribd to PDF docs, so would you gents be interested in them?

>>52745270
What magical deductive powers convinced you to waste a post on asking.

>>52745270
If you post those here, I will throw a small tantrum and post on my tumblr how horrible it was.

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>>52745270
>Planescape

>>52744421

>1 in 6 chance the world croaks when they do

That's hilarious.

>>52745270

Well, they're not in our Trove's Planescape folder, so I suppose we need a copy.
You might want to let the PDF share thread know, too, they have a TSR and WotC trove which will need it too.

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>>52745633
Roger wilco.

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>>52745664
And here's the counterpart file.

>tfw trying to get a feel for what sort of enemies to use in my first B/X game by reading modules for level 1-3 but all of them have shit like

>9 gnolls
>2-5 ogres

it's an abstract kind of feel.

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>>52745843 ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Reskin them ya dingus.

>>52745843
That's honestly why I prefer 2e's MC entries.
Let's look at the Gnoll
>Climate/Terrain: Any tropical to temperate non-desert
>Frequency: Uncommon
>Organization: Tribe
>Activity Cycle: Night

Alright, now let's switch them out for say, Bakhna Rakhna (http://www.lomion.de/cmm/bakhnara.php). A little weaker but a different flavor gets thrown in.

Now Ogres:
>Climate/Terrain: Any land
>Frequency: Common
>Organization: Tribal
>Activity Cycle: Any

This one's a bit tougher but let's say Jann instead of Ogres, maybe dropping them down to 1-3. Alternatively, sub in humans, since they're also common frequency creatures.

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>>52745843
It might be easier to go for a top-down approach.

What is the goal of having an encounter here?
What general type of creature should be present? (Large and dangerous, small and swarming, intelligent, magical, bestial, etc.)
What are the associated attributes of the creature?

Example:

The dungeon is a burial complex.
Goal: this room should have a combat encounter in it. The encounter should be challenging, and try to force the players to retreat and get into a better position.

General Type: This room is connected to a larger room, so maybe it doesn't contain any skeletons, mummies, or that sort of thing. Maybe this is was where the royal charioteer's horse were entombed. Ok, so 2 skeletal horses. That makes sense.

Attributes: The skeletal horses were harnessed together, so they move and fight as one creature with eight limbs and 2 biting mouths. It's really more of a skeleton-spider thing. Aside from the buffed move speed, let's also make it capable of running along the ceiling. That'll force some inventive moves.

>>52746182
Thats a really helpful way of looking at it, thanks!

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>>52746218
No problem.

Once you've got your creature/room sorted, you can think about questions like:

How did this creature come to be here?
Does it need to sleep, move around, or feed? How does it acomplish these goals?
What is it doing here?

Skeleton horse-spider is easy. It's here because two horse were buried here and then accidentally animated by the corrupting influence of the Netherstone. It doesn't need to sleep, eat, or move, but it can't see in the dark, and the PCs have torches. Its goal is to kill all living things it can see. It's crumpled inside its coffin most of the time.

But for more complex examples, like 2 orcs guarding a pie, or a Beholder, you start to see ecosystem development.

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Who has any of the new LotFP stuff? I'm too broke to buy something without skimming it over first.

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>>52745888
Has the right of it.

>>52745843
9 gnoles (fight as gnolls, but melee from one room away)
2-5 pygmy fomorians (fight as ogres)

How does osr feel about artifacts and relics.... I'm doing research.

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>>52746482
In what context? And maybe define the terms (as you see them).

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Anyone got any more cool combat rules?

Please don't let this thread degrade into political faggotry.

>>52746482
They need to be interesting, for the player's sake.
They shouldn't bypass *too much* shit, for the referee's.

Otherwise, go nuts.
Be thematic or violate your genre if you want, nobody cares.

>>52746692
>Please don't let

Why would that happen?

>>52746692
Player's option: combat and tactics
I had actually come up with a way to use hit locations depending on where the die landed after you threw them against a trifold screen. The section facing you represented their front facing. The left side was their front left flank. The right side was their front right flank. It got rather complicated but some player's liked it as it gave their character a mechanical bonus to their hit roll.

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Found this dice substitute in the Trove (03_OSR Games/Dungeon Delvers.pdf).
Fixed the table, since it had some crazy ass weighting on it

>>52742079
Not a fan of the Dungeon Upkeep, especially it's frequency.
If I used it at all, I'd make 5. Patrol and 6. 1d6 (1-5) patrol, (6) Upkeep

All and all though, great tables.

>ended up burning a lot of time stocking a megadungeon.
Any chance you'll post it at some point?

House rules to emphasis resource management?

I have a loose assortment of players in my campaign, so it's more open table. There is no big narrative story mode adventuring (although the world is alive of course, yada yada). Only epic adventures in dangerous places.

I love challenging my players, and a part of that challenge can be logistics. So what are your favorite rules (be they house rules or pillaged from one of the OSR systems) that emphasize this?

Currently I have the obvious rules in place (such as encumbrance vs movement speed which affects distance per turn and affects wandering monster checks), as well as a system for weapon and armor degradation.

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>>52747053
Um... why wouldn't you just add up the number of fingers, and just flip the scale when you went over 6 or under 1? It doesn't make any sense to me that 2 fingers equals 5 and not 2.

>>52747833
>not wanting to consult a matrix
Blegh!

>>52747867
I'm just saying that if you can read more than two thirds of the results at face value, that seems like a boon to me.

>>52747833
Makes it harder for the players to try to game the system by trying to predict the GM's choice.

>>52742697
Replace Chaos with humanoids, fill the old Chaos table with goblins, ogres, bugbears, gnolls, giants, and yes, orcs. Then replace the old orc result with human barbarians or something.

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You guys like tables, right?

I got to play "Roundabout" at the end of the last session, too. It ended with the party being plunged into hell.

>>52746182
That's a really nice design method. Kudos!

>>52746692
I actually like class-based damage. It lets fighters be more dangerous with anything they wield while allowing for my favorite cliche of wizards with swords.

>>52740332
/osrg/, I'm having trouble with one thing: Large encounters and tallying off individual hit points.

1. Are there any rules for "mobs" of monsters? Like 5 goblins acting as one unit?

2. I'm thinking of counting HD = hit points for monsters and simply counting every 3 damage done as 1 HD lost. e.g., you do 6-8 damage, monster loses 2 HP, 9 damage it loses 3 HD, etc. Plz no bully.

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I want to have race+class, without messing around too much or adding new subsystems. In short, I just need a reason for players to pick humans.
Elves get infravision and detect secret shit
Dorfs get infravision and detect architecture shit
Hobbits get thief-like stealth, ranged bonus, AC bonus sometimes
Humans get...? (a bonus to ability scores is ok by me)

>>52749899
I do swarms as a normal monster, where each hp is one critter. They attack as the swarm HD, but can attack once to anybody inside the swarm area - and they can break formations and reach inner ranks.
I don't use 'mook swarms', but you could do something like this. How I play D&D depends a lot more on individual positioning and making even small enemies a threat -- IMO they don't work that well unless you want a pulp/heroic/cartoon tone (and I mean all three at the same time).

I haven't tested this but here's another idea - mooks have 1hp individually, but as long as they are together, they ignore damage less than (say) 10hp per round. You describe a few dying with each hit and all that -- but actual hit points don't move unless player coordinate attacks to deal more damage, split them, or get lucky and deal massive damage.
Sounds a lot better, right? A monster worth fighting, not just weak meat.
A 1HD mook swarm should be a decent threat for a 1st level party, while keeping the 'cartoon mooks!' feel.

>>52750241
>Humans get...?


If not a bonus to ability scores, then a bonus to experience points.

Where other races would hit a level limit, instead you just throw humans even higher exp bonuses.

>>52750250
XP is not important in the game. There's no % bonus for primes, and all classes require the same XP (experimental - I might regret this). My players like doing interesting shit, they aren't that driven by xp/gold/power.

I'm thinking that the best idea would be allowing to rearrange ability scores.
Alien classes are alien, homely humans get comfy stats -- also explains why they aren't overshadowed by the others.

>>52750371
>My players like doing interesting shit, they aren't that driven by xp/gold/power.

In that case, the answer is simple: humans are the world power. Humans are everywhere, and can go anywhere, whereas elves and dwarves stick to their little forests and mountains and are looked at really weirdly.

If your players like doing interesting shit, then integrate the racial relations to the game and put the other races down into minorities. If a player rolls up one, they will gain some stat bonuses, but the world itself will be against them.

Of course, some players would see this too as a bonus...

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For those who aren't following the PDF share thread, Veins has been upped:

https://mega.nz/#!EIcTEZIK!Z1CZUOfXwQ-ZKtaRqm34A9l2uQvqvG24WCnKW8o1bWU

Good writing but man, that is some ugly-ass artwork.

>>52750829
Scrap's art is polarizing. I love it myself.

>>52751101
It'd be cute if it were some random blog sketches, but love it enough to pay $100 for it? No, thanks.

>>52751151
Do you pay for the art or for the writing?

>>52751151
I understand, as quality, they are quite bad. Terrible, in fact. But they just convey a strange maddness and great force with just a few scribbles, and that's why I love it.

The book is still painfully expensive, though.

>>52740924
>Magical Martial Arts
Sounds like you'd be better off just making that into a spell rather than writing new rules for it. 3rd-level spell that gives +3 to hit, damage, and AC, and an additional +1 for every four caster levels beyond 5th.

>>52750829
I disagree, the artwork gives the impression of a mad artist trying to get the horrors it witnessed out of its head before expiring in a pool of vomit and tears.

>>52740442
I have to agree, this is bad, posting it was bad and you should feel bad for doing so.
ToH is one of the best modules ever, it's supposed to be a meat grinder ffs

>>52751190
In an RPG book: both. It's not a novel.

>>52750371
>I'm thinking that the best idea would be allowing to rearrange ability scores.
I'm a race-as-class guy myself, but I actually like this a lot. 3d6 in order, but humans get to swap two scores (or arrange them freely, even?). That's a much better suggestion than level limits or any of the other shit I've heard suggested, for any edition.

>>52751151
>but love it enough to pay $100 for it?
No book should be so expensive. Even 5e books are cheaper

>>52740924
>only casters can do cool things and they get to steal the fighter's schtick too

D&D causes brain damage example #18,072.

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>>52746182

Clear, concise, and helpful? Capped.

>>52751380

I'm with you, I like it. It's interesting and evocative, which is more than I can say for most fantasy art.

Is there a simplified turn undead table? or a easy formula or something. I play Basic but anything goes.

So far I have this, using the AD&D table:
>roll d20, success on 10. Each undead HD is a -3 to the roll, each cleric level adds +3 to the roll.

How to simplify this (so its a dX + level - HD) and add destroy undead when rolling above a threshold?

>>52740442
This is a very shitty article written by a jaded person for sure, but how it ended was good. Those poor naive players climbing into the mouth one by one after being warned is great. Experiences like that is how you learn. However, both the writer and the 5e GM made the same mistake: The Tomb of Horrors is not just for experienced players, but masterful players. I mean, it was designed to stump Gary's friends who kept beating his dungeons and was later used at a competition. Neither of these groups had any business running this dungeon. I have Tomb of Horrors I have never run it and probably never will.

>>52752791
To be honest, I don't know whether the module even works in its intended application anymore these days, purely thanks to its reputation and all the memes.

My party is fairly inexperienced and I can't claim any of us are all too good at the game, but if I were to drop the module on them they'd probably emerge out unscathed.

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>>52752749
The closest to AD&D's that I can quickly figure is to roll 1d6+1d4. You succeed on a 6 or over against monsters of your same level. For every hit die the creature is higher, add 1 to the number you need to roll. For every hit die the creature is lower, subtract 1 from the number. If your target number is 1 or lower, the creature is destroyed.

Or, to phrase it a different way: 1d6 + 1d4 + Level - HD vs. a target number of 6 (or greater).

>>52753299
I've been thinking about this and I could be wrong but-
* you auto-turn undead of 1 level less
* you auto-destroy undead of 3 levels less
* otherwise roll d6+level-undead HD, success on 3+

Seems correct using the BX table. Not quite as cool as a d20 roll but w/e.

>>52753020
Well, just about any party can make it out if you give them enough tries or use one of the newer versions. But if you put a limit on the number of lives each player has and used 1e, I would imagine most inexperienced parties wouldn't clear it in a single session.

>>52740332
Something I've asked last(?) thread but got told to repost due to the thread being almost done for:

I'm doing my first OSR (short?) game and I want to make a wilderness hexcrawl. What is a decent map size? I mean, I've made maps for campaign worlds before but it was usually abstract. What is a proper scale? How much pre-planned locations should I put in? Ideally I'd want a decent-sized regions where I can put in small villages and towns which are somewhat isolated.

>>52753489
That's basically what I mean - there are no inexperienced parties, by this definition. All of us have experienced the Tomb of Horrors, even if we've never actually been there.

>>52752018
Breh, I realize this is bait but do YOU realize that sacrificing a Charm Monster or Polymorph for the equivalent of *one round's use* of a +4 weapon is actually not cool or stealing a Fighter's schtick at all, but in fact dogshit? The main flaw of the other guy's rule is that it just isn't that good, it's a kind of panic button of very restricted usefulness *at best*.

I think you had brain damage before ever coming close to D&D.

>>52753571
>All of us have experienced the Tomb of Horrors
Well, every player who has experienced traps and no-win situations like spheres of annihilation. Some DMs never use traps in their campaigns and players need experience to know they need to check for traps often.

>>52753529
>What is a proper scale?
6 mile hexes mesh well with travel times.
1 mile hexes fit set pieces nicely.
Really though? Whatever floats your boat.
>What is a decent map size?
Flesh out 10x20 to start with, but pick terrain for 30×50.
>I mean, I've made maps for campaign worlds before but it was usually abstract.
If you don't need details, don't make them.
>How much pre-planned locations should I put in?
How many places do *you* want your PCs to visit?
Double that number, but don't place 1/4th of it (put those on tables instead).

>>52753666

He means that a lot of its "gotchas" have made it into the RPG memesphere, so D&D players are generally aware that you don't stick your hand in the green devil face, for instance.

I need tables for:

carousing, simple and compact (d12?)
XP for exploration (using hexes if possible)
XP for anything else that is not 'story', so no downtime activities and shit.
I remember some cool tables from AD&D a few threads ago but can't seem to find them now.

>>52753782
>carousing

http://rolesrules.blogspot.fi/2011/01/experience-carousing-inc.html

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>>52753480
Basic's range is much tighter than AD&D. You might want to do 2d4 system. Your target number would be 5 (-1 for every level you higher the monster, +1 for every hit die the monster is higher than you... you destroy if your target is a 1 or below). That gives you a compromise range between them, and though it does give you a bit of a boost overall compared to AD&D, it averages out to be pretty close to Basic (though spread out more).

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>>52753831
>>52753480
Actually, you know what works great? I don't know if it would offend your sensibilities, but fudge dice would make this a breeze. Roll 4 if you want a range closer to AD&D's, or 3 if you want one closer to Basic's. Your results directly indicate the relative hit dice of monsters you can affect. So if you roll a net of plus two, you can affect monsters of two hit dice above your level.

Are there any good OSR Space games?

How is White Star?

>>52754923
There's Stars Without Number

>>52754923
Spelljammer, ostensibly.

All right, my hexmap is ready. Now only the hardest part remains: coming up with names.

Anywhere to help with that?

>>52755312
Are some of your players well read? I like messing with mine by including semi-well known names and attaching them to things that don't match. Like using Biblical words referring to hell, demons, and the like for safe rest areas, old harmless men named after ancient heroes, or words from other languages in general. It's fun to challenge their expectations a little.

>>52750241
My game has race + class, and I gave human PCs "inspiring stick-to-it-iveness," which gives their hirelings advantage on morale and fear checks.

Full disclosure: I haven't actually gotten the chance to test this rule, it's just an idea for now.

So, how much should ability scores matter?

On one hand, focus should be in player skill rather than characters having really high or low numbers. Also, rolling 3d6 in order for something really important would risk randomly and arbitrarily crippling our characters, and nobody wants that. On the other hand, it's just about where the entire character mechanics are based on and shoving them off into unimportance feels weird to me. Plus, managing to actually roll a 18 on 3d6s feels a lot better if it actually means something mechanically as well.

Where goes the balance? What edition or retroclone, in your mind, does it best?

>>52753529
20x30 is fairly large, giving you 600 hexes you have to fill using encounter tables.

>>52755312
I either give every thing descriptions "Posh Town," "Barkeep's Daughter," "Third Prince of the Tree Kingdom," etc. or really stupid names "Yuushu'dn Behir," "Terrance Ten Toes," "Braggi," etc.

>>52753610
>wizards need MORE options

Just stop.

>>52755654
Having attributes be important helps to differentiate characters and provide a useful basis for noncombat task resolution, but if you're going to lean on attributes, you should use a more controlled method for stat generation.

>>52755654
>What edition or retroclone, in your mind, does it best?
LBB. The referee occasionally references attributes for arbitration, but as far ad the player is concerned they're almost entirely a role guide.

>>52755827
>if you're going to lean on attributes, you should use a more controlled method for stat generation.

Such as? Surely you're not about to suggest 4d6, drop lowest, arrange as desired, or even - heaven help us all - point-buy?

>>52755782
>"Braggi,"
Hmmmmmmmmmm...

>>52755856
I'm the "draw cards or randomly select arrays" guy, so I'd suggest drawing cards or randomly selecting arrays.

>>52755654
I've been trying to find a balance for this too. I don't think modifiers should be important -- righ now I like the BX modifiers, -3 ... +3, but I plan to let my players rearrange scores (>>52750371) so I can ask for some roll-under checks now and them without feeling like I'm screwing them for no reason.
Mostly for Int checks so I can dispense lore and history and pokedex info.

I don't think that
-3d6 in order is 'crippling' a character. AT ALL.
-you should ask for d20+mod checks or roll-under-score if you don't let your players influence their scores. That's how you cripple them.

>>52755830
>d20 rolls
>+-1 modifiers
Why? On a d6 roll this would make sense and it'd be perfectly fine. But on a d20 roll, having to add your stupid +1 is wasting time and RP potential.
Make a mechanic meaningful or remove it.

>>52755856
Eh, I do something fun after a TPK-
I roll 3d6, everybody notes that score next to the stat they want.
Just that. It makes for a fun minigame of 'do I put it in Str or maybe wait for a better roll?'
Cool for one-shots where you just want to get started fast&fun, bad for newbies that aren't familiar with the game.

>>52755961
>Eh, I do something fun after a TPK-
>I roll 3d6, everybody notes that score next to the stat they want.
>Just that. It makes for a fun minigame of 'do I put it in Str or maybe wait for a better roll?'
>Cool for one-shots where you just want to get started fast&fun, bad for newbies that aren't familiar with the game.

That sounds like something worth trying sometime.

>>52755654
3d6 in order and rolling for hp is great. I don't even allow writing off "hopeless" characters. It varies the party and makes them use some tactics like protecting their weaker members. Ability scores only really matter for which class is picked and what adjustments to hit, to damage, to hp, to reaction, etc are made. And if the party ends up being an assortment of characters with classes that don't require minimum ability scores with only 1-2 hp, so be it. It makes the campaign more fun anyway. Most modules start off with blurbs about how adventurers die by the dozen...why should the players be any different? For every adventurer in the area, there's another 20 ready to take his place.

>>52755654

Over in Classic Traveller, their default task setup used a balance of about 80% of tasks relying on your skills (which would be class/level stuff in D&D), about 25% being affected by your stats, with some overlap between them, and the remainder being miscellanous rolls against in-world stuff like the law level of a planet or something.
I feel like this is just about the right mix for D&D, as well, it's enough that your stats are useful sometimes, but having poor stats will only occasionally be a problem in specific situations, instead of crippling you.

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>>52755961
>On a d6 roll this would make sense and it'd be perfectly fine. But on a d20 roll, having to add your stupid +1
In LBB attack rolls are 2d6, a +-1 to missile to-hit is a big deal. Either way, you missed my point.

>>52756143
>that table
I like how shields make absolutely no difference half the time. And wow, does leather armor suck. It's only better than being unarmored 1/6 the time.

>>52756249
Yea. I can't believe there are still people who play with the LBBs without modification. It feels so unpolished and frankly doesn't make sense some times.

Heya /osrg/, I come to you as someone who's, as of late been fascinated with the earlier parts of D&D's history, but not quite knowing where to start.
I've got experience with 3.X, 4e, 5e and various non-D&D systems, and I've played Baldur's Gate, if that helps.
A lot of early D&D seems kinda alien or otherwise weird (I'm not going to pretend I'm not one of the people who go 'THAC0 seems real unintuitive', or 'race-as-class kinda seems wrong to me'), but there's a certain allure to it as well.
I hear OD&D is useless, but apparently B/X or BECMI or Moldvay are solid? and I've got even less reference for 2nd ed.
I'm also willing to check out retroclones worth their salt.

>>52756498
B/X is a good place to start if you want to get a feel for old school D&D. It's short (2 books of 64 pages apiece), a good deal more intelligible than some of the other editions, and seems to have more retroclones based on it than any other edition. Coming from new school D&D, any of the old school editions are probably going to seem rather ad hoc and unpolished, but the new school stuff definitely screwed up some stuff they got right.

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>>52756498
LBB -> alien and full of poor explanations
OD&D -> poor organization and explanations
Holmes -> well organized/explained OD&D, level cap is 3
AD&D -> bloated OD&D, but better explanations and slightly worse organization
2e -> neutered AD&D, leans on attribute and aims for Epic Fantasy (instead of Swords&Sorcery)
B/X -> ruleslite AD&D, runs (instead of leans) on referee fiat
BECMI -> B/X thatt (tries to) sacrifice organization for "ease of teaching," level cap is 36
RC -> BECM (no I) in one book, dry and somewhat misshapen (but a good reference)

The best way to understand OSR is to understand the Swords&Sorcery genre.
You aren't a hero raiding the fortress to kill the lich and save the kingdom; you're a desperate chump who's life has been a series of bad decisions that ultimately led to trying to burglarized the lich's home at the bottom of the murder-hole.

>B/X or BECMI or Moldvay
B/X *is* Moldvay. c also >>52756607

>>52756857
>B/X *is* Moldvay

Moldvay/Cook, you mean. Moldvay's Basic set and Cook's Companion set.

>>52755790
>still stuck in the dnd 3e wizard are op mentality
Fighter (or elf) is best class for b/x m8 you dont have to worry about wizards being op anymore

>>52756498
Start with B/X. If you like it, tack on C, then M, and then I if you continue to like it (with some minor changes because they were made for Mentzer's BE not for B/X). If you're hungry for more old school, switch to either 1e or 2e.

Don't: Try OD&D or Holmes at all. There's really no point other than historical curiosity.
Mentzer's BE, it's inferior to B/X in almost every way.
RC before trying out B/X on its own.

>>52745843
>9 gnolls
>>2-5 ogres

Whats wrong with 9 gnolls and 2 to 5 ogres?

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>>52756954
>Cook's Companion set

Cook's Expert set, that is.

Can B/X and others of its kind do epic high fantasy at all, or am I better off with 2e?

>>52756857
>B/X -> ruleslite AD&D, runs (instead of leans) on referee fiat
How does it runs on dm fiat more than od&d and ad&d?

>>52757124

I suppose you could. Start at level 3-5, tack on some of the stuff from RC/BECMI.

>>52757063
Nothings wrong with it, but they don't want *only* that.
>>52757125
AD&D and (to a lesser extent) OD&D are chok full of corner-case rules.

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>>52757124 Sure it can!
But don't write-off S&S without trying.

>>52757124
You can, but you're probably better off with 2e.

>>52742124
I don't know why, I didn't actually like it much either. I asked him like four times if he was serious about that stat gen method and he finally started getting pissy so I laid off.

>>52756857
My copy of holmes goes all the way down to 20th level??

>>52757124
It does, but you might want to bump die sizes like in AD&D: F d10, C d8, T d6, MU d4
Or start at 2th level. Depends on your players and your ability to balance encounters.

>>52757219
>But don't write-off S&S without trying.

I like S&S fine, it's just that in my experience 2e is just about the only system that can do both S&S and high fantasy equally well, sometimes even alternating in the same game.

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>>52757219
An anon here made this one. Got some formatting issues at places though.

>>52757309
20th level? Sounds like Labyrinth Lord
Holmes definitely goes to level 3.

>>52757337
Welp, check out the grey cover version in the trove, it's a complete game. Some classes stop ath 14th but wizards go up to 22th.
It seems it was reedited by wotc, added levels and some illos (love the mad max illusionist!)
And it has a decent!! layout and everything.

Somebody ran The Hexenbracken before? What would be the best place to start?
http://save.vs.totalpartykill.ca/grab-bag/hexenbracken/

>>52757558
Interesting. I wonder how it compares to B/X.

>>52757665
It's more like O/AD&D. Race+class, paladins druids and the lot, lots of weird subsystems and knife-ear worship. Comes with wilderness stuff, hobbits capped at 4th level, beholders, the works. It's fucking D&D, in short.
Oh and it has an easy combat sequence: in dex score order, ties roll initiative.

>>52757810
That sounds neat and I want to play it. It was edited by WOTC, is it in hardcopy? I can't find any ebay listings with it.

>>52756857
>2e has better organization
>2e has clearer rules
>2e finally stops pretending that D&D is swords & sorcery and finally admits it's heroic fantasy
>but it's bad because muh gygaxian prose and half-orc assassins and devils

>>>/KnightNKnavesAlehouse/

>>52757862
>>52757810
Are you guys referring to Greyharp or something?

>>52756857
>>52757309
>>52757337
>>52757558
>>52757665
>>52757810
>>52757862
speaking of Holmes D&D, anyone else backing the Blueholme Journeymanne Edition Kickstarter?;

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/dreamscapedesign/blueholmetm-journeymanne-rules/

>>52757880
>2e finally stops pretending that D&D is swords & sorcery and finally admits it's heroic fantasy

But... sword & sorcery -is- heroic fantasy.

>>52757944
>HK$
Uh, this looks interesting but who the hell is doing this? He only has 3 titles on dtrpg and 2 of them are realted to this.

>>52758013
Actually nevermind, all three items are related. Same for his lulu page. Still, $19 for a print-on-demand softcover for a retroclone sounds nice.

>>52740332
Do I need an osr system to run osr adventures, or do they run okay in 5e?

(I know Pathfinder isn't suited at higher levels, but 5e has a lower power level than pf.)

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>>52758080
Posting this again.

>>52758126
We really need a better 5E conversion guide than my shitty summary of 2 other anons' posts.

>>52758126
>no free light sources
Continual Light has existed since the 70s.

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Help me out /osr/.

I'm trying to make my first hex map, and while I have made a few fantasy maps before, this is the first time I've had to worry about scale. What's fucking me up are mountains.

How much space on the map do they take up? If I am going with 6 mile hexes, and the peak is the mountain hex in the middle? How far out should still be "mountain" terrain, how far beyond that is foothills and so on?

>>52758013
>>52758041
also worth mentioning that you get the Art-Free PDF immediately after pledging, so you can take a good look at the rules(personally I'm liking the system he's got for playing races outside of the default set, it's surprisingly simple)

>>52758288
The prentice rules are in the mega, I'll go through them. If they seem nice I'll grab the hardcopy.

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>>52758279
Why the fuck care about scale? Maps are the mean, not the end. You're designing a game, think in game terms.
PCs move 4 hexes per day, twice if mounted (or w/e). "2 days of travel" is a good euphemism for "8 hexes, maybe a whiteorc lair and perhaps feral merchants, plus the random encounters and a change of terrain type".
Create content around that.
Nice mountain, btw.

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>>52758376
Ok first thoughts: the prentice rules are mostly an editing of Holmes so nothing special there, but the font used for sections is pretty bad. I wonder if it's like that for this expanded rulebook.

>>52758126
>1, 2 : Give very little combat XP and reward XP from Treasure instead.
That doesn't sound hard. I currently ignore the usual XP rules in favor of shadowrun-style XP for mission objectives modified by overall difficulty in my regular campaigns. Using a different XP model for the gameplay you want is par for the course, for me.

>3: Treasure Only from Lairs.
Certainly easier in 5e than PF where you actually need the items to keep up.

>4, 9: Emphasize resource & encumbrance tracking

>5: Reduce resource management avoidance
This might be a bit of a job.

>6: 5e Combat isn't dangerous enough - nerf their shit.
Wouldn't it make more sense to leave their shit alone and scale up your enemies? That sounds like the easier approach.

>7, 8: Remove Perception Rules, and various other mechanics, and have everyone handle such things through freeform roleplay.
This sounds trivial, you just need a list of what to remove.

>9: More Exploration
Is this just GM advice, or...


[Cont...]

>>52758521
[Contd...]


>10: You're not the center of the world
This mentality comes from having PCs well above the power level of the other humans in the world. If PCs are comparable in power to normal people, and just have a very dangerous job, this goes away. I've been running all my games in multiple systems like this for a decade.
You scale up the NPCs and you're good, for this one. Rookie City Guard? Level 5 Fighter. Grizzled Soldier? Level 10 Fighter. War Hero? Level 17 Fighter. Done.

>11: Skill checks are hints, not solutions
I assume you mean perception checks and the like, not like, athletics. This also sounds like a repeat of #7.

>12: Casters are rare
I'm not sure how you'd implement this one, but I can see how reducing the amount of magic powers floating around would up the lethality.

>13: Level Tiers: 11-20 is epic.
5e E10 rules then, perhaps? Certainly doable.

>14, 15: A smart enemy can fuck you up, be careful. Get Mounts and Servants
More GM/Player advice? this one doesnt seem mechanical.

>16: Magic is obviously magic.
Unless it says no verbal or somatic components, and describes it as not obvious, isnt that always the case?

>17: Magic is really, really rare.
How would you pull this off in 5e? How critical is this (and why)? Could you not get similar effects (assuming its about mechanical options you dont want available) by just going through the spells in the book and banning the ones that are problematic?

>>52758538
>Rookie City Guard? Level 5 Fighter. Grizzled Soldier? Level 10 Fighter. War Hero? Level 17 Fighter. Done.

You've got about four levels too many on each of those.

>>52757908
No. See >>52757558. It's apparently WotC-era edit of Holmes Basic, or something, which dramatically expands the levels it covers.

>>52758589
>You have too many levels on your NPCs
Not if the PCs can go from 1-20 and still aren't superheroes the world revolves around, I don't.

If "Epic" is level 10, however, I'd cut those numbers in half, (2 or 3, 5, 8 or 9) and flat out say nobody passes level 10, full stop.

>>52758080
>Do I need an osr system to run osr adventures,
No.
>or do they run okay in 5e?
No, but the run with some legwork.

Worth a read:
http://kaiserkabuki.blogspot.com/2017/04/the-end-of-cycle-and-new-hope.html

>>52758126
Well stop.

>>52758279
Start with a sketched non-hex map, then apply a hex grid.
>What's fucking me up are mountains.
>How much space on the map do they take up?
Anywhere from "not very much" to "a lot."

If you need examples you don't, look at real maps.

>>52756249
>I like how shields make absolutely no difference half the time.
That's the POINT, dufus. If flails are made to get around shields, then why would shields protect against flails?

The matrix isn't a matrix because smooth, even bonuses are the greatest forever and what better way to show off a consistent progression than a large matrix? It's because they wanted to implement weapon efficacy vs. specific types of armor.

>>52758590
I found what it is. It's a fan-thing, not official WotC. http://blog.retroroleplaying.com/2009/09/grey-book-od-compiled.html?m=1

>>52758689
>Well stop.

Why?

>>52758762

Not that guy, but I'd agree with >>52758161

(I am, however, one of those anons who wrote the posts being summarized. If I'd known it would see this much use I wouldn't have half-assed it so badly)

>>52758279
1 hex for the peak, 1 hex for the surrounding mountains and 1 hex for the foothills. Okay?

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>>52752461
>>52749518
Funny story, I thought that was how everyone did it...

Well, time to write another blog post, I suppose.

>>52744421
>reading this as i drink for the third day in a row

Christ i have a problem don't i

>>52758689
>Start with a sketched non-hex map, then apply a hex grid.
Yeah, I was probably going to do that anyway, the issue was in filling out the sketch, making the transitions feel natural and all.

>>52758825
That sounds like a good rule of tumb, thanks

>>52758521
>Wouldn't it make more sense to leave their shit alone and scale up your enemies? That sounds like the easier approach.
No, because that leads to HP-bloat and people hitting it each other for hours and endless boring combat. OSR is about having 5 hp and knowing that a single hit from a goblin could end your pathetic life on the spot. Nerf downwards rather than upping scale or you'll end up with 4E heroic superhero fantasy.

>>52758822
So, summarizing your guys posts, here's what it *sounds* like OSR 5e needs:

Mechanics
>New XP Rules.
>New/different advice on how much tougher to make the monsters & NPCs - but the Monsters and NPCs DO need to better keep pace with the PCs so they don't become superheroes.
>Replace problematic Class Features (List of what to cut?)
>Cut problematic spells (List of what to cut?)
>Cut problematic mechanics (Search/Perception, Hirelings, ??? (List?)
>Possibly Some sort of E10 rules

DM Advice
>Treasure stays in Lairs.
>Be a hardass about resource and encumbrance tracking.
>Emphasize Exploration
>Enemies fight to win.
>Magic is obviously magic, and paints a target on your head.

And someone mentioned rare magic, but if we are cutting the problematic abilities, I'm not sure why that's necessary.

>>52758279
>How much space on the map do they take up? If I am going with 6 mile hexes, and the peak is the mountain hex in the middle?
Alpine ridges are about three miles across on average, so a six-mile hex of mountain will be approximately two ridges and the valley between them (or the reverse if you prefer, of course). The Mont Blanc tunnel is a touch over seven miles long, so most of Mont Blanc fits in one six-mile hex; that's basically the upper bound for the size of a European mountain peak. For other mountain ranges like the Pyrenees, the figures are normally lower.

Plausible mountains ARE hard, and a terrain type that Known World/Hexographer-style maps are singularly bad at handling. Almost everything one might want to actually know for the purposes of navigating mountains is left out. >>52758450, albeit rude, points out the easiest solution, which is to accept it as an extremely high-level gamey abstraction, which works as long as you don't try to be too immersive in your descriptions. Another way would be to draw out the ridgelines using the line tools in Hexographer. The best way IMO is proper topo-map style mountain art, but it's time consuming as fuck and also hard to draw.

t. sperg who spent too much time measuring satellite photos

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>>52758904
>Christ i have a problem don't i

Yes. If you want to talk about it, let me know.

>>52758932
>Padded Sumo HP Bloat
So scale up their damage, not their HP. I just suggested to make them tougher, more dangerous fights. There's more than one way to accomplish that.

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>>52758822
>>52758948
Here's what I tell my players:

>OSR Playing Style
>Time is very important as wandering monsters can be
encountered every 30 minutes on a 1-in-6 chance (GM rolls).
>Light is fragile: torches and lanterns have a 1-in-6 chance to go
out during combat, falls, swimming or other crisis situations.
>Equipment for overcoming dungeon obstacles is crucial:
poles, torches, oil, holy water, spikes, rope, etc. See attached
gear list and tips for use.
>You get XP for treasure hauled out of the dungeon. 1 silver
piece = 1 XP when the money is spent outside the dungeon.
No XP for killing monsters unless they’re in their lair & have a
hoard of treasure.
>Avoid Combat if it doesn’t deliver treasure is a good general
rule, as combat wears down resources for no gain.
>Mapping prevents disorientation, loss of direction and must
be done by the players. Without a map it may be hard to find
the entrance to the dungeon again, especially in dungeons
with many convoluted levels.
>Roleplaying Skills – players, not characters, are expected to
describe searching rooms, finding traps, parlaying, diplomacy,
lying, etc. A Class roll is only helpful, not a complete solution
and the GM may omit it entirely if the player is particularly
good or bad in their description.
>Limited Magic – spells are simple and avoid replicating Class
abilities. Players can invent spells on the spot. In general the
rating of the Class you’re using determines the level of the
spell that is possible, but the GM is free to determine the
Difficulty based on the Class being used.
>No Safety – there are no automatic rest periods, safe spots or
auto-healing in dungeons or combat. The only safe place is
back in town or a locked, defended room in a cleared area.
>Silver is the standard currency

>>52758903
>dat Oglaf
>bestiality and necrophilia are amusing

>>52758904
Depends how much. I drink I can of beer a day, on average. It's healthy and not even close to alcoholism.

>>52758979
If you scale up damage from weapons, armor becomes less important. Armor is heavy and can be a slowing factor in dungeon crawls; PCs without armor will be much faster and able to avoid certain obstacles better.

Law of unintended consequences. OSR D&D is a finely balanced machine and fucking with one sub-system will inevitably break some other ones.

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>>52759000
>bestiality and necrophilia are amusing

Is that a question or a statement?

>>52758743
Then why put wotc logo and some isbn # at the back?

>>52758980
>wandering monsters
every 20 min

>>52758126
>3: Treasure Only from Lairs.
They should have something on them, if only a pittance.
>5. no free light, no free lunch, no cheap healing, no cheap bypassing
Bogus, depends on the tone, depends on the tone, bogus.
>>52758521
>6. That sounds like the easier approach.
It sounds that way because it is.
>9: Is this just GM advice, or...
http://www.darkshire.net/jhkim/rpg/dnd/dungeonmaps.html
>>52758538
>11: I assume you mean perception checks and the like, not like, athletics.
He should have meant that, but he didn't.
>12: I'm not sure how you'd implement this one,
Don't limit PCs from playing casters, but if they want to hire an NPC caster should be an adventure.
>More GM/Player advice?
Partially. https://tuckerskobolds.com/
>this one doesnt seem mechanical.
You glossed over this at #8 as well, but hirelings&retainers are /very/ mechanical.
>16. Unless it says no verbal or somatic components,
Nothing OSR says that.

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>>52759011
>Depends how much

Surprisingly, no, it doesn't. The real deciding factor is control, and how much control you want to have over your own life.

A beer a day might be a perfectly fine, or an obsession, or a soothing balm that clears your head but makes you feel disgusted with yourself. Drinking for 3 days in a row could be a fun partying weekend or a loss of control. It's all about how /you/ feel about it.

You can go to AA for having one glass of scotch a week, provided you feel like you can't easily choose to /not/ have that glass.

>>52759099
>You can go to AA for having one glass of scotch a week, provided you feel like you can't easily choose to /not/ have that glass.
What kind of weak-willed sad-sacks are we talking about here?

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>>52759111
>What kind of weak-willed sad-sacks are we talking about here?

People that are still 1000x stronger willed than someone who won't go to AA at all.

>>52759048
A statement. I find Oh glaf!'s smutty humor to be very funny.

>Race

>This god is the mentor of a specific sentient race (dwarf, elf, gnome, halfling, and human, and even half-elf if there enough half-elves that they are recognized as being an actual species). Usually, the god is the one who, in the legends, created the race in question -- or at least nurtured and educated the race in difficult years.

>Naturally, there is a separate race-god for each race.

>The gods' priesthoods are dedicated to staving off threats against the race, persuading members of the race to achieve their maximum potential and destiny, and to preventing members of the race from betraying the race (or, for that matter, the world, or all life on the world).

>The DM should be careful when letting race-oriented priests in his campaign. It's not difficult for new or inexperienced players to misinterpret this class as a priesthood of prejudice, which is not the intent at all. These priests are supposed to support and celebrate the virtues of their own race, but not to be nasty to other races, contribute to stereotypes about them, exalt in jokes about them, etc. There may be priests like that in any order, but they should be NPCs who are not liked or appreciated by their fellows.

I never knew 2e was so redpilled

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>>52759042

>>52759042
>From weapons
???
I was suggesting scaling up enemy STR Damage bonuses, not scaling up weapon damage. IE: Changing the enemy math without touching the PC math.

>>52759061
He also discouraged spells replciating class abilities, Knock be damned!
He's riffing the OSR tone, not wedding himself to the mechanics.

>>52759276
>, Knock be damned!
Pretty much, yeah. I nerfed a boat-load of spells that interfere with the dark dungeon grind (continual light and spider climb looking at you).

>>52758743
>The Gray Book

Most of the links are dead but this one still works:

http://www.mediafire.com/download/5nzhz1ztiyx/The+Gray+Book.pdf

>>52759061
>Then why put wotc logo and some isbn # at the back?
I don't know, an illusion of authenticity?

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>>52759325
>The only major feature I noticed missing from OD&D and its three rules supplements is psionics.

>>52759140
So is it:
>1. People who are addicted but have the willpower to not do the thing they're addicted to without help
>2. People who are addicted and lack the willpower to not do the thing - seek help
>3. People who are addicted, have no willpower, and wallow in it and don't seek help

1 > 2 > 3?

>>52759383
What the fuck, it says that?
How do you read Eldritch Wizardry without looking at a single one of the pages?

>>52759420
It's easy when you're one of the hipsters who latches onto the OSR because muh art project

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>>52759400
I don't think it's a ranking system. It's more like:

1. People who don't have a problem
2. People who have a problem and a) don't do anything about it or b) do something about it

And it's not like you have to be addicted to get help. Therapists will help you with depression /way/ before you're at the "time to buy some rope" stage. It's just a way of solving a problem you're having. In this case, the problem is "having a drink when you don't actually want to have a drink."

>>52759473
Some people have the problem of craving booze, but have the discipline to not act on it. The craving itself is a problem (whose severity will vary by the person in question).

Addiction can still be a problem even if you've got the willpower to not indulge it.

>>52757880
>>52757880
heroic =/= epic

>>52757999
Wrong

>>52759926
Nope. They're the same thing.

You might be thinking of high fantasy.

>>52759944
inb4
• epic fantasy
• high fantasy
• high magic
semantics shit-sprawl #8936

>>52759567
>>52759944
Instead of this shit, lets talk about the best setting that D&D has ever produced.

Spelljammer

>>52759944
Sword and sorcery is not heroic fantasy.

Heroic fantasy has characters forced into responsibilities they're not prepared for. Its action based, but they're heroes.

Sword and sorcery is about characters dealing with the world around them on a more personal, selfish level, greater good beyond their personal worldview be damned, and also has the built in themes of all civilization being corrupt and evil, and most magic being corrupt and evil.

>>52760055
You misspelled Planescape

>>52760055
>>52760075
You two are terrible at spelling: it's Wilderlands of High Fantasy.

>>52760075
You misspelled Spelljammer

>>52760055
>the best setting that D&D
D&D doesn't publish things, that's the best TSR published.
Best published /for/ D&D was Wilderlands of high fantasy

>>52760075
>>52760088
Good points, but I am sorry, you are both wrong, neither of those settings will let me sneak the treasure of the legendary Pirate Dragon (getting it was adventure enough) off a planet under the noses of klingon Orcs or Horatio Hornblower Elves.

Wilderlands > Eberron > Spelljammer > Ghostwalk > Al-Qadim > Mystara > Dark Sun > Maztica > Blackmoor > Council of Wyrms > Kara-Tur > Greyhawk > Birthright > Ravenloft > Dragonlance > Planespace > Forgotten Realms

>>52760229
Solid enough, though I'd place both Al-Qadim and Planescape a bit higher. Above Dragonlance at least.

Planescape could be higher still if it weren't for that insufferable slang.

>>52760253 ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
>Above Dragonlance at least.
Guess we do owe Zeb at least that much...

Wilderlands > Eberron > Spelljammer > Al-Qadim > Ghostwalk > Mystara > Dark Sun > Maztica > Blackmoor > Council of Wyrms > Kara-Tur > Greyhawk > Birthright > Planespace > Ravenloft > Dragonlance > Forgotten Realms

>>52760229

My Homebrew > Shit >Your Homebrew >>>>> Published settings

>>52760253
>Planescape could be higher still if it weren't for that insufferable slang.

Eh, it was the 90s, that was how you did a splatbook back then, apparently.

Personally, I don't like Spelljammer. It always felt like they decided to do D&D in space, but went about it in the most hamfisted way imaginable.

>>52760229
>Ghostwalk, Greyhawk, Birthright, Ravenloft, Dragonlance: better than Planescape and Forgotten Realms

Not a chance.

Also, Al Qadim, Maztica, and Kara Tur are places *IN* Forgotten Realms.

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Okay yall. My players are now working for the guy in the picture (not literally from the anime, but pretty much so). They are not necessarily evil, but this guy runs an adventuring business. It functions like your standard corporate office and this guy is the founder/ceo.

The adventure is starting with the players finally wrapping up their internship with this company. You know, making coffee and photocopying files.

Anyways, I need NPC's to fill this office up. Anything from a coworker, suppliers, salesmen trying to sell stuff to the business, stockholders, cleaning ladies, whatever.

Just wondering if anyone has any ideas for some NPC's. I have been writing some throughout the last few days, and now have writers block.

>>52755079
Spelljammer is great. Look at tons of Cosmic Marvel and Thor for gameables.

I need ideas (traps, interesting encounters, weird rooms) for an Into the Odd dungeon, this is what I got so far:

Tower carved out of giant quartz crystal
First room is warmed by a fireplace, a hidden trap door descends into the tower.
Female Ice Demon worshiped by cultists
Room of mirrors, it's a maze and the reflections will occasionally attack the players
Tower is cold
Cultists
Penguin monsters
Bodies encased in ice
Friendly hibernating bear

>>52760229
Where's Lankhmar

>>52760416
You, I like you.

>>52760464
or Pelinore!

>>52760229
Homebrew>Points of Light>Mystara>Ravenloft>Birthright>Lankhmar>Eberron>Pelinore>Al-Qadim>Spelljammer>Wilderlands>Blackmoor>Maztica>Greyhawk>Kara-Tur>Council of Wyrms>Dragonlance>Dark Sun> Planescape>Ghostwalk>Forgotten Realms

>>52760416
I wasn't saying Spelljammer is bad, I was saying it isn't actually in spaaaaaaaace.

>>52760464 >>52760557
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BGNa3dSaZCA
Pick a spot. Where do you think they should be?

>>52760759
It's in an antiquated understanding of space. It's not mean't to be a science fiction setting. It's specifically fantasy.

Do you have written up encounters that you can just drop in when a result on a table calls for it, or do you wing the encounters using the monster books as references?

>>52760773
>It's in an antiquated understanding of space.
It's a magic ocean that crimps on "muh sci-fi" for marketing purposes.
Ship to ship combat is even on a plane!

>>52760744
Points of Light < < < < < < < < < < by-the-book Underworld and Wilderness Adventures

>>52760851
>Ship to ship combat is even on a plane!
No? A sphere is not a planet. A Sphere is like a system, where Wildspace exists. Then there is the Phlogiston which is like currents of very flammable material between spheres.

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>>52760819
I like to make tables that have a bit of an encounter written into them.

A wandering monster table might have an entry like:

4. 2d10 kobolds. One of them has a large and unwieldy crossbow, which they've been using to shoot bats.

5. 1 ogre. Trying to get at a shiny gem-fish in a stone basin. Its fingers are too large. The PCs might be able to help before the ogre realizes he's supposed to squash intruders.

Or nested table like

2. 3d10 goblins 1) fucking 2) fighting each other 3) setting up a trap 4) dividing up loot (rubbish), 5) devouring some hapless creature 6) practicing a goblin battle drill

>>52760886
The ship to ship combat rules use a 2-d hex-grid.
How are you even misreading >>52760851?

>>52760911
Oh shit it says plane not planet. Fuck my eyes.

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>>52760229
Nice work, anon. Look at all the shit you've stirred.

>>52760933
>Fuck my eyes.
I would just as soon fuck a Beholder.

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>>52760953
>I would just as soon fuck a Beholder.

Well, what're you waiting for?

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>>52760953
>>52760992
Come on, anon. Don't make me cast Charm Person.

>>52760851
>It's a magic ocean that crimps on "muh sci-fi" for marketing purposes.
Do you have a point on this besides giving me a hardon?

>>52761728
https://youtu.be/bFtcLJVN8yg c >>52755079, >>52760416, >>52760759
>I wasn't saying Spelljammer is bad, I was saying it isn't actually in spaaaaaaaace.

So we have VotE and BMSF for Lamentations. Has anyone uploaded a pdf of Blood in the Chocolate?

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More things to Summon!

For those of you unfamiliar, you can summon these guys for 1d6 hours (at level 1) and 4d6 hours (at max level). You can summon up to 4 at once at max level. They have 10 Attack, 10 Defense, and 10HP unless otherwise stated. Most of them can talk, though some might not want to.

38. Leticular, Stairway Between Realms
Enters silently, subtly, and nearly invisibly. Appears as a faint stairway of glass, rising either up or down (randomly determined). The steps appear to be 1' high, but in fact raise anyone stepping on them by 1', 10', 100', 1,000', etc. respectively. By the 5th step up, the air becomes cold. The 6th step up causes nearly instant death by freezing cold and lack of air. Similarly, if the staircase, leads down, you can descend the first 1', 10', 100', and 1000' safely (though you will emerge into solid rock unless you step off very carefully). By the 5th step, the air is intolerably warm. Any further, and you are either incinerated by the heat or dragged from the stairs by the guardians of Hell. You can step off the stair at any time, and if you carefully judge your step, emerge at a useful height.


30. Kylon, Discord Manifest
Enters with a clatter of stones. Appears as a dusty stone idol the size of a brick. Up to [sum] times per summon, Kylon can cause two people to Save or disagree on topic they were discussing. The disagreement may be resolved, or it may turn to violence. If the dust from Kylon is rubbed into a book or letter, the text will change to contain veiled insults and contradictions for the duration of the summon. Kylon can hear and speak, but prefers to remain smug and silent.

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>>52762299
27. Lukian, the Eye of the Gatekeeper
Enters with a trumpet blast. Appears as a grey glass orb the size of a marble, flickering with faint shadows. Hovers and faintly chants hymns. No ghost or demon can willingly come within a 10' radius of Lukian. Any invisible ghosts or demons within 30' are fully revealed in their true form. Lukian can also tell false priests of the Authority from true ones.

26. Goamloamer, the Warming Beast
Enters with a shuffle and a pop. Appears as a pig-like creature with no face. Gloamloamer is twice the size of a horse, moves as slowly as a person walking, and cannot attack. It has 20 HP, is always hit by melee attacks, and feels no pain. It is very warm. You cannot eat its flesh, but if you sleep next to it, you count as being inside a tent. If you place a healthy egg under the gloamloamer it will hatch in 1/100th the usual time (5hrs for a chicken's egg). You can put up to 20 eggs under the Gloamloamer at once.

32. Krentos, Knight of Leaves

Enters with a storm of dried leaves. Appears as ancient suit of animated plate armour with branches growing from the joints. The Knight of Leaves has Attack 14, Defense 16, and HP equal to the hours of the day remaining until sunset (18 to 8, depending on the season). At night, or if not exposed to sunlight in the past 2 hours, the Knight of Leaves is completely dormant. While active, it will attack any targets you designate. It does not speak. Dryads and tree-creatures will be polite to anyone in the company of the Knight of Leaves.

>>52761983
Really? Where at?

>>52751101
I love it, fuck everybody else. It feels so raw and personal.

>>52757999
Conan didn't give a fuck about saving the land, he just wanted wine, gold, and puss.

>>52761193
This is more uncomfortable than a lot of the intentional creepy/yucky art from LotFP.

>>52762692

PDF share thread. I've been skimming Veins of the Earth, it's awesome so far.

>>52763092
Damn right, Conan wasn't some "hero" he was just a guy doing his own thing. Sometimes that thing was heroic, sometimes it was absolutely not heroic, but that wasn't why he did it.

>>52760346
>Also, Al Qadim, Maztica, and Kara Tur are places *IN* Forgotten Realms.
Places loosely tacked onto Forgotten Realms. They pull apart with no effort.

>>52763799
>I've been skimming Veins of the Earth, it's awesome so far.

It is truly glorious.

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So I'm reading the God That Crawls.

"Oh, this is neat. A giant blob thing in a dungeon, with some Wicker Man overtones and good religious trappings. Plenty of material to work with. I wonder what the dungeon itself is like."

>2:10 Chariot of Unreality
>This room contains a great marble statue of
a chariot, larger than the doorway into the
room. While the driver and the horses have
been carved in marble, the axle is metal.
If this axle is mounted onto a real chariot
and pulled by two horses moving at a full
gallop, the chariot will transform into a fireball
and move at incredible speed along its path. The fire will threaten to consume the chariot
and all within in; the driver must decide how
many rounds he wants to continue to drive the
chariot (with the warning “MORE THAN FIVE
ROUNDS WOULD BE RISKING IT ALL!!!!”
delivered in overdramatic fashion) before
revealing or determining its effects.

>This ride has the following effects that are
cumulative: [paragraphs of blithering nonsense]

So... what the fuck?

What the fuck is any of this stuff /doing/ here? It's like the author came up with a cool idea for a dungeon, a cool mechanic (a chase), and then threw every neat idea they'd had into it, in chronological order, one by one, room by room, as they occurred to him. It's just stream-of-consciousness dungeon design. There's no ecology here. There are patterns, but there's no /reason/ for the patterns. It's just... stuff.

>>52764051 c >>52755782, >>52755930

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>>52764078
Hrm... hrm...

Nope. Still don't understand.

>>52764051
>What the fuck is any of this stuff /doing/ here?

What, you think the God That Crawls is the first thing they decided to worship there? These guys probably go through gods like Johnny Carson through wives.

So... are dungeons even appropriate for Dark Sun? I was thinking of running a dungeon crawl + hex crawl campaign over a small area, but it occurs to me that I don't know of any Dark Sun dungeons at all.

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>>52764097
>What, you think the God That Crawls is the first thing they decided to worship there? These guys probably go through gods like Johnny Carson through wives.

Yeah, but this place looks like Elvis' rummage sale. There's all kinds of crap that a giant squamous monster would probably knock over or break in a century or two. It's just a capital D Dungeon - the reason for it seems entirely secondary.

I can get the weirdness of Tomb of Horrors because it's designed to be a deathtrap for clever little shits (both in setting and out of it), but that doesn't mean those design principles are suitable for /all/ dungeons.

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>>52740332
I am wanting to start running BECMI with the D&D Rule Cyclopedia and some AD&D rules added in. I eventually want to run my players through 2nd Edition Dark Sun from the first boxed set after they gain a few levels and was wondering what are some tips for using 1st edition characters in 2nd edition adventures? I know there is a lot of similarities between the two, my end goal is to be able to play through a bunch of TSR content while keeping the rules light using the BECMI Rules Cyclopedia as the base system.

>>52756857
>The best way to understand OSR is to understand the Swords&Sorcery genre.
>You aren't a hero raiding the fortress to kill the lich and save the kingdom; you're a desperate chump who's life has been a series of bad decisions that ultimately led to trying to burglarized the lich's home at the bottom of the murder-hole.

Nah, that's just a bit of "my tastes > your tastes." Whether your character is moral amoral or immoral is primarily a feature of alignment and the tone the DM sets for the campaign, in old editions and in all editions.

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>>52764102
Pick /any/ time period in the setting.
A sandstorm has just uncover some ruins...

>>52764093
>

>>52756249
Against daggers and swords vs leather armor, and hand axes, maces, swords, and polearms vs leather and shield, leather armor makes more of a difference in Chainmail than it does in normal D&D.

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>>52764155
Right, so is this just "something this author does", like Gygax taking 20 words to say what could be said in 2, or Brian Jacques talking about food for half a chapter?

If so... why?

Ah well.

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>>52764150
>what are some tips for using 1st edition characters in 2nd edition adventures?
>

>BECMI with the D&D Rule Cyclopedia
Use the 16HD Mystics from the Master Set, not the Rules Cyclopedia ones.

>>52764182
>If so... why?
http://kaiserkabuki.blogspot.com/2017/04/the-end-of-cycle-and-new-hope.html

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>>52764196
Ah, so it's the George Lucas problem.

Guy gets good, popular, and then loses any ability to take editorial direction. Since you've had one good idea, /all/ ideas are therefore good ideas, and should be published without any major self-reflective editing. And when you run a blog, that's fine. You can do gonzo one day and spooky the next and tag them accordingly. But publishing should, in theory, elevate your game.

Nobody said, "James, what the fuck is this chariot doing here? You want a dungeon that's a chase, and you've filled it with long descriptions of magic food-plants and memory-eating coins. Why?"

>>52764275
You've given him more credit than I would, but I've been in the general long enough to get polarized. So I suppose your description of it seems fair.

>>52764141
Welcome to LotFP dungeons, the epitome of dumb "gotcha" BS and adversarial GMing.

>>52764439
Poisoned door handle at the entrance to the tower

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>>52764439
> the epitome of dumb "gotcha" BS and adversarial GMing.

And see, that kind of thing can be fun, if you buy into it at the start. I've got no problems with that.

But it's the pointless inconsistency that makes it hard. It's easy to go on a power trip if you don't have rules, and these dungeons were not built with rules in mind.

>>52764305
I try to give everyone credit. People try their best, or at least, what they have convinced themselves their best is.

>>52764481
To be fair, there's a pretty good reason for it to be there.
It's still a dick move, though.

>>52764787

I still think it's fine. Why in the hell would I, as a well-known evil dickass wizard who doesn't like intruders, not make the snake-shaped door handle on my tower poison anyone who tried to just brazenly open my front door and waltz on in without knocking?
Anyone who does that is A) a thief, and B) too stupid to be entertaining. Better to leave them dead at the front door for the apprentice to deal with in the morning.

>Let's just walk up and pull on the snake-shaped door handle! Maybe the evil wizard just forgot and left it unlocked! Nothing could go wrong with this!

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>>52764889
Any experienced party has door-clearing procedures that make them look like a SWAT team of obsessive-compulsive shamans.

>>52764930

Even inexperienced ones don't fall for the snake-handle, according to more than one account posted in the /osrg/ over the past couple years.

>>52764305
I like the idea of low levels being high fives and brojobs, and high levels being adversarial."

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What abilities should a Lamentations of the Flame Princess Monk Class have?
Fighter with d6 HD
Inflict Minor, Medium, or Large weapon damage with their bare hands at levels 4, 7, and 10, add half Attack Bonus to AC, Must be Lawful

Should they have d8 HD instead, like a regular Fighter?
Should they get a speed bonus?: Speed over short distances: 60’ in a round unencumbered; 160’ running per round, Must be unencumbered

>>52760346
>Also, Al Qadim, Maztica, and Kara Tur are places *IN* Forgotten Realms.

Incorrect. Forgotten Realms is the continent of Faerun. Zakhara, Maztica, and Kara-Tur are neighbors to Forgotten Realms, but not directly a part of it.

>>52764624
I think our DM runs them pretty well, the place is obviously full of dumb gotchas but nobody ever dies to them until shit hits the fan and people start running around like headless chickens to get away from certain death by overleveled immortal monsters.

The downside is that the game slows down to crawl when the reward of every careless action is around 10% chance to die outright.

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>>52765955
We don't need a goddamn monk.

IIRC there was an updated version of Tomb of Horrors (dunno which system, don't care) -- does someone have it?

>>52766263
There's probably an updated version of it for each edition since the first. I know for a fact that 5e has two.

How easily do assassins and monks from 1e translate to 2e?

>>52765955
All of that sounds incredibly fucking retarded for a game that barely has any magical weapons and armor at all.
The class you describe is superior to a fighter in every way imaginable, since it doesn't even need armor or weapons. There aren't any downsides.

>>52766434
>The class you describe is superior to a fighter in every way imaginable
Attack bonuses weren't mentioned, so maybe not in *every* way.