/5eg/ Fifth Edition General

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hi

Druids
Are
GHEY!

If a spell has a casting time of a minute, and you do in combat, that's 6 turns. But does it take up your entire turn (I'm presuming so) or do you get a bonus action? Do you get reactions?

>>52496543
>>52496596
You halve incoming nonmagical damage and you deal extra for no additional cost. You're not supposed to be able to cast spells while you're doing it, that doesn't fit with the flavour and it defeats the point of raging. You can always not rage or cancel it, but its purpose it to turn the Barbarian into your front line tank and damage dealer all at once.

Don't know about heavy armour. Guess you don't need it.

So what's your goal as a DM? What about inspirations? Do you actively steal character concepts from other media and put them in your world?

>>52496621
>that's 6 turns
lol

>>52496621
But the heavy armor wielding barbarian is a common staple of fantasy storytelling.

Also people casting magic stronger because they're angry is a pretty common trope too.

And moreover, it's just arbitrarily limiting character concepts.

Is it all right to have 16 Cha as a Sorcerer at level 8 if you're in a party of damage dealers? I'd like to get ritual caster for more utility, which the group has very little of

>>52496651
barbarian rage =/= angry

>>52496645
Sorry, ten turns. I was thinking of a reply to the OP.

>>52496682
get 20 cha first

>>52496651
>But the heavy armor wielding barbarian is a common staple of fantasy storytelling.
Uh... No? What are you even talking about, barbarians generally wear little or no armor.

>Also people casting magic stronger because they're angry is a pretty common trope too.
You're thinking of wild magic sorcerer.

>>52496651
Dude, balance has to come from somewhere. You DO have options for making a spellcaster heavy armor wearing barb, but you just can't by default. Why? The same reason any class has it's own limitations and advantages. D&D isn't a freeform do-what-you-want game and it isn't trying to be. Go play GURPS or whatever.

>>52496651
>But the heavy armor wielding barbarian is a common staple of fantasy storytelling.
Show me one

>Also people casting magic stronger because they're angry is a pretty common trope too.
In animu maybe

>>52496687
yeah I'm tired of people thinking that
I got into a fight with the DM over whether calm emotions ended rage or not

What's the chance of rolling a critical on at least one of six attacks?

>>52496690
Figured. I prioritized elemental Adept because of fire draconic at level 4.

>>52496651
>arbitrarily limiting character concepts.
Sure, in the same way that rogues being unable to sneak effectively in heavy armour is arbitrarily limiting character concepts. Or being unable to cast two concentration spells at once is limiting.

Rage is a solid ability that has no reason to let you cast spells. If you're using it, you're using it to do melee weapon attacks. Why are you trying to Rage and cast spells at the same time anyway? If you got some bonus to them I'd understand, but it's like turning out the lights and then complaining you're arbitrarily unable to see.

>>52496621
>If a spell has a casting time of a minute, and you do in combat, that's 6 turns. But does it take up your entire turn (I'm presuming so) or do you get a bonus action? Do you get reactions?
It's 10 turns and I'd rule that no, it takes your entire turn.
>>52496651
>But the heavy armor wielding barbarian is a common staple of fantasy storytelling.
The unarmoured berserk warrior is probably more common (the term 'berserk' probably originated with norse warriors that went into battle wearing bear-skins), though it is true that there are armoured barbarian types.
>Also people casting magic stronger because they're angry is a pretty common trope too.
It's not just being angry, it's a mindless rage where you can't focus on anything except hitting people.
>And moreover, it's just arbitrarily limiting character concepts.
It's no more arbitrary than any other restriction like not giving wizards heavy armour proficiency.

>>52496692
>Uh... No? What are you even talking about, barbarians generally wear little or no armor.
Rollo rules
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0JkSX-5kOI

>>52496710
6/20, 3/10. I think. But then, the odds of NOT getting a critical in those times looks to be about 74%, so I'm not sure how it works out exactly. I hate probability.

>>52496682
Would be better to get it as part of variant human.

I was thinking ritual caster on a sorcerer sounds stupid because it's basically trying to be a wizard but sucking, but it's not so bad. It has one of the major advantages of a wizard while still having your twinned haste gimmick.

If you do a lot of combat, charisma is better.
If you don't do lots of combat and don't have a wizard or tomelock and you expect your DM to give you stuff you can copy, rituals could be nice.

>>52496702
What's the balance reason for not allowing spellcasting or heavy armor while raging?

Bear in mind that Barbarian is by far the weakest class in the game.


>>52496740
>It's no more arbitrary than any other restriction like not giving wizards heavy armour proficiency.

Actually it is more arbitrary. A wizard could gain heavy armor proficiency and then make full use of it. Gaining that proficiency would consume a lot of character development resources, but it wouldn't be arbitrarily not allowed by dint of other class features if the wizard gained it.

>>52496710
About 30% I believe.

>>52496710
1-0.95^6 = 0.265

>>52496692
>>52496704
While I agree with you that it shouldn't be like that in game, Conan enjoyed using his great endurance to wear as much armour as available. Frank Frazetta's illustrations, while fucking great, are somehow more connected to Conan than the texts.

>>52496710
0.251 by my calculations.

>>52496774
Thing is, Conan doesn't fit into any one class. If anything, he's a Fighter/Rogue with Outlander background

>>52496757
We DO have a tomelock. He's useless. I rolled half elf.

>>52496754
>>52496761
>>52496773
>>52496788
I got something in that range too so that might be it. Thanks all.

>>52496760
>Bear in mind that Barbarian is by far the weakest class in the game.
Did you forget about Beasmasters and elemental Monks?

>>52496712
>elemental adept
you should've convinced the DM to make it give +1 to spellcasting ability score because it's really bad on it's own

>>52496788
>>52496761
Oh, right, I think I fudged something up. Should be >>52496773

>>52496789
>the archetypal barbarian doesn't fit into the barbarian class
>this is a problem with the archetypal barbarian, and not WotC's incompetence at making a barbarian class.

>>52496807
>And then I fudged up linking to the original poster

>>52496796
If you just tell them to get the invocation...
Well, whatever, he's probably busy using it on useless invocations, not even repelling+agonizing blast.

>>52496802
No. But those are subclasses, not classes. If we're comparing subclasses, Battlerager and Berserker are still worse than both, by a fair bit, because both of those have the otherwise good ranger and monk classes to fall back on.

>>52496810
Conan is the archetypical barbarian BECAUSE of illustrations and Arnold. Barbarians don't typically use heavy armor

>>52496596
>Codex UA guy didnt take the anon path
>will never update shit again
Feels bad

>>52496760
>What's the balance reason for not allowing spellcasting or heavy armor while raging?
Oh, so it's a problem with the Rage ability. I agree with you, then.

>Bear in mind that Barbarian is by far the weakest class in the game.
not really tho, elemental monks and beastmaster rangers exist.

>>52496810
Conan wasn't a d&d barbarian tho.
He was a thief, a king, and an adventurer.
He wasn't very prone to berserker rages.

>>52496740
>It's 10 turns and I'd rule that no, it takes your entire turn.
Yeah, I meant 10. And I figured about taking the whole turn.

So what's the point of the secondary use of Magic Circle? I get that you can set up the normal way (people inside are defended) before combat, but when are you ever going to use the inverted form to trap people if it effectively takes you out of the fight for so long?

Unless you know for sure that you're about to be attacked and get about 54 seconds of setup time so you can spring it at just the right moment, but that seems way too chancey to be worthwhile.

>>52496743
That first fight scene was really good, albeit a little jarring. Too much camera shake. How is the show overall? Fight scenes look really good, but how about everything outside of it?

>>52496810
It's because in 1E Barbarian class was about destroying magic items and leading a barbarian horde.
In 2E there were kits for horde-leader (called Barbarian) and for berserker (called exactly that)
How did it mutate into a berserker in 3e, I have no idea

>>52496834
see: >>52496821

>>52496760
Wolf barbarian is pretty damn good in an all-melee party.

It's also good for multiclassing. 5 levels of barbarian with levels of rogue, or a single level of barbarian with fighter, or anyone who would have both high con and dex level dip.

It's pretty nice in the early levels, even if a moon druid might outclass them, but their main problem is that their mid-levels don't really offer anything interesting and that in order to be useful to the party in combat they have to take PAM+Sentinel+GWM etc if they're not multiclassing.

>>52496832
That's why you don't post shit on Reddit. WotC notices, then kills it or buys it out and stops you from doing it again.

Are bardic powers some complicated thing that can only be learnt at a college, or can it be learnt different ways? I was thinking of having a tribal half-orc bard, but college doesn't really fit that. Could it be some sort of knowledge taught and passed down each generation?

>>52496877
You can refluff it easily. No one's gonna stop you unless your DM is shit.

>>52496877
Can't you say he's a part of oral tradition of warrior-poets that is eqiuvalent to a bardic colledge?

>>52496877
Plenty of real-world oral traditions that involve singing and poetry and all that shit.
Also "college" doesn't necessarily have the same meaning in this case as the one we're used to. It basically just means a collection.

>>52496743
You mean the dude we see literally shirtless for half of the video? And as for the rest, it's probably not heavy armor either, medium at most (which barbs can use).

>>52496845
Vikings is great. Definitely recommend watching it.

>>52495530
>>52495534
>>52495511
>FOOL
As if it was my choice. But so you're suggesting pretty much make a group stealth check for the monsters? I can get behind that.
>You could give those with high PP an inkling that something is up
The moment I do that they're gonna start rolling checks all over the place and then the monsters won't surprise anyone.

What I think I'll do is the average group check thing for the monsters, and then the PCs with higher PP can roll a perception check to not be surprised.

>>52496877
I'd still recommend the character fits jack of all trades into their character better than 'parents taught him' or something. Say, he also tried a great many jobs, tasks, travelled the world, etc to get experience in a wide range of subjects.

>>52495511
>Complex

It's literally 'You're surprised, you're not surprised'
Announce the lowest enemy stealth roll and anyone whose passive perception is equal to or below it is surprised. Simple.

Must easier than this 'Okay, X number of creatures need to pass a check out of however many' on some arbitrary basis.

>>52495486
>Surprise rounds
Any creature that does not notice the ambush in time (lowest stealth beats their passive perception) does not take a turn on the first round of combat, easy and simple.

>>52496964
>10 monsters rolling stealth
>9 roll high enough to beat the highest passive
>1 rolls below 10
>no surprise round because Bob fucked up the ambush

>>52496964
It's not RAW, but it is the most sensible solution. Ay salute you.

How would a future Forgotten Realms even be like? I mean, a modern-equivalent world with spells and stuff.

>>52497028
Humanity would have nuked the gods and finally freed the world of their influence.

>>52497028
>>/srg/

>>52496845
I really like it. Ragnar (who is also the mascot for the Vikings NFL team, wtf) grows from a farmer, to a king, and then becomes a legend who is tired of fighting. Several decent time skips. His sons rule and Laergatha, his warrior ex-wife, is a good character. Frankly I love the show.

>>52496912
No, I was agreeing with you. Rollo doesn't seem to ever wear anything heavier than studded leather. I don't play barbarians but Rollo is who I would model one on, if I did.

>>52496964
>>52495486
Just realised nobody actually gave the correct RAW interpretation. I assumed somebody did and just kinda kept it short. So >>52496964 is RAW.

>All enemies roll stealth
>Take the lowest stealth roll, this is what passive perception is tested against. If your passive perception doesn't notice this, your character doesn't become aware of the danger fast enough to get ready for the first round of combat. If you do, you hear something approaching, and get ready. This is a span of about 6 seconds, note.
>You only get surprise against creatures not in combat already. Any creature that's in combat expects combat and is fully ready for combat.
Also, not RAW, but seriously should be considered:
>If ALL players/enemies are surprised, use a surprise round instead where you don't roll initiative but just take your turns because there's nobody to shout 'We're under attack!' and the enemies/players might not decide to attack and reveal themselves

>>52497007
Exactly.
>A group of 10 creatures is approaching
>One trips over something, loud clattering
>All the players know there's something, ready for combat

Are you saying 1000 peasants should be able to easily ambush 1 noble because they can apparently cover for each other's stealth rolls?

>>52497012
Pretty sure it's RAW, but stealth rules in 5e are one of the hardest things to grasp and I wouldn't be surprised if I fucked up somewhere.

>>52496596
>Can someone explain to me why Barbarians aren't allowed to cast spells or wear heavy armor?
To reduce their synergy with paladins, clerics, fighters, rangers and the like. They're basically concentrating on raging, and the heavy armor thing is kinda like how monk weapons aren't technically finesse.

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>>52496760
>Bear in mind that Barbarian is by far the weakest class in the game.

>>52497053
>No, I was agreeing with you.
Oh. I should've understood that. I blame the fact that I'm very sleepy right now. And yeah, I never thought of it but now that you say it a Rollo inspired barb would be great.

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>>52496760
>barbs are the weakest class

i bet you also think monks are overpowered

barbs are much better than druids, monks and rangers at the very least

>>52496596
Where's the 5eg discord?

>>52497053
>Pretty sure it's RAW, but stealth rules in 5e are one of the hardest things to grasp and I wouldn't be surprised if I fucked up somewhere.

They are needlessly complicated when it comes to hiding and surprise rounds.

>Any character or monster that doesn’t
notice a threat is surprised at the start of the encounter.

RAW, instead of the lowest stealth roll, it should be the highest stealth roll that gets checked against passive perception, because they only have to miss ONE threat in order to be surprised.

I always thought it was a bit back to front. Instead of enemies being surprised for the first round, anyone who passes all the stealth checks should get a "Surprise Round" where they just get a turn before combat starts.

Otherwise you just need ONE person in stealth to go unnoticed and the entire enemy side is surprised and your entire side gets to attack.

>>52497059
Oh, also, another thing that's not RAW but should seriously be considered:
>If somebody doesn't want to join the stealth party (They're liable to fuck it up due to back stealth rolls) they can opt out of the stealth party. These players start a distance from combat (30ft? 60ft?) as your DM directs and also cannot take their first turn in combat, but may take reactions.

>>52496844
Knock something out or incapacitate it somehow and cast before it recovers, or as part of a plan to bring such a creature inside like with summoning.

>>52497156
People usually aren't happy to see it in the OP because discordfags occasionally shit up the thread.
Every couple of threads it's reposted.

>>52497211
Nasty

>>52497007
>The larger your group, the harder it is to hide.
What's your problem here?

>>52497156
>/5eg/ Discord server
https://discord.me/5eg

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>>52497244

>>52497175
>Otherwise you just need ONE person in stealth to go unnoticed and the entire enemy side is surprised and your entire side gets to attack.
Completely wrong. If your PP beats the lowest stealth roll, you have noticed A threat. You are not surprised.

>>52496596
fa/tg/uys, I need feedback, and I need from the most anally rules oriented community I know, which is you

I'm going to DM seriously for the first time long term and I need to establish a few ground rules, among them some on UA material.

Now that the dust is settled, which Mystic are okay to go, and which ones are Lore Wizard tier? So far I'm only really seeing the Nomad as a good choice

Are the Warforged and Changeling memes?

What if I allow the Aaracockra but only for the Monk class?

Any other advice you wish your DM had gotten?

>>52497271
Oh shit, it can actually be read either way.

>Any character or monster that doesn’t notice a threat [as in, there's a threat that goes unnoticed] is surprised at the start of the encounter.

>Any character or monster that doesn’t notice a threat [as in, has noticed at least one] is surprised at the start of the encounter.

No wonder this ends up in confusing conversations.

Are the magic items in TYP any good /5eg/?

>>52497282
Published material only, UA on special consideration (only to serve as a filter and so you don't have to look up every UA), but never allow UA multiclass.

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>>52497282
>What if I allow the Aaracockra but only for the Monk class?
KAWWW!

>>52497282
>Are the Warforged and Changeling memes?

Any non-human, non-dwarf races are memes. If you allow them to play those races, you are training them to be bad roleplayers.

>>52497117
>>52497153
What class do you feel is weaker, retard-san?

>>52497282
Mystic is fine, just realize it's a frontloaded class. Ban the focus that allows you to switch proficiency bonuses on the fly, it's shit, but other than that, it should be fine.

Changeling can be fun, just realize a Changeling won't auto pass deception checks to be other people. Warforged have to work out their backstory with you, as otherwise it could easily be out of place. And realize Warforged aren't robots, they are golems.

I've never seen an Aaracockra in play, so I'm not sure about that one, just make sure whoever plays them aren't doing it so they can just go "CAW, CAW."

Remember the Action Economy, and that singular enemies will never be as threatening as they can be against a party. If you make a villain, make sure that they're going to be a duo or a group, so the climactic battle isn't a shitty gangbang on the villain.

And no multiclassing into UA material.

>>52497282
After playing it I can tell you that Mystic CAN do anything... Worse than any specialist class.

Let them play it.

>>52497376

I think allowing Variant Human is a pretty strong way to ensure they are not going to stray for from that/Half elf

>>52497369
Randy, get out of here

>>52497381
Not that anon but Ranger is the weakest class followed by Monk.

Barbarian's problem is being frontloaded, being useless outside of combat and not having meaningful build options, but Monk has the same issues so it comes out ahead in the low tier ranking.

>>52497414

What about the Wu-Jen, and the Immortal? I heard those guys were pretty obnoxious

>>52497313
Yes it can, but one way doesn't make sense, so I don't know why people jump to it instead of just recognizing that English is being a silly goose here and flipping it to the right one.

>>52497471
Immortal is a bit more obnoxious, however let them play it, for as bothersome as it can be it is rather interesting to see in action

>>52497471
Immortal is hard to kill.
That's all. And it's MAD as fuck.
Fun to play though.
Wu-Jen is only dangerous if you let them multiclass into wizard. Then it can spend psipoints to create spellslots. Else is a slightly better warlock.

Has anyone ever actually played the winged Tiefling variant or seen anyone play it

>>52497376
You sound like a boring person.

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>>52497376

>>52497448
Not the guy you responded to but why do you think ranger is weak?

>>52497552
Yes, I had someone play a winged tiefling wizard in one of my games.

>>52497448
>monks and rangers
>useless outside of combat

Yep, confirmed for retarded.

>>52497588
How'd it go?

>>52497567
im so sick of people using this stupid image to justify their dumb ideas

What's everyone's opinions on milestone leveling? I'm going to be running Curse of Strahd next week, and the module recommends this method of leveling. It looks like it equals out to be a level every session or two up to 5th level, and then every three sessions or so after that.

>>52497614
>not playing anything but human and dwarf

And I'm the one with stupid ideas

>>52497581
For the reasons earmarked in the Ranger Revised UA.

>>52497595
It went fine. He died by getting turned to tiefling goo by a black dragon's acid breath.

>>52497614
Go play your only human and dwarf campaign and fuck off then.

>>52497638
That dragon dindu nuffin

>>52497590
Pray tell, what out of combat utility do Monks bring to the party?

>>52497643
>>52497633
im not him Ace, but I think he was baiting you

Any opinion on the new Mystic UA? I have a serious hardon for psionic warriors and the like, so I'm really hoping they'll actually bring out something usable sooner or later.

As presented in the UA, would the Mystic be playable? Or broken? Or just terrible?

>>52497659
But why defend his stupid idea?

>>52497663
We... we have spent half the thread discussing them.

It's good. Some say that you need to beware the proficiency swap discipline.

>>52497663
Are you serious? Read the thread, literally right above your post.

>>52497651

>Aboleth or other assorted mind rapist brings down most of the party
>wood elf monk cutie saves the day anyway

I guess..

>>52497677
I just hate that image and the people who post it.

>>52497651
Way of the Shadow gives you group stealth and later teleportation.

Way of the 4 Elements gives you a rough equivalent to warlock pact magic, and all the out of combat utility those spell like effects can provide.

Way of the Open Fist is the least useful outside of combat, but can still fall back on the monk's general mobility to succeed.

>>52497663
It's in a weird spot where it can be built to do anything, but is worse at it than a specialist, and not as good at being a generalist as a Bard.

It works fine. Read the thread.

>>52497627
I definitely prefer it to keeping track of EXP. An EXP system either encourages too much combat and not enough non-combat, or you'll be rewarding EXP for milestones anyways, so it's effectively the same.

>>52497703

Is there some site that has some DPR averages for all or most of the classes?
Mid to high level.

>>52497695
Our case:
>Half the party shooting crossbows and bows.
>Mystic spending all psipoint keeping everyone in the frontline, specially the pally over 0HP.
>Monk skewering and punching foes like nobodies business.

>>52497704
Shadow Monk makes the monk a stealth specialist like a pseudo-Rogue. It works... if multiclassed into Warlock + Rogue.

Wot4E is hot garbage and the fact that you mentioned it at all reflects that you have no idea what you're talking about.

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>>52497738

>>52497627
It works well on campaigns but less so on more freeform adventures, as you get into difficulty with what counts as a milestone or not.

For CoS it should be fine.

>>52497704
I've seen a Shadow monk turn hilariously broken. Basically, unless you're prepared to include a super-fucking-ninja (whose player would like nothing more than to evade combat and basically commando through everything with surgical precision), you're going to end up gritting your teeth.

Basically, it's awesome if you like that, and annoying if you want them to do the fighties you prepared for them.

>>52497763
You asked a question. The sad fact is that even the worst monk subclass has more out of combat utility than any barbarian subclass.

Barbarians are THE worst class in the game.

>>52497764
I'm just trying to do some minor changes to a class and want to make sure it doesn't do too much damage.

>>52497282
>Aarakokra monk
>Mobile for more speed and disengagement for free on attack
>Moves in
>Grapples
>Carries them up high
>drops them

Warforged is an AC stacking meme but it's okay. Not great.
Changeling is just warlock with disguiseself/alterself.

Allow all UA with the exception that if you attempt to multiclass with UA material, your build will be monitored strictly and only a few UA need to be necessarily banned (Lore wizard). Even then, lore wizard can be fine if you trust the players not to bring the stupid OP shit parts of it in like strength save hold person and they can justify and roleplay out the spell changes. It can be quite brilliant if they'd doing it for non-metagame reasons.

>Any other advice you wish your DM had gotten
Don't make every single NPC 5x the level of the players because you fear the players might gangbang them. The players could still gangbang them, but it turns into a power fantasy for the DM somehow.

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>>52497771

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>>52497703
>>52497614

>>52497793
>not understanding the point of the image

Seriously?

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>>52497825

>>52497793
wat?

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>>52496610
Behold the look of extreme displeasure upon my countenance.

>>52497915
Don't give him (you)s

>>52496610
Excuse me, the animals my druid fucks are exclusively opposite gendered.

>>52497376
>he thinks dwarves aren't memes

>>52497471
Wu-Jen Clan ain't nothing to fuck with.

>>52497627
They're easy, efficient and really hard to fuck up.

However, a really good DM should be able to use something else for EXP such as 'Gold=EXP' or 'Monsters=EXP'. However, as part of good DMing, you have to know when this is appropriate - It must relate to the player's goals and not be completely nonsensical or encourage stupidity. Monsters=EXP is good for a party focused on exterminating monsters and all monsters they find, as such parties aren't expeccted to work around monsters. Money=EXP is better for dungeoncrawls, greedy players and works best if you can actually justify it (Magical Power Money)

On a freeform adventure, it can be very hard to define quest EXP and all that, and milestones are recommendable unless you're really good at working this shit out.


For a good deal of DMs, I'd recommend milestones, but they tend to feel more arbitrary than appropriate (doesn't encourage stupid/unfun behaviour) defined EXP.

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What's the best way using official rules, classes and races to make a summoner type character?

Haven't played 5e since initial launch and I love minion generating builds.

>>52498211
Any Druid with Conjure Animals.

That's the whole build.

>Making a new character
>Maybe I'll play a goliath bard or a halfling cleric
>End up picking up something sensible like a half elf sorcerer
whats wrong with me

>introduce high level npc to be an ally to my PCs
>npc is the godfather of a child who is also there to drive the plot forward
>player who thinks that he is in skyrim gets tired of the kid and decides he wants to kill the kid because "it would be funny" and that he's "sick of the kid"
>I say that the high level npc gets in the way and asks player to stop or npc will stop him
>player tries to follow through anyway
>npc drops and knocks player unconscious in one round of combat

Did I go too far and become That GM?

>>52497282
Pick through the UA material.

The races can be allright.

As for classes... Very few are okay for multiclassing. And by that i mean only the Barbarian, Cleric, Monk UAs along with the Rangers and Rogues UA are somewhat balanced for Multiclassing.

The rest is either single class or ban it.

>>52497651
Scouting.

>>52498260
The only trouble I can see with Mystic multiclassing is Wu-Jen + Wizard.

>>52498256
I'd say yes.
Not for stopping something stupid, even if I wouldn't have done so, but for making the NPC that much stronger.

>>52498260

Oh right i forgot to add:

''Ban mystic completely.''
>>52498356

>>52498383
I'd like to read your reasoning.

>>52498383
Oh you.

>>52498211
If you play in a game that gets to level 6, Necromancy Wizards can have 10 Skeletons at once, although you have to command them. And they only get more over time.

>>52498256
If he thought he was in Skyrim, shouldn't the children be invulnerable?

How would you handle a curse that's basically a slower version of being stabbed with a Morgul blade? Basically, your body and soul become tainted and you fall more and more "into the shadow" as it haunts and tortures you. It'll eat away at your flesh and mind until you're nothing recognizable any more, more akin to an undead horror than the man you once were.

This has become relevant for my current campaign and I'm wondering how exactly I should model it. We've already established it's something you can resist (so the PC isn't just basically counting down to death), but it's still going to be something that will hinder him and that he'll have to struggle against, both physically and mentally.

All right nerds, what's the big argument of the thread so I can wade in without having read any of it?

>>52498790
Modified Madness effects from the DMG?

>>52498790
>>52498846
Innistrad Planeshift Madness Variant.

>>52498843
ban variant human

>>52497818
10/10 image anon

>>52496651
>But the heavy armor wielding barbarian is a common staple of fantasy storytelling.
Not in the kind of fantasy D&D actively attempts to emulate.
>Also people casting magic stronger because they're angry is a pretty common trope too.
Meh, sometimes.
Examples of "anger making you tap into negative/evil magic" have slightly more examples in this type of genre, or the anger itself actually doing nothing at all to the magic. Magic=feelings isn't particularly common.
>And moreover, it's just arbitrarily limiting character concepts.
You signed up to play a class-based game and knew that before you started.
Honestly, what were you even thinking?

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>People hate variant human but also houserule it so that everyone gets a feat at level 1

What the fuck is going on?

>>52498843
What is the weakest class and why is it barbarian?

>>52496810
Conan is the archetypical barbarian but very little of the stuff going into the Barbarian class or classic Berserker kit has anything to do with him and takes more from Norse berserkers; Conan very rarely every goes into a blood-mad battle rage for instance, and never in Howard's own literature.

He's more of a straightforward Fighter [Champion] because much is made of his sheer fighting skill and incredible physical prowess.

can i play a sickass lizardman in this game

If I have illusion for armor and weapon, could I kill illusion enemy?

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>>52498955
The problem is that v.human is the optimal choice for every single build because of the free feat. Removing it as an option and giving everyone a free feat encourages more diverse race selection while maintaining an optimal build.

Plus, if everyone is super, no one is.

>>52498955
Who did this and when?

>hey dave, you get hurt a lot in your fights have you ever considered wearing heavier armor? You could obviously do so
>I'd love to Sam the Sorcerer, but if I wear armor, I can't get angry as effectively. It's weird, but I just don't feel as angry when I've got plate armor on.

>>52498985
Volo's Guide page 112 is your friend.

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>>52498955
I had a friend who said something like this

>how about changing the "get an ability score or feat thing"
>ok how
>so you can either get +2 / +1 +1 or +1 and a feat

>>52499015
>Too stupid to realize that wearing highly-restrictive heavy armour interferes with the ability to become a whirling force of fury
>This is why you shouldn't dump INT

>>52499015
Too tired to feel angry, obviously.
Besides, have you ever flipped out into a berserker Fury and killed everything only you end up still having to take off all that heavy plate armor afterword when you're all tired?
It's such a downer, you just can't get all worked up knowing that that's what comes next.

>>52499052
>>52499066
>plate armor is restrictive/exhausting meme
There's only two people in the world who still fall for this one, so:

Mearls or Crawford, go home, you've got a UA due tomorrow and shitposting and samefagging isn't going to get it done. Your quality has dropped lately.

http://www.benjaminrose.com/post/mobility-in-medieval-plate-armor/

>>52498955
>Variant human
>Players pick it just so they can start with their precious sharpshooter/GWM etc but are forced to be a human
>Give everyone a feat and don't allow variant human
>Players get more customisation at the start without them having to play a human to be optimised

>>52499000
>>52498955
No, the problem is that martials have compulsory feats. Casters don't really need feats so much, so they're free to be non-variant-humans.

>>52497792

If an Aaracockra can't fly if they are encumbered with Armor and such I'm pretty sure they're not supposed to be able to fly with a grappling enemy.

>>52499103
>forced to be human
>not realizing that humans are the best race to roleplay as

Any other race is going to be hampered by it's customs and standouts unless you have the top tier of players. Anyone who isn't that good is going to be killing themselves by playing a race that defines them. It's why dwarf players are almost all gruff drunks, all elf players act high and mighty, all tiefling players act excluded and edgy, ect, except a few. Whereas humans can be anything because we ARE humans, and as such, understand the differences you can make.

A bit of a dumb question but can enemies use readied actions? I don't mean like boss monsters or anything, I'm talking about the low of the low, goblins for example.

>>52499098
You sound like a civilized man, knowing so much about plate armor, so clearly you have no say in what does and doesn't work.

The heavy armor struggle is real.
I can't even flex my pecs so hard that they become like steel when I'm in heavy armor! If there's nobody there to see my steely pecs then it doesn't work.

>>52499159
I'm sorry your group is bad.

>>52499162
If they're smart enough to use tactics, then yes. And your players will hate you for it.

t. almost killed a character with readied crossbow fire when he kicked in the door.

>>52499159
>Anyone who isn't that good is going to be killing themselves by playing a race that defines them. It's why dwarf players are almost all gruff drunks, all elf players act high and mighty, all tiefling players act excluded and edgy, ect, except a few
yeah, but my players have fun doing it, so why should I care?

>>52499159
>variation is bad because the people around me suck at roleplaying as nonhumans
sucks to be you

>>52499170
>not living on the edge of a king's lands, raiding his pathetic patrols in armor bought with the blood price

Pathetic.

>>52499190
Alright thanks my man, as a player surprisingly even though I've played 5e for a straight year now it has never ever come up before. Joined a new group and the DM was having goblins use readied actions against us. We still won rather easily, just that it was a mild annoyance.

>>52499103

consider banning GWM/SS/Lucky

>>52499218
>claiming to be a barbarian
>acting like a bandit
Yes, it is pathetic.

>>52498885
I'm glad somebody appreciates it.

>>52499098
>http://www.benjaminrose.com/post/mobility-in-medieval-plate-armor/

If you're going to provide a source saying you can rage in heavy armour, then at least read the damn thing.

Being able to roid out and rage will be made a whole lot harder if you're strapped with 50-60 pounds of metal.

>>52499218
>the blood price
mebbe go back to game of thrones where nobody wants you, because nobody wants you here either and you're gonna get even less traction

we talk about casters here

Does True Polymorph grant you everything in a creatures stat block? Proficiencies, legendary actions, etc?

If so how is this not the best 9th level spell? Everyone harps on about Wish constantly, shot is way more limited than this. Why not turn your level 17 fighter into the fucking dragon or balor that is according to CR a challenge for your whole party?

>>52499218
>living on the edge of a king's lands
>not storming the king's castle and taking the crown for yourself

>>52497536
>allowing UA multiclassing
Don't do it.

>>52499289
>>52499289
>Being able to roid out and rage will be made a whole lot harder if you're strapped with 50-60 pounds of metal.

Why?

So far, nobody has provided a good answer to this, neither lore nor balance.

Is no UA multiclassing just a suggestion from you guys? Or is it actually something WotC say not to do?

>>52499107
This. Spell Sniper and War Caster aren't nearly as build-defining for casters as GWM/Sharpshooter/TavernBrawler/ShieldMaster.

>>52499316
hahaha
because

>>52499298
You maintain class features of your new form can use them right?

>>52499327
just a suggestion

>>52499327
It's actually something WotC says to do, because they're too incompetent to find obvious multiclassing flaws with their UA before releasing them to the public.

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>>52496596
While you can't cast spells while raging, if you mutliclass into warlock you get a few options for concentration-less spells that can seriously up your survivability and damage output. A totem barbarian/bladelock has access to armor of agathys and gains resistance to all forms of damage - including psychic when you go high enough with warlock.

So essentially you'll be shrugging everything off and have massive amounts of temp + real health while dealing damage to anything stupid enough to throw a punch at a hulking musclebound hell savage covered in ice spikes. You'll also have eldritch blast, hex, and hellish rebuke as backups in the event you run out of rages and happen to have any of your spell slots left. Its mad as hell, though.
I've been wanting to play this class combo forever as a dragonborn fiend bladelock of Godzilla but I'll never convince my dm to let me do it. I'll also never roll the perfect set of stats to start it off.

>>52499327
UA are not official game content. They're untested ideas from the design team. Their numbers and abilities are unbalanced. They are not allowed in official games. Your DM can allow whatever they want at home but odds are the PC will be over or under powered and possibly no fun.

>>52499316
Look at it this way, anon.
If you want to houserule, go for it. Nobody really cares that much on here about what you do in your game, as much as we occasionally pretend otherwise.
If you want the core rules themselves to change, too bad; you're so far from barking up the right tree that it's you're not even in the right forest anymore.

You're an adult; you don't need either our validation or permission to do things.

>>52499440
Actually, I am houseruling things anon. I was just hoping to get a rational answer why the default rule is the way it is. But none has been provided, so I will change it. There's absolutely need to get pissy when someone is asking for elaboration.

>all this talk about non-casting Barbs
just multiclass into champion of gwnharwyf ;)

>>52499316
Is it easier to swing your arms with or without weight strapped to it?

There's your fucking answer. I'm sorry reading your armor blogs and jerking it to historical reenactment videos has impeded your ability to think critically.

>>52499483
Oh, I'm not even one of the guys arguing with you actually.
I was only pointing out that you didn't actually need to argue or complain or do anything on /tg/ at all to completely solve the problem for your household and thus hopefully resolved your issue.

There is no explanation.
It's D&D; fluff doesn't match the mechanics and mechanics don't match the fluff.

>>52499316
Barbarians are already resistant to damage, and if you go path of the totem they are to all but psychic. Now pile on armor that cranks their AC up and then just makes it so you don't hit them until later and you know why. Added to that is they have the potential to have huge amounts of hit points and you have your reason.

Giving them high AC, high health and damage resistance is stupid and unbalances shit.

Playing an Arcane Trickster in a campaign, party's first magic item is a book that grants a feat. I ended up getting it, so now I'm trying to figure out what would benefit me most in the long-term. Level 4 for what it matters.

I'm leaning towards something like magic initiate for the 1/day free shield and extra cantrips, but I'm not sure. Any suggestions?

>>52499605
Mage Slayer. Then get Invisibility and See Invisible.

>>52499605
So you already got your ASI/feat from level 4, right?

The answer completely depends on what you got from that.

>>52499529
Sure, it's harder, but the only thing that effects is how quickly you'd get tired doing it. Most battles won't last long enough to make anyone exhausted. Still not adequate.

>>52499530
Fair enough.

>>52499538
Counterpoint: Unarmored Defense, the level 2 feature, already makes barbarians have AC on par with heavy armor, eventually even surpassing plate armor's AC.

>>52499605
What do you do in your party? Where have you noticed your character underperforming? Where do you want your character to excel?

>>52499605
It would be best used on a monk(mobile)/fighter(ss/cbe/gwm/sentinel/pam/shieldmaster)/barbarian(sentinel/gwm/pam/shieldmaster)/ranger(sharpshooter/cbe)...

But then again, rogue has crossbow expert which is briliant if you don't have a hardcore melee build like arcane tricksters / swashbucklers have.

If you don't already have mobile+boomingblade+greenflameblade etc then you should get crossbow expert.

>>52499316
>nobody has provided a good answer to this, neither lore nor balance

Lore:
The shirtless barbarian même is huge in artwork (based Frank) and the general popular psyche. When you think of a barb you picture a huge mass of muscle just going apeshit and laying into people with a big ass weapon.

Balance:
barbarians already have high damage output and health. Giving them high AC independent of stats is stupid. If you want to be unkillable just say you don't die.

>>52499483
The default rule is the way it is because the barbarian would be brokenly overpowered otherwise. No class should have that much consistent damage PLUS that much health PLUS that much damage resistance PLUS that high AC

As someone who has DM'd a barbarian from 1-15, I can safely say that if he had access to heavy armor from the start he would have been for all practical purposes indestructible, and would probably have been able to solo every level-appropriate encounter in the campaign.

>>52499645
Fair point but from what I can tell they set that up assuming people wouldn't roll for stats and instead would use the standard array.

5e was made so anyone, and I mean anyone, could figure it out enough to play. So they set up the classes around that assumption, which can lead to potential problems when you play different than what the book intends.

>>52499681
>>52499605
Oh, right, I missed the obvious.

If you're going melee and haven't aquired mobile, get mobile.
If you don't care, get crossbow expert.

If you already have mobile, you really don't need any more feats.

You could get observant for extra high passive perception, or you could get dungeon delver or resilient or tough.

>>52496682
That's low as shit. What the hell are you putting your other points into?

>>52499640
I took the ASI and pumped my Dex to 18.

>>52499634
Might come in handy, I get the feeling there might be Hags coming soon in the campaign, so that might be a topical choice as well as viable later.

>>52499669
My role is mostly striker in combat, and outside of combat I use illusions, prestidigitation and mage hand to play scout, burglar and party support. Not much of a face.

>>52499645
How many barbarians have 18 con and 18 dex?

Only a dex barbarian or dex barbarogue gets that high.

And they don't even care much about heavy armour because they'd need to put a 15 in strength to wear plate when firstly they could wear light armour for no stealth disadvantage + 17 AC (And no stealth disadvantage is sometimes considered to be worth +1 AC) or.. Well, they build around unarmoured defence.

>>52498689
I have no idea, I think he feels like he can do whatever he wants without consequence even though he's level 3

>>52498377
I was wanting to do what the makers of Mega Man X did with Zero: have this kick ass ally who is straight up better than you with the incentive that one day you can be as good, if not better than them if you try hard enough

>>52499719
If you think Hags are coming, I'd recommend Alert. +5 to initiative, no advantage on attack rolls when hidden against you, and you negate surprise rounds.

>>52499777
What about wovens of hahas?

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Finally starting a level 1 campaign again, its been like 2 years, holy shit.

I almost sort of forget what to do for low level characters who have never adventured. What sort of stuff have you thrown at your fresh parties recently, /5eg/?

I was thinking, since all their new characters know each other and live in a small village, to just have a bulletin board where townsfolk can put up notes asking for help with stuff (taking guard's patrols, investigating a robbery, etc.) and the players can sort of pick and choose what they want to do?

>>52499842
That's alright, but something should happen during whatever job(s) they pick up that 1. forces them to work together, and 2. sets off whatever plot you plan on using.

>>52499645
'Realism' is not an adequate argument, because by the same token there's no reason any class shouldn't be able to put on heavy armour and wear it just fine, because in real life you don't actually need to be that strong or have more than a couple of hours of training to move just fine in full plate mail.

The real point is that if you give barbarians heavy armour proficiency and let it work with rage (and all those other barbarian features that specifically don't work with heavy armour, whoa, it's almost like the developers purposefully intended the barbarian not to wear it) then it invalidates every other type of barbarian playstyle by presenting one that is objectively superior, because it means they can shift all the points they would put in Dexterity straight into Constitution and become unstoppable meat walls.

>>52499685
>Lore
The shirtless man is a meme, not how barbarians actually function in literature, history, or even the class description in the PHB.

>balance
See >>52499645

>>52499706
That's a definite problem with the edition then, if running it outside a very narrow set of memes is going to cause problems.

>>52499694
I'm sorry about this, but you're a retarded DM if you think the barbarian being able to use plate would result in any of the following:
1. The barbarian automatically having plate armor from the start. Plate armor is expensive, and not something someone would start the game with, unless you're just giving away everything for free to your players OR they are starting at a high enough level that the AC bonus is helpful, but not overpowering.
2. The barbarian being unkillable. There are 6 other ways to attack people beyond just AC. They're called Saving Throws. Use them. Hell, throw tough enemies at the barb that threaten him. DnD is a game you balance on the fly, and if you aren't capable of that, you are the problem.

>>52499731
I don't know about 18 con/18 dex, but 20 con/16 dex isn't actually farfetched, especially if you play that one dwarf subrace.

>>52499902
Who said anything about giving the barbarian heavy armor proficiency? This has only been about removing the heavy armor limitation in rage.

>>52499904
You sure are passionate for a guy who's already fixed his problem.

>>52498955
I've played three variant human characters and I used the feat for Medium Armor Master (it was a dex-based knight and i wanted to wear knightly armor, but medium armor is outright inferior to light and heavy without the feat), Healer (character was supposed to be a doctor so mechanically i just grabbed medicine proficiency and healer), and Tavern Brawler (my fighter had a backstory that revolved around getting in fist fights in bars, he gained his first few fighter levels by punching people).
I've only seen someone use Variant Human to take one of the martial "compulsory" meta feats one time. It's taken commonly because customizing your skillset to fit the concept of you character and what they're supposed to be good at is more appealing than just "you're a tiefling".

Hence why giving every race a free feat and buffing standard human is the solution.

>>52496740
>It's 10 turns and I'd rule that no, it takes your entire turn.
This is basic phb. It takes your action. You can still move, still bonus action, and still reaction. But you have to maintain concentration on casting the spell.

>>52499777
Might as well get observant instead
>expertise in perception + observant + a +1 wisdom modifier gives, at level 5, 22 passive perception
>When ambushing you, all enemies must beat 22 passive perception
>When hiding, enemies must beat 22 passive perception to be hidden from you
So you'll never be ambushed and enemies will never have advantage to attack you anyway.

And then you can help your team by finding all the traps and alerting them of things.
And you ALSO get +1 int, on an arcane trickster.


Though, I'm not sure 'hidden' refers specifically to monsters who have taken the 'hide' action and +5 initiative is pretty nice. It's best on an assassin though.

>>52499645
>the only thing that effects is how quickly you'd get tired doing it

By adding mass, you're increasing the amount of energy it takes to execute the motion. Either you compensate by expending more energy to swing with the same amount of force, or rather you swing slightly less hard to not drain yourself. If you've ever played baseball, you'd know that's why they add ringweights to bats when they warm up swinging.

>Unarmored Defense, the level 2 feature, already makes barbarians have AC on par with heavy armor, eventually even surpassing plate armor's AC

It's a level 1 feature, and also it only surpasses it horribly if you roll for stats (which is a moot point because that shit is unbalanced and shouldn't figure in the discussion). The most optimal build, Mountain Dwarf with 15x3/8x3, only surpasses plate at 12th level.

>>52499904
How're you getting to 20 con?

First you'll want to increase strength from 17 to 20. In one of the ASIs you can put +1 str +1 con.
Then if you're going for strength, you want PAM and/or GWM and probably even sentinel and maybethis or that..

Sure, you could be upping your con, but why? You're already the tankiest person in the party. You need to help your teammates, and you won't deal much damage or keep enemies away without more strength/weapon feats.

By the time you have all of those, you've at best got 15 dex 18 con.

Or, you could be a tank, but then why not just be a barbarogue?

>>52500035
This anon is just plain retarded. Myself and a couple others have tried explaining the mechanical/balance reasons for not letting them do barb things in heavy armor, yet he keeps coming back and saying that we're wrong or whatever.

It's classic goalposts.

>>52499931
Because if you're already ignoring intentional design decisions, why not go the whole way?

As already discussed there are a variety of mechanical and fluff reasons for barbarians not to be able to wear heavy armours, and the features of the class are very clearly intended not to work when wearing heavy armour. By removing such a key limitation to their features and then writing it off by saying 'they'll have to become proficient on their own' all you've done is make Heavily Armoured a feat tax for barbarians, because it's an objectively better way of playing the class - because the class is only balanced around not wearing heavy armour.

>>52499893
I sort of had an idea, have a bunch of different "payment contracts" on the bulletin, and have the highest paying one be the one with the potential plot thread.

Again, tell me if this wouldn't work, as I haven't really tried something like this for a beginning.

>>52499991
>baseball analogies

Sure, but that still only means that you get tired faster. Blame the system for not accurately detailing exhaustion in combat.

>unarmored defense
>there's only one way to do this
>proceeds to go through another way of doing it.

>>52500035
By ignoring your proposed feat taxes.

>>52499977
It's my hope that by continuing to engage with you, one of you will eventually come up with an explanation.

>>52500107
Plate armor wouldn't be objectively better for barbarians any more than it is currently objectively better for wizards. Next!

>>52497783
>An open hand monk has more out of combat utility than a totem barb.
Are you really this clueless? I know we're racing for last place here, but really?

>>52498256
kick that fucking retard out of your group

>>52499904
The point is, with heavy armor the barbarian can reach the upper bounds of AC much faster and with no investment beyond strength, which all barbarians will have anyway. Any magical armor they end up getting will also be better because all the really great stuff is heavy.

>just use saving throws
isn't a solution either, because then every enemy the party fights ends up being a spellcaster, or every spellcaster only targets the barbarian. On top of this, they have high Constitution and Strength, proficiency to both of those and get advantage against Dexterity saves they can see coming, which covers the majority of saving throws they'll face. They're let down by Wisdom and Charisma, but they also have an entire party to back them up on that front and by the time those become really threatening (charm and dominate, for example) they'll generally have countermeasures. Furthermore, unless you've played with a barbarian I don't think you understand just how much damage they can soak up - letting them negate even more damage from attacks, the only consistent and reliable source of damage in the game, is just a fast track to not bothering to ever target them.

You do have to balance the game as you go along, and as such there's no point shooting yourself in the foot before you even start by removing an important restriction from one of the player's classes.

>>52500146
>It's my hope that by continuing to engage with you, one of you will eventually come up with an explanation.

I gave you the explanation already >>52499530, and it IS in fact the only explanation ever given; it's that way because the rules say so and the rules and fluff in D&D have never perfectly synched up or even partially synched up in most editions. If you don't like it you can change it, but there is no "canon" or even basic logic to explain that stuff, and you are already aware of it on some level.

Right now you're arguing because you like or are enjoying the argument itself; you neither need nor want an explanation because you were given one already. And yeah, it's not a good explanation and I can totally understand not liking it, but not liking it doesn't stop it from being any less accurate true either.

>>52500146

>>unarmored defense
>>there's only one way to do this
>>proceeds to go through another way of doing it

I'm sorry, I thought it was implicit in my example that if a player decides to min max their character to get the highest AC possible in exchange for gimped damage, then more power to them. 22 AC with a shield at level 12 is perfectly fine since you're essentially wielding a toothpick to do so.

What you're so idiotically putting forth is to let them have that stupid high AC without the level restrictions and not reducing their damage output as payment for a meme build.

>>52500146
>By ignoring your proposed feat taxes
>By ignoring the things that make barbarian actually okay, you can become good at something and this makes the barbarian better

It's a tradeoff. You're trading actually useful features (More damage, preventing enemies from reaching your teammates) for tankiness (Something you're already great at), and you'd be better tankiness wise if you were a dex barbarian/barbarogue, at which point you don't care about heavy armour much anyway.

>>52500329
I don't believe the rules should, or are arbitrary. Answering "why is the rule like this" with "because that's what the rules say" is not helpful. If that's the only argument anyone can muster, that's a sign of a serious flaw in the game.

>>52498256
While I'm really not keen on high level NPCs that just knock players out when they step out of line because they're oh-so-mighty and important (If you want mighty and important NPCs, they should be relating to mighty and important players).

However, it's quite possible the entire party could still murder that NPC anyway, so eh.


It's fine, but it would've been cooler if the guy did more than just 'okay, you're unconscious now', and instead did stuff like disarming the player, grapple him, shove him, then threaten him or knock him unconscious if he doesn't stop.

>>52497783
>gets the most hp
>can become resistance to all damage types
>just gets flat bonuses to all their damage
>heightened movement speed
>advantage on all of their strength checks
>all of their amazing high level shit

>compared to Fighter's 'you have a scarce few Cool Boy Points with underwhelming effects and if you want more you need to convince your group to change our ridiculous resting rules so taking a short rest is actually reasonable'
>and here's one more feat to take the compulsory martial feats with even though you can just be variant human

>>52500146
>Plate armor wouldn't be objectively better for barbarians any more than it is currently objectively better for wizards. Next!

Fighter 1 / Barbarian X

Heavy Armor prof. plus Fighting Style. Bonus go Variant Human to have Heavy Armor Master, now you have (DMG/2)-3 at level 2. You delay your Extra Attack by one level - who cares, you're the thoughest thing this side of level 8.

>>52500396
You're ignoring the fact that the reason they're like this is because giving the barbarian more AC at no cost, you're throwing out how the class was balanced in the first place.

>>52500428
>the rules are aribtrary, you shouldn't delve into them
>that's retarded
>no wait, here's a reason

Already debunked, see numerous previous posts. Next!

>>52499904
The reason is quite simple anon.
Raging creates a lot of heat. in order for the barbarian to rage to their maximum potential they need to remove that excess heat from their system. Usually this is done by radiating heat from the skin but wearing heavy armor will cause the heat to be reflected back into the barbarian, potential causing huge problems. the body will enact countermeasures to protect itself but this requires energy that won’t be used for the barbarian’s rage, reducing the barbarian from a storm of fury to just being more upset than usual. I hope I answer your question anon.

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>>52500396
Sure, that's the only argument anyone can muster if you KEEP IGNORING ALL THE FUCKING ARGUMENTS PEOPLE ARE MUSTERING

To summarise for your benefit, in hopes it will pierce through whatever attention deficit disorder you have
>flavourfully: the heroic barbarian archetype, on which the class is based, wears little or no armour
>mechanically: the class would be unbalanced if it had access to such high AC without needing to invest in Dexterity or Constitution

There, have some fucking arguments

>>52500423
Seems fine to me. You're delaying your ASI, extra attack, etc, etc You won't have plate armor before level 6 generally, going by DMG treasure guidelines, so that comes with a pretty big opportunity cost.

Has anyone run a Suicide Squad-themed campaign yet? Meaning a group of Evil characters being forcibly conscripted into bringing down some even bigger bad. If so, how did it go, any interesting ideas I could steal?

>>52500449
Look buddy, at this point it's pretty clear you're just pretending because mommy didn't hug you enough as a kid and now the only way you feel any connection with other living human beings is to troll and shit post on a Laotian basket-weaving forum in the hope for (You)'s.

You've won, congratulations. I'm tired of explaining the exact same thing over and over while you say "nuh-uh" with your eyes closed and shake your head really hard.

>>52500489
Already debunked both. I'm not ignoring anything anon, but you certainly are. See:>>52499904

>>52500417
>All their amazing high level shit
They don't have a lot of high level shit aside from the level 14 and level 20 abilities, really.

You get, what, more damage on crits? (insigificant damage boost), persistent rage? (Your rage shouldn't be ending anyway), more reliable strength checks? (Compared to the rogue getting more reliable EVERYTHING), and if you take resistance to all damage types you have to be a bear barbarian rather than, say, wolf barbarian which gives advantage to frickin' everyone in melee.

Flat bonuses to all their damage isn't really better than paladin's +4.5 radiant to all attacks (improved divine smite) or fighter's third attack.
Advantage to strength checks is mostly for grappling, not that you get expertise in athletics. Though it's nice to have.
Movement speed isn't astounding. A melee rogue can pick up mobile for the same speed, a monk is faster and a fighter or ranger or most other people can just fight at range.
Also, a fighter could use one of their extra ASIs that they get instead of, say, brutal critical to give themself +2 hp/level and exceed the barbarian's health. A fighter can get 19 AC easily without using a shield, a barbarian will usually reach 17 AC with 14 dex.

Tips for scaling monsters up? Not templates as much as just raising the numbers to make a monster more challenging without changing its functionality.

Also class levels on humanoids and the like to make orcs and shit a threat past the first couple levels.

>>52500449
>why do wizards only get to cast this many spells a day?
>why do classes get the amount of hit points each level up that they do?
>why do characters only get to take one action in a round?
>if I ignore everyone's explanations I can claim that they're all arbitrary, and change them at will without regard to the gameplay consequences

>>52500520
Sorry, debunked by this guy >>52500311

What was that about not ignoring anything?

>>52500396
It's not an argument, it's a declarative statement of fact, just like how "gravity orients us downward" is one or "when human beings get too old they die" is one; it is true, and it doesn't matter if you like or care about it or not.
The rules are that way because the rules are that way, no other reason. Since these rules are not in any substantial way based on reality, they do not require reasons to exist.

The upside is that being merely a series of words and numbers arranged in paper, you are in no way obligated to follow these rules and to some degree are even encouraged to modify them. Certainly no one here actually cares if you do, and there's no penalty for it.

What you are looking for is not an explanation, but VALIDATION.
You want to hear your own opinion echoed back at you or reiterated to you in a similar enough way that it agrees with your basic houserule ideas.
The downside to this is that for the exactly the same reasons that nobody really cares if you houserule (certainly not enough to punish you or stop you or even pause in their daily routine), nobody actually cares about your individual opinions either, need for validation or not.

>>52500496
You don't need plate for the DR, you'll get it from wearing chainmail.

>>52500547
If your monsters are solitary monsters, then buff their HP, else Action Economy will get them killed too fast to do anything.

>>52500524
Oh, and, if you're going for superresistance bear barbarian, fighter can go EK for shield spell and other things like haste to stack on AC a load.

They're not normally as tanky, but still.

I wouldn't say barbarian's much worse than fighter, though, but they're generally less flexible. They definitely wouldn't be overpowered if they had +1 AC from heavy armour from a multiclass.

So to answer the question which has already been answered
>>52496596
It stops barbarian 1 from being a compulsory multiclass for strength fighters.

>Feats are an optional part of the game
Do any classes become bad/unplayable because of no feats? I assume it hurts valor bards and EKs

>>52500499
Oh! Oh! I'm actually in a game right now, though we aren't really being "forced" to fight the main villains at all.

guys, i need some help

basically, my character is an evil thief in a neutral/good party, however ever since i joined the party ive been pretending to be a good character (i have a stolen thing that identifies me as part of an organisation of archaeologists who go around collecting dangerous artifacts to keep them out of the hands of bad guys, but i am actually with the bad guys). this is a low magic world so luckily my charisma and deception has been enough to keep the finger of suspicion off of me, however we have a paladin in the party

sometimes the paladin casts detect evil to find enemies when we are fighting demons and such, and obviously he can also see me. so far ive managed to convince them that im not actually evil, but im running out of a good ways to do this. so far ive said

- you must have cast the spell wrong (i won a deception check and he lost an arcana)
- oh its probably just one of the artifacts
- well as a paladin, everyone is probably 'evil' to you, i think you just have too high standards
- you are racist against elves and are picking on me

can you guys think of anything else along these lines?

>>52500547
>>52500597
Also consider giving them lair or legendary actions, or else some other way of letting them act off-turn. If the fight turns into a JRPG battle of the boss attacking, then all the characters having their turns, then the boss attacking again it can be pretty boring.

>>52500613
So Evil on Evil? What the PCs' motivation?

>>52500552
>spells per day
Probably something to do with the encounter math. I don't know. I'm not trying to fix wizards right now.
>hitpoints per class
This actually goes towards class roles and differences. Some classes are meant to be tanky, some are not. Etc.
>why do characters only get to take one action in a round?
To keep turns short.

Ez. Now answer my question.

>>52500582
>>52500311
Must have missed this one in the switch to my main computer: Barbarians want to max Constitution and Strength regardless of their unarmored proficiency, and after that Dex. Unarmored defense is therefore not a sacrifice for them. AC wise, barbarians might be one point behind the Armor curve, but that isn't significant enough to warrant your concerns.

>saving throws
Okay, you're definitely retarded if you think the only things that use saving throws are spellcasters. Read the fucking Monster Manual, it's clear you skipped that bit. As a DM, it is your job to attack your players with a diverse field of threats.

How can one stretch Curse of Strahd out?
I really want to go all out as a DM on this campaign

>>52500645
Detect Evil and Good reveals the presence of aberrations, celestials, elementals, fey, fiends and undead.
Divine sense only works on celestials, fiends and undead.
Neither works on evil-aligned humanoids, no matter how despicably villainous, so he should never have noticed you in the first place.

>>52500584
>gravity orients us downward
This is true due to the definitions of downward, gravity, and orient. It is axiomatic.
>when human beings get too old they die
This is true due to facts in the world: it has a reason, which would be something something telomeres, cellular decay leading to aging, something something.

"Why are the rules designed in X way" is like the latter, and not the former. What is the reason?

Anyways, you aren't adding anything at this point, so I will start ignoring you.

>>52500714
Couldn't you just close the tab?

>>52500697
ah i guess we didnt read the book properly

still thats the rules we will be going with, so i still need some new ideas

>>52500645
If I was in your party I'd slap the DM for having you show up to detect evil, and then making the paladin have to succeed an arcana check (with probably negative modifiers) against the thief's deception check, who's probably proficient in it.

At some point you just have to own up to your bad shit but spin it in a way that convinces the group that you do what you do for good reasons.

And if you can't come up with a reason as to why your character believes what they do is the right thing, then your character's poorly written and has no real motivation.

In retrospect you should be making characters that can fit within the group in the first place.

>>52500524
a fighter that takes Tough still isn't damage resistant
even if you take Wolf totem, you're still resistant to the most common damage types (slashing/piercing/bludgeoning) from default rage
you're basically just writing off the other abilities with "I don't like it". Rogue getting reliable everything doesn't make them into a brutal killing machine like the barbarian is, the movement speed and damage boosts are both fine abilities and having to move around on the battlefield comes up a lot if your GM actually makes good fights, and you're forgetting that they can just opt to not drop to 0 HP when killed.

>>52500736
Get an evil artifact and carry it.
Something simple like an Imp Foot.

>>52500743
>you should be making characters that fit in the group

This. You're probably THAT GUY. As long as you aren't stealing from the party it isn't that bad

>>52500743
yeah we let it pass because im a 'magical expert' in a low magic world, and like you say my whole character is built around lying to people

my character doesnt believe theyre doing a good thing, theyre only using the party as a tool to get to the magical treasures so she can deliver them to the evil guys she works for. i wanted to make a character that is technically completely against the party but can exist with them (at least for a short amount of time), and a psychopath was the first solution to that i came up with

>>52500666
It's easy when you realize "Evil" and "Good" aren't all one happy family by virtue of alignment. I mean, is that how it works here? Do Mafia groups and violent criminals never kill each other at all? Of course not.

The party was kind of created deliberately by our table as the "inverse" version of usual D&D stereotypes (usually of character archetypes we often play), but we're actually still adventurers, we just have zero moral scruples and act almost like independent professional criminals.
The motivation against the primary villain is a mixture of a desire for survival (it/they are gunning for us) and revenge; the villain/villains screwed us over near the beginning of the game and we were adequately motivated to ruin his shit because of that.

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>>52498231
What's the best Beast Shape + Conjure Animal combo for a Level 8, which is where the GM is letting me start?

>>52500499
I remember hearing Matthew Colville talk about one of his campaigns being like that. I believe the premise is that they were all doomed prisoners of different origins, and the king of the land needed to stop a threat. Didn't say what. So he went to the prisoners and offered them a choice. Either die, or use their skills to defeat that threat.

I think a good idea would be to have a magic charm fused to each character's ankle. Or neck. Then have an NPC paladin quest with them. If anyone strayed too far from the Paladin, they would suffer different exhaustion levels, or something similar. Basically the charm would slowly sap their life away until they died or returned to the Paladin.

tear druids out of your copy of the PHB

>>52500671
>Unarmored defense is therefore not a sacrifice for them

How is that an argument, of course Unarmored Defense isn't a sacrifice. As is, the feature works as intended: the barbarian gets passable defensive stats and is able to deal good damage reliably. They aren't sitting on 18 AC until much later but this is mitigated by the fact that they have a whole shit-ton of health.

Here are the current options, since you don't seem to understand that player choices revolve around trade-offs that favor a certain attribute over another.

Barbarian as it is and is meant to be played:
> Max STR->CON->DEX
> Get good damage
> Get decent AC

Barbarian as it is and min-maxed to get meme-tier AC:
> Max CON->DEX, who cares about the rest
> Get shit damage because no rage bonuses/reckless/whatever
> Get great AC at 12th level and beyond

Barbarian as you seem to want it:
> Max STR->CON->DEX maybe, but hey whatever I can use Heavy Armor at no opportunity cost
> Get good damage
> Get great AC at the same time as the Fighter who can't do things you can

>>52500824
This. What are they good for anyway?

>>52500836
I know.
Hey guys I can shift into my fursona twice a day

>>52499190
>And your players will hate you for it.
Nothing more annoying than the Retard GM who sends 8 goblins after a party of 4, and moves everything, and then attacks with all 8 at the same time, while also using flanking rules.

All but garantueed to 1 shot at least 1 player. So much fucking fun.

At least it tells you to avoid the GM and find a better group.

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>be sipping ale in the tavern with your qt3.14 halfling gf when suddenly this crazy-eyed elf comes in and slaps her on the ass
>what do?

>>52499338
No.

True polymorph replaces your current character sheet with that of the creature you choose.

No more spellcasting unless the new form has it, no action surge, no feats, nothing.

>>52500803
Why is she working for the bad guys though? Is she in a debt that she needs to pay off or something? Did they just get to her first and she's extremely loyal?

Basically what's her motivation to work for the bad guys? I'd try to avoid "she likes money" because adventuring in general tends to be more profitable than anything. Even the bad guys in Indiana Jones (who I'm assuming your backstory is based off of) had aspirations beyond "we're gonna sell that shit for money." They wanted fame, to commune with gods, attain eternal life, etc.

Recently I had to explain to my party where I got my warlock powers from and I told them a half-truth, that the villains in the story were meddling in dangerous powers they didn't understand and one wrong slip from them could spell disaster if I didn't help put a stop to them. Really, my character and they people he works for sees them as rivals and that's why I want them dead.

>>52500917
Cast silence, then grapple.

What's the best class for having a spectral ghost buddy? Would it be Ancestor Barbarian? some kind of Warlock for the familiar?

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>>52500959

>>52500917
I tell the GM that it's clearly time for him to stop and let someone else GM if he's resorting to pathetic 4chan memes for ideas already.

There's no shame in being out of ideas or being a shitty GM, just in not admitting it.

>>52500959
Evil character with a remnant haunting you.

>>52500671
>Some classes are meant to be tanky, some are not. Etc.
And it's for this exact reason the barbarian doesn't get heavy armor proficiency or the ability to use its features while wearing heavy armor. Their ability to be tanks comes from high health and resistance to common damage types, not from high AC

The thing is, you can't just blow off the idea of 'maxing' stats as if it was no problem at all, because each stat is competing for limited resources. For the barbarian, the competing stats are Strength for damage, Constitution for health and unarmored defence, and Dexterity for defence. The two standard possibilities are medium armor or unarmored. Using the standard array and assuming a favourable choice of race, the character can start with +3 in two stats and +2 in another. The choices up to level 4 are thus
>STR+3, DEX+3, CON+2 unarmored with 15 AC, lower health, no armor progession, no magic armor, better skills
>STR+3, DEX+2, CON+3 unarmored with 15 AC, higher health, no armor progression or magic armor
>STR+2, DEX+3, CON+3 unarmored with 15 AC, higher health, no armor progression or magic armor, better skills, lower damage
>STR+3, DEX+2, CON+3 medium armor (assume chain, which is fairly available) with 15 AC, higher health, armor progression and magic armor available, cap on the utility of dex, possible stealth disadvantage
Every possibility requires at least some investment in Dexterity, and three are improved by further investment.

If the barbarian can just get heavy armor though (and, as mentioned previously, this requires at worst one feat and at best a single level dip in Fighter, one of the better dips)
>STR+3, CON+3 heavy armor (assume chain) with 16 AC, higher health, armor progression and magic armor available, stealth disadvantage, floating +2 and no requirement to invest in dex
Then you have an outright better way to play barbarian as a tank that requires no tradeoffs and leaves you free to assign your remaining +2 however you want.

>>52500917
Catch him in the face with my knee as he bends all the way down to reach halfling-height ass

Whenever my group has them, barbarians are usually better than any other martials, but we also tend to do the 4 minute D&D day, so using all of your shit, or getting exhausted from the subclass is a non issue.

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If the anon of this homebrew here is reading, I really want your update you said you were doing on the Runeweaver last time you posted it. This is the version I got, which is from quite a while back. But I really love the concept and I'm going to play this version with maybe a few of my own modifications in a weeks time. But I would prefer yours.

>>52501072
what's the 4-minute dnd day?

>>52500853
>twice a day
Do you not eat lunch or tend to wounds at all? You regain all charges of wild shape with short rests.

>>52501072
I haven't had a long rest on the whole campaign and I'm level 3.
>>52501116
Burst all your abilities and features on one encounter, then find a corner and go to sleep.
Same thing tomorrow.

>>52501072
>this is totally good, just don't play the game as it was intended, and break the rules.

>>52500942
extreme loyal. back story is she was just working as a scribe in a library at one of the few magical universities in the world because she has a really strong thirst for knowledge, power and a desire to be magical, though she has no ability at all. gradually she started to break into sealed off sections of the library, peoples offices, etc. just to get access to more information. eventually was noticed and approached by an extra-planar cult who are similarly obsessed with arcane knowledge, who offered her the chance to join them. so now she goes around collecting shit for them

perhaps based slightly on the indiana jones bad guys, though i cant really remember their motivation outside of wanting some crazy weapons to take over the world with

>>52501139
Hang on. Which rules are being broken?
I know he isn't having the standard amount of encounters, but isn't that a suggestion?

>>52501130
>making a playful joke
>gets a super serious autistic response

>>52501137
oh. that's fuckin dumb

>>52501170
You can't sleep for 8 hours after having been awake for 1.

Nobody works that way.

I sat down at a 5e livegame for the first time yesterday. I went with my new bf, who seems to be really into it. He said girls don't normally play with his group but it would be ok. As I sat down, I proudly proclaimed that I was FEMINIST AND PROUD and I wasn't going to put up with boys being gross at the table. My half elf bard named Gaga was quickly overrun by orcs.

>>52501173
>Post something incorrect.
>It was just a joke.

>>52501173
>make autistic joke.
>gets concerned response.
>>52501195
True, but isn't that more common sense than rules?

>>52500499

Yup. Mine are mostly variation of fey (gnomes, elves, firbolgs) whos sentence was bought by an Archfey

Made a *huge* deal at the start and onwards about how fey cannot directly lie, especially the more powerful they are, the more dire the consequences of breaking a bargain

Then once they took a deal to go take care of something the archfey couldn't take care of herself because of Archfey tier politics (Winter/Summer Court is really useful in that regard) they went and got that taken care.
But when one of the guys decided to backstab the archfey, I took him down two levels. The dickslapping worked for its intended purposes.

The trick is, to find a loophole to keep them continually on the hook for the first few adventures at first (a fuck up they did in the Archfey's careful wording and so on) that forces a group of anti social ass holes to keep cooperating together, and the logical progressive rewards and ownership on long term, so that when it's time to free them, there's an excuse or a stake that can keep the adventure going foward (they now control territory and gotta take out people who are trying to muscle into it, or something)

My players want to harvest dragon parts.

What can they do with any parts of a dragon?

Try and Make armor and weapons?

>>52501222
>True, but isn't that more common sense than rules
It is a rule.

DMG if I recall correctly.

>>52501244
I have this issue with all of the monsters I have. I usually allow it to be sold or if they have a crafter to go to or one in the party they could try and make something out of it.

>>52501244
They can make dragonbone wands which are magic. They can make dragonscale armor. Poison daggers out of its teeth, true seeing artifacts from its eyes, and if you fry and eat a dragon's testicle you grow 1d6+1 year younger.

>>52501219
April fools was yesterday.

>>52501170
>>52501222
PHB186: A character can't benefit from more than one long rest in a 24-hour period, and a character must have at least 1 hit point at the start of the rest to gain its benefits.

If you're long rests only last an hour by using the variant rules, then you could probably long rest every 3 hours or something silly.

>>52501273
Great, now I have to make a dragon hunter who only wants eternal youth via eating dragon balls.

I sleep 16 hours a day irl

How do you buff standard human when using the "Everyone gets a feat at level 1+no variant human" houserule?

Just give it a free skill proficiency?

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So I'm playing a 100% solo game (no party, just me and the GM) in a day that is thematically (but not practically, as in it's a different setting completely) based off of pic related, and I'm trying to decide what Class I want to be.
I know how to make effective characters of different classes just fine, but I'm kinda stuck on WHAT exactly I want to play.

>>52501283
Oh, nice.

>>52501250
A long rest isn't necessarily sleeping, is it? Adventurers can pause and take a rest whenever, it's up to the DM to decide whether they are in a safe area and keep them from resting if necessary.

>>52501351
A long rest is a period of extended downtime, at least 8 hours long, during which the character sleeps or performs light activity: reading, talking, eating, or standing watch for no more than 2 hours. If the rest is interrupted by a period of strenuous activity-- at least 1 hour of walking, fighting, casting spells, or similar adventuring activity-- the characters must begin the rest again to gain any benefits from it.

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>>52501309
Oh, that's easy.
Play a Devotion Oath Paladin worshipping some kind of solar deity, use a sword and shield and take the appropriate Feats to do so as you level up (assuming the game lasts that long).
Since you're a Paly you'll be pretty powerful, using sword and board will keep you decentl defended, and you'll be able to basically use a patische of Miracles to heal and buff yourself, plus you'll have a semi-decent fluff reason to go it alone all the time.

That said, not sure that D&D is the best way to capture Dark Souls mechanically, unless you just throw monsters WAY too powerful for the current PC level at them, and even then that's something if a crapshoot due to randomness of dice.

How does Watery Sphere even work? is the bottom of the sphere touching the water, or is it partially underground? If something walks into Watery Sphere's space right on the edge, does it just get vacuumed up even if its a halfling? Should I really be viewing this as "Watery Cube and Watery Hexagonical Cylinder?

>>52501351
A long rest is almost certainly going to include sleep; it's a fairly significant portion of the day you're spending doing nothing physically strenuous or difficult.

>>52501137
Your casters must be fucking miserable.

>>52501405
I'm almost out of bolts and my talent only does 1d6.
Also, out of HP.

>>52501244
>>52501265
>>52501273
Would you let players just harvest them? Or give them some sort of skill challenge?

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>>52501244
>Implying the answer isn't obvious

>>52501137
Why don't you just fuck off somewhere and go to sleep?

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I just had the dumbest fucking alignment discussion in my entire life

I started a new game today and one of my friends rolled a barbarian. he used to work as a mercenary until they sent him on a mission he wasn't willing to complete (assassinate a child) and now he's being hunted down by his former crew.

so after we hear the backstory just as an afterthought I ask "cool so what's your alignment?" expecting something anything from chaotic good to true neutral.

"lawful evil."

"really."

"yep."

"that kinda sounds like it doesn't fit the backstory, doesn't it?"

"no it totally does. I'm evil because I don't care much for other people's rules but I'm lawful because I have my own inner code I'm not willing to cross so I'm really a good guy"

"that's the exact opposite of lawful evil."

"no it isn't. I'm lawful evil. You know, like Conan."

I honestly thought he was fucking around. Me and another guy tried our hardest to convince him but in the end he pulled the "I've been playing this for 15 years" card which was true. so I just let it go.

so yep now we have a lawful evil barbarian who's too fucking stupid to realize he's chaotic good

>>52501400
How? I could sit on /tg/ and shitpost for 8 hours and that could be considered a long rest. No sleep necessary.

>>52501448
We are under siege.

>>52501483
Sounds legit to me.

>>52501273
Dragon parts are extremely heavy though

>>52501510

I wish to god I was making this up. It caught me off guard because I've been playing with this guy for months and he's a pretty decent no-bullshit player overall. I honestly don't know how he can be so oblivious when it comes to alignment

>>52501490
Fair point, though the precise example you're using wouldn't 100% work even though the basic idea is perfectly functional.

>>52501542
Yeah, but who cares about alignment?

It's mechanically pointless and purely there to help people adhere to their character. If this guy has a schema that he's going to follow and wants to call it Lawful Evil while you consider it Chaotic Good, then what's the problem?