Pathfinder General /pfg/

What's your favorite way to make a map? I'm getting ready to roll out my own campaign and I'm just bottlenecked on making a map that looks decent.

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Would you rule that breadcrumbs can be used as pocket sand?

>>52217765
Of course!

>>52217765

Breadcrumbs are too soft and chunky to be good pocket sand, you need something fine and abrasive.

The ideal pocket sand is glass powder.

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>>52217732
>Potato Soup breadbowl
Dang that does sound good right now.

Anywhoodle, Reposting this into this thread.

Here is my attempt at an Unchained Armorist for SoP, because the original kinda sucks.
>https://docs.google.com/document/d/1NyV2ScbDMk7WHwLQt8z8MVfBQfBsiVa3pykH_tcTGMY/edit?usp=sharing

Once again, ANY and ALL critique, criticism, and commentary is appreciated, as well as any other cool ideas that you think would be neato for the new Armorist to have.

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>>52217765

You'd need an awful lot of breadcrumbs, anon-I'm not sure you could handle that much bread.

>>52217765
>>52217792
Russian black bread, set over a kiln and macerated roughly should be pretty ideal pocket sand.

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>>52217751
Fantasynamegenerators has a decent map generator tool. Open up GIMP and do some themeparking.

>>52217792
What about panko breading?

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>>52217820

Did anyone save a copy of the Legendary Kineticists 2 playtest? The book isn't in the trove yet unfortunately and I was a dummy and didn't do it myself.

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>>52217944
Got you, anon.

>>52217732
Do Dhampir have functional taste buds with which to taste fresh bread?

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>Warning: Weapons Grade Autism

What if we made some sort of level-independent metric for dpr? I've seen just the numbers of various builds, but numbers are hard to intrinsically grasp. "Rounds to kill an equal CR monster" is alright, but doesn't quite grasp the reliability and randomness that can accompany that number. Basically, I want to see some sort of "Probability to one-shot an equal CR" with optional "two shot" statistic as well. Eventually forming a large enough sample that we could get a z-score like number to say how autistic we all are.

How about it, /pfg/?

>>52218068
Of course, after all a slice of piping hot sourdough is the perfect pairing with a nice glass of Ulfen red.

>>52218068
I'd say it depends on the bloodline, though my gut instict is that, while they do they are either slightly muted, or over active in that the like to revel in the sensation of tasting any new thing

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>>52218104
3pp Bread Bloodline.
Alternative skill modifier: Craft (baking)
Alternative spell-like ability: Conjure food (usable 3 times per day)

So I don't come here often, but I'm looking for some advice to try and make something that doesn't suck.

Right now the basic idea of the concept is a natural attack using skinwalker (Probably witchwolf) to hit fast and hard. However, I'm not exactly sure how to make this build work out without lagging behind a lot of other things in most games, let alone be impressive at hurting things. I'd prefer to avoid initiating, but most big name third party should be fine.

So far, ideas have been things like a ridiculous psion using metamorphosis and share pain.

I've also considered some options such as barbarian, or ranger with the natural weapon combat style, but 'm afraid that my 2 claws (And extra bite, if I spend a feat on an extra transformation feature) just wouldn't hold up. Is there any good way I could keep this idea from sinking?

>>52218133
Anon, that idea sound very crumby

>>52218195
Lunar mystery Oracle is good for this. Take the Gift of Claw and Horn revelation for more nat attacks and nail people with crazy full attacks all the time

>>52218195
Firstly, consider being a Ragebred instead of a Witchwolf; you get Gore and Hooves as your natural attacks, which are MUCH rarer and thus can be applied alongside the commonly-gained claws and bite.
Secondly, try out a Beastmorph Vivisectionist Alchemist; you'll have a good amount of skills, plenty of utility with your formula choices, your damage will be high thanks to having a ton of sneak attack dice, and you get Claws and a Bite to work alongside your other attacks.

>>52218195
If your GM allows Spheres of Power, the Mageknight (Resizer) or Shifter classes might be up your alley.

>>52218195
Beastmorph Alchemist.

>>52218195
Double claws works with boar style, i think.

>>52218195
Have you considered that UC Monk archetype from the Alteration sphere handbook? Afterall, I think there are Monk options that allow you to do flurry and use your abilities with natural weapons
Also, NatAtk Barbarian still isn't a bad idea either, or you could even go for a Bloodrager if you want to as well.

>>52218195
Ragebred skinwalker is a great way to stack up a lot of natural attacks and make them work for you. With a couple traits and feats, you can be rocking 2 claws, a bite, a gore, and maybe a little extra.

>>52218075
http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/bestiary/monsterCreation.html

That's got all you really need to turn DPR/attack numbers into effective CR to beat.

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For anyone wishing for some arabian adventures, there's still plenty of time to get your apps in for Legacy of Blood and Flame.

https://app.roll20.net/lfg/listing/67321/legacy-of-blood-and-flame

>>52218247
>>52218229
Ragebred could work, I was definitely hoping to go wolf for the flavor, but if I desperately need more attacks, it could work.

>>52218235
>>52218229
Beastmorph looks okay, but as I understand it, it takes on qualities as per the beast shape spell, my goal was to stay humanoid, and preferably to have attacks that didn't run ona limited duration per day.

>>52218231
>>52218245
These options could work, I'm not the msot up to date on spheres. Shifter seems like a good option, almost the only one that has good permanent attack options. The monk archetype is neat, I'd prefer for it to be available somewhere other than a playtest. My biggest concern is running out of juice, which was why I thought about going skinwalker.

Let's imagine I did change my flavor and went with ragebred, what feats/traits were mentioned for getting permanent claws/bite?

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>>52218211

>>52218397
Do the deeds gained from Swashbuckler VMC function using your character level as your Swashbuckler level?

>>52218410
>The monk archetype is neat, I'd prefer for it to be available somewhere other than a playtest.
The books been published for a while now anon

So how classically spooky is the Gingerbread witch?

>>52218480
That's what I get for not following things. That's definitely a doable set of options. thanks. I suppose that just leaves a 1PP build, or the egoist to think about in case somehow, spheres is out and/or psionics is in. (Not building this for a current game, but as an idea to be ready when a game comes along that catches my interest)

>>52218471
Interesting point. I'm going to say character level - 2, since precise strike is on the table and I would still like there to be a reason for someone to take Gunslinger or Swashbuckler as their main class if they so desire.

>>52218565
>Taking swashbuckler
>With PoW allowed

Oh I'm laffin

>>52218591
Checking it now, and there are only two initiators out of about a dozen apps.

I'm guessing that anybody who actually has your attitude got scared off by the lower, non-gestalt power level.

>>52218591
>There's already a Virtuous Bravo and a Mouser

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What 1PP options exist for maximizing Disarm? My GM has banned PoW saying it's too OP, so Fool's Errand is no go.

>>52218612
To be perfectly honest? If NOBODY that gets in actually has it that sounds perfect. The problems come when it's mixed in with normal "martial" types, because it will blaze past them at sanic speeds unless it shits itself in the foot to handicap itself.

>>52218007
Thanks famalam

>>52218645
So what does one do if you want to not invalidate other martials, and not just "5ft step/charge and full attack"

>>52218629

That lady has too many chromosomes.

>>52218742
I wonder how many bonus feats it'd take to bring swashbuckler up to par with stalker.

>>52218748
>lady
I love this meme.

>>52218742
Find a role that the other martials haven't filled, and work with them so you complement each other. Build yourself to a particular set of combat maneuvers that someone else hasn't focused on, for example.

>>52218742
I guess you could go for battlefield control, but unless you actively build to avoid dealing damage, you're at bare minimum going to have the same damage as a full attacking swashbuckler just sitting in your pocket.

>>52218773
>>52218779
I'm not the swash anon or anyone with an app or anything, just a nigga looking to have fun as a martial guy without shitting on his friends.

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>>52218397
Roughly how many genies will be encountered?

>>52218767

She's a lady, wooah wooah wooh!

>>52218814

Source?

>>52218814
More than a handful.
Frequency will start low and then ramp up.

>>52218811
If you're PoW and someone is playing a normal martial? With great difficulty. The martial guy likely only has full attacks, while you have an entire toolbox of shit PLUS full attacks

>NPCs - Don't Post
>first post is Lost: Sad Girl, Last Seen: In Dark Souls

>>52218814
WELL I GUESS I'M MASTURBATING TODAY.

>>52218839
Homare.

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>>52218858
And you felt the need to share this with the class because?

>>52218856

CAT STOLE MY BACKSTORY

HOW DID AN NPC STEAL MY BACKSTORY.

>>52218877
My apologies my penis has tourettes. I won't do it again.

>>52218853
What about non-pow, but still fun, options?

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>>52218899
And why didn't the GM use the version with a transparent background? For shame GM. For shame.

>>52218899
She's unnervingly close but not too close to my backstory too, because much like in my backstory people die and some things are sad.

>>52218926
It probably won't be nearly as egregious as PoW vs Non-PoW, so go for it.

Wait, does this mean Bonfire Blades are a thing in Puella Labia Dentata?

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So, what if I ran a lewd game, but each PC was required to be a worshipper/follower of Folca?

>>52218974
I meant what are my non-pow, still fun options?

God, I am bad at saying what I mean.

So obviously PoW tried to balance themselves with the introduction of archetypes for classes that weren't originally PoW, but if balance is really an issue why not just give every class access to one school of disciplines that fits that class's "style" (so for instance Golden Lion for Paladins), then if they want access to more than one they can just take the archetype that gives them more?

>>52219040
I'd assume you were a troll and tell you to fuck off.

>>52219040

Hello FBI

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>>52218997

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>>52218997
If so, then that means there could also be BONFIRE MIMICS!

>>52219044

Barbarian can keep up with PoW if you do chained and the usual leap/pounce/superstitious/CAGM madness

>>52219044
I mean, that depends on what you want, man. A lot of the time "being a martial" boils down to "point self at thing and hit it until it dies", because that is usually all you're allowed to be good at. Fighters can, with some shenanigans, get access to a variety of spells thanks to Advanced Armor/Weapon Training, but I'm no expert on that.

>>52219040

That's a waste of a lewd game, if you want my personal opinion (which I know you do) I'd suggest a game set in Hermea, where we play high-PB, high-level badasses who retired to the island to breed and journey north to Azlant and tango with the Spire Elves.

And to make things even more interesting? The breeding pairs are chosen by popular shipping committee in the thread.

>>52219095
So what 3pp can I use to be good at hitting things until they die and also a few tactical options like spells, and out of combat stuff like skills?

>>52219137

Warlord is great, since you can get all the social skills going.

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>>52219137
You sound like you want to play a half casting gish, not a martial, my dude. Though, have you looked into the Vigilante at all? Especially Jolly's books? Legendary Vigilantes and Legendary Villains: Vigilantes?

>>52219162
>guy asks how to be not PoW and still have cool things
>suggest PoW to him

G E N I U S

>>52217732
I once smuggled in a potion of invisibility by pouring it on a sponge cake.

It was a stupid plan, the breaded potion worked, but it was still such a stupid plan.

Fuck you, Steve.

Is review anon gonna cover LoBaF?

>>52219100
You almost had it, and then you lost it.

Seriously, /pfg/ is TERRIBLE at shipping. Leaving pairs up to the thread basically ends in three things: idiotically ill-fitting ships in the hope that someone gets killed, one character getting forced (usually by their player) as the world's greatest stud, and some assholes pulling for ships to break up or get invalidated just because their NTR fetish has consumed their entire lives.

>>52219175
The sponge cake didn't turn invisible?

>>52219173
I have looked at some of the vigilante stuff and am aware of some of jolly's stuff as well. Was there ever a non-vancian warlock-y option?

>>52219175
On a scale of crumby, half-baked plans, I have to put the "exterminate the vampire cult with holy watered wafers" the dumbest idea I've heard.

>>52219193
One would hope so.
I'll probably start offering reviews fairly soon, myself.

>>52219193
ReviewAnon (original edition, no namefagging) is on the case.

Going to be a day, though.

>>52219204
nah, but there was absolutely no use to put it on a cake. We were to give a political prisoner his last meal, then bust him out later. Frankly, we could have just served the potion with his cake. There was absolutely no need to pour it on a perfectly good cake.

I rolled a nat 20 making that perfectly good cake!

>>52219211
Someone made a sphere version, though it doesn't quite play nice with Jolly's iteration. Don't have it handy unfortunately.

>>52219213
>tfw want to apply, but realize I would probably not have time to play
>applying with the cat would probably create endless shitposting anyway
It was fun to think about at least

>>52219245
Like an actual cat a la Dragon 2?

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>>52219212
>crumby, half-baked plans

I see what you did there.

>>52219231
Did you have Craft(Baker) or Profession(Baker)? This is important.

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>>52219245

RIP IN PISS MEMEC@

>>52219213

Do it! Working with your DM to help make your character better fit a setting is one of the best parts of character creation!

>>52219254
>c@posting
Am I in /xivg/?

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>>52219250
Yes.

>>52219276
Might as fucking well be.

>>52219299
Can we start saying "remove c@s"?

Do we have an issue with au ra too?

>>52219290
DAMN CRUEL FATES IN DENYING US THIS MEETING, THAT WE MAY NEVER KNOW THE CAT FOR CURSE OF SCHEDULES AND TIMING.

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>>52219310
Remove dogs too

>>52219321
Foxposting > Catposting >>>>>>>>>>> Dogposting

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Homebrewing some insanity mechanics. How can I flesh out the list a bit more?

>>52219213
>>52219275

I also want to see you shit on people for not reading the OP.

>>52219321
Dogs aren't in ffxiv though. Are they in Pathfinder?

>>52219310
REMOVE AWOO

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>>52219327
All weeb-shit is shit, but not all weeb-shit is equal.

POST COWBOYS

>>52219335
Yeah, witchwolf skinwalkers are.

>>52219327
Horseposting, cowposting, buffaloposting, ratposting, snekposting

>>52219213
I kind of dislike the idea of DM reviews, I suppose it does help the DM get better characters in their campaign and it's prooobably a good thing to do, but it kind of feels unfair to think that some players might end up with better or worse personal material to work with.

>>52219328
why

Jolly, if you're here, have you done or will you do content for magus? Vigilante seems really nice with your stuff now, and I wish that it was better.

>>52219312
I'm sorry I've failed you, anon. It's unfortunate that I realized my schedule was fucked before I actually tried to figure out how to work out all the details, because I had a general outline set.

who dis

>>52219137
SoM stuff might work, but it's still playtest
Old DDS Wardancer and Vauntguard also have options

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>>52219332
No need. I've just made a post clarifying the desired format in the application thread, and anyone who ignores it has only themselves to blame.

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>>52219370
A man who likes cats but doesn't like cat girls.

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>>52219360
Lovecraft

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/pfg/ I need advice

Whats are some good torture methods that won't leave physical wounds?

>>52219400
Water boarding and similar?

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>>52219400

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>>52219400

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>>52219391
Well, to be fair, I would likely have to stick to a humanoid form most of the time for sake of mechanics. Being a tiny, non-humanoid creature only gets you so far in life.

>you will never get to play an intelligent cat trapped in human form
just fuck my shit up senpai

>>52219400
There's all manner of wonderful emotional tortures just waiting for you to discover them!

>>52219400
Any form of torture followed by a good Cure or Regeneration spell

>>52219353
>>52219327
I suppose we'll see where genieposting falls on that scale.

>>52219425
>>52219412
>>52219421
>Guantanamind

>>52219412
>>52219421
>>52219425
I know that the FBI and CIA monitor 4chan for potential threats, but I didn't imagine they'd actually participate in thread discussions

>>52219437
Genie fetishbait is legit

>>52219362
Jolly is working on a Spheres of Might archetype for the Magus.

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>>52219353
>buffaloposting

More reminders that I need to work on my setting. Thanks anons.

>>52219488
But will it fix the lackluster SoP magus?

>>52219501
>fixing sphere magus

but anon, what you want is clearly Mageknight! Kill me and anyone who seriously thinks this is true. : ^)

>>52219516
You retard, it's OBVIOUSLY an Iron Mage Hedgewitch with the Combat Tradition on the other side that is better than the Magus!

Alright guys, gals, and intermediates,

I've got time to review 1 app tonight, so who's it going to be?

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>>52219531
NOW YOU'VE DONE IT

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>>52219516

So I noticed that all the prestige classes in PoW get to exchange a maneuver at 2nd, 5th, and 8th level. Meanwhile in PoW:E, none of the prestige classes get this. Is that intentional, and if so why?

>>52219516
What I want is a high skills (Social or knowledge), lightly armored, melee class with quick magic buffing, access to more tactically influential options x/day (like spells, but not vancian) and keeps up with most martials provided resources allow. Inquisitor, Bard, Magus, and Warpriest, to a lesser extent, are all close outside of the vancian thing. And their SoP conversions are just kinda meh. Especially the Magus.

I guess it's just >>52219531 for me now.

>>52219584
I know anon, I want something similar, but people go full retard whenever I say "I wish sphere magus wasn't shit"

>>52219546
roll for it

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>>52219461
To be fair, it's a fairly well known and publicized form if torture that is really simple to get together.

Personally, I prefer the more subtler, time intensive, and Pavlovian methods, like locking someone in a windowless monocolor room (beige is a good choice), feeding them the same meal day after day. With each day the only sound tonne heard is the sound of a nail scraping against wood on the other side of the walls, on and off in alternating patterns of every 3,5, and 6 hours.

After a month of this, I will introduce something new to the room, like a wi Dow that wasn't there, a flower growing out of a crack, or perhaps fortune cookies with the food. Also the scratching noise will stop.
This will go one for around 2 weeks. After which, and after the victim has regained some comfort and sanity, then I'll act. I'll remove and destroy the thing I. Front of him, or in the case of a window I'll show it was an illusion all along. I will violently wrench theirbhope away.

And then, while they are left on the ground d sobbing at the senselessness of it all, that's when the scratching will come back.

Thoughts?

>>52219594
>hurr durr, let's make the sphere magus use SP for it's arcane pool
>But let's give Combat tradition hedgewitch an arcane pool anyways.

>>52219594
Funnily enough

if you convert the Spiritualist to Spheres (which is easy enough, just drop spellcasting, add spherecasting, and say the phantom can deliver sphere abilities with a touch attack) then the Phantom Blade is a better MAgus than the Magus

>>52219609
I think the Magus bit was them realizing that what they did with the tradition was retarded

>>52219572
PoW:E changed the wording of all the base classes so they get to change a maneuver every even initiator level from 4 onwards.

As PrCs advance initiator level, you get the swaps automatically as a feature of the base class.

>>52219599
Seek therapy

Waiting is hell.

>>52219609
>>52219615
Arcane Pool being combined wouldn't be so bad, but they forgot a crucial detail: They didn't make anything that used Arcane Pool actually comparable to Sphere spells, despite often costing WAY MORE THAN SPHERE SPELLS FOR WORSE EFFECTS.

What should I gestalt with Eldritch Scion Magus?

Paladin for Smite/Spellstrike combo
or
Bard for more utility/support/crowdcontrol?

>>52219659
Paladin

or Bloodrager :^)

>>52219645
Mostly this, Arcane Pool is used for a lot weaker effects, and while managing two pools is hella retarded, it's better than making a lot of class options pull from the same resource as your spells. And then there's the whole issue of sphere magus being a 2-3 level dip.

>>52219620
Oh cool. That seems a lot less clunky. Thanks for the explanation.

>>52219659
Using your gestalt to take a single level dip in as many classes as possible.

>>52219546
Review the first Romance of the Righteous Kingdoms app!

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>>52219631

There's plenty of ways to pass the time, anon.

>>52219662
Eldritch Scion is already bloodrager-lite.

>>52219679
I know :^)

>>52219678
Passing the time isn't the problem, being unsure of the end result is the problem.

>>52219686

And if you won't know the end result for a while, you might as well find some way to pass the time, right?

>>52219686
Personally it's passing the time that's the problem for me. Assuming we're talking about game apps, I've never felt bad about being turned down but while I'm waiting I can't help but go back and forth on my character trying to change things. I stop caring about them the moment time's up.

>>52219623
Hey, it could've been worse, I could've instead of feeding them the same thing I could've alternated between drinks of normal orange juice, and orange juice in a toothpaste lined glass

Anyway for the food, alternate between hardtack+dried meat and, once every few days, kimchi+durian+lutefisk.

>>52219678
Off-topic, but man, it's really annoying that Microsoft Edge doesn't have support for .webms yet. It's ticking me right off.

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>check old mythweaver sheets for apps of old games
>everything's gone

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>>52219645
>>52219665
As someone playing spheres-adapted Magus archetypes that replace the thing that grants extra pool points, this is especially cancerous because I don't even get the compensation for losing my arcane pool, but I still have the MASSIVE DRAIN if I want even my most basic fucking function of weapon enhancement. To the point I would be gladly willing to pay two arcana to make it 10 minutes/level just so I could save spell points.

My only compensation is the fact that I am gestalted with an initiator, and therefore am less likely to need to actually spend points for shit.

>>52219723
Do you feel the call of the dip, my dude?

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Have you ever played a character who was a parent? How old was their child or children?

I am maybe thinking about making a character for LoBaF who is an elf with an adult child

>>52219736
NO FUCK OFF, I MADE THIS BED AND I WILL DAMN WELL LIE IN IT.

>>52219743

Please make said adult child an unrepentant shitter.

The more annoying and lame, the better.

>>52219743
>This character gets in
>Amalthea gets in
!!

>>52219757
Why?

I was thinking of them being the boring responsible one and treating the PC disapprovingly for being an itinerant adventurer

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>>52219743
He's a sailor. He's been with a few barmaids. There's a couple kids floating around that he figures he has but doesn't know about

>>52219743
Make the kid a NEET who needs her mom to find her a good husband.
Of course, she'll need to test their "husbandly potential" personally to ensure that they're up to snuff...

>>52219763

Isn't it a bit cringey to see the same character being shilled for EVERY SINGLE GAME?

>>52219774
>EVERY SINGLE GAME
As far as I can tell it's just RotJR, Legacy of Fire, and the Ruse Cruise. Did she get posted in any other games?

>>52219723
just be a non sphere magus

>>52219546
Hell's Vengeance Apps! HELL'S VENGEANCE APPS!
I'm not even in Hell's Vengeance, it just looks like a ton of actual fun.

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UC Armorist guy here.

How would y'all feel if I tried my hand at Unchaining the Sphere Magus

>>52219771
>Mother turning 300 this decade and she still dresses like a human bard
>Father could be any number of long forgotten party members
At least the kid's full elf, right?

>>52219792
You mean Rebels?

>>52219763
>entire party ends up moms

>>52219743
>Have you ever played a character who was a parent? How old was their child or children?

I played an alchemist.
Aloof and distant I was to everything but my research with no time for petty social interactions or the opposite sex. I had created her in a laboratory with my own flesh and blood and still remember the joy I held in my heart the first time I held her in my arms, not the joy of scientific achievement, but the joy of parenthood. I legally adopted my homunculus and taught her everything I know.

>>52219791
The issue is I fucking hate Vancian casting. Spheres at least lets me pretend I'm making actual choices for spell selection, it's just the chassis of the class itself didn't get anything to go with that fix.

>>52219834
>Most of them don't start as one

>>52219809
Either that or half-elf.

Or for maximum confusion, half-elf and tiefling siblings.

Anybody have a link to Magitech archetypes? I wanted to check it out but didn't see it in the trove anywhere.

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>>52219837
Eyyyyy, this guy knows what's up.

The real way to do it is to have tried and failed to have a "real family", and fall back to alchemy to fill in the void.

>>52219821
Yeah, I meant Rebels, REBELS! Review... either the Doggo, the Bitchsinger, or the Sailor!

>>52219841
What if you ask the GM to just give the magus its arcane pool back

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>>52219834
>no dads

>>52219857
Here you go senpai
https://mega.nz/#F!sBNSUC7A!b7715VoelTmvubC_s3kiBQ

>>52219859

And then you make simulacrums of the crazy musclegirl who ditched you, but this time, she's in the form of a cute, shy meido

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Why can't I just be a good red mage, /pfg/? Why is it so hard?

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>>52219874
... Well, it's a little late for that now, but that would have been much simpler.

>>52219887
Have you tried Eldritch Scoundrel/Hidden Blade Rogue, anon?

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>>52219837
>>52219859
I want to make my own doll daughteru

>>52219834
Gamze isn't a mom!

>>52219887
Because Paizuri hates you.
That being said, Warpriest, Occultist, or Witch/Martial/Eldritch Knight may be your best bet

>>52219887
Magus is a Red Mage analogue.
If you want to dual cast, it can legit be done with metamagic and two traits.

>>52219904
Too bad you can't make a good archetype to go with her! Haha-HA! It kills me to look at it, but I love it still.

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>>52219905
Yet.

>>52219893
I've looked into it, but I also hate vancian like >>52219841 does. Also I'd rather it be high social skills more than high knowledges but I'd settle.

>>52219910
I think I'm meaning more of a melee + light offensive magic + buff/debuff rather than Black and White magic, since efficient and fun healing in pathfinder is impossible.

>>52219914
Have you not read the thread? Magus is shit design. It's only saving grace in 1pp is that devs won't touch Dervish Dance, and it's 3pp options are ass.

>>52219922
but who would be the father?

>>52219922
I better take Craft (Clothing) and Profession (Baker), then.

>>52219933
I'm sure if your DM allows spheres, you can convert it to using Spheres of Power, and there are feats and traits that let you use INT instead of Charisma for a lot of skills.

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>>52219934
If there isn't an analogue I'm sure one will apply, and if no one applies then I'm sure there'll be some handsome merchant's son.

>>52219501
Top priority is that the SoP and SoM archetypes are fully compatible with each other, and combining the two will be way better than taking only SoP Magus. That said I'm going to push for either a rework of SoP Magus or a harmonized SoP/SoM archetype in the Gish Book.

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>>52219887
Adorable art anon. Currently playing a Final Fantasy homebrew and that will do nicely.

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Anyways

Folks, I have slaved away to bring you the Mageknight Guide that was requested! Tomorrow, I will bring you the Armorist guide!

https://sites.google.com/site/bloodymountainpath/writing-stuff/sop-class-guides/mageknight

>>52219933
>I think I'm meaning more of a melee + light offensive magic + buff/debuff rather than Black and White magic, since efficient and fun healing in pathfinder is impossible
Oh, then you want a Symbiat focused on either Enhancement or War (for buff/debuff), and maybe a minor dip into something else, like a quick dip into Destruction and grab the destructive weapon support things

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>>52219950
>Ignores the discussion on why spheres magus is terrible

>>52219975
Now copy-paste stuff from your setting doc into the appropriate pages in that google site, you dingus. It won't take very long at all and will help you have it filled out much more nicely.

>>52219971
Hail Sithis

>>52219976
What /does/ the symbiat do in a nutshell?

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>>52219796
I got no responses. Should I take that as a "Don't do it you absolute madman!" Or a "just do it faget!"

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>>52219904
you got it wrong, anon
doll is for lewd

>>52219796
>>52220047
Many have made claims, but none have succeeded. Dare you be the first to prevail where others have fallen short?

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>>52219988
EVENTUALLY, anon. the fire of my penis burns, not with syphilis, not with arousal, but with the VIGOROUS DESIRE TO WRITE GUIDES to SOP CLASSES, because holy fuck they've existed for THIS LONG and have gone without?

>>52219984

Honestly I never liked the Magus, I was just offering a suggestion.

>>52220008
They're a sort of hybrid of the Monk, Bard, and Rogue. They get INT-to-AC, a lot of abilities focused on buffing allies (with arounds per day duration like Baric Performance), and they have a focus on the Mind and TK spheres.

>>52219976
The thing I like about the Magus is the action economy improvement for casting + full attack and the "touch spell delivered through weapon" since they give both a red mage dual cast feel and the mystic knight spellblade feel. Unfortunately, those are the only thing the class has going for it in SoP, and they're both gained really early. Without the penalty to multiclassing that SoP gives, Magus ends up as a 2 level dip, with maybe a third for an arcana, or Blackblade if that even worked, which it doesn't.

Sphere Magus 2, Font of Inspiration + Combat tradition Hedgewitch seems better and better, if not for the odd progression of the two arcane pool abilities.

Thinking of changing my Virtuous Bravo to some kind of Swashbuckler so I can escape Lawful Good. Any advice on shoring up my will save? Fearlessness is the main reason I went bravo.

>>52220066
First, why do you need to "escape" LG? Is your GM a shit?
Second, get the Irrepressible trait if you feel worried about Will, it covers some of the most common effects you'll need to worry about.

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>>52219743
Yes.

Many children. All of them so close and dear.

>>52220066
I know its not what you asked but, you could prestige into Chevalier for fear immunity, still requires you to be good though. Otherwise there's the Ghost Rider archetype for Cavalier which is full of spooks and also has spook immunity.

>>52220066
Free VMC fighters gets you Bravery, so there's 1 Will right there :^)

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>>52220054
I will try, or go down in a blaze of glory
And then subsequently revive as a revenant, because I got stuff to do

>>52220085
Ok. Well that's not creepy af or anything. Thanks for the nightmare fuel, anon.

>>52220083
It's for my Legacy app and I'm just bad at playing lawful. I'm more concerned about fear effects than compulsion effects because I want to go full rope swinging swashbuckler.

>>52220116
Charmed life already mostly covers it.

>>52220066
>tfw you picked lawful good even though you're not even a paladin

I'm sorry, why don't you want to be best alignment?

>>52220112
>DM will never let me roleplay as 8BT Black Mage

>>52220144
>tfw picked lawful good and therefore decided to be a paladin
right with you, screw that guy and his disregard for the law

>>52220116
Believe me, compulsions and charms are far more dangerous. Fear just imposes a debuff, and at worst it makes you run away, which might save your life.

Compulsions and charms won't just get you killed, they could start off a chain that gets your whole party killed.

>>52220144
I have a fixation on fire and high places!

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Anybody know if we are gonna see a Firearms Sphere in SoM?

>>52220166
Being a lighthouse keeper is an honorable profession.

It represents the authority of a king and the decency of community, and protects men of the sea from harm.

Shitty gestalt idea- Blaster Armorist // Stalker with Sniper's Tools and a focus on Tempest Gale and Solar Wind.

Could it work, anons? Could I go Hawkguard Warder and BECOME THE TURRET?

>>52220183
There is no firearms-specific sphere, but a bunch of spheres work really well with firearms - including Dual Wielding. (Design philosophy is that spheres should be as weapon-agnostic as possible.)

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>>52220223
And if I want to go long-gun?

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Maice's player here.

I just wanted to thank the anon who reviewed my character sheet earlier (if you aren't secretly the GM). A bit of talking about mechanics and design gave me some ideas on how to improve her backstory and integrate a tome encounter, while picking a class more suited to the campaign.

So she's now a Tyrant Antipaladin, building towards a mix of Overrun/Bull Rush and Mounted Charges.

I do want to respond to some things that were said, w/r/t her backstory though.

I intentionally didn't give her dead parents or relatives because I kind of wanted to explore the idea of a girl who wasn't a monster because of trauma- but seemed to become a bad person in response to a perfectly good childhood, and only became shittier. I did give her a little loss in her backstory in the shape of her BFF, whom she promptly iced without a second thought because the world is ugly and what she wants is the power to clean the slate, of course.

All that Maice wants is some skinship-type relationships with cute girls and eventually a long-term relationship with someone who appreciates her for her personality, not her looks, status or violence.

So I realized as a fighter I wanted a familiar for initiative in Legacy of Fire, but I didn't really want Eldritch Guardian stuff.

I game to the conclusion of VMC wizard grabbing Divination. This gets me the feat and more initiative.

Which means +1/2 my level to initiative starting at level 7.

So at level 7 I'll be looking at:
>24 dex (+7)
>Improved Initiative (+4)
>Hare Familiar (+4)
>Heart of Wild Fire (+4)
>Reactionary (+2) actually first the character
>Dusty Rose Ioun Stone (+1)
>Divination School Power (+3)
>Dueling Sword (+4)
Total: +29

What else should I look out for? Honestly I might just stop bothering at 29 because I doubt anything will beat me at that point.

>>52220253
I hope a genie curses you to be the best at blowjobs.

>>52220239

>lesbian

Of course.

>>52220239
NO CUTE GIRLS. ONLY MONSTER DICK.

>>52220253
Initiative is worthless if you and the party is caught flatfooted and unaware.

At least 10 initiative + some darkvision, magical perception, scrying, etc. is better.
Not only can you act ahead, you can even plan ahead.

>>52220253
Is that you, DHB?

>>52220272
He'll take the Divination school that lets you always act in a surprise round.

Where can I buy SoM?

>>52220239
>personality
>when she's on the wrong side of the Hot/Crazy chart

>>52220253
Swap Hare Familiar for Ioun Wyrd.
Blindsense is more valuable later on for when you need to know if some rogue intends to sneak attack you.

>>52220272
Once I hit level 7 I always act in surprise rounds because of Divination via Forewarned. So I don't really have to worry about being caught unaware.

>>52220265
I mean, it's not like I'd have to give anyone blowjobs.

>>52220237
I believe there is going to be a "sniper" sphere, to represent the long ranged combatants that like to keep distance. Like there is going to be a "barrage" sphere for unloading everything you got.

>>52220292
In the future

>>52220304
Nice. Can't wait.

>>52220301
By the point that becomes an issue simply having See Invisibility goggles will be on the table, but blind sense is still important. Hm.

I do like Ioun Wyrd but they fit the character far less than either a Greensting Scorpion or a Hare. I'm looking for mostly desert fauna.

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>>52220266
Skinship is totally normal for girls! Haven't you ever seen girls hugging or cuddling while still being friends?

You watch too much anime.

She's actually straight though.

>>52219975
>The wording should say Swift Action and not Immediate Action, otherwise this would be a lot less useful.
This is so awkwardly worded that I don't know if you're arguing it should be nerfed to Swift or what.

>>52220303
He does if he wants to be king.
http://oglaf.com/simon/

>>52220304
It was there in the very first SoM playtest, it gave its own version of Vital Strike that stacked with the feat as its base ability.

>>52220303
http://oglaf.com/gifted/

YOU'RE THE BEST... YOU'RE THE BEST... you're the best... y o u ' r e t h e b e s t...

>>52220348
>>52219975
I think GuideAnon is under the assumption that Immediates can only be used off-turn.

Which is false.

>>52220469
What. Have I been playing wrong this entire time? Don't immediates just consume your next turn's swift?

Another question for everyone. I'm coming up for an eventual final list of enchantments for my character's sword for Legacy of Fire. I spent two traits, Heirloom Weapon and Reclaiming Your Roots on it, and plan on taking an AWT to be able to make magical weapons so my character can improve it themselves.

I was struggling between Ash Wand and Red Summer, several people liked Red Summer but I realized Ash Wand fits thematically with my character. It's a Dueling Sword.

Right now the main ones on my list are:
>Dueling
>Flaming Burst
>Keen

The sword is supposed to be theme'd around both dueling one on one combat and fire. Anyone have any thoughts on that I should grab besides these? I have considered switching out Flaming Burst for Igniting and possibly grabbing Countering as it fits the dueling theme. By the end I'm planning on having an extremely expensive sword.

>>52220492
They consume your next turn's swift IF USED OUTSIDE OF YOUR TURN. Otherwise they're just the same as swift actions, except you can use them in response to things. Like crits.

>>52220503
Oh sorry, I misread the first post as "can't be used off-turn" because I'm stupid.

How good is the slumber hex for a bladebound hexcrafter magus? I'm about to hit level 6 and want to figure my first arcana choice out (I picked flight as my level 4 hex).

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>>52220501
Hold on a second.

One thing that EVERYONE applying should know. Fire will not be the best choice for your favorite energy type. It's nice and thematic, yes, very evocative, but...I'm just gonna say, keep a backup plan in mind.

>>52220525
pretty good.

>>52220548
What are other good ones to take under the circumstances I mentioned? Am I missing out on any obvious picks first?

>>52220545
I'm not planning on the flaming burst being essential to the overall build, so it shouldn't be a huge problem. Really it's just a little extra damage when it does apply.

>>52220545
We'll be dealing with multiple kinda of Genie in the adventure right? Or is it mainly Efreeti?

>>52220557
Aura of Purity is my usual 2nd pick for a Hex Crafter.

>>52220545
Fire continues to be the lamest element in PnP. Not because it isn't AWESOME but because everything resists it.

>>52220545
>>52220672
>Elemental Flux

>>52220672
fine by me. electricity master race.

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>>52220237
Barrage and Sniping are both good for long arms. But you know what's better? Dual Wielding two-handed firearms as light weapons while being able to reload without a prehensile tail and ignoring the penalties for firing a two-handed firearm one-handed.

>>52220795
I'd rather have my players invent magazines than have them doing free action reloading

>>52220880

What's wrong with free action reloading? There is a lot of times when 'A magazine' wouldn't really be appropriate.

>>52220895
Less immersion breaking

>>52219659
Something functional so that at least half of your character is an actual working class

>>52220929
>Fires 40 arrows in 6 seconds.
wut

>>52220929

Less immersion breaking than a flintlock pistol with a magazine for all PCs?

>>52220959
Flintlocks with a magazine is kinda dumb when Revolvers exist.

Now, a Rifle with a magazine, yes. 1 capacity, fucking Paizo.

I swear, the only reason that Revolvers have six is because they'd get crucified if they didn't.

>>52220959
Tech for tech
Magic for magic

>>52220943
40 arrows?
That is some real elf shit

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>>52220880

>>52221066
Not being open to all concepts is not same as hating fun

why doesn't anyone around here use psionics.

>>52221213
It's a nice system but the classes themselves aren't interesting.

I do wish more people used the psionic-psychic fusion classes, though.

>>52221370
I mean I also like the occult classes and stuff

What are the psychic-psionic fusion classes, DSP trying to make psionics more in like with occult stuff?

>>52221378
They're a bunch of really interesting classes by forrest and co that are either psychic archetypes of psionic classes or vice versa.
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?472513-Dreamscarred-Press-Psionics-Augmented-Occult

Personal favorites are the Empath, Shattered Mind and Avant Guard, with a shoutout to the Gambler even though that's less a hybrid and more 'we used this chance to make a completely new psionic class and called it an archetype'

>>52221419
>http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?472513-Dreamscarred-Press-Psionics-Augmented-Occult

Nice i need a good look at this shit

What is the most horrible oracle curse to inflict on another PC with Oracle's Burden? I can't decide between Clouded Vision and Wrecker.

>>52219392
>lovecraft
>pathfinder
Pick one.

>>52221120
Yeah but that particular concept IS fun. /pfg/ complains about how bad firearms are, but when given something that makes them not shit they complain?

>>52220795
How do I do this? Please explain in detail; you've piqued my interest.

>>52221535
lovefinder

>>52221560
There's 52 different people in here. There's at least one or two shitchugging cumguzzlers who think firearms don't belong in the setting and neither they nor crossbows should ever be made stronger than a shortbow let alone composite ones.

One issue I'd have with magazines though; the game's built around multiple attacks, so if the magazine makes reloading once it runs out WORSE than what you can get normally (aka free actions), then it'll be left by the wayside, sorta like how until some errata what, middle of last year? Advanced firearms were strictly worse than early in all but range as soon as your musket master could reload for free.

>>52221370
>>52221419
Eeh, I don't think that most of the Psionic classes are uninteresting, but I agree that some are pretty bland. I usually forget that the Tactician even exists!

On the other hand, I wholly support the claim that Occult Psionics are super dope: I've got a Gambler//Aegis in my home game and holy shit is that class a good buffer/blaster. He picked up shared power and is throwing Vigor left and right, and he just picked up body adjustment, too. Send help.

>>52221213
Aegis is powerful. Top-of-the-line T3 if it has multiple subsystem access.

Soulknives are one of my favorites. The old crap was, well, crap, but later archetypes leave it utterly unrecognizable. The Warsoul and Living Legend in particular are just spectacular.

Cryptics have always been lacking; a ten of all trades living in a world of jacks and queens and kings and aces of those same things.

Vitalists are one of the most (dunno if they're still #1 but they were for a long time) powerful healjobs you can get, and turn the party into a cohesive telepathic unit.

Tacticians are quite effective, similar in many ways to vitalists but with melee-buffs and free actions instead of heals and debuffs.

Psions/Wilders are T2 full casters, 'nuff said.

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>>52215060
To be fair, in this case it's just a flat 'use the higher' rather than actually directly giving you the feat. You can use Constitution for your class features instead of Cha, which isn't a bloodforge option, after all!

Body Pact was more intended to focus on the unarmored, multiple-stat-to-AC option than the 'charisma to everything' option. This is at least partially because even WITH the removal of Spirited Swordsmanship... we kind of have to deal with Divine Fighting Style pushing some builds heavily towards being SAD anyway. While Monk is far from a well-designed class, it's rather key to its balance that it IS split between too many attributes - if it got Wisdom to as many things as the Self Avowed did, then it... turns out that's a real numerical problem, other balance aside.

The new Body pact was an attempt to capture as much of the spirit of the original Self pact as we could, while pushing them towards a theme of physical perfection (by encouraging them to increase all their physical attributes). However, making them four-stat MAD without investment, like the Monk, wasn't something we were comfortable with - thus settling on the three-stat MAD we have now. We ARE still concerned it may be too weak, so feedback is greatly appreciated, but we really can't BALANCE the numerical problems that came with having a PRIMARY attribute to attack rolls, damage, saving throws, armor class, and saving throw DCs. They just ended up too good at everything compared to someone who needed to invest in three to four attributes for that.

>>52221593
underrated post.

>>52220469
>>52220517
>>52220503

If this is the case, I'll go back and edit the text of that ability. It was late at night and my brain was a little bit fried. Remind me, which ability was that little bit of text referring to?

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>>52220795
What the fuck? How?

>>52221766
The level 19 ability to use a sphere effect on a critical.

>>52219195

Then the pairs are determined via the DM playing the role of Mengkare!

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>>52221779
Thanks anon, I'll fix it up later today. For now, there's stuff I need to do.

Also, shitty idea of the day- should I make a Stand Master Casting Tradition? wherein YOU don't gain any spheres, but you gain Conjuration as a bonus sphere, a bound creature, and the creature gains your spheres and uses your CAM? It's a shitty idea because I'm not entirely certain how it would work

Pic-related, Hetatonkheires Symbiat

>>52221833
more like thicc symbiat

>>52221880
This is true

Y'know, theoretically speaking, an Elemental Scion Shifter can be the most appealing girlfriend. Shapeshifter, has high Charisma, and can protect you from danger

>>52220144
>best
>when it's the alignment that will face the most disappointment once all it's done turns out to be for nothing

At least the CE's are comfortable with failure if they get theirs now. You're going to weep some very bitter tears once the daemons come for our souls.

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>>52217751
Inkarnate is pretty good. I made this in it, it's just a second draft, I probably have 3 more tries ahead of me.

How do you lot deal with hirelings, coolies, and taggers on?
What profiles do you use, and do you scale them up/down for the situation? Like, if the party were in a fairly prosperous city, and wanted to hire a group of the best warriors in town to aid them, what would they get?
What if they sought out a powerful wizard? What level would that be at?

>>52222385
Town guards are always level 5 and do not scale. It makes a good measuring stick. Standard guards are NPC warriors, officers are leveled Fighters.

For the other questions, depends what they can afford. There's listed costs for hired spellcasting, some casters would follow along and keep track of every used slot and charge for them all, with an extra fee for on-site dangers and cost of healing.

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>>52222416
>Town guards are always level 5

Does that means level 1 PCs are even schmuckier and more incompetent than before?

>>52221213
I looked at Marksman.
Everything sucks.
No matter what choices you make you're going to have to suck somewhere.

>>52222423
It means a first level literally who is exactly that. What's wrong with that? You want your first level adventurers to be able to waltz through town unable to be effected at all by level 0 guards?

>>52222416
What if a PC is a town guard? What about town guards in training?

>>52222416
>Looks at NPC's
>Guard (Human Warrior 3)
Checks out.

>>52222416
>Town guards are always level 5 and do not scale. It makes a good measuring stick. Standard guards are NPC warriors, officers are leveled Fighters.
Then what would experienced mercenaries be?
What would be the line between a hired warrior being a ranger, a fighter? When is it appropriate to use other classes, like barbarian, skald, a magus?
>>52222465
Except I'm not trying to make every hired man based off a guard.

>>52222470
There's a Grizzled Mercenary who's Warrior 6 and Professional Mercenary who's Fighter 5.

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>>52222423
>>52222438
Well it does bring the problem of "if the basic mooks are level 5, how fucked are you".

Reminds me of the FF MMO's, where you see a whole bunch of retard kids outside the city walls desperately fighting for their lives against ladybugs, slightly fluffy looking shrubs, and maybe a bunny of some kind. Meanwhile the local merchant carvans which you are told are well known for being unarmed and undergeared are making the trip between here and a level 60 area twice a day, while you will fucking party-wipe if that moo-cow looks at all of you funny.

>>52222482
Would other classes be of the same sort?
If the group expressively was seeker a capable woodland tracker and warrior, Ranger 5 would be amenable? What about a druid?

>>52222521
Sure. 5-6 is about the level of a veteran officer. Above that and you get into leaders of organizations.

>>52222460
Then they're a guard in training, or a new guard, or just a shit guard.

>>52222470
>what would experienced mercenaries be?
Probably more experienced
>What would be the line between a hired warrior being a ranger, a fighter? When is it appropriate to use other classes, like barbarian, skald, a magus?
When it feels right. Do you really have to ask this?

>>52222488
>if the basic mooks are level 5, how fucked are you
Guards aren't basic mooks, they're supposed to be better than the mooks to be able to deal with them. If guards are actually the shortest thing around to be considered basic mooks, they might as well not even be there. What kind of a town would hire them?

I'm wondering why this idea of "guards are a set level that starts better than you and ends below you" is too complicated for so many of you.

>>52222488
>if I'm able to be apprehended by authorities, I must be so fragile that even a butterfly could kill me
What makes you think this way? This just seems idiotic.

>>52222385
I run a higher power setting, so, for example, the best merc in a major would be a level 15 gestalt with a small company that goes from levels 8 to 12, or a party of level 13+ mercenaries that work as a team, and are have significantly good teamwork.
A dedicated Wizard could easily reach 17 if not higher, single class since he's largely dedicated himself to his studies, and similarly his spell collection would be mostly of utility or relevant to his specialization, and not a combat-oriented set of spells.

>>52222605
*the best merc in a major city
*and have significantly good teamwork
*his spell collection would be mostly of utility spells
Was distracted, sorry.

>>52222488
>if the basic mooks are level 5, how fucked are you
Wow, it's like a level 1 party will be in a world where there's dangerous shit out there.

A pack of wolves vs a town guard in chainmail - who do you think should win?

>>52222636
Not him, but the guards should obviously win. The guards have to be better than basic threats for the setting to work, but a fun game demands that you should surpass them eventually.

>>52222636
>A pack of large predators vs a human with medieval gear
Gee, it's almost as if carnivorous animals are supposed to be dangerous.

>>52222563

>Guards aren't basic mooks, they're supposed to be better than the mooks to be able to deal with them. If guards are actually the shortest thing around to be considered basic mooks, they might as well not even be there. What kind of a town would hire them?

Level 5 seems a lot better than a professional soldier would be a lot of the time. I mean, that's 'Can cast fireball' levels of skill if they are a spellcasting class (And in a D&D like setting why would guards be only physical guys when spellcraft is needed for dealing with magical crimes?)

>>52222657
Is this ironic?

>>52222636

A single guard? He should get torn apart by an entire pack of wolves.

>>52222658
You can adjust it to fit your games, it's not exactly going to hurt my feelings if you do. Considering they're only level 5 of an NPC martial class, it's not exactly high-powered in my experience.
>in a D&D like setting why would guards be only physical guys
Because it's significantly easier to teach some nobody how to swear a sword while wearing metal than it is to educate a few hundred or thousand people to cast fireball.
>when spellcraft is needed for dealing with magical crimes?
In 4 seconds I already thought of a half dozen solutions for this. From simply taking a rank or two in a skill, to bringing on a consultant. What's the big deal? Just adapt to a situation.

>>52222563
>Do you really have to ask this?
There is actually very little advice anywhere on how to design npcs that the party may bring on, it's assumed the party will be doing everything themselves.

>>52222690
Yes, that question is fair to ask. However, that's not the question that I responded "do you really need to ask this" to. That was in response to "hurr, I can't figure out what to do if I want a guard to be a Magus... This is too complicated! Someone tell me how to do this!"

>>52222690
If that's the part that's sticking for you the most, I could help. Please be more specific, though. What part of creating a helper for your party are you having trouble pinning down?

>>52222687

>Because it's significantly easier to teach some nobody how to swear a sword while wearing metal than it is to educate a few hundred or thousand people to cast fireball.

It's still 5 levels in a class. That's well beyond 'Wear a sword while wearing metal'. Fighters are also in the same training difficulty category as: Summoners and Witches so it's clearly not exactly as easy as just 'Hit them with the sharp end'

>>52222754
Yes, and as I said PC classes are reserved for officers. In case that word is confusing you, I don't mean like police officer, I meant like a command ranking military official officer. All you get for the NPC version of a fighter is some BAB, HP, and proficiencies. It's actually just teaching someone how to hit the bad guys with the pointy end.

>>52222778
>It's actually just teaching someone how to hit the bad guys with the pointy end.
Not to get them to level 5 it isn't.

>>52222778

So it's easier to train someone to level 5 than it is to give them ranks in a PC class?

Then again, NPC classes existing past first level is something that never sat well with me. Untrained Warrior: PC class. Slightly trained warrior: NPC class. Well trained warrior: PC class.

>>52222794
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/npc-classes/warrior/
Yes, it is. They literally don't get anything else. It's just proficiencies and an extremely bare BAB and saves progression. They even get shit all for skills. Why is this bothering you so much?

>>52222825
There's more to attacking someone with a sword than "the pointy end goes this way", anon.

>>52222778

Wouldn't expert be better than warrior? Warrior doesn't get: Perception, Sense Motive, Diplomacy, Spellcraft or Appraise.

Literally any of the skills for 'Being good as a guard' outside of being a legbreaker with intimidate.

>>52222819
It's defenitely more pragmatic for your basic training to be daily exercises and sparring that it is to try to educate and entire platoon on spellcasting.

>>52222847

The untrained warrior example was barbarian, not a spellcaster.

>>52222837
I was going to call you a pedantic asshole splitting hairs for seemingly no reason, then I remembered what board I was on. Do you have an actual complaint about this, or just nit-picking my word choice?

>>52222841
Experts don't get decent proficiencies or BAB. Besides, it's just a guard. It's not like every npc in the city is a level 5 warrior, and it's not like every member of the local militia is exactly the same rank and skillset. You just don't need the Experts to stand by the gate.

>>52222860
Actually the examples in that reply chain were Summoner and Witch.