/CofD/ &/wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness

File: whizzard.jpg (6KB, 147x147px) Image search: [Google]

6KB, 147x147px

FIRST FOR MAGE SUPREMACY

>>52006122
second for mages can't resist the knot

>>52006111
>Biggest pet peeve
Seers of the Throne have no special Seer-only method of guarding against Wisdom loss.
Which is a massive weakness when their masters demand such abhorrent acts of them on a constant basis (ignoring the fact for a moment that they themselves are usually pretty horrible people).

>>52006111
The lack of information on what Infrastructure looks like/does/etc
The books are vague as hell about it, with most descriptions just saying "THE GEARS" instead of describing shit, and the only good description I can think of being a stack of magazines in a doctor's office that's spread so there's always a smug looking mom looking at the person in the chair nearest to the stack(and I vaguely remember something about the corners of the pages looking *too* sharp, somehow, or something like that)

File: df04a8efb27fa79f2f0f63cab6bc9266.jpg (124KB, 640x1138px) Image search: [Google]

124KB, 640x1138px

>>52006156
>is a massive weakness when their masters demand such abhorrent acts of them on a constant basis (ignoring the fact for a moment that they themselves are usually pretty horrible people).

I just house rule this so that things done for their masters don't count. I also don't count self-defense or even preemptively murdering someone who is gonna murder you first.

File: 8-Bit-Theater-21.png (52KB, 720x496px) Image search: [Google]

52KB, 720x496px

>>52006122

As a mage player;

Do you play anything that is not Mage or is charity below you too?

>>52006111
>>52006167
I fucking hate God Machine. It combines "humans are weak pawns" with "every race has a big enemy" and makes retarded "your enemy is a giant set of information infrastructure that you can't really defeat because muh hidden conspiracies".

>>52006225
I would never lower myself by playing anything other than Awakening.

How do you guys calculate combat encounters in VTR 2e?
I am relatively new and have a party of 5 neonates. We are up to our first combat with some street gangsters with clubs and guns. I think that something like 3 gangsters should be a good challenge for a vampire. But ain't I missing something?
I am not sure there is a linear progression.

>>52006303
>3 gangsters should be a good
I mean 3 for each of them. 15 in total.

>>52006243

So its robot Tzeentch.

>>52006321
>>52006303

That could become overkill. Okay here is the thing anon; if you run that fight as is, by RAW, then you have 10 additional actions more than your players are allowed access to. This is called Action Economy. When you have a widlly disproportionate action economy vs your opponent, you will generally win unless you options per action are terrible, such as having Str 1 Brawl 0 and trying to fist fight an angry Uratha.

I don't know how well built your PCs are but that could be rough for them. The ones with the clubs, not so much, but I wouldn't go overboard with the guns if your PCs aren't powerhouses designed for that kind of fighting. Even with damage behind coverted to bashing it wouldn't be hard to fuck up a vampire if 2-3 guys keep putting bullets into them.

Vampires
Werewolves
Mages

What factions in each are best at chimpingout?

>>52006407

Alternatively, if this is a scenario the neonates bungled their way into, or it was a trap set by someone else, then it could be a decent lesson in learning to not underestimate armed mortals in large numbers.

Always remind them that they can run away; there is no reason to fight to the death, especially for vampires.

>>52006422

Werewolves hands down. WtA chimped out so hard they broke their own goddess and murdered half her children.

WtF werewolves chimped out so hard they ruined their own race and dominance over the spiritual world and mankind.

>>52006243
You could very well destroy the God-Machine. It's an end-game thing, though, and should require a large amount of work, because doing so is literally game-ending.
It's just that the books leave it up entirely to the ST what the G-M actually is, so doing it requires a lot of work from both the players and the ST.

>>52006422
Werewolves.
One of their main themes is chimping out.

>>52006422
>What factions in each are best at chimpingout?

werewolves, though you may need a particularly creative ST to really drive the YOU ARE VULNERABLE TO A CHIMPOUT AT ANY STRESSFUL MOMENT

>>52006111
How do the Strix mesh with the God Machine?

>>52006485
Like shadows and cogwork.

That is to say, who gives a fuck?

>>52006485

Strix are faggy bitchboys who pick on one of the weakest splats.

Good thing big strong Mages are here to protect their Vampire waifus for flappity-faggot birds~

>>52006303
Better question- why in the fuck are they fighting 15 gangers with clubs and bats? Hell, why are 15gangers hanging around in one place? That sort of congregation is rare. Gangs usually keep in small clumps to avoid getting all busted at once.

So what are Strix made of?
I'd find it fucking hilarious if Death 1's Shadow Sculpting could fuck with their "physical" form.
A horrible shadow-bird transformed in an armchair made of shadows by one of the weakest fucking spells in Death's arsenal...

Fuck it, I'm writing that up as an actual spell.

>>52006548

Any Mage with an inkling of Death is going to be an anti-Strix terror.

>>52006593

Is it bad that I actually want to see a Mage defending the honor of their Vampire spouse by trashing the Strix?

>>52006407
>This is called Action Economy. When you have a widlly disproportionate action economy vs your opponent, you will generally win
Ok, so what proportions I should use in order to design a balanced combat? 1 to 1? What about the fact that vampires are generally stronger than humans? Much stronger.
Thanks for your answer, btw.

>>52006588
That'd need Death 3, at least, probably, considering you're reshaping a being. Also, probably withstood(by Resistance, b/c ayy simple attributes).

>>52006639

You can gang up on players just be aware of their combat stats and don't go overboard with firearms because iirc vampires can't apply their Defense vs Firearms without discipline powers.

They can probably take a beating and kill some gangbangers with knives and bats, but a bunch of young turks unloading into them every round is going to get messy fast.

>>52006635

It's all fun and games until you bring out the Moros housewife.

>>52006580
Well, my players want to bust their weapon storage to arm themselves. Those places should be well guarded, right?
%%Their objective is just to intercept farther weapon selling, but they've got greedy.%%

File: hm.png (73KB, 400x240px) Image search: [Google]

73KB, 400x240px

>>52006671

So basically some leech married pic related

>>52006658
I can see Withstood being a factor in a Mage vs Strix encounter, but I honestly don't think you would need three dots in Death to sculpt the angry owls.

Death already has a lot of special exceptions (that are entirely sensible) as far the Arcana go, such as transforming into a shadow without the need for Life.

>>52006681

Sort of, but maybe not that well. Could be stashed in more secret places, or maybe Jamal just shoved them in the back of his truck and threw a blanket over them.

If they're storming a house or complex you could have them spread out, some chilling and bullshiting and getting fucked up, while an unlucky few have to stand guard or patrol the perimeter.

>>52006664
No no, there are no autoguns.
I am using standart enemy template from CofD corebook. Gangsters have like 7 for firing action. Thought now that I think about it... 15 enemies with THAT kind of stats + colts are a bit too much, right? From the other hand it is not like I am going to make them focus their fire at someone.

>>52006711

Exactly that. Especially if she happens to be from Japan.

>>52006740
>If they're storming a house or complex you could have them spread out, some chilling and bullshiting and getting fucked up, while an unlucky few have to stand guard or patrol the perimeter.
Yeah, that's a good plan. Vamps can easily heal themselves using enemies blood, so long run combat against groups of enemies should be an easy cake.

So is the G-M an exarch level threat? Or is it just another malignant high rank ephemeral entity?

>>52006681
See, but unless we're talking a lawless wasteland where the cops stay out like the slums of Mexico City, the gangers will likely only have a few, trusted guards. See, the more dudes you have nearby, the more likely people will notice- and that means the cops are more likely to come. These places rely on stealth, not heavy guards. And even then, they'll be divided- guard duty is boring, so some will be eating, some will be fucking around, some in the bathroom, ect.

>>52006750

7 dice to shoot with? Yeah it could be too much if your PCs can't apply Defense vs Firearms. Again, even if it converts down to Bashing damage, it will still fill up and spill over.

But honestly? I keep the encounter as-is with those stats and would let your PCs know ahead of time that they will have to play Smart if they want to cash in on this. Surely they have at least a few dots in useful powers that could cause confusion or split the gangers up so they're easier to kill? Misdirection, but also shock and surprise. They aren't military, they're hoodlums. They won't react well when a blood soaked monster comes bursted through the third floor window and decapitates one of their niggas.

>>52006785
Probably right under the Exarchs.

>>52006789

Yeah, as a GM you should approach situations like this as if it were a stealth game. Likewise, your PCs should also treat it that way.

>>52006750
Remember also that these are gangers. They're not well educated, trained, or often that intelligent- they also see themselves as tough motherfuckers, and thus don't really expect other people to challenge them. So they're likely to panic, make bad decisions, and otherwise fuck up and be very disorganized in a sudden attack. Give them some time to organize and fire themselves up and they'll be dangerous, but without that they're idiots. Most aren't very good at shooting either. 1 or 2 dots in firearms at most.

Veterans, are, of course, a slightly different matter.

>>52006208
>preemptively murdering someone who is gonna murder you first.
It seems like that would count, to me. Killing in self-defense, in the heat of the moment, is one thing, but premeditated murder is another, even if you do have an understandable reason for it. You are making a calculated decision to end somebody else's life.

>>52006840

You could have 1-3 of them actually have some experience, maybe even ex-military or whatever, but the rest aren't cold-blooded killers despite their posturing.

>>52006856
This. Even a dangerous gang will usually have a very small core of actually scary fuckers- and then a bunch of guys that look tough and are willing to hurt people if they're not in danger- but in a firefight will spray gunfire wildly, scream "OH SHIT!" a lot, and then run away unless they think they can win. Gangers have awful morale. Even the ones that can shoot well tend to turn to shit once things get scary, because they're 90% posturing.

File: Strix into Shadows.pdf (1B, 486x500px)

1B, 486x500px

>>52006658
I went with Patterning, as you're changing the Strix (which falls under the Arcanum of Death) into something else under the purview of Death (Shadows).
Much as how my "Vampire into Vanity Set" spell works.
Except in this case, much easier.

There's an argument to have it under Weaving instead, but this way nobody can complain that Strix aren't "necessarily" made of shadows, and you can render them completely incapable of taking any action (so long as you can keep beating them at a Clash of Wills).

>>52006897
You can already shape the Strix using the Compelling Practice.

>>52006805
>>52006840
>>52006856
>>52006879
You are right guys. I should think about their behavior. I believe vtr doesn't have any rules about how mortals react on supernatural shit while in combat? Something about Integrity breaking points?
Btw what about dirty combat?

>>52006929
They're gangsters, how often do you think they bath?

Of course it'll be dirty combat

>>52006925
That depends greatly on the nature of their existence as "shadow-creatures" which might not be true shadows, or need to take a certain form to manifest powers.
I mean, you don't necessarily lose the ability to walk just because someone's shaved your legs.

My version bypasses all considerations of what they actually are, and shuts them down hard by forcing them into existence as something else.

>>52007051
So you just want to ignore cross-splat physiologies and go straight for their throats?

Thinking like a true mage there, Anon.

File: too spooky owl.gif (268KB, 500x334px) Image search: [Google]

268KB, 500x334px

>>52007051
>>52007108

KILL ALL SPOOKY OWLS

>>52006897

>This kills the Owl

>>52006739
You're right. It'd be 2 dots, like Shape Ephemera.

>>52007319
Even more hilariously, it doesn't.
It does however lets you leave them in a little heap, sweep them out into the street, and leave them for the sun to deal with.

>>52006785
>>52006811
According to the Demon STG, it's about equal with the Exarchs. Granted, that's in-setting speculation from Demons based on observances of G-M and Exarch activity.

>>52007415
According to Imperial Mysteries, the God-Machine was a former Supernal god kicked out by the Mage lords of Atlantis.

Apparently he is trying to rebuild himself and re-assert his place as a true god.

>>52007490
That's one interpretation of that section, written and released in a book before the God-Machine chronicle was.

>>52007516
Eh, different splats different interpretations.

>>52007415

Considering the Exarchs represent the fundamentals around the God-Machines very existence, I would indeed consider them to be above it in power.

They already won their right to rule, remember.

File: 1487941868153.jpg (22KB, 401x401px) Image search: [Google]

22KB, 401x401px

>>52006739
You'd also need forces in addition to life.

File: 76757261747656.jpg (28KB, 695x316px) Image search: [Google]

28KB, 695x316px

>>52007811

File: whenIseeadirtyfanger.jpg (3KB, 288x160px) Image search: [Google]

3KB, 288x160px

>Take archery merit
>See two fangers sodomizing each other in alley
>Stake 2 for 1

Double up boyssssssss!

File: 1480209361455.jpg (665KB, 990x1156px) Image search: [Google]

665KB, 990x1156px

>>52007824

Hey guys, I saw my cousin's character sheet and he had a dot in entropy. So should I kill him to preserve my family's honor?

>>52007901
Get Mind 3 and open his perception to how much cock he's sucking

File: 1XZyCq.png (340KB, 398x582px) Image search: [Google]

340KB, 398x582px

>>52007901
Render him impotent with your life magic anon.

File: Nice.png (92KB, 570x533px) Image search: [Google]

92KB, 570x533px

The Entropy hating weeaboo is back, I see.

File: 1464277477837.jpg (837KB, 1177x1263px) Image search: [Google]

837KB, 1177x1263px

What happens to the souls of vampires (Masquerade) when they die?

>>52008168

If they're lucky, they stop existing or pass on. If not, I believe they have a chance at becoming Wraiths.

>>52006111
>What was/is your biggest pet peeve about your favorite setting?
Changeling the lost is most definitely not a setting for people new to CofD and is harder to explain in concept since there are no defined character archetypes

Are there any merits that enhance throwing weapons? I want to play a Dio inspired character in my next game.

>>52008507

Anime is dumb.

>>52008585
You're dumb.

>>52008507
There's a 2-dot Throwing Weapons style in Hurt Locker.
First dot gives +Athletics to initiative when using a thrown weapon, second dot lets you inflict the Impaled Tilt to an individual if you successfully damage their arms/legs/hands with a thrown weapon... At the cost of losing your Defense for the turn. So fuck that.

Otherwise, not really.
If you're playing a Mage though, you can use Forces 2 to enhance thrown weapons with a Reach option. Which with additional reach can let you knock people down, or stun them with just a dagger.

>>52008601
I was originally leaning towards a vampire with celerity for obvious reasons. But on second thought Time magic would actually let me stop time.

The real question is if I could throw volleys of knives during a Time stop.

>>52008655
I don't think so, Anon.
Taking any such action would cancel the spell, even if you coordinated with someone else for you to remove that knife from the spell the moment it was thrown.

File: reverend smith.jpg (37KB, 500x280px) Image search: [Google]

37KB, 500x280px

Out of all your WoD games who was your favorite NPC? I remember during a vampire game our group became friends with a priest who I swear was based on pic related (most likely was considering the ST was a big deadwood fan).

The group almost came to blows trying to decide if we should turn him to save him or not when his health started failing. In the end we didnt and let him go with God.

>>52008701
It wouldn't cancel the spell.

>>52008785
>"He may move freely, examine objects, take any Mental actions, heal, touch things, and even cast spells with himself as the subject, but not physically move, consume, or injure anything — any attempt to do so immediately ends the spell, but returns the subject to the timeline having just completed the action he attempted."
Nope, it does.

>>52008814

>take a step forward
>you move your clothes which instantly ends the spell

>>52008828
Yeah, that's the problem with that spell, it doesn't specify nearly enough what the limits on movement are.

I mean, sure it really shouldn't break because you blow air in someone's face, but what about running along a rope bridge, climbing creaky stairs?

Much of this stuff would seem to be "common sense" stuff, but it would still help to have some direction.

Alright, through circumstances which i still do not understand, yesterday i somehow obtained a card from the Vampire: The Eternal Struggle from some guy on the street.

It reads Praxis Seizure: Cleveland, what do i do with it?

File: 1460669702767.jpg (2MB, 2880x1620px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 2880x1620px

>>52008180

Huh, had no idea they could become Wraiths.

Okay, another Masquerade question: does consensual diablerie still leave the tell-tale sign on one's aura?

>>52009520
Yes. Though I've no idea why any vampire save a very inhuman elder would do that, since diablere involves drinking the soul, which makes it a fate far worse than final death.

The soul eating is what causes the black. Just drinking someone's vitae isn't enough to diablerize them.

>>52009586

I came across something in some VtM book where a mentor/teacher of some sort did it to pass on their knowledge. They might have been a Cappadocian?

>>52006111
>Kill Middle
>Fuck Right
>Marry Left

>>52009618
Cappadicians are weird, so they might. Still a fate worse than death. And any theoretical coughharbringerscoughsonsofsamedi Cappadociqn remnants would not be fond of it, given that Giovanni diablerized Cappadocius himself.

>>52009618
>>52009652
Some Salubri purportedly have their childer diablerize them upon achieving a necessary level of personal enlightenment. Though Salubri also definitely qualify as a weird bunch.

>ywn diablerize your Salubri waifu

Why even Jyhad?

File: 1488589747901.jpg (143KB, 640x1500px) Image search: [Google]

143KB, 640x1500px

>>52009673
>>52009652

>you will never have a Cappadocianfu who's willing to comfort you when unlife gets you down

Final death NOW!

Could you incapacitate a vampire by punching/shooting him in the bails? Do they have the appropriate nerves?

What is the best vampire clan and why is it the Ventrue antitribu?

Would a mage ever willingly date a vampire?

File: Vampire the Dark Ages 20th Anniversary - Core Rulebook - Tzimisce.jpg (1MB, 2118x2800px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 2118x2800px

>>52009731

Best clan is Dark Ages Tzimisce.

>>52009682
>you will never tenderly and lovingly diablerize your Cappadocian waifu
>you will never feel her squirms and quivers of delight turn to convulsions of fear and agony in your arms as you ravish her body and pull out her metaphysical essence
>you will never embrace her supple, naked soul with your own

Just stake me now.

>>52008430
Changeling was the first nWoD book I ever read. It made the others slightly disappointing.
If I ever get a game, I'm playing an eight year old boy who traded seven years of service to get his sister to a better place and another seven to remove the "one stolen child a generation" curse that his ancestor called down.
His sister is still a spoiled Fae princess and well on her way to True Fae. But she got him a long break between his first and second terms of service.
Guess how many generations will descend from his father between the two?

>>52008998
Keep it. Make a plotline out of it. Have a mage and a freehold take advantage of yugioh to put vampire politics in the hands of the gestalt results of thousands of children playing a card game.

>>52009741
>Best Clan
>Iconic is a magical tranny

Nah m8. That's a man butt

>>52009813

You mean Sascha Vykos?

Don't give a shit about that Byzantine buttboy.

And I picked Dark Ages specifically because Vicissitude wasn't still so widespread throughout the Clan.

>>52009798
Shit boy, i don't even have the other cards and the guy on the card looks like a malnourished Tommy Wiseau in front of an art installation.

I don't even know why i got it, i had drank three white russians before and i stumbled through town to get home and i got the card at some point.

>>52009741
What, no smug commentary about every single out-group? What has the world come to?

(A better place.)

>>52009819
Nah, the OC chick in the DA:V20, the one in the picture there. Magical Tranny.
The Clan just can't escape degeneracy.

File: Untitled.png (1MB, 1156x1581px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 1156x1581px

>>52009894

It's the 20th Anniversary of Dark Ages.

Earlier ones have something of a smugness to them. This is from the 2nd edition of Dark Ages.

>>52009899

How do you know it's a tranny? No, I'm serious. Are you just guessing or do you know that character's name?

>>52009927
>if they absolutely must have hideousness and grotesquerie, we would be happy to accommodate them.
I thought this boast about the Baali was pretty good.

>>52009927
Hold on, I'll hunt up the backstory.

Here:
>http://theonyxpath.com/dark-ages-peeling-back-the-curtain/
>https://docs.google.com/document/d/15o_epaY5ti9kzAubF9-B2Fr6V99DnEVjpFTYmneVx08/edit

Not to say that I wouldn't totally fuck her, but she's mad Transexual, yo.

File: Untitled.png (2MB, 1285x1769px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 1285x1769px

Hmm, I seem to recall one particular edition of Dark Ages, or something like it, where the Tzmisce mention the Salubri and being close with them. Does anyone know which book that might be?

>>52009927
>>52009894

And this is the Revised.

>>52010009

Well, damn. Not surprising for a Tzimisce, but still, OPP should have just stayed clear of making any new characters.

>>52009731
It's both Ventrue branches or Dominate Malkavian for me. I'm also partial to the Gangrel, the Giovanni and the Samedi.

>>52008168
Vampires have a chance, lower than that of mortals, to become wraiths. Other than Mages, they're the splat most likely to become a wraith.
Vamps that achieved golconda transcend on the spot. The rest get sucked straight into oblivion.
At least, this is how Wraith handles it. Not sure if it's done at all differently in the vamp books, wto is my main splat.

File: 4Bb8Ln.png (568KB, 852x880px) Image search: [Google]

568KB, 852x880px

>>52008040
>this emo genuinely believes there's only one who knows his sphere to be shit

File: Death magic.jpg (163KB, 956x598px) Image search: [Google]

163KB, 956x598px

>life waifu turns herself into an army of waifus
That's good
>matter waifu makes you a cocktail of sex drugs
That's good
>Mind waifu creates vivid sex hallucination
That's good
>Entropy waifu makes a corpse to suck you off
Holy shit honey we're getting a divorce

>>52009927
>tfw you now want to read a doomed romance between a Tzimisce lord and a poor Tremere fledgling girl.

>>52010635

The only romance between a Tzimisce and another clan that I'm aware of existing is the stuff you see in Redemption, between a Brujah and a Tzimisce ghoul-turned-vampire.

>>52010577
>wto is my main splat
Given that I'm a complete newfag when it comes to WoD games, what's the main draw for wraith?

So most of the orders in awakening seem to not really care about sleepers or even look down at them. A staunch humanist that awakened would probably find himself hanging out with the council even if he thinks some of them are a bit crazy, right?

>>52010708
The Silver Ladder and the Free Council both care deeply about sleepers, in different ways.

The Ladder for the potential in their souls, their destiny which they must grasp, and the Free Council by their works, the Magic that is their culture and creations.

>>52010752
That being said, the Council has quite probably the loosest leash on its membership.
So if your character wanted the benefits of Pentacle membership without pretty much any of the costs?
The Libertines are the way to go.

>>52010771
Well honestly its either them or the Arrow. The guy has a nasty combination of survivors guilt and a hero complex.

>>52010708
Nope, such mage can find a place in literally every order. Except Mysterium. Those guys really don't give a flying fuck about Sleepers.

>>52006483
Aren't Vampires prone to go into Rotschreck if somebody lights a match?

>>52011049
They'd have to be the most spineless, cowardly vampire to have ever existed for them to actually frenzy over that.

>>52009731
You know what I like about V:tM? All the clans are equally good, your choice depends only on preference alone

>>52011124
>All the clans are equally good
>Ravnos and Nagaraja exist

File: 1442039380340.jpg (56KB, 493x387px) Image search: [Google]

56KB, 493x387px

>>52011124
>All the clans are equally good

>>52011124
>>52011140

Has anyone actually ever played a Ravnos?

Or one of the other minor bloodlines?

>>52011140
>>52011148
Well the main 13 (15 with Dark Ages), at least from a lore perspective.

Even the Ravnos can be charming and Chimestry is one of the more interesting abilities

Let's hear wodg's opinions on the clans:
>Assamites: literally the assassins
>Brujah: muh Carthage
>Followers of Set: seem interesting, but I never played or crossed paths with one
>Gangrel: pretty cool guys
>Giovanni: interesting concept, poor execution
>Lasombra: eh, Morte Ascendo, kid
>Malkavian: can be decent depending on the player, but most examples in the books encourage fishmalks with overblown derangement instead of the subtly insane/depressive/obsessive bloodsucker
>Nosferatu: they should tone down on the freak show gallery and focus on their unnerving aspect, like the VtR version.
>Ravnos: no opinion, I can't really see the appeal
>Toreador: they're okay I guess. They weakness is a bit weird
>Tremere: dude wizards. Thaumaturgy is way too busted, but I like their whole conspiracy inside the conspiracy shtick.
>Tzimisce: how the fuck did they decide grotesque fleshcrafters had anything to do with vampires?
>Ventrue: proper vampires

>>52011291

>Tzimisce: how the fuck did they decide grotesque fleshcrafters had anything to do with vampires?

Corruption by the Kupala.

One Tzimisce noted how every time, even when trying to create beautiful forms, there was something inherently very inhuman about them and it kept being degraded slowly over time into monstrous shit.

>>52011306
I was asking from the writers' perspective. I could have seen them as lordly shapeshifters like the original Dracula, but fleshcrafting Giger style abominations isn't something I'd associate with vampirism.

>>52011344
I think there was a book or something about space vampires from which they ripped off Vicissitude almost word for word

>>52011360
Really? I thought it was something they came up with themselves. This makes it even worse.

>>52011437
Yeah, just checked it's the necroscope series.

>control over flesh and bone
>cold
>territorial
>sadistic
>their ability is a parasitic infection from outer space (Dirty secrets?)

Remind you of anyone?

So...how 'bout them Mages?

>>52011999
>>52006153

File: qt thyrsus.png (329KB, 680x660px) Image search: [Google]

329KB, 680x660px

Lovely Mage girl

>>52011513

Women?

File: Af55OwG.webm (664KB, 720x404px) Image search: [Google]

664KB, 720x404px

>>52006925
>You can already shape the Strix using the Compelling Practice.

HELP ME WODG-wan Kenobi!

I need two 'world news' articles for my VtM game today, and I don't want to take a lot more from the ToJ Newsticker. HALP!

>>52012211

delet this

t. strix

File: vamp tats.jpg (173KB, 563x1292px) Image search: [Google]

173KB, 563x1292px

Y'know, I've noticed that Lore of the Clans actually has some pretty decent art (excluding "Dracula" and the rest of the Clan representatives).

Like this Toreador antitribu who's getting tattoos that are imbued with Presence powers through the Combination Discipline "Devil's Mark" (Presence 1, Vicissitude 2).

...She's pretty sexy, don't ya think?

>>52012341

are you sure that she vampire and not just usual run of the mill leftist chick?

>>52012374
>are you sure that she vampire and not just usual run of the mill leftist chick?

either way, 10/10, would bang

>>52012341

>tattoos on a vampire

But doesn't their skin revert to how it was on their next wake up?

Also

>Lore of the Clans

The what now?

File: party time.jpg (140KB, 967x635px) Image search: [Google]

140KB, 967x635px

>>52012523
>But doesn't their skin revert to how it was on their next wake up?

Usually, yes, but not if they've been fleshcrafted to make it *look* like they have tattoos.

The Combination Discipline "Devil's Mark" uses blood from the tattooist (either by mixing it with ink ink, or by bathing their instruments in it) , and then using Vicissitude as a way of "painting" the skin the right colours, or by modifying their body so that they can easily use piercings, that sort of stuff.

In this way, Sabbat warparties sometimes tattoo and pierce their bodies with symbolic sigils and marks, and if the tattooist has the required knowledge they can basically "infuse" the power of Presence (levels 1-5 only) into said tattoos and piercings, allowing the "marked" vampire to spend those Presence abilities at their leisure.

When the Presence power has been used, the tattoo's/piercing's power is lost, and the tattoo will automatically disappear the next time the Vampire rises... unless the tattooist spends a point of permanent willpower, which will make the tattoo and the Presence-power permanent until the tattooed bodypart gets cut off or until another Fleshcrafter messes with the "design".

>>52012523
>The what now?

Lore of the Clans is a V20 supplement for Vampire the Masquerade. It gives a sort of "our look on things" for all the main thirteen clans, along with a f*ckton of new Combination disciplines, advanced disciplines, concepts for new player characters, new clan-exclusive merits and flaws, and more.

It's well worth a read, and you can find it here, in the "20th Vampire" folder.

mega:#F!KI00XCZA!sFV9L2S77bld5vzEmw5-vg

>>52012709

Thanks for the download link, and the info on tattoos, but I've got it already, I just haven't gotten through everything else yet from VtM, let alone reached the 20th anniversary folder.

>>52010628
Prime wiify?

What is the difference between oWoD and nWoD?
I never played ANY, so just need to see which direction to go.

File: why always me.jpg (171KB, 462x533px) Image search: [Google]

171KB, 462x533px

>when you have 9 dice into swords and you literally get 0 successes on every weapon swing you do in the entire session (7 times) , even when you used willpower

>when the schmuck guy with the pistol that has 5 pool ends up rolling literally 7 10's at one point, instantly melting what we were fighting before I even got a chance to swing my weapon

I don't know the statistical odds of these both happening in one session. All I know is being a Hunter was a mistake.

>>52010635
10/10 would read. Just imagine all of the abuse!

>>52011140
>ywn hug your Nagaraja waifu
>ywn lovingly feed her fresh scraps of the finest models and athletes Dominate or Presence can buy
>ywn feel the exhilaration as she takes vitae-rich bites out of your flesh during the tender act of lovemaking

Why even Jyhad?

>>52014540

Very high, nwod system is shit for this specific reason.

>>52015350
Owod has this issue time times worse.

>>52015378

Not really, owod system is barely okay until combat, then it shits on the bed.

Nwod/chrod is constantly mediocre all the way through, it never reaches the lows of owod but also never reaches the highs

>>52014370
oWoD's system is a bit clunkier in my opinion, but it has some neat ideas like variable success levels, while nWoD is more straightforward, as it has a fixed number for successes, fewer skills and the like.
Fluffwise oWoD has an intricate, omnipresent metaplot that tends to focus on vast conspiracies and very powerful players (super elder vampires etc.) while nWoD is more centered on the city-level and its setting is fairly easy to change or ignore.

>>52015619

However owod is also a setting in a can, you can run it, exactly as it comes and it can be fun if forgetabble.

Nwod setting lives or dies by the work/talent of the dm to cherrey pick/use the various setting elements into a cohesive whole. A by the number nwod game is a bland mess.

>>52010009
>by David A Hill Jr

So DavidH gets freelancers that can't help but add magical trannies in Dark Ages. Good thing it isn't in the book itself, at least. The more I read about him, the less I care if he's quitting over e-celeb drama.

File: 1488387442310.png (140KB, 631x1073px) Image search: [Google]

140KB, 631x1073px

>>52016122
For your reading pleasure

>>52016358
"Waifu". Seriously. At least a Japanese put him to his place, but is there really a thing this guy won't do to get imaginary good boy points ?

>>52014370
Requiem's system is less messy and better balanced than Masquerade and the Disciplines (vampire powers) are better.

Masquerade has a large metaplot which can be fun, but it's very gonzo and definitely a product of the 90s with the brand of edginess it brings.

Requiem actually has a lot of backstory too, but it isn't as dense as Masquerade. It has two Rome books and a book called Ancient Mysteries that is about vampire society during certain historical times.

Masquerade has a lot more Clans than Requiem, but the Clans in Masquerade are all pretty one note in my opinion. You either end up playing a stereotypical member of your Clan or are some kind of rebel.

Also the Covenants (essentially Vampire political parties) in Requiem are cooler than the Camarilla and Sabbat.

>>52016453
No. He's a neo-pinko commie progressive, he has to inject his politics into everything.

>>52011175
>Has anyone actually ever played a Ravnos?

I have. Both pre-Week of Nightmares and post-Week of Nightmares.

Chimerstry is pretty good at the higher levels, and you can really create some hilarious (and sadistic) effects, but the fact that you pretty much always need to spend willpower to use it means that you probably won't use it as often as many of the other active disciplines.

>>52011175
>Or one of the other minor bloodlines?

Yes again. I've roleplayed quite a few characters from various bloodlines. Though several of them died quite early in the stories.

I've played a Nagaraja (independent), a Laibon (Impundulu), an Ahrimane (Dark Ages version), a Daughter of Cacophony, a Salubri Antitribu and a Samedi.

>>52016716
>a Salubri Antitribu

This is my dream right here. What was yours like?

>>52016765
>This is my dream right here. What was yours like?

Very passionate, but followed the Path of Honorable Accord. Was taught how to use a longsword by a Ventrue Antitribu.

Was a pretty successful character, but ended up dying during a Crusade against a Cammy city. Got cornered by a trio of gangrel, and killed two of them before the third ripped her head off with Feral Claws.

File: 1446734988797.png (633KB, 1047x1837px) Image search: [Google]

633KB, 1047x1837px

Anyone know if Project Vaulderie might be restarted now that CCP is out of the picture?

>>52017001

Given that new White Wolf wants to be "very protective" of its IP and hinted that it wasn't afraid to legislate to do it, don't hold your breath.

>>52011291
>Assamites:
Islamic assassin-terrorist-vampires are boring, just make into generic vampire-spooks with a Vitae-addiction and a reputation as serial Diablerists. Make Assamite beliefs and politics into a Sect popular among different vampire Clans in the Web of Faith.

>Brujah:
OK I guess? Seem a bit superfluous with the Gangrel, which I guess is why Requiem combined the two.

>Followers of Set:
A Sect, not a Clan.

>Gangrel:
Pretty cool, yeah!

>Giovanni:
Strip away some of the racism, and they work well as a single dynasty of necromancer-vampires that only embrace within the Family

>Lasombra:
Cool Discipline, but they feel a bit superfluous. Combine with Assamites?

>Malkavian:
Remove with prejudice to stop fishmalks. Maybe make into disease spread by using Dementation on someone too much?

>Nosferatu:
Pretty cool!

>Ravnos:
Urgh, remove with prejudice.

>Toreador:
OK I guess.

>Tremere:
Cool concept, Discipline needs rebalance.

>Tzimisce:
I like these guys too much not to keep them. Besides, the Old Clan works pretty well as one of three dominant vampire-Clans in Eastern Europe and Russia, with the Gangrel and Nosferatu.

>Ventrue:
These work pretty well.

Bonus round:

>Cappadocians:
Bring these guys back as cool vampire death-scholars!

>Baali:
A Sect that uses the Second Embrace to recruit from other groups and teach Daimonition and Dark Thaumaturgy to initiates of its inner circle. Might be a Clan, but nobody really knows.

>Caitiff
Lots of these around because sometimes sires abandon their childer. Especially the Ventrue, when they've sired someone who doesn't meet the minimum standard of being rich and upper class.

>>52017646
I feel Lasombra could've worked as a Ventrue bloodline in Requiem. Historically using the clergy but in the modern times have turned to banking with shady backroom deals.

>>52011291
>>52017646
As a Mage supremacist, I condemn all things Tremere.

And support all things Tzimisce.

playing Blood & Smoke for the first time. I have a question about Vigor.

If I pay a blood point do I add vigor to my strength twice, or am I reading the persistent effect wrong?

File: b4548114b153208b285f2289f3f685daf9ecfbc1844f23606550799465485bf7.jpg (24KB, 480x178px) Image search: [Google]

24KB, 480x178px

Wuz the Black Striders Kangz N Shieet?

>>52018466
no, they had their homelands stripped by them bitchass vampires tho

>>52018518
>>52018466
10/10 best tribe to make into Follower of Set Abominations.

File: What did they mean by this.jpg (86KB, 377x753px) Image search: [Google]

86KB, 377x753px

>>52018466

File: sees the knot.png (84KB, 186x198px) Image search: [Google]

84KB, 186x198px

>>52018578
if mages can't resist the knot what makes you think you and your pathetic vampire cult stands a chance?

>>52018743
>TFW you can now use Settite Sorcery to make people addicted to the knot

>>52006167
It's not vague, they are literally gears sticking up through the floor. They mention this several times.

>>52018743
Please stop trying to ruin mage boipussy

File: that giving mages the knot look.jpg (12KB, 246x246px) Image search: [Google]

12KB, 246x246px

>>52018832
>trying
I got bad news for you, buddy

>>52018859
Only Entropy mages should be getting knotted against their will. Other mages are innocent

File: Voormas.png (129KB, 470x470px) Image search: [Google]

129KB, 470x470px

>>52018859
>>52018880
>TFW an entropy mage obviously wants the knot

>>52018918
lolVoormas

A whole legion of werefaggots would get annihilated by him lifting his pinky finger off of his cane.

>>52018938
>Eviscerate
too bad you can't knot an eviscerated corpse
...or can you?

File: IMG_0717.jpg (46KB, 888x456px) Image search: [Google]

46KB, 888x456px

How did humanity not go extinct in pre-history on a planet crawling with chaotic and neutral evil creatures?

What is a caveman supposed to do against against a werewolf or vampire?

>>52019066
>implying pre-history existed
lol sleeper

>>52019066

The Werewolves ruled over humanity until the Humans chimpedout.

>>52019066

What is the werewolf or vampire going to do if the caveman turns out to be a mage?

has anyone seen an interactive, dark ages, second edition character sheet pdf? i looked through the megas and found a 2nd edition character sheet, but i'm spoiled and looking for something interactive

>>52019151
they'd be fine, lawnchairs hadn't been invented yet

>>52019066
>What is a caveman supposed to do against against a werewolf or vampire?

By threatening to make pictograms of them of course. Didnt our savior David Hill teach you anything?

>>52014370
oWoD's system is a piece of shit

It's so shitty you'll never get anyone who will want to play it.

nWoD is understandable but 2e is for cuckadoodles. Soon you'll need to buy 3e.

File: FIOmqJ.jpg (60KB, 530x535px) Image search: [Google]

60KB, 530x535px

>>52007824
>I don't need Forces to use its arcana

why some introductory rules use d6 instead of d10?

>>52019268
>2e is for cuckadoodles

Go fuck yourself Anon

>>52019066
by lighting them on fire

>>52019346

He is not wrong though.

>>52019415

Nah, you're just a total fucking faggot.

>>52018938
He wouldn't have fallen to Jhor had he been knotted

>>52017894
As a Mage supremacist you need to bend over and receive your nightly knot

File: 74G3dg.jpg (35KB, 550x325px) Image search: [Google]

35KB, 550x325px

>>52019346
>>52019420
>assumes everyone is the same poster
>SJW tier rhetorician
>Cuckadoodles

What a cuck thing to do,
no wonder you enjoy edition 2,
he plays a vampo poo,
and then gets jewed,
By better splats,
then in a year,
a new edition too

>>52019066
Nothing. Remember, the Ancients enslaved humanity totally until they got wrecked.

>Uses mind to make four new minds
>Use Prime to hook up minds with part of one's own arcana
>Suddenly I can cast five spells at once at five different targets

File: 1488235037868.png (479KB, 1159x913px) Image search: [Google]

479KB, 1159x913px

>>52018579
I don't know why spooks want to tarnish Lovecraft for naming his cat the best name when WoD pulls shit like this and pepe every edition.

Has anyone here ever played Urban Shadows?

Does anyone have the Kickstarter files?

>>52019740
>PEPE illustrating a silver ladder rote
Kek confirmed for oracle

>>52006422
I like that was have designated nigger factions.

And a designated "pfft, nothing personel kid" legacy for magies, but mostly the nigger thing.

>>52006422
>Vampires
Brujah's clan weakness is chimping out, so they're the obvious winners

>>52020073
Their signature character is also a straight up blaxploitation hero. He's fucking Django Befanged.

File: 1431318442661.png (724KB, 710x592px) Image search: [Google]

724KB, 710x592px

>>52019817
Pepe wants to awaken the neckbeards and enslave the normies.

Every now and then, anons reply with the perfect amount of smug, the ultimate one liner that rips a hole in space/time centered on their screen, and He appears.
>Climb his silver ladder, anon.

>>52016487
Pew pew, birds! Vampire zombies! Cucked by Mages! Pew pew! More birds! Muh Roman origins!

File: So this is Mage Supremacy.gif (1011KB, 500x273px) Image search: [Google]

1011KB, 500x273px

>Using Shifting Sands to travel back to before the Hierarch betrays (and attempts to kill) the entire Consilium, and before the revelation that the city as a whole is under a Pax-Arcanum-Breach level spell to introduce Fallen Ladder Sympathy involving 4+ Arcana (this is my theory)
GM had to halt the session so he could decide what this means

>>52020275
Good point. Brujah are the Chimp Kings of V:tM. Not even sure who a good runner up would be. Probably either Gangrel fucks or those WE WUZ KANGZ Nosferatu losers.

>>52020604
we wuz sages n shieet but then they tremeres came out of them pantries

>>52020275
*smacks lips*

>>52020655
HOL UP

>>52019341
is first edition d6 only?

>mage supremacy

>>52019341
>>52020980
Because D6s are way more common than D10s.

>>52019341
5,6 sux is roughly about 33.33% 1/3

so it works

File: sam legit.gif (441KB, 500x278px) Image search: [Google]

441KB, 500x278px

>>52017001
>restart a fan project that was stopped due to illegal use of IP
>New owners of IP planning on making a AAA game

Yeah, I'd say no.

>>52019341
Quickstarts were meant to be just that, quickstarts. d6s are more common than d10s and more readily available.

Honestly, I really love the quickstarts. They do a good job of being a 'quick game' for pickup and such.

>>52019066
>chaotic and neutral evil
There's a little bit of complexity to that. The thing about Vampire is that no matter how much of a good person you try to be, you're still a blood-drinking corpse that dies in sunlight. If you want to go full rebuke to the setting your best bet is to be undead Daredevil.

Similarly, werewolves are fighting to save us all... but that doesn't change the fact that they're anger fueled killing machines that are permanently locked in the bronze age and to say that they're out of place in the world in which they have to fight is an understatement.

Mages have it the easiest in this regard because They're just people who've received an upgrade. However, they're more prone to realpolitik than vampires at the higher levels.

Why should I play Hunter instead of Monster of the Week?

>>52022825

This makes me angry.

>>52022720
>your best bet is to be undead Daredevil.

I believe your best bet is to be Morphius, the Living Vampire if you wanna be a comic book superhero.

>>52022882
Its a lovely and cute movie though

>>52022825
>Father's Form
pls go

>>52022679

I still dream of following in the footsteps of Qwixalted, taking the quickstarts and creating my own Quickening Darkness RPG.

>>52022825
>Mage receiving the knot

File: 1488668400290.jpg (52KB, 598x338px) Image search: [Google]

52KB, 598x338px

>>52013485
Prime wifey is more subtle beyond the obvious making more waifus out of tass.
She enchants your balls to be a node of mana.

Soon every mage bitch looking to recharge starts knocking down your door.

>>52023129
That's so fucking cruel.

Not that the roles can't be reversed.

>>52023129
Isn't that where the path of wizardry begins? If you ever give your sperm to a woman, you lose your mana and can never become a wizard?

>>52022887
Yeah, but Daredevil did that whole guilt and redemption thing better than Morpheus the lab vamp ever did.

>>52023119
Innocent mages shouldn't be getting the knot

What's Istanbul like in Old World of Darkness?

>>52011291
oWoD newfag here:
>Assamites
They could have gone with a cult or something.
>Caitiff
Mongrel vampires are great.
>Brujah
I'd never thought about a roidrage vampire before. The execution is kinda eh.
>Followers of Set
I'm still not even sure what they are. Crimelord vampires working for some egyptian god, right?
>Gangrel
Pretty cool, agreed.
>Giovanni
I dig the isolationism and the mafia theme.
>Lasombra
What >>52017646 said.
>Malkavian
So much potential. If a player chooses one, make sure to work a lot with him to avoid fishmalks. Or just kick him out, which is faster.
>Ravnos
I don't know much about them but, I like the idea of illusionist vampires.
>Toreador
Obsessive pretty vampires are an important side of the mythos, I guess.
>Tremere
Interesting.
>Tzimisce
Great.
>Ventrue
What my head cannon of vampires was before getting into VtM.

File: tumblr_o1ixwtk31w1qhttpto4_1280.jpg (658KB, 1280x915px) Image search: [Google]

658KB, 1280x915px

What's it like to tage Mage's virginity?

>>52011291
>Assamites
They make more sense as a small Sect rather than a Clan, but I'm really fond of them.
>Brujah
I really love the 'fallen idealists' thing they have going on. That sort of tarnished lineage thing is what I want out of Vampire.
>Followers of Set
THAT'S NOT WHAT SET DOES OR IS LIKE YOU FUCKERS JUST MAKE BAALI A CLAN AND HAVE THESE BE A SPLINTER GROUP CALLED 'THE FOLLOWERS OF APEP' FUCK
>Gangrel
Better werewolves than Werewolf.
>Giovanni
The Cappadocians are better in every single way, and the organized crime angle has always been stupid.
>Lasombra
"What if the Ventrue had an overpowered Discipline and better clothes?"
>Malkavian
I've literally never seen one played well. At best, they're offensive, at worst, they completely disrupt the flow of the game.
>Nosferatu
I've never seen the appeal, but don't hate them. Their focus on secrets is fun; their focus on computer hacking is stupid.
>Ravnos
I'm so tired of explaining to people that the old take was racist and is no longer canon. V20DA did them best.
>Toreador
I've never seen the pont.
>Tremere
They should be their own Sect and less overpowered.
>Tzimisce
I wish they were all Old Clan kolduns.
>Ventrue
Bland but fine.

Requiem = Dark Ages >>>>>> Masquerade.

Would Don Quixote and Baron Munchausen be good inspirations for a Changeling: the Dreaming chronicle?

>“When life itself seems lunatic, who knows where madness lies? Perhaps to be too practical is madness. To surrender dreams — this may be madness. Too much sanity may be madness — and maddest of all: to see life as it is, and not as it should be!”

>Why, why, why! Because it's all logic and reason now. Science, progress, laws of hydraulics, laws of social dynamics, laws of this, that, and the other. No place for three-legged cyclops in the South Seas. No place for cucumber trees and oceans of wine. No place for me.

>>52023504
Horrifying. Because the mage forced you to do it.

Even if you don't realize it at the time.

>Mind is rape

>>52023606
Yes.

File: poop.png (220KB, 1280x1094px) Image search: [Google]

220KB, 1280x1094px

Daily reminder that both versions of Mummy are complete doo doo.

>>52023702
>implying

>>52023708
>reminding

>>52023702
Nobody even plays Mummy.

Except for atamajakki.

But who cares about that guy?

File: NflMC1t.jpg (61KB, 600x618px) Image search: [Google]

61KB, 600x618px

>>52023608
No, it was completely consensual.

>>52023969
That's exactly what the Mind Arcanum wants you to think.

>>52024002
Mages are sweet and innocent, they could never do something so horrible

>>52024016
Of course not my child, trust, believe in the Paternoster.

So how common are multiple family members awakening? Pretty sure I read its quite rare, but in the mage sample characters theres a family with at least 4 awakened in it.

>>52024116
Mages are crazy fucking rare, what's more being exposed to the kind of magical shit that causes some people to awaken is no guarantee at all that that'll work for someone else. In fact, it likely won't.

Basically you have to be in a receptive state for the Watchtowers, then they have to be in the mood to extent their blessing (Imperial Spell).

Best you can do is be a Sleepwalker, Proximus, or have some other kind of Supernatural merit, and pursue that shit as much as possible, figuring everything out for yourself.

Then get really, really lucky.

Or be an Archmaster and turn your kids into Proximi.

>>52024149
So Whim's family just got super fucking lucky in the mage lotto I guess.

Is there any way for another supernatural to defend against an ES Unmaking killing spell?

Or is the supernatural just plainly fucked?

I'm concerned because Masters have insanely good ES chances once they reach 5+ Gnosis.

>someone on /tv/ is trying to argue that Kindred: The Embraced was faithful to the source material

Has anyone here watched that shit?

>>52020592
>not locking down Time in whole town before revealing your keikaku
It's like years and years of magic were lost on your GM, anon.

>>52024279
Some kind of magical shield; anything that turns it into Clash of Wills, where they can use their power stat to defend.

>>52024414
Exceptional Success on the casting roll Anon.#

Also Hierarch-Senpai was a Mastigos, and I'm pretty sure not that proficient in Time.
If at all.

>>52011291
>Assamite
OP but awesome all the same. They're a sect unto themselves as well as a clan.

>Brujah
Blue Collar Generic Vampire. Still awesome because that niche needs to be filled. They don't fill out the "Just a vampire" role better than the Toreador, however.

>Followers of Set
Robert E. Howard style snake cultists. Yes please.

>Gangrel
Have some of the most iconic vampire powers and the slow dissolution of personality thing that they have going on is classic V:tM. Very yes.

>Giovanni
Super rich Italian cousin fuckers? I have never wanted to play one and will never play one but goddamn do they make great NPC fodder.

>Lasombra
Not very iconic vampire buuuuuuuut... they play their role as honest Ventrue well. Their unique discipline is straight booty, however ZOMG PLS NERF

>Malkavian
White Wolf hath dared too mightily.

>Nosferatu
They need a sliiiiiiiightly more sympathetic portrayal. Kind of like how the Technocracy got in their guide. "Do you like not being murdered by fucking werewolves all the time? You're welcome. Yes, we're the heroes. Really."

Something along those lines.

>Ravnos
I have never used nor will ever use one of these. They could disappear tomorrow and I wouldn't notice.

>Toreador
White Collar Generic Vampire. Thematically, they make a very good Anne Rice style vamp and there's a rich vein to be mined with the bored degenerates angle. Monsters who seem reasonable on the surface but get up to all kinds of horrid shit behind closed doors.

>Tremere
Play up the "Conspiracy within a conspiracy" Angle, let simmer and then serve over ice. Serves a family of five.

>Tzimisce
Yes. Yes yes yes oh my fucking god yes. They do the "Degenerate nobility turned violent punks" angle better than the Brujah ever could. Go back to dark ages or just Eastern Europe to drive this angle home. Show the players how far they've fallen from their great-grand sires.

>Ventrue
They fill a niche well, but they fill it boringly.

>>52023564
Yeah, yeah, yeah, You think all apocalypse players are neo-nazi Trump fans despite the fact that the setting was clearly written by hippies. We get it.

>>52024543
Clash of Wills, anon. No way around it.

>>52024642
Blame the GM Anon, also we were in a neighbouring city, having barely survived an ambush, and were travelling back to before when we think he went nuts.

This is seriously some pet peeve tier annoyance, but I can't handle the fact werewolves in the 2nd edition of Forsaken must eat meat. I don't know why, I just find it completely retarded and pointless. It adds nothing to the story or characters, it's not like we needed yet another reminder they were hunters and predators. Feels like someone just had to fill another row on the Primal Urge chart to make them more comparable to vampires or something.

>>52024741
I feel ya. Especially given that neither men nor wolves are actually obligate carnivores. Cats literally can't handle vegetable material, they'll just throw it up (it's why cats who are feeling sick will start eating grass. They want to throw up whatever bad thing they ate). Wolves, in the wild, will eat a fair amount. It's not their favorite thing ever, but they will eat it and in fact NEED to in order to be at their healthiest.

>>52024760
>It's not their favorite thing ever,
Wolves eat berries and melons quite happily.

>>52009741
She is very dark skinned for a Carpathian aristocrat.

>>52024741

Werewolves don't honestly line up with actual wolves very well at all. It's kinda funny when they talk so much about doing it like nature.

>>52024770
I know, but given the choice and assuming ideal conditions they'll eat meat first.

File: TomboyMonk.jpg (154KB, 1748x2480px) Image search: [Google]

154KB, 1748x2480px

cutie Obrimos Arrow with Shadow Name is symbolic of the Sun

>>52017001

...they were going to remake Bloodlines? It's not THAT old yet, and still looks and plays pretty well on max settings. You wouldn't be able to get the same level of voice actors and such, unless they planned on ripping assets. Consider the amount of work that would have been involved, it sounds like a doomed and pointless project in the first place. That cease and desist was a mercy. Cruel as that sounds.

>>52024805
>It's not THAT old yet
13 years is a long time in the video game world. Consider that Black Mesa started when HL1 was only 8 years old.

>>52024279
No, there is absolutely no way of defending against it, unless you're lucky and can trigger a Clash of Wills. Somehow. Even then the Mage will likely (far more often than not) win at it. Wizards demand high Willpower.

Masters are supposed to be terrifying. Balance isn't focal in crossover unless the ST starts trimming things down.


>>52024448
>Some kind of magical shield
So only Mages can defend against it?

>Clash of Wills
Not everything is clashed

>>52024741
I will miss the mental image of a bunch of gruff werewolves in leather jackets and chains sitting around a table in someone's dingy apartment gruffly eating pizza. It was somewhat iconic of the World of Darkness for me. That surreal combination of the modern world and old folklore.

For that alone, I don't like the "only meat" thing. Werewolves should be able to eat pizza, dammit.

>>52024830
>So only Mages can defend against it?
Also Ephemeral Entities.
They can use their Influences to contest Unamking.

>>52024848
Those aren't exactly playable.

We're discussing actual Templates.

>>52024868
>Not playable
And?
Either you're a non-Mage and you're a retard for putting yourself into such a situation, or you're a Mage in a Mage game and it doesn't really fucking matter.

I could see Changelings getting a clash against Fate spells with Embracing the Wyrd, Sin Eaters against Death spells through calling on their Geist, and Demons in many cases which seek to subvert their form while in their Cover.

Really though, doesn't fucking matter.

>>52024830
>So only Mages can defend against it?
Depends on the GM. There is no such ritual in Theban Sorcery, Cruac or Coils (I take vampires as an example), but I'd allow one.

>>52024915
Those examples are far too situational and specific to be reliable, yet still good examples.

>>52024925
That's just it. You have to house-rule when it comes to dealing with Mages in crossovers.

File: 1466546694859.jpg (213KB, 1920x1080px) Image search: [Google]

213KB, 1920x1080px

>>52024824

True, but Bloodlines looked good at release and looks decent even now. I just see how you could look at image related and decide "yeah, let's build a team, and spend years making something that will... well... probably look not much better and sound a lot worse than this niche game."

>>52024947
>That's just it. You have to house-rule when it comes to dealing with Mages in crossovers.
Well, not really, because inventing new blood rituals is the part of the rules.

>>52024279

Masters can eventually garner a solid 90% chance of acquiring Exceptional Successes using their single Reflexive Yantra.

I'm not even going to bother mentioning the various other tricks they have up their sleeves.

>>52024953
What Bloodlines needs, other than all the shit Wesp5's patch does, is an upgrade off the beta version of Source that it's on. Take advantage of all the shit that got added between Source '04 and Source '13.

>>52024973

I doubt that would even do anything when you consider just how good Masters are at bypassing defenses.

>>52024982

Master mages are truly some of the most terrifying people that your average character may run into in the CofD, even without the ES trick or insta-kill Unmaking effects

This was an intentional game design decision, and for a great many, a feature, not a bug, in the setting.

One does not attack Merlin, Gandalf or Dr. Strange, one negotiates respectfully and prays for luck.

>>52025031
Well, that gives them at least a chance to resist the spell.

Why are mages so fucking powerful?

>>52025180
Because they are the cutest.

>>52025180
Because they have access to the cheat engine of reality

>>52025180

I fail to see why vampires, fairies and werewolves should be stronger than wizards?

>>52025180

Someone has to be the most powerful splat, might as well be mages.

>>52025253
It also makes the most sense that it would be them.

>>52025046
That's probably my biggest problem with Mage being in a shared universe. With the amount of power they wield and the ease with which they can deploy it history sections on rowdier locations should at some point go, "and then Dracula upset one two many apple carts and he and everyone allied with him spontaneously combusted."

This is ignoring that it's easy to secretly seize control of a supernatural government structure with the right Arcana. You'd think it would be pretty common for some high ranking Seer in any given city to have the Prince in his pocket.

Or when something extremely dangerous like an Idigam rolls through town that could threaten a bunch of people and threaten a bunch of possible Mysteries. Mages should be aware of the situation before everyone and be better able to handle the problem. Obviously when it is a little problem they'd probably ignore it so they could study it, but when a primordial spirit starts sucking out human souls and fusing them with spirits to create spirits with human memories and thought patterns Mage society would want to put a stop to it.

>>52025180
>Why are mages so fucking powerful?

You need to focus on the themes of the individual game lines.

Mage is largely about what happens to regular people when granted immense reality-bending power with few boundaries and limitations. It's also a metaphor for privilege and consequence.

In a game about corruption of power, if the splat and mechanics didn't provide such great power, it would not fit the setting.

Within its own line, mages face adversaries that are equal in power, including anti-reality horrors and other mages. Against their intended antagonists, mages certainly aren't "too powerful".

The discussion only arises in the context of crossover and fan competition. That's why crossover is almost always a mess. The dissonance of the themes and priorities of the various game lines are rarely, if ever, copacetic.

>>52024620
>niche needs to be filled.
Why couldn't over Clans cover the niche collectively? Clans shouldn't be cardboard cutout walking stereotypes.

>Tremere
Compared to the rest of Masqurade the Tremere feel like wizards first and Vampires second. That isn't surprising seeing as how they were ported over from Ars Magica.

>>52025323
Well, Mages arguably deal with the most powerful antagonists in the entire setting. So of course they would need the necessary power to push them back.

As such, they don't see the need to deal with the other splat's issues, as they have bigger fish to fry.

>>52024741
>>52024760
It is a reflection of a Werewolf slowly needing to eat stuff higher higher on the foodchain and closer to themselves spiritually.

Spirits>Carnivores>other animals>everything else.

Also Werewolves can still eat other food for pleasure, they just can't get any nutrients from it.

>>52025352
The Idigam are more dangerous than plenty of Abyssal shit (of course the opposite is just as true). A large enough Parliament of Strix or out of control Shartha population would probably also garner their attention.

>>52025323

Mages can be everywhere all the time. They are also not superheroes or police. They rarely want to put their important selves at risk without significant benefit.

I believe one of the best ways to "balance" mages against the rest of the supernatural population without disregarding the setting or altering the mechanics, is simply to make the Awakened much rarer in proportion to other splats.

This should be relatively easy, particularly in 2e, where Dave has emphasized that the majority of the Orders and cluts are mostly comprised of various types of Sleepwalkers and even many Sleepers, while mages are just the few individuals atop the power pyramid.

Look at the most recent Dresden files books or inspiration. We learned that Harry, a single White Council wizard, was a significant enough force that many baddies avoided Chicago entirely, and in his absence, the city went to shit despite the best efforts of much of the remainder of the supernatural community. Entreaties were made for more WC Wizard assistance, but the WC simply lacked the resources, and even other friendly wizards like Ramirez just didn't have the time and resources to help.

>>52025414
Yeah, no. Moros are hard counters to any Strix and Abyssal Entities include actual sentient timelines and living realities such as the Prince of 100,000 Leaves. Then you got the Exarchs which already won their right to rule over the planet.

The only splat antagonists that you can actually compare would be the God-Machine and a select few from Mummy.

>>52025414
>The Idigam are more dangerous than plenty of Abyssal shit (of course the opposite is just as true). A large enough Parliament of Strix or out of control Shartha population would probably also garner their attention.

If things really got out of control, mages would probably step in and help. However, I imagine that they would lead from behind so as to not risk their vastly superior selves.

I also assume the Mysterium would likely want to delay any assistance in order to provide the opportunity to both carefully study and record the phenomena as well as allow a significant culling of the sleeper herd.

>>52025456

Don't forget fallen Supernal gods, which would eat any Idigam for breakfast.

>>52025471
>Don't forget fallen Supernal gods

Like the God Machine in Imperial Mysteries...

>>52025471
Are there any suggestions for Idigam rank?
I would assume no lower than 4, and no higher than 6?

>>52025475

That poor robot, being kicked out of his house by those meany wizard lords of Atlantis.

>>52025456
>>52025471

What about the evil mustache-twirling Archmages? Can't forget those baddies.

>>52025480
The most powerful Idigam was ranked at 6.

>>52025480
>>52025536

Idigam Rank doesn't translate to Spirit Rank.

A low ranked Indigam is still vastly more powerful than any Spirit below Rank 6.

>>52025416
>Look at the most recent Dresden files books or inspiration

I would love to see Dresden Files under the CofD rules.

Isn't Dave a DF fan?

>>52025545

I'm going by the books here. They use ranks, and the most powerful Idigam currently on record was Gurdilag at Rank 6 with potentially higher Idigam rolling around somewhere

>>52025545
Spirits aren't the only entities to use ranks. Imperial Mysteries uses charts for Deathlords, Supernal Beings, Archmages and a few others.

>>52025596
>Rank 6 with potentially higher Idigam rolling around somewhere

They're still probably on the moon.

NASA probably hasn't returned to the moon because smart mages have stopped the dangerous and ignorant monkeys from causing more trouble.

Has DaveB released any official Deviant Open Development material?

>>52025456
>Moros are hard counters to any Strix.
The Strix can be a real pain for newbies because of their ridiculous Resistance. They wouldn't bother with a small number of Strix. If you get enough of them in one place sooner or later something cataclysmic will happen. That's ignoring all the people getting possessed or turned into Vampires. You also have to remember Vampires lack the means to easily fight the Strix outside of Blood Sorcery or certain rare Bloodlines and Devotions.

>Abyssal Entities include actual sentient timelines and living realities such as the Prince of 100,000 Leaves.
Most Abyssal entities are not the Prince of 100,000 Leaves. There is a reason I specifically said "plenty."

>>52025462
>If things really got out of control, mages would probably step in and help. However, I imagine that they would lead from behind so as to not risk their vastly superior selves.
They sure seemed to be doing a whole lot of nothing during the Idigam Detroit thing despite the Idigam being a Rank 6 super spirit that created dozens of human souled spirits and Claimed.

>>52025596
>>52025615

Archmasters represent each rank based on their individual capabilities. It's one of their many advantages, as everything else is forever frozen and can't increase in power, while the super-wizards can.

They can eventually rival Luna. Spirit 9 Transfiguration alone can enslave her.

>>52025475
That was speculation and a really, really boring answer to what the G-M is.

>>52025636
>Enslave Luna

So, could a sufficiently perverted Archmaster build a harem of gods?

>>52025633
Clearly the Idigam wasn't a threat if they didn't bother.

>>52025633
>Idigam Detroit thing

What self-respecting mage resides in Detroit?

That shithole was lost to the Abyss decades ago.

>>52025665
Spirit Masters can already deal with rank 6 Spirits.. .. .. Above that? Fuck no.

Or maybe not, as Masters of Fate could punk even the Gentry, which are rank 7, even easily if they decide to Unmake their names/titles.

You need to be specialized to deal with these beings pre-Archmaster, but it CAN be done.

>>52025665
>>52025699
I remember that at some point someone (Chris Allen, DaveB or a book I think?) said that Idigam can't be controlled or shaped by Spirit magic. If they could than you run into the bigger problem of Mage enslaved Idigam.

>>52025773
Dave also mentioned that an Archmaster would be more than enough to deal with an Idigam.

>>52025832
That doesn't matter for this topic though because Archmaster's don't get involved in this sort of thing.

>>52025773

That sounds strange, to say the least. I don't think DaveB would have said that. Unless he did.

That would leave his previous comments about "punking" the Idigam as moot.

>>52025335
>In a game about corruption of power, if the splat and mechanics didn't provide such great power, it would not fit the setting.

I see your point, but I disagree; the theme of "corruption through power" could just as easily be explored via more "low-power" scenarios where the characters can't cause the universe to explode by farting or some crap.

A pimp abusing women just because he has power over them, a mayor slowly losing sight of his moral compass as bribes start stacking up, and so on are just two perfectly valid examples of being corrupted through power. Hell, we could spend DAYS writing up all sorts of concepts where you don't need the power to make countries go "boom" for a "power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely" theme to fit.

Even if mages only had access to, like, one or two dost in any sphere, the theme of "slowly being corrupted and abusing one's powers" could be achieved just as easily.

Of course, the same goes for all the other splats: vampires could slowly degenerate into monsters even if they lacked high-power disciplines, werewolf and their gifts, blablabla.

You could just as easily make the (false) claim that for example Werewolves MUST have the hope of becoming the potentially most powerful, otherwise their struggle to save the Earth would render playing a werewolf meaningless, since their splat is all about hope and fighting for a better tomorrow and avoiding the end of the world.

In other words, while I understand that *some* splat probably has to have the highest rank of "power" in a crossover setting, and it's totally fine for it to be Mage, the idea that it MUST be the Mage-splat because Mage is about corruption through power is just silly.

>>52025870
>the idea that it MUST be the Mage-splat because Mage is about corruption through power is just silly

It's not silly. That's one of the focal themes of it all. I'm sorry you disagree with something that has always been present and far more weighty over the other gamelines.

The obsession of power has been one of the many pillars of Mage since the days of Ascension.

>>52010577
>Vamps that achieved golconda transcend on the spot.

Actually, that point is left open for Storytellers, since Golconda is whatever you want it to be.

If you want Golconda to be about "transcending and leaving your vampiric unlife behind", sure. If you want it to be "you become a potentially super-powerful and humane vampire", go for it. If you desire it to result in "you finally realise that surrendering to the Beast is the only true way to Golconda", great! If you want it to be "You achieve Golconda, and then God descends and says 'lol nice try' and instakills you on the spot", WHATEVER WORKS FOR YOU!

Golconda is left intentionally vague so that STs can fill in the blanks themselves.

>>52025870

The sorcerer stereotype / trope has always been infused with the addiction and accumulation of power.

Vampires and werewolves not so much. The strongest fictional wizards have always been stronger than the fictional former.

>>52025847
Either way it doesn't matter. If Spirit Mages can easily deal with Idigam they should. The amount of trouble they can cause in a human-rich environment would warrant it.

>An entire neighborhood's worth of souls has been stolen. We must put an end to the Reaper menace!
>Actually sir, it appears to be an Idigam.
>Oh, never mind. I'm sure those sexy Werewolves will take it down in a few months. Sure, we might lose a couple of dozen more Sleeper souls and possibly those of our friends and family, but it is a small price to pay for my precious time.
>But sir, you're a Time master!
>Don't talk to me or my wife's son ever again.

>>52025842
>>52025832
Archmasters can go suck a dick. If they don't do anything, then they're useless. Just a means for mages to wank.

>>52025930
It doesn't help that enemy Mages have to carry the idiot ball because if every Mage were halfway competent they'd be doing the same shit PCs do which would turn the whole game into a huge mess.

>>52025894
>The obsession of power has been one of the many pillars of Mage since the days of Ascension.

Yes, and as I just pointed out, the splat neither requires world-destroying spells in order to play out a "power corrupts" theme, nor would the splat be lessened by the removal of them.

It's just the simple truth, anon.

>>52025958

The simple truth is that you don't like the concept of such world bending powers. Equality isn't the prime directive of Chronicles, even the Developers acknowledge this. Balance derives from the specific game-line in itself, not outside sources and crossovers.

If you don't agree with the premise, don't play the game. And Jesus, stop enforcing your views like they're fact. There is no truth to what you write, only opinionated words.