/CofD/ &/wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness

>>51203790
Probably not

File: Malkavian.pdf (1B, 486x500px)

1B, 486x500px

An update to that VtM Monster Manual I was making. I couldn't resist having some fun with this entry.

Walk your own path

>>51203790
>Will there ever be a World of Darkness vidya again?
WoD, yep. CofD, nope.
And no CofD novels, comics, or any other kind of extra material.

>>51203790
>Wish the MMO had taken off edition
knowing ccp it would have been 75% spreadsheets.

File: Martin Ericsson.jpg (67KB, 1280x720px) Image search: [Google]

67KB, 1280x720px

>>51204068

>We will never see non-tabletop support for nWoD/CofD
>2e CofD is utter shit because they had to try to differentiate further from the original WoD in attempt to fix something that wasn't broke in the first place

Damn you, Martin Ericsson!

>>51204107
True, as terrible as Paradox Interactive has been with how they're handling White Wolf, at least they have some semblance of interest in the IP (well, one of the IP's anyway)

CCP basically gutted White Wolf to make an MMO that wound up never getting past the concept phase, rendering the whole thing pointless

I don't know which is worse, CCP leaving White Wolf to die on the vine or White Wolf being run by a brain-dead edgelord blinded by nostalgia?

Given how terrible of a human being Martin Ericsson seems to be combined with his contempt for Requiem, I'm tempted to say he is worse than CCP, but not by much.

>>51204589
You're being too harsh on Dracula. He seems an okay dude despite being a nostalgic edgelord with dubious writing skills. He won't pull the plug for CofD, and it isn't his fault if they keep putting out Beast garbage instead of stuff people actually like.

>>51204589
Does Ericsson even have any say in Requiem besides choosing to keep licensing the IP or not?

File: Revy Angry.jpg (102KB, 580x478px) Image search: [Google]

102KB, 580x478px

>>51204688
Either way, I'm done supporting either White Wolf or Onyx Path.

I'll keep my old 1e nWoD books and my 1e/2e oWoD books, and I'll still buy second-hand hard copies of older books off of Amazon, but I will never send Martin Ericsson or the SJW hipster toolbags at Onyx Path another penny of my money.

Fuck them.

Plus, I'm the kind of guy who hacks his WoD settings anyway (I remove the metaplot from oWoD entirely, and remove Humanity and other morality systems from nWoD), so Onyx Path and White Wolf already hate me for having badwrongfun.

Fuck them. I'm glad that White Wolf is no longer in CCP's hands, but they couldn't have been bought out by a worse group of people.

Paradox should just stick to making strategy video games and stay the fuck away from World of Darkness.

File: Justin Achilli.jpg (177KB, 500x376px) Image search: [Google]

177KB, 500x376px

So, who is the worst White Wolf/Onyx Path developer?

Martin "Dracula" Ericsson?

Phil "Satyros" Brucato?

Justin "World of Darkness is Serious Fucking Business" Achilli?

The fucker responsible for Beast (forgot his name)?

>>51204946
Brucato, probably.

>>51204946
I have no idea who any of these people are or the larger politics surrounding White Wolf/Obsidian Path/whatever. I just like Vampire: the Masquerade and am jazzed about V20 existing and getting support.

I also just never cared much for Requiem. It just feels bland and empty next to Masquerade. Not that Masquerade didn't suffer from the reverse of that problem (i.e., bloat). But between the two, I prefer the setting and themes of Masquerade to the setting and themes of Requiem.

>>51204542
Pretty much, yes.
And they are claiming it is to "protect" CofD. That irks me even more.

>>51205011
Meh, I keep the base setting but chuck out the themes for both Masquerade and Requiem. Eat the chicken and throw away the bone is my general approach to WoD's themes.

I just generally prefer Requiem because it has no metaplot and Rule Zero is more encouraged and easier to achieve than in Masquerade, which strongly discourages Rule Zero (at least in Revised).

>>51204946

Personally i think David hill Jr is one of the worse people working for OPP. He is the definite proof of OPP shitty hiring practices of getting people from their own little echo chamber.

Then Phil Brucatto, though i dont blame him as much as the company itself for not reviewing M20, then hitting him with it draft several time on his face and send him to his safe space without a organic dinner until he produce a quality product.

As for Dracula, he hasnt actually release a product just yet.

File: 200px-Rodrick_Ferrell.jpg (11KB, 200x246px) Image search: [Google]

11KB, 200x246px

>>51205048
Martin Ericsson is an utter toolbag who probably got his ass kicked in high school a lot.

He really strikes me as one of those edgelords who cuts themselves while voluntarily listening to Type O Negative, Sisters of Mercy, and Linkin Park.

If Rod Ferrell never snapped, killed two folks, and went to prison, he would've been the American equivalent of Martin Ericsson.

>>51205011
>I just like Vampire: the Masquerade and am jazzed about V20 existing and getting support.

Same here, at least they didnt fuck up masquerade....yet.

>But between the two, I prefer the setting and themes of Masquerade to the setting and themes of Requiem.

In the end is easier to ignore stuff you dont like from a game that is creating stuff you like from nothing.

>>51205048
Martin Ericsson's "Differentiate our WoD" program is OPP's only defense against White Wolf!

>>51205092
True

I'd say Brucato is the worst, given how much of a nutjob he is, with M20 truly revealing the depths of his insanity. Seriously, M20 is like a Chick Tract for Chaos Magick.

After him, I'd say Achilli is the next worst because of his snobby attitude and how he basically made toxic elitism the norm for White Wolf fans with his work in Revised Edition.

Then David Hill is bad for Beast alone.

Ironically, Martin Ericsson is probably the least offensive of the four despite the fact he is a whiny edgelord blinded by nostalgia. He hasn't actually written any game material yet, so we don't exactly know how bad he's gonna be. Worst thing he did was neuter CofD's potential, and considering he could've just discontinued the franchise altogether, that's not as bad as it could have been.

>>51205150
>Then David Hill is bad for Beast alone.
What? Did he even work on that?

>>51205167
I don't know for sure, but I think he may have. I'll have to check my sources.

File: Untitled.png (89KB, 1149x845px) Image search: [Google]

89KB, 1149x845px

>>51205101
Oh yeah, that reminds me, I put together a playlist of pretentious music for my upcoming V20 game. Thoughts?

(For the record, I'm the guy who keeps bring up The World Of Ow I Stubbed My Toe Someone Turn On The Damn Light, so a lot of this is meant to be tongue-in-cheek intentionally edgy)

>>51205101
>in an alternate world, Rod Ferrell is the CEO of White Wolf while Martin Ericsson is serving a life sentence for double murder

>>51205191
In a tongue-in-cheek context, that playlist actually works.

Hell, I'd still use Inner Universe and Dragula in a game's soundtrack unironically.

>>51205150
>how he basically made toxic elitism the norm for White Wolf fans with his work in Revised Edition.

Can you expand on this?

>>51205150
>After him, I'd say Achilli is the next worst because of his snobby attitude and how he basically made toxic elitism the norm for White Wolf fans with his work in Revised Edition.
Thought that was cause of Exalted.

>>51204897

Camilla, please shut the fuck up.

>>51205233
Ever notice the "One True Way" attitude so prevalent in White Wolf's fandom.

Justin Achilli essentially normalized that shit with his decisions made during Revised Edition's run.

The whole "If you're not playing overly angsty personal horror, you're playing the game WRONG!" attitude.

1e and 2e oWoD had personal horror, but it was treated as one valid theme out of several other equally valid themes.

>>51205173

David Hill has been great on Changeling so far.

>>51205218
I wanted to put in some Linkin Park, but nothing really felt like it fit. Maybe "Faint" or "Numb". "In The End" and "Crawling" are a little too on the nose, on the other hand.

I'm actually going to go on record as stating that I actually unironically like the My Chemical Romance album The Black Parade. It's a decent rock n' roll album, which is more than I can say for 90% of rock n' roll that come out in the past 10 years. But then again I'm really into 70s/80s rock n' roll in the vein of Slade and early Queen, and The Black Parade was intentionally modeled on that style, so it might just be the appeal factor.

>>51205243
I never read Exalted, so I would not know, but that does not surprise me, to be honest.


>>51205249
We finally got rid of Aspel and now we have Camilla. These threads just can't win, can they?

>>51205256
Nigga what?

Have you read VtM? There's entire parts devoted to telling you to do you. Revised and V20 as a fact were supporters of that .

God damn I wish IanW was around to kick people like you in the face.

>>51205282
Meh, I prefer oldies music from the 50's, 60's, and 70's along with classic rock (1960's-1980's).

Once rock started becoming "alternative", I tuned out.

Classic country is good too, but modern country sucks ass.

>>51205256
Ah, so he's the reason why I felt the need to put a disclaimer in my Vampire Monster Manual.

Personally I think Vampire runs best when it runs like the first 2/3rds or so of Bloodlines. Dark without being oppressive, but lighthearted at times without going full farce. Open to both overt and subtle approaches to problems. The attitude that "being a vampire is awesome" isn't a wrong one.

>>51205291
1e and 2e had that, and V20 brought that back.

Revised had that stuff too, but usually with a backhanded comment on how you didn't truly understand the game.

>>51205317
Yup

Achilli was a shitlord, but he did mellow out somewhat over time.

Brucato is clinically insane while Ericsson is an utter dickwad.

File: Regina.jpg (144KB, 618x800px) Image search: [Google]

144KB, 618x800px

>>51203790
>Will there ever be WoD vidya again?

Probably not and even if there was, it would probably suck.

Speaking of vidya, I miss the Street Fighter RPG that White Wolf made in the 90's. I even mix it with my oWoD games from time to time.

Speaking of Capcom, I wish Dino Crisis would come back.

>>51205319
>Rules-wise, higher existences are tricky because hard-and-fast guidelines rob the accomplishment of its mystery ("If the character sees God, she may ask him 1d3 questions")

From the Revised Clanbook Tzimisce.

For my part, I come from D&D natively, and my approach to the matter is that if D&D can start as a tabeltop wargame where characters were disposable and become a game where individual characters matter and you want to run the same one for years, it's not wrong for WoD to go the other direction.

I also generally prefer having some hard-and-fast guideline rules in order to streamline play. It's not that I'm lazy, it's that when my players are making a mess of things and doing stupid shit like trying to negotiate with the sapient vozhd, it can be a pain in the neck to come up with stuff on the fly.

>>51205409
Whatever its other flaws, D&D has been knocking around for more than 40 years. It's doing SOMETHING right.

>>51205409
Agreed

File: jill001.jpg (18KB, 293x404px) Image search: [Google]

18KB, 293x404px

>>51205398
Too bad the only good Dino Crisis game was the first.

I wish oldschool tank control Resident Evil would come back
Jill is 10/10

>>51205492
Nooot a fan of any Resident Evil before Resident Evil 4. I'm kind of bad at video games that aren't called StarFox 64, see, and inevitably what happened to me in Resident Evils 0-3 and Code Veronica was that within the first 15 minutes I was out of ammo and health and was desperately shuffling away from zombies and/or dogs. It just wasn't fun for me.

Jill is indeed 10/10, though.

>>51205492
This

>>51205522
You are what is wrong with the Resident Evil fandom

File: OnlyREkidswillgetthis.png (158KB, 299x599px) Image search: [Google]

158KB, 299x599px

>>51205522
I probably spent the entirety of my middle school life playing Resident Evil games. The series sort of died to me after 4, which I consider one of my favourite games of all time, but not really a Resident Evil game.

Old Capcom horror games in general were and still sort of are my fucking jam. Haunting Ground was superb and I still play through Clock Tower 3 every now and again.

This also reminded me of an old youtube channel I used to watch and now I'm just ashamed

>>51205658
Tank controls were bad and you should feel bad. It also went downhill on new controls because after 4 they forgot to add horror with their action but that's a completely different axis of good-bad than controls.

>>51205701
I remember her but didn't follow. I wonder if she ever got any better over time?

I also remember Capcom Friends

>>51203816
Ahh, that brings back memories. Nothing like a Fishmalk to make every other character look good by comparison.

Also, do you use a template to make the stat-blocks? I'd love to use that format for my own games.

Is the Viking dark era any good?

>>51205788
Leggy's animation improved with time, but looking back at her channel it all feels sort of adolescent. Stuff that I would be really down with if I was still a teen, but now it just seems sort of mid-2000's lolsorandumy to me.

That was sort of the whole fandom in a nutshell though, lots of lolsorandumness. It still doesn't stop me from getting Capcom nostalgia every now and again though.

>>51205908

It reads like a dry history book and then there's also werewolves. One of the weaker Eras.

>caring about anything other than Forsaken by Rome

>>51205850
Yes. In truth, it's assembled from the D&D 5e's monster statblock, which I find to be among the more elegant ever made given how neatly it organizes things, though obviously it's been heavily modified for my purposes.

Still, if you head over to /5eg/, the Mega in the OP should be able to get you to the Microsoft Word document that contains all the templates n' stuff. The stat-block is made out of a bunch of invisible tables and seems to actively resist attempts to edit it, though, just as a heads up.

It might be just as easy for you to build the thing from scratch in Microsoft Word, using tabs rather than tables.

File: mfw encountering the 'torpid vampire'.jpg (209KB, 1200x800px) Image search: [Google]

209KB, 1200x800px

>>51205924
>That was sort of the whole fandom in a nutshell though, lots of lolsorandumness.

God I remember fandoms for everything back in 2005. I was online before then as a younger teen, but it was around then I first started venturing out of anime forums and getting involved in fandoms and other sites besides with my friend group and going to a local convention. Shit was so terrible.

That's also about when I first stumbled onto this site. There's no escape.There never was.

That feeling when you get rejected from a game simply because the ST didn't like your character concept, even though he asked for 6 players and 6 people posted.

>>51206316
What was your concept?

>>51206320
Rich Moros who survived a near death experience during a sea trip and was carried back to land by someone he saw as Charon The Boatsman. The experience made him reconsider the purpose of money and power, so now he uses his resources and magic for philanthropy. He is a member of the Silver Ladder.

>>51206316
I mean I've shot down PC ideas before because it doesn't work for the game, tonally skewing way dark or light, or due to it being an obvious troll. Usually you work with the player to either fix the idea or go back to the drawing board though.

>>51205908
Not really. It focuses way too much on the wrong things. Like a battle at the ass-end of the era.
It also doesn't bring up the Shadow of old Scandinavia, like, at all.
It has a decent translation of the Technology Gift to a pre-industry setting though.
Oh, and it has a write-up of a Lodge without ANY mechanics. It's literally a waste of space.
Oh, and the Geist tack-on is just bland.

>>51206376
He didn't give say what he disliked about the concept at all, nor did he give any indication that he might accept a modified or alternate concept.

>>51206425
Should have asked, but he should have had some commentary anyway. Weird. Maybe he just really hates one specific aspect. The altruism? The Silver Ladder? Charon?

I'm curious, can Mages summon Wraiths with death magic?
Or any of the other strange things from the underworld like Plasmic monsters?

>>51206481
I dunno, I get the feeling I wouldn't have fun at his table. But that's ok. I can find other games. I am not so sure if my concept is so good either.

Can anything be magic in Mage the Awakening?
Like... no matter how odd the belief it can have supernal relevance and be true magic?

>>51203790
IGNORE X

>>51204688
>Believing Drac has any control over newworld
haha lulz no

>>51206759
What are you talking about?
Belief has absolutely 0 to do with magic in Awakening.

File: vampire 2014-05-06 14-28-27-86.jpg (551KB, 2880x1620px) Image search: [Google]

551KB, 2880x1620px

>>51203790

So what parts of WoD are represented in that image? Other than Vampire.

>Will there ever be a World of Darkness vidya again?

Sure. But I'm not really holding out any hope for it being any good.

>>51204946
>M20
Phil. fuck this hack.

Drac is like that over enthusiastic kid. so meh. good luck to him I guess. maybe he'll make something?

>Beast
The developer succeeded in making a mechanically noob friendly cross splat, but suffered in the writing department(terrible) but I'd chalk that one up to lose time. and cracking under the schedule. Which really does suck. Because it's got some interesting ideas. just didn't come together.

Justin? Don't remember the story on him

>>51206871
Yes?
Like.... anything and everything is magically relevant in Mage. You can have weird mages who believe that the stock markets have a magical influence over the world and by manipulating them they can cast magic. And it works for them.

>>51203790
>Will there ever be a World of Darkness vidya again?
There's an MMO in the making. For almost a decade now.

>>51207025
Wrong game. Awakening at best you can use some mortal trappings to aid in spell casting but they don't do anything and aren't magic. Ascension is the belief is magic line.

>>51205283
>We ever get rid of anyone
What fresh new hell is Camilla?

File: 1393380474548.jpg (83KB, 500x431px) Image search: [Google]

83KB, 500x431px

>>51206759
No, not really.

Magic in Awakening is not finding Magic in the world, it's using the symbolism of the world to call down the pure power of the Supernal realms.

So for example, there's no inherent Magic in Hermetic concoctions, Druidic chants, and Wiccan rites.
However each of those represents various Supernal symbols in different ways, which a Mage can use to enhance their Magic using them as Yantras.

Basically instead of creating an entire spell by yourself, using nothing but your imagination, you can use those stand-ins, which define parts of the spell by themselves, to enhance your spell.

Also, these traditions can hide kernels of Supernal knowledge, hidden deep within the fallen detritus of Pancryptia, which a Mage can pull forth and learn from. These wouldn't actually let their Sleeper practicers use Supernal Magic, but they might for example include Spirit-summoning rights operating off Fallen magic, or they might just be a hiding place where the Supernal has sequestered away some secrets.

>>51206759
Yes and No

It's mostly based on finding symbolism and sympathetic connections in the world prison . BUT you can buy into and spend exp in order to use off beat tools to still do your magic. It can make for some highly specialized but non then really effective magic

>>51207154
I should also probably clarify when I mean it's not about "finding Magic in the world". I mean it's not about finding the actual ability fo cast Magic in the world.

There's a fuckload of Magic shit going down in the Fallen World all the time, however as a Supernal Mage you're probably just going to be getting enlightenment from that (increasing Gnosis), as well as finding discrete Magical items/effects which you can use for your own benefit.

You can find a lot of Magic in the world.
But you can't find the ability to cast Supernal Magic.

>>51207037
that was cancelled when CCP sold the rights to Paradox

>>51207491
it was cancelled way before that.

>>51206374
Did he tell you why? I'd accept that PC in a heartbeat if I gave two shits about Mage.

>>51206950
Just vampire, that was all concept art from the MMO IIRC.

>>51207491
That was cancelled two years before CCP sold anything to Paradox. They couldn't get enough PSSSSH in it.

>>51207143
Someone who won't shut up elsewhere about how the Morality systems are wrong and how he strips them out and hates the 'standard mode of play' for the WoD games.

>>51207847
>PSSSSH

?

>>51208424
nothin personnel kid

>>51206497
You can summon ghosts with Death magic, as well as command, harm, strengthen, and bind them, but proper Wraiths are a supernal summon. They come from Pandemonium, so you would actually have to be a Disciple of Mind to summon them.

You might mean Spectres, which are one of the supernal summons of Stygia and can be summoned by a Disciple of Death.


please note that I could be wrong, I've never really read up on the subject extensively

File: 1483299217152.png (533KB, 544x544px) Image search: [Google]

533KB, 544x544px

>>51208424

Oh man, you never heard of it?

>This constant build and rebuild approach meant massive issues in the development process. Features that were good enough to retain in one build had to be redesigned from scratch for the next because so many other interconnected parts had changed. Even when there was enough to play, internal testing revealed a confused and unfocused experience.

>Most of the sources spoken to for this piece identified the same problematic CCP manager, who had little vision for what the finished game would look like.

>“Not once could he answer any question about moment-to-moment gameplay or areas of focus,” says one source. “Instead, he preferred to deliver buzzword-laden rambles… It was not uncommon for him to communicate in onomatopoeia.

>"I once saw him looking over the shoulder of a programmer at some bit of User Interface the poor guy had hacked together. He straightened up, put fingers to lips and said, ‘No, this isn't it at all. Make it more... psssshhhh’ He hissed on his fucking fingertips, like the air coming out of a bicycle tire, and then just walked away.”

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/jun/05/world-of-darkness-the-inside-story-mmo-ccp-white-wolf

So how bad is Conquering Heroes?

>>51208619
Bad. Don't read it.

>>51208642
Thought as much. Same style as Beast?

>>51208691
Yes, but with dick eggs.

File: 1467483715165.png (11KB, 638x94px) Image search: [Google]

11KB, 638x94px

>>51208424

>>51208719
That a new kind of creature?

>>51208738
Yep. And those dick eggs, cause consumers to also produce dick eggs!

What do you guys think of Boston Unveiled? It has some cool stuff in it. I wouldn't mind playing a game based on it.

If I could ever find anyone to play with

So one of my Mage players is playing a Silver Ladder Lictor. I'm currently trying to think up a situation where he could be called in to perform his duties as magical judge & investigator.

I want to have a scenario where there's a small-scale conflict between the Guardians of the Veil and the Silver Ladder, but where, if you look deep enough, the Guardians are actually in the right. Or at least, MORE in the right.

What are some reasons that Mages from those two orders could come into conflict?

>>51209158
>What are some reasons that Mages from those two orders could come into conflict?
For the same reason that different branches of law enforcement come into conflict. Maybe the Guardians get handed the official investigation on a crime but your player is ordered to look into it on the sly. Not because he can crack the case, but because the Silver Ladder doesn't trust the Guardians to handle it. So while your player has good intentions he is undermining the Guardians, who also have good intentions.

>>51209158
Disputes over recruitment, and the right to Awaken.
Conflict over the competing rights to use Magic, and to maintain the Veil.
Issues regarding their different policies towards other Supernaturals.

Example conflict:
A local dirtbag with a lot of money, and serious influence has been pubically noted as undergoing a Mystery Play.
The Guardians see him as entirely bereft of virtuous moral fiber, and entirely undeserving of the Awakening he may soon undergo. They are as such considering leveraging the Labrynth to disrupt his burgeoning enlightenment.
The Ladder see him as being an individual, who while a total shitbag, is still deserving of Awakening, and can be taught the principles of the Awakened. Every Soul has the right to Awaken, and do deny that right is to aliken oneself to the Exarchs.
The guy has however already come to the attention of a powerful Seer, who is waiting for him to Awaken, so he can then snap him up immediately, break his will and turn him into his newest Pawn. Even if he doesn't, the man is still entirely unsuitable for the Diamond Orders or Free Council, and will likely either turn to the Seers in time, or become Left-Handed.

Has anyone ever run an antagonist campaign, playing Pures, Seers, Belial's Brood etc...? How did it turn out?

So if I may ask, what exactly is the problem people have with M20? As far as I know V20 and W20 are at least fine, so what happened?
And would anyone have advice for someone who might be interested in running VtM? Are they "x by night" books translatable?

>>51209490

In shortest form, Mage 1e, Mage 2e, and Mage Revised were all WILDLY different games.

Despite ostensibly being about the same stuff, they are hugely separated in terms of theme and approaches, to the point that the fanbase for oMage is fractured.

M20 wasn't big enough to do full service to all 3 of these presentations, so it inevitably had to pick one (primarily 2e's "You're shit and selfish for even participating in the Ascension War"), and piss off everyone else.

>>51209490
There aren't actually rules to play the game in the book. Many of the charts are copy and pasted from old editions with no rules text near by.
Phil Brucato not only doesn't know how to write rules but he killed the core idea of paradigms to jerk off his little group of chaos magick users... (Which he also believes in IRL as well as thinking that playing a nephandi will make you a bad person. Full on Blackleaf going on here)

Its an incomplete mess that he edited himself.

>>51209541
> Many of the charts are copy and pasted from old editions with no rules text near by.
And that's if the charts have /any/ rules text to them.

>>51209530
Was the 2nd ed group at least the biggest or just his favourite?
As well, is 2nd ed good? i got the corebook at half price books, haven't met enough people around my area to play it yet.

>>51209155

Its good but the central mistery (the secret concord) sucks. PC have little reason to know or investigate the secret concord, one dev said the way its suppose to happen the is for the hierarch to hostigate the pcs until they get back on the railroad which is shitty dming 101.

Aside from that it was early in 1st edition so many things dont quite fit on late 1st and second. For example too many uniorder cabals.

I also heard that if you read the GotV order book then the GotV cabal makes no sense but i havent read the order book so i dont know.

>>51209541
>but he killed the core idea of paradigms to jerk off his little group of chaos magick users...

What?

>>51210079
Paradigm doesn't mean anything in the new book. He removed any flavor and uniqueness the Traditions had in favor of just "purple paradigm"
He also writes as if anything else is stupid, in part, because he actually believes that. Like IRL. Hes a nutter that didn't have his book edited and so its a big 700 page mess that I paid way too much money for.

>>51209677

Its a goos game that require A LOT of work from the dm. Not only on the setting but adjudicating rules on the spot that either the game shrugs and tells you to decide for youself or that are just not there.

However is one hell of a flavorfull game, with a little of NWoD attitude of "make the city however you fucking like"

Its basically a game of metaplot without setting.

>>51210161

I dont remember that when i read the paradigm sectionS. The fucking goat boy bucatto divide paradigm in 2 chapters apart from each other fucking moron.

I just remember that it had a section to make your own paradigm that i found convoluted and unnecesary

>>51210228
Its utterly disconnected from the magic you do. It doesn't matter where in the book it is.

File: imagearticlegrande26.png (598KB, 960x540px) Image search: [Google]

598KB, 960x540px

>>51203790

Question here for VTM, would a bank robbery made by vampires be considered a masquerade violation ?

>>51210379

Depends on how they pull it off. If they do it discretly and no proof of supernatural nature is left behind then i doubt it.

>>51210379
Anyone who can't rob a fucking bank without announcing to everyone present that they're vampires is a masquerade disaster waiting to happen anyway.

>>51210379
Not unless they get caught and are obviously vampires. A rash of unexplainable crimes is probably going to attract Hunters though.

>>51206316
He rejected me too but his explanation was having enough players. I think 6 is just the default number of slots on roll 20.

>>51203790
Yes, i think so. Isn't there a mobile game out now?

>>51211512
There's a choose your own adventure audio book thing I think? Or a preview/demo of one.
I think.

>>51210379
Definitely.

The Camarilla will pretty much invariably err on the side of caution and consider it one, even if the robbers did nothing obviously vampiric. The police will investigate (preventing the investigation would likely be a bigger breach than the robbery), and if they identify the robbers (which they nearly inevitably will), they will be identified with people who the records show should be dead. The official story will be that the investigation hit a dead end, but one or two cops (or worse, Hunters) might get overly curious (maybe they've seen this sort of thing happen before and have noticed a pattern) and find out the truth. The Ventrue will probably send a mop-up crew to perform the requisite memory wipes, some judicious and discrete murders might be performed, but they won't be at all happy about it.

It sounds paranoid, but that's how the Camarilla and the Masquerade operate: even the slightest hint that vampires exist is perceived as an immense danger to all Kindred, and must NOT EVER be allowed to happen. The Camarilla motto is basically "NO MISTAKES. EVER. FOR ANY REASON. NO MATTER HOW SMALL."

>>51211719

I get it but if the vampires are already centuries old how could they identify the robbers if they can't even find information about them in the registries ?

>>51211967

centuries old vampires don't need to rob banks to get money

>>51210034
The main thing I like about the book is the way it presents and fleshes out the setting. Boston being an archaic but magically rich place is really interesting. The cabals are mostly alright, and the GotV cabal doesn't make sense anyway. Just a bunch of cryptic assholes who are cryptic assholes for the sake of being cryptic assholes. But the pirate one, the knight one, and the nerd one are all pretty cool.

Plus all the extra shit like the necroamalgalms, the 300 year old necromancer ghost, and Madea the friendly neighborhood Tremere are all neat. I think it would be a good place to set a game with your own main mystery with some of the side plot hooks thrown in.

File: void engineers prepare to combat nephandi astral travellers.gif (2MB, 260x209px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 260x209px

post technocracy memes

File: virtual adepts prepare to fight the Technocracy.gif (1MB, 230x216px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 230x216px

>>51212334

>>51206374
I see nothing wrong with this. Your ST clearly would have sucked anyway.

File: A7OSdgMCQAEGL3x.jpg (21KB, 500x333px) Image search: [Google]

21KB, 500x333px

>>51204946
Reminder: Achilli is a self-important egotist, but he at least is capable of putting out a functional and easy to read product.

"Satyros" is absolutely the worst. The backhanded insults, the bizarre rants that bloat the wordcount (and then the sidebar reminding you space was limited), the fact he scotched the Magic rules in a game about Magic so badly that two books on we still have little idea how it works, the Chaos Magic Cheerleading and shitting all over Foci and Paradigm (according to one Anon it's because the madman thought people could ACTUALLY INFLUENCE REALITY THROUGH THEIR GAMES), broken rules, hard to read rules, hard to understand rules, contradictory rules, missing rules, an entire book that felt like it had been copy-and-pasted at random and then pissed on, just to charge loyal consumers top dollar for the insult.... it all adds up to a big "FUCK YOU".

I can't comment on Beast as I haven't played it, but what little I've seen is simply distasteful (that said, the whole "I throw a skyscraper" shit flies in the face of supposed "crossover" when literally every supernatural race is running some kind of Masquerade).

Martin Ericsson, on the other hand, has yet to shit the bed. I haven't seen anything from him that has really pissed me off. If anything, his voice gets me moist, and I want to fuck his brains out. I wonder if he's ever heard the phrases "gay for pay", "party and play" or "420 for reward".....

File: 1469081160132.jpg (120KB, 465x787px) Image search: [Google]

120KB, 465x787px

Somebody explain Beast to me.

It sounds awful.

>>51203790
Yes, there will be WoD games again. Ericsson is in negotiations with various software companies and working on a "Style Bible" to guide such projects.

Chrod will never receive such treatment, however, as it might distract from the One True WoD in Ericsson's eyes. Although given the direction Beast has taken, perhaps we should be eternally grateful.

>I throw the Eiffel Tower!

File: M20 Food.gif (42KB, 403x509px) Image search: [Google]

42KB, 403x509px

>>51212605

Don't forget about Phil's culinary demands in M20.

>>51206849
Even better, call him a FAT TRANNY BASTARD

>>51207037
DO I have a story to tell you....

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/jun/05/world-of-darkness-the-inside-story-mmo-ccp-white-wolf

>>51212664
Here is some reading material
https://www.reddit.com/r/rpg/comments/38m7wm/beast_the_primordial/

http://projects.inklesspen.com/fatal-and-friends/kurieg/beast-the-primordial/

Lets not have a huge thread fight over this. Largely it is mechanically simple which is good for new players or playing off splats in a mostly one splat game. And it's build a monster aspects are interesting. But its themes and writing have a lot of unfortunate implications

If run well you could have yourself a really interesting idea. but I find it's whole thrwoing the narrative upside down. silly when I can just do that in any other game without needed a new splat with baggage

>>51212728
Its the wasted space that gets to me. This fag made a conscious effort to write this instead of explaining a damn Scrying effect.

>>51212844

You need to get your priorities straight.

How can we possibly role-play a game about modern wizard without Phil's life lessons and recipes for success and happiness. For heaven's sake, the man is such a paragon of creativity, success and enlightenment that he needs a Patreon to help pay his rent.

>>51212728
Complaining about this triggers Aspel more than mentioning people throwing skyscrapers in Beast. I have no idea why. Maybe because it exposes the level of Brucatto's privilege? Not everyone has the time, the money and the resources to roast fucking VENISON for a Tabletop game.

>>51213082
I WOULD HAVE THE MONEY FOR IT IF I HADN'T SPENT $375 ON THE DAMN BOOK

>>51209482
I ran a VII chronicle. It worked out quite nicely. It was set up to be a combination of infiltration chronicle and murderball. We used the Seven Houses version and it worked REALLY well. The players had a good time doing the normal vampire politics, faking being other clans, and then picking targets and doing infiltration and stealth to kill the prime targets.

>>51213097
Yeah, I feel you buddy.

Along similar lines, have you noticed how every sale on DriveThruRPG - and I mean, *every* sale - excludes POD titles? Right now they have a sale on, and it's just to shave a few dollars off their already overpriced .pdf's. I don't *want* a fucking .pdf, I want a fucking book.

It's gotten to the point where I just don't buy POD titles anymore, I order them online from second hand vendors. Fuck the game devs.

>>51213097

You should be proud to own such a luxurious and well crafted paper weight.

Not only was M20 a disappointment, the fact that How DO You do That didn't really explain how the heck you do much of anything really added insult to injury.

I imagine Tome of Secrets will similar be little more than Phil's Tome of Narcissistic Meandering.

>>51210379
Not until the cops figure out names. If it's a big mystery then it's just one more unsolved crime.

Of course, if someone cast Obtenebration 4 in order to pull it off, that's another story.

>>51209530
Can you go into more detail about how they're different? I'm very much into the older stuff and I want to hobble together a working game out of stuff that pre-dates this horrendous M20 "fucken gimme some oh ya cash" edition

>>51213177

I always liked the Seven Houses version of VII the best, but for some reason I just keep coming back to the Sleepers version when actually running Vampire.

>>51213082
>Complaining about this triggers Aspel more than mentioning people throwing skyscrapers in Beast. I have no idea why.

Dont forget questioning his limited understanding of what Fascism is. Or playing carthians in a way outside of the 3 pages of the carthian book he did read.

>>51213199
Unless he got someone else to write it unpaid and nearly unaccredited. Then Tome of Secrets could be good. Or maybe at least functional. Maybe.

>>51213196
Yeah, I always check the sales and its never on what I want. Actual things. I've only gotten two older pdf PODs and I prefer the look of the original print runs to them.
My original plan was to buy the enitre CofD line as it came out. Then Beast happened and now I'm weary everything they sell will be a half rewritten mess.

>>51213272
That's my second favorite version of it. I would totally run another game of that when my Masquerade game ends in November. The shining moment for our players was when they found out the Prince was a descendant of a vampire who was involved by proxy in the fucking-over of the Houses during their war, and so they sought extra hard to end her unlife. These five ancilla-equivalents (IIRC we had two Iranovich, a Marisovich, an Alexander and a Petronavich).

>>51213363
Reminder: he freely admits he doesn't read the books. He just seems to enjoy arguing the indefensible. Remember when he said things don't increase in weight as they increase in size, and the only example he could give was the old "pound of feathers vs pound of lead" exception? Or when he told the disabled Anons (plural) that he knew what their disability meant better than they did?

They should engrave "well ACKSHUALLY" on his tombstone.

>>51213420
Nope. It's literally more of Phil's bullshit, only it's the bullshit they cut from M20 for space reasons.

Who's ready to see how badly he butchers the rules for Sorcerers and Numina?

>>51213527
On top of everything else hes a slow writer too. If it was cut content you'd think he'd be fucking done by now.

>>51213259
>Can you go into more detail about how they're different? I'm very much into the older stuff and I want to hobble together a working game out of stuff that pre-dates this horrendous M20 "fucken gimme some oh ya cash" edition

One of the big differences between Revised and 2nd edition is the avatar storm. Basically the whole "let go to live into the wizard planet" is a non option and travelling to the umbra is gonna fuck you up. That said immediately they release a rote of the dreamspeakers the allows you to bypass that.

Setting wise Revised and late 2nd edition said this "Ascension wars is over, everyone lost and 90s apathy rules the reality" the ascension war became a cold to non-existant war and most of the sides are cleaning house.

Supposedly Revised rules for paradox are super harsh but personally i didnt felt them that way so ymmv.

Revised also introduce Resonance as mechanic which while aparently universally despised i found it that is the best "morality" meter those hacks at WW/OPP ever produce. Basically the more you cast a type of magic or use a type of magic the more resonance of that type you get which is gonna make that kind of magic more powerful the downside of that is that your resonance is gonna infect your magic or make a different type of magic more harder to use.

For example you got a mage who is a little sadistic, and you get a high entropic resonance of pain. So all your spells now (aside from their usual effect) cause searing pain. Which is good when you gonna keep using your magic that way but then if you wanna say heal someone you gonna find out that even your healing is gonna cause intense pain.

Which is a fresh breath of air from the usual simplistic "evil people are weaker" from all the rest of the moralities of Chrod or WoD. It treats the price of power better than any other WoD/Chrod game ever by not making "being bad" and the inefficient option.

>>51213473
>My original plan was to buy the enitre CofD line as it came out. Then Beast happened and now I'm weary everything they sell will be a half rewritten mess.

My recomendation is just buy the 3 cores (Vamp, Mage and Werewolf) the rest is meh. Maybe signs of sorcery wont suck but who knows.

>>51213527
>Who's ready to see how badly he butchers the rules for Sorcerers and Numina?

There wont be rules for sorcerers, phil said that he could do them justice (he dislike them because everything should be Magick to him) and at this time there wont be a 20th representation of them.

>>51213527
>they cut from M20 for space reasons

Considering the unrelated, immaterial and inexplicable crap that was actually included in the M20 brick, I'm afraid to see what OPP and Phil thought actually warranted being cut.

I expect about 200+ pages of Phil's recipes for tofu and kale with some sidebars about postmodern feminist socialism.

Damn I wish DaveB was the developer for M20. Maybe he could Make Ascension Great Again.

>>51213624

As for core supplements, The Pack for Forsaken was actually quite good, but Secrets of the Covenants for Requiem sucked (and was very late, even by WW/OPP standards).

>>51213473
>>51213624
Vamp is a good introduction. And they're all varying levels of good to ok. Beast is just the red headed step child of the bunch

>>51213668
Man you're right. It would be cohesive and I could actually get new people into it. CofD Mage 2nd (or wutever) is much easier sell to players for me.

>>51213668
Maybe White Wolf's 5th edition or by some miracle By Night Studios will Make Ascension Great Again.

>>51213732
>As for core supplements, The Pack for Forsaken was actually quite good, but Secrets of the Covenants for Requiem sucked (and was very late, even by WW/OPP standards).

While good, and a proof that Leblanc art can not suck (Cover not withstanding) it is really PoD worthy? It has very few mechanics and its mostly fluff bits that one wont use in a single game normally.

>>51213624

But Promethean 2e is amazing and Changeling looks super good.

What's your opinion on using famous fictional characters in your games mostly for coolness factor?

>>51213941
Go for it. Bonus points if the character is from classic gothic horror, although it could be entertaining to, in the words of Pete Steele, "take something light and beautiful and feminine and.... mutilate it."

>>51213863

I no longer find many ttrpg books print-worthy, and I'm an ancient, old-school role-player with a very large print rpg book collection.

Whether The Pack is POD-worthy is really a personal decision, with consideration of how much you like and want hardcopies and how useful you find the specific material for your chronicles. I simply believe The Pack easily passes the current minimum "it doesn't suck" standard that now applies to many WW books, and which core books like Beast and supplements like Secrets of the Covenant don't even come close to passing.

>>51213934
>But Promethean 2e is amazing and Changeling looks super good.

Oh yeah forgot promethean, though i dont care for it i heard its pretty good.

Changeling 2nd though is another story. Personally i wont recommend it. It basically enforce its "one true way" to play in many regards and limits character option and play styles in favor of "muh vision". I would never recommend Changeling 2nd.

>>51213966

You need a new meme.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FROn3LtGFl0

>>51214007
That gave us Curse of Sleeping Beauty which I loved without irony when cringe watching with a friend so I guess that's okay then

It is the worst but takes itself so seriously

>>51214007
>>51213941

Abraham Lincoln was a Seer of the Throne and the War of Northern Aggression served the Lie.

>>51205150
>>51205167
>>51205173
>>51205271

I thought David Hill was working on Hurt Locker and Changeling 2e and it was Matthew McFarland that did Beast and Promethean 2e?

>>51214026
Not when shes so cute

File: boipucci.jpg (400KB, 737x1079px) Image search: [Google]

400KB, 737x1079px

Alright lets get to the hard hitting questions
Who would you fuck caine or abel?

>>51214007
>>51213941
>>51214054
>Abraham Lincoln was a Seer of the Throne

Meh, did you know George Washington was embraced in 1797, and ran a shadow US government until he fell into torpor in 1860.

He is prophesied to wake in the next few years, and when he finally rises. he and the Invictus will crush the Carthian scum and Make America Great Again.

>>51214016

Your loss.

>>51214054
If Abe was a Seer wouldn't he have wanted to keep the United States divided and the slaves enslaved? I thought the Seers were big on enforcing class differences.

>>51214187
seriously why would someone in ancient precivilization days before time be wearing fucking earrings what is this gay shit lmao

>>51214242
Obviously they played the long con for Capitalism.

>>51214016
I haven't kept up with the spoilers for Changeling 2ED. What is this One True Way they are trying to impose?

>>51214187
Abel desu, Cain's too much a edge lord.

>>51214187
>not going in for a threeway
absolutely Masquerade-breaching.

>>51214197
Reminder that George Washington was literally bled to death. That's on record. The drunken old souse that treated him bled him twice. A young doctor on hand wanted to perform the world's first tracheotomy, but he was shouted down by assholes that insisted on bleeding him some more.

Someone wanted all that blood....

>>51214230
Hahahahaha, no. I'd rather the Hedge be interesting than "it's literally the scissors that circumsized you, and they're coming back for more OH SHI-"

>>51214242

Abe served the General, and the dead and suffering of the war was part of his Imperium to join his Exarch master.

Besides, while the Union technically remained together and slavery ended, Abe knew racial and political differences would lead to great bloodshed and division for centuries. Abe was no fool, and one does not become a Seer Minister without playing the long game.

Abe's also still alive, but that's a story for another time...

>vtm pitch
>kindred in the prince-dom are getting murdered, and the malks all ramble about the culprit "the childer of cain"

Rate, hate, tell me what you'd do with it

>>51214246
Many "primitive" cultures continue to use piercings, scarification and tattoos to signify life changes, rites of passage and tribal identity. It's not a stretch to imagine Abel had bones through his earlobes.

>>51214469
I'd go for it, but create a whole new bloodline that hadn't been seen since the Second City as the culprits. Remember, if you read Revised carefully, it keeps saying
> "there are 13 known clans...."
> known
> implies there are "unknown" clans

Throw in a side quest to find some lost fragment of the Book of Nod, some stanza on stone tablets in Aramaic or Babylonian that details them, "lost words of the Antideluvians" or such.

>>51214449
>Silent hill isn't interesting
It's Chronicles of Darkness not Chronicles of Brightness.

>>51214581
>It's Chronicles of Darkness not Chronicles of Brightness.

At the very least, is Chronicles of the 1990's Emo WOD are Fuckin' Over.

>>51214581
>circumcision is bright and cheerful

k

How man points in vigor do I need to walk vertically like Dio

>>51214722
But in the hedge the rabbi doesn't suck you off after.

>>51214581

Said the edgelord

>>51214746
>>51214733
Said the rabbi

>>51214733
In all fairness, the Rabbi only used to kiss the tip of the little boy's penis in NYC. Still, that was enough for babies to show herpes outbreaks.

Or did you mean institutionalised child abuse? Because I hate to break it to you, but if the Hedge has the Scary Dog that Scared you when You Were Scared, but DOESN'T have the religious leader that abused his position to put the bad touch on you, you're only proving our point about how much 2nd ed Changeling sucks dicks.

>>51214722
>Is afraid of horror in a horror game
If you want to play fairy tale fantasy. Knights in cheery armor. That's Dreaming not Lost

>>51214974
>Things No-one Is Saying: The Post of The Book of The Film of The Tram

File: antitribu pirate.jpg (16KB, 177x285px) Image search: [Google]

16KB, 177x285px

>>51213097
I pirated it

everyone, leave >>51214974 alone. Contradicting a delusional psychotic only disturbs them, and his parents may not have any Thorazine.

>>51212030
>centuries old vampires don't need to rob banks to get money

vampires technically don't *need* to do *anything* but stay hidden and ambush people for blood every so often.

>>51215029
>I pirated it

Not the super mega ultra-deluxe hardcopy.

>>51215138

if you live off ambushing people then you might fuck up eventually and get caught, but if you build up a foundation you need to play politics

there's no real winning when you're a vampire, but in the latter case you at least don't need to worry about getting money

>>51215195
>there's no real winning when you're a vampire

You're a dangerous blood sucking parasite with a deadly temper and impulse control issues that will die if exposed to sunlight.

"No real winning" is an understatement.

>>51215029
I now have a "try before you buy" policy based on pirated .pdf's, and it's all thanks to Phil "please put money on my Patreon, the landlord is threatening to evict me" Brucatto.

>>51212810
That shit sounds like hot garbage. Who thought this was a good idea?

>>51215191
Has anyone been tempted to actually edit M20? Cut out all the bloat, cut and paste rules so they sit together well, re-instate Paradigm and Foci, dare to take a pair of scissors to Shatyros' insipid yapping.... it'd be a helluva job, but White Wolf are supposed to be supporting "fan projects they would have no interest in pursuing" and clearly they have no interest in a 20th Anniversary version of Mage that actually works and reads well....

Anyone wanna hear the story of how a Neonate Tzimisce one-shot a Garou in Crinos form and walked away without a scratch?

>>51215410
does it involve Silver?

>>51215385
All the poor bastards that were defrauded in a Kickstarter scam, sadly.

They were promised ultimate crossover potential; they got a shit sandwich.

They were promised the ability to play ancient, primordial monsters; they got teenage otherkin revenge fantasies.

Some people paid HUNDREDS just to get kicked in the dick.

>>51215420
...maybe.

>>51215410
Sure, lay it on us.

>>51215410
Yes.

But only because I want to tell you how fucking stupid it is.

>>51215410
Only if you deliver it in a series of haiku

>>51215399

It would be a monumental effort I doubt anyone would ever finish. I'd use it if someone else did all the work.

>>51215448
rolled nothing but tens
zulu form fucking rocks, bros
eat shit crinos bitch

>>51215410
Get the fuck away from my Carpathians, Shadow Lords

File: k.png (118KB, 300x300px) Image search: [Google]

118KB, 300x300px

>>51215436
>>51215440

>Dark Ages Vampire
>game is set in Constantinople around 1100 AD
>party consists of a setite sorcerer, an assamite, a tzimisce, a warrior salubri (me), and a lasombra
>we've been tasked with investigating a string of events attributed to infernalists
>every time we enter combat the tzimisce and i bulldoze everything
>incredibly lucky with ours rolls on top of just being really fucking strong
>enemy balance is getting better with recent sessions, though we're trying to steer away from combat in general
>don't want to solve every single problem through violence in a game all about political intrigue, subterfuge, etc.

>party splits up to handle a few different things
>tzimisce and salubri head off to some nearby woods
>brought a ghoul with us
>we come across some animal tracks
>a few botched perception rolls later, the ghoul notices something off about them
>footprints are gigantic and clearly don't belong to an ordinary animal or human
>any sane cainite would turn back now, so obviously we head deeper into the forest
>we hear the sound of footsteps nearby, so we continue toward it
>ghoul botches his stealth roll
>draws attention to us all
>shit

>>51215424
The more I read the more I hate it. It's just so fucking stupid.

>>51215813
>no point in hiding anymore
>armor of caine's fury
>3 successes
>charge the garou and prepare to say goodbye to my character sheet
>storyteller is obviously confused and for good reason
>didn't expect us to do something this dumb
>hastily throws together a sheet for the NPC
>new to DMing and hasn't really messed around with werewolves before

>tzimisce manages to roll a higher init than the werewolf
>activates celerity and blood buffs his strength
>calmly rolls
>does 7 damage with the first
>2 damage with the second
>oh right, his weapon has silver coating
>damage is all aggravated and unsoakable
>baby's first lupine is slain
>howls in the distance
>rush out of there and don't look back
>think on our (un)life decisions as we conclude the session

>>51213599
I always figured the increasing attitude of "The war is over, the Technocracy won" thing from Revised was the result of the fact that it was becoming increasingly apparent that the Technocracy is the closest thing CWoD had to a legitimate good guy organization.

Well, them and mummies, but mummies are weird.

File: Mad.png (151KB, 700x615px) Image search: [Google]

151KB, 700x615px

>Anon complains about changeling's darker tone.
>Anon offers alternative
>Anon Complains

>>51215259
You're an immortal with sweet supernatural powers that only has to consume a few mouthfuls of blood per night to have a decent shot at living forever.

I'd call that winning. All the problems that Kindred experience is a result of politics, not nature. Even the best defense against the Beast is a full stomach, and a vampire doesn't actually have to kill or seriously injure anyone to keep that.

File: 134703.jpg (562KB, 858x576px) Image search: [Google]

562KB, 858x576px

>>51203790

Question here regarding the rules for V20 VTM, are the attributes specializations cumulative with the Abilities specializations ?

Since most rolls are Attribute+Ability it would mean that each 10 could potentially be worth 4 sucess wich is way too OP to be a correct interpretation of the rules but the rulebook never explicitly say that so I'm confused.

>>51216355

god v20 looks fucking ugly

I will never look at dracula's shitty traced photograph and not cringe

>>51216183
>All the problems that Kindred experience is a result of politics, not nature

>can't go out during the day
>can't make any real friends because the beast
>can't eat, can't drink anything but blood
>even sex isn't as much fun as it used to be
>doomed to watch as every friend and family member from mortal life either meets tragic ends or just wither and dies
>one of the most popular and notorious creatures on the supernatural scene but far from the most powerful
>eventually going to succumb to the beast
>and more

Vampires get a raw deal, no two ways about it. There really is no winning as a vampire. There's only trying to make someone else lose more badly than you.

>>51216408
>There's only trying to make someone else lose more badly than you.
Also the longer you "live", the worse you're going to get.
Sure you're all moral and shit now.
But let's see how long that lasts.

File: shark thinks youre fintastic.png (202KB, 499x315px) Image search: [Google]

202KB, 499x315px

>>51216408
Hey, I could become a vamp tomorrow and my life would be exactly the same

>>51216183

Keep living in denial you undead fool.

>a vampire doesn't actually have to kill or seriously injure anyone to keep that.

Yet somehow it just never works out that way.


"Vampires are abominations, a pox on humanity and an affront to all that is good, decent and holy.They're an insult to the natural order; unending parasites who bring nothing but darkness and misery to all they know and touch.

Never for a moment abide by their deprivations or offer them mercies that their insatiable, demonic natures cannot fathom. You are a sheppard. Protect your flock. Render any leeches in your territory nothing but smoldering ash."

- Jophiel, Obrimos Master, Adamant Sage of the Adamantine Arrow, Chief Sentinel of the Austin Consilium, excerpts on honor and duty taught to her new apprentices

>>51216503

>uppity, arrogant, trigger happy mages

>the reason why the supernatural world can't have nice things

>>51216503
>Obrimos master who hates vampires
I'm guessing Austin has a very low vampire population.

>>51216469
>A NEET

>>51216555
All the vampires in Austin are hipsters who live there Ironically

>>51216378
Nearly the entire White Wolf payroll is represented in that one image. Dracula, yes, but also, the woman at the back in purple, the man second from right, and if we add some glasses, the man fifth from right.

>>51216551
We are the master race

>>51216355
I didn't think you could specialise with Attributes. Even if you can with both, that's just re-rolling 10's twice. Potentially 3 successes, not 4.

>>51216503
Yeah yeah, Mage supremacy, using Life magick to increase dick size in an urge to compensate, we get it. Fucking yawn.

>>51216648
Don't worry, they're just jealous they can't get that furfag pussy the way Forsaken can.

>>51216555
>I'm guessing Austin has a very low vampire population.

Vampires are like cockroaches. You never seem to be able to kill them all, and they hide in the darkest and dankest places. Even worse, some of the Wise actually find value in dealing with the leeches, abdicate their duty, and permit them to continue terrorizing humanity!

However, Jophiel is powerful, patient and determined, and many a requiem has been cut short by her righteous flame and holy light. She has also trained many mages who understand the value of her wisdom and experience.

Her flock generally remains safe in Austin, by Jophiel remains ever vigilant.

Seriously, why would someone not play a Mage?

>>51216707
Is Jophiel an actual character or what?

She sounds nice.

>>51216717

when you have a chance to play a demon, the true main characters of both game settings

>>51216717
Why would someone not want to play a hyper-obsessed basement dweller who made the shitlist of forces overseeing all of reality? Gee, let me think..... hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

>>51216741
If being on that shitlist gets me some sweet, sweet Mage Supremacy then sign me up.

File: laughing bitches.jpg (94KB, 942x630px) Image search: [Google]

94KB, 942x630px

>>51216740
There are so many things wrong with that post, kek

>>51216722

She's actually an npc I originally used in a very old Mage 1e chronicle that I occasionally have show up whenever there's a "vampire problem."

Her backstory was that she and her sister were teenage runaways from an abusive home in rural Texas One night they were suddenly attacked by a frenzying vampire. Her sister died and Jophiel was badly injured. However, it triggered her Awakening. Although she never found out the identity of that vampire or the reasons for the attack that killed her sister, it left *quite* the impression on the young Obrimos. She then dedicated much of her time to protecting poor young women and other powerless people in the area, largely blaming vampires for urban misery and exploitation.

>>51205271
Can't say I agree.

>>51205271
I respectfully disagree.
He has been... Adequate, but disappointing.

>>51216717
>Seriously, why would someone not play a Mage?

I'm a big fan of the other CofD game lines like Requiem and Forsaken. They are great Mage antagonist supplements.

File: why__am_i_drawing_bloodborne_by_sunnyclockwork-da6picw.jpg (199KB, 1000x1268px) Image search: [Google]

199KB, 1000x1268px

So having actually read the book unlike the hordes of proto-Aspels that haunt this place, Beast: the Primordial works perfectly well if you want to drag-and-drop a Beast into another splat's game so That Guy can have his fun and offer the rest of the group a bunch of cool stuff and abilities as contrition for having to put up with him.

It doesn't really work at all for an all-Beast game, because when you have to spotlight them their mythology is vague and uncertain, their antagonists are too personalized to work well against a group of disparate characters, and they don't have a social structure.

IMHO you can fix basically all of that with Y-splats and some setting tune-ups. In my game most stuff actually does sort of descend from the Dark Mother, who is a rogue process of the God-Machine, which was maybe built by Lovecraftian entities but more importantly is explicitly not part of any natural order or fundamental universal process, it's a fucked-up broken machine. This also gives me a "higher" source of antagonism than Heroes to offer story direction and organized resistance for my players who prefer that to sandboxing. But any random grab from Blasphemies or Mage Abyssal stuff can work as a refluff for Beast IMHO, just slap it around a little and transplant. That's the easy part.

What I want to get a handle on are Y-splats. I want three easy-integration splats aimed slightly more at players than at creating setting problems and three more conflict-driven splats aimed slightly more at creating setting problems than at players. I've got some sketches, but I'm curious if anyone else has done anything with that gaping emptiness in Beast where its structural backbone is supposed to be.

>>51217041
Looks to Vampire

y splat that accepts their monstrous side
y splat that rejects their monstrous side
y splat that just wants answers

You don't even need to make them full splats. Just make them thoughts and ideals to strive to.

>>51217041
No amount of cool shit could bribe me into putting up with the smug special snowflakes who would want to play a Beast. I'm reading through the book right now and it just is not good. I mean the book itself has glaring issues, but the bigger problem is the kind of person who could read through it and buy into all the unique donut steel stuff and the revenge fantasies and find that stuff appealing.

File: 1483905967832.jpg (968KB, 2560x1600px) Image search: [Google]

968KB, 2560x1600px

>>51203790
>Will there ever be a World of Darkness vidya again?

Yepp, I thik they even confirmed it.
Things will speed up when the One World of Darkness books come out.

So basically these games will be neither cWoD or CoD, but "One World of Darkness" (the continuation / sequel of cWoD).

>>51217396
Anon, the entirety of the WoD, both editions, cater fully to smug special snowflakes and all WoD players are to one degree or another. Beast doesn't extra-allow revenge fantasies compared to any other gameline, you pick what you think are acceptable targets or go full asshole. Beast, Demon, Vampire, and now Changeling (and kinda Werewolf too) all share parasitic feeding methods and do some amount of moralizing to be okay with it.

I don't know what you mean by do not steal stuff. Beasts are aggressively non-unique if anything.

Beasts can build evil castles out of stray hauntings and have some very fun power collections. That's the most commonly cited motivation to play one.

>>51217734
90% of the feeding examples in the book are all about punishing bad people and terrifying stereotypical bullies. The rest are all batshit insane. I would actually be okay with all of this if they didn't try to put such a moral spin on it. And I didn't actually mean to say that Beasts are actually unique. They're painfully generic but couched in such a way that shows that the writers want you to believe that they are unique, despite evidence to the contrary. That's what donut steel means.

I stand by what I said. Each splat attracts a bad kind of player, and the bad player for Beast is someone I wouldn't want to be in the same room with.

Although I think I would play a Beast game if they let me play as a Hero.

>>51217812
>I think I would play a Beast game if they let me play as a Hero.

Fucking this. A game where you curbstomp the fucking freak would be nice.

>>51217860
Ech Hunter already allows you to play a deranged vigilante

>>51217041
If it only works conditionally, it's still fucking broken.

Speaking of Aspel, it's been over 12 hours since he shitposted. Dare I suggest we've seen the last of that fucking faggot?

File: the_nightmare_of_mensis_by_sunnyclockwork-da6u0p7.jpg (163KB, 1000x1309px) Image search: [Google]

163KB, 1000x1309px

>>51217179
Yeah, that sounds about right.

Sketches:

DAEMONS: Mostly Beasts who want to still be people; they think of their Horrors as invasive entities they must live with and control. Tend to claim communities and clean out other predatory supernaturals; best relations with Heroes, worst relations with other supernaturals. Heretical subgroup hunts and eats people to claim their lives Demon-style. Group bonuses help them mitigate low Satiety penalties and pick up social Merits, and other supernaturals gain some social penalty mitigation.

THE CHILDREN: Beasts who consider the Horror to be an inherent extension of themselves rather than a separate entity. Most predatory; relationships with other supernaturals depend on prey traits and whether they can "match speed." Tend to claim isolated but oft-visited locations, feeding on horror tourists, lovers, and historical societies. Typically less discriminate feeders, but some keep codes or lure particular sorts of victims. Hero-killers almost to a fault. Group bonuses help with gaining Satiety and Lair awareness; other supernaturals have an easier time with degeneration's ill effects.

CIRCLE OF UR: Explorers, Lair architects, and lorekeepers. These Beasts follow their Horrors into ever-deeper abysses, with a tendency towards madness and personal sacrifice for power. Best relationships with other supernaturals, including antagonist splats and malevolent entities; least regard for stability or the Masquerade. They prefer to claim places of occult significance, the less traffic the better (some enjoy cults as an exception), and to do their hunting through other monsters. Most problems with Heroes despite general ambivalence towards them. Group bonuses to dealing with other supernaturals and investigation; other supernaturals gain some of their eldritch diplomacy and awareness.

Others: God-Machine magpie demolitionists, Hero-tormenting Beastmakers (no dick eggs), and a splat focused on dreamstuff, Lairs, and Twilight.

>>51217919
I'd like to contest the "deranged" bit. Most Hunters are reasonable fellows with clear goals and they help the community a lot.

>>51217919
Yeah, but can you sing this while you do it?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VuJTqmpBnI0

and, appropriately;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5CES2rLxtO4

Reminder; The Beast locked Belle in a tower until she loved him. That's called "Stockholm Syndrome", children. Just because Gaston was a jerk didn't make him any less right to kill the fucker and turn him into a decent rug.

>>51217926
You really should know better.

>>51217812
There's no moral spin. The 90% is bullshit too. Feeding means hurting people, and shit like "but, uh, we teach lessons" is intentionally meant to resemble bullshit. Some Beasts do good even in their feeding habits, but it's not universal or even normative. You don't have a morality meter and there's a reason for that: you're not a vampire meant to be struggling with your former humanity, you're a monster. You can be a good monster but I don't know how you're confusing CAN with SHOULD or ARE EXPECTED TO.

>convoluted explanation for using an antonym of what you actually meant
>explanation is wrong
>"that's what donut steel means"
>it isn't

Anon, is it possible YOU are the bad kind of player?

>>51217939
found the Slasher

>>51217945
>Reminder; The Beast locked Belle in a tower until she loved him. That's called "Stockholm Syndrome", children. Just because Gaston was a jerk didn't make him any less right to kill the fucker and turn him into a decent rug.

It actually does make him less right because his intentions were bad. He wasn't ridding the town of a monster, he was ridding himself of a romantic competitor, and where the Beast starts off evil and redeems, Gaston starts off just an asshole and then graduates to kidnapping and blackmail (and murder, I guess).

By the time Gaston gets around to it, the Beast didn't need killing, and while the Stockholm infliction is awful he's also not looking to reinforce it; Belle is free to recover and leave. But he turns into a hot rich prince, which DESU is probably as good as therapy.

Five years before the start of the film would have been a great time to gank him, but that's not how it went. Gaston isn't morally justified, and even from his perspective we can see he's way more focused on getting his and uncucking himself than he is on Belle's wellbeing or the theoretical threat of the Beast.

>>51217945
>kill the fucker and turn him into a decent rug.

The only good Beast is one whose head is mounted on my wall as both a trophy and clear warning to his friends.

>>51218061
>the Beast didn't need killing

I don't believe you understand.

If you are a Beast, you feed on misery and fear. By definition, you need killin' as soon as possible.

At least those filthy vampires don't offer any pretense of not being monsters. Beasts are uppity and deluded, the worst kind of monsters.

>>51218108
You can feed on bad people or in ways that don't cause any actual lasting harm. You're not actually required to cause misery and fear - the Hungers are diverse and offer many relatively low-impact avenues of feeding, and there are a ton of people who do need killing who you can kill to not need killing yourself.

This isn't within a character's control, but as a player you can set your Horror to align with whatever you're comfortable with or want to explore.

Also, Beasts can feed through other splats. A Beast who keeps company with werewolves, changelings, mages, or the Bound isn't necessarily involved in anything bad.

>>51218061
>He wasn't ridding the town of a monster, he was ridding himself of a romantic competitor

Why not both? We're talking about a fucking *monster* that held a young girl prisoner for about six months. Oh, he let her go? I'm sure that makes six months in a rape dungeon totally acceptable, officer, no need to press charges.

The one good look he gets at the Beast is from a magic mirror that shows him a horrific, cloven-hoofed fucking thing roaring like a lion. Most people would have hauled Belle off for a psych evaluation at that point, given how much "but I LOVE HIM" justification she was screeching. Hell, most of you have no sympathy for people attracted to others wearing Paddle-Pop Lion costumes, and I sure as shit don't accept "but I love him" as reasonable grounds for tolerating domestic abuse. Neither do the police in most jurisdictions.

The way I see it, Gaston was trying to free her from the demonic influence and head-fuckery of something that quite literally resembled Satan. With CLAWS.

Your attempts to justify amoral and evil behaviour sicken me. Accept facts; Gaston was doing the right thing, even if he had a selfish angle. But then, doesn't everyone? Mother Theresa was a fucking vicious old cunt but everyone in the West acts like she shat golden nuggets and wandered into the underworld every night to defeat Apophis. Fact remains, she enjoyed watching suffering, she punished her underlings for asking questions and she embezzled millions to establish a global presence.

>>51218146
>You can feed on bad people or in ways that don't cause any actual lasting harm.

It's not OK to torture allegedly bad people, and I don't care if the harm is "low impact." In civilization, we still call that assault and battery, criminal harassment and a multitude of other felonies and misdemeanors.

Since prison is not really an option as punishment, and there's not "cure," execution is both necessary and appropriate.

Further, any self-respecting member of a major splat would kill a Beast on sight, no questions asked. Among the beings of the world, they know precisely how fucked-up Beasts really are.

>>51218008
>There's no moral spin
>book goes on and on about how Beasts teach lessons to humanity through fear, making them stronger and better and if a Beast goes too far it just can't be helped sometimes
>also Heroes are by and large mindless murderers obsessed with glory

>90% thing is bullshit too
>feeding example involving defending a nerd from bullies
>feeding example involving ruining rich people's lives
>feeding example involving beating up bad sexist men
>feeding example involving revenge on people who look down on junkies
>feeding example where a fucking cabbie ditches rich people in bad parts of town
>and many more

>shit like "but, uh, we teach lessons" is intentionally meant to resemble bullshit
Really? One of the biggest recurring points throughout the book, one of the big things that shows a person has the potential to become a Beast, is just bullshit? The whole "wisdom from the Primordial Dream" is just nothing?

Have we read the same book?

>Anon, is it possible YOU are the bad kind of player?
Maybe, but I think it's more likely that YOU are the bad kind of player.

>>51218108
>If you are a Beast, you feed on misery and fear.

My grandma is a Beast too

>>51218259
Oh and I forgot the one where the Beast is literally a trans avenger of the night, killing rapists and abusers in the pursuit of justice.

>>51218154
>The way I see it, Gaston

...kidnapped and institutionalized her father as black leverage so he could force her to bear his young, you retard. That's kidnapping, blackmail, and sexual coercion, all also illegal in most jurisdictions, you are likely surprised to learn.

>Gaston was doing the right thing

He was killing a redeemed soul because it still looked ugly so that he could force his obsession to become his broodmare. This is actually evil.

The Beast is a horrible role model for romantic relationships precisely because he romanticizes abusive behavior, but Gaston is not in any sense morally justified in murdering him.

>>51218336
>Gaston is not in any sense morally justified in murdering him

Unless and until the CofD has a functioning supernatural law enforcement, judicial and incarcerative system, Gaston sure as hell is justified in killing him, morally and otherwise.

>>51215399
>Has anyone been tempted to actually edit M20? Cut out all the bloat, cut and paste rules so they sit together well, re-instate Paradigm and Foci, dare to take a pair of scissors to Shatyros' insipid yapping.... it'd be a helluva job, but White Wolf are supposed to be supporting "fan projects they would have no interest in pursuing" and clearly they have no interest in a 20th Anniversary version of Mage that actually works and reads well....

I am working on it for my home group. Sadly i dont know how to make/edit PDFs so its basically me and a booknote.

>>51212030

Well money is power and vampires want power from what I know, correct ?

>>51218583
Yeah but they don't need to rob a bank. In fact a lot of the more civilized vampires would probably look down on it as crude.

>>51218583
Money is only one aspect of power, and ultimately, it's merely the power to bargain with other people who recognize its value, and deal with certain mundane problems.

But yes, Elders are likely to have a lot of cash.

>>51218505
Just copy and paste the pdf to a word file and see if that works.

oWoD player here

How I kill mages?
Why is celerity so strong?
Why is parry so much better than block and dodge in most situations?
Why are guns the best melee weapon?
Why is dex so infinitely more useful than strength?
How do I purge the world of magic using scum?

>>51218815
You have made so many mistakes in your life, the first one was playing oWoD and the second one was not playing a Mage

Enjoy being a lawn chair bro

>>51218815
Surprise explosions sometimes work, sometimes.
Because being lightning fast combines well with a shotgun.
Because your GM is an idiot who doesn't shoot people.
Because one is a chunk of metal, the other is a projectile weapon which fires chunks of metal faster than the speed of sound. Also it's a shit system.
Because all the power in the world don't mean dick if you miss.
Cry and whine and suck off the GM until he lets you. Otherwise you can't. Shit's bullshit mang.

>>51218849
It's my first character in my first tabletop game. If I knew how bullshit mages were, things would have been different around here. Regardless, we're playing hunters next--rules are mortals only as PCs.
>tfw can't even kill the Tremere scum plaguing my city

>>51218916
Chantry too well fortified.
>Hurrdurr the chantry is invincible
>There are ghouls guarding the chantry
>There are traps in the chantry and we have practically unlimited blood stored up
>We have wards that give us vision of everything you do
>We have escape routes
>There are multiple chantries
>Path of Blood lets Tremere fags buff down to an extremely low gen
>Literally a spell that just sucks out your blood or boils it and kills you

Fucking vampire mages. Then you have actually mages who actually just demigods and they're still Jewing us out of our cash.

How roundabout are we going to have to be?
>Have literal real mages feeding us information
>Took over the city's fucking cops and had our Tzimisce tear them open and plant semtex inside our cop ghouls--planning a raid on the Tremere during the day and accusing them of terrorism and it hoping it escalates to waco siege levels when we blow up a cop and say they did it
>Trying to get blueprints to the building to see if it uses gas for its heating, cooking, fire, ect or trying to convince bureaucracy to demolish the building
>Have the entire Sabbat and BH backing us in a Sabbat controlled city

The game has literally become amass money and control the city boogaloo: let's amass firepower then nuke this chantry down even if we all die in the process and the U.S gov wonders why there a war on their soil.

But yeah. Celerity is good, I shoulda took melee or firearms instead of protean claw+brawl, though. Most people use guns, but parrying people who try to attack you with fist, claws, daggers, ect is hilarious with a sword. You can just take defensive actions constantly and murder people.

>Guns have a diff 4 to hit within 2 meters

>>51219135
You're the guy that wanted to diablerise his sire, right? In any case, the storyteller is a dick, and the Tremere are fucking cowards. They wouldn't stay in their chantry if the whole city was Sabbat, they'd leg it as soon as things get bad for the Camarilla. Try to Dominate their ghouls to fuck shit up on the inside or something.

File: 1bdf4739ae72b70045f35da7b75bb286.jpg (143KB, 600x600px) Image search: [Google]

143KB, 600x600px

>>51219135
Oh, and
>Try to have our ghouls stalk their ghouls so we can glean information from them
>Try to catch out Tremere when they leave chantry
>Try to find out what they're trying to get and why, so we can lock them out of the resources they need
>Constantly through different plans without letting the Tremere that we know where one of their chantries is

Nothing works. At this point I might as well drop vampirism and the jyhad for a couple years, build up absolute control in the city in both political workings and the underworld, then just have humans and other newer vampires do everything.

Also.
>Dex gives you automatic successes for damage on hit, and additional dice for damage on melee

God. I should level up obfuscate and shoot some mages in the back of the head but they'd probably have some shit to see through that. I hate mages so much.
>tfw inferior race

At least I hope I'll have enough power to demolish that fucking park in the city. God, I fucking hate werewolves too. Goddamn furry hippie bastards.

>>51219180
Yeah, I haven't gotten to that yet. Still planning how to trap and safely murder an elder city gangrel that has probably been alive for hundreds of years. For some reason he has no beast marks and has relatively high humanity judging by how he acts. You'd think a gangrel that old would be a beastly monster by now

Maybe I am just stupid, but I have a lot of difficulty understanding how Awakenings are supposed to workl. The 2ED Core's descriptions of the Paths and their sample Awakenings have a lot of metaphors and abstractions, which my brain doesn't grasp easily. Can anyone tell me if my understanding is correct?

Acanthus: You must make a radical life change that marks the beginning of a new story for you.

Mastigos: You must take control of your passions instead of letting them control you

Moros: You must accept that all things come to an end and that change is inevitable

Obrimos: You must find the missing piece in a personal theory that puts the world into order

Thyrsus: You must abandon the flasehoods of civilization, emrace your wild side and join something greater than yourself

>>51217592
that's a lovely paining, who made it?

>>51218336
>...kidnapped and institutionalized her father as black leverage so he could force her to bear his young

Again, why not both? Sure, it was self-serving, but remember that we have here an older man with a history of mental instability ranting about demons. He was potentially a danger to himself and others, enough to convince a man who ran the local institution PROFESSIONALLY that such intervention was needed. And when confronted with evidence that the man's story was correct, Gaston changed tack accordingly.

It's not kidnapping if the person becomes a ward of the state. It's not blackmail if he genuinely was trying to help Belle's life improve, and from where I'm sitting, Stockholm Syndrom kind of sucks bad. I don't think mutual back-scratching really can be considered "Sexual Coercion", do you?

>you retard
Tsk, tsk, tsk. Do you idolise monsters so closely that you need to copy their speech patterns? Such unfortunates are referred to as "intellectually disabled" these days, you are being inappropriate and discriminatory.

>He was killing a redeemed soul because it still looked ugly so that he could force his obsession to become his broodmare.

And how did he know it was a "redeemed soul"? Remember, the mirror showed a monster roaring it's teats off. As far as Gaston knew, the poor girl was traumatised and needed rescuing from the monster that had bewitched her. That's what Heroes do, they help and rescue. Or do you think Fireman Sam is a pervert now?

>>51218254
>It's not OK to torture allegedly bad people,

Sure, but it's fine to torture definitely bad people. Jesus Christ in Heaven might not think so, but his daddy does, and if it's good enough for the G-man it's good enough for the heritors of the fruit of the knowledge of good and evil.

It's not in any sense wrong, if you know someone's diddling their kid, to feed them to your Horror. You've improved the state of the world. Civilization can't function with vigilante justice normalized, but you don't need to be accepted, you're magic - you can do the right thing and get away with it.

I've never understood what pacifists think they're doing trying to talk about roleplaying games. It's uncomfortable and it should be, but there are lives that need to end.

Not that you need to end lives, of course. Thousands of ways to be a Beast of strong and wholesome moral character, if you want.

>Further, any self-respecting member of a major splat would kill a Beast on sight, no questions asked.

No, Aspel, that's not true.

>>51218259
Not the guy you're responding to, but yeah the wisdom thing is bullshit, I think Matt even said it on the forums somewhere. Or more specifically it's not a commandment from the Dark Mother or anything, it's just a kind of cultural thing Beasts invented to feel better about being monsters and to give their lives some kind of meaning for the ones who need it.

Basically it's fake in origin but you can actually do it if you want. It's definitely not a moral "spin" for Beasts, the book explicitly mentions Beasts who don't give a fuck about teaching anything and Beasts who SAY they're teachers but really just do what they want to who they want.

>90%

Half those examples are obviously not abusing bad people. Dumping someone into a dangerous place just because they're rich isn't fucking morally justified. I can't tell if YOU can't tell or if you think the WRITERS couldn't tell, but either way you're wrong.

>>51216617
I know most of them. A few of them are on BNS' payroll, but most of them are just avid game fans and LARPers. The Malkavian model is the coolest short lady you'll ever meet, even with her obsession with Mandalorians..

>>51218505
WW PDFs are OCR, which means they're copy/paste friendly. Take the sections and stick them into a Word file, judiciously adding tables and junk where they need to go.

Save as PDF.

Done.

>>51219413
>that's a lovely paining, who made it?

It was me, James!
The author of all your paintings.

>>51215399
At that point, I'd just use Mage 2e and buy a secondhand copy off of Amazon or something.

As bad as Revised Mage was, M20 managed to be an even more monumental fuckup.

>>51219392
Awakenings can be just about anything really. There's really no set anything to follow or have to do. I'm pretty sure the only concrete thing mages know on the topic is how to identify when someone is in the process of Awakening.

>>51216082
As is the way 4chan is.

>>51220263

Personally i found awakening magic system too restrictive to play ascension (its perfectly fine for awakening though), wisdom is shit for ascension so its hogtie magic too. But also i am someone who likes revised and think casting without paradigm is not how you play the game so ymmv.

>>51220552
I'm talking about Ascension 2e from the 90's.

Awakening 2e is utter shit, like most of 2e CofD.

>>51220575
Consentual reality and it's utter retardation isn't a thing in Awakening, so maybe try not to throw stones while standing in that glass house.

>>51220575
I think most of the core rules and Vampire 2e are pretty good.

File: sailor moon gangsta.jpg (70KB, 500x707px) Image search: [Google]

70KB, 500x707px

I'm just gonna be blunt and honest, I think Mage: The Ascension 1e and 2e are fucking awesome, but Revised and M20 just plain suck. I mean, most of Revised Edition oWoD sucked because of the shitty metaplot and Achilli's pretentiousness spreading across White Wolf like a wildfire, but the worst part about M20 is that V20 and W20 were actually quite good.

Brucato fucked up and fucked up bad.

As for Awakening, I don't play Mage: The Awakening, so I can't judge. If it's like the other nWoD/CofD gamelines, I assume that the 1e version is superior to the 2e version (If it ain't broke, don't fix it!)

Just my two cents on the whole affair.

Also, I want to do Senshi: The Merchandising 20th Anniversary Edition, update the fangame to X20 rules. I attempted to do this in 2014, but it fizzled out.

Now I've discovered there is a fan-made Street Fighter 20th Anniversary Edition, so I am renewed in my interest for doing the same for Senshi.

>>51220622
I still prefer 1e, but with some setting hacks.

2e has shitty reworked Disciplines and over-emphasis of the Strix.

>>51220575

Oh my bad, 2nd edition has lots of great stuff in ita supplements. However i never read it core so i dont know how good/bad it is.

>>51220642

Metaplot aside whats bad between 2nd and revised mechanically for mage? Honestly revised ascension made me switch from Nwod to Owod and realize how much better the owod was.

>>51220647
The 2e corebook for Ascension is awesome. I own it on hard copy. Get it, it's well worth it.

Avoid Revised and M20 like the plague.

>>51220646
I'm pretty ambivalent towards the disciplines, but I agree on the Strix. They should stay in Requiem for Rome.

>>51220663
Paradox is an utter bitch in Revised, but is more manageable in 2e.

Also, 2e has more room for other types of gameplay and is overall more versatile than Revised due to the lack of the Avatar Storm and the "One True Way" mentality that plagued Revised Edition era White Wolf.

File: jim cornette fuck this company.jpg (57KB, 583x600px) Image search: [Google]

57KB, 583x600px

>>51220670
Indeed

Hell, I even cut them out of Requiem for Rome. But if you're gonna have the Strix, keep them in Ancient Rome.

I also cut out the emotional deadness bullshit from 1e, which was a holdover from Revised Masquerade.

2e CofD is a trainwreck, not as bad as M20, Revised oWoD, BNS's LARP material, or the upcoming One World of Darkness from the looks of it, but it's pretty damn close.

White Wolf jumped the shark in 1999, with the release of Vampire: The Masquerade's Revised Edition. They jumped back a little with the release of nWoD, but not enough to truly save them.

Pic related

>>51220670

I think the most basic idea of the strix could have worked.

"This vampire like creatures appear in cities and are omen for shit getting fuck"

However the problem is that the strix are said creatures instead of either giving you a system to create vampire like beings or the strix being just one of the possible creatures.

Say i am running a game in italy so thr vampire like creatures that appear are the strix but i am running a game in southamerica the vampire creature that appear are a local mythological vampire creatures.

Could have worked as a sort of times ot thinblood mixed with the "predator's competition" that the kue-jin gave.

But no, we got boring fucking owls.

>>51220689

Yeah i agree with that while i like revised i remove the avatar storm from the setting, its just boring.

File: Reika Kitami.jpg (98KB, 640x670px) Image search: [Google]

98KB, 640x670px

Stat me, /wodg/.

Preferably Vampire or Mage.

>>51220775
>>51220670
>People actually agreeing with Camilla

Can this board get anymore autistic?

>>51220810
So I'm autistic because I think the Strix are incredibly bland?

>>51220670
>>51220646

Well. Good thing the Strix ain't mandatory then.

Seriously, people act as if Strix are thrown down everywhere as the eternal enemy, and that you can't play 2e Requiem without them.

Also, what is wrong with the 2e Disciplines? They made them actually usable. 1e Disciplines were about as useful as chocolate hammers.

>>51220828
Nah, it's just Camilla is widely hated here and he usually leads the charge against the Strix and 2e CofD. Most of the posts decrying 2e Requiem are him, while the posts against M20 are a mix of him and others because M20 legitimately sucked.

I just never thought I'd see the day when people actually started agreeing with Camilla on here.

Though at least he's not as bad as Aspel.

>>51220810

Who the fuck is camilla? Is that aspel hooker name?

File: Boone's Farm.jpg (11KB, 380x380px) Image search: [Google]

11KB, 380x380px

>>51220884
>It's a good thing the Strix aren't mandatory
>they get a whole fucking chapter in Requiem 2e, are referenced everywhere, and pushed out Belial's Brood from the setting

Sure, the Strix aren't mandatory in Onyx Path's new vision of CofD, keep telling yourself that....

I need a fucking drink.

>>51220884
My problem is that they had an entire chapter while other antagonists had what, a couple of pages at most? I know that I can read older books, but a new edition should include some variety.
The power level of disciplines is fine, but I have some quibbles with things like The Lying Mind being at 4 while Entombed Command is at 3, or Protean 4 dealing aggravated only with an extra merit and during frenzy. I like how they revamped Nightmare though.

>>51220884

No, however the game does set them as the big bad campaign long antagonist as the idigam for forsaken and in that regard they fall flat.

Yes one can ignore them as with many things however that doesnt excuse how bland they are.

>>51220978
I agree that they are pretty bland, but people seem to take the existence of the Strix so personally.

>>51220941
No, Camilla is a poster from Onyx Path Forums who is known for hating personal horror and hacking the fuck out of his WoD and CofD games, usually by removing all the horror stuff and putting in weeb shit.

He is a massive weeb who is obsessed with anime, mafia films, and 1990's nostalgia, and generally hates anything he sees as Goth/Punk/Emo/whatever...

He has a massive hard-on for 1e nWoD and generally hates anything to do with 2e CofD, and also has disdain for Revised oWoD and its metaplot.

He's a clueless and annoying weeb who doesn't truly understand WoD/CofD and would honestly be happier playing some other game, but is too stubborn to do so.

>>51220987
The worst part is that as terrible as Camilla is, Aspel is ten times worse.

Camilla's a dumb weeb who doesn't get it, but Aspel is self-righteous and a literal pedo. Fuck him.

>>51220978
Agreed

The Strix have no place in my games.

>>51221016
Ignore Aspel, that fat tranny pedo bitch brings nothing positive to the table.

At least Camilla's stupidity can be amusing at times. That and being a clueless weeb isn't nearly as bad as being a literal sexual predator in the making.

The Sttix fit one great niche in the game though: Keeping cities isolated.
The reason no new Camarilla has been able to rise is that the Strix infiltrate and destroy any such attempts.

>>51221121
Eh, I prefer the idea that vampire politics have become so fragmented and factionalized that the reason why vampire society is so isolated is because of the vampires themselves, rather than some boring invincible owls.

>>51220612
Just so you know, accusing other people of "utter retardation" when you're so intellectually impaired you can't even spell "consensual" properly implies you should put down the stones in your lovely glass house, too.

So guys how squeamish are you about killing npcs that your players grow attached to? And then what about bringing those npcs back from the dead?
Do you ever do it?

>>51221156
World of Darkness homie. If you wanted someone to survive you should have protected them better.

>>51219548
Funfact Beasts get more food from the child's abuse than just killing the abuser

>>51220689
I just houserule that all effects are coincidental if sleepers aren't present, and the Avatar Storm never happened. Other supernaturals count as "Awakened". Problem solved.

File: 1478341852964.jpg (23KB, 552x672px) Image search: [Google]

23KB, 552x672px

>>51220810
Cry more, bitch nigga, your mascara is running.

>>51221156
Death is never the end.

>>51221138
It doesn't make sense. A vampire strongman would've cowed cities under them.
Also, the Strix aren't invincible. They just require tricks to take down.