/5eg/ Fifth Edition General

So Alchemist's Fire is 5 foot Radius. Is that 4 Square or 9 Square in Grid combat?

>>51145798
It says radius, not diameter, so should be a 9 square.

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>>51145772
Adding to the question: is The Hidden Shrine of Tamoachan (C1) adventure any good? I know it'll be in Tales from the Yawning Portal. As it is, it looks a bit ... outdated. And tedious as fuck.

44 pages of size8 text. Ugh.

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Hey guys, got a hot new Dragon-person Only Barbarian Archetype here for you to tear apart.

Any comments are welcome!

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Deleted and posted in this thread instead.

>>51145761
different guy, but ive only started dming recently

how dangerous should something like, say, balancing on the edge of a cliff to get to a landing? as in, how forgiving should i be to the players with how many fails can happen before they plummet?

it always feels like environmental encounters have a farrrr stronger chance of killing a PC.

>>51145824

Go for a skill check; 3 failures is death, x amount of success is resure/clambering to a secure place.

>oh gunsmith sounds cool
>thundercannon is 2 handed

so they just said fuck you to small types then?

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>roll stats for a new Bard character just because you can get some funny results
>decide to go even more bonkers and just roll in order
>6, 11, 10, 14, 11, 14

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Next class you're hoping for?
Pic related for me.
>drop street smart and rabble rouser
>dig deep moved to 13
>bloodied but unbowed moved to 4
>moxie-fueled fists to 7
>fancy foot work and shake it off removed
>drop everything on peak physical condition other than the ASI
>possibly something with Fighting Spirit I think this should possibly trim fat and balance it a touch. I'd compare it to barb rather than monk.

>>51145824
Pretty much this >>51145858
>3 failed skill checks
PC falls, starts making death saves, if he passes he is just unconscious on an escarpment, can be rescued
>2 failed skill checks
PC falls, but manages to hang on to the edge, can climb back up or be pulled
>1 failed skill check
PC nearly falls but manages to balance himself on the edge, should move at half speed next turn to carefully move back

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>>51145940
> Next class you're hoping for?
Warlord!

>>51145887
It's not heavy so small races are fine

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>>51145940
In case anybody wants the rest.

>>51145940
Any kind of non-monk unarmed fighter will be an archetype, probably for barbarian or fighter like in 4e

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>>51145772
>I'm making a "loot the ancient pyramid" one shot that I'll DM soon enough.
>Any tips? What can I throw at them except Yuan-Ti & serpents?
Giant scarabs/scorpions. Insect swarms, bonus points for locust or rot grubs from Volo's. Mummies. Yuan-ti Mummies. Crocodile/hyena mummies, maybe use their giant variants. Ape/baboon mummies/zombies. Kleer skeletons if you wanna get SERIOUS. Jackalweres? Lion golems & other living statues of sandstone. Maybe dust mephits? A bone naga if you want to throw in some spellcaster enemies. A sphynx of some kind if you want a higher level spellcaster, could make it a boss.

>>51145921
what the fuck a smart bard

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>>51145968
While I understand, I feel like they miss some character archtypes by doing that. Dudley is not the same as Boxer. A pit fighter isn't the same as Holmes.
Also
MYSTIC
WHEN

>>51145949
wont happen m8
battlemaster is already an option

>>51145940
Stop forcing this shit.

>>51146053
Legit when is mystic UA coming out. Gimme a date and i'll stop until then.
Not that it actually matters. 1 pdf when we never reach max image limit and you can just filter it

>>51146003
Battlemaster is a shit replacement for warlord, and you know it.

>>51145822
So the central drawcard is the breath-weapon, right?

Maybe give 1/2 uses per rage? 2 cones of whatever a day seems a little underwhelming when compared to stuff like "halve all non-psychic damage."

I do like the capstone. A lot, actually.

>>51146085
>i wanna heal people
>no i don't want to be a caster for that i wann heal people with how awsum i am
It's a shit concept.

>>51145994
They can all be achieved with one single archetype, flavor is independent of that
A barbarian that fights with fists can be a pit fighter, a boxer or whatever

Sherlock holmes was a rogue with a couple of monk levels

And there is already a mystic UA, why do you keep posting that thing?

>>51146125
>And there is already a mystic UA
The mystic UA is crap. There's a reason why they're remaking the whole thing in, what, a months time.

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How long do your sessions last, /5eg/?

We used to do 2-3 hour sessions, but we never got as much done as we wanted to. Lately, we've been doing 4.5-6~ and been having a blast.

>>51146093

Hmm, so up it to two additional uses when raging? Can do.

>>51146172
Generally three, because people have shit to do the morning after and frequently at least a half-hour of that is total chaff.

>>51146172
Around six hours, twice a week.

>>51145940
Urgh. Don't get me wrong, it's an okay idea. I'm just not a big fan of 'it's a monk but uses strength" for my unarmed types.
I'm willing to accept Monks because they explicitly run off weird supernatural energy that gives them magical.hands or some shit.

>>51145942
I like it. 3 checks seems a little excessive, but I suppose "lol bad roll you die regardless of your hp or climbing skills" is a little too gritty and realistic.

>>51146125
Archetypes are flexible. If anything I think we have too many classes as-is, so I'm all for diversifying through archetypes.

Want to be a boxer? Fighter archetype.
Want to be a brawler? Barbarian archetype.
A monk archetype based on grappling probably isn't too hard. "Add your enemy's strength modifier to your grapple rolls" would be nicely in-flavor but idk how balanced it would be.

>>51146105
and it's also covered by Rally which is pretty cool.

>>51146085
So again, no warlord for you.
Can you name a thing warlord did that battlemaster can't? Something that would fit 5e.

>>51146209
>twice a week

I'm impressed. We usually do our 6~ sessions every Friday. So, just once a week.

Don't wanna exhaust or burn anyone out.

>>51146138
But they are working on it, and mystic v2 is playable, that homebrew is a waste of time to even read

>>51146172

About 20 hours over 2 days, every 2 months.

Gow do you map a 15' cone to a grid?

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>>51146217
>Want to be a boxer? Fighter archetype.
>Want to be a brawler? Barbarian archetype.

Pretty much this, there is no need for a whole new class when archetypes can scratch that itch

>>51146217
>I'm willing to accept Monks because they explicitly run off weird supernatural energy
I'm not going to get too bitchy but how do you suppose Barbarians and Fighters work? D&D is heroic/epic fantasy. It is all about being able to do outrageous and heroic acts by sheer force of will. Possibly not to hercules' level but damn close.

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>>51146277

>>51146277
T shape

>>51145822
I am ripping this and making it a 4e theme, and you fuckers can't stop me.

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>>51145954

Noob DM here. I've got a player who wants to play a monk with some lucha flair, so the Arena Royale seems great. I'm going to let him take it as his Monk Tradition, with a few alterations. In particular, I want to give him a Signature Maneuver at level 3, changing the existing one to Finishing Maneuver and leaving it at 17. Sort of like the difference between the People's Elbow and the Rock Bottom.

But I'm too inexperienced to be confident in making my own class features. Here's my stab at it: "Create a Signature Move, giving it a name and description. You can use spend one Ki point to use this move as an action on an adjacent enemy that's been knocked prone. On a hit, the target takes 2d4 (martial arts dice) + 1d4 damage for every 10 feet of movement you took this turn prior to attacking."

besides few metamagic feats is there any real reason to pick a sorcerer over a bard?

Hey /5eg/, new to the edition, got a couple questions about shadow monk:

Is the Mobile feat redundant on a class that's already super fast? It fits perfectly with the character and is less boring than something like Lucky.

Is the Monk capstone ability as underwhelming as I think it is? Considering dipping a few levels into rogue, even at the cost of Empty Body.

>>51145772
>Unearthed Arcana: Artificer
>Specialization: Gunsmith
>spells specialize in mobility, sensory enhancement, and illusions
>mechanical servant: polar bear, looks like a sword-wielding mechanical golem
>free magic items: Eyes of Night, Rope of Climbing, Heward's Handy Haversack, Slippers of Spider Climbing, Wings of Flying

We Titanfall Pilots in DnD now. Video related:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJQlGNjJJ5A

>>51146217
>Want to be a boxer? Fighter archetype.
>Want to be a brawler? Barbarian archetype.

Those are fucking shit archetypes when stacked up next to shit like "Necromancer" and "Dragon Dude" and "Disciple of the literal Devil"

>>51146323

Oh nooooooooooo

But really, glad you like it enough to steal.

>>51146345
Mobile is good because it always makes you faster, allow ignoring of difficult terrain and allows attacking and disengaging in the same round.

>>51146295
Fair enough. I've just never been a fan of the "I want to fight unarmed, but I want no mechanical disadvantages for this" idea.

I feel like a true, vanilla martial Unarmed archetype would be a grappler at heart. Punches are perhaps the WORST way (short of finger-jabs or combat licking) to fight without a weapon. Compare punches to grapples, kicks, elbow strikes, eye gouges and the like.

tl;dr I want to see a Fighter archetype that's just 90% nut shots.

>>51146334
Fucking do it, my dude. Make sure the archetype or class has ways to knock prone, though.

>>51146345
I'd say mobile is worth it for the free disengage. Hitting and running is pretty good if you can afflict enemies with a status, or hit them with a manuever.

Hell, just run in, hit, then run behind the Polearm Master fighter.

>>51146374
And "I punch with my fists" is pretty shit compared to "I open a portal to my own private pocket dimension, with blackjack and hookers."

Some people like the martial shit.

>>51146374
For you maybe, but some people don't wanna fag around in robes or suck demon dick
Some people wanna be big guys and punch shit on the fucking mouth

>>51146448
>I feel like a true, vanilla martial Unarmed archetype would be a grappler at heart. Punches are perhaps the WORST way (short of finger-jabs or combat licking) to fight without a weapon. Compare punches to grapples, kicks, elbow strikes, eye gouges and the like.
I'm fine with this. Make one archtype that is pure punching with big ol haymakers, one that works on counters and sweeps and such, and one pure wrestler either lucha or professional flair.

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>>51146286
>d4 damage

When will this meme for non-Monk unarmed fighters end?

>>51146502
>When will this meme for non-Monk unarmed fighters end?
When 5e stops being aimed at being heroic fantasy. So never.

>>51146502

It makes sense to me. You punch another person, sure it's gonna hurt, but unless you're a professional boxer, you're not really in any danger of seriously hurting them. Now, if you go up and try and punch some of the shit that adventurers fight, you're not gonna do a whole lotta good. Like, go up and punch a cow one day. They probably won't give a shit.

>>51146502
It scales at the same rate as monk

>>51146502
Wait you want to be better at unarmed combat (and combat overall because better fram) than a monk? fuck off, or improve monk too

>>51146502
From the look of it it gets better with levels, and you can't expect a novice adventurer to be crazy good at punching from the get-go, especially when punching is normally just 1 damage

You also have to consider it is a barbarian so it will end up being 1d4+STR+Rage, which is more than a monk does

So a lot of Bards play music to cast their spells.

For something like Vicious Mockery, I imagine that is not the case?

>>51146296
Thats kind of awkward

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>>51146448
>>51146389
So, the action/ki-free disengage is great, and enables easy hit-and-run tactics. That's cool, thanks for the help.

>>51145798
5 squares at the middle of a square, 9 only if your DM is generous.

4 squares at a grid intersection.

>>51146554
It only has V component. So no, it doesn't require them to play music.

Speaking of Vicious Mockery, is it a good cantrip or is it shit?

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>>51146531
>A man can attack 9 times with the largest sword a man can wield after running 30 feet to an enemy in 6 seconds
>A man can summon creatures from other planes, spawn fireballs and icestorms, and control the minds of others like puppets
>A man can channel the powers of an active god that counsels them in times of trouble and gives them the powers to heal
>A man cannot become good enough at unarmed combat to contribute similarly
Realism is pointless. Internal consistency reads "people become supernaturally skilled at their heroic exploits" and unarmed fighting and the use of a bare body as a weapon is a classic archetype.

>>51146345
People will tell I'm shitposting or baiting or whatever, but yes, monk in general is slightly underwhelming unless the only thing you expect of him is stun stun stun stun, for everything else ask other party's members help

Way better than 3.5 though but worse than 4e

>>51146577
Anon, you can call somebody a faggot so hard their brain hurts.

its great

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>>51146286
Hey someone actually saved my stuff, neat

>>51146587
It's hard to move away from tradition, and traditionally unarmed sucked in D&D. If you don't use feats unarmed damage is ok, if you use feats it's laughable but at least you can stun.

>>51146587

Nah, a man can do that. 17th level Monk is doing d10's of damage. And a 17th level Monk is different from a 4th level Fighter that took Tavern Brawler. Makes sense.

>>51146277
Not like >>51146296; that's too many squares. It's "One square, two squares, three squares". When you're shooting it horizontally its "square in front of two, two squares with one to your left/right, three squares in a line in front of you." When you shoot it diagonally, it's "one square diagonally, two squares diagonally, three squares diagonally". For the one shot at an angle with one side verticle (the top left on the diagram), it'd be "one square, two squares (one to the left), three squares (two to the left)".

Does that help you?

>>51146577

if you are a bard and you don't pick up vicious mockery, you're dead to me.

What attack spells do fire or radiant damage. I plan to multiclass warlock undying light

>>51146587
>>A man cannot become good enough at unarmed combat to contribute similarly

A man can.
By Monk levels.

>>51146622
Sadly everybody else's is dealing 1d10+10 at that time

>>51145940
justplayamonk.jpg

>>51146638

The ones in Light Cleric spell list

I've run across a bit of a problem. I'm running a modern campaign using 5e. Hammered out enough details to the world to run and came up with my own firearms that would be more balanced with the existing melee weapons. We convened to make characters and do session zero on Monday. Then the artificer came out and one of my players made one, going into gunsmith. The rub is that the thundercannon, at its base, is slightly weaker than the rifle I already came up with (2d6 vs 3d4). What do?

>>51146587
>A man can punch hard enough with one of his bare fists to cause damage comparable to that of a great maul, a weapon that the guy that attacks 9 times has to hold with both hands

Punching with the strength of an actual sledgehammer isn't enough for you?

>>51146470
>>51146482

way to miss the point

"Guy who is also a dragon" is way more character-defining than "Guy who still just beats things to death--but with his fists this time"

It's not about magic vs. martial or power levels, some archetypes say a lot of cool shit about your character and "punches more good" is a wet fart

Do you think we'll ever see a new setting in 5th edition?

Everyone's so busy jacking themselves off over old settings that I feel like 5e would burn from underneath them if Mearls had the balls to release a new setting before first updating literally everything else ever published.

>>51146644
And monk is doing 5d10+25
Are you an actual retard? Or just think kenshiro is a valid thing to aim for in DandfuckingD?

>>51146663
>is slightly weaker

only slightly? Then it doesn't matter. Besides, it's the same damage on average.

Also, check out the UA modern spells

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>>51146577
>>51146592
Speaking of which, I need to create an extensive list of insults for all sorts of races. Cant be unprepared.

Lets start with Dwarves.

>>51146342
They're different roles. Bards get almost no good offensive spells except for those few they can steal with Magical Secrets. The only offensive cantrip they get without wasting a feat or a magical secret is Vicious Mockery, the weakest damage cantrip in the game. Though bards can bleed into the sorcerer's role a little bit, bards are mostly for support and utility, and the fact that they CAN take the place of a cleric usually means they kind of have to.

And don't treat all metamagic feats as equal. The two important ones are Quicken Spell and Twin Spell. Twin Spell is fun as hell as it lets you effectively concentrate on two spells at once.

>>51146688
>new
>5th edition

NNNope

>>51146688
why not create one, anon?

>>51146694
>>51146644

The Kensei was created to give the Monk a big damage GWM users so Monk isnt just a moderate damage guy that puts riders on his attacks.Monks pretty much have an archetype for everything nowadays and are at least moderately good at it [Save E monk and LD]

>>51146685
Again, for you

In my personal opinion "guy who punches things into next tuesday and subjugates the mightiest of beasts with his bare hands" is much cooler than "sword dude" or "dragon sperm collector"

You're saying the idea has no merit solely based on your subjective opinion, which is a retarded premise

>>51146694
No, the retard seems to be you, monk doesn't have 5 attacks, that's for starter, and monk can't use GWM or SS (where the +10 comes from), so next try to read, then reply.

But if you prefer
Monk deals 1d10+5 at the veryveryvery best
Rest deal 1d10+15 with more chances of adding a +1 from magic items to all their attacks while monk has almost none

>>51146696
But, when the ranger starts getting multiple attacks, he's completely outdoing the big class feature of the artificer.

>>51146718
>The Kensei was created to give the Monk a big damage GWM
Sadly if he wants to also have Defense, they don't deal much more damage, charts say they deal like +5 compared to a normal punchy monk, and that's pitable, a barbarian, ranger or a paladin deal double what a monk deals. A fighter can even quadruple what a monk deals.

>>51146577
It's very good. Applying disadvantage to an enemy's attack makes them miss quite often.

>>51146615
At least 4e made monks good, too bad the industry is allergic to change.
>>51146622
The problem is that a level 17 tavern brawler fighter is still doing 1d4.
>>51146642
I love monks and the archetypes they represent, but sometimes other classes are a better fit for certain unarmed archetypes, especially anything using strength. A street boxer, a fighter who's a master of martial arts but not mystical self improvement/enlightenment, a raging windmill of fists and muscle, etc. The fact that monks are the only unarmed class is insufficient.
>>51146664
I'm fine with the scaling that monks get, they get more utility than raw power, as they aught. Concepts that don't fall under monk fall behind, because the monk class has very flavorful abilities that imply someone who meditates and masters enlightenment and power of self, mind, and body, who can punch (or use small weapons) as a result of this training of inner strength.

>>51146730

meh, that may as well be, as I don't have the artificer in front of me right now, but on the flip side, just consider how the ranger is shit anyway, so it might as well gets it consolation prize of damage


Alternatively, you can let the gunsmith apply the Crossbow Expert feat to the artificer

>>51146694
>5d10+25
Citation needed

Also is pretty fucking clear the other anon was mentioning greatweaponmaster but I guess you couldn't even get that

>>51145798
Aren't radius attacks always made on a point on the grid? So it would be 4

>>51146587
Realism is not a single all-or-nothing thing. Different genres have different, separate unrealistic conventions for which they ask the audience to suspend their disbelief. For example, comedy, action, and horror movies are all unrealistic, but no two are unrealistic in the same way.

The conceit that armed and unarmed combat are equally effective (in which case why would anyone ever bother with weapons?) is native to superhero comics and kung-fu movies, and not even all of those. Western fantasy RPGs, and the fiction they're based off of, run on an entirely different set of conceits.

>>51146624
Do you an image?

So this artificer pet, you go polar bear right? Also I don't see it scaling in any way so it's useless past level 10 or whatever?

>>51146748

The fuck are you talking about?

Most damage comes off the +10 and they only use Dex even for 2HWs so theres no reduction in anything. You get the same two attacks with GWM almost everyone else gets and could gets a pair of extra UA attacks to tack a little more on

>>51146753
>The fact that monks are the only unarmed class is insufficient

It's a pretend game. Take a monk and let it use Strength instead of Dexterity, and refluff the rest

I just had this problem with a player who wanted at all costs to play a homebrew summoner class because he really really wanted to have a "edolion" or whatever, until it finally took me fifteen minutes to refluff the moon druid into a tiny beast that shapeshifts into big beasts and has a human familiar

>>51146755
Ah, well. I'll just have to get some real play done and see how the group goes.

>>51146793

Basically with no scaling it gets less and less useful but since its pretty easy to patch back up its not a huge loss if it gets KOed.

The best choices are probably the Allosaurus or Sabertooth Tiger for raw survivability+damage and the occasional knockdown will be helpful too. Theres also nothing stopping you from getting them Barding to up their shitty ACs and riding them with Mounted Combat can help offset weaknesses even more. Thats my plan anyways

Id making a ranged spell attack considered casting a spell?

>>51146794
>gets a pair of extra UA attacks to tack a little more on
Enjoy 1+Str
Also the "other people get" have on top +1d8 to (Paladin at 11th level), Rage, +1d6 (Ranger), Extra attack for another 1d10+10 (or 2d6), advantage almost always or at least when needed. Do the math or better, go to archives and read the math already have been done.

Full unarmed monk (OH was the one used) deals around 32 on average at 20th level, Greatsword kensai dealt 38 on average at 20th level because people don't consider like ever the fucking -5 you have to eat to add +10 to damage and that monks can't get reliable advantage like other classes get (OH can from tripping but only to his last attack ever because how FoB works).

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>>51146770
Nigga, the monk was first added in 1975, before clerics. D&D is founded on pulp culture including science fiction, wuxia movies, and vaguely understood mythology.
I don't want everyone to punch as well as they hit with a greatsword, but the fact that only one class can meaningfully specialize with one of the most celebrated fighting styles in history (at least in ceremony and legend, but this is heroic fantasy) is a crime.
>>51146797
So now you've got someone who has the same attachment to enlightenment and inner power, but is implicitly muscular and less precise. You've not solved anything besides buffing their Athletics checks and carrying capacity.

>>51146853
The monk was a mistake.

>>51146867
Ranger, Monk, Paladin, and Warlock should be prestige classes

>>51146663
The Artificer gets other shit though.

I balance my guns twofold.

1. Expensive as shit, and ammo is just as bad.
2. Exploding crits on Str based melee.

>>51146832
Could you not also go with flying?

What do you guys use to make and design your PDFs? I want to upload something to dms guild.

>>51146883
Imho the game should have level 10 classes, and from 11th level and beyond have stuff like Monk, Warlock, etc less conventional classes.

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>>51146902
Microsoft Word.

>>51146853
>So now you've got someone who has the same attachment to enlightenment and inner power,

Annon, have you ever watched Rocky? Shit is enlightned as fuck

How about Ong Bak? Or the Raid? Shit, or any of the Karate Kids? Shit is literally Boxing the Movie

>>51146924

Everything monk uses for Dex, except for skills, you use Strenth?

Attack Rolls? Strength? Armor Class? Your Muscular Guard covers it too
>wah wah, but my magicless punch man
Nigga, if being an MMA instead of a Mike Tyson is really getting you down that hard, then you're just being autistic

>>51145811
>5ft diameter
>4 squares
lol you dumb

>>51146902
Naturalcrit

>>51146842

Whoa whoa whoa piggy slow down

Fully unarmed OH Monk does what it is meant to do.It hits things for moderate damage usually 2-4 attacks for 1D10+5. It gets to tack footsweeps onto its flurry and nutshot stuns when you think that that has a good chance at working. So thats about 10 damage a shot 20 with no resource usage 20-40 and a knockdown% if you spend some Ki

A Kensai gets access to a 2D6 weapon he can use Dex with as well as GWM and if he wants to use Ki Sharpening the blade which WILL stack with a Magical weapon giving him as much as 2D6+21 for 3 Ki and the option to still use Ki for flurry or stuns if he feels so inclined. The pluses offset the penalty a lot AND you get a free reroll on a miss at higher levels. Its built for this build and does just fvine at what its meant to do

Now apologize to the people here you fat stupid idiot

>>51146853
Monks only managed to get kind of shoehorned into D&D through the idea that you had to undergo a very strict and specific discipline to harness your ki, at which point you followed the rules of a kung-fu movie instead of D&D (not wuxia; the heroes in wuxia still use the best weapons available to them.) If ki isn't necessary, and any idiot like the meathead in your picture can fight just as well unarmed as a guy with a greatsword, that's insane.

>>51146688
New settings?

Why on earth would they ever do anything for new players, when they can just remake old settings so the lifers can play them for the 3rd edition in a row?

>>51146964
Go back to archive and read the math against actual AC, faggot.

>>51146924
I'll concede that monk (namely Open Hand or Long Death) can be reasonably used to portray the sweet science, but there aught to be an option for characters who don't want this skill and wisdom to manifest powers to walk up walls or speak any language or turn invisible or astral project. I actually like the idea of a boxer trained roughly by an old master who unlocks their own enlightenment and school powers through personal experience, but it'd be nice to have the option for unarmed fighters and barbarians to keep up.

>>51146901

Sure its an option but the fliers tend to be CR1 Giant Eagles or Vultures that only have about 20 or so health.Its not a bad option especially before you can infuse Fly spells onto jetpacks

This entire thread has turned into

>I wanna play a punch-man that doesn't taste like soy sauce

>NO SWORDS ARE BETTER THAN FISTS MUH REALEEZM STOP LIKING WHAT I DONT LIKE

Does the Wizard add int bonust to attack spells?

>>51146138
>There's a reason why they're remaking the whole thing
They're iterating on the design. It's not going to be a radical change.

>>51146230
>Can you name a thing warlord did that battlemaster can't? Something that would fit 5e.
Restore HP to an ally making death saves as a bonus action. Help an ally end a temporary disabling effect like paralysis, poisoned, blindness, or deafness. Give a shit about Int. It wouldn't even be hard to do these few things with a few changes to battle master maneuvers. The battle master is intentionally not warlord-y.

>>51146374
"Boxer" is already a competitive character in his own game alongside "immortal psychic dictator powered by evil" and shit.

>>51146448
>Punches are perhaps the WORST way (short of finger-jabs or combat licking) to fight without a weapon.
Good thing unarmed strikes aren't just punches then!

>>51146705
Subtle Spell lets you get away with complete shenanigans in social encounters, if that's what you're into.

>>51146729
A shadow monk can attack 5 times in a round at level 17. A fighter can attack 4 times with an action (so up to 6 times a round) at level 20. Paladins, Rangers, and Barbarians aren't keeping up with those two in attacks. You want a legendary weapon for your monk? Belt of Storm Giant Strength.

>>51146770
>Western fantasy RPGs, and the fiction they're based off of, run on an entirely different set of conceits.
Beowulf. Your agument is invalid.
>>51146838
Only if you cast a spell, so if you're asking, probably not.

>>51146842
>Enjoy 1+Str meme.
You can hold a greatsword in one hand and flurry with martial arts. Stop promoting illiteracy.

>>51146997

>>RRRREEEE ill ignore your point
>>Bounded accuracy is bullshit
>>Compare to other damage dealers class cant be comparable because it doesnt match my narrative
>>RRRREEEE WHY DID YOU LEAVE DADDY?

>>51147021
Must be wednesday then

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>>51146977
D&D was originally pulp nerd shit "shoehorned" into Chainmail. And once monks were in the game, they were just as much part of D&D rules as the fightan man. Even if these characters haven't been taught the secrets of ki and how to harness it to catch arrows and punch fire, why can't they have sufficient martial training to be fantastically strong unarmed fighters when others can become so absurdly strong specializing with crossbows?

Need plot solution ideas.

How could a single, unknown person displace a beloved ruler and take over, with a minimum of bloodshed?

>>51147025
Yes. He adds int and proficiency bonus to his attack.

>>51146832
The best choices are Giant Eagle or Giant Owl. You don't fight with them. You use them as flying mounts that have enough intelligence to activate infusions on their own.

So Im playing Necro Wizard. Should I get animate dead at level 5 or wait for level 6 and get it for free?

>>51147044
> Single, unknown person
> Displace a beloved king
> Take over
I'd suggest looking up to Varys or Littlefinger from a Song of Ice and Fire. Though plans of both of them included a shit ton of bloodshed.

>>51147045
Any reason why Eldritch Blast doesnt get CHA bonus until agonizing blast?

>>51147049
>>51147012

Oh yeah noted above and I dont disagree I just like the beefier fightier option and im gonna do my best to make it work long term

>>51147070
To keep it a warlock feature instead of giving away the full power of the spell via Spell Sniper and Magic Initiate.

>>51147044
Disguise self?

Any illusion wizard can just Aizen his way through every situation.

>>51147058
Ask your DM if you can get a different spell for free at level 6 if you take animate dead now. If not, wait. It's painful, but it's worth it.

>>51147070
Because with or without CHA bonus Eldritch Blsat is the best damaging cantrip. Also don't know if you're that other guy but Wizards don't get +INT to damage with attack spells, just to the attack roll.

>>51147070
Agnizing blast adds CHA to damage, you don't add casting stat mod to damage on spells except in specific circumastances like that one

>>51147070
Attack rolls and damage rolls are different terms, where an attack roll is "to hit" and damage is self explanatory.
When making a spell attack, the spell attack bonus (to hit) is your spellcasting modifier plus your proficiency modifier. When rolling damage for spells, you do what it says on the can. Firebolt does 1d10 (scaling later) fire damage, and doesn't add anything. Eldritch Blast also adds nothing, but the invocation allows them to add Cha to their damage roll as well, making them more similar to weapons (which add ability mod and proficiency to hit, and also ability mod to damage)

>>51146296
Cones don't start from the corner of a square though

>>51147040
Because why the fuck would they? Swords exist. Hell, sticks and rocks exist. Historically, there was a reason why a lot of Chinese martial arts are unarmed or use improvised peasant weapons. The reason was that real weapons were regulated because they're so much better. Martial artists who could use swords, spears, or other real weapons generally did so. D&D settings tend to be pretty laissez-faire about letting anyone go around armed to the teeth, so a tradition of unarmed martial arts simply would never develop in that environment.

>>51147058
Talk to tour máster, get it on 5 And get another spell at 6

Can we really not just house rule an unarmed fighting style to please this guy and move on

>>51147026
>immortal psychic dictator powered by evil
http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/895976-street-fighter-v/72317138
A decent enough tier list for the canon strength of everyone based off of comics, manga, and endings. Boxer can hold his own, no doubt, but not against Dictator for very long unless he gets some help.
I'll just hold that Hugo, being able to stay awake after eating a Shin Shoryuken, is fucking strong as shit.

>>51147069
>Varys and Littlefinger
I'm familiar with the characters from the show, though I haven't read the books. They're starting out with more power than I had in mind (at the start of the narrative, I mean - I'm trying to work out something in a shorter timeframe), but it's something to go on. Thanks!

>>51147094
An artifact, maybe, character doesn't have magic themselves. Would need them to quietly assassinate the ruler, though I expect that could be worked in. My ideal is some sort of political coup.

>>51147044
Pretty much this >>51147069 find another beloved noble and use it as your puppet, make sure they are next in line and then quietly remove the monarch

>>51147026
>Paladins, Rangers, and Barbarians aren't keeping up with those two in attacks
Paladin adds 1d8 to all his attacks at 11th level
That's 2d6+1d8+5 per attack (compared to 1d10+5 from monk)
Barbarian adds +4 to all his attacks at later levels
That's 2d6+5+4 per attack to all his attacks (compared to 1d10+5 from monk)

Sure, Monk makes more attacks, but the other two classes deal more damage per attack (without spells, reckless attack, channel divinity, etc)

Just paladin deals on average 17.81 per hit, add GWM and that's 27.81 per hit. 55.62 in 2 attacks, if GWM triggers, 83.42 in 3 attacks.
Monk deals 1d10+5, which is 10.5, 52.5 in those "5" attacks.
Barbarian deals lower than Paladin (16 on one attack assuming he isn't 20th level yet for that delicious +4 to str, 26 with GWM) but has more chances to hit thanks to reckless attack and to trigger GWM. In vaccum he deals 78 per turn.

>>51147109
Why do you keep trying to bring realism into it? It's a fucking game with dragons and spells

Barbarians can have skin as tough as plate, they should be able to have fists as damaging as warhammers

>>51147138
>find another beloved noble
That could be the key I'm looking for. Perfect.

>>51147032
If you time to be triggered you also have time to check the archive in where grown ups made the math for you. Thank me later, fairy

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PCs were sent to meet with the guard captain of a nearby city.

This city was attacked and is already being looted by it's citizens.

The governor is in his office and needs to be escorted to safety.

A madman will suggest burning the city to the ground

What other goals or ideas could the PCs be given?

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>>51147109
>Swords exist
Who gives a shit about swords existing if you can punch hard enough to not need them. D&D, since at least 4e, has been HEROIC fantasy. This means doing all the things of myth and glory.
D&D is not meant to be some in depth simulation, it is meant to be big heroes doing larger than life things.

>>51147132
>They're starting out with more power than I had in mind
Mind you Varys didn't start out with that power. He was like...a street urchin at first. A cutpurse. Then learned the contents of a man's letters were more valuable than that of his wallet. Started trading information. Built a Rogues Guild essentially. Then i guess somehow transitioned into being on the Small Council of The Seven Kingdom across the Narrow Sea.

Basically what you need to do is always push towards being a bigger fish and being valuable to having other people in the world.

>I have this thing you want. I don't want money, I want power in exchange.

My DMs idea of creating a "challenge" for me, a rogue, is to make sure I can never enter stealth or that all enemies beat my stealth check with just their passive perception. For example:
>enter tower
>go up stairs
>"magical room" reveals the location of anyone that enters at all times
>will not allow any option to enter stealth or stop the magical properties of the tower

Fine. I'm a good sport and he's the DM so I'll just accept the tower was rigged against rogues.

Next example:
>sneaking through alleyway with high stealth check
>guard runs up to me and starts attacking
>zero explanation other than "his passive was high enough"
>later admits to raising his stats to beat my stealth (no shit)

This is pretty much every encounter. If I enter stealth at all he throws a fit about how I'm just skipping his encounters or it's not fair. I get that the DM gets final say but at what point is it over the top and requires me to say something to him about it? Is there anything I can, or should, do?

Another example

>>51147127
In my table we have a feat:
Sum Ting Wong, Bang Ding Ow:
. -5 to hit +10 to damage on unarmed attacks
. Your unarmed attacks are Piercing, Slashing or Bludgeoning whenever you like

>>51147165
Assassinating king is notably difficult, and his heirs are very unlikely to be compliant to some literal nobody.
Instead, you probably want to prove that the king is an asshole and/or illegitimate. Forge the convincing proof that he plots to centralize power and become an absolute ruler. Implicate him in assassinating his rivals. "Find" evidence that he was born a bastard (and thus neither he, nor his children have any claim at all), or maybe he's not our king at all, but a body double/doppelganger/foreign agent in disguise.
Than take this proof to the most ambitious and powerful motherfucker around. This will give him an excuse to depose the king and his line.

>>51147213
Ignore last line. On mobile and didn't see it was there before posting.

>>51146724
how is

>"guy who punches things into next tuesday and subjugates the mightiest of beasts with his bare hands"

appreciably different from a guy who does the same thing but with a club? or a staff? or a sword?

Wizard archetypes range from "raises the dead" to "sees the future". Sorcerer archetypes range from "is a dragon hybrid" to "is a living thunderstorm". Warlock archetypes range from "Chosen of the Fair Folk" to "Knight of Hell".

Again, it's not about martial vs. magical. The problem is that 'punches dudes really hard' isn't all that different from 'bludgeons dudes really hard'.

I missed shitposting about the Artificer. Consensus on balance?

Personal thoughts:
>Core stats match the cleric, which is neat
>Wondrous Invention is brilliant
>Infuse magic is also pretty damn cool
>Mechanical servant should've been an archetype, has absolutely no business as a core feature. Also cucks the ranger
>Alchemist seemed broken until I realized healing draught was 1/long rest, now it seems perfect
>Gunsmith is fine except when put next to alchemist (both get new at-will abilities but alchemist has a choice and more utility)

>>51147148
Show me where those non-monk classes can stun on multiple hits, and let's factor accuracy into those damage numbers.

It's not as dire for the monk as you would lead people to believe if you're calculating never-miss scenarios.

>>51147127
It's easy to solve the problem of not having the mechanics I want. I've homebrewed tons of shit, made over $100 on races alone from DM's Guild. I love studying the mechanics and precedent of the game and making things that fit the terminology, diction, and style used by it. The quick fix is just add a fighting style that gives scaling unarmed damage, and even if you just play a "plate and shield punchguy" and homerule that dueling applies to unarmed strikes you're just 2 points of damage behind longsword, and have an extra trick. I'm not upset there aren't official supplements, I just hope there will be eventually.
I'm arguing for the sake of explaining my opinions and their foundations and trying to convince other people to come around to them and understand my position, not rant autistically. Forums are about discussion for the mutual entertainment/learning of everyone there.

>>51147213
Talk to him, outside of a session. So, before or after, or just whenever if you're IRL friends.

Explain that you feel like the way he designs situations is preventing you from using your characters abilities, rather than forcing you to use them creatively. Give an example. Then, give an example of how you'd prefer encounters to be designed.

This should be a cooperative conversation not an antagonistic one.

>>51147171
>there are magical bombs in the city
>the governor is an imposter
>the governor is actually orange and corrupt and not worth saving
>the city museum holds relics of incalculable value (magic items)
>the people are being possessed by evil spirits
>the underpeople of your choice are taking advantage and rising up to take over the surface
>there is a group kidnapping citizens and turning them into flesh golems
>the remnants of the peacekeeping force can be rallied to the PC's cause
>the PCs find the governor dead, they are framed!
>the governor's family needs rescuing
>there is a portal to another plane opening and swallowing the city
>dick wizards are growing dicks on things
>a reward is being offered for the head of a particular faction among the rioters
>the governor's political rival caused everything, she is a hag
>a meteor is headed for the city
>the PC's left the gas on

>>51147267
>>Mechanical servant should've been an archetype, has absolutely no business as a core feature. Also cucks the ranger

Not an issue because the ranger's pet gains hit points, proficiency, and ASIs.

>Gunsmith is fine except when put next to alchemist (both get new at-will abilities but alchemist has a choice and more utility)

It's the damage archetype. It traded away the utility to hurt things more than the alchemist does.

>>51147227
Implying the doppelgangerness might be the best bet. The tricky part is that it's a drow city, and the ruler came to power by talent rather than dynasty, so them being a dick, illegitimate, and assassinating people sadly doesn't factor in.

Considering magic is commonplace, is it still possible to "prove" they're not who they say they are?

>>51147292
Thanks. We are actually brothers. I've casually tried to bring it up after a session but he gets mad. I'll probably try again this time with more intent and make sure it doesn't sound like bitching.

>>51147181
No matter how strong you are, that strength would be put to better use if you had a sword. Someone choosing to go unarmed when they have other options isn't just unrealistic; it makes no sense by D&D's own unrealistic internal logic.

>>51147273
>Let's factor accuracy
Reckless attack removes (statistically speaking) the -5 from GWM
Devotion Paladin removes (if you have 20 Cha and at those levels you probably will) the -5 from GWM for 1 minute per hour

Not Barb, but Paladin has spells that work as bonus action and other shit, I was not counting spent resources beyond ki for FoB, but if you want, check the Paladin's list.
Barbarian doesn't have anything like that per se (didn't check the new subclasses though) but he isnt' even a damage dealer more like a tank but still tends to outdamage monk

>calculating never-miss scenarios.
Funny you throw that to me when the other anon didn't even account shit for his kensai he just assumed GWM with 2d6+5 on two attacks better than 4d10+20

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>>51147213
>>51147229

Ask him why he wants to quell stealthing so much, and bring up how it supresses one of the main facets of the rogue that you would like to be able to use.
Try to explain sneaking past a comba encounter isn't cheating or cheesing it, it can be as rewarding to get by a close one. Just ask him to throw you a bone and let your sneaky skills shine from time to time.

I do think the guard wailing on you because of bullshit passive perception or whatever is unseemly. The tower he might had reasons it's whatever

>>51147296
Scaling hit points don't make up for not being able to act independently. Not when most games don't go past 10.

>>51147339
>strength would be put to better use if you had a sword
No it would not.
If that were true why would Heracles not use a sword instead of a club or his fists.

>>51147345
>Reckless attack removes (statistically speaking) the -5 from GWM
Advantage averages to +3ish though. It's only worth +5 when you need an 11 to hit.

>>51147305
Proclaim he's actually a sun elf born in Halruaa. When he protests, demand his birth certificate.

>>51147296
When does revised ranger pet take over mechanic servant in health and damage?

>>51147305
>Implying the doppelgangerness might be the best bet.

Is it?

My group assumes every NPC they meet is a doppelganger because of some changes I made on the fly when we ran LMoP that made it particularly doppelgangery. I can never use dopplegangers without it being a twist within a subversion anymore.

>>51147345
And then there's Battlemaster (but we all know he's the king of smack) and Hunter Ranger who can reliabily make 5 attacks with a bow (probably volley will make more though) that deal 1d8+5+10

>>51147358
Wait are we talking about the shitty PHB ranger? Read the UA revised ranger. Their beast has its own actions.

At level 6, the UA ranger's black bear would have
AC 14, HP 39, proficiency in all saving throws, and claws that hit for 2d4+6 assuming the ASI went to Strength.

A polar bear is offensively slightly stronger and defensively weaker. The scaling goes in favor of the beast ranger's pet.

>>51147234
I'm sorry butif you can't appreciate why punching things is markedly cooler than stabbing them or hitting them with a stick then there is nothing I can do

You say they're the same because you feel like they are, I say they are not because it's a completely different paradigm, I can't force you to agree with me but I know what I'm saying has merit or else there wouldn't be at least 3 people on here arguing the same thing, so if you can't see it then whatever

>>51147357
I'll probably talk to him today about it. The tower and guard examples happen ALL the time. Im fine with overcoming situations but at a certain point it's obviously just to stop his "least favorite mechanic."

>>51147213
You don't need to fudge dice rolls or give NPCs godlike stats to make stealth impossible. Stealth requires total cover to initiate and at least partial cover to maintain. There's a little bit of DM leeway regarding who notices what in the middle of combat, but in general if you walk right into plain view of someone, they're going to see you without a roll, no matter how high your Stealth is. A hallway with a few ordinary guards, or a room with an ordinary guard watching each entrance, cannot be penetrated stealthily without magic.

>>51147415
>>51147357
Can you specifically request a stealth based dungeon, possibly as a one shot?

That might be a good eye opener for all involved.

>>51147369
If you take into account that you'll probably need something between 7-14 on the die, advantage is more like a +4

>>51147379
It passes in health at level 7, though it's worth noting its AC is already higher and proficiency to all saving throws will make its HP last longer.

It won't pass the polar bear in potential damage on a single target but the accuracy keeps scaling up, and the level 11 feature makes it possible to get high damage on a multiple target attack.

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>>51147295
Kek

Thanks there are some good ones in there

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>>51147339
To continue on >>51147360
Pic related is not most swords. Even if you discount the fact that a regular sword can break and shatter and that most require going on quests to get better things, putting more strength behind a cutting edge can only do so much more. Once you can cut clean through someone, which any 5e fighter worth his snuff can do, there is very little worth in any strength beyond that unless you step up both your game and sword at the same time to hunt bigger stuff. Meanwhile, Enkidu the punch dude will always do large amounts of damage by sheer force. He won't be as skillful as the fighter but with enough brute force only limited by the body of a hero that won't matter too much.

>>51147378
Kek

>>51147380
Any counter suggestions? So far I'm pulling from this thread that using a political rival would be the best bet, but what does the weak individual offer the rival that adds value and prompts a takeover?

>>51147417
>>51147213
In the case of the tower, the DM didn't make that up. There's a spell called Alarm that alerts the caster of anyone and everyone who passes through a particular door, window, or 20-foot cube of space. It's first-level. It's the most basic level of security that anyone with access to magic would put on their territory.

>>51146997
I'll do you one better, and post it right now.

Totem barbarian 20 with GWM and PM.
Reckless attack
>+8 to hit for 1d10+7+10+4
>26.5*0.75+22*0.0975=22.02
Gets two of these, three on a critical or KO.
Bonus Action reckless attack
>+8 to hit for 1d4+7+10+4
>23.5*0.75+10*0.0975=18.6
Gets this if it doesn't KO or critical
Reaction attack
>+8 to hit for 1d10+7+10+4
>26.5*0.5+22*0.05=14.35
Gets this if an enemy runs up or runs away. Variable.
So a standard round is going to be 62.64-66.06 damage, with a possible 14.35 extra from an opportunity attack.
>Total possible average of 80.41.

Level 20 Kensei with GWM.
>+9 to hit for 2d6+5+3+10
>25*0.7975+7*0.0725=20.445
>(25*0.7975+7*0.0725)*0.55+(25*0.55+7*0.05)*0.45=17.58975
Flurry of Blows
>+11 to hit for 1d10+5
>(10.5*0.8775+5.5*0.0975)*0.3025+(10.5*0.65+5.5*0.05)*0.6975=7.901625
>10.5*0.8775+5.5*0.0975)*0.196625+(10.5*0.65+5.5*0.05)*0.803375=7.62105625
Bonus GWM attack
>+9 to hit for 2d6+5+10+3
>(25*0.7975+7*0.0725)*0.3025+(25*0.55+7*0.05)*0.6975=16.0193625
Just being thorough.

Two attacks for 38.03475, then once the blade is sharpened, two flurry attacks.
Total average damage in a round of 53.55743125.
If you get an OA for some reason, that does 20.445, so it can do up to 74.00243125 as an average.

Bringing it all together, the barbarian has one less ASI and does 63.27441 plus more opportunity attacks and the monk does 53.55743125 and can stun. The barbarian does a lot more damage. About 20% to 50% more.

>>51147148
>Just paladin deals on average 17.81 per hit, add GWM and that's 27.81 per hit. 55.62 in 2 attacks, if GWM triggers, 83.42 in 3 attacks.
>GWM just adds +10 damage and always triggers an extra attack
You aren't even trying.

>>51147417
I agree. The mechanic is tricky enough to pull off that it's really it's own challenge. A challenge I enjoy so I play rogue.

>>51147429
This is a good idea. I'll suggest it.

>>51147459
Yeah I was totally fine with alarm but it went way beyond it. Once you pass through no matter where you go in the tower your location is known. I also get creating things that don't normally exist and we have to overcome, but it's gotten obvious he's just anti-rogue or stealth in general.

>>51147452
>So far I'm pulling from this thread that using a political rival would be the best bet, but what does the weak individual offer the rival that adds value and prompts a takeover?

In these situations, it's usually more the case that the heir is being manipulated or influenced.

For example, history has many examples of a queen grooming her son to overthrow the crown prince born the king's previous wife.

So it could be an unambitious or emotionally vulnerable 2nd in line or heir, being influenced by another party who would then be the defacto ruler. Or even a young heir, who would then need a regent...

>>51147470
>>Just paladin deals on average 17.81 per hit, add GWM and that's 27.81 per hit. 55.62 in 2 attacks, if GWM triggers, 83.42 in 3 attacks.
>>GWM just adds +10 damage and always triggers an extra attack
Someone should explain to you what IF means

Also read Devotion and Reckless attack which statistically remove the -5 from GWM which make the roll to hit the same as a Monk not using GWM so isn't needed to calcualte who's better, though the averages per turn vs AC aren't calculated but that's not important because A will still be higher than B because both need the same roll to hit.

>>51147517
>Also read Devotion and Reckless attack which statistically remove the -5 from GWM which make the roll to hit the same as a Monk not using GWM so isn't needed to calcualte who's better

Learn how statistics work before you make that argument. +5 is the maximum equivalent benefit of advantage, not the average.

If you multiclass as 2 different casters who have access to the same spell, how will I know which stat to use to attack with the spell or its spell save DC

>>51147544

By which class you prepare it for, duh. If you prepare it for both classes (why?) then you could pick either.

>>51147544
You average the two DCs together

>>51147470
>You lack one ASI
Not needed, Monk needs all his ASIs for Dex and Wis, Barb only needs to rise Str and that's it, he can survive just fine with Armor, monk can't.

>>51147544
Which class did you actually prepare/learn the spell on? That's what determines the stat to use, not availability.

ex: If you're a bard/cleric and you prepared cure wounds as a cleric, you use wisdom. However healing word that you picked as a spell known on bard uses charisma.

>>51145772
Seriously looking at the Artificer UA, I'm noticing a lack of "short rest" or "long rest" type notations in the subclass abilities. Does this mean that a Gunsmith can deal 11d6 + Dex damage each round? Since the Thunder Cannon is treated as a weapon, and Thunder Monger is *bonus* damage with no caveat about how often you can get that bonus.

Meanwhile the Alchemist can force a target to make a Dexterity save against 10d6, or multiple targets in a 5-foot radius to save against 7d6. Not as impressive, but again, nothing says you can't do this every turn.

I could see a rogue with a crossbow or shortbow getting quite jealous of the Gunsmith in combat.

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>>51145772
Did anyone already played Artificer? I'm not sure if I should give Alchemist a try, or just stick to first concept - Thief with Healer feat.

New class looks kinda bland with 1/3 casting, some spammable "spells", non-leveling pet and some situational magic items (with some notable exceptions). Yet it looks kinda cool

Bonus question: How does Sanctuary spell and Alchemist Vials interact?

>>51147592
>Did anyone already played Artificer?
It's been two days.

>>51147592
It literally came out yesterday famalamadingdong

>>51147583
You have to reload the gun as a bonus action. Also those special things don't use the Attack action, so there's no benefit to Extra Attack, Haste, reaction attacks, etc. 11d6+Dex isn't much different than Sneak Attack at that level. Rogues can dual wield or use crossbow expert to get 2 chances at Sneak Attack, and they can use Sneak Attack on reaction attacks.

You're over-reacting.

>>51147492
>>51147213
Maybe your DM is trying to do you a favor. It might be a choice between the following options:

>Rogue splits the party and goes out alone
>He gets caught immediately
>He's close enough to the rest of the party that they can come in and save him

>Rogue splits the party and goes out alone
>He makes it deep into enemy territory while the other players just kind of sit there and wait
>He gets caught after a while
>He's fucked because there's a whole skipped dungeon standing between him and the rest of the party

>>51146085
The only problem with Battlemaster as a replacement for Warlord is that it can potentially do much more than Warlord.

If you want to play a Warlord but don't want the ability to do anything besides support your teammates, just play a Purple Dragon Knight.

>>51147517
You still aren't even trying.

The monk's stunning strike can give advantage too. Devotion's CD can only be used once per short rest and takes an action to activate just like the monk's empty body. Their chance to hit is different and can't just be handwaved.

>>51147470
Why does this level math ignore the advantage a monk can gain from using Empty Body?

>>51147652
This has been my experience with rogues as well

He tried to stealth off down a hallway after the BEG while the party was getting eaten by ghouls and he fell down a hole and got eaten by a ghoul

>>51147652
I get why you would think that but I've never once left the party (except for moving to a more concealed location in the same room). What he's wanting is for a head on fight with no rogue mechanics. I know because he's literally told me.

> tfw Artificer is already on the meganon's site
I don't know him personally, but I'm sure that meganon is a wonderful human being.

>>51147569
That gets you a monk with 20 AC compared to a barbarian with, at most, 17 AC. It's not relevant for hitting things, but it is a difference.

>>51147688
If he literally told you he wants no rogue mechanics then I advise you to reroll

>>51146842
This is why you take the Lizard folk race, you can bite people for 1d6 + str instead

>>51147699
I've told him that before and asked if I should. He said he's "just trying to make it challenging."

>>51147583
>1d8+dex+10d6 sneak attack.
With a bonus action free to dash, disengage, or hide for advantage on every turn.

>2d6+dex+9d6 thunder damage
>Using a bonus action to reload every turn.

Who's going to be jealous?

>>51147726
I've only heard your side of the story, but your DM seems like a moron.

>>51147673
Because it costs a lot of Ki and takes a whole action to activate. It's useful if you're prepared and dumping a lot of Ki into a fight (7 for prep, plus flurries and maybe stuns is a lot of Ki), and dragons and shit have extraordinary senses that can see through it. You'll tear through a horde of humanoids though.

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>>51145813
A lot of these can be rather small dungeons I think. Consider expanding the adventure to focus half on getting there in the first place (or getting back). The Jungle is the Monster sort of thing.

Finding the lost pyramid, moving through the wilderness, looking for clues, guardian monsters and tribes, terrain that is dangerous, weather that is worse, that sort of thing.

A fight to get there, a struggle to clear the pyramid and get the goods, then more challenge trying to get back - ambush from rival groups, tribes now on the alert, good stuff.

Hell, put it on the Isle of Dread.

>>51147760
>dragons and shit have extraordinary senses that can see through it
True, but then it's also defensively good against them because of all the resistances. Almost like a counterpoint to rage.

I guess I don't understand why people talk about high level monks and only look at the DPR for their contribution. A high level monk is pretty well balanced for offense and defense.

>>51147609
You can basically use the Thunder Cannon once per turn, if you're willing to consume your bonus action to do so. As a rogue, you can Sneak Attack once per turn, if you spend one or more turns setting up a situation in which to do so, or an ally helps you out with flanking.

It's not that one ability is stronger than the other, it's that one is more reliable than the other.

However, with the Alchemist, it's absolutely a matter of relative damage. If you're a warlock you don't have to be jealous of the acid flasks, but a cleric who got +Wis to Sacred Flame or a sorcerer who's casting two offensive cantrips per turn might feel jealous.

>>51147816
>if you spend one or more turns setting up a situation in which to do so, or an ally helps you out with flanking.

>hide
>use ranged weapon

Sneak Attack every turn.

>>51147742
He comes up with cool stories and it's a good guy, but I think he's become jaded at players from roll20. He has said before that when they made 5e they only thought about players and didn't give any consideration to the DM... whatever that's worth.

>>51147835
What does that even mean?

Someone translate this.

>>51147835
>He has said before that when they made 5e they only thought about players and didn't give any consideration to the DM... whatever that's worth.

That is hilarious if you're coming over from 3.5 or PF.

>>51147831
Most rogues can't hide in plain sight. You won't always have something to duck behind.

>>51147662
>I'm going to point out your short rest feature but I'm going to completely ignore the ki I'm spending on FoB, Stun and sharpening blade, that's unimportant

Not even that guy but didn't this started as a unarmed monk vs rest of martials, the fact that kensai is slightly better than unarmed at damage was not the subject. I want a punchy build not a stun gun.

>>51147901
"I don't have 50 pages of DC tables."

>>51147957
Then rogue's potential depends on how good your DM is at designing not-shit combat areas.

>>51147781
I consider it an alternative to stunning strike because of the ki cost. Against a group of enemies it gives you advantage more often and against a single legendary enemy it protects you when they can't be stunned right away. It's great.

Just for you, here's the numbers with advantage from stunned or invisible.

>+9 to hit for 2d6+5+3+10
>25*0.95899375+7*0.11724375=24.79555
>(25*0.95899375+7*0.11724375)*0.7975+(25*0.7975+7*0.0975)*0.2025=23.950001125
Bonus action
>(25*0.95899375+7*0.11724375)*0.63600625+(25*0.7975+7*0.0975)*0.36399375=23.27553642221875
Flurry
>(10.5*0.98499375+5.5*0.10944375)*0.63600625+(10.5*0.8775+5.5*0.0975)*0.36399375=10.50962996484375
>(10.5*0.98499375+5.5*0.10944375)*0.558095484375+(10.5*0.8775+5.5*0.0975)*0.441904515625=10.4165775294150390625.
Rounding it all together:
Action for 48.745. Bonus action for sharpening the blade, then 23.275 from GWM or 20.926 from flurry. OA can do 24.79555.
Average damage of 70.16429 if it has advantage from stunning, invisibility, or some ally's help. The barbarian already has advantage.

Ball Bearings or Caltrops? Which one is worth the gold or should I split them?

>>51147974
"The Dark King of the Chest High Foliage Empire raises his staff, and..."

>>51147957
Thats why you use a ranged weapon. You can go to where the terrain features are.

Also Skulker is a thing.

>>51147971
>/5eg/ has only one thread of conversation.
There are links if you'd like to follow along with the rest of the class.

Kensei GWM vs Barbarian GWM was a different subject, and the kensei is only using sharpen the blade and flurry in that first big post, and flurry only when it has to. It's quite sustainable.

Paladin vs Shadow Monk is different, and the shadow monk can quite sustain flurry and empty body or stunning strike. Trying to use both would be draining.

>>51147781
In saves only, due their "" MAD"" their HPs are laughable for a martial, and the waste of ki is also an issue and depends a lot on the number of short rests your GM gives you, on average (1-2) is propably not worth mentioning, but sure a plus in some encounters, Rage will be used more often if not almost always.

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I've been shittalking Critical Role because of how low the sense of danger has been for seemingly forever but

>that latest episode
>niggas getting shit on

>>51148035
>4 ki is a lot of ki
kek

>>51148068
I don't watch Critical Role. Can you sum it up?

>>51148013
If Mass Effect and Gears of War can get away with it, so can a DM.

>>51148086
>These people are prettier and funnier than your group, but trying to copy them will make your game lame

>>51148082
It's when you also add several stuns, FoB, sharpen blade (if kensei) and only have like 1-2 short rests but 6-8 encounters a day as the system recommends. You might do it once a day, while the rage can be used almost always.

>>51148116
I mean the events of their last session. I know what the series is.

>>51148086
Lets put it this way. There is a site that tracks KOs and Deaths on Critical Role. Episode 80 is the latest one.

>Vex’ahlia (ep76, 2:33:33) Ghurrix
>Pike (ep77, 2:34:54) Gatekeeper Xanthas
>Trinket (ep79, 0:36:29) Thordak
>Vex’ahlia (Ep80, 1:00:25) Raishan
>Vax’ildan (Ep80, 1:30:32) Raishan
>Vax’ildan (Ep80, 2:05:11) Raishan
>Vex’ahlia (Ep80, 2:05:12) Raishan
>Vax’ildan (Ep80, 2:14:37) Raishan
>Scanlan (Ep80, 2:15:01) Raishan
>Pike (Ep80, 2:15:30) Raishan
>Vex’ahlia (Ep80, 2:36:03) Raishan

>>51148024
I'm one of the guys who started that conversation, I leave and one hour later this?, it just puzzles me how people ignored it and just went with the kensai. I don't want to use weapons on my punchy mckicking char.

>>51145772
>Artificer
>Gunsmith

I'm worried about what they're going to do to Eberron. One of its caveats is that magic replaces technology (ala Flintsones with rocks replacing tech) not Final Fantasy style steampunk/magitek.

Wizards with wand holsters, and hommunculi instead of androids, elemental flying ships instead of zepplins, and diviners instead of detectives.

It's like the Flintstones, where the cars is more than just a car made of rock, it's pillars of stone lashed onto wood and powered by your feet. Guns aren't hollowed out rock tubes full of gunpowder that shoot rocks. They're slingshots. Airplanes aren't bit flying contraptions, they're pterosaurs with howdas on the back.

Just to make it clear, I'm not knocking on the idea of a gunsmith class/archetype. Just concerned about it being part of the archetypal Eberron class because Eberron has long since been a setting that actually doesn't have guns. I suppose they're going with Faerunian Gond-style Artificer.

>>51148173
Nobody cares about unarmed because muh stun.

>>51148117
It depends on the fights you're up against. You can empty body and then (stunning strike and flurry) *3 for half your Ki at level 20. A barbarian can literally always be raging at level 20.

> only have like 1-2 short rests but 6-8 encounters a day as the system recommends
It really doesn't recommend that.

>>51148173
Shadow Monk attacks *5 without advantage = 35.5.
Shadow Monk attacks *5 with advantage = 48.75.
Open Hand monk just uses Quivering Palm = 55-dead.

Personally, I'd like to scale up monk's unarmed damage at each proficiency level so they'd have 1d12 at level 17.

Does a multiclass character get access to archetypes for each class?

i.e. would a Rogue 4/Ranger 3 be able to take Assassin on Rogue and Deep Stalker (from the Underdark UA) on Ranger?

Follow-up question - would it be worth multiclassing to this (assuming it's possible) purely for the Underdark Scout advantage on the Deep Stalker archetype?

it would give an extra attack on your first turn during combat, which could complement the assassin's Assassinate first turn advantage (+Alert for dat initiative bonus). But is that more valuable than just going Rogue 7 for 4d6 Sneak Attack boost?

Other factors:
>Ranger's Dueling bonus for +2 to damage rolls
>?

>>51148173
fuck off faggot play something that fits D&D

>you're in a cave fighting kobolds who've elected to hold you off so their superiors can prepare for you
>there's already been repeated rumblings in the cave, but they've been quiet and not led to anything yet
>a bullete dives through the wall during this fight, charges past you and the enemy, trampling anyone who fails a Dex save to get the fuck out of the way
>when it barrels through the other side it breaks open a small, previously sealed off chamber where a couple of long-dead fuckers have turned to ghouls and starved in the quiet dark for centuries
>they attack both sides indiscriminately

Is this awesome? I'm trying to add cool things to this dungeon and I'm on the fence about this particular part. I've had a couple levels where terrain is the dynamic part so I thought mixing it up with "suddenly a reminder of the ecology of the region" followed by a couple lingering bads unrelated to lizardfucks was a fun way to do something else.

>both captchas are stop signs

>>51148157
Is Trinket dead??

>Be me
>Be playing a Moon Druid
>Fight Yuan-Ti
>Generally play poorly up until the second half of the session
Like yeah I turned into a polar bear and dragged the wounded away but at the end everyone was out of slots and was on one or two death save fails each. The terrain was flat and featureless and most all of the Sneks had EB. There were also two instances of Hunger of Hadar up that I didn't dispel right away because I forgot I could.

How do I play better, my dudes? If it helps my Moon Druid has the Keen Mind feat so she's got Eidetic Memory.

>>51148185
I would think Eberron would ship with its own archetype. The UA artificer is for everything else.

>>51148213
Yes.
It's not bad, but you might consider taking 5 in Ranger ASAP and then taking Assassin, since the extra attack always provides extra utility.

>>51147901

In previous editions of D&D, DM was god and knew everything because the rules were mostly written for him and there was a chart for everything. If there wasn't, it became pretty much a case of "DM may I," where players would state their intentions, try to come up with a justification/bullshit explenation, and the DM would tell them what did/didn't happen.

As the game and playerbase evolved, players started getting more savvy and capable of getting the results they wanted due to a combination of powergaming, getting very adept at DM bullshittery, and the tendency for more class mechanics to simply say, "You can be or do this thing."

A big example is magic items. Before, it was almost completely at the whim of the DM and most players didn't know what most magic items even did. Then players started figuring out what items did, which items were most useful and tried to get those from the DM. Then some charts and mechanics started suggesting that players NEEDED certain magic items at X levels. Then some class abilities/progression started giving out magic items as flat out automatic features in the same way one gets a new spell, an extra attack, or more HP.

Many DM's have felt that this has taken away their "power" and made it harder to DM because they have to accommodate the whims of the players, which can differ from what the DM wants to happen.

Could an Artificer Gunsmith create a spare Arcane Magazine using the same method as replacing a lost or destroyed one?

Can he stockpile ammo between rests or is his maximum the 40 gained from a long rest?

>>51148068
Speaking of, are there any good 5e groups that put out videos and not just audio?

For example, the official youtube series of published campaigns are exactly what I want, aside from having seen them all by now.

Every 5e series I've found is annoying / autistic or audio only.

>>51148185
If the gun is just a magical boomstick wand that doesn't need gunpowder and instead needs rechargeable Khyber shards for its blasts, it can be mechanically the same.

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>>51148227
it's pretty good i think

not AMAZING HOLY SHIT WHAT THE FUCK but if done well, the scene where they realize they're against a fuckton of starved ghouls should be at least memorable.

> two stop signs as well
> mfw

>>51148297
Do these khyber shards bleed and adopt a crimson coloration if I'm Evil?

>>51148227
Sounds nifty. Fun way of switching up the action. Either implement fairly quick when the kobolds are encountered so everybody is fresh enough for a big three way battle or let the party get roughed up and nearly finish off the kobolds and have it happen while kobold reinforcements can start arriving

>>51148246
>>I would think Eberron would ship with its own archetype. The UA artificer is for everything else.

It will, but I'm concerned about how people who "don't get" Eberron are already so eager to toss steampunk elements in are going to just use gunsmiths without a second thought. Or that the art may come to reflect it- as many artists don't actually have much experience with the fluff.

I cite, for example, the image of Lhesh Harruc in the Eberron Campaign Setting book that depicts him as an Orc when he's actually a Hobgoblin (but D&D Orcs look closer to generic fantasy goblins).

>>51148285
>Could an Artificer Gunsmith create a spare Arcane Magazine using the same method as replacing a lost or destroyed one?
RAW no, they have to lose it first

>Can he stockpile ammo between rests or is his maximum the 40 gained from a long rest?
By my reading of it RAW, there is no upper limit to how much ammunition you can carry, apart from weight limits. (10 bullets weighs 1 lb.)

>>51148339
I don't get the reference.

Khyber shards are blue and seemingly smoky inside.

Post an image of what you picture the thunder cannon looking like.

>>51148344
>it's been almost a decade since the last Eberron book
>nobody even remembers anymore
>so many new players have never played anything but Forgotten Realms
>every other setting is going to be reduced to the nearest cliche (Eberron --> Steampunk)

This is the future you chose

>>51148377
Star Wars.

>>51148199
It would be bad design to have both attack rolls and damage upgrade at the same levels, though. But I agree that eventual d12 wouldn't be OP.

>>51148227
Kobolds aren't well known for self-sacrificial behavior, is my main concern.

>>51148344
I wish I would "get" Eberron but it seems it's a bit hard to summarize and I can't get into it enough to read the setting book. Maybe because I don't really like how it's written to be honest.

But to me it's quite close to Torchlight's universe. Am I wrong ?

>>51148341
I'm probably gonna fire it off as soon as the first round completes just so it feels like a passing landshark just aimed at noise and charged, got distracted and fucked off to eat something else because it smelled dwarf once it got in the room.

>>51148303
Thankfully I've already had one of those moments so this doesn't need to be a high point.

>>51148185
This Artificer class is not tied to Eberron.

>>51148435
If you assume steampunk means alternate tech run by steam, Eberron is magipunk. Find a way to create civilization with magic runnings the modern conveniences.

i.e. There's no zeppelins because they achieved flight via ships made from a very light wood surrounded by a ring that has an air elemental fused into it to make the whole thing fly.

>>51148432
>Kobolds aren't well known for self-sacrificial behavior, is my main concern.
According to Volo they are, which is kind of odd given their traditionally lawful evil alignment. Given their loyalty at least to their clan you'd think they'd be lawful neutral.

>>51148398
Anything from a "Steampunk lightning gun" Google search

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If you guys had to choose, would you rather the DM...

>made the adventure long and engaging on the way to the boss but had the boss' lair be rather straightforward

>made the adventure on the way straightforward and quick but had the boss' lair be long and engaging

>>51148432
I mean they don't intend to die there. Staggered retreats to different holding points have been pretty standard for them so far, it gives them a chance to soften up the PCs before leading them into traps set behind them.

They're just getting desperate at this rate.

>>51147592
>New class looks kinda bland with 1/3 casting, some spammable "spells", non-leveling pet and some situational magic items (with some notable exceptions). Yet it looks kinda cool
It's basically Cantrips: the Class.

>Alchemist Artificer
>not Gunsmith Artificer
Superior single-target damage, bigger AoE effects, and you get to run around pwning noobs with a big-ass rifle.

Combine it with all the buffs you can get from your spells and magic items, and you're basically video related:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqeMjHmL9eg

(Incidentally, riding around on your mount's probably one of the stronger methods of using it at high levels; your mount gets free Dash or Disengage actions, so you just run away and shoot your enemies until they shoot your mount out from under you - and if your GM's cool with it, you might even be able to fluff that as you riding around inside your giant robot.)

>>51148398
First thing that popped into my head while reading through it was the fuggin' thunder gun thing from cawadoody zombies. I'd much rather rinse that mental image link from my brain

>>51148435
>>51148478
There are no guns because wands of magic missile/scorching ray/etc. are everywhere and have been made usable by people with little or no magical ability.

Imagine half the population has Magic Initiate because they figured out how to teach that to kids who can afford to go to a basic school.

>>51148489
I think long engaging adventure,

by the time it was time to fight the villain I would like to be ready and honestly I would be itching to just get to him and stick something pointy in him with out too much faffing about or set backs

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>>51148432
>>51148481
Relevant passage.

.>>51148398
>Wrong picture type
Shit. Well look up the Dragon Cannon.
http://dungeondefenders.wikia.com/wiki/Dragon_Cannon?file=Dragoncannonicon.png

>>51148432
>It would be bad design to have both attack rolls and damage upgrade at the same levels
They do that at level 5 and 17 though.

>>51148478
Don't Eberron airships have jet engines made by fusing fire elementals into rings?

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>>51148398
Fuck yeah

>>51148538
>Don't Eberron airships have jet engines made by fusing fire elementals into rings?

Both types exist actually. I remember the book about making them that said either air or fire worked.

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>>51148398
I'd say either something like >>51148538 or those rockets from Mulan, and/or something a little subtler like the guns from Princess Mononoke.

>>51148010
Ball bearings are good for moving heavy objects, too.

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>>51148582
>>51148549

>>51148409

I know. I mean, it pretty much happened as soon as Eberron came out. It was instnatnyl glommed onto as the anime/Final Fantasy/Exalted/magiteck setting.

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>>51148637
Mörkö, 1300s, Sweden

>>51148538
>Don't Eberron airships have jet engines made by fusing fire elementals into rings?

No. The Fire/air elemental is bound in a ring around the airship and lifts it up with magic. The elemental has to be coerced into powering the vessel by someone carrying the magical mark of Storm.

>>51148489
Over time, a mixture. If you're doing a one-shot, the focus being on the lair makes more sense.

Any recommendations for making a more monstrous character. Nothing as extreme as a Beholder. But something a step further than Dragonborn. Something visually unique whose powers are inherent in its form.

>>51148755
>>>3.PF

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>>51148755
Please leave

>>51148739
Not that weird. It *is* a circle. Just use the half the square rule if you need to know if any squares on the edge are affected.

>>51148755
Refluff existing race like how DMG recommend.

>>51148803
So Alchemist ability would get 5 square. Since all the diagonal edge doesn't cover half square?

>>51146172
about 5 hours once every 4-6 months, with lots of empty talk of how we should play more often.

fucking kill me

>>51148857
Why aren't you finding a secondary group?

>>51146172
About 5 hours once a month.

I'd prefer 2-3 hours or 8 hours, but we have one player who's perpetually one hour late and work schedules prevent the latter.

>>51148377
>Kyber crystals were inherently attuned to the light side of the Force, and would attempt to resist any effort by dark side practitioners to utilize them in lightsabers. To this end, the only way a Sith, or other darksider could make use of a kyber crystal was to use the Force to dominate the crystal, bending it to their will. This process would cause the crystal to "bleed", as if it were a living organism, resulting in the distinctive crimson-bladed lightsabers synonymous with the Sith.
God bless the new canon!, Disney can do no wrong!

>>51148916
I read about Khyber shards, along with Eberron shards and Siberys shards, in the ECS a long time before I ever heard about this shit in Star Wars.

>>51148875
I shouldn't complain because it's my fault really.

I'm just really picky about who I play with nowadays. I could probably find a group at my FLGS, but I would rather play with my friends.

>>51148943
Nobody was implying SW came up with the name first, anon, it was just a harmless joke

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>>51148398

>>51149063
>Be alchemist
>throw thunderstones at your feet for rocketjumps

If only thundercannons could do this.

>>51146172
The weekly game I DM for lasts about 4 to 4 and a half hours.

The other game I sometimes DM for and sometimes play a PC in lasts about 3 and a half hours. It meets about every a 2 weeks. It would go longer if any of these people could ever do stuff earlier than 7 PM on a weeknight.

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>>51149082
Our 6~ hour sessions usually go from 1am-7am on Fridays.

Everyone in our group besides me and one other works shitty jobs with shitty hours, so that time on a Friday is all we have.

>>51148842
Maybe you can get 6 squares if you put it in the middle of a line between two squares. I don't know. get a 1" grid and a 1"radius circle and play around with it.

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>>51149063
>>51149079
This isn't the first time PR fucks with the props from Sentai

>>51148762
>>51148797
Why you guys gotta be dicks about it?
Are the desires you have for what kinds of characters you want to play somehow more virtuous than mine?

>>51149189
5e is just the wrong system for that. Monsters and players aren't built with the same rules.

>>51148755
Warlock, go full flesh crafter. Polymorphs, pact weapon as some sort of bone sword.

Here's what I want from a gunslinger class/subclass:

>Fancy Ability Name: when you make an attack roll with a firearm, rolling a natural 1 doesn't cause that firearm to explode.

Is it weird that I can't really picture an Artificer, especially the Alchemist, wearing armor?

>>51148755
There are plenty of monstrous options in volos. Ignore the retards. 5e was made to be open to modification.

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>>51148398

>>51149217
I dont want to play with the stats from a monster from MM or VGM.

I should have been more clear in what i asked. I thought it was clear that I was building a character normally, with race and class and background, but making it like...Frankenstein's Monster or Quasimodo.
>Any recommendations for making a more monstrous character.

I will explain further.

Which class would be best suited for making a more monstrous character whose abilities are inherent in their form, and said form is visually unique?

Also, any recommendations for interesting backstories for something like this, aside from Frankenstein's Monster and/or Quasimodo.
Also trying to avoid "Last of his Kind"

I like the idea of him being infected with a parasite and it is changing him. Like a Slaad Tadpole mutated inside of him and started merging with him. Because then it isn't "Last of his kind" or "Wizard did it"

Probably have to make his background Charlatan, Hermit, or Outlander for obvious reasons.

Suggestions?

I was thinking of maybe atleast 2 levels in Barbarian for "Monster Strength!" and "Monster Instincts"

>>51147697
The barbarian can also use a shield, has resistance to some or most damage, and has 2 more HP per level and per hit die

Any good 5e podcasts that aren't super sjw or SFW or anything?

>>51149387
The only class of any kind with innate powers is the sorcerer. So make your special snowflake some kind of chaos mutant or dragonkin, or else you may have to just make a normal character with a personality who is no more special than the deeds he performs in life

>>51149079
Well, you could always infuse your Thundercannon with Jump and say that's what you're doing. Still not quite accurate with what the spell does, but I'm the DM and I can do what I want; you're going to gun-jump and you're going to like it

>>51149431
haha nigga what

>>51149387
Shadow Monk then.

Moves unnaturally fast, teleporting in darkness. Can walk up walls and along them. The extra damage can be fluffed as extra limbs or unnatural claws, etc. You're basically a horror movie antagonist.

>>51149387
>a more monstrous character whose abilities are inherent in their form, and said form is visually unique
Draconic sorcerer. Your fucking grow scales that make your skin tougher.

>>51149483
Movie horror antagonists are unkillable, monk is fairly easy to kill compared to other martial classes, unless you reach high levels

>athlete feat
>monster walks up to you
>throw thunderstone at the ground, fail save on purpose
>launched back 10ft and prone, enemy gets no opportunity attack and must save or get knocked 10ft away from you and prone
>only costs you 5ft movement to stand up again

Of course you could just get mobile, but nah.

>>51149537
Mobile requires you to attack enemies. An alchemist can throw things from prone with no penalty.

>>51149537
As far as panic buttons go, that's a pretty fun way about it.

>>51149537
I want it be able to deal some thunder damage, but I'm afraid they'll make it have to deal damage and lose all these fun hijinks.