Oldhammer/Rogue Trader

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First for Johnny

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>>50881582
>Inquisitor

Weirdly that game was hugely profitable, probably because there wasn't actually much behind it in terms of production due to the small range of entirely metal miniatures that people would buy without even playing the game. GW sold a bajillion of that space marine figure at the very least.

It very much was a clusterfuck, a last-gasp off trying to recapture the intended playstyle of Rogue Trader but in a very messy way with so many bad choices, and unfortunately by that point the new-style audience of competitive-play no-GMs had really set in so people were trying to play it like a skirmish wargame not an RPG battle. The lack of campaign rules was a massive, massive misstep especially given the success of Necromunda/Blood Bowl/Mordheim campaign play.

>>50883391
>dose sweet Norse Dwarves

So good... and not a horned helmet in sight.

Reposting the WD archive for the new thread

https://www.mediafire.com/folder/tx4hcy4u487pv/WD

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>>50883727
Thanks, was just about to do the same.

It's weird looking back at White Dwarf during the 3rd edition warhammer era and noting just how few articles there are for it. Tons for the RPG, hell even tons for Dark Future which hardly anyone remembers, but very few for the wargame.

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Gotta giggle at the comment about the points system given they'd later adopt the method happily insulted here.

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>>50883345
fresh picture of my own

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Mission cards were actually a great idea. Shame everything went to just roll for a default scenario. Could get some interesting combinations going on with the cards. Not exactly balanced but then fuck it was 2nd edition and that was a shitshow of everyone and their dog being overpowered if they chose to be.

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Some interesting commentary on tactics in Rogue Trader here. Really illustrates how much of a different game it was.

>>50883731
Is that Genestealer Magus the one that was never released?

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>>50886749
Pretty sure that one was released, he's in the catalogue.

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>>50883731
Those colours are great. there is a shocking lack of checkers and hazard stripes in modern 40k paintjobs.

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>>50886819
Agreed.

>>50886819
>a shocking lack of checkers
The marines stopped listening to ska.

>>50886819
The dappled grey on the titans is one of my favorite "classic" effects on older models. That's something you hardly ever see anymore.

Amazing how much the game has changed over time.

>>50888877
....and yet, according to official 'canon', the actual Imperium of Man hasn't changed, like, at all..........thanks HH and your shitty writers!

>>50886819

Checkers are some of the hardest patterns to paint. Hazard stripes are more the realm of the Iron Warriors, now. Although Orks do have some checkering still, and AdMech has brought back some of the hazard stripes on their wiring. Seems like old 40k aesthetic is steadily creeping back in.

>>50889407

I like the description of warp travel. Really gets across how fucking weird the warp is. You're essentially taking a soap-bubble of realspace around you into the realm of nightmares, and then punching that bubble back into reality someplace else.

>>50890292

To me if such things have been absent it's because the painters at GW personally didn't feel like they fit or that they lend themselves better to certain factions. Knights, Titans, Orks, and Harlequins come to mind as the factions that use checkers. Could possibly get them working on Guard too if the models were different.

>>50890496

Hazard stripes seem more like a guard thing. Plenty of old schemes had their chainswords decorated in hazard stripes, as did a lot of the edge areas of their vehicles.

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https://warhammerworld.games-workshop.com/2016/12/27/from-the-archives-warhammer-40000-rogue-trader/

WEW LADS

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>>50895655
> available for the first time

Are some of these old minies worth anything? I have some old plague marines still in the sprews.... they look like shit

infact all my shit is terrifyingly old and ugly.

>>50895689
Kek!

>>50890292
>Checkers are some of the hardest patterns to paint.
Like piss they are. Checker patterns are one of the first things I ever painted when I started. You could paint them just by clenching the brush between their asscheeks.

>>50888950

Yeah, I pretty much always think of the 30k era as the mohawk, heavy metal 80s version of 40k. It's nice that Forge World pay tribute to it occasionally but I like the idea of the early days having that wild Mad Max feel. To me, the gothic feel should only really be a thing when the Emperor becomes a religious icon.

>>50895655
>Not being britbong
>No ad-ons

Well lads, sing along:

Fifteen men on a dead man's chest...

>>50895655
Made to Order RTB01 when?

Actually looking at the price of GWs plastic kits these days, maybe not.

>>50896434
Daily reminder it will be "special", "collectors" etc. So think even more.

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>>50895655
>not picking up an original for about £20~ on ebay

Call me when they reprint both books of Realms of Chaos. If they even have the balls to.

>>50895743
Yes, depending on what it is.
And more if you strip the paint off.

>>50897063
There was that Index Apocrypha thing that was some parts of RoC combined with old WD articles and stuff.

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>>50897063
They are doing their best to remove Slaneesh.

They will never ever reprint RoC.

>>50896434
Uhh...is that stuff worth anything? Because I have a few...

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>>50897278

>>50897317
Built and part painted, unfortunately. I should dig them out.

>>50897133
why are they removing Slaanesh?

>>50897582
The god of tits and wine isn't family friendly.

>>50897582
>>50897592
So. If they remove slaanesh, what does that do to the d/eldar? As the lore and flavor of the space elves is almost solely defined by their reaction to the threat of slaanesh. If we remove slaanesh... then what?

>>50883345
Why is he called Johnny?

>>50897640
Maybe they'll kill Slaanesh and the emperor's children / d.eldar in some big update?

>>50897694
that's the thing. Killing slaanesh wouldn't hurt the dark eldar, it'd make them stronger because they wouldn't have to avoid realspace.

>>50897796
Well maybe the D Eldar wouldn't be killed off and removed. But Slaanesh could still be killed.

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I love these occasional threads. I have something of a soft spot for a lot of the old plastics particularly, easier to obtain for cheap I guess. Been hacking a lot off their integral bases and modernising them a bit, for use in Heroquest and eventually skrimish games like Song of Blades and Heroes.

I don't particularly go looking for stuff, but when you see someone selling 50 miniatures even of dubious quality for £10, you end up with several potential warbands.

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>>50898094

I've been promising myself to go to Bring Out Your Lead, the main Oldhammer event hosted by Bryan Ansell's Foundry Miniatures in their stately home not far from Nottingham. Just need to paint a few more dudes to show off. I have some lead, but mostly more "Middlehammer" stuff than pre-slotta.

I would buy more old-school single miniatures from places like Ral Partha and Foundry if it wasn't like £3+£2 postage minimum.

>>50897582
It was a lot safer to link lgbt and orgies to demonic influence in the 80's

>>50897592
> THERE IS ONLY WAR
> BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD
> EXTERMINATUS AND GENOCIDE FUCK YEAH
> Whoah hold on is that a boob back the fuck up I'm not putting up with this

Every time.

>>50898274
'murca.txt

>>50898274
Don't worry. The Imperium and the Chaos are going to be bunch of nice guys soon as well. They are changing setting as a whole to be less and less "offensive". The religious and totalitarian themes are soon to be [REDACTED] as well.

If they keep to mutilate the setting, I hope it at least slips out of their hands (as Fantasy did).

>>50895689
>>50895748
it's hardback

original's a soft cover, ain't it?

http://realmofchaos80s.blogs
pot.co.uk/2013/02/the-mighty-avenger-interview-with-bryan.html

Nice article about early Citadel and GW


>>50898230
>>50898274
>>50898396

Why are yanks obsessed with soppy bollocks PC identity politics? Cut it out knobheads.

>>50898416
My copy is, but GW were definitely producing hardback books around that time too so maybe it also had a hardback version.

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>>50898416
My copy is hardback.

>>50898416
It was in hardback too as I've seen one, but paperbacks are much more common

>>50898626
>>50898649
>>50898579
Oh, interesting. My memory is worse than I thought.

>>50898439
This is not a Yanks only thing, its a mainstream media thing and that is universal.

They want to sell to kids, they need to pretend to moms and dads that the hobby is wholesome.

As a species we think shooting hordes of bad guys is a-ok but show some tits and suddenly Tarquin must be protected.

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>>50898784
>As a species

I think you're mistaking the anglosphere for everyone.

They're not removing slaneesh, thats just paranoia. Watch, first was Khorne, now Tzeench is getting a big push atm, I'll bet you both nurgle and slaneesh will get one too.

Relax.

>>50899246
>Denial: The Post.

Call ye bullshit.

They totally not have done it in AoS?

In 40k it will need more bullshit-tier asspulls, but they will get to it. Ascended Belakor/Abbadon? Some new god resulting from psychic explosion? One of C'tan? Fucking Hive-Mind ascended?

Does not fucking matter who they get to it, it still will be shit. Internal consistency will sooner or later be given up in order to carter momies and papas who lay out the cash on their sonnies first 3000k army.

>>50899372
I, for one, welcome the coming of the Horned Rat into 40k.

(Space skaven when?)

>>50899450
Mantic make those already, so never.

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>>50898784

Its supposed to be the God of excess, not the god of sex and drugs. I never understood why neckbeards have such a hard time accepting this...

>>50899531
When the company markets it based on sex and drugs and most of the adventures relate to hedonism...

I know its excess and perfection but GW do like a nice bit of S&M or a tit monster or to go on about how seductive the daemons are...

>>50899611

I think GW did it wrong releasing the titty-models of last ed daemonettes to be frank. This is the one thing neckbeards will remember to the grave about Slanesh. And when the recent ed daemonettes was released, they where met with grave critique, despite being more close of a model to the original concept than the daeomon loli´s.

So yes, you are right, GW fucked up with that release, as it put focus on the sex part. And we as a community fucked up big time, because thats the only part we still want Slanesh to be about it seems.

>>50899698
I partialy agree, but Slaneesh and his idea of excess have always carried certain focus on decadence and sexual or semi-sexual, sadistic pleasure, especially when one removes ROCK'N'ROLL aspect that GW deemed not serious eunough.

There were aspects of big S. they could have focused on instead, like want of glory and fame.

They are too shit writers to do this tho.

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>>50889396

>puffy shirt marines

I don't know if I love this or not...

>>50898274
this

>god of witchcraft and backstabbery
>disembodied eyes everywhere
>bueno

>god of murdering people for no reason
>followers are covered in blood, skulls, dead infants
>nbd

>god of disease
>followers are basically walking pustules and it's hard to even look at the models (especially when they are done well)
>still fine

>god of excesses
>a single tit
>WHAT THE FUCK GW PLS REMOV REMOV REEEE

>>50900361
"it's not a tit, it's a pustule"

>>50900430
Oh. Well then. Carry on.

>>50883731
>terminator marine with pokemon banner standing in a beehive

love it

>>50883816
it's disingenuous to dismiss the intervening 30 years of development and changes to audience playstyles

you have made detective somerset disappointed

>>50900987
Given they started adopting the other method within something like 5 years of that statement, well, no.

>>50897582
they're not

>>50897133
lots of RoC stuff was in the new Index Chaotica: Apocrypha, which you can still get as an ebook

various eras of Daemonette were made available as part of made to order just this month

etc

etc

>>50897063
they're no longer running either of the systems that RoC applied to, in fact, they're 5 or 6 editions later for 40k and fuck, like 12 and a whole new deal for WHFB/AoS

fuck you, casual, go jerk it at the library if you're gonna fetishize out of print shit

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I recently bought pic related, would it be a good idea to buy Index Chaotica?

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>>50901043

>>50901063
Thinking of buying it anon, is it worth a twenty or should I wait for the softback copy?

>>50901056
They are neutering the franchise. Deal with it. They already removed Slaneesh from one of the settings.

As for RoC:
No one really cares for early 90's 40k, WH and WHFRP rules. But the vision of Chaos was pretty interesting and intense. Some most iconic artwork are there, for example Miller's Chaos Wastes.

>>50901063
What's in those books? Artwork? Old articles? Trivia?

>>50901352
Here's a video where a guy gives the book a runthrough

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cOtm7noYEJ0

What is the AoS justification for the lack of Slaneesh anyway?

>>50901389
Something about being full and sleepy and then shanked by the Horned Rat.

>>50901389
Got owned by the Aelfs while in a chocolate daze from eating too many souls, replaced by the Great Horned Rat.

>>50901408
>Lord of Excess in a stupor from excess
>vulnerable at such a time
Who wrote this trash?

>>50902038
Age of Shitmar in a nutshell

>>50899531

Excess and hedonism being linked with sex is as old as language

>>50898176
This image hurts my humanity.

>>50902344
What's wrong with it? I guess I genuinely don't see the problem.

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>>50902407
Maybe he's never seen wargamers having fun before?

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>>50902407
People should strive to not appear as the negative, derogatory stereotypes that are branded on them.

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>>50902765
They look like normal people, what is that even supposed to mean?

>>50902765
Meh, apart from one ponytail, they are a usual bunch of middle-aged men that wouldn't stand out in any bar or bus.

Considering they are British they should have high percentage of morbidly obese, so they look better than their country's average.

It's interesting how you will look when you reach their age.

>>50902968
>better than their country's average
Nope

>>50903093
There's literally no-one in that image who'd look out of place on any street in the UK. Normal people doing nerd things.

>>50883290

Where could one get RT minis without resorting to Ebay? Like... is there ANYWHERE I can get a box of ye olde marines or squats or generic adventurers?

>>50903299
Maybe if you get very, very lucky in a flea market?

>>50903299
Second hand or third parties who make not!RT stuff.

Reliable resellers are basically non-existent.

>>50889402
Does that nid warrior have a raging hardon?

And a second raging hardon with a stinger on the end?

>>50903606

Yes and yes.

>>50903582
>>50903427

I wish I were that lucky haha. Will have to keep an eye out.

>>50902765

Look pretty normal to me for British wargamers

>>50902765
>be defined by what others think of you

Nah.

>>50903299
the oldhammer facebook group is good, founded specifically to avoid crazy ebay prices.

>>50903888
One of the chinamen might have something but I really don't know.

>>50903955

Yeah, I'd recommend the Oldhammer Trading Company page, Wargaming Trading and also the Middlehammer discussion page, I've got the odd bargain on there for 2nd ed 40k and like 4-5th Fantasy.

I think the biggest page is called something like Wargaming- swap and sell

>>50904023
>>50903955

Hell yeah, just joined.

>>50903977

Idk how the chinaman stuff works, never tried it at least. Last I heard the site recieved a cease and desist from GW?

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>>50904280
> That top-leftmost one

>>50904280
>>50904361

literally no difference

>>50903950
>allowing strangers to affirm what they already think of you by matching often exaggerated stereotypes

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>>50904280
There's a part 2 of that

>>50904626
> giving a shit what strangers think of you

Yes I am aware of the irony in this statement.

>>50904626
Once again, who gives a shit?

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>>50904635
Neat, thanks.

>ratskins
>mfw

>>50904676
Every friend you make was a stranger once.

>>50883290

Anyone got any pics of any RT-era Rogue Traders? I'd like to convert one for my Inquisimunda warband and I honestly don't like the look of the Big Mclargehuge pirates in their giant regal coats.

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I have so much old OOP 40k shit.

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>>50904967
Going way back.

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>>50904835

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More Fantasy pls.

>>50905001
I used to wonder who would be stupid enough to put one in their mouth and chew. Its sharp and pointy.

Then I remembered how much filing was needed on the integral bases (and mold lines), and the bag of doritos on my hobby desk.

I have over 300 of those old models from various companies.

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>>50905341

>>50905341
>all shall be consumed by Chaos and the final darkness will descend, never to leave
God dammit if there's one thing I wish it's that the major fantasy wargame of the world would have been less grimderp

>>50905447
But it was foretelling Age of Shitmar ;^}

>>50905391
Lead has a slightly sweet taste; there's a reason children used to eat chips of paint from the walls.

>>50906218
Probably couldn't taste the lead dust over the doritos. There wasn't a lot on my hands as I brushed them off on my jeans, but I was definitely upping my intake. I should probably see someone about it.

I just feel some shame that I am the sort of person warning labels are re-written for.

>>50886749
He was released, I have him. Came with a mini-Genestealer familiar as well.

>>50906275
Just make sure you have a lot iron in your diet. Lead is bad because the body can't get rid of it very well on its own, but eating iron-rich foods helps since the body -can- get rid of iron and the lead bonds to it, getting rid of it as well.

>>50906569
So, there would be no need for Failcast if people were eating more fish?

Ah, schnucks.

As a person who always kept all iritating precautions when working with lead, I still prefer metal over resin.

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>>50905242
>badge of rogue trader kresallius

Boys' got some 'splainin to do.

>>50898945
I get a serious Uzumaki vibe from this image. It's giving me the creeps and I wish modern 40k had this kind of stuff.

>>50905242

Yooo, hella. Any more?

>>50906897
I don't think the existence of the 'Nids was known at that time.

>>50907160
I don't think so, either, but it's an amusing coincidence. I could see BL releasing a story inspired by it, ala FW releasing updated versions of oldhammer minis. I'd def read about a RT house corrupted by a genestealer cult, spreading infection wherever they go.

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>>50902576

>>50907234

Same.

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Not exactly Rouge Trader but its from the same time

>>50904280
>>50904635
>Instead we get a thousand types of marines in different coloured armour


Fucks sake

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>>50909047

Because they sold. If the different variations of Guard sold well then there would either be plastic versions of more than just Cadians and Catachans or the various metal models would still be available in one form or another. It probably doesn't help that given how the Guard supposedly has varying types of kit, there is nothing stopping someone from buying third party models and just giving them the proper equipment.

>>50909087
You do realize that he almost certainly already knows this, right? What he's lamenting is most likely how commercial pressures made the game/setting aggressively less compelling as a whole and left us with a husk of what it could in purely artistic terms have been.

I mean, not to sound all /leftypol/ and shit, but this is a classic problem of creativity in the capitalist system. Art (I guess this is where I prove I'm not leftypol) invariably comes out higher quality but in much lower quantity in an aristocratic/tyrant system.

...Or maybe he just wishes that GW's strategy had been to position muhreens as an elite troop choice in an IG army instead of their own faction, so that people who liked space marines would have played IG and thus wanted/been able to support variety in the IG troop figures.

>>50909087
Half the old metals are still available on the website.

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>>50909548

Indeed. There is a certain irony, a few of the old sculpts were plucked out of the drawings of the large art department headed by Blanche.

These days, temps have to insert the models exactly as they are into the art, they couldn't give a Bloodthirster a different axe to the one on the sprue even.

>>50909631
It's a shame, art should inspire model design, not the other way around.

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>>50910403
Just bought bunch of old miniatures for my RT/Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay/Mordheim/Necromunda.

They will arrive in few days. Of course, as standard for the models from that era (at least ones in resonable prices) they are rapepainted.

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>>50910708

If you're in the UK I found a very good paint stripper that a couple of people on the forums have been raving about.

Wilko's own, thick gloopy stuff but it was very gentle on my old white plastics whilst absolutely disintegrating the various acyrlic and enamel paints used on them.

>>50910797

Any USA version of that?

>>50910708

What'd ya get?

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>>50910797
>there was a time when it made economic sense to sell six-faction-split box sets
>you were not alive during this time

>>50911103
Technically five cuz, y'know, Orcs & Goblins.

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>>50910972
Simple Green is a commonly recommended stripper for miniatures.

>>50910797
wilko paint stripper, or wilko something incredibly odd?

Dettol works great, and that's not a paint stripper at all.

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>>50911209

Wilko All Purpose Paint and Varnish Stripper, £3 for 500ml. Just don't breathe it in too much.

I've tried a few different ones myself and after a couple of test runs with various old models I'm very pleased. I'm quite conservative, I'd never use anything that eats plastic/lead if you leave it a week or whatever.

Dettol I found was a very good stripper, but the stench I can't bear. Straight Isopropyl alcohol, the ingredient in Dettol that makes it strip paint mostly, has similar results for a lot less effort. However with these you have to be careful, as you probably know you can't touch the models with water or it makes the remaining paint turn into an immovable sludge.

>>50911343

Another thing to is that I seem to do a lot less scrubbing, with Dettol and other stuff I've tried like Fairy Power Spray, I did a lot more scrubbing and getting bits out with a toothpick before leaving them for another night.

>>50911113
Well that instantly makes much more sense then!

Seriously, how DID they justify this? Were they mostly selling to D&D players and such at the time?

>>50910972
Basically it's bunch of assorted stuff. Most is 2nd WH40k/3rd and 4th Warhammer.

Some I don't even recognise (neither the seller did).

Will post photos when they arrive.

>>50911575

One of their first steps into plastic injection moulding. Probably a lot cheaper than running 5/6 individual molds and gauging interest that way.

>>50883290
I really think that the Squats returning one day is actually going to be real.

They brought back the Harlequins as a faction (they were this back in 3rd ED), the brought back Genestealer Cults as a faction (there were still rules before 5th ED waltzed in), 6th ED retconned Squats back into the list of still existing abhumans (and they aren't on the extinct or endangered list).

Yet if they are going to do so, then probably not as a faction in their own rights. Not to mention that there are still Demiurgs around...

>>50897682
You need to watch Ed, Edd 'n' Eddy.

>>50889390
>That Harlequin with a Lightning Claw

Bueno.

>>50897640
>>50897694
>>50897796
>>50897904
Impossible.

Ynnead is dead. Courtesy to the fatal writing that is Death Masque.

>>50907160
>I don't think the existence of the 'Nids was known at that time.

They were a thing, but they were just Termagants and Zoats. Genestealers were a separate thing entirely from the hive fleets.

Playing Heroquest tonight, wish me luck.

Last time was an absolute shitshow with a Barbarian and Wizard barely clearing the tutorial.

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My Valhallans.

I've sold off nearly everything but I cannot bring myself to scrap these guys. One day I'd like to repaint them full ice world, maybe when I dig them out in my retirement days.

>>50913193
These are fucking good, Anon. I love the figure with the chain-shaska in the lower right corner.

>>50913997
That's a standard GW mini, I have one too.

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>>50911675
They even made a model of him, here in the upper right.

I miss it when Space Marine chapters were elites who worked in squads closely with the guard and also were given to Rogue Traders.

>>50914477
Ditto. I also miss their original description, the whole "if not a disciplined killer, at least a controlled one" bit. Hive ganger marines are the best.

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>>50913997
Thanks man

>>50914009
>That's a standard GW mini, I have one too.

Aye, this ones a bit more curved though

>>50914535

Yes. That so much lol. I dunno what it is and why I like original marines rather than the hyper-zealous religious templar marines of modern times.

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I painted this recently. Do you guys like it?

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>>50915921

Do people still play rogue trader? How would I be able to get into it?

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>>50914477
>and also were given to Rogue Traders

>>50899531
>God of excess

Gluttony, lust and unrestrained indulgence.

Basically the god of Fluffyponies.

>>50905391
Kids are extremely stupid.

>>50915254
damn, that looks good enough to let ogryns kill things for once

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I lost.
I fucking love old Geedubs.

>>50917041
I dun gedit

>>50916542

Nice. Never heard of them before.

>>50916445
I feel like the hardest part would be finding people to play with.

And most people want competitive tournies over fun.

>>50917191
Tall hats, low corridor.

>>50915921
>>50915932
That visor's amazing.

>>50917240
>I feel like the hardest part would be finding people to play with.
Agree. If you had the people, getting into Rogue Trader should be unusually simple since the scale is potentially so low, IIRC the game thinks a perfectly reasonable force for a game is "a tank and a squad of regular Guardsmen" or "one squad of Marines".

>>50917320
I have some friends that are willing to play it. Thing is I don't know how easy the rules will be to learn.

>>50917438
Find a pdf of the rules and give them a read?

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>>50917320

That is literally perfect.

God what happened lmao. Apoc looks cool I guess and it captures what all the artwork shows but holy shit please no.

>>50917460
Modern 40k and Apoc is to big for the table, theres no tactics anymore.

If you want to recreate the artwork you need to go full Epic, at least then you have actual tactics and choices kicking in.

>>50917460
>God what happened lmao.
GW realized that more figures per player meant that each player would have to buy more figures, but didn't realize that it also meant fewer players as they raised the barrier to entry. That's pretty much it.

(I think a lot of the fans at the time also wanted rules that would play more smoothly with larger forces as they started to collect large amounts of figures despite not strictly needing them to play. Personally though I think it would have been much smarter to keep the small-scale game alive as the base game/entry point and provided a supplement for larger armies, instead of just doing 2e 40k. Still hindsight is uh... easier when you don't have a shot at making a million 1990 pounds by doing the "wrong" thing.)

>>50917320

So, modern Kill Team is what RT used to be? But with better aesthetics?

>>50917438
It doesn't seem TOO difficult, I found a book on scribd

https://www.scribd.com/doc/98081091/Warhammer-40K-Rogue-Trader-Rulebook

>>50917841

I meant to say that RT had the better aesthetics lol.

>>50917642
Agreed. Keep it small scale, have an entire other game based on enormous fukchuge battles

>>50917266
Hehe

>>50897063
>intermingling their guttural battle cries with frightening philosophical truths

>>50917841
I don't really know anything about Kill Team. But Rogue Trader kinda pretends there's no upper limit to the number of figures/points you can use, it just gets unwieldy.

>>50917438
The main thing you'll have to get used to is probably the expectation of a GM, desu. Again going from memory, I believe the book says the unit points system is just a sort of hack for if you don't have a GM on hand to make a properly sensible scenario.

>>50917438
Maybe the best way would be to find two friends to play a game and GM it for them.

The RT book itself even says the best way to play is with a GM.

>>50918574
kek

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Reminder that originally Leman Russ was just a normal marine commander.

>>50918846
...That's magical. Source?

>>50919016
Rogue Trader, p98

>>50919061
10/10

>reading the RT book
>lore chapter says the Emperor is alive even though his body is a carcass and pretty much states he actively rules the Imperium even though his body is a corpse
>maintains strict control over the development of humanity
>chooses the Master of the Adeptus Terra personally
>generally conveys the impression of him just being basically a spacewizard, not a huge gold space marine
They really shit this game up bad pham

I miss when space marines just seemed to be specialized mercenaries in power armor.

>>50919191
Actual Marines were still religious warrior-monk types in RT, it's just power armour wasn't exclusive to them.

So the mercs you're thinking of were probably actually just mercs, rather than proper marines.

>>50919191
Yeah, there are actually pictures of the early Marine figures in the Rogue Trader rulebook that say shit like "here are some dudes in power armor". They don't even seem to identify it as "marine armor" so much as "good armor, which the marines have because they're elites".

>>50919251
Eh, the book does say that Rogue Traders routinely receive contingents of marines for their explorations. Not *exactly* mercenary work, but...

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>>50919334
You mean these dudes?

You can tell they're renegades because they don't spell it 'KIL'

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>>50919251
Also sometimes they were the space-police

>>50917438
it's more about narrative, scenario play than it is pickup games

rules are easy otherwise
just play the battle at the farm if you want a test run of the system

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>>50919421
I was thinking specifically of pic related, but yours is another good example, yeah.

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Anyone tried Rogue Stars yet?

Written by the guy who made Song of Blades and Heroes, which is a nice little fantasy skirmish ruleset. I don't know if this uses similar mechanics, he already made a post-apoc adaptation of that called Mutants and Death Ray Guns.

Seen there are mixed reviews in the Oldhammer community, maybe because if it is a SoBH game it may be somewhat simple mechanically but then use a load of special rules.

>still reading the RT book
>all these insane monsters and shit for GM control or for a player to run in one-off scenarios against another player's regulars
>space orangutans who build non-warp ships out of sweet fuck all, with rules for rebuilding shit during play
>lore bits with excuses for why orks and humans might be allies or even friends, eldar mercs and so on so you can just build your force however the fuck you want
>everything just looks colorful and fun and gives the players huge freedom
>they outright state that the point system is a poor substitute for an experienced GM's judgment
The modern game is shiiiiiiiiiit
SHIIIIIIIIIIT

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Would Laserburn be considered under the realm of 'oldhammer,' since it was done by Bryan Ansell and a few 40k/RT stuff started there?

>>50919696
>>50919667
>>50919573
>>50919463
>>50919421
>>50919334

Fucking nice. I want to run an army of mercs in power armor run by a Rogue Trader. Doing it.

>>50919158
I always figured that the Emperor of Mankind was based on King Huon from Michael Moorcock's Hawkmoon books. A lot of early GW stuff was influenced by or lifted from Moorcock, and there is a scene in one of those books that pretty much describes approaching the Golden Throne.

http://stormbringer.wikia.com/wiki/King_Huon

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>>50920231
Just compare this description of Huon with pic related from the RT book.

"In appearance, Huon resembles a deformed foetus with an enlarged head. He speaks with an artificial voice which sounds like that of a healthy young man. Huon's limbs are atrophied and useless, and therefore in order to control his Throne Globe, he uses his long, prehensile tongue, which has been described as "insect-like".

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>>50919884

Definitely. Both the fluff and crunch of RT took inspiration from it.

I think Andy Chambers called it the most unenjoyable ruleset he'd worked with when they tried to make Confrontation with it. Of course a lot of the Confrontation setting survived into Necromunda, but they used 2nd Ed 40k instead.

I'm fully on a tangent away from Laserburn now but I wish more of the Confrontation miniatures made release, they have a certain panache that the more defined, stereotypical 2000AD gangs for Necromunda lack.

>>50920265
I guess I don't really see the Emperor's insect tongue in that pic.

I do think you have a point, but the picture isn't really a strong argument for it -- the similarity comes out stronger in that (by RT lore) both of them built their thrones themselves in advance because they knew they'd need them to prolong their lives, for instance.

Y'know, a really striking characteristic of Oldhammer compared to the new stuff is that both in 3e-era Warhammer and Rogue Trader, Chaos has barely any presence at all. In Fantasy, Chaos warbands are mostly rumors and old stories about the borderlands that nobody believes in, and a few degenerate cults.

What the fuck happened? I'd assume it was muhreen-style commercial pressure only as far as I understand, Chaos has never really sold well, so...?

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>>50919810

Literally amazing

>>50920214
Inquisition w/ power armour acolytes would probably be your best bet in terms of rules.
Or Sisters.

Or Imperialis Militia from the Horus Heresy books.

>>50919810
Wait till you get to the randomly generated mission plot hooks.
They're beautiful.

>>50921199

For modern 40k? Maybe. Though I would rather play smaller stuff like RT and Inquisimunda.

Too bad I can't find players for either around CT.

>>50921052
We need way, way more RT terrain

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>>50921052

Some guy made copies of these recently. Quite like them. Can't find the Hab Unit ones I was looking for, clearly made from the end of Cola bottles, but painted bright colours with doors, windows and all sorts of details.

>>50921052
>>50921328
It's gotten to the point with me where I actively prefer the kinda shoddy Planet of Cup Noodle type terrain, not because of the looks so much (although less gothy shit is always nice) but because lower standards mean terrain pieces that people actually finish and can table reasonably quickly, so you can have more of it for your game.

And if this guy >>50921328 for example wanted to work on his terrain later there are some easy ways to upgrade it, notably the doors/windows could use some polish and detail.

>>50921426
For me its the proof that my opponent wants to have fun with little dudesmen, but still takes it seriously enough to finish the models, and try to get them to wysiwyg.

You know that kind of player; the one that cheers at any amazing outcome, irrelevant of its for or against them.

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>>50921328
>>50921426

I like the old buildings because they remind me of something out of Star Wars or some space fantasy opera.

The enormous sprawling hive cities covered in cathedral houses and towers look cool but the gothic architecture everywhere hurts after a bit.

>>50921574
What the hell is that 8-ball model in the back of that pic?

>>50921734

I think that's a robot some guards painted to look like an 8 ball.

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Found a nice report of the Battle of the Farm.

http://www.lead-adventure.de/index.php?topic=71067.msg912649#msg912649

There's even an og Crimson Fist Johnny fighting alongside Pedro Kantor.

Anyone got a pdf of the entire 3rd ed BBB? I can't find one with the army lists in it.

so let's say someone were to make a "Simulacrum" game heavily based on Rogue Trader era 40k in both aesthetics and general style of play(if not an exact copy rules or setting wise for copyright/trademark reasons), would you be interested in it, and what additions or changes would you want to see?

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>>50921734

It's a fishbowl helmet. Painting them as 8 balls was a little meme back in the day.

Either that cast, or a very similar one, is possibly available from Foundry.

When Ansell left Citadel he seemingly took some unreleased GW molds as well as the Citadel Historicals we know about.

>>50922936

>Crimson Fists dying in droves

Ayy

>>50924162
For all the fun involved, the RT rules could be cumbersome and require too much look-up to determine which bit of wargear or special rule did what.

>>50920444
I think both of those books pre-date the Realm of Chaos books, which is when Chaos really got off the ground as a faction.

>>50925996
You still kinda have to wonder how it took off to the point of taking OVER, though.

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>>50909548

>What he's lamenting is most likely how commercial pressures made the game/setting aggressively less compelling as a whole and left us with a husk of what it could in purely artistic terms have been.

While I did only offer the argument that the Space Marines took such prominence because they sold, I wouldn't say that is the entire reason either, at least not in the beginning. Space Marines were on the cover of Rogue Trader and had numerous insights into them. To me that says that there were those among the creatives who liked what they represented and got lucky that customers liked them too. Something Gav Thorpe said recently kind of supports this, he said that the inspiration for Space Marines partly came from the popularity of Chaos Warriors. Now I'm not as familiar with the original editions of Fantasy so I can't say if Chaos Warriors were something that became popular and were latched latched on to or if like what I said above the creatives enjoyed them and got lucky that other people liked them as well.

>>50909600

So they are. I haven't checked the IG range in sometime and thought that the first made to order deal was about making a lot of those metal models available again, not just the ones that GW has phased out over time for one reason or another.

>>50909631
>>50910403

There is reason to complain about this, but at the moment I think the blame is either wrongly laid at GW's feet or laid there for the wrong reasons. Instead of blaming GW's desire to sell you should also consider the possibility that the artists are just doing it for the money or that GW offered piss poor art direction.

Watching people commission artwork over the years has taught that while there are artists who endeavor to do their best as a point of pride, there are also those who have to be corralled if their heart isn't in the project. Even with corralling you'll still probably end up with something worse than a piece with the artist's heart in it.

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>tfw spent the whole afternoon reading grogblog battle reports of Oldhammer fans playing RT

Anyone got any Space Marine/Spacefleet pictures and stories?

>>50928857
Here's something for Space Fleet

http://teasgettingcold.blogspot.co.nz/2016/08/fleets-in-spaaace.html

>>50929368
Also

http://leadplague.blogspot.co.nz/search/label/Space%20Fleet

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Oldhammer rules, have some blogs:

http://classicastartes.blogspot.co.nz/
http://oldschoolworkshop.blogspot.co.nz/
http://mrsaturdaysmumblings.blogspot.co.nz/
http://port-imperiale.blogspot.co.nz/
http://oldhammeronabudget.blogspot.co.nz/
http://teasgettingcold.blogspot.co.nz/
http://realmofchaos80s.blogspot.co.nz/
http://oryctesmodellismo.blogspot.co.nz/
http://bluesmarauders.blogspot.co.nz/
http://talesfromfarpoint.blogspot.co.nz/
http://eldritchepistles.blogspot.co.nz/
http://warlordpauluk.blogspot.co.nz/
http://leadplague.blogspot.co.nz/
http://theworkofshaitan.blogspot.co.nz/
http://therealmofjinnai.blogspot.co.nz/
http://magpieandoldlead.blogspot.co.nz/

Got any to add to this list?

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2nd ed best ed

>>50931331

I-is that cardstock terrain?

GW pls sell cardstock terrain again

>>50932454
Cardstock terrain was the fucking best.


They should rerelease the plastic Bulkheads that held it all together.

>>50932540
I think I have all the 2nd ed starter kit terrain in a box somewhere.

I have so much oldhammer I should really sell on.

>>50931314
http://www.oldenhammer.com/

>>50932540
Surely someone must have scanned the old terrain at some point.

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>>50932782
Ask, and ye shall receive.

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>>50933197
Even more stuff.

>>50933221
And the last one I've got.

http://www50.zippyshare.com/v/ap8IadXg/file.html

>>50925825
>For all the fun involved, the RT rules could be cumbersome and require too much look-up to determine which bit of wargear or special rule did what.
so either streamline those rules or make some high quality reference cards for people to use, makes sense

>Oldhammer
>Ugliest fucking modles
>Objectively worst rules
>Fluff is as deep as a coffee cup
>Shit-tier terrain.
>Garish fucking colour schemes.

You all shoud take off those Nostalgia glasses and go play a real wargame with good lore.

Theres a reasin 40k changed and fantasy was killed.

This thread is full of crap.

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>>50933637
You can do better than this.

>>50933659
It's a reddit, methinks - look at that spacing!

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>>50933637
You forgot to hide your red shirt.

AoS general is down the hall and to the left.

>>50915921
Where'dya get the bits for the base, homie? I was looking to build up a "steampunky" base series for AoS Dorfs.

>>50933974
Not him, but it looks like those are just gears from an actual watch -- there are ebay sellers who will sell you job lots of those from garbage clockworks.

>>50921328
>>50921052

Anyone got anymore tupperwear buildings? I am gonna make some lol

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Tin cans work too.

I would advise doing like this guy, giving the pieces actual bases, made from thin plasticard imaginably, then sanded, drybrushed and flocked. Makes them better looking and strudier.

>>50921325
God I want to play Inquisitor. Hell, I want to GM that

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>>50936010
>>50935762

Plastic casings off stuff like fans and TVs (don't use any old circuitry though), Greebled up.

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>>50934817
I miss it when everything had flags. I liked the flags.

>>50935762
Just to make sure you don't fuck some shit up to no purpose, these are not actually made from Tupperware and Tuppperware doesn't make a good base material for buildings. The buildings are usually instant-ramen bowls. Those are made out of styrene plastic, very similar to and quite possibly literally the exact same substance as Plasticard.

Also Tupperware is stupidly expensive for some reason whereas even an expensive instant ramen bowl costs like £4 and contains something you can eat.

>>50936626

Hey thanks. Gonna get me some cup noodles.

>>50936010
Fab.

>>50936216
Shit, me too. Read the rules for the first time ever today, and damn. I wish I had been into this in high school instead of 40k. It's so much better and it seems more like RT was??

I like the system for speed.

>>50936317

The colors were all nicer in general

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>>50899531

Slannesh is #Pizzagate: The God

>>50917266

Holy shit I haven't gotten this joke for almost 20 years.

>>50917041

That's actually really funny.

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I really miss the atmosphere of the old photos/scenes

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>>50936317

>>50896133
2nded. For this reason my favourite 30k units are the dickbikes. They really feel like they're part of a different, less gothic, more 'golden age' setting. Wish they'd applied that feel to other models.

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There seems to be nearly no not-arbitres (so-wacky-not-Dredd) figures in production, unless any of you can point me towards something.

Shit, even Warlord removed their Dredd range, for they seem to have aquired a wider 2000AD license.

>>50940920
>Night lord renegade captain
>Khorne symbol

>Salamander captain with terminator honours
>not in terminator armour

>Urban camouflage imperial fist
>Massive fucking yellow pauldron

Wat/10

>>50883711
Were these anmes inspired by that one Philip K. Dick novel ?

>>50942062
40K back then didn't get itself serious.

>>50942062
iirc Terminator honours is like a badge or medal that means you have the right to wear Terminator armour.

>>50942062

The Terminator Honours one is pretty fair, he is qualified to wear that armour but isn't currently.

Even in 3rd edition making a Tactical Squad's Sergeant into a "Veteran Sergeant" was a sign that he might have Terminator Honours

>>50942125
>>50942146
This, it's worth remembering that before Space Hulk came out terminators only just barely existed (there were I think three models all of which look colossally weird, maybe anon can provide pics), and even after Space Hulk the lore was very vague and half implied that terminator armor was only used for space hulk clearing. (GW only really provided rules for terminator squads on the tabletop after Space Hulk became stupidly popular)

So for a long time it wasn't really nailed down what exactly terminator honours meant (and, unsurprisingly that was more fun when you could decide for yourself).

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>>50942310

I love the first Termies. You can see they clearly picked one design. Shame as I like the guy with massive pauldrons.

>>50942496
>dat turbopaldurons

It's so fucking retarded, that it springs back to awesome.

>>50942496
Hoping Saturnine Termies will be truly awesome.

Also hoping they'll give back SMs their Imperial Jetbikes.

I bet DAs actually have Jetbike STC, but they aren't telling this anyone.

>>50942125
>>50942146
>>50942310
You know?

I miss the times Terminator Honours were an upgrade for your Marines.

Now everyone who's a character can have a suit...

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>>50942496
>>50942572
Slightly better shot of the termies courtesy of the SoL scan.

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>>50942827
>Top right is just a normal marine with a terrible field of view

>Pic related is bottom termie before receiving terminator honors

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>>50904635
top row, #3

>Woad warrior of Xymox Clan

It sort of makes me smile that there was at least one Sad Old Goth working in Games Workshop at that time, to add that little in-joke to the page.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OiJ3KU0bme0

>>50943072
>It sort of makes me smile that there was at least one Sad Old Goth working in Games Workshop at that time
>Sad Old Goth
>Old
>First Xymox album came out in 1985
>Rogue Trader came out in 1987
That probably went in courtesy of an 18-year-old kid, famiglia.

>>50943618
The image is from 3rd edition Imperial Guard codex in about 1999, not Rogue Trader.

New Thread

>>50943715
>>50943715
>>50943715

>>50936626
I think those might be yoghurt pots, which are even cheaper.