Imperium Asunder

Guys, how do I wiki? I want to make a separate page to put all of the 'mortal forces of the Tempestus gap' stuff we had last thread on.

>>49749741
Making a new page shouldn't be that difficult. Start by making an account. As for headers and images, just copy stuff from other articles. Cannibalize.

>>49749755
Right, done. Sleep now.

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>>49749990

>>49749741
>>49749990
There's actually already a page for Realm Guard and mercenaries.

https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Realm_Guard_and_Mercenaries

>>49749102
It was a normal raid. Ignace led the new recruits to the storage facility, where they would get medicine and food. It would be a good way to test them, without putting them straight into combat. Ammunition and weapons were much-needed as well, but without men to wield it, a gun would be just a lump of plasteel.
This facility was scarcely guarded, barely a closet compared to the vaults of the Warmaster. It was filled with food for the citizen, medicine for the loyal. Raiding it would hamper their cause, but times were bad. And they had received word of the Eyes going to war, meaning this was their best chance to get what they needed, while the Warmaster´s servants were busy arming themselves at the Palace.
However, when they arrived, there was one of the serfs of the Eyes-a threat as bad as one of the Marines themselves should he get word of the rebel´s presence out.
They slipped past the serf, using the darkness to conceal their presence. The storage unit they first entered was filled with medicine: More than ever reached the workers. Cursing the cruelty and lies of the Warmaster, they filled four backpacks with what they needed: Bottles of antibiotics, painkillers and De-Tox. They even found a cheap bionic leg, which Ignace sent one of the recruits to haul the loot outside as they moved to the food storage.
They started to open the boxes, and found them full of canned goods. However, as Ignace took one of the cans, he realised something was wrong: It weighed almost nothing. He hastily opened it and found it empty. The others reported every can they had found to be empty as well. The serf of the Eyes of the Warmaster slammed the door shut, locking it.
Outside, the rebel recruit tripped, and a few bottles broke open, spilling the coloured water and small rocks all over. He barely had time to realise what had happened as a shotgun roared, ending his life.

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>>49750313
Grim.

Updated version of the Astra Telepathica stuff. I removed the Adeptus Custodes because, honestly, I feel like they work best as an autonomous organization.

>>49750444
Uh. So, normally the space marine chapters can use their own guys to navigate the warp. (Librarians). Navigators are used for the Imperial Navy.

Do these guys work in conjuction then with "mortal" fleets, or are you saying that the Asunder legions don't use librarians and rely on these guys too?

Or is it another case of "some use them" "some dont"?

>>49750509
Do they? I think you need navigators, even Space Marines. A navigator is not just a psyker. If librarians could do it, then they would have gotten rid of the navigator houses long ago.

>>49750529
Not really, seeing as space marine forces are a tiny portion of the imperial defence. The navy and guard do 99% of the fighting. With the space marines doing blockade runs and precision strikes.

I know some like the space wolves use navigators because they are retarded and dont think of their librarians as librarians. However others like Night Lords only use (captured) navigators if they dont have a sorcerer around to do it. Loyalists do the same thing. Navigators are used for normies mostly, not for supermen.

>>49750529
In main 40k, there are conflicting accounts of Librarians navigating. I believe Blood Ravens do it in the books, while some in the Horus Heresy do. Sorcerors definitely CAN, though it's not always (rarely, actually) pretty.

>>49750509
I'm guessing the mortal fleets use them.

Though whether Navigators are necessary for Marines is... vague, even within the main canon.

>>49749673

Who's likely to be the next Primarch we get a portrait for?

>>49750571
correct. depends on the chapter. considering the importance of self-sufficiency in this universe. I think that Void Lords, Crimson Warhawks, and Scions - would probably have their librarians do it themselves. Wanting to remain separate.

Xun who sees himself as the 2nd coming of the Emperor, probably wants to intergrate with the political aspect of using navigator houses and boosting effectiveness that way, as he does with this auxillia.

Likewise for Paladins and Angels of Light. I think actually, its something that would have been mentioned in the Codex, along with breaking up the legions into chapters.

THe recommendation to adopt external navigators through oaths and bonds. A further separation of powers.

>>49750630
We have no clue. Drawfag the Remembrancer hasn't given us an inkling.

We need a relationship chart for Faustus to put on the wiki.

>>49751308
Sure, where should we start?

>>49751308
Marcus: Go away, I'm working.
Raydon: Go away, I'm working.
Kashaln: Go away, I'm working.
Anders: Go away, I'm working.
Graha'nak: Go away, I'm working.
Gengrat: Go away, I'm working.
Aodhan: Go away, I'm working.
Engerand: Go away, I'm working.
Oramar: Go away, I'm working.
Rubinek: Go away, I'm working.
Balthasar: Go away, I'm working.
Anshul: Go away, I'm working.
Alexios: Go away, I'm working.
Xun: Go away, I'm working.
Sarco: Go away, I'm working.
Enoch: Go away, I'm working.
Saul: Go away, I'm working.
Klaus: Go away, I'm working.
The Warmaster: REEEEEEEEEEE

>>49751616
Kek. I'll be home soon, then I'll take a look.

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>>49750230
It also encompasses all the forces of the galaxy that aren't space marines. Even their specialty on the main page reads: Not being space marines.

On the subject, does anybody mind if I copypaste my regiments from here to the Hektor Heresy? I miss them.

If you do mind then I will post 40kute until you don't.

>>49751691
You're pretty much free to do whatever, as long as you adapt them to IA, instead of just throwing them in here.

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>>49751721
I wasn't going to do that. I was just going to literally copypaste them without removing references to crusader states, the Dark Imperium, the Tempestus Gap, etc.

>>49751721
Wait, who are you?

>>49751774
Uhh, Doctor Jobs?

>>49751897
It's been a while, remind me who Doctor Jobs is.

>>49751904
I think he just made the name for this after he started posting.

>>49751904
>>49751915
I'm me? I'm not sure what you're talking about? Unless you're asking which characters I contributed here or to the Hektor Heresy, which is none.

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>>49751915
And who are you?

>>49751929
I honestly don't remember who you are. How long have I not been here?

>>49751957
Fuck, I dunno. Couple of threads at this point.

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>>49751957
Not actually him. My ideas are objectively much cooler.

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>>49751977
They're both the same to me. Except the Undying Scions aren't as spooky.

I've been trying to go through the wiki, look to find a place to start reorganizing, but I just can't do it. We need to figure out how to model these pages.

>>49752159
We also need to delete the old Imperium asunder page.

>>49751616
he really hates the warmaster

>>49751308
I'm guessing he only really had time for a few of his brothers. He may have found Rubinek fascinating, and was pretty mad when he got exiled, further increasing his alienation from his brothers.

He likely had a special hate for Alexios and Enoch, as they were the Warmaster's biggest admirers prior to the Heresy. I get the impression that he'd hate Anders' naivety too, and think of Gengrat like a needy child constantly sulking over the fact that the adults wouldn't give him any real responsibility.

I don't see him working particularly well with anyone, but I can see him being tolerable with people like Saul, Raydon, pre-Exile Rubinek, and Dread Sarco. They don't mince words, they don't try to get him to play beer pong or expect him to smile, they get on with the job.

>>49752967
Was Faustus the most professional of the primarchs? I get the feeling other than his hate for the WM, he was very mission orientated at whatever the mission was. With his large numbers, he may have brought in the most worlds to the Imperium. Not through all war mind, but he could probably bring in a ton of them through offering a cure to everything and juve treatments to the rulers.

>>49752967
Do you think the Emperor would have wrangled him into helping design Sarco's life support systems?

>>49753027
I think he definitely tried to get things done quickly and efficiency.

His difficulties working with others, his stubbornness, and his spite probably made him not exactly the most professional Primarch (I'd give that to Saul)... but definitely very focused on doing whatever he's doing and doing it efficiently.

>>49753121
Oh hey, maybe. That could be cool.

In fact, it might have even made him a little bitter toward Sarco afterwards.

>"Hey son your brother needs our help, get over here."
>"I'm busy."
>"...Did you just tell the Master of Mankind that you're busy? Get out of your room and get down here right now."
>"FFFFFFFine, ugh, this is going to waste so much of my time."
>"Son, I am extremely disappoint right now. You should be more like [REDACTED]."
>"..."

Years later, Sarco still doesn't understand why Faustus keeps glaring at him during meetings.

>>49751308
I think he'd pretty much get along ok Marcus, both of them are more focussed on the sciency side of things, so they'd have a similar mindset. If they were too meet, they'd probably ask what the other's up to out of politeness, maybe show something off and then be about their way.

>>49753181
I like thinking of this continuity's Emperor as a struggling single father.

>Rubinek is a cripple, soaks up money in hospital bills, and is a spiteful little shithead on top of it
>Alexios is a bookish neeeeerd who can run about three meters before collapsing, goddamn, are we really sure the nurses were right when they said he was a boy?
>Faustus is a no-hope hikki who never comes out of his room
>Oramar is an obnoxious weeb, always watching his dang chinese cartoons
>Balthasar is a jockish bully Big E gets constant disapproving letters about
>Sarco is another money drain, has to be pushed around everywhere in that goddamn wheelchair
>Gengrat is constantly blasting that shitty industrial music everywhere, acts chuuni as fuck in public, needs pills for his hyperactive disorders, dear lord kill me now
>Grahanak grew up alone in a cabin with his mom's rotting corpse for four years before child services tracked him down. He... hasn't really integrated well into society
>Aodhan is a party Chad, constantly stoned or drunk when he's not slamming dunks, only graduating because he's banging his teacher
>Xun... Xun is what happens when you take a trip to Asia and forget to pack condoms
>Kashaln owns body wax, nuff said. Counting the days until he comes out of the closet
>Marcus is winning every science fair by dismantling every fucking thing in the house FFFUUUCCK
>Engerand has no inside voice.
>Anders has a permanent black eye because he's constantly picking fights with older kids
>Enoch... Enoch didn't inherit the tall genes
>Anshul won't stop harping on about his new age buddhist shit, no, nobody wants to try vegetarianism, not even for a while
>Saul ate a lot of batteries as a kid, now he's weirdly fixated with explosives
>Raydon is a god damn delinquent, won't go to school, probably in a gang or some shit
>Klaus literally has no ability to concentrate on anything but winning the next fencing championship
>Why can't they be more like [REDACTED]?

>>49754265
>Saul also has that weird friend. Almost as nerdy as Alexios but focuses all his attention on occultism
>He was nice, once, but now he's just obnoxious and refuses to move from my son's neighboring seat at school
>Why did Saul befriend this freak in the first place
>Why can't he choose his friends wisely, like [REDACTED]?

>>49750230
Oh, huh. Should I delete the page and move everything over?

>>49754588
Guess so.

Easy mistake to make, really. We haven't talked Realm Guard in a while, what with detailing the Heresy and such.

>>49755110
Right, change made. I decided to start a separate 'Chaos Warband' section since I didn't think the chaos warbands really fit in with the Dark Imperium realm guards since they were described as operating independently.

Now how do I delete a page? Just delete all the content?

>>49751616
>>49753181
>>49754265
I see today is a day for sillyness

>>49753027
>most professional
Ehh
Yes and no.
Yes in the sense he was mission focused
No in the sense he pretty much abandoned his legion to focus on science. So he is arguably the least professional because he literally quit his job.

>>49754265
This is fantastic.

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>>49749673
Yo.

A couple days back, one of you IA people showed up in a /tg/ heresy thread, and when we got talking about rules, he mentioned that you guys didn't really have a numberfag on the project, and there were a couple of characters he wanted me to stat and balance,.. But I don't remember what they were.

So! If anyone wants a (semi)professional numberfag to take a look at their rules, here I am (especially if you're whatshisface that talked to me the other day).

>>49750639
Yeah, I think it varies strongly. My understanding of things from Path of Heaven is that librarians can do it, but not as well as a navigator.
Similarly, given the nature of Astropathic communication, it's best to have a dedicated choir.

Xun definitely tries to keep everything integrated as you've said. I think the others, Void Lords in particular might have one or two specific houses essentially exclusive to them.

>>49751616
Seems legit.

>>49752967
Though this is probably more accurate.

>>49754265
Made me burst out laughing.

>>49755497
I'm really not sure how you delete a page, but the war bands section sounds useful.
We still haven't discussed how the Dark Imperium is organized, either.

>>49755630
Isn't every day?

>>49756960
You should just take a look at the rules at the bottom of each legion page and tell us if anything is absurd or bad.

>>49750639
Well the Codex forbids the use of librarians, so....

>>49756960
I just finished doing up a bunch of rules and stats actually. Id love some feedback

>>49757005
I'm not seeing rules at the bottom of any legion pages. At all.

>>49757062
Sure, whatcha got?

>>49757098
>I'm not seeing rules at the bottom of any legion pages. At all.
For a second I literally forgot that this wasn't the Hektor Heresy and our wiki is not as good. I need coffee.

An anon has all the rules saved, they're not posted anywhere.

>>49757120
>An anon has all the rules saved, they're not posted anywhere
This is less than useful.

Although, I wasn't even aware that those Hektor Heresy rules existed. I'll go fuck with them.

>>49757145
If you'd not mind coming back in a few days, we should have rules posted on the wiki by then.

>>49757180
Are you guys based more in the "modern" setting or the heresy?

>>49757015
Yeah so those that follow it would certainly rely on navigator houses.

Those that dont follow it rely less.

Those that actively spur it night take up positions to refuse the use of navigators.

>>49757098
Im actually stuck at work. Ill try to post at lunch. So +4hours.

If im unable, ill create a wiki page and do it tonight.

Thanks heaps. You say youre semi professional. What does that actually mean

>>49757224
Our heresy is mostly finished and we've moved on to M32-M39

>>49757241
It means that in my job I work with relative number values in an arbitrary system a lot, so those skills transfer over pretty well to working within game systems like Warhammer. It basically means I'm good at mathhammer and balancing.

Lately I've been adapting EvilExec's FAXIV system into a template to have consistently balanced primarchs (somewhat balanced, anyway. Nothing that buffs your army can ever really be balanced) because I was building primarch rules for the Hektor Heresy guys.

>>49757324
are you Josman-sempai?

The rules are still very much WIP which is why they're not posted anywhere but the threads yet.

>>49757354
Yes, I just wanted to avoid jumping into another crews thread and immediately namefagging. Seemed off, somehow.

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>>49757384
I'll post what I have saved

>>49752967
>>49753181
>>49753262
So a srs bzns kind of guy, cold, but cares deeply about humanity. I'm imagining a classic misanthrope-- hates individuals, loves the species.

I think he's got the genoccult tradition in the back of his mind, he's a hermeticist, not heavily mystical, for him the perfection of the Monad can be found in man.
He'd hate Lorgar, but we don't have a Lorgar, so I think he's pretty cold towards Oramar and his Xenotech. Anshul spends too much time gazing into the warp. Gengrat chases spirit. Marcus and a small segment of the Mechanicum is ok in that they chase the perfection of man, but really most of them are as bad as Gengrat.

Xun is ok. Not great. Too close to [Redacted], but at least he is trying, unlike Oramar and Anshul. The wird obsession with building systems is off-putting, though. You trying to find perfection or perfect tools?

I think he actually gets along surprisingly well with Graha'Nak. After you get past the furs and fangs, their philosophies are rather similar.

Klaus is alright. Not scholarly, but in terms of the applied monad, he does pretty well.

Aodhán Kashaln is a trivial fool. There's more to life than... wait... they're two different people?
So then who did I put in a dreadnought?
Oh! I thought that was the one with the hammer fetish and the fast ships.


I think he gets a new perspective on some of his brothers once the heresy breaks out.

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>>49757423
ENGERAND - Hammer of Wrath, Furious Charge, Terminator Armour (Bulky, Deep Strike, No Sweeping Advances)
> Sire of the Storm Hammers
LA: Gain Furious Charge, and units w/i 24" gain +1I and +1T during the turn they charge.
> Strumgan
Weapon: x2 Str, AP2, Strikedown, Two-Handed, Armourbane.
> Mantle of the Storm King
Enemies who charge Engerand or his unit count as having disordered charges. Provides 2+ Armour Save and 4+ Invulnerable, as well as immunity to poison and fleshbane.
> Mjuln
Weapon: Range: 24" Str: 4 AP: 4 Assault 4

BALTHASAR - Rage, Rampage, Counter Attack, Furious Charge, Battle Born
> Sire of the Bloodhounds
LA: Gain Rage and Counter-Attack rules
> Cloak of Blades
All models in base contact must take a StrX AP- Hit at the start of each assault phase. Confers 3+ Armour save and 4+ Invulnerable Save.
> Battle Born
If Balthasar destroys a unit in close combat (inc running it down), he gains FNP 5+, which increases to 4+ if he destroys 2 or more units.

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>>49757437
KLAUS - Blademaster, Dolorious Blade, Paragon of Steel, Mantle of Kings
> Sire of the Knights Exemplar
LA: All Knights Exemplar gain +1 Leadership (to maximum of 10) whilst Klaus is in play, in addition they may re-roll failed charge distances. Terminators can also be taken as troops if Klaus is the Warlord of the Knight Exemplar Primary Detachment.
> Blade Master
At the start of each combat phase choose 1: (Enemies only hit on 6's before modifications and regardless of respective WS / Gain +2 Attacks / Gain Smash and AP1)
> Dolorious Blade
Str: User AP: 2, Special: Increase invulnerable save to 3+ in close combat, Armourbane, Blind
> Mantle of Kings
2+ Armour save, 4+ Invulnerable save
> Paragon of Steel
Friendly models engaged in combats within 24" gain +1 to combat resolution and are stubborn

RAYDON - Gunfighter, Evasion, Repressed Psyker, Special Ammunitions, Havoc, Shadow Mantle
> Sire of Crimson Warhawks
LA: All fliers gain strafing run, deepstrike, and +1 Jink Save.
> Gun Fighter
Can use Havoc in close combat, gaining Concussive, Lethal Precision, and abilities conferred by special ammunitions.
> Havoc
RNG: 24" STR: 6 AP3
> Special Ammunitions
Psybolt (Ignore Invulnerable Saves), Tempest (Tesla, Haywire), Turbo-Penetrator (Sunder and AP1), Dragonfire (Fleshbane), Inferno (Ignores Cover)
> Evasive
All shooting at Raydon whilst he is not in a unit counts as being snap shot.
> Repressed Psyker
Counts as ML3 Psyker who does not generate warp tokens or psychic powers. He is permanantly under the effects of precognition and gains the Trusted Insticts Warlord Trait
> Trusted Instincts
Re-roll reserves and mysterious terrain rolls to indentify terrain by your units. In addition when tactical objectives are used you can immediately discard an active tactical objective and generate a new one.
> Shadow Mantle
3+ Armour Save, 5+ Invulnerable Save, Move through Cover, Hit and Run, Stealth and Shrouded Special Rules.

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>>49757448
AODHAN - Giants Bane, Widow Maker, FNP 6+, Heart Taker, Pearlescent Plate, Furious Charge
> Sire of the Negators
LA: within 12" gain Fearless, All LA gain FNP (5+). Increasing to FNP (4+) on the turn Aodhan destroys a vehicle or monsterous creature.
> Giant's Bane
When charging a monsterous creature or vehicle Aodhan gains +6" charge range. When fighting in close combat against a monsterous creature, or vehicle his FNP increases to 4+
> Widow Maker
STR: X AP: 1 Special: Two Handed, Widow Maker automatically wounds in close combat and unsaved wounds caused by the weapon become D3 wounds.
> Heart-Taker
RNG: 12" STR7 AP3 Assault 2.

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>>49757458
GRAHANAK - Terror incarnate, Black Fang, From the Shadows, Raiment of Shadow, Hit and Run, Anguish
> Sire of the Void Lords
LA: Whilst Grahanak is on the field enemies must take all Fear Tests on 3d6 taking the worst result. All friendly Void Lords automatically succeed Sweeping Advance checks whilst Grahanak is on the board.

> Terror Incarnate
Enemies within 12" suffer -3 Ld and must take pass a leadership test in order to charge Grahanak or his unit. If they fail they cannot take any other action that turn.

> Black Fang
RNG: 12" STR8 AP2 Assault 1. Enemies that would suffer a wound are instead moved 3d6" towards Grahanak, stopping 1" short of terrain they would encounter. If targetting a unit, the unit is allowed a free consolidation move to maintain unit cohency. If this would move the model into 1" of Grahanak they are considered to be engaged in combat however neither gains the benefits of the charge.

> From the Shadows
On the turn Grahanak deepstrikes all shooting at him is considered snap shots, in addition if not in combat and not part of a unit, Grahanak can be moved into reserves at the end of the controlling players movement phase instead of moving normally. He may then re-enter from reserves using the deepstrike rules.

> Raiment of Shadow
Terminator Armour conferring Deep Strike, Stealth, and Shrouded, as well as 4+ Invulnerable Save.

> Anguish
Str: User AP:2 Shred, Paired Weapons.

>>49757423
Why is Saul not also Pert?

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>>49757480
I think he's supposed to be a buffmander instead of a beefmander.

ALL of this is WIP, so everyone feel free to discuss/disagree with details.

>>49757458
Yeah... Let's get this on a formatted document or a wiki before my autism and OCD gang up to kill my brain.

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>>49757502
we started out by making formatted pictures but we got lazy

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>>49757498
I don't actually know the rules, but having Alpharius next to his name just seems weird, given the fact that Saul wears terminator armor.

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>>49757518
Oh, yeah, I remember that guy! He's broken as fuck!


He's massively overcosted in most scenarios, but actually becomes undercosted depending on the game size and the composition of your enemy's army. His relative intrinsic value is massively inflated if you have a large army (where his buffs affect more units for the same cost) or if your enemy's army is infantry heavy (where his demon spawning rule will mean a lot more.

Also, that demon spawning rule almost has to be taken as a sort of buildup effect rather than a 1 = 1 kill to spawn thing. Being able to create ten or twenty one model units in a single assault phase is MASSIVELY more valuable than creating a single ten or twenty model unit in that same assault phase. Maybe "After he kills ten units, he can spawn a unit of 10 bloodletters" or something. As it sits I would punch my opponent for bringing that shit to the table.

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>>49757607
>Also, that demon spawning rule almost has to be taken as a sort of buildup effect rather than a 1 = 1 kill to spawn thing. Being able to create ten or twenty one model units in a single assault phase is MASSIVELY more valuable than creating a single ten or twenty model unit in that same assault phase. Maybe "After he kills ten units, he can spawn a unit of 10 bloodletters" or something. As it sits I would punch my opponent for bringing that shit to the table.
maybe just make them obligated to merge instead of giving them an option?
Or we could just pirate KDK rules more directly lol

>>49757498
Yeah so i took what stats were suggested and found existing stat lines that were closest.

As alexios said he is a buiffer not a fighter (he uses guns over fists)

>>49757423
What do the Lorgar tier primarchs have?

>>49757433
That's the impression I get. He'd need some sort of ally though, even if he has no friends. How's his relationship with the Emperor?

They're both human supremacists, peerleas scientists, unable to properly explain themselves other others (read: lessers), yet are adored by the common man for what they do for humanity. I bet he was the Emperor's closest to heart, but Malcador's support and the fact every other Primarch listens to [REDACTED], plus Faustus barely leads his own legion mean that [REDACTED] got the Warmaster job. It would explain why the Big R didn't squash Luna himself in the censor, given how it took so much for him to destroy Horus at the height of the Heresy in front of him backed by the Chaos Gods. Add in the leeway it would give Faustus to pursue his projects on Luna instead of being on the front.

One final thing is it would help explain the censoring, given that the Warmaster is using it partially to cement his role in the eyes of others if they knew how the Big E liked Faustus more.

>still no Sarco rules
s m h t b h f a m

>>49757534
Its not about the characters or there themes. Its the closest stats from existing primarchs.

>>49758206
I know, so why would a guy wearing Terminator armor have a statline similar to a guy wearing regular power armor?

Otherwise though, yeah they'd probably be pretty similar.

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>>49758184
m a k e
t h e m
u p
y o u r s e l f
f a m p a i

>>49758233
Stats and armor don't really have anything to do with one another. You don't need high S to wear terminator armor or anything like that. In fact, a weaker guy might be more inclined to wear heavier armor.

>>49758255
Obviously, but the stats reflect him in the armor don't they?

>>49758184
Ill do it tonight with the wiki page. I meant to get around with it but forgot. Im sorry sarcobro

>>49758233
The stats that put him out of pert range iirc were strength and toughness or possibly ws and bs. Pert has really high stats with a bunch of 7s. That didnt reflect saul. But his wargear (big old armour with weapons and such) did. So the wargear is based off pert but the stats from alpharius.

I dont have my notes woth me so please forgive inaccuracy in this post.

>>49758255
>stats and armor don't affect each other.

This is objectively false.

A higher (lower, ie 2+) armor is worth dramatically more on a model with high stats than one with low stats.

For example, the 3+ on a daemon prince has much greater intrinsic value than the save armor on a space marine.

>>49758184
Who is sarco?

>>49758240
I would, but I don't know enough about the wargame to trust myself with making anything remotely balanced.
>>49758319
Thanks man.

>>49758402
>I would, but I don't know enough about the wargame to trust myself with making anything remotely balanced.
The dude doesn't even have his own lore page, and someone is supposed to stat him?...

>>49758446
>>49758394
I will amend this terrible mistake when I get home from dinner.

>>49758454
Does he have any kind of publicly posted lore? Anywhere?

>>49758484
I just realized that aside from in these threads, he does not. I'm going to fix this, don't worry.

>>49758446
Ive picked up what i think i need from the threads to at least make up a v1 rules. They wont be perfect no doubt but thats what discussion is for.

Do any of the primarchs have a family or group of close people? Roboutte had his mother, and Dorn his grandpa.

>>49758596
>>49758625
If you get some lore posted for him tonight, I'll mash out some rules for him. Won't have time for a thorough playtest tonight, but it'll be better than just freehanding (free... Minding?) it yourself.

>>49758631
Roboutte had both parents, Dorn had his papa, Vulkan had both parents and a bunch of siblings and cousins, Perterabo and Mortarion both had a father figure they hated, Magnus had a sorcerer daddy, russ had a wolf and later a king... I think the only ones that didn't have someone was Conrad and Angron. And possibly Horus and the twins, we don't know.

>>49758272
Stats in armor are whatever your stats are plus a 2+ armor save. Terminator armor doesn't boost your stats.

>>49758376
right but giving a model terminator armor doesn't automatically give it 2 more strength or something.

>>49758159
I also think the Big E was tied up preventing a warp breach in the webway thanks to Oramar.

>>49758596
This once again shows what I've been saying for a while now. We've done a lot of stuff. It's time to finally make respectable wiki pages.

>>49758693
He was asking if any of ours do. I think it'd be humanizing if any did.

>>49758693
Didn't Horus have the emperor as a father figure because he was recovered early on
The twins if I recall had a pirate crew they were a part of

>>49758805
Should he get his own page or should I put his stuff in the legion page?

>>49758830
Sure, would allow for a lot of info to be organized better. But we ultimately need to go from legion I to XX and add anything important to the pages. It really is a mess that bottlenecks people from joining the project.

>>49758704
True, but it does affect their relative intrinsic value, and thus affects their worth on the tabletop.

>>49758805
This.

>>49758824
>Horus having the emps
He was full grown when the emps found him.

>The twins had a pirate crew
They have like seven origin stories.

>>49758830
Every primarch and character should have their own page separate of the legion page.

>>49758631
Raydon grew up in a fleet. Lots of his bridge crew are like his family. Very similiar to something like star trek where he took his crew with him where he went. Its why he had a "legion" flagship and his own ship which he captained whenever he could.

He was big into bonds of fellowship.

[Spoiler] why aodhan did you have to go traitor, whhhhhhhy [/spoiler]

>>49758937
I disagree. I think we should keep things fairly dense and consolidated so its easier to A: update and B: find

If every legion has a different page for stories, characters, their primarch, and legion multiply that by 20 add in xenos, major events, other factions and its unmanageable. If we keep all the legion data collated then its 20+timeline+factions+xeno. Its still big but finding something is just a matter of looming up the right faction page.

>>49758937
>>49759061
A page for the legion and a page for the primarch is fine. More pages might prove nessecary eventually.

>>49758937
That's just page bloat for no reason. Primarchs and Legions should have 1 shared page.

Alright, how do I make an account on this bastard?

>>49758763
How did that happen anyways?

>>49759061
>>49759145
>unnecessary bloat
Wrong. This presupposes that more pages has any downside, which it doesn't as long as you categorized them appropriately and have the appropriate link box at the bottom of the page. Having more pages is not a bad thing. if anything, it makes it more approachable because you don't have fifth subarticles in each page.

It actually makes it easier to update pages, because it's easier to keep track of different edits over time on each page. You may not have one page for every character, but each legion page should certainly be separate from their primarch.

>>49759354
You click the "create account" link in the upper lefthand corner...

>>49759145
It most certainly does not. In fact, I'd argue it makes the whole thing more palatable because things aren't huge imposing walls of text with a half dozen sections with their own subsections.

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>>49759456
More pages means you need to go to more pages to get information. If I want to learn about a particular faction, I would rather read 1 page rather than 2. What a Primarch does and what a Legion does are extremely related. If you had two pages, there would have to be SO MUCH overlapping content on both pages, and vital context for something on one page may only exist on another page. God, what a nightmare. No thanks.

The Primarch's history and the Legion's history are the same. Why write it out in two different places? Why have TWO blurbs about legion homeworlds on TWO pages when you can just have one? Why split content like that?

>>49759469
Yes. Right. I'm retarded.

>>49758817
I had been imagining Xun as having a philosopher king, space Confucius king parent, with the full court that comes with.
When the king dies and everyone finds out that Xun has been designated heir, there's a rebellion of royal relatives and Xun puts it down, but the whole experience impacts how he rules.

>>49759526
Because Legion and Primarch history are explicitly NOT the same. Moreover, you'd have to have individual sub-headers for Primarch disposition/appearance and legion disposition.

>>49757423
Balthasar seems like he should have a mechanic that allows him to get a random number of extra attacks. Or maybe just more on the charge. Anshul and Aodhan should probably have +1 attack each too. Anshul has six arms (though his attacks are probably meh by Primarch standards) and I don't know that Aodhan is supposed to be slow.

>>49759559
>>49759470
>>49759456
I agree with these posts

>>49759559
>Because Legion and Primarch history are explicitly NOT the same.
With the exception of a scant handful of years before the primarchs are discovered, yes they are.

>History
Write a blurb about the legion before the primarch
write a blurb about the primarch's homeworld and discovery
write a blurb about the legion and primarch's actions during the crusade
write a blurb about the legion and primarch's actions during the heresy
write a blurb about the legion and primarch's actions after the heresy
Write a blurb about the primarch's death/disappearance/whatthefuckever
Write a blurb about the legion after the primarch and in perpetuity to m42

>Primarch personality
Write a blurb about the primarch's personality
Have a relationship matrix/table/list

>Military doctrine
write a blurb about their military doctrine, special equipment, etc

>Territory
write a blurb about their territory

>Rules
Write any rules people made up

page done.

>>49759526
Because if you don't it ends up unpalatably bloated? Also I'm not sure where you're getting this idea that warhammer fans DON'T like looking into the minutia. Also this >>49759559 .

>>49759605
Go to the warhammer wiki. Compare the legnth and content of the canon primarch's pages to that of their legion.

Gonna go to sleep. I hope that when I wake up, some consensus has been reached on the wiki formatting. Then we can actually go and sort this mess out.

>>49759698
>Go to the warhammer wiki. Compare the legnth and content of the canon primarch's pages to that of their legion.
We don't need anywhere near as much content on a page. The primary home for content is in the threads, not the wiki. The wiki should just be a place to get a basic idea of the legion/primarch, what their deal is, and a loose outline of what they did.

This project exists for the threads, and the primary audience is us. The wiki is just there as a helpful tool, not as a sum repository of everything. This is not a 'project' like the Hektor Heresy where the threads are just the tip of the iceberg. This is a 4chan thread with a supplemental wiki. Or at least that's how I'd like it to be.

>>49759456
Sorry im not sure what youre talking about with tracking edits.

I dont see the need honestly to have different pages. I see less pages = more easy to find the stuff youre looking for.

More pages = harder. If im wrong im wrong thats just my understanding of it. Thats how i look at trying to use it.

>>49759470
Valid. But thats a matter of formatting.

>>49759589
The stats anon explained his limited attacks as explicitly a balancing mechanic because Aodhan autowounds and ignores armour saves. And if you imagine him fighting carnifexs or what have you, it makes sense he is more concerned with a few hard hitting precise blows than hacking away with a flurry of attacks. IMO it makes sense thematically and works well mechanically.

>>49759605
>history
Good prompts. Will do.

>>49759751
>main effort is threads
>suppirting effort is wiki
I concur. The wiki is to cement good ideas and make it easier for new anons to catch up and join in. My thougjts anywho

>>49759751
>We don't need anywhere near as much content on a page. The primary home for content is in the threads, not the wiki. The wiki should just be a place to get a basic idea of the legion/primarch, what their deal is, and a loose outline of what they did.

Ah, you see that's where you and I are hitting dissonance. If you aren't codifying and recording the results, the entire exercise seems utterly pointless to me, but if that's how you guys do things, that's up to you. Personally I prefer the Hektor Heresy method: the threads are used more as a forum for discussion, and the content itself is posted on the wiki.

>>49759840
Agreed. More importantly if we want people to create content in the threads, new people especially, they have to be able to reference something. A skeleton reference is fine, but a comprehensive one is better.

>>49759822
>More pages = harder and more confusing.
90% of the /tg/ stuff I do happens on wikis, so I can say from much experience that is is false. If you try to put too much information into one page, it gets bloated.

Rather than having a legion's history, culture, tactics, rules, and primarch all on one page, you instead have one page for the primarch, one page for the legion, one page for the rules, and you have everything accordingly connected by links and categories to make them easy to navigate. Having three pages with ten subcatagories each is much simpler and more welcoming than having one page with thirty subcatagories. It's also way easier to edit, because tracking edits becomes easier, as there's less edits per page.

>>49759589
Balthasar has basically every rule that gives situational bonus attacks

rage
counterattack
rampage
hammer of wrath
daemon weapon

8+2d3 attacks on the charge plus 1 HOW.

>>49759751
I agree with >>49759840. I'd like all of this to be stuck somewhere where people can still read it after the threads have died and everyone has drifted off without having to sift through sup/tg/ or 4plebs.
Threads are just entirely inadequate for information storage.

>>49759840
The Hektor Heresy's design philosophy is that they are writers creating something for an audience. The wiki is the product they are producing.

Our design philosophy is that we're playing in a sandbox and we're our own audience. The wiki's there to teach people what our sandbox's rules are so they can play too.

>>49759854
>if we want people to create content in the threads, new people especially, they have to be able to reference something
That's another thing I can't believe I forgot to mention, as it applies to me directly. I came here specifically meaning to create a large amount of content, specifically rules. I can't do that, because there's almost no information on your characters posted on the wiki. The same would hold true for any other newcomer. If you want new people, you need the info to be easily accessible, or all this just becomes one big circlejerk.

>>49759901
You can do that by talking to human beings here in the thread instead of reading a wiki page you know

>>49759891
We may be the audience and the creator, but everyone who is here is not the only audience and creator. We've lost people, we've gained people, we will lose and gain people. They have to know what we're doing and what our charaters/setting are all about. See >>49759901

>>49759901
Yeah, but I came here to play in the sandbox, ready with blueprints and templates, yet I can't do that, because there's little info to be had by someone outside of the project.

>>49759920
This was for this >>49759891 , just misclicked.

>>49759913
That is horribly inefficient, and it presupposes that the original writer of a character will be in the thread any time I need to access that information, which is impossible, as you've lost people over time, so odds are that at least some of the OG writefags aren't even around anymore.

>>49759913
That takes time. Weird time too. People who have crucial information might fall off for days or even weeks, leaving the people that are here to pick up the pieces and try to describe what they wrote. Given enough time, it would end up broken telephone.

>>49759948
>>49759955
It's how we mostly get by. When I'm writing about something and I need to know or confirm something about x faction, I ask and someone answers. Most namefags here can answer questions for basically all legions.

But we're getting a little off-topic. I want an informative wiki too, and I don't mean to imply otherwise. But it only needs to be informative enough that someone can get started, it doesn't need to be thoroughly exhaustive.

>>49759981
>it doesn't need to be thoroughly exhaustive.
and even if they were they would be nowhere near the length of the canon wiki pages on lexicanum because we simply don't have as much content as the black fukken library.

1 page is plenty to give you an idea of a primarch and his legion.

>>49760006
I still disagree. Two smaller pages, no matter how small, are more appealing than one longer page. Especially if we don't have someone good at formatting making the pages attractive.

>>49760029
>Two smaller pages, no matter how small, are more appealing than one longer page.
Man I 100% do not disagree. I'd rather scroll than load a new page.

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>>49760043
>Man I 100% do not disagree.
I mean do not agree lol, fuck.

P R O M P T :

describe a legion to anon

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>>49759981
>But it only needs to be informative enough that someone can get started, it doesn't need to be thoroughly exhaustive.
Well, I mean it doesn't NEED to be...

Look, it's your guy's project, so you do what you will for content, but trust me, there should be a separate page for each primarch an legion, if only for ease of editing, and that's not even considering the approachability issue, which I'd say two pages would help with over one longer page.

>>49760043
>>49760056
Editing wikis is kind of what I do, and I can guarantee you that more pages does not decrease traffic until you start getting truly ridiculous about it. A page's traffic DOES decrease however when it starts getting bloated with subcatagories, which a primarch+legion page inevitably will.

>>49760083
I don't care about traffic I care about me, as a user, having to load a new page. It's a nuisance.

>>49760078
Yes, stop your writing and brainstorming so you can explain to newbies what your legion is. And you have to do it in 10,000 words or more, to a better extent than a wiki could do it. And extensive wiki just isn't practical, by thunder!

>>49760108
Man you can summarize a legion in like three sentences.

>>49760103
Okay, but your comfort is not more important than the overall efficiency of the project, or the ease of access to new users.

>>49760120
But you can't do it extensively, and an extensive summary is necessary for anyone coming in to do more content, as we've seen here today.

>>49760123
>efficiency of the project
man literally who gives a shit about this?

>ease of access to new users.
Ease of access is what I'm talking about.

>>49760134
You don't really need that extensive a summary. One wiki page of comfortable reading length can easily contain all the information you need.

>>49759914
>>49759955
>>49759920
>>49759914
Didnt link everyone but i think you 3 are the anons.

I dont think anyone disagreez with having as much good quality content on the wiki as possible.

The more we can put on there as possible is good. Ill readily admit i forget to update the hawk page as much as i should. But i think its relatively decent. I think maybe we should come up with a template as to the format and content of a page. Even if that means we have a summary page with details combined of culture tactics primarch history etc. As well as various pages for detail on each. As long as everything looks the same

>>49760154
>One wiki page of comfortable reading length can easily contain all the information you need.

I'm dubious.

But ultimately, all I really care about is having an informative and appealing wiki. If you think one page is better, go ahead and write it that way. So long as no one comes along later saying they can't get the information they need out of it I guess the actual readability is kinda secondary. That said, everything we fucking got goes on the wiki. No less.

>>49760078
1. Self righteous book fags.
2. Ron Swanson the legion
3. Space marines in SPACE that arent scary marines IN SPACE

>>49760154
>man literally who gives a shit about this?
If we're considering what approach will lead to the best environment for the creation of new content, we all should. If you really don't care about the group effort, why are you even here? If you weren't looking for collaboration you could have just wrote everything yourself and never posted any of it, and you'd have total creative freedom.

>ease of access
You're talking about it, but you're only considering it from your own viewpoint.

>You don't need and extensive summary
I disagree. If you're making new content you need to understand the setting and factions you're working with. Nuance is never a bad thing when seeking understanding.

I'll probably just continue to write about muh Primarchs on the Legion pages until there's enough material to merit a new page.

Can we just agree to do that for now?

The Primarchs have a lot of material but much of it is summarised. Make a page for them when you're prepared to writefag up the stuff you've summarised in detail.

>>49760211
>efficiency of projects
I concur. Efficient is good.

>easy access
Again i agree its important. I suggest 1 summary page with blurb about everything and link pages off with details.
Downside will be keeping everything consistent however.

>dont need extensive
I think my proposition handles both arguments.

>>49760247
I'll shake to that for now.

>>49760269
>I suggest 1 summary page with blurb about everything and link pages off with details.
This is unnecessary. The best format for a project of this size would be one page for each legion containing all their in universe information, one page for the primarch and all his in universe and gameplay information, and then one collective rules page for every legion, with dropdown sections, a la the legion tactics page that's up on 1d4chan right now for the canon legions.

>>49760316
Drop downs are a great idea.

I agree that having the links going off is unnecessary at this point, however it does allow room for growth. Drop downs however are cool and i support that idea.

>>49760279
Whose void watcher? Are you new? Welcome if so.

>>49761709
No, sorry, I left my name on from the other Heresy. I'm Saul's anon.

>>49760247
Seems useful. I think the important thing is to get the data up there. We can format it later, since that will help new anons. But you can't format what you don't have.

>>49761948
Honestly formatting should be done first. This allows things to be sorted more easily, compiled, and lets us know what blanks need to be filled.

Once we have a template, it becomes a matter of filling it in. Rather than trying to design a template to fit variable caches of data.

Using Alexios' post from above. I suggest the format for the wiki summary pages being

Primarch History
>Details on Primarch: Personality, Gear, Physical Description.
Details on Primarch Home-world and their discovery
>Details of Primarch during the Great Crusade
Details of Primarch during the Heresy
>Details of Primarch after the Heresy
Details of Primarchs Death/Disappearance/Ascention
>Details of Primarchs myth/legends/end times scenario (If applicable)
Primarchs relationship matrix

Legion History
>Details on Legion worlds
Details of Legion during the Great Crusade
>Details of Legion during the Heresy
Details of Legion after the Heresy

Legion Doctrine
>Military Doctrine
Recruitment details
>Codex compliancy
Special Equipment / Units

Legion Territory
>Crusade / Heresy / Post Heresy

Rules
>Legion Astartes rules
Primarch Rules
>Special Unit Rules

And if their page is too bloated we can move stuff onto other pages as required. But this should be compiled for all before we worry about making it pretty.

I'll put some stuff about Sarco up on the wiki tomorrow. In the meantime, here's a story I wrote a while ago.

http://pastebin.com/gMWezQFR

>>49762465
My recommendation would be the following.

Space marines would be organized into (at least) 37 pages.

1 page for each legion (with their history, culture, etc), 1 page for each primarch (with their history, personality, etc, and rules), and one collective page with their legiones astartes tactics and rules, the way we did it with the canon primarchs and legions on 1d4chan, and the way we did it with the other AUs.

>>49762512
You mean three pages, right?

>>49762512
20 primarchs
20 legions
1 rules page
1 timeline page
1 crusades page
1 setting page

>>49762512
How do you reach 37 if the legions work in groups of 20?

>>49762523
>>49762536
I mean 37.

I said space marines, so 18 legions (9 loyalist, 9 traitor, 2 missing). 1 page each, 1 page for each primarch, and one unified page for all their tactics. 18 + 18 + 1 = 37.

Admittedly, I forgot that there are 20 primarchs here, not 18 like canon, so it would be 41 pages, which is really quite fitting considering the setting.

>>49762615
Oh, I completely misunderstood what you meant. Keep in mind that we should have at least one page for realm guard and mercenaries as well as some for xenos such as the resurgent Eldar Empire.

>>49762677
And the Archaeotect Collective. There is literally nothing about them on the wiki.

>>49762677
>>49762687
As I said, this is specifically for the organization of space marines.

>>49762687
>>49762677
>>49762536
So
20 Primarchs
20 Legions
1-5 Xeno Summary(that leads into each faction (orks, Eldar, archeotect etc) - So thats like what 5 or so extra?
1 Guard and Mercenary
1 timeline
1 crusades
1 setting summary
1 rules page

Now we are at 50 pages.

>>49762810
With good links and navigation it could work.

>>49763179
I propose someone fluent with the wiki html make a template then base on >>49762465
combined with the side profile for the legions so we can begin then.

Does anyone here know how to make such a thing?

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>>49762536
>>49762615
>>49762810
If you feel like making 50 fucking wiki pages you go right ahead, but I'm in favor of >>49762465

>>49763311
If someone knows how to make that template, I have no issue sorting through and filling them in. I just dont have the requisite knowledge to make up a form.

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>>49763667
Had no idea where to start for Undying Scions Sire of the X rule. But otherwise here is v1 of Sarco.

>>49763311
Having 30 or 50 wiki pages doesn't really change anything. It's just that when you sort things out like >>49762810, it's waaaay easier to find the thing you're looking for. Whether you stuff a single page full of text or you spread it out over two, it doesn't make it more work. We only need to link properly.

6th Crusade seemed undeveloped, so I decided to flesh it out a bit.

>the Chaos Champion Dralech Greyonne rises to prominence from the hunting grounds of Wendigos, uniting the Soul Reapers, Burning Sons, Bloodgorgers, and Skinwalkers warbands
>wielding the Daemon Axe Doomtide, his fury is unmatched, and he violently subdues several other disparate hunter gruppes of Bloodhounds
>he campaigns for several years, hunting other warbands and adding their survivors to his forces, until the Daemon Primarch Balthasar takes notice, bestowing upon him the title of Huntmaster
>the ensuing torrent of rapturous violence unites many disparate elements of the Bloodhounds Legion under a single banner, quickly spilling into loyalist space
>the tide of blood-frenzied warriors and maniacal pirates at Dralech's command crashes against the borders of the Storm Kingdom, targeting isolated worlds at first, turning them into desolate abattoirs where the Bloodhounds hunt scattered prey and press thousands into service via threat of indescribable torture
>their forces strengthened, the armies of Dralech press further, the dark champion declaring that he will reduce Lostregia to a haunted shell of its former self and claim it as his personal hunting ground
>sounding the call for aid, Engerand marshals his Legion and its successors. He is sorely disappointed when only Anders answers his call, many other Crusader States tending to their own borders
>declaring the Sixth Great Crusade in the hopes of coaxing forth his borders, Engerand marches to war himself
>he is leery of his allies from the Protectorate, but they soon prove themselves, and the defensive bulwark they put in place stills the advance of Chaos
>hoping to break through and tear his way to Lostregia, Dralech concentrates his forces upon the essential Agri-World of M'khan, hoping to severely diminish the flow of supplies to loyalist forces

>>49766249
>the Planetary Defense Force, though bolstered by forces of the Paladins of Kor, is severely diminished by the time Engerand and the bulk of his Legion arrives
>energized by the slaughter, Dralech commends the blood of a billion innocents to Khorne, among them a number of tortured psykers, and tears open a rift into the Warp, allowing the Legions of Khorne to flow into the material realm
>never one to retreat at the first sign of hardship, Engerand leads a daring assault upon Dralech's position while Anders secures the world's Hives for evacuation. He faces Dralech in combat and shatters his Daemon Axe, but is deceived
>seeking anchorage in the mortal realm, the beast within the axe reveals itself to be DOOMBREED, Highest Prince of Khorne. It takes the opportunity to possess a willing Dralech and tears loose Engerand's left arm in the ensuing battle
>defeated, the Storm Hammers retreat, and the loyalists depart from M'Khan, forced to initiate total Exterimatus of the planet. Doombreed's armies continue to tear their way toward Lostregia

TO BE CONTINUED when I get back.

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>>49766256
>>49766249
moar!

>>49766358
Can't write in detail right now, but the reat of the Crusade has four major events:

1. The Death March. The beaten loyalist forces muster billions upon billions of conscripts and Realm Guard, and march them into a series of insanely bloody stalling actions while they develop a plan and wait for reinforcements from the other Crusader States

2. The Steppes Hunt. Forces from the Void Lords and Warhawks show up to divert some of Dralech's armies, leading them on a perilous void hunt through northern Ultima.

3. The Counsel. While he recovers, Engerand is approached by a mysterious group who repair his chipped hammer with a tiny fragment from a strange artefact they call the Fulgurite

4. The Battle of Lostregia. Time stands still at the Iron Hill.

>>49766514
Oooh. This is sounding good.

>>49766514
>dat spoiler

Shit's getting really real yo.

>>49766514
So once the scale of the invasion becomes clear, do the other legions send aid? And does this solve the problem or just escalate the situation?

>>49767996
It sounds like this Dralech guys bringiing at least a whole legion with him and conscipted billions of people to fight for him or face the lash so maybe the two loyalist forces will be enoguh but smaller groups from other crusader states are sent or if theyre autonomous groups choose to go on their own to help push back the forces of chaos.

>>49768133
Makes sense.
In that case let's fluff up some Paladins, Hammer, and relief forces.

What are we thinking the Storm Hammers daemon control situation looks like?
I'm thinking the Ravens of Morgas are still running around doing their thing, but what else?

Alright, I'm making a page for Sarco right now. If we decide to limit the amount of pages I can just have it redirect to the Undying Scions page.

>>49768953
A seperate page for legion and primarch is fine, really.

>>49767996
Anything that involves big Daemon presence will draw several squads or even a company of Oathsworn. Don't know if they still have nulls, but them Terra flashbacks mean they got to hold the line if there's hardcore chaos.

Who knows, maybe they busy out a cool one off trick. Their expertise means that they still are extremely useful for guarding against corruption and keeping recovered gene seed pure.

>>49768133
>>49768727
How about the Paladins send xeno Auxiliae along with their astartes, including a few cohorts of Eldar Wraith Titans?
The numerous xeno forces cause friction on every front, but none can deny the efficacy of the wraith bone colossi.

Meanwhile, the Sky Serpents, usually quick to aid others if only out of a desire to use allied space to maneuver with no need to worry about collateral damage, are unexpectedly reclusive following the 5th crusade, instead sending specialized anti-daemon task forces alongside a primarily mortal and mechanicum force.

>>49768977
How am I going to want to format this? Keep in mind that I have no idea how to use the various wiki tools.

>>49769073
For the primarch page, this is the best format:


Primarch History
>Details on Primarch: Personality, Gear, Physical Description.
Details on Primarch Home-world and their discovery
>Details of Primarch during the Great Crusade
Details of Primarch during the Heresy
>Details of Primarch after the Heresy
Details of Primarchs Death/Disappearance/Ascention
>Details of Primarchs myth/legends/end times scenario (If applicable)
Primarchs relationship matrix

If you're lost, look at the pages for the OU or Hektor Heresy primarchs.

>>49769028
Ooh, that's a cool idea. Maybe the Silent Knights are a myth at this point, but during this one they deploy en Masse, hacking through daemons on numerous worlds before vanishing as mysteriously as they came. Their actions seem largely independent from the larger Oathsworn activity, though the reasons for this are unclear.

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>>49769098
Gotcha. I'm going to use this as a placeholder picture until the return of drawfag.

>>49769116
How do I make an infobox template?

>>49769200
Just copy one from another page and fill it in.

>>49769217
I guess I'll use the HH template then.

>>49769243
Say what you want, but the Hektor Heresy guys know how to log their stuff. No shame is copying their wiki layout.

Is the style of warfare in IA more medieval with the way things are structured in the crusader states and dark imperium

>>49769637
How do you mean?

Okay I've started Sarco's page. I'd like some feedback on the page quote, does it make sense and all that.

>>49765510
Well at this point I think we ran off the guy who actually knows any wiki-fu, so it might be a moot point.

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>>49766249
>>49766256
>>49766514

THE DEATH MARCH
>Doombreed's emergence demonstrates the terrible scale of the invasion, and other Crusader States are galvanized to action
>with Engerand wounded and both his and Anders' forces badly mauled, they are forced to engage in a series of desperate stalling actions while the rest of loyalist space moves its fleets into position
>every available Realm Guard regiment is mobilized, every Houseguard host is drafted into combat, and billions upon billions of conscripts are sent to the grinder. Unable to sit back and watch the slaughter, Anders leads his Legion into the fray
>the battles of the Death March are desperate struggles, the tide of daemons, Bloodhounds, and heretics proving overhelming. There are myriad tales of daring and heroism throughout the campaign as the defending forces fight tooth and nail to stall the armies of Chaos and save what lives they can
>bloated with the power of Khorne, Doombreed and his followers subject their billions of captives to foul rituals, the energies of the Warp transforming them into mutated beastmen, and with every hive that falls the armies of the beast grow
>opportunistic as ever, warbands of the Silver Spears, Warp Raiders, and Negators are sighted throughout this period. The former two attack loyalist supply lines and isolated settlements, while the latter is more concerned with raiding the Black Abbeys and Astral Lighthouses of Storm Kingdoms space. The loss of many Astra Telepathica assets and records is partially responsible for the divided state of the modern Storm Kingdoms
>as the slaughter continues, the loyalists devise a strategy to siphon off the warbands under Doombreed's control, taking advantage of their eager nature, and finally meet the Deamon Prince's reduced armies on the fortress world of Moloch

>>49769065
An idea for a Storm Kingdom force/forgeworld.
>Thunor Prime
One of the major forges in the Storm Kingdoms, Thunor Prime is notable for its deviant cult of Electricity. Here, electricity is regarded as a tangible expression of the Omnissiah's will and as such many of the forge's terrible wonders are based around a unique harnessing of electricity and magnetism.
The affiliated knight houses are well stocked with Maegara units, but beyond that, such electrolaser based weapons are common across all forces on the forgeworld.

>House Volta
The primary knight house of Thunor Prime, house Volta is known for their Valor and agression. They have an above average number of Knight Lancers and Maegara units, but beyond that are known to replace the battle cannons on Knight Errants with more arcane lightning based weapons, such as Voltaic Arrays and Induction Lances. In battle, house Volta fights as a single warband, it's massed ranks of lancers harmonizing their shields to form a shieldwall, charging forwards, even as the more exotic weaponry reduces foes to smoking ash.

>Legio Menhir
Legio Menhir is Thunor Prime's primary Cybernetica legion. Of similar temper to the Knights of house Volta, Legio Menhir's core is composed of the rare Domitar Ferrum pattern automata. This core is augmented by a large number of Vultarax and Castellax units. The Castellax units often have Voltaic Arrays in place of the more mundane bolt Cannon. Behind these units are the siege automata, typically armed with lightning cannon, arc serpenta, and magnetic bombards, an Ersatz plasma bombard invented after the fall of Ryza made those weapons unavailable.

>Skitarii
I think they'd have galvanic rifles out the ass. Arc guns. You get the idea.

I'm thinking they also have a metric ass load of Fulgurite Priests.

>>49769737
I've been told that the Sarco page is blank. Does anyone have any idea why?

https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Sarco_Funerus

>>49769871

THE STEPPES HUNT
>unheralded, and as though preempting their allies' plans, the forces Void Lords and the Crimson Warhawks, as well as two chapters of Oathsworn remnants attack the outlying Chaos forces
>the Burning Sons, the Blood Axes, the White Howlers, the Heralds of Slaughter, the Bloodied Ones, and several smaller warbands detach from the main body of Doombreed's forces to chase this new prey
>the loyalists lead the forces of Chaos across the northern stretches of the Segmentum, often confounding their foes despite their drastically inferior numbers
>eventually they are brought to pitched battle when forced to resupply, though by this time they have led the traitor forces far from the frontlines, to the desolate world of Lunaphage
>their objective completed, the loyalists have no intention of remaining planetside for long, but unexpected raids by the Spiraling Hearts warband of the Silver Spears halts their progress and mires them in a desperate battle
>unexpected relief comes in two stages - first, the battered forces of the 33rd, 14th, and 9th regiments of the Chaeronea Aquila Guard, hearing of the Astartes' situation, decline to return to be cycled out of the conflict, and make for Lunaphage to relieve the Space Marines
>second, a series of lightning strikes by an unknown Harlequin troupe target the leadership of the Bloodhounds warbands
>reinforced by the stalwarts of Chaeronea and facing an confused enemy with much of its leadership either fallen or gravely wounded, the Void Lords and Warhawks manage to drive the forces of Chaos into full retreat

>>49770207
Uh, there's gonna be a slight delay, but I promise I'll finish this later.

>>49770133
It isn't blank.

>>49770538
Oh, weird.
Well, back to fluffing.

>>49770476
>Lunaphage

Oh boy, Oathsworn better pull out some stops on a place named like that

>>49770769
On checking, it doesn't show up if you aren't logged in unless you go to the discussion page first.

Trying to think of ideas for how the Emperor first appeared to Sarco. Any thoughts?

>>49771654
In a wet dream.

>>49769065
Sending xenos would be a bad idea.

Even if youre helping you dont go to a foreign nation and wave around things that offend them. And xenos do offend other astartes even if kor manages to avoid it. Something like Eldar rangers might be doable if they avoid friendly detection

>>49771806
Xenos would end up with Oathsworn saying fuck it all and unleashes some nightmare virus they'be been working on for centuries meant to fuck with Daemon's too.

>>49769106
Silent knights all died on luna. That was the compromise reached to allow null marines to exist in the first place.

>>49770207
>void lords and warhawks
>fighting in space together
Well khorne you tried.

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>>49771790

>>49772005
Amarnth was a jungle world no? Maybe there were tales of !kingkong who the emperor sent people to find. And when they reported sightings were actually of a 8ft man. He went himself knowing it was a primarch.

From there it was just a matter of hunting down sarco in his natural environment and when he was caught by the emperor he accepted him as his leader.

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>>49770207

THE COUNSEL
>loyalist operations elsewhere mirror those occurring in the upper Segmentum
>forces from the Jade Empire and the Imperium Minorum draw off less disciplined warbands while Engerand's armies, along with battalions from the Forgespace and the Uyielding Vigil, reinforce Moloch and prepare to face Doombreed
>in the midst of his recovery, Engerand broods on the state of his realm, likening it to the heavily chipped head of his hammer, when he is approached in his quarters by a contingent of masked Eldar clad in garish colours
>one of them, a seer, grants him a word of advice, and the xenos repair his hammer with a tiny shard from a strange artefact they call the Fulgurite
>they depart as suddenly as they arrived, leaving no trace of their presence save the mote of blinding energy worked into the fore of the Primarch's hammer, and Engerand turns their words over in his mind for days on end until the final phase of the loyalist plan draws near

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>>49773016

THE BATTLE OF MOLOCH
>the multitudinous forces of Realm Guard and Paladins under Anders' command fall back to a heavily defended Moloch
>Doomtide takes the bait and full force of his armies, those that haven't dispersed to hunt other prey, descend upon the heavily fortified world
>the armies of the Forgespace, the Unyielding Vigil, and the Storm Kingdoms fight across every locale the world offers, but it soon becomes clear that the entirety neither the traitor nor loyalist forces are present
>the 1st and 2nd chapters of the Storm Hammers, along with Engerand, are missing, and while Doomtide's mortal armies have crashed down upon Moloch, the Daemon Prince and his legions of Warp-denizens are nowhere to be seen
>dun dun DUH

>>49773425
>Doomtide

DoomBREED. Fuck, his name is so awkward.

>>49773447
Mfw doomtide is a better name

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>>49773425
>using the glorious anguish of a thousand psykers to navigate further than normally possible with unerring accuracy, Doombreed and his daemon armies transition out of the Warp over Lostregia in a fleet of ships more bone and sinew than steel, Doombreed leading from the helm of Dralech's flagship, the Skulltaker
>they are met by the hardened planetary guard of Lostregia, as well as the 1st and 2nd chapters of the Storm Hammers, six Orders Militant, three Convents of Silent Sisters, and Engerand himself
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3aB6CPyO0Ww
>daemons rain from the skies and battle is met
>the conflict etches deep scars over the face of Lostregia, men and daemons falling by the thousands
>alongside a contingent of a hundred Silent Sisters, Engerand storms Doombreed's flagship as it tears through the atmosphere
>Doombreed reveals his magnificent form, having woven the bodies of many thousand felled warriors into the form of an immense serpent
>while the Sisters keep his armies at bay, Engerand engages the Daemon Prince in single combat.
>their battle shatters the spires of Lostregia, each blow of Engerand's hammer seeming like the crack of dawn, each serpentine heave of Doombreed's immense form tearing the land asunder
>as Engerand tires, the daemon snatches him up in his vast maw and sinks his fangs through his armour. Their fiery poison burns his very soul, but, with a roar of defiance. the Primarch brings his hammer crashing down on the beast's skull
>the Fulgurite shard within releases a pulse of blinding light, brighter than nuclear fire and hotter than the core of a star, and Doombreed shrieks in agony as he is torn asunder
>their anchor in the material realm destroyed, his daemon horde begins diminish back to the Warp, and Engerand declares the day won
>the assembled armies make for Moloch and assist in driving the mortal armies of Chaos, many of them feeling the loss of their master from lightyears away, back beyond the Firewall

>>49773612
It kinda is.

No idea what GW were thinking when they called him Doombreed. What does that even mean?

>>49774416
He breeds... ah. Doom.

Or his is a a breed called Doom. Or his presence incites doom.

>>49773676

CONCLUSION
>truly driving the forces of Chaos from the Storm Kingdoms would be an endeavor not truly finished for many years to come
>however, the brunt of the assault was broken after the traitor defeats at Lostregia and Moloch
>despite the incredible loss of loyalist life, the Crusade is considered, in hindsight, an exceptional victory, primarily due to the fact that Doombreed has not been seen since his banishment by Engerand, causing some to speculate that he was truly put to an end by the power of the Fulgurite
>the nature of the Fulgurite remains unknown to loyalist scholars, though many believe that a chosen few other weapons have had small shards of the strange relic forged into their makeup, and these weapons have been presented to a worthy champion in a time of great need
>despite the successes of the Crusade, there were several loyalist losses beyond the simple loss of life
>the bountiful Agri-World of M'Khan, as well as several others on Firewall-facing edge of the Kingdoms, were beyond saving, and had to be utterly destroyed during the stalling operations of the Death March
>invaluable records kept by the Black Abbeys were destroyed or stolen, and, combined with the destruction of several Astral Lighthouses, their loss has meant that there are many unused starways and unknown worlds lost throughout the Storm Kingdoms
>this compounds the problem caused by Doombreed's mass-conversion of humans into mutant beastmen. To this day, the uncharted and less-traveled reaches of the Kingdoms are prowled by tribes of piratical beastmen
>most prominently, but known to few, was Engerand's health toward the end of the Crusade. Doombreed's poison wrought horrific damage upon his body, souring his bones and weathering his flesh. Despite the damage, he was said to be more powerful than ever, but was rarely far from his Storm Hammer in the days following, as though he knew in his heart that only the energies of its Fulgurite core were sustaining his life

>>49776049
>scant few weapons made that can kill presumably anything
When i get back to civilization im going to write up something about Warhawks raiding a loyalist vault to steal one, maybe a radical or maybe an official plot. To "put the tools to good use".

Yay infighting

>>49776196
I think the implication is that the Harlequins have them.

I wonder where Engerand's hammer is now that he's dead.

>>49776271
Only the pure of heart and clean of colon can weild it.

>>49776271
Oh.
I see.

>>49776361
Weild them maybe.
Put melt them down and infuse into bullets is a different matter

>>49776444
And this is why we can't have nice things.

>>49777345
3rd time today ive been told that.

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miss one day and suddenly there's a whole book to read

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>tfw you're so lazy you can't even fill up your own wiki page
End it all.

>>49778453
It's progress, my friend.

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I'm not going to link up to the arguments over balance between thread and wiki, but some of the more excitable types in Hektor Heresy said that you guys were imploding and I'm really glad to see you're not. In my opinion (for what it's worth), I think that any suggestion that IA should be more like HH, or the reverse is kinda silly. It's good to have the projects operating in different ways, so folks have a better chance of finding something that's comfortable for them.

Good luck and keep up the good work!

>>49779999
Hey, thanks man. IA and HH are inherently different projects, and with good reason. The two should definitely not aim to for uniformity, but I do feel like there are things we can take away from each other. Things like proper documenting written pieces, so we can focus on the fun parts, instead of repeatedly answering questions on things that have already been discussed.
I don't know what could possibly have been considered IA 'imploding'. People disagree, but that's kind of the point of a discussion.

>>49780596
Some people just like to inflate internet drama.

>>49780788
No they dont you commie bastard

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>where's Engerand's hammer?

There are three routes we could go with this.

1. It's a Legion relic only toted out for certain battles, because the Fulgurite shard is too much for non-Primarchs to handle for long.

2. It's lost. Fuck.

3. The Harlequins reclaimed it after his death. They hand it out to people when necessary, though the chosen hero rarely lives long, and it always vanishes soon after their death.

>>49781174
I'm liking the first the most. You could kind of try to bring some of >>49776361 into it, where only those who adapt to Engerand's geneseed very well can wield it. Having the requirement actually be 'being a good person' is kind of weird, but being genetically similar to Engerand could work.

>>49781376
Yeah, if Engerand's hammer has a BE THEE WORTHY clause to it, it shouldn't literally be 'good person'.

To wield a Fulgurite weapon you most likely just have to have extraordinary strength of will and not be Chaos corrupted.

>>49776049
>Storm Kingdoms were originally united by a godlike man with a magic lightning hammer
>they have a vaguely germanic theme
>in recent years they've fractured into a collection of bickering states ruled by various counts, under an overall leader whose power is official but barely effectual
>the realm is full of uncharted areas where beastmen lurk
>despite its troubles, it's the only thing standing between the northern barbarians and the rest of the world

Vanth you cheeky motherfucker I see what you're doing here. Is the current Legion Praetor of the Storm Hammers called Karl Franz, by any chance?

>>49782346
It's like pottery, it rimes.

>>49782973
Oh also I reckon the big leadership position in the Storm Hammers is probably something like Lord Marshal or Grand Marshal or something.

Praetor doesn't seem to suit their image.

>>49782985
Grand Marshal.
It has a nice ring to it

Jaysis, we slow today. This one of them American holidays where you guys run around shooting hotdogs out of your mandatory Colts or something?

Anyhow, does anyone have any problems with the 6th Crusade stuff? If not I'll start making it flow better for the wiki.

>>49784305
I think it's good stuff. No idea why we're so slow today though.

>>49784305
>>49784572
I've been waiting for the wiki format stuff to get ironed out.

The crusade stuff looks great, I just haven't had all that much to contribute outside that one forgeworld idea that really needs a lot of work to make it something more than planet electricity fetish.

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>>49784572
>>49784879
Coolio.

In other news

>working on internal Sisters of Silence doctrine
>sigh forlornly at the fact that we'll never get much info on them, let alone models
>Burning of Prospero announced
>mfw

>>49784879
What do you think about the (admittedly scant) fluff about Sarco on Amaranth? Does it fit what I've been saying etc?

>>49784879
Well, the big point of discussion was whether we should have one page with both the legion and the primarch, or whether we should split that into two. What are your thoughts on the matter?

>>49785026
Sounds right to me.
So what happens to Amaranth after the Imperium comes?

Though now I'm also thinking of Tarzan, which, I think is intentional, but still...
Me Sarco.
You Emperor.

And many fun images of Sarco hanging with his animal friends.

>>49785679
>Not Emp-Rar

https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Feral_World_Religion

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>>49766249
>>49766256
>>49766514
Finally got some free time to read the thread. This looks neato burrito. Storm Hammers felt very underrepresented and this is also a great point in the time period for us to start dealing with regular spess muhreenz running the show like Dralech Greyonne.

>northern Ultima.
Did we ever land on whether or not it should be Segmentum Constantine or if we should just keep Ultima for ease and laziness? I'm withholding my opinion because I don't want to be THAT guy who re-names a third of the galaxy after his own character.

>>49786000
Trips say Constantine.

>>49786000
Ultima =/= Ultra. It's called that because it's the biggest segmentum, not because Guilliman was a conceited asshole.

>>49786122
That's cool with me then.

>>49785752
My bad.
Makes you wonder how that would go down in this one.
His son Darkman? Emp-Rar's sons, Angryman Hammer, Space hawk, Doctor, and Box.
His son Box from jungle.

Though really I suppose the best analogue would be feral worlds in the Dark Imperium, where the Asuran Sisterhoods check in on cultists who regale them with tales of Blue-Man and the Emperor's son who fell in love with a tank.

Some Black Suns fluff to go with new offer of writefagging: who would you like me to write of? What theme would yo like the short story to have?

On year 374.M37, the Black Suns' defenses crumbled under the combined efforts of Dark Imperium's agents and the Ash Bearer's assault, leading to the near destruction of the warband. Driven to the Tricorn palace, the last Black Suns were ferocious and unnatural combatants, moving like shadows and using every weapon in their disposal, including their artefacts, sorcery, and mysterious devices that called forth beings from the warp that hardly resembled any known daemons or xenoforms. Yet one by one they all fell to the fiery wrath of the Ash Bearers.

Until only Cyrus Dumah remained.

>>49786215
>implying the feral world isn't amaranth

>>49769871
>>49770207
Yo these warband names are really good.

>>49773016
HERESY

>>49773425
intense

>>most prominently, but known to few, was Engerand's health toward the end of the Crusade. Doombreed's poison wrought horrific damage upon his body, souring his bones and weathering his flesh. Despite the damage, he was said to be more powerful than ever, but was rarely far from his Storm Hammer in the days following, as though he knew in his heart that only the energies of its Fulgurite core were sustaining his life

Could we maybe put Engerand into gulliman/lion like stasis as his end-state, like Alexios dying and Xun ascending?

>>49782346
While this is an awesome parallel, for the record the Storm Hammers are supposed to be !Swedish and Engerand is supposed to be !Gustavus Adolphus

>>49781376
Couldnt it just be a prized relic. It doesnt need to have limited use beyond "if we give it to john and he dies its lost forever... i dont think he needs it"

>>49782973
I see what you did there.

>>49782985
>>49783301
Engerands title (only) during the 1st crusade was lord high marshal. Its likely high Marshal kr grand became a thing shortly after.

>>49786303
I like this idea. After some climatic fight either in this crusade or the next one, Engerand beats his enemy but is mortally wounded in the process. A strange honor Guard, including, if rumor is to be believed, Harlequins, bear him back to Loestrega, where he is placed in a tomb in the fortress. Legend has it that he is slowly healing and will return one day to lead his legion.

>>49787635
What is all this fuckery about harlequins? I dont get the love.

They are literally xeno motherfuckers. Why would any emperor fearing Astartes tolerate or collude with them?

Also why the love for them to begin with. They are nonsensical.

Secret cabal comes to him in the darkest of night and offers a secret auper weapon.
Awesome. Like actually cool.

Allowjng them into his honourguard? Are you crazy? Hell allowing them to take back the weapon at all is crazy. They are not allies. They used Engerand for their own purposes. And he would use them for his.

No need to make him an eldar loving bitch.

Also, the slowly healing part contrasts with his need for bionic replacements.
Since he has needed so many replacements its reasonable to assume his healing factor is weak or actively inhibited by some injury.

>>49787635
>Eldar lovers
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>>49787797
That's fair. So then say the Harlequins know their place, and definitely don't take the hammer back.
How about the Sisters and some Oathsworn to take him back to Avalon?
And then we just leave the king in the mountain trope as he will return eventually.

>>49787635
>>49787797
>>49787838
Xun-kun has a tendency to take things just a little bit too far. I like light touch of harlequin involvement in Vanth's story. They show up mysteriously, offer help with Engerand is suspicious of, and then vanish. Reminds me a bit of the encounter in Fulgrim if it had gone well instead of Fulg-sama getting all buttflustered when they talk bad about Horus.

The Harlequins are an extremely distant enemy to the Storm Hammers, as the new Eldar homeworlds are literally on the other side of the galaxy. He would mistrust them, but if they offered him the means to deliver a more serious and pressing foe, Engerand would begrudgingly accept their aid. Especially once they explained to him Fulgurite's connection to the Emperor.

>>49787797
Bruh I don't think anyone was saying they'd be let into his honour guard. Just that they'd return his presumably-missing body to Lostregia. And people like Harlequins because they're a shard of the old, hair metal Eldar of yore.

I think it's implied that his injuries aren't healing, or at least are healing extremely slowly, due to the weapons that caused them. Daemon poison, Kashaln's spear, etc.

>>49787915
His Pallbearers should/would probably be his closest captains. Which makes me think of a prompt:

Who is Engerand's Equerry?

>>49786303
The proposed Crusade list up above had him getting killed by one of his brothers, but managing to teleport them both into his crashing flagship as a final fuck you.

We could easily say that no trace of his body was never found, but that the hammer was returned to Lostregia by parties unknown, and that whenever a Marine wields it for however long they can withstand the Fulgurite's power, they can feel a certain sense of his presence, like it radiates this sort of confidence that he's alive and will return.

Or, hell, we go full Morte d'Arthur and the hammer vanishes after his death, but is once again offered to some Storm Hammers dude a century or so later, who is told that it must be kept safe but use well until the day the Storm King returns.

>>49787926
Harlequins are even more distant than that, really. They mostly hang in the Webway.

Most Marines, and even most Primarchs I think, don't even know they exist. With their masks on you might not even realize they're Eldar.

>>49788097
I like the latter idea, with conflicting rumors as to where the body is and who handed off the hammer.
(As of yet, the Scions have not acknowledged possession of the body, but this has not stopped Angel suspicions...)

>>49787950
Yeah, I don't really remember any clear Equerry character.
I imagine Engerand is the sort to have a champion kind of equerry, the kind of guy you might at first mistake for a Knight Exemplar. The difference I'd think is that this guy is far blunter. The sort of guy that eschews a defensive stance for offensive power, figuring that there's a reason he's wearing armor. I imagine that the Knights Exemplar keep their plate immaculate, while the Storm Hammers would be covered in dents and scrapes. Not Death Guard level dirty, but not clean like Emperor's Children or even the Sons of Dorn.

Bumpin before bed

>>49787950
I considered that his equerries (yes, plural) were a pair of brothers from Lostregia. Hurin and Munen Ravenmane, two dudes who are increasingly active on his behalf as his health declines, and are often responsible for keeping an eye on the politicking of the increasingly fractured Storm Kingdoms, making sure Engerand knows what's up and when he has to intervene. Either after the 6th Crusade or just prior to their Primarch's death they'd get their own chapters.

Speaking of brothers, I believe someone asked which of the Primarchs had families. Aodhán had a pretty complete family among the tribes of Nusku, with a mother and father and several siblings. Unlike certain other Primarchs, he never tried to get any of them uplifting to Space Marine status, as he didn't want to risk them dying in the process. Anshul was adopted by one of the noble houses of Ravana and had a doting father, as well as two brothers, one of which attempted to kill him out of jealousy and came to a sticky end. For much of his mortal life he deeply regretted that his adoptive brother's feelings of inadequacy and anger went unnoticed by him until it was too late.

>>49789947
>families
Balthasar killed his Karachian father Lord Bornhold in a people's rebellion
Alexios was raised by librarian monks
Oramar was discovered, raised, and eventually lead a pirate crew on the salt flats of Azrimuth. He was raised by the previous captain of their saltskiff who was basically pic related. Most of his buccaneers took to the Astartes geneseed, and those who survived make up the bulk of his sahabat cult leaders.

>>49790045
>Oramar raised by a pirate crew
God i can see raydon and he singing pirate shanties long into the night after a succesful battle.

>>49791234
Fifteen orks on a dead man's hulk...

I know Malcador raised and favored [REDACTED], but who did the Emperor like? Someone earlier mentioned he liked Faustus but I don't know if that's canon for us.

>>49791605
I think he probably liked how [REDACTED] got shit done.

I imagine he had his doubts about Marcus on account of Mars and the Mechanicus possibly being a problem. Gengrat I can see being someone he keeps on a short leash. Faustus I can see him being the closest to being his most respected son, but also the one that seriously infuriates him the most. Dude's a genius and a visionary but he won't get off his fucking moon when Big E tells him to, or if he does, he makes a big deal about it getting in the way of his work.

Klaus seems like he'd be kept close and considered super reliable. Someone also mentioned that the Emperor probably considered Balthasar one of his most loyal sons due to his willingness to go murder his brothers.

>>49791821
I just get this vision of Big E telling Faustus to get out of the lab and socialize with his little brothers. Cue an entire world of Xenos burning. Who else hated Xenos as much as him?

>>49792405
Makes some sense. I have a feeling that some of the legions who were less than compliant when it came to the censure and needed to be brought to Cadia were the ones that had those special weekends with Faustus.
Probably was grumpy the whole time and nobody quite came away from it thinking what a good time it had been, but at least has an experience positive enough to give them pause/worry the Warmaster. (I'd imagine Faustus is sent out with someone like Enoch and it ends poorly.)

>>49792526
I picture an Iron Warriors 12 Phosphex mortar list supported by phosphex medusas and basilisks.

There's no survivors, or habitable ground to take. I imagine they only work together during grand xenocide campaigns.

>>49792526
In particular I think a potential shared campaign with him and Xun would be interesting. Faustus would have been expecting some feral world barbarian who thought medicine was best done with beads and rattles. Worse still, a simpleton in thrall to the Warmaster.

Xun would likely have been expecting Alexios, but without any of the qualities that make Xun fond of Alexios.

I imagine they came away from it surprised how well it went.
Faustus found Xun far more cultured and educated than he'd expected, thinking that if Xun ever focussed on a single field, he might actually amount to something. And stops all that silly art stuff.


Xun probably realizes that Faustus is motivated by love for humanity and it softens his perception of him. The result is that Xun takes on some more Oathsworn and sends some of his Apothecaries to Oathsworn bastions.

This would be shortly before the heresy. Maybe before Nikea?

Did we reach a decision about the emperor recruiting Faustus to help create Sarco's life support systems? Would he have gotten Marcus to bang out the sarcophagus designs?

>>49792656
Maybe since Xun was found in the eighth decade when Faustus was still a huge presence, Faustus was the one who found him? The Oathsworn were always the largest presence and at the forefront of finding worlds by sheer dint of numbers attached to every exploratory fleet. Would be neat to have some of the earlier found primarchs step up like Ferrus Mannus and Horus apparently did in the war effort.

>>49792681
The life support was all Faustus. Maybe the Emperor helped because he finally has a son who isn't in that weird mars cult to do science with, and Marcus could have done the external design. What keeps Sarco alive is fundamentally Oathsworn work though.

>>49792656
Oathsworn are big enough they'd work well as the rock that the Sky Serpents hit and run tactics skirt around in joint operations. They're the most vanilla chapter after all, just suped up with apothecary stuff until the heresy

I'm glad we didn't throw out the Oathsworn after that one anon threw a fit. They're quickly becoming one of my favorite legions.

>>49792689
That makes a lot of sense. In which case, I imagine Xun looks up to Faustus as something of a symbol of all the cool stuff that the Imperium is capable of.

If this is the case, then when does Xun meet the Emperor and who else does Faustus find?

>>49792713
>Dread stuff
Makes sense. I imagine that's also part of why the Emperor really doesn't mind that Faustus obsessed over gene tech, it gives an alternative tech system for use if the Martians revolt or the Navigators flip out.

>Oathsworn core
Yeah. That makes a lot of sense. Many thanks, Anon.

>>49792739
Yeah. I think some of the cooler ideas in this universe has come from taking ideas and working on them until they fit.

>>49792656
I dont see faustus as the kind of guy to think that honeslty. He wouldnt by into rumours or slander about someone even if they did reach him in his lab.

Hed be the kind to either not think.about it at all. Or wait until he had gathered some intel himself.

Remember ue was always at odds with the Warmaster so he would immediately discount anything he didnt see with his own eyes as potential propaganda.

And while he might have thought he was educated he likewise wouldnt care unless he managed to produce something out of it. Hed probably be mad, the fact that he had an education and ability and wasted it on frivolous stuff.

>>49792739
I find it cool that they work so much better (thematically) in the 40k era with only a few hundred-maybe a thousand running around as grizzled and grumpy vets. Determined to keep themselves a float. Than they do as vanilla marines.

Honeslty i wish id thought of it for the Hawks. That vietnam flashbacks idea is just so cool.

>>49792739
Im glad they could be utilised. For a long time i thought theyd just be wasting a spot.

>>49792739
Wait what? I must've missed that.

>>49794901
If it's the fit I remember, it was quite some time ago.

>>49795563
Maybe it was before I showed up then, yeah. Up until a couple of threads ago I would've agreed that the focus on the legions was completely out of whack, but we've been straightening that out properly. The crusades are a great way to focus on different legions.

Which other legion should get some love after the Hammers and the Oathsworn? (I keep typing Oathsword, I don't know why.)

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>>49795680
>Oathsword

This is cool. This should be something that exists.

I'm using this.

>>49795760
Could make for a pretty bitching eviscerator for Faustus to use. I like eviscerator, they're just so gloriously dumb.

The Oathsworn hate xenos, right? Like even more than other astartes? Do they still do their gene experiments on them? Xenos may be foul, but they might lead to further understanding of genetech as a whole.

>>49795865
They do, but that kind of experiments leads in two directions. One, biophages and xenocide viruses to better unleash on the xenos like hellfire rounds, or two, shit like the space dragons and stuff that got unleashed on Terra. They probably aren't very happy with the Kor protectorate, and whole companies have been exiled as extremists for what they do.

Could be an interesting feud for them. Maybe they life eater virus'd a world or two? A pretty stark contrast to other crusader States where they're heroes of the people. I imagine Faustus lost his shit at the warp raiders too at Nikea.

>>49795865
I think it was generally agreed that Faustus wasn't much of a fighter by Primarch standards, and used a power staff + a suite of chemical dispersion devices worked into his armor.

I could see him having something like that one Magos Biologos relic Mechanicus lists can use that surgically takes apart and analyzes its targets in the space of a heartbeat.

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>>49795865
I'm thinking it could be a set of relic blades created on Luna, right before the end of the Heresy. They're the last true examples of the super forbidden tech Faustus was dabbling with, and were raised by the surviving chapter masters of the Oathsworn when they made their collective vow to never stop fighting until Terra was destroyed.

I was thinking they could be vampiric in nature, like Farsight's sword. Turning flesh to dust and transferring its vitality to the wielder. This is how many Oathsworn chapter masters seem to survive the most ridiculous odds.

>>49796005
>Hatred (Kor Protectorate)
Most definitely. Given that the Paladins were some of the first in on Luna, I think there's a lot of anger and resentment there.
I'd imagine that some Oathsworn go out and get revenge when they have particularly bad flashbacks, something Alexios is happy to use to his advantage.

>>49796615
What kind of buffs did he five his army? I'm interested to see what the Oathsworn army LA and primarch looks like now with all this talk. Maybe they have some sort of death company or if its rare/powerful enough, Emperor's Champion character. Their flashbacks take them back to their genetic lineage of whoever had their geenseed's proginator on Terra, one of whom was called the Emperor's Champion when the daemons were unleashed.

>>49797024
If I remember correctly, the LA is that marines cost less, so they can field considerably more infantry units.

bumpuru

Bump. Also question about the Black Suns: Should they return after the events of >>49786246 or will it be, at last, their end?

>>49796717
Seems like a good idea. I think there should be a bunch of those borderline heresy kinds of things, some of which survived, and others long flrgotten.

>>49800203
Nah, all will be returned, right? I think they work well as a weird, eternal threat. Maybe even building up to threaten part of the Dark Imperium before being "exterminated" again.

>>49800265
Well, if they do survive, this is a good point to begin the buildup to the End they foretell.

>>49786246
>Cont. assuming they survive
What exactly happened afterwards is still largely a mystery, but the survivors described Cyrus as a "monstrous being of unnatural power, barely contained within the withering form of a man"
Additionally, those witnessing the Black Seer heard his voice, a whisper in the dark chamber:
"By your actions, the Herald has been born. Rejoice, for he shall return as foretold"

>>49796963
>hated the protectorate / anders
He wouldnt be the first.

Actually since he was second found he might have been the first... carry on.

>>49797024
Emperors champion doesnt fit since at the time he was the traitor (at the time)

>>49800203
>WILL THIS BE THERE END... TUNE IN NEXT TIME FOR DRAGON BALL Z!

Normally im all for killing of factions / characters. I think a story or character is enhanced 10fold through the use of a solid conclusion however the Black Suns are unique in that since its mostly an ideology i can see them being wiped out entirely only for someone to come along later and find a !sith holocron and learn it all again.

Especially if they need to rebuild through finding ancient ruined bases and stuff.

>>49801056
But they weren't traitors. The Oathsworn were always loyal to the Emperor. The Warmaster sparked a war with them while the Big E was trying to seal a Webway breach caused by Oramar.