Statting intensifies edition Previously on Imperium Asunder

>>49705421
You forgot the subject, mate.

>>49705421
Yo buddy, can you give an example of the Black Suns color scheme?

>>49705421
No subject edition.

Also version 1.0 Gengrat.

GENGRAT - The Voices, Techno-Cultist, Panopy of Battle
> Sire of the Behemoth Guard
LA: BG monsterous creatures gain IWND or +1 to IWND rolls if they already have it. Rhinos and Razorbacks are assault vehicles.
> Cyberthuegist Master
Counts as having Cyberthurgy special rule. In addition he may reroll failed Cybertheurgy tests. In addition, he can select 1 vehicle within 12" of him at the start of the movement phase and repair it on 5+ (restoring 1HP and 1 weapon destroyed or immobalisation)
> Scrap Code Infection
Once per shooting phase in addition to shooting normally Gengrat can select one unit with 18". Roll to hit as normal, if the target is a vehicle, all of its weapons gain Gets Hot. If infantry (or a variation of) must immediately take a pinning test.
>Panopy of Battle
Confers a 2+ Armour Save and 3++ Invulnerable Save. In addition incorporates: A heavy flamer, plasma cannon, a mult-melta, and assault cannon. He may only fire one of these each turn.

>>49705953
Oh I forgot the last line.

> The Voices
After suffering a wound roll a D6, on a 4+ Gengrat Transforms. On any other result, nothing happens.
When Gengrat Transforms he gains +2S +2T and +2A, however suffers -2WS and -2BS as well as -2Ld. He also gains Rage, Rampage. (Post-Heresy he no longer loses Ld)

Personally, Im not a fan of this, so far. I would love some feedback to improve this last ability that stays true to his jekyll/hyde nature. I just can't think of anything apart from gain +1S +1A for each wound suffered.

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>>49705659
Sorry about that. I only realised I didn´t do it after posting.
>>49705924
Black, white and metallic grey. Maybe add some silver, but that is the base. Also, now that I am back at my computer, pic related.

>>49706186
Right, got it.

I've asked an old friend to actually create our legion badges (+ the Black Suns).
She wants some compensation, which I'm willing to cover, but I want to make absolutely sure everyone agrees on the badges:

I. Bloodhounds | Collared dog with hackles raised
II. Crimson Warhawks | Black lightning bolt behind a white feather
III. Fists of Mars | Fist inside a cog, black and white
IV. Silver Spears | Crossed spears
V. Warp Raiders | 8 pointed spider web
VI. Storm Hammers | Thundering Hammer
VII. Judgement Bringers | Circular chain with a skull in the center
VIII. Void Lords | Halo around a dark moon (eclipse)
IX. Oathsworn | Winged apothecary prime helix, with pierced sword through it
X. Paladins of Kor | Lion Rampant
XI. Second Sons | Shield with a star in the center
XII. Angels of Light | Winged ankh
XIII. Sky Serpents | Circular quetzalcoatl
XIV. Behemoth Guard | Crimson nine pointed star
XV. Arms of Asura | Lotus made of 6 hand with flame at the center
XVI. Eyes of the Warmaster | Single, burning eye
XVII. Iron Hearts | Green heart with lightning bolts
XVIII. Undying Scions | Roaring panther's head
XIX. Negators | Woad blue triquetra
XX. Knights Exemplar | Crossed swords

Black Suns | Silver chalice with a crimson clawmark on it

Does everyone agree with these?

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>>49706223
The Black Suns insignia is approved of. Also, posting Sergeant.

>>49706223
Sounds good to me. Those are what everyones agreed to.

How many successor chapters are there?

>>49706718
Hard to say for sure. Not too many legions have successors. If I remember correctly, the Fists of Mars and the Warhawks are still legions, maybe there are more. I do know for sure the Angels of Light have chapters.

>>49706718
>>49707278
The Storm Kingdoms are hugely divided on the issue of the Codex Astartes (it's one of the reasons why they are the Storm KingdomS rather than Storm Kingdom). Some regions are held by multiple compliant successor Chapters, some regions are held by successor Chapters that pick and choose their CA rules and are way beyond compliant number, and others are held by Storm Hammers legionaries that think the whole thing is stupid and don't follow the Codex at all.

The Sky Serpents have 'Tzolkin' chapters, which are essentially successors, except they ultimately answer to the greater body of the Sky Serpents Legion. The Undying Scions do something similar.

Good morning sempais

>>49705953
>LA: BG monsterous creatures gain IWND or +1 to IWND rolls if they already have it.
There literally are no monstrous creatures in the 30k codex, so this rule does nothing.
Leave IWND to marcus, give Gengrat something that makes his vehicles *different* rather than *better* to signify the fact that he's a tinkerer.

>> The Voices
Maybe something akin to Slaves to the Voices from crimson slaughter?
>roll a d3 every turn
>1. Spirit Beacon: Gain Shrouded
>2. Beast Form: Change type to beast
>3. Incorporeal Bodies: 3+ invulnerable save and Rending

Buffing it up to something a primarch might have, maybe

>Roll a d3 when Gengrat takes an unsaved wound.
1. Mechadendrite Fury: Gain +d6 Attacks (doesn't stack)
2. Beast of Terrodyne: Unit's type changes from Infantry to Monstrous Creature
3. Gain Rending special rule and +2S (doesn't stack)

>>49706223
Looks right to me.
Spend money at your own discretion though.

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>>49704657
Just gonna bump this here. I want to get some more thoughts before I start writing about it.

>>49709676
I'd been thinking he should give a bonus to any automata in the army.

I'm not feeling the table thing, in part because rending and MC won't do much for a primarch.

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>>49709826
>Age: Young (1 - 2,500 years old)
>Current Archon: Fallen Craftworlder/Exodite/Corsair Prince
>Archon Personality: Ambitious, Flamboyant
>Kabal Origin: Dark Eldar Pirates
Kabal Demeanor: Purity Above All - A particular hatred of psykers, for the attention from She Who Thirsts that they bring.
>Kabal Flaw: Eldar Arrogance
>Territory Location: Docking Spires
>Territory Condition: Mandrake-infested
>Tactics: Performance Art: Poison
>Resources: Weapon Forge
>Signature Weapon: Splinter Weapons
>Currently Not Betraying: Another kabal
>Goals: Defending the Kabal's Traditional Territory

So he's a young, ambitious Corsair pirate leader with a touch of flamboyant style. He absolutely loathes psykers and, consequently, the craftworld fools and their new Empire of corpses. He believes strongly in traditional D-Eldar values of raping and pillaging, which the new Empire is leaving behind, and is angry that other Kabals are leaving the good life and joining the witch bastards. Hates that filthy Mon'Keigh are allowed into Commoragh with impunity and HATES that one of them is trying to take on the aspect of Khaine.

Basically he's a young alt-right eldar who posts on the webway equivalent of /pol/ to whine about degenerates. This idea is potentially hilarious.

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>>49709935
>>Territory Location: Docking Spires
>>Territory Condition: Mandrake-infested
This is potentially cool too. He'd maybe live in a section of the Dark City which was abandoned when the Deldar rejoined the resurgene Empire. What was once a thriving docking spire complex is now abandoned and infested with cannabalistic half-mad mandrakes lurking in the shadows. He is surrounded by a constant reminder of what once was, and is no longer.

>>49709935
I'm imagining an Eldar Kylo Ren.

If we want to go full-on edgy mary-sue mode he can be the kid of Vect and a craftworlder.

>>49710028
>Kylo Ren.
Off topic but I really really liked Kylo Ren as a character. He's not some turbo-badass with obscene power, he's a young kid who wasn't trained properly and isn't as good as he wants to be, but has to pretend he's powerful or be consumed. I also really liked the idea of a darkside character being "tempted" by the light side and him struggling to suppress his conscience.

Episode 7 was a good movie.

>>49710028
Yes. One of Vect's sex slaves. He hates Vect, in part out of loyalty to his mother, but also thinks Vect has the right idea and the craftworlders are insane.

>>49709978
>>49709935
This sounds great.

As far as he's concerned, it was psykers that ruined everything in the first place and thus the true eldar Empire should emerge from Commoragh.
Khaine is dead. Ynnead is a distant phantasm. Cegorach isn't worthy of the title.
The Dark Eldar have it right, no gods, no kings, only Eldar.

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>>49709935
>>49709978
>>49710028
>>49710160
>>49710221
>unwanted Eldar whoreson grows up into bitter neckbeard with regressive beliefs
O i am laffin

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>>49710304
Does he get killed by Demon Prince Saul then?

Actually, speaking of Eldar, have we touched on Altansar?

In M41, Maugan Ra goes and pulls the craftworld out of the Eye and after that, they're all spoopy. It's implied they struck a deal with Ynnead.

Anyways, it seems to me it would be pretty badass to have them suddenly pop up in the middle of the Dark Imperium and either evacuate the craftworld or make a dash towards a massive Webway portal.

>>49710160
>turbo power
Idk man. That scene where he stops the blaster bolt and that rebel scum pilot was i thought an awesome indication of pure power.

Episode 7 was a good movie. I only had 1 or 2 issues with it and considering how big and well established star wars is that's a feat within itself.

>>49710405
We have not. Any ideas for them?

>>49710405
Isnt Ynnead the eldar god that isnt born until the last eldar dies? The one thats prophesied to kill slannesh. If so how could they strike a deal with it.

>>49711194
Yeah, but it's in the codex. 1 it's a rumor, 2 the warp doesn't quite work in a linear way. Slaneesh has always been part of the pantheon, right?

>>49711098
I'm thinking they can do a run towards a Webway gate, since no way they'd be allowed to survive in the Dark Imperium space.

I'll write up an outline later.

Last thread someone mentioned that the various mortal armies hadn't been fleshed out.
So here's a force.

>The Jantine Fortressmen
Operating out of Forgespace in the Tempestus gap, the Jantine Fortressmen are a force of combat engineers specializing in the rapid transformation of ordinary planets into self-sufficient fortress-worlds. Their method of operation is deceptively simple: they are deployed to worlds within the Gap that are either of strategic significance or will soon come under threat.
To this end, they have a wide variety of specialized equipment, from a bewildering array of pre-fab fortifications to super-heavy engineering vehicles to the fearsome 'drop citadels', massive forts equipped with over-sized grav-chutes and ablative plating meant to be deployed directly from orbit. However, the true secret of their effectiveness is their logistical genius and powerful propaganda machine. The Jantine are experts in mobilizing every available resource, co-opting the rulership and population of the worlds they land on in the transformation of their planet. The efforts of millions of conscript laborers scar the surface with trench lines, dig massive agri-vaults miles below the surface, build and upgrade weapons factories and fill the orbits with mines.
Despite their skill, most Jantine-held worlds are over-run. Either they are attacked before the Fortressmen can start their transformation in earnest, or repeated Chaos attacks wear down the defenses over decades. But some hold, becoming outposts of Forgespace within the gap for use as staging grounds in further operations. And even those that fall make the enemy bleed for every millimeter.

Thoughts?

>>49711487
Nice. A cool twist on traditional 'hold the line' regiments.

Solid.

>>49711862
Have another one. Same region, different side.

>The Howling Swarm
A Slaaneshi warband operating within the Tempestus Gap. In a variation of normal Slaaneshi operating procedure, the Howling Swarm makes heavy use of cybernetic and genetic augmentation, trying to achieve heights and types of sensation impossible for unmodified humans. Skin-grafts with massively denser nerve endings, eyes that see magnetic fields, internal drug reservoirs, dozens of tentacles for arms, yard-long cyberdongs, every day brings some new atrocity against decency and sense. Many members of the warband are no longer even vaguely human.
As a result, they have close ties with the Dark Mechanicus, volunteering themselves as guinea pigs and fighting for Dark-Mech interests in exchange for new implants. The majority of the warband give praise to the Omnissiah alongside Slaanesh, and most even see them as the same entity, in the same way OU orthodoxy held that the Big E and the Big O were the same entity. After all, both seek the same goal- the transcendence of the limits of the human mind- and, for the Howling Swarm at least, the same methods.
Links with some more unscrupulous DEldar Haemonculi are also rumored, but not confirmed.
In battle, the Howling Swarm tend to use sensory-overload weaponry. Hallucinogenic gases, mind-affecting magnetic beams, blinding lasers, seizure-inducing stroboscopes, eardrum- and mind-shattering sonic weaponry, and the simple overwhelming terror of their inhuman appearance, carefully sculpted for maximum psychological effect. Once incapacitated, the enemy force is collected for forcible induction, sacrifice, or sale as slaves. Against enemies hardened against these weapons, the Howling Swarm relies on its heavy augmentation to carry the day in close combat, backed up by swarms of lesser cultists/meat-shields.
If these don't work either, they will generally retreat, muttering that they probably wouldn't have made good playthings anyway.

Thoughts?

>>49712530
That's pretty clever, I like it.

>>49713235
Have a third.

>The Rhadam Raiders
A formation of rough riders operating on and around the outskirts of the Unyielding Vigil, recruited from the death-world Rhada. The Rhadam Raiders are specialized as a stay-behind force, placed on planets in danger of falling to the enemy in order to wage guerilla war against the occupiers. Raider units are typically divided up and attached to other regiments to act as advisors and training cadre, teaching other forces their ways of war. For a full regiment of Raiders to be deployed as a single unit is generally a sign that something special is being planned.
In addition to their tactics, the Rhadam Raiders are noted for their animals. Genetically engineered to survive in any environment, half boar and half rat, their mounts are a far cry from ordinary horses, twice as smart and twice as vicious. They are capable of eating almost any organic matter, and give human-edible milk. With their mounts, the Rhadam are capable of operating for extended periods of time in the most desolate environments.
Despite their undeniable use, the Rhadam Raiders sit uneasy in the overall Vigil force; although their uses are undeniable, their tactics fit poorly with the overwhelming siege focus of the Undying Scions, and as a result Raider detachments tend to drift from one command to another. This lack of consistent oversight leads to discipline problems, which further encourages Vigil generals to pass them off like a hot potato as soon as possible. As a result, the Raiders tend to wind up assigned to some of the furthest and most desolate corners of the Vigil- which is where their tactics work best.

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>>49713495
>Half boar
>Half rat

Oh look, RG&M stuff.

>>49705421
http://menducia.atspace.com/primarchs/XI.html

This is fascinating.

>>49713867
Interesting, but I don't think I fully get it.

>>49713867
It's relating the primarchs to tarot cards.

poorly.

>>49714066
I think the personalities match up pretty well, even if the actual interactions between each other don't.

Though, I suppose in a certain way it's like tarot reading itself. They're all so generic and inclusive that realistically you could almost apply any one to any other.

>>49714130
nevermind the fact that specifically mentions astrological connections to the primarchs and this doesn't take any account into that.

Horus is supposed to be Sagittarius, but he's listed as Aries.

It's just lazy bs.

>>49713495
I'm liking these concepts a lot.

>>49711418
So how about some time in M39, Maugan Ra senses a shift in the æther. He informs the Eldar Empire of his gambit and asks for their support.
The majority think he's insane, after all, how could a craftworld survive thousands of years in the warp.
However, Mymera, Lugganath, and Bel Tan are unwilling to abandon fellow eldar and volunteers appear from many craftworlds.
Several harlequin troupes also throw their support behind Maugan Ra.
Rangers and Harlequins scour the Webway for gates that will be of use, and manage to secure a massive gate a reasonable distance from the Eye itself.
If Altansar can make the dash, then the entire craftworld can be transported to the domain of the Empire.
The challenge is getting there.

>>49715416
Projections show that Eldar casualties will be massive if they just go barging in there so they devise a plan to trick the Jade Empire and Storm Kingdoms to strike into the Hunting Grounds and Imperium. They could also try getting the Vigil and Forgespace to go on a rampage, but I think that would run a substantial risk of having some sort of impact on the Eldar Empire.
So the Mon Keigh are lured into a substantial engagement with the forces of the Dark Imperium, leaving a burning path through the Warmaster's domains.
Thinking this a precursor to a crusade, the Warmaster pulls forces from around the northern Imperium.

This leaves the space around the Eye relatively undefended. Thus it is that when Maugan Ra drags Altansar from the grasp of the warp, no substantial fleet stands between them and the webway gate they seek. It is by no means an easy flight, as they are pursued by the forces of the Silver Spears and the Dark Imperial Navy, but they make it to the gate and vanish.

I'm thinking the world that has the webway gate is a hiveworld or something and the Eldar fight a big battle there to clear it, and the battle is on a really tight timetable since they didn't want to alert the Dark Imperium. So they've got a week at the most to clear the way for Altansar, otherwise Altansar will be trapped and them along with it.
I'm also picturing some pretty cool void battles.

>>49715416
>>49715529
This sounds pretty awesome. I hate to impose, but do you think we could devise some way for the Kabal we made to participate?

>>49705953
Version 2?

>Sire of the Behemoth Guard
LA:BG Vehicles have Power of the Machine Spirit.
i can't believe we didnt think of this before. It fits his fluff well.

>> Cyberthuegist Master
>Buffing battle automata
I'm cool with this i suppose, but imo Primarchs need to be best in their own legion armies. You shouldn't be forced to bring a second detatchment of mechanicus just to get one of the primarch's special rules to do anything.

>> Scrap Code Infection
Once per shooting phase in addition to shooting normally Gengrat can select one unit within 18". Roll to hit as normal, if the target is a vehicle, all of its weapons gain Gets Hot. Otherwise it must immediately take a pinning test.

>>Panopy of Battle
Confers a 2+ Armour Save and 3++ Invulnerable Save. In addition incorporates: A heavy flamer, plasma cannon, a mult-melta, and assault cannon. He may only fire one of these each turn.

>>49716501
Most definitely, though to be honest, I'm not quite sure how Kylo Trump would respond.
I think the Harlequins might apply pressure in the Dark City to keep the Negators busy and since these guys are pretty antagonistic to everyone they could probably raid the Negators without causing too much trouble for the rest of the Dark Eldar. Though this seems like something that could easily bite everyone in the ass.

How about they challenge the Mon Keigh King to some sort of challenge. For the plan to rescue Altansar to work, they can't go raiding in the East, since the East needs to be applying pressure and distracting the Western Imperium, but perhaps a joint hunting expedition against Orkz or Nids could work out in their favor?
Sort of a "I think you're a fraud and I have a bunch of denizens of the dark city who support me. Do something impressive and maybe I'll respect you."

The other option is a gang war. I mean Kabals regularly fight one another and the Negators are going to be part of that, ne?
So what if Vect sparks a major gang war with the intention of eliminating some of his rivals. This being Vect, he's too canny to do it directly, so he gets his son to do it. On the other side, you've got Lady Malys stirring trouble at the behest of Cegorach, since she gave her heart to him.
The result is that some livestock are purposefully mishandled and escape from the arenas even as the Kabals go to war. Everything is in chaos and Aodhan is distracted by a thousand shiny things as Kabals on both sides call for his aid.

This Kabal is one of the ones arrayed against the Negators.

The Harlequins are there too, in part because they're trying to turn Aodhan into Khaine, but also because Harlequins fighting Wyches sounds awesome.
(OOOOH OOOOH AND DUKE SLISCUS IS OUT HELPING ALTANSAR!!)

>>49716683

When the Warmaster calls for Aodhan to strike the craftworld, figuring that the Negators will be pretty quick to show up given their ability to use the Webway, he finds that they're embroiled in a massive gang war and can't immediately send aid. Aodhan does try to send forces, in part because Pheonix Lords > Archons and in the process, Vect ensures that the right Archons are taken out, strengthening his hold on Commoragh, which, thanks to Aodhan had slipped some over time.

>>49716590
I'm liking this.
>The Automata thing. Oh! I was imagining that he'd come with a cortex controller standard and thus allow Cybernetica units to be taken as Elites and HS. Also been playing around with a Behemoth Guard rite of war which allowed them to take cybernetica. So that was the logic there.

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>>49716683
>Kylo Trump
mfw

>>49716752
in that case, cybertheurgy is awesome.

Things we need

>Inslavers

>Xenos coalition predating the Tau Empire

>Genestealer empire

>Chaos Squat empire

>>49716806
How about Dravos Vect?

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>>49716831
>Inslavers
I dont know what that is

>Xenos coalition predating the Tau Empire
I vote we make the Hrud a bigger thing.

>Genestealer empire
We have one but it never got wiki'd. There is a planet called Cocytus in the far far far galactic east where a relatively large number of Oathsworn were hidden during the REDACTED snafu. Only Alexios knew the planet even existed and he's fucking dead, so nobody knows about Cocytus except the Oathsworn and humans who livethere. Our Tyranids come in smaller and more scattered waves, mostly exploratory feelers, as the astropathic signal in our milky way isn't quite as bright. A genestealer precursor fleet comes to Cocytus and their cultists quickly take over. Genestealer Astartes cultist-doctors and shit ruling a secret planet.

>Chaos Squat empire
I am one billion percent on board with having Squats

>>49716590
>LA:BG Vehicles have Power of the Machine Spirit.
Genius.

> Cyberthuegist Master
I think he was meant to have a rite to take them? or they were part of his list. If not, 100% agree he shouldnt have to take another detachment just to play normally.

>>49716683
>Kylo Trump
Wot

>>49716831
wot

>>49716894
>Squats
whhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhy

I feel like you guys do a lot of great work, but its only ever in threads and once the thread dies its gone forever.

You should consider fixing that.

Keep up the good work though.

>>49716683
I'm not sure if Vect Jr. Would see Aodhan as the kind of enemy that he'd want to challenge. That definitely wouldn't cause him to experience the right kind of emotions, and he knows that he'd probably beat him in a stand up fight. Maybe they take the opportunity to flood Aodhan's digs with mandrakes or give all his psyker consorts some kind of psychoactive poison that makes them vomit daemons everywhere.

>>49716894
>>Inslavers
>I dont know what that is
Google.

Then be afraid. Very afraid

>>49717046
I'm saying things we need. Are you dense?

>>49717396
A: Inslavers aren't a thing, Enslavers are.
B: We don't NEED anything, those are merely things we COULD add.
C: Genestealer stuff has already been worked on
D: Why would we want squats let alone chaos squats.
E: What are you dense?

>>49717396
>>49716894
>>49716831
It's "enslavers" with an E. They're psychic parasites that live in the warp and can take over whole planets with little effort. Usually the only cure is an exterminatus. It's worth mentioning that they're the reason the Old Ones are extinct and the Necrons went to sleep.

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>>49717371
>Aodhan chillin with his squad in the dark city club
>two tau slave bitches under each arm
>drinking space drugs and tripping off of soul shard dust
>two if his crew are dueling each other to death just because they're bored
>bunch of eldar homies hangin out doing space opium
>horrible mutant slaves brings Aodhan a plate of drinks
>he shares with the whole club because he's Aodhan and Aodhan's crew drinks for free
>everyone turns into a horrible tentaclebeast
>Aodhan has to kill them all with his bare hands
>bursts out the club wall because fuck doors
>covered in blood and wall dust
>Kylo Tr'ump and his dock gangers waiting outside with their space AK-47s
>"You pissed off the wrong gangers now, Mon'Keigh Kong!

Cast it as a movie with 80s Arnold and I'd watch that movie

>>49717424
man why the fuck wouldn't you want squats they're awesome

>>49717424
No, but you're a dick

>>49717465
>you're wrong
>point that out
>Im the dick
riiiight.

Enslavers aren't something that should be included before expanding on the Hrud.

They are totally boring, literally unable to think beyond "open portal to make more enslavers" I don't know why youd want to include them.

>>49717462
I'd watch it.

>>49717046
Yeah, my logic on the cybertheurgy is that he's got a cybernetica cortex standard and therefore you can automatically take Cybernetica in HS and Elites.

Outside of Gengrat, access to cybernetica units comes in two primary forms:
First off, you've got a special Praetor upgrade and a Consul upgrade.

The Praetor upgrade is like Warsmith and it gives you a servo-arm and cybernetica cortex.

The Consul is Technoccultist or Machine Mystic or something and gives you:
+Cortex Controller
+Servo Arm
+Cybertheurgy
+ML1 with a power generated from the Technomacy table

So both of these would allow you to take Thallax, Vorax, and Castellax natively.

Similarly, I'm imagining a Rite of War that's a souped up Brethren of Iron the same way that the Dark Angels Ravenwing is a souped up Sky Hunter Phalanx.

So basically I'm thinking it'd look something like:
+Can take Castellax and Vorax as non-compulsary troops, Domitars and Aratalax as Elites, Vultarax as FA, and Thanatars as HS
+IWND FOR EVERYONE (or all robutts, anyways)
+Legion inductees rule on those fuckers
+Anybody with a cybernetica cohort can do cybertheurgy and all techmarines can take them for +15 points
-Must have 1 dude with a cybernetica cortex for every three cybernetica units
-Must have more units with LA (Behemoth Guard) than cybernetica units
-Must take a Technoccultist
For the record, I'm thinking Behemoth Guard LA rules look something like:
+Inviolate Armor (-1 Strength to incoming fire)
+Gun them down! (Within 12", all guns have pinning)
-In the Company of Behemoths (Half the army must have either an AV value or be an MC)


A second RoW would be something vehicle focused, Behemoth Guard Raiding Force?

>>49717046
Wangsty Kylo + Alt-Right Trump MAKE COMMORAGH GREAT AGAIN

>>49717371
That could work a bit better, yeah, particularly since it allows him to make the case for zero toleration for psykers.

>>49717424
>>49717462
>Xenos
DESU I don't see the appeal of Squats.

Enslavers fuck yeah.

Slaught. We need more of them.
Rak'Gol.

>That movie
I'd watch the fuck out of it. It'd be like Kung-Fury.

>>49717568
To continue Behemoth Guard shit, I really like the idea that they have a special table of upgrades you can apply to their vehicles. Basically allow you to make any crazy tank you can dream up and field it, like a Kustom Battlewagon ++.
Wanna loot a Dracosan? Done.
Chimera? You can do that too.
Rhino with an open topped section that takes the transport capacity up to 15? Sure.
Fast Goliath Trucks? Why not!

Set it up so it's a bit more expensive than normal for balance.

So far as unique units, I'm imagining Thrallmasters, which are kind of like side-graded Technmarine covanents. You can have up to three Thrallmasters per slot and they start off with like 5 basic bitch servitors. You can then upgrade the servitors with things like frenzon injectors, power-flails, neuro-talons, armored carapaces, etc etc. The result would be kind of like that build your own Ogryn unit from the Cult/Militia list. So you can have a horde of cheap, poorly armored arco-flagellants, or a couple of ultra-tough gene-bulked Ogryn Charonite types.

And then once they go heretic, you can add in some other nasty warp-related upgrades!


Oh, and on their rite of war, I think there should be a priviso to allow them to take daemon engines and abomination engines once the heresy hits. That way you can have maulerfiends and the like, since in this universe, the Behemoth Guard are the ones who invent them in the first place. That or they just get added into the traitor lists or something.

>>49717707
Maybe not as loose as you're implying, but yeah, more tank wargear in their ROW is a good idea.

>unique units
oh boy here we go

>>49717707
>build-a-tank
im sorry but thats just damn near impossible to balance properly. You could have it so they can choose a few extra options, but much like the Ork ones they almost need to be overpriced, and still have only 3-5 options.

>Unique units
They are pretty unique just by having Techno grap already, do they need more? And when they go full chaos, they would be the creators of stuff like obliterators, forge fiends and such. Honestly I don't think they need extra. They would be the creators of half the 'unique' stuff from canon.

>>49717948
I was thinking in terms of the way that every unit gets 2-3 unique units during the heresy.

>>49717707
Well, the Slaught live in Calixis-sector. The Black Suns largely let them be, as long as they don't get too aggressive in their food gathering. A few thousand a year on X planet is okay, but half the hive is not.

>>49718009
But wouldnt forge fiends, maulers, obliterators, be more representative of their mixing of technolgy and daemons?

If your primarch were a pokemon, which one would he be?

>>49718036
>>49717948
>unique units
Most definitely, but that's something they pick up as the heresy progresses. At the start of the heresy and during the crusades, they're known for their servitor hordes, pimp wagons, and robots.

Later on the servitor hordes become daemon hosts, more often than not.

But yeah, you're right too. I'm thinking in terms of the standard 30k Crusade army list, while obliteraters read as 40k to me. And I'm really not sure how we want to represent that transition from 30k Crusade List to Codex: CSM, know what I mean?

I think we'll just leave that for later.

>issues with looted wagons
That's a good point.

>>49715416
Have a fourth!

>The Bloody Rags
A Khornate warband operating in the Tempestus gap. They are notable for their evangelical fervor; where most Khornate warbands will simply slaughter indiscriminately and only recruit opportunistically when raiding, the Bloody Rags make concerted efforts to recruit as many people as possible. This process naturally still involves mass slaughter; the entire population is forced into gladiatorial combat until the survivors, soaked in the blood of family, friends, countrymen- generally somewhere between a third and a tenth of the people who went in- are inducted into the Bloody Rags. In this way, they have swollen to immense size, holds of their slaughter-ships bursting with billions of cultists.

On the battlefield, their most distinctive feature are their pure white uniforms. Whatever material they're made out of, it only stains in blood; the mud of the battlefield falls off it cleanly, but blood will never come out. How stained a uniform is forms a semi-formal rank system among the Bloody Rags; the more stained, the more status.

As the existence of an actual uniform indicates, the Bloody Rags have a decent logistical base, although it strains under their ever-growing numbers. In addition to their uniform, each cultist gets at least a lasgun and a chainsword. Support weapons like heavy stubbers and missile launchers are reasonably commonplace, although the Bloody Rags eschew any indirect-fire weapons like Basilisks or mortars as a matter of principle. While the majority of the force is light infantry, there are decent-sized detachments of armored cavalry and aircraft with each raiding group. Notably, although they have the resources to mount a proper training program they do not do so, preferring to let battle sort out the wheat from the chaff.

(cont.)

>>49718241

In battle, while the Bloody Rags are as eager as any follower of Khorne to close to close range, they're not stupid about it. They make use of orbit-mobile tactics to flank entrenched positions, and in the charge use smokescreens and suppressing fire from support weapons to cover the advance.

Thoughts?

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>>49718205
Balthasar is Mightyena and then chaos turns him into Houndoom

Alexios is Ampharos

Oramar is mewtwo

>>49718251
That's hilarious. Is this the Warmaster's doing? A private venture on the part of a bored Behemoth Guard? (I'd suggest Iron Hearts, but they don't have a sense of humor.)

On an unrelated note, any ideas for cool planets to have the gate for Altansar on?

>>49718205
>>49718337
Xun = Sawk
Faustus = Lunastone
Demon Aodhan = Slaking
Raydon = Gengar

>>49718372
I have absolutely no idea what you find hilarious about the use of smokescreens and shuttles.

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>>49718512
>he doesnt get it

>>49718632
No, I don't.
Anyway!

>Oncolog Hermeticists
A force operating out of Forgespace in the Tempestus Gap. The Hermeticists are a specialized anti-Nurglite force. Where the NBC suits of the typical PDF or Guard regiment is bulky, restricts field of vision, makes it difficult to breathe, and chafes badly, the Hermeticists' 'iso-armor' makes use of some of the finest technology in the Forgespace to make it suitable for long-term wear. With its padding, lightweight alloy construction, wide-angle visor, fully sealed air supply, internal supply of liquid rations, and catheters, it is intended to be worn for weeks at a time without ever being taken off. Its sealant-resin layers even prevent small armor breaches from compromising the environmental integrity of the armor, and multiple layers of anti-corrosion coating protect the suit from Nurgle's many metallophages. In short, by almost totally isolating the wearer from the outside environment, the iso-armor removes Nurglite force's greatest advantage. It's not completely perfect, but it's the best you'll find short of Astartes.

In battle, the Hermeticists naturally use a fuckton of incendiary weapons. The flamer:lasgun ratio is higher than any other force in Forgespace, and hand flamers are the most common sidearm. Their doctrine emphasizes mobility and speed; fully mechanized and with significant air assets, they are generally able to outmaneuver the stereotypically slow and lumbering Nurglite forces, trapping them in pockets and annihilating them with massed artillery.

Notably, none of the Oncolog Hermeticists are actually from Oncolog anymore. A deep reprisal raid by Second Sons forces, in retaliation for daring to set themselves against Nurgle, destroyed Oncolog entirely. However, by then the concept had proven itself; new regiments were raised on a hundred worlds, collectively taking the name of Oncolog in remembrance.

>>49715529
So, as the distraction, the Eldar somehow get the the Sky Serpents to raid in force into the Hunting Grounds of Balthasar. Most likely some sort of projection that Balthasar is building up for an attack and that the best way to beat him is to strike before he can assemble his forces?

Towards this end, 5 Tzolkin, including the Storm Wolves, Blood Dragons, and the Talons of the Hydra, as well as numerous regiments of Auxiliae, including the Thule Rimeguard, Argon Apemen, Sobek (crocodiles?), and a sizable Taghmata drawn from Tindalos and Incaladion are dispatched.

The Storm Kingdoms send stuff too, but I'm not sure what they've got. Ravens of Morgas and Taranisian Guard?

These fleets make their way towards Karach.

What do they run into and what does the Warmaster redirect from the area around the eye to prepare for a major crusade?

>>49719065
>Their doctrine emphasizes mobility and speed
suggest changing to slow and methodical, as to not miss something that is going to spawn another plague because they were too concerned with going fast.

... and because it seems like everything anyone here writes about is speed and mobility.

>>49719107
Whats this about?

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>>49719143
GOTTA
GO
FAST

>>49719143
A two-pass method, perhaps; first slice apart the enemy with high-mobility warfare, then bring in the superheavies and massed Earthshakers to wipe the earth clean. Two separate specializations and doctrines within the same formation.

>>49719174
2 things, goes fast = spread disease
and again, literally every faction except those fortress dudes posted earlier and the judgement bringers (who are treated like a joke) say they go fast.

Can we please have a few dudes who aren't
AIRMOBILE HYPER FAST MOBILITY HOVERJETBIKEBOARDFLIERACESENCIRCLEMENTMASTERS

>>49719197
A point, a point. Hmm. Massed artillery, rocketry, and (to a lesser degree) air power to shatter enemy formations at long range, followed by infantry/armor sweeps to clean up the remainder, then engineering forces to do proper deep sterilization. Giant microwave/UV arrays, massive pyre-machines on superheavy tank chassis, millions of tons of sterilizing agents to blanket the earth. Thorough and unrelenting.
Yes, I like it.

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>>49705421

You forgot about the ants

>>49719275
>massed artillery
incidiary
>rocketry
with anti-virus gases
>air-power
who crop dust vaccines

>>49719143
The diversion campaign that the Eldar set up to divert the Dark Imperium's forces towards the Hunting Grounds so that Altansar can make a dash across the sector or what have you to a massive Webway portal.

>>49719197
On the subject of people who aren't GOTTA GO FAST, I've been trying to work out a guard regiment that the Jade Empire uses. Basically mortal garrison and siege troops. They're combat engineers who work closely with members of the Mechanicum. They're kind of like a defense oriented Death Korps of Krieg. Only catch is that I can't think of a good name (been thinking Egyptian theme) and I don't know how to sum up what they're designed to do in a succinct phrase.
I'll rework what I have on them tomorrow.

>The Thousand Kinds of Blindness
A Tzeentchian organization operating in the Tempestus gap. The Thousand Blindnesses operate effectively as two parallel, cooperating, but ultimately separate units.

The first is the cult network. Spread across a large number of worlds, the cults of the Thousand Blindnesses do all of the typical cult things: conversion, destabilization, etc. They are much more effective in this than the average cult, having access to off-world support networks and professional-grade training in infiltration, sabotage, and subversion. The general pattern of operations is to smuggle a few agents onto the planet, who then start exploiting pre-existing fault lines among the society to recruit and build up infrastructure.

Then there is the raider fleet, which is a bunch of warships and landers stuffed with troops. Beyond a couple of daemon-ships, nothing out of the ordinary.

When the time comes to take a world, both arms of the Thousand Blindnesses act simultaneously. As the raider fleet translates in-system, the cults on the ground kick off the revolution, inciting riots, sabotaging defense systems, and assassinating leadership. When the ships reach deployment range of the target planet, the defense is already in chaos; chaos which will not be helped by having ten million Chaos reavers dropped on it.

In battle, the Thousand Blindnesses make heavy use of compromising enemy command networks.. In addition to the normal tricks of compromising vox networks and issuing false orders, sorcery opens up many more options. Subliminal messaging, psychic mind control, shapeshifting doppelgangers, hallucinogens in the officer's mess; the possibilities are near-endless. Setting up these opportunities is one of the prime duties of the cult network pre-invasion; done well and thoroughly, and the Thousand Blindnesses can force the enemy to feed their forces into trap after trap until the soldiers mutiny.

(cont.)

>>49719451
>garrison and siege
so siege as in on the attack or siege as in meant to be able to hold out for a long time? If the latter you can sum them up nicely by calling them a PDF.

Its literally everything you want.

>>49719497
Among the petty powers of the Tempestus Gap, the Thousand Blindnesses have achieved a reputation for invincibility. In a sense, this is earned; nearly every offensive battle they have engaged in has been an overwhelming victory. However, this is because they choose their battles wisely. With the cult network providing detailed information and destabilizing defenses, the Thousand Blindnesses can choose when and where to fight with exquisite precision. The raider fleet never attacks a system unless it has already won.

Theologically, they view Tzeentch as a god of pointless change, meaningless change, the change of shifting static on a television screen. A god of Revolutions, named that because they go around in circles. That so many other followers of Tzeentch- and so many of his daemons, for that matter- fail to perceive this is the First Blindness. (Yes, they can name a thousand kinds of blindness. Being able to do so from memory is one of the tests of Grandmastery. The name is not (purely) fanciful.)

Thoughts?

>>49719553
The Reaver fleet sounds like something the Crimson Warhawks would be interested in beating down, after they reach there peak infamy ofcourse.

Otherwise it sounds cool. A faction that is just itself, I like the idea of them being a weird culty religion as well as being typical chaos cult.

I had a thought.
Without Magnus to fuck everything up, what happened to the Imperial Webway project?

>>49719197
Well, the Black Suns are pretty much the Imperial Guard of marines in their tactics. They hold the line until either side is at a breaking point. They have fliers and bikes, but those are scarcely useful in their defensive warfare, and as such, they focus on infantry and spezialice in melee (as they are horribly outnumbered most of the time, getting swarmed and forced to melee is considered an eventuality). So there are some Marines in addition to the Judgement Bringers wh don't go very fast, although they are a minor faction who aren't a direct threat to anyone.

>>49719658

Good point. Without the Webway distracting the Emperor he could have left Terra, set sail out to meet the Traitors personally and whipped the Warmaster so hard the Chaos Gods themselves would cringe.

>>49719658
>>49719712
Instead of Magnus fucking it up accidentally, Anshul could probably to it intentionally.

Speaking of Anshul, something about him bothers me. I remember someone saying Anshul is basically Magnus x 1.5 in terms of power. I think that's a bit rediculous, what's the justification for this?

>>49719658
Oramar.

Oramar happened

>>49719774

Magnus was almost a Daemon Prince already. It was described that he didn't even have the usual organs like lungs or a heart, his body being largely full of warp-stuff instead.

So either Anshul is basically a Daemon already or he isn't that powerful. Because at 1.5 Magnus, he's coming close to the Emperor in power (Magnus was the second most powerful Psyker ever after the Emperor), and could even feasibly fight the Emperor 1 on 1 psychically without a Chaos powerup.

>>49719806
Exactly my thoughts. From what I've gathered, I can only assume it's because Anshul is very weak physically, whereas Magnus is still pretty damn stronk. Even then 1.5 is waaaay too high.

>>49719806
>>49719849
While admittedly he might be too strong psychically, his initial concept was quite literally the phrase "phenomenal cosmic power". He was intended to be a psychic hulk. Damn near unparalleled mentally, very much meant to be the psychic equal to the Big E.

However, if Magnus is already roughly equal with the Big E, then he could use a power down.

>>49719887

Psychic equal to the Big E makes him practically unstoppable. Look at everything the Big E can do. Now imagine Anshul can do the same. He could create or extinguish the Astronomican (Imagine him extinguishing the Astronomican at the beginning of the Heresy and see the Imperials lose their shit almost immediately), obliterate whole armies with mind bullets, be second only to the Chaos Gods in power.

>>49719916
>Eliminate the Astronomican
Yes that happens
Yes they lose there shit
>Eliminate armies with mind bullets
Its almost like chaos might win the heresy!

You also seem to be contradicting this post
>>49719806
which claims Magnus could feasibly 1v1 the Emperor, which means he is near enough to equal that he could do the same stuff.

So whats the problem?

>>49719949

Why would the Emperor make a Primarch as strong as him? Does he want to be replaced or make himself obsolete?

>>49719916
Honestly apart from the Big E being 'the most powerful psyker ever' I don't know much about what he actually does with his powers.

I know he doesnt age, can change his appearance / height, and presumably has telekinesis. But no knowledge of actual feats he performs.

>>49719973
>Does he want to be replaced
>Magnus's purpose was to replace the Emperor on the Astronomicon
Ah... Yes?

>>49719975
Jesus. For anyone like me, I found
https://www.reddit.com/r/respectthreads/comments/2jxqaq/respect_the_god_emperor_of_mankind_40k/?st=iu3wki1p&sh=ec5558f4
Which details specific feats of the Emperor.
At this point it seems totally impossible for Horus to have got as far as he did, likewise we just need to hand wave away how the Warmaster actually managed to kill the Emperor. The mother trucker is as OP as they come.

>>49719984

Magnus was not stronger than the Emperor. Making something stronger than you is almost always a bad idea.

>>49720050
>The Emperor
>Never had a bad idea
You don't say.

Ultimately the point is that, in my opinion, having a Primarch that's a (considerably) more powerful psyker than Magnus, is super wanky. I feel that if he was, the Emperor would have put a stop to it long before Nikaea.
Anshul is IA's Magnus, I don't feel he should be Magnus++.

>>49720194
I think I agree. He doesn't need to be more powerful, if we can describe him just being pure force. I think it'd be easier if Magnus had rules/stats or was actually comparable to the Emperor in any measurable way.

>>49720231
Lorgar has stats, right? The (human) psyker power raking is:
1. Emperor
2. Magnus
3. Malcador
4. Lorgar

Could even be that I'm remembering incorrectly and Lorgar is in place 3.

>>49720264
But that doesn't provide a sense of scale or magnatude (at least to me).

Its more or less the same as saying
Primarch: Str6
Ogryn: Str5
Marine: Str4
Guardsman: Str3

Where a Primarch has only x2 the number but a marine is meant to have the strength of 10 men. But an Ogryn isn't notably more powerful than an Astartes and certainly isn't 100 times the strength of normal people.

Perhaps a bad example, but at least demonstrates the issue that the gaps can be large or small.

>>49720288
Yeah, that's fair I suppose. But in-game stats are completely different from fluff strength.

>>49720298
Yeah it wasnt a great example, but I don't know of any examples in fluff that worked as well.

>>49720327
On a different note, did you ever get a response from that artist on dA?

>>49720367

Has the Drawfag come back with another Primarch Portrait?

>>49720367
Negative.

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>>49720437
Not yet, but we are waiting patiently.
Anyone you're looking forward to in particular?

>>49720467

I want to see what kind of thing he eventually comes up for for the Warmaster. A Helmet? A Blank Face? A Self-Censored Portrait?

>>49720496
The Warmaster is the only one people couldn't agree on. The only things known about him are the grey skin and the orange eyes.

>>49720515

I like the idea that no-one knows what the hell he looks like. That he's utterly faceless.

>>49720541
Meh, not really. I like the idea of him being faceless in the setting, but I still think we should have a good idea of who he is.

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As the person who has designed a lot of Anshul's look and feel and such, I don't think he should be the Emperor's psychic equal. The Emperor had to dupe all four Chaos Gods to get to where he is.

Is he '1.5 Magnuses?' I dunno, I find it hard to determine exactly what a 'Magnus' is as a measurement. I definitely have a pretty concrete idea of the kind of things Anshul could pull off (i.e. he's more than a match for any Alpha-Plus), but I'm not sure what kind of power Magnus can summon.

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Oh, and I'm making a thing.

>>49716894
>Oathsworn getting their genes etolen or fucked with by anyone, much less a a xeno

For one Astartes are immune to the genestealer cult shtick. For two, if anyone eas going to fuck the tyranids up srven god damn ways to Sunday, it would be the people who are masters or bio warfare and invented the destroyer corps to deal with xenos.

>>49720689
That'll be pretty convenient.

>>49720678
Yeah, there isn't a comprehensive list on the feats of Magnus. I'll see what I can find.

>>49719366
Theyre in the heart of the dark imperium wouldnt the warmaster wiped them out because of the danger they could become once they get better FTL

>>49720829
>>49720678
Alright, I found someone who has doon a pretty good summary on some of the impressive shit Magnus has done.
http://comicvine.gamespot.com/forums/battles-7/magnus-the-red-vs-darth-sidious-1636548/

How would this compare to Anshul?

>>49720750
That's a good point. It might be that the Coctys Oathsworn found the genestealers infesting an outlying world or something and decide to do some experiments. Like Krieger Ant level experiments and realize they may well have found a to fight chaos. The result is a mini Oathsworn hive fleet or something.


Also, why doesn't Alexios recall them?

>>49721092
It's not like the Warmaster can see the future, and I'd imagine that pacificus is lightly defended at best because the vast majority of threats to the Dark Imperium come from the east.

>>49721539
the imperial reports on the this xenos species stated that that if they were to get FTL and actually want to leave their territories they could become a major threat with their proximity to terra.
Wish i had the report on me it went into detail more.

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>>49721307
I think that sounds about right, I think. There's no reason for Anshul to be any more powerful than Magnus if Magnus can turn an entire ocean to acid in an instant and decimate a Legion WHILE soloing its Primarch.

More Telepathica stuff. Posting it as it progresses so people can cut in with suggestions.

>>49721450
>Mini Oathsworn hivefleet

God I don't even know if you care about canon or even respecting it.

>>49721606
Did you see the things posted about Asdrubael Junior?

>>49722502
What are you talking about?

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So like nobody actually thinks anshul should be stronger than the emperor... r-right?

>>49722924

>>49709935
>>49709978
>>49717462

>>49722502
Eldar /pol/ack? Yeah I saw it, it seems like a pretty cool idea.

>>49722948
I don't think so.

Though I can never quite get a full bead on the Emperor's power. I feel like power creep has made the Emperor's actual feats that we know of sort of meager. It used to be that you could only see him doing something as impressing of mind controlling a country, but now every Alpha-Plus psyker can apparently dominate a entire worlds.

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>>49722948
Hopefully not, no. The Emperor should always be psyker numero uno.

>>49722958
Hilarious, but the Dark Elder are the race I know the absolute least about. Like, gonna be honest, I had to look up who Asdrubael Vect even was. It's not that I don't like them, it's just that I don't really care.

>>49723053
Anything you want to know specifically?

Also, does anyone know if the Dark Eldar path books by Andy Chambers are any good?

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So what do the daemon primarchs look like?

>>49723334
I guess my biggest question would be about Dark Eldar society itself. How do they work? All I know about them is that they keep slaves and like bondage, while sitting in their city in the webway.

>>49723375
Big, mean and ugly most likely. I know Bathasar is a red werewolf looking bastard.

>>49723446
An integral part of Dark Eldar society is their need to drink souls in order to satiate Slaanesh so it doesn't eat their own souls. The best way to do this, I guess, is to feed off of pain. For this reason they go out into realspace to pillage and capture slaves for torture. Now, in Commoragh each Dark Eldar is looking to stab someone in the back to increase their standing in whatever organisation they are a part of, but in realspace this almost never happens. All Commorites need soulstuff, and they all work together to gather slaves to avoid being eaten by Slaanesh. I'll go further into their antics in Commoragh in my next post.

>>49723446
>>49723675
Every single emotion an Eldar feels automatically and instantly makes Slaanesh stronger. If an Eldar is happy, or sad, or scared, or proud, Slaanesh gets stronger. If an Eldar dies, Slaanesh straight up consumes their soul and molds it into his being.

Ever heard the phrase "feed a cold, starve a fever?" Well the Eldar and Deldar disagree on whether Slaanesh is a cold or a fever.

Craftworld Eldar solve this problem by deliberately avoiding all emotion using the disparate teachings of the Aspect temples. They also trap the souls of Eldar dead in soulstones before Slaanesh can consume them. They seek to starve Slaanesh of power and keep their souls locked away so he can't have them.

Dark Eldar, on the other hand, choose to overfeed slaanesh with the emotions, pain, and eventually the lives of captured slaves. Slaanesh doesn't think they're as tasty as eldar, but the Deldar get so damn many of them that Slaanesh's hunger is sated. They seek to keep Slaanesh so well fed that they can go unnoticed.

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>>49718205
I think this is appropriate.

It would have been too easy to just say Persian.

>>49723375
We've discussed Enoch in some detail--he's a man of clay and metal. When he moves, the dried clay cracks and the magma beneath surges forth to fill the space. It's like continental drift on the Thing or something.

Anshul just looks like Anshul but scary, I think.

Gengrat hasn't really been discussed in all that much detail. Personally I like the idea of him being made of a million little machines kind of like the machine god in the Matrix. He's constantly shifting and rippling and the machines aren't actually his body, rather he's a spirit that possesses machines. Diabolos Ex Machina.

>>49723375
Whoally shit.

They're making Magnus' daemon prince model before his standard Primarch model?

>>49724483
GW is making his 40k Daemon Prince version before Forge World does the pre-Daemon Prince version. Yeah.

>>49723375
Enoch: Hulking man of rock and clay, constantly oozing boiling pitch from the various fissures that scrawl across his skin.

The Warmaster: Dunno lol. I imagine him looking like the most 'standard' daemon primarch. Like a shadowy, insubstantial version of Be'lakor.

Anshul: Has an indeterminate number of arms that seems to constantly change, blue skin with a multichromatic tint, third eye tattoo is now actual third eye.

Gengrat: Covered in thousands of flowing mechandrites, part flesh and part machine. Super big, probably the tallest daemon primarch.

Aodhan: Not sure if he counts. Bigger, bronze, and on fire.

Kashaln: His normal self, but bigger, with six arms and a long, serpentine tongue. Possibly has horns.

Balthasar: Big red werewolf-y looking guy.

>>49724625
You forgot the vertical third eye, but yes.

>>49724625
And Saul?

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>>49724625
Daemon prince Warmaster could be some superspooky mix of Slenderman and the Silence from Doctor Who.

Except, you know, without the 20th century suit.

>>49724643
I don't know exactly, but I ASSUME he's like a huge armored ghoul blazing with radioactivity.

>>49724956
If I have understood correctly, he is mostly if not fully skeletal.

>>49721623
Yeah thats way over board.

>>49721606
The custodes shouldnt be below. The telepathica. They should be in line withit, tjey would remain an independent group.

>>49721623
>God I don't even know if you care about canon or even respecting it.

I 100% don't and I would hope that's the general opinion in these threads. 40k is a goofy nonsense setting and so is this.

>>49725459
If its not worthy of respect its hardly worthy of imitation and thats what we are doing here. You cant have it both ways.

>>49725459
Bro if you hate 40k why are you here

>>49725617
>If its not worthy of respect its hardly worthy of imitation
I'm not sure I really agree with that. Sometimes it's fun to just play in the dirt.

>>49725671
>Bro if you hate 40k why are you here
There's a huge array of opinions between hating something and respecting it

>>49725699
This is just negativity for the sake of it.
Im out.

C'mon guys, wtf. If you don't like someone's suggestion, just say that. Don't immediately start asking him what he's doing here. That's just completely counter productive.

>>49725699
If you don't respect 40k how can you respect this? If you dont respect AI how can you be relied on for quality content. Or feed back.

>>49725817
Theres a difference between saying you dont like X and saying btw your project is akin to playing in dirt

>>49725847
It's not about respect, it's about enjoying it. He can still enjoy the setting while also not treating it like an infallible gospel. If he wants to pitch an idea, look at it for it's own merits not for how it fits the existing canon.

>>49725868
Alexios has, for the most part, put out quality ideas. If that's what he thinks is the fictional equivalent of playing in dirt, that's his prerogative. I for one kind of agree. 40k is good, but it's also often very silly. There's no harm in accepting it's very far from the height of literature.

>>49719598
Thanks.

>The Golgorian Dungeon Crawlers
A formation supported by, but not officially a part of, the Unyielding Vigil, operating in the Tempestus gap. Golgoria is a hive-world of ancient provenance; it was a hive-world when the Imperium conquered it, a hive-world when Long Night fell, a hive-world when the first human settlers made landfall although the original inhabitants had all gone, leaving vast and empty buildings behind. Although archaeology is not exactly a high priority in the remnants of the sundered Imperium, all indications are that Golgoria has been a hive world for millions of years, across dozens of owners.

As such, the Golgorian Crawlers are dedicated hive-fighters, mostly recruited from the gangs and militias that effectively control most of the planet's inhabited volume. They are armed for close-quarters fighting in enclosed spaces, storm shields paired with a variety of one-hand weapons: hand flamers, melta pistols, hell-pistols, chainswords. Long-range support weaponry is mostly abandoned in favor of more grenades, demo-charges, and flashbangs. (They do have some to deal with occasional open spaces, but less than what would be expected for a normal heavy infantry unit.) The only vehicle in common use among the Crawlers is a variant of the Rapier weapons platform.

In battle, Dungeon Crawler strategy emphasizes infrastructure control. Hold the water purifiers, the food distribution centers, the power plants, the transport trunks. Cut off the enemy from these vital functions, and wait for them to die of dehydration and their industries to grind to a halt. Tactically, they make heavy use of breacher charges- why go through a door when you can go through a wall? They also make good use of 3D mobility; Golgoria is a very vertical environment, so all soldiers are equipped with climbing gear and know how to use it.

(cont.)

>>49725929
I think its still a derogatory way to refer to a group project. And directly insults everyyonr who contributed

>>49725968
That's your opinion. I'm not offended by any means, and I don't think Alexios had any intention of being inflammatory or derisive towards the project. This is something he's doing for fun, and therefore must be something he enjoys.

>>49725942
This is paired with a strong cadre of infiltration specialists (often abhuman). They are used to scout out enemy positions and seize vital infrastructure in advance of the main thrusts. There are ratlings in the ducts.
Inside hives, the Golgorian Dungeon Crawlers are utterly lethal. Outside of them, they pay for their overspecialization.

The Dungeon Crawlers originated as a purely defensive unit, slicing apart enemy raiding groups using superior knowledge of the terrain in the endless miles of abandoned construction. Entire armies could be lost without trace in the expanse of abandoned, ancient structure- and were. This changed when Golgoria became a vassal of the Unyielding Vigil, trading basing rights and a tithe of its soldiers in exchange for technical support for its failing industries. This prompted a shift in the composition of the Crawlers, from a light-infantry urban guerilla force to a heavy-infantry urban assault force. Under the supervision of Vigil drill sergeants, the transition went smoothly, and now Dungeon Crawler detachments are a common sight among Vigil expeditionary forces in the Tempestus gap.

Thoughts?

>>49726085
I wanna give you some constructive feedback, but I have absolutely nothing to add. Good stuff. Are you adding all these to the wiki?

one could be the chosen ones of slaneesh. They tend to rape inncoents and often participate in bestality, inter-species relationships, pedophilia, necrophilia, and gay rape, and they rape thousands. Legend has it they raped everybody on a whole planet and captured 8000 concubines for their... "needs"

>>49726738
What's the difference between rape and gay rape?

Also what?

>>49726788
Interesting question priority there kek.

>>49720689

Adepta is the female term. Pretty sure Custodes aren't girls.

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>>49726921
They most certainly aren't

>>49725968
I dont think that was his intent. Although i grant you i understand how you came away offended.

My thoughts on the matter are that while 40k may be silly beyond reason there is no need to follow suit. I see it as an opportunity to improve upon the inconsistent 40k setting. Rather than use the 40k canon as a prop to setup equally ridiculous ideas. We should take the best parts and inprove the worst. In saying that there is always room for some silliness. Reference Angel of Light turned Indiana Jones or Warmasters war council consisting of 9 people, 6 of which are hired actors pretending to be generals and 1 of them pretending to be the warmaster.

Tldr; we should try and improve 40k rather than sink to its level but that doesnt mean we cant have some fun and silliness as well.

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>>49726738
What what the the fuck fuck

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>>49726676
No. Too much like actual work.

>>49726788
I think it's an attempt to contribute to the 'mortal forces of the Tempestus Gap' thing we have going.

>The Wings of Rust
A Nurglite force operating in the Tempestus Gap. The Wings of Rust are notable for their heavy focus on air power. Instead of the typical plague zombie horde or the plodding heavy armor favored by mechanized Nurglite forces, the Wings of Rust consist nearly entirely of aero-space craft, typically deployed from orbiting carriers. The strategy is entirely straightforward: first, achieve air supremacy. Then, blanket the helpless population centers in virus bombs until the planet succumbs to Nurgle's embrace. Leave.

The Wings of Rust have a theme of industrial pollution and decay, as opposed to the usual pus and vomit or the Second Son's Chernobyl. Their pitted, corroded aircraft trail thick clouds of chemical smoke, which jam the guns, foul sensors, and corrode the engines of enemy aircraft that fly through them. The bombs they drop are filled with toxic metals, asbestos, and condensed smog in addition to the normal run of diseases. Metal rusts, machines fail, and guns jam. Tetanus crawls on every surface as jagged oxide spikes sprout from every metal surface like some metallic fungus. Unusually for a Nurglite force, the Wings of Rust also make moderate use of incendiaries, adding plumes of choking ash to the pollution. As the relentless bombardment continues, the planet's sky becomes choked with ash and smog, the sun dims, factories choke. Everything comes to a halt.

Although their tactics are simple, countering them is usually entirely beyond the resources of the average planet. With anti-orbital defenses always the first installations targeted, the orbiting carriers form an unassailable rear area from which the Nurglite bombers can attack the entire world with impunity.

(cont.)

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>>49725886
>It's not about respect, it's about enjoying it
This guy gets it. I'd use a lot of adjectives to describe 40k: Campy, silly, over-the-top, edgy, grimdark, and just plain fun. However, I would not in any way describe it as respectable, and that's part of why I like it. 40k Isn't literature, it's not quality art, and it's not trying to be or say something important. It's just plain old fun. If you take 40k or Imperium Asunder seriously as art I think you're probably either insane or an idiot.

>>49726970
>there is no need to follow suit.
I want to totally follow suit though. I like the silly, goofy, rule-of-cool, fuck consistency who even cares attitude that 40k has, and that's part of why I like writing 40k fanfic. It's a fun environment that's very loose from a writing perspective and can accomodate ideas that are simultaneously really stupid but also really fun.

This is why I sometimes get upset when people try to force things to make sense with shit like operator marines. Space Marines patently do not make sense and if you think they do you either don't understand them or don't understand real warfare. They're an absurd fictional construct whose tactical intelligence is worse than even that of even a modern army. But they're cool as fuck, so who fucking cares if accurate grenade launcher rifles and tanks are on the same battlefield as swords and shields?

40k is not respectable, and that's precisely why I like it.

>>49727131
Engagement happens when and where they desire, demolishing enemy air forces and air defenses one at a time, bringing their full force to bear on each in turn.
The Wings of Rust do have a ground force, consisting of air cavalry and drop infantry. They are used as commandos, striking to destroy hardened targets where air power alone cannot suffice. On occasions where taking and holding territory becomes necessary, the Wings of Rust prefer simply to throw hordes of 'Smog Zombies' (a variant of the standard plage zombie, purely aesthetic) generated by their bombardment at the problem.

Once the planet has been reduced, the Wings of Rust simply depart. Although many planets such visited become sources of further Nurglite warbands, the Wings never recruit from the world they attack, and often never even land on them. They replenish their numbers and supplies exclusively from their unknown homeworld.

Thoughts?

>>49726738
Seek help.

>>49726738
>Legend has it they raped everybody on a whole planet and captured 8000 concubines

That's an oddly specific number. You'd think they'd get more from a whole planet.

Is their homeworld the planet Sadpanda?

>>49727704
8 is the sacred number of Khorne too.

>>49727131
Why is countering them almost impossible? Wouldnt it much easier to defend against air raids through the use of ground to air defence and air to air defence then it would be to supply an air raiding force. Considering refueling is the critical weakness of air forces?

They sound imba.

>>49727133
If theres aspects of it you like, for example: its not trying to be something it isnt. Then its fair to say you have some sort of respect for it. You can respect things that arent high literature or fancy art.

>>49727133
>no need to follow suit
We dont need to, i for one value internal consistency though.

>rule of cool, goofy, fun
100% agree. I just dont think the two ideas are mutually exclusive.

>dont understand warfare or dont understand space marines
Id hope i understand the first and im certain i understand the latter. Again space marines are cool and its totally plausible for them to line up in ranks and walk towards there enemies. But at the same time if thats all they do then they are no more interesting to me than orks. I like the idea of them being tactically flexible and to represent that i made the Hawks. Not every legion or chaptwe has to be that way, amd if they were they would probably be pretty boring. But again i dont see why they cant be operators operating.

Space Marines can pretty much be anything.

Operator Marines exist in canon. They're called Raptors.

So do Draculamarines and cyborg Marines and biker Marines. There's basically a Marine chapter of every flavour.

>>49727941
Countering them is difficult because they're not flying from ground-based air bases, they're flying from carriers in orbit. This allows them to drop down directly onto their targets, minimizing the time in which they can be intercepted and virtually guarantees local force superiority. They can hit anywhere in the world with maybe twenty minutes warning, which simply does not give local forces enough time to respond. Aerospace vs. pure air.
While you can hit them as they climb back to orbit, their craft are more durable than they have any right to be and their pilots are no slouches. Nurgle's blessings allow pilots to withstand a lot of g-forces as well, so they're also unexpectedly agile.

Plus, many of the effects they use are especially effective against aircraft, complex and delicate machines that they are. You can win dozens of battles and still lose the war as your aircraft choke on smog and rust on the runways.

Ultimately, however, the main factor in their effectiveness is that they're mostly hitting lone planets with no patron, whose armed forces are stereotypical PDF-tier. They're not usually fighting Astartes or even generally elite Guard-tier opponents.

>>49728146
Yeah. The way i see it. Space marines by themselves are pretty boring conceptually. They suffer from superman syndrome where they are just damn near perfect. So to make them interesting the players and writers add something or take something away.
Cyborg marines
Dracula marines
Mongol marines
Roman marines
Tragic marines
Holy marines
Knighty knight marines
Plague marines
Sonic marines
Etc etc etc.
The base idea works and is so cool because they are mutable. To discount any particular flavour goes against what i think is there biggest advantage.

>>49728515
>not hitting astartes or elite guard tier
This is how you do it. All of a sudden they arent op they just choose their targets carefully to seem op.

>>49710221
Plot twist: He himself is Vect's sex slave, not his mom.

>>49728636
Plot twist twist. His mother is Vect.

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>>49725132
I believe this was the image that was used to describe how he looked as a daemon prince.

>>49728857
Tripleplot twist: Both are true.

>>49729038
Quadrupletwist plot, he's actually Vect.

>>49728636
>>49728857
>>49729038
pls no

once they alsu attacked a planet simply to show that while they can rape everyone, they can especially rape Astartes.

They slayed an entire space marine chapter, and then raped the surviving marines, Astartes havng much longer sexual endurance so they could take much more rape then regular people.

Female astartes make good fuck toys was their reasoning.

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So let's talk about some Dark Eldar.

The Dark City is more abandoned than occupied, with many having gone to rejoin the Resurgent Empire. Its dank underchambers, massive docking spires, and vast pleasure plazas now lie in disrepair. Only a few disparate gangs stalk Commoragh's twisting webways, fighting over scraps of territory and petty disputes.

Living out of the mandrake-infested docking spires, one of the most powerful dark city gangers is Kyl'thros Vect. Kyl'thros is the bastard son of Asdrubael Vect by an exodite slave girl, and he has all of his father's strength of will. Leaving his father's court in adolescent rebellion, Kyl'thros cobbled together a cabal from the reject gangers remaining on Commoragh.

Kyl'thros was not alive during the true Eldar Empire, and has romanticized it in the extreme. He hates the craftworlders, the Exodites, and even his father's dark kindred. To Kyl'thros, the old ways of the Eldar are the ways of Slaanesh. To trap one's soul in a stone is an abomination.

The Dark Prince's cabal grows ever stronger, for Kyl'thros promises the Eldar something that the craftworld fools and their soulbound army do not: the homeworlds. Kyl'thros believes that through adoration of Slaanesh and adherence to the ancient culture of the lost Eldar Croneworlds, the Eldar Empire can be great once more.

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>>49729835
Cabal colors: White
Typical units: Probably more corsair codex units than deldar codex units, anything with poison weapons.
Excluded units: can't ally with no filthy craftworlders with filthy soulstones.

>>49729835
Eh, I'm not super into the idea of an abandoned Commoragh. I was thinking Vect jr. would want to renew the ways of the Dark City before their craftworld cousins started their nascent empire. Besides, don't we already have slaaneshi Eldar?

>>49729835
I'm down for slaaneshi eldar-- presumably She Who Thirsts has made assurances, likely something to the effect of "nah man, the Eldar lie. I was just pissed that they didn't return to ME. I am the God they made, after all. Come willingly and I will raise you up above all life. You are my true son, Kyl'thros..."

The only catch is going to be the moment anyone catches on, all the Eldar are going to turn against him. Vect, Harlequins, Craftworld. So what if his inclinations and weird cult come out during the shakedown in Commoragh. And his message appeals to many Dark Eldar who are terrified of Slaneesh.
At the same time, Aodhán never liked him and hates the idea that Commoragh, last bastion of libertarianism will fall to Slaneesh, that foul prince who got Kashaln. So in Commoragh, Vect and the Negators team up to fight this guy and his Kabal and like 2/3 of the haemonculi.
Kashaln shows up to represent and back up his boi with his enormous spear.
As a result, when Altansar breaks from the Eye, they're mostly in the clear. Enoch gives chase and somewhere in the warp, the changer of ways laughs.

>>49729978

So, I'm thinking he's sort of false in that regard. He just wants people to join his gang so he's stronger than the other gangs. He does that by spreading race-hate against the Monk'Keigh king and ranting about reclaiming the homeworlds. He talks big, but he's really just a two-bit hustler.

>>49730059
I actually got confused reading this. Can you rephrase please.

>>49730132
Sounds cool

>>49729835
I think the idea with the Resurgent Empire is that it trades with and has increasingly close relations with Commorragh, rather than having emptied the city.

The Empire still mostly follows Craftworlder traditions, with their increasingly strong relationship with certain Kabals and many Corsair Princes showing that they are in danger of slipping back into the depravity the old empire.

Maybe this guy could be some kind of agitator trying to push for greater Commorrite power over the empire? Maybe he's trying to convince other Kabals that THEY should be in charge rather the the Craftworlders, since they Dark Eldar have shown that you can stay just as Old Empire as you want and still flourish, whereas the Craftworlds have only compromised.

>>49730337
>Maybe this guy could be some kind of agitator trying to push for greater Commorrite power over the empire? Maybe he's trying to convince other Kabals that THEY should be in charge rather the the Craftworlders, since they Dark Eldar have shown that you can stay just as Old Empire as you want and still flourish, whereas the Craftworlds have only compromised.
ooh yeah i can totally get behind this instead

>>49729978
Yeah, there was something an Eldar daemon prince or something being like the Messiah of Slaanesh. The last Eldar of the old empire to be sacrificed before its depravity reached critical mass, whose death cry was Slaanesh's birth scream.

>>49730337
>>49730373
It's kinda hard to determine what a "regressive" would be in Eldar culture, but whatever it is, Kyl'thros should be that.

>>49730188
No worries:
Slaneesh tells Kyl'thros the same thing he told Lorgar-- the Eldar only aroused the ire of Slaneesh by rejecting him. She tells him it will be fine for those who come willingly and that together, they will fulfill the Eldar destiny to rule everything, warp and material.

So far so good. Problem is that the moment anyone finds out about a Slaneeshi cult they'll take him out. So he waits and carefully builds a network, mostly outside the dark city. And then Vect comes to him to ask a favor. He asks him to make havoc in the city. Or he doesn't ask, but he manipulates Kyl'thros into stirring up trouble.
Vect is doing this because the Harlequins have made him an offer and he wants a shakedown anyways. So Vect is happy to tie up Aodhán.
As a result Vect doesn't look too closely at the activities of Kyl'thros. Kyl'thros is scheming, but that's exactly what Vect wants him to do.
As a result, when things start going nuts, Vect doesn't react immediately, allowing things to drag the Negators into it.
But then Kyl'thros shows his loyalty to Slaneesh, which is not planned.
So Vect teams up with Aodhán to fight it, but Slaneesh wants this, so Kashaln gets brought in to help Kyl'thros.

As a result, there is madness in the Dark City.

All this was started as a cover operation for the rescue of Altansar and so they're in the clear outside of a hurried operation lead by Enoch to catch them.
The Changer of Ways is pleased because Aodhan is a step closer to becoming Khaela Menasha Khaine reborn, which will weaken Khorne and Slaneesh, boosting his own position.

>>49730676
I really don't see how that would work considering he hates psykers and wants "purity above all"

>>49730714
Oh, just running with the idea that he sees Slaneesh as the fulfilment of the old Empire. Just an idea, though maybe a meh one.

>>49730896
Oh, I wasn't thinking his ideas were that old fashioned. I was imagining that since the new Eldar empire is growing, he feels like Commorite society is going down the tubes and wants to bring it back to the way it was circa M32, which is basically how Deldar are in the OU.

>>49730676
+1 i rate

>>49730918
I think that'd be Vect's standpoint.

So what do we want to call the Storm Hammers/Sky Serpent diversion assault into the Hunting Grounds? Any ideas for what to have happen?

Trying a concept again:

>Jade Empire Siege Regiments
The Sky Serpents have never been much for static engagements. This task they delegate customarily to their human Auxiliae. As a result of this practice, there are numerous mortal regiments geared for garrison duty and long, grinding sieges.
Among the most famous are the Sobek Fusilliers. The Sobek Fusilliers are organized into paired companies, infantry companies and artillery companies. The infantry companies are universally equipped with lasrifles and flamers, but their most potent tool is their entrenching shovel.
They make planetfall with prefab defense lines, but once these are set up, the Infantry get to work digging and constructing a system of trenches which will serve as the basis for more complex defense works.
The artillery companies, meanwhile provide cover with relentless bombardment even as their guns are set in protected emplacements. The guns themselves run from rapier mounted field guns, to heavier mortars, up to weapons such as the basilisk and Medusa seige guns and beyond.
The Sobek Fusilliers have a sizable Mechanicum contingent, extending beyond the usual enginseers. Instead, techpriests of Orders Macrotek and Reductor are placed throughout the forces.
Typically, one of the two consuls is a Magus.
This is to ensure that the fortifications constructed are up to mechanicum standard and that the enemy position is levelled with optimal efficiency.
At times, this mechanicum oversight can also mean that heavier and more arcane weapons are brought to bear, including the holy Ordinatus Engines.
Under most circumstances, the Sobek Fusillier Infantry companies adopt a defensive posture. Not for them are the human wave assaults of some similar forces. Instead, they try to get the enemy to come to them, luring them into an assault with false weaknesses and crushing them. Not for nothing is their sigil that of a crocodile.
This said, the Infantry is perfectly capable of assaults, though that...

>>49733551
...though the bloody task of mass assaults is usually left for forces such as the Argon Apemen penal legions.

Another common practice is to use the Sobek Fusilliers to draw out or focus an enemy assault, allowing forces of the Sky Serpents to strike elsewhere.
Oddly enough, but perhaps characteristic of the impact of Jade Empire propaganda, this sort of mission is seen as among the most honorable. Because of the nature of such things, the Sobek Fusilliers seldom are told before hand that they are to be a distraction force, so naturally, they assume that honor is theirs.
To the soldiers of the Fusilliers, they are partaking in an age old rite of the mortal warriors, serving the Empire and legion with their steadfast defense just as the human troops called up by Songkulkan during the People's War allowed Xun and the Legion the time they needed to honor the Emperor and thrice-Sainted Faustus by rescuing Malcador and the other legions and buying time for Xun to return and slay the foe, as the legion always will.
Thus the glory of the people and the proletariat is to serve where needed and to stand fast.
They're sort of the logical extreme of the Jade Empire propaganda 'proletariat shield' idea. They have conviction that their sacrifice allows the semi-divine Legion, potentially acting through human regiments like the Thule Rimeguard, to do what it needs to do and through their steadfastness, they reenact the holy actions of the virtuous proletariat of Songkulkan's day. It lets them emulate Faustus, who stood fast on Luna. Just as Faustus told Xun to return to his people and that he would martyr himself to ensure the Emperor's ascension, it is their duty and right to be martyrs to let the legion serve the Empire. (Faustus said no such thing and Xun doesn't say he did. Nor do the scholar-bureaucrats and Legion believe any such thing. But you try telling that to a prole.)
Of course, having walls to hide behind and big guns does nothing to harm morale.

>>49733833
I feel like changing the lyrics to "when the tigers broke free" to fit this, but I'm way too tired.

PROMPT:
What is the most powerful single opponent your primarch has slain?

>>49734974
hmm.
Well i'd have to say Oramar. I mean, I like to think he would have beaten Aodhan if the fight continued, but thats neither here nor there.

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>>49734974
Balthasar killed a prime-ork.

Alexios mostly lets his men do the killing

>>49735097
Who kills all the other prime orks?

>>49735122
I don't think that anyone has claimed the kills. The whole war has been left into who were there and how Balthasar killed one of the Primorks, turning the tide of thw war.

>>49735122
There are six of them, right?

Gengrat's role was being redirected to fight the opportunistic loyalist forces, so he probably didn't kill one.

So I guess Kashaln, Saul, Balthasar, Aodhan, Enoch, and Anshul each have a Prime Ork to kill.

>>49735833
Turns out nicely.

What other -mega- opponents are in the setting? if any

>>49734974
Sarco I guess.

Aodhán has probably killed a whole load of powerful things the Emperor sent him to murder. I'm assuming he bagged a Prime Ork. One of his most famous kills is a transcendent Shard of the Nightbringer so large that dispersing it caused a whole bunch of other Shards to break free of containment (nice going retard).

>>49735983
Things that can fight a Primarch equally:

Prime Orks.
Older Daemon Princes.
Older Greater Daemons.
Transcendent C'tan.
Phoenix Lords.
Solitaires.
A few anomalous xenos (the Overlord of Barbarus, etc).

Things that should be an uphill battle for Primarchs:

Bigger Prime Orks.
The Dragon of Mars (or similarly powerful shards).
Daemon Primarchs.

>>49736157
A few of the older Archons are probably in super motherfucker tier. They get stronger with age and some of them have been around almost as long as Commorragh has existed.

Can any of our Primarchs, as currently statted, defeat Smashfucker?

>>49736969
Probably not.

>>49734974
Welln it's inevitable Faustus is going to kill the warmaster with the lunar colony drop

>>49737038
Hold up. Faustus is STILL on Luna? After 10,000 years?

>>49737116
When's the last time you moved house? You get settled in, get it how you like it, and you ain't moving for the apocalypse.

>>49737143
Well sure, I get he wouldn't want to leave, but the neighbours are a real issue. A 'blow up your house' kind of issue to be exact.

>>49737116
Shits hanging over Terra Majora Mask style, stuck in time by the gods. Every time chaos loses a major battle or the gods are weakened, it crawls a little closer. 10000 years later as the end times begin, Luna is devastatingly close to crushing everything and destroying the eye of Terra. Who knows what will happen when it does, but given Faustus apparent mate of null genetics by the end out the heresy...

>>49736969
In a 1v1 challenge, most of them could do it. Same goes for the canon Primarchs.

If it's Smashfucker and his retinue... at a glance, only Klaus, Aodhan and Rubinek may have a chance at winning.

Remember though, it will take Smashfucker 14+ turns to kill some of these guys, and in that time it's very likely that his Librarain will suffer Perils and lower his durability massively.

>>49737172
So Luna is trapped in it's own warpstorm or something? I really don't understand how it's supposed to work? If it takes 10,000 years for Luna to move over to Terra, I don't think it'll wreck the planet or w/e. Also doesn't really explain why the Dark Imperium or the Gods don't just wreck the shit out of it.

>>49737213
It's stuck in time in space by the gods. Like it's still going full Ameggedon tilt on it, just the gods have displace it from time and space like a stasis field. What can be seen is reflection in real space. Arguably it could be reached by going into the warp, but I bet it's in the Gods' domain now and guarded jealously.

>>49738150
Right. So when Luna breaks free and crashes into Terra, barely any time will have passed for Faustus?

>>49738195
Yeah. Like, as far as he's concerned, the Heresy is still in progress and he's seven or eight seconds from winning via mutual annihilation.

>>49738623
Hm, that's a actually pretty cool. Would be interesting to see what happens if Faustus manages to survive somehow.

Can someone post the current list of Crusades again?

Was it the 1st, 2nd or 3rd when the loyalists are riding the coattails of Waaagh! The Beast? What about when the Negators and Iron Hearts took a bunch of Undying Scions territory?

>>49739188
1st was the ill-advised vengeance crusade that ended up not being very successful. It happened concurrently with the Century Siege in which the Judgement Bringers laid siege to the sector surrounding Amaranth. I believe the second crusade was when the Beast went on his rampage and several of the crusader states took the opportunity to push into Warzone Tempestus. While this was happening, the Scions took the Maelstrom Zone from the Iron Hearts.

>>49733833
It was just before dawn
One miserable morning in M41
When the forward commander
Was told to sit tight
When he asked that his men be withdrawn
And the generals gave thanks
As the other ranks
Held back the enemy tanks for a while
And the Segmentum Fortress was held for the price
Of a few thousand ordinary lives

>>49739649
And kind old King Xun sent mother a note
When he heard that father was gone
It was, I recall, in the form of a scroll
With gold leaf and all
And I found it one day
In a drawer of old photographs, hidden away
And my eyes still grow damp
To remember
That younger brother signed
With his own rubber stamp

>>49739759
It was dark all around
There was frost in the ground
When the Sheridans broke free
And no one survived from the Sobek Fusiliers, Company C
They were all left behind
Most of them dead
The rest of them dying
And that's how the high command
Took my daddy from me

>>49739188
I think Crusade 11 is the Nurglite Schism when Saul returns as a Daemon Prince.

>>49739791
HA JOKE'S ON YOU! In space-China seals and stamps have the role and status of signatures.

(Oh wow. Right in the feels.)

>>49738623
>>49739101
I'm loving this idea. I'm picturing Faustus standing on a command deck in full plate, surrounded by a phalanx of Silent Knights, a strange imitation of the Emperor in shades of silver. He's ready because he has seen the power of the warp. He is ready because his own forces are mighty. He is ready because he hates the Warmaster and on the off chance that the Void shields protect the throne room, he wants to be ready to slay Redacted with his bare hands.
Faustus probably could have escaped and let the moon do its work, but this is personal. It goes beyond revenge for the death of a distant father, beyond the rage at the death of his legion, beyond the hatred for a dream destroyed. This is personal.
From hell's heart he will spite him, from madness' grasp he will smite him.

>>49739625
>>49739800
Okay so.

1st Crusade: Loyalists push back. Judgement Bringers and Negators fight their way toward Amaranth but get stalled eventually. Loyalist forces are sent packing back beyond the Tempestus Gap.

2nd Crusade: Waaagh! The Beast is in full swing and the loyalists attempt to take advantage. The Maelstrom Zone is retaken and holdouts are established throughout Segmentum Tempestus.

??? Crusade: Alexios is killed by Anders over the Tau dispute. T'au is glassed and the Empire is rolled over by angry Imperium Minorum forces. The remnants of the Tau Empire are either folded into the Protectorate or join the roving Farsight Clans and embrace a warlike existence devoted to revenge.

11th Crusade: Saul Sheridan is brought forth from the Warp as a Daemon Primarch of Nurgle, triggering the Nuglite Schism. Nurgle forces throughout the galaxy mount relentless attacks against all living beings, the Crusader States put aside their differences to form a cohesive counterattack.

13th Crusade: Warp shenanigans, war on two fronts, a living saint declares this the Last Crusade.

Also, I recommend that we call the 13th major Crusades against Chaos the Great Crusades, leaving room for other conflicts to be named the 'insert name' Crusade (i.e. the Macharian Crusade, the Damocles Crusade, etc). I feel like only the wars between loyalists and traitors that bring in significant forces from both sides should be among the Great Crusades.

>>49740176
>??? Crusade: Alexios is killed by Anders over the Tau dispute. T'au is glassed and the Empire is rolled over by angry Imperium Minorum forces. The remnants of the Tau Empire are either folded into the Protectorate or join the roving Farsight Clans and embrace a warlike existence devoted to revenge.
12th

>>49740176
>The one where Alexios dies
How about we call that one the Damocles Gulf Crusade.
Also, if memory serves, we had Negators and Warp Raiders showing up to screw with Alexios during it. Part of it was false flag operations by the Warmaster to make it seem like Anders is in league with chaos, but I think there were other motives at play, too.

When I get home, I'll try and make a wiki page for the Crusades.

There's also one where Xun ascends.

>>49740176
9th Crusade: The necropolis cult reveals itself and moves to attack the worlds surrounding Amaranth with the assistance of its necron benefactors. Only the timely intervention of the Crimson Warhawks prevents the total annihilation of the world. Purging the necrons takes the combined forces of four Crusader States and leads to mistrust of the Undying Scions in the future.

>>49737116
What no he isnt.

>>49737172
Null genetics? Where are you getting this.

>>49737210
Whose smash fucker and what makes him so powerful?

>>49737213
Disregard what these jobos are saying. Luna isnt moving closer. Its hanging above as it was put in a sort of stasis to prevent it crashint into terra.

>>49738623
Faustus was written to disappear from luna. His sacrifice and last stand means shit all if he is in stasis. Just stop. Youre confusing Jobs with brand new amd conflicting info and none of the fags are on to point out how wrong you are

>>49740535
https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Chapter_Master_Smashfucker

>>49740564
I'm pretty sure we never actually said what happened to Faustus. I for one like the idea that he's stuck in stasis on Luna.

>>49740595
>>49740564
>>49740535
Maybe people should update wiki pages?

>>49740564
The original decision on Faustus was "it's a mystery." Someone posed that he might be on Luna a whole bunch of threads back, and it gained traction, but eh, whatever.

>>49740474
>How about we call that one the Damocles Gulf Crusade.

Maybe something like the Angel's Crusade? The Angelos Crusade? The Alexandrian Crusade? Something to signify that it was fought in retribution for Alexios' death.

I agree that it shouldn't be one of the thirteen though. Those should be loyalists v traitor affairs.

>>49740595
>>49740755
I think this, like most things in 40k works best as a mystery. People say Faustus is dead and many cults that honor him assume this, but there's a tradition popular in some areas and amongst the Oathsworn that Faustus lives, trapped in the slow time as Luna falls.
They say that at the end, at Skyfall, Faustus will slay the Warmaster in single combat even as the moon smashes Terra.
Only in death does duty end.
(This view is popular amongst the Sobek Fusilliers.)

Gathering stuff and making some suggestions.

1st Great Crusade: Loyalists push back. Judgement Bringers and Negators fight their way toward Amaranth but get stalled eventually. Loyalist forces are sent packing back beyond the Tempestus Gap.

2nd Great Crusade: Waaagh! The Beast is in full swing and the loyalists attempt to take advantage. The Maelstrom Zone is retaken and holdouts are established throughout Segmentum Tempestus. Engerand loses an eye to Kashaln.

3rd Great Crusade: Spearheaded by the Judgement Bringers and Iron Hearts Legions, the forces of the Dark Imperium swarm Segmentum Tempestus in an attempt to scour it of loyalist holdouts. The loyalists respond with a furious counter-offensive, the entirety of the Forgespace and the Unyielding Vigil mobilized to combat the forces of Chaos.

4th Great Crusade: The Void Lords locate a tenuous passage through the Firewall into the Dark Imperium. The Astra Telepathica is mobilized to light the way and a vast host is assembled from every Crusader State, accompanied by household fleets and militant orders. They tear into the unguarded, unprepared worlds on the other side of the Firewall, establishing a beachhead for further offensives. Several gains are lost when the Crimson Warhawks unexpectedly diverge from planned operations, Raydon having heard tell of the Warmaster's location. He boards the Warmaster's flagship and bests the daemon prince, but cannot kill him, and is executed by Kashaln.

5th Great Crusade: The Firewall's light flickers, and a passage opens between the Jade Empire and the Unyielding Vigil. Both Crusader States mobilize to stem the inevitable tide of traitor forces that surge into loyalist space. The fight is bitter and bloody, but comes to an abrupt end when Xun vanishes into the Firewall and it mysteriously reignites.

>>49741380
6th Great Crusade: A champion of Khorne achieves eminence among the warbands of the Chaos Marches, and is given Balthasar's blessing as Huntmaster. The resulting frenzy of violence spills out over the borders of the Storm Kingdoms, worlds burning in its path. By the time the forces of the Kingdoms and the Protectorate have put a stop to the devastation, Engerand has lost his left arm and the border worlds of the Kingdoms lie in ruins.

7th Great Crusade: High-Marshal Engerand, seeking to preserve his domain from further attacks, proposes that the loyalists seek to extend their beachhead on the other end of the Firewall across its northern stretch, creating a defensive line. Forces of the Jade Empire, Unyielding Vigil, Forgespace, and Imperium Minorum push from the beachhead, while Storm Kingdom and Protectorate armies attempt to fight their way around the northern edge to join them. The Warmaster's response is swift and the campaign proves a shambolic failure, the loyalist forces constantly harried by Warp Raider efforts. Engerand is killed by Aodhan, though he manages to teleport them both into the bridge of his burning flagship as it careens out of orbit. The traitor Primarch is not seen again for many years.

11th Great Crusade: Saul Sheridan is brought forth from the Warp as a Daemon Primarch of Nurgle, triggering the Nuglite Schism. Nurgle forces throughout the galaxy mount relentless attacks against all living beings, the Crusader States put aside their differences to form a cohesive counterattack.

>The Angel's Crusade/The Damocles Crusade/The Alexandrian Crusade: Alexios is killed by Anders over the Tau dispute. T'au is glassed and the Empire is rolled over by angry Imperium Minorum forces. The remnants of the Tau Empire are either folded into the Protectorate or join the roving Farsight Clans and embrace a warlike existence devoted to revenge.

13th Crusade: Warp shenanigans, war on two fronts, a living saint declares this the Last Crusade.

>>49741380
Boom: https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Imperium_Asunder_Campaigns

>>49741424
Nice. All the important things seem to be in order as far as I can see and the details can be added later. The crusades that have no text under them haven't been talked about yet, I assume?

>>49741424
Heroic.

Is there anything more in the oathsworn the wiki page is missing a bit

>>49742457
Man, there's fucking tons.

We need to add the Luna Campaign. We need to add their Black Rage ish tendency to have Heresy flashbacks. We need to add the stuff about them having this secretive, masonic cult within their ranks that is labyrinthine as fuck to outsiders.

>>49742457
I think we should really move them to Loyal, seeing as they held the line and Faustus is a huge deal saint.

>>49742736
I agree. They're a neutral force among the Crusader States, but they're still loyalists.

>>49741424
I'll ad my stuff on the 13th Crusade momentarily. Though I'm not sure it was agreed on by everyone and people are free to pose problems.

>>49742736
Yeah that seems sorta important.

>>49742685
Speaking of Black Rage-ish tendencies, should the Scions have something like the Iron Hands' weird persecution complex? They were the last to leave Terra and then they were seemingly abandoned on Amaranth by the others while they crusaded into the Dark Imperium, and they're trying to keep it a secret that they have the Emperor's corpse.

Added the 13th Crusade stuff, with some edits.

>>49743062
I think that might be rather cool. It could add to their view of themselves as the true bulwark against Chaos.

>>49743115
What are your thoughts on Vect Jr? How do you see him operating?

>>49743183
I like the idea posted somewhere above of him being an agitator who hates that the Dark City is having greater and greater contact with the Craftworld Eldar, hates that the new Empire is mostly based on their values, and constantly pushes for the Commorrite Kabals to exercise their power more fully in realspace. In his view the Craftworlders and Exodites are weak, tainted by their use of half-measures, and neck deep in denial. If there is to be an Eldar Empire it should be ruled the Commorrite way, as the Old Empire was.

I imagine he often snipes at the Empire by remarking that it doesn't even have an emperor, what with it being ruled by a council assembled from representatives from each Craftworld (I'm seeing an Autarch and a Farseer from each. Starholds, Exodite Worlds, Isharan Worlds and Custodian Worlds all count as under the jurisdiction of their nearest Craftworld). Some radical, alt-right equivalent Khainites and Corsair Princes like him because he proposes that any empire should be run by a supreme military ruler and be unforgiving in mannerism, and his ideas prey upon their desire to seek emotional fulfillment to their hearts' content.

He's a prime candidate for corruption by the 'Prince of the Old Empire' character I came up with ages ago.

>>49717462
Holy shit how did I not see this earlier? Fucking excellent. Makes me think of
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dH1GoDtzSbw

>>49740474
>Also, if memory serves, we had Negators and Warp Raiders showing up to screw with Alexios during it. Part of it was false flag operations by the Warmaster to make it seem like Anders is in league with chaos, but I think there were other motives at play, too.

If Negators were involved it was definitely other motives. Aodhán hated Alexios and he'd likely defend whatever Anders is defending just to make sure Alexios' death is as meaningless as possible.

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>>49741380
>1st Great Crusade: Loyalists push back. Judgement Bringers and Negators fight their way toward Amaranth but get stalled eventually. Loyalist forces are sent packing back beyond the Tempestus Gap.
cool

>2nd Great Crusade: Waaagh! The Beast is in full swing and the loyalists attempt to take advantage. The Maelstrom Zone is retaken and holdouts are established throughout Segmentum Tempestus. Engerand loses an eye to Kashaln.
also Balthasar becomes a DP

>3rd Great Crusade: Spearheaded by the Judgement Bringers and Iron Hearts Legions, the forces of the Dark Imperium swarm Segmentum Tempestus in an attempt to scour it of loyalist holdouts. The loyalists respond with a furious counter-offensive, the entirety of the Forgespace and the Unyielding Vigil mobilized to combat the forces of Chaos.
k

>4th Great Crusade: The Void Lords locate a tenuous passage through the Firewall into the Dark Imperium. The Astra Telepathica is mobilized to light the way and a vast host is assembled from every Crusader State, accompanied by household fleets and militant orders. They tear into the unguarded, unprepared worlds on the other side of the Firewall, establishing a beachhead for further offensives. Several gains are lost when the Crimson Warhawks unexpectedly diverge from planned operations, Raydon having heard tell of the Warmaster's location. He boards the Warmaster's flagship and bests the daemon prince, but cannot kill him, and is executed by Kashaln.
[[DESIRE TO KNOW MORE INTENSIFIES]]

>5th Great Crusade: The Firewall's light flickers, and a passage opens between the Jade Empire and the Unyielding Vigil. Both Crusader States mobilize to stem the inevitable tide of traitor forces that surge into loyalist space. The fight is bitter and bloody, but comes to an abrupt end when Xun vanishes into the Firewall and it mysteriously reignites.
iirc this is 6 not 5

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>>49741394
>6th Great Crusade: A champion of Khorne achieves eminence among the warbands of the Chaos Marches, and is given Balthasar's blessing as Huntmaster. The resulting frenzy of violence spills out over the borders of the Storm Kingdoms, worlds burning in its path. By the time the forces of the Kingdoms and the Protectorate have put a stop to the devastation, Engerand has lost his left arm and the border worlds of the Kingdoms lie in ruins.
Did you make this up because i've never heard it before and it's awesome

>7th Great Crusade: High-Marshal Engerand, seeking to preserve his domain from further attacks, proposes that the loyalists seek to extend their beachhead on the other end of the Firewall across its northern stretch, creating a defensive line. Forces of the Jade Empire, Unyielding Vigil, Forgespace, and Imperium Minorum push from the beachhead, while Storm Kingdom and Protectorate armies attempt to fight their way around the northern edge to join them. The Warmaster's response is swift and the campaign proves a shambolic failure, the loyalist forces constantly harried by Warp Raider efforts. Engerand is killed by Aodhan, though he manages to teleport them both into the bridge of his burning flagship as it careens out of orbit. The traitor Primarch is not seen again for many years.
neat

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>>49741394
>11th Great Crusade: Saul Sheridan is brought forth from the Warp as a Daemon Primarch of Nurgle, triggering the Nuglite Schism. Nurgle forces throughout the galaxy mount relentless attacks against all living beings, the Crusader States put aside their differences to form a cohesive counterattack.
k

>The Angel's Crusade/The Damocles Crusade/The Alexandrian Crusade: Alexios is killed by Anders over the Tau dispute. T'au is glassed and the Empire is rolled over by angry Imperium Minorum forces. The remnants of the Tau Empire are either folded into the Protectorate or join the roving Farsight Clans and embrace a warlike existence devoted to revenge.
12th crusade, or i guess the Alexandrian Crusade. It also ends with the establishment of a neutral zone between the protectorate and the angels.

>>49743299
So what's his view on the Prince of Pleasure?

>>49743577
>Did you make this up because i've never heard it before and it's awesome

I made up the 3rd, 4th, 6th and 7th on the spot as suggestions. Just throwing stuff at the wall, seeing if any of it sticks. If we're gonna fill out the list we need at least some basic ideas for them all.

>>49743642
Considering he hates psykers, I imagine that he sees Slaanesh as the number one threat to the Eldar race. Allowing the craftworlders to continue to congregate runs the risk of attracting its attention and causing another fall. This time, however, not a single Eldar soul would survive.

>>49743642
Being a Slaanesh worshiper IMO doesn't synch with his hate for psykers, since that's supposedly derived from the idea that psychic talent attracts Slaanesh. He sees Dark Eldar as more highly evolved and inherently superior because they've let their innate psychic talents shrivel down to the state they're in and are better equipped physically to fight without them.

That said, I could see him being open to corruption. Someone mentioned the idea that Slaanesh worship was the 'natural' evolution of the Eldar Empire, and I think something like that, along with his spite and anger and inferiority complex, could turn him to Chaos.

>>49743577
>>49743608
>>49743626
This is making me think.

How about for the 8th Great Crusade, Anshul, in an act of ritual sorcery centuries in the making and only possible due to the accumulated slaughter of past crusades, punches a flaming tear in the fabric of realspace, creating an immense Warp rift in the Grey Stars region just above Imperium Minorum and to the right of the Kor Protectorate. Bolstered by hordes of daemons and slavering worshippers, the Silver Spears and the Arms of Asura swarm from the breach, later accompanied by forces from the Negators, who transition out of the Webway for opportunistic raiding sprees throughout the crusade. They wreak immense havoc amidst the Grey Stars, targeting the Black Abbeys and the Telepathica houses that keep the Crusader States connected. The loyalist response is massive, but uncoordinated and panicky, with the forces of Imperium Minorum and the Protectorate arriving first and often butting heads. As much of the 8th Crusade is fought in space, over massive void citadels, the Void Lords excel throughout, and the the campaigns of the crusade see many heroes immortalised among them. They spearhead the daring final assault on the key planet at the mouth of the great Warp fissure, where a slew of arcane constructs consume psykers by the thousands to keep the breach open. Grahanak and his close companions ambush Anshul and, with the assistance of the Sisters of Silence, drive him back, Grahanak closing the rift while still planetside, the entire world vanishing with him on it. The last anyone hears from him is a garbled transmission vowing that he will never stop fighting. For millennia to come, late into the sleep cycles of ships in Warp transit, lonely crew members swear to have picked up a stange transmission that sounds strangely like an Imperial vow...

>>49744642
1000% yes

>>49744642
Actually, I think it's better if the final transmission is telling whoever is listening not to fear for him, or to be afraid of the battles to come.

The weird transmissions sailors in Warp transit get while alone always come when they're afraid, and tell them not to fear.

>>49744642
>>49744702
He should shout "SAVE YOURSELVES" obviously

>>49744642
This could also be the crusade where Aodhan gets buttravaged over seeing Kashaln with Raydon's sword on his belt and attacks him.

Maybe Kashaln, being a daemon prince now, is winning his rematch with Anders, when an angry Aodhan happens and everything goes to shit. Maybe the resulting chaos with Aodhan tellings his dudes they get mad props for every Silver Spear they kill is what allows Grahanak's fleet to slip by the traitor forces and take Anshul by surprise.

>>49744642
Awesome.

>>49744702
>>49744767
"The ancients taught this:
The first thing is not to be afraid. Fear is indeed the mind-killer, but I believe the first step is to learn to live in that fear. The ancient Terran alienist, Freude Invicta wrote that in our animal souls the only responses were to fight or flee. But you see, little brothers, if life in the void has taught us anything, it is that terror is on all sides and there is no place to flee. Out here, no-one can hear you scream, no gods, no kings, only you.
So I say the first thing is fear. Know it. Live it, and learn to master it lest you die. Seak out that which you fear, for it has power over you, kill it, consume it, that that power becomes part of you. To master your fear, you must become fear. Thus do I say liberate tutame ex terrore."
-Graha'Nak

Question. I'm editing the section on the Tempestus Gap, and I need to know- what Chaos legions are closest to the gap?

>>49745424
Iron Handsu run the highly fortified border worlds. Misc warbands range for some distance beyond that.

>>49745424
Iron Hearts.

>>49745479
>Handsu
Heartsu, I mean. Pls no sue, GW. Fair use!

>>49741380
>several gains are lost when raydon goes rogue
Kek not how I originally wrote it. But probably better. Fuck da material gains in here for revenge.

Im not sure he would jeopardize a campaign like that, but then again its probably worth it given how out of reach the warmaster is so i can see it.

Possibly swap it out for a later crusade though? Around 6ish to fit current timeline?

Also when does Raydon v Aodhan on the burning hull of a ship? Did we ascertain that?

>>49746076
I though that was during the flight from Terra, while the Warhawks are covering everyone else's retreat.

>>49742736
>>49742849
Yeah its just out of date. Remember originally they were renegade as fuck.

>>49743062
>abandoned
Thanks metalbro good to know the hawks that died helping out are remembered
>scribbles down new grudge in !bookofgrudges

>>49746216
>seemingly
It's not like psychological issues are rational anyways.

>be Engerand
>lose leg in the Heresy
>lose eye in the Second Crusade
>lose arm in the Sixth Crusade
>watch as your Legion fractures into a bunch of bickering kingdoms because of Alexios' fucking book
>final campaign is a terrible failure for everyone involved

Wew. I'm betting his last words to Aodhan were "Fucking finally, thanks bro."

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Bumpu

>>49746321
Won't all that grow back, though? Except the dignity.

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Bump for the night.

>>49747754
Maybe he regenerates more slowly? Or maybe due to the nature of his injuries they dont?

Idk I like the idea of a Primarch more and more given over to bionic replacements to demonstrate the cost of being a front line powerhouse for such a long time.

Question. Preparing to edit the wiki; could someone summarize everything we've decided about the Hunting Grounds? Who's the legion in charge of the closest Chaos March, are there any other forces operating in the area, etc.

>>49748428
The Bloodhounds use it the most, Storm Kingdoms are on the other side of the fire wall and try to expand that way. Hence why its called the hunting grounds.

>>49748504
Right, thanks.

>>49748428
>>49748504
>>49748631
It unnerves me that it wasn't obvious that the *hunting grounds* is the territory of the "muh hunting" legion.

>>49748643
I thought it was because there were a shit-ton of DEldar there.
Are there a shit-ton of DEldar there, by the way?

>>49748658
Deldar don't really give a shit about typical conceptions of 3d space. They live in the webway.

>>49748504
>>49748643
Okay so, I was writing it up, found myself getting a little carried away, and wrote this:

Which is not to say the Bloodhounds ''rule'' the grounds, of course. No; they ''cultivate'' it, as a game warden cultivates a hunting ground. A rapidly industrializing and militarizing world might be left alone for decades or centuries, so that it develops into a worthy and entertaining fight. Another might suffer relatively light yearly raids, to keep the population sufficiently cowed without ever dropping below sustainable levels. A third might be carefully goaded, calculated indignities heaped upon one another to encourage dreams of revenge- and an eventual fall to Khorne. Like cultivating bonsai, but with more chainswords and screaming.

So what I need to know is: are the Bloodhounds actually together and coherent enough to 'groom' a region like this, or do I need to scrap it?

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>>49748874
That's more or less how i described the region ages ago. The Hunting grounds are known for this sort of behavior, deliberately not finishing off enemies so they can milk them for more violence for their own twisted amusement.

There's a story of General-Captain Cullen bombing a city just a teeny tiny little bit so that the people would flee into the wilderness so he could hunt them to exhaustion rather than just blowing them all up in the first place, and that's what they were like when they were still loyalists.

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>>49748874
> Like cultivating bonsai, but with more chainswords and screaming.
Yeeees

>together and coherent enough to 'groom' a region
Probably not, however!! Thats maybe why there are several different types of 'cultivation' some warband leaders thinks its better to keep them low and scared, others like abit of a fight and even give them technology to facilitate industrialisation, others still only care about having them fall to khorne. Some might not be into 'cultivation' and attempt to spoil the game, only for their brothers to turn on them.

I'm in the mood for doing some writefagging. Any requests for theme and/or participants of a short story?

>>49748874
>>49748953
Balthasar still seems coherent enough to keep his legion running. Warbands splitting off seems inevitable for a traitor legion, especially a Khornite one.
So yeah, the Bloodhounds could probably manage to 'cultivate' the region.

>>49749043
Yeah, its less an issue with his authority or even the warmasters and everything to do with being on the fringe of the Dark Imperium, and being devoted to a god who famously 'cares not from where the blood flows, only that it does'

You're bound to end up with religious differences, power scheming, literally blood frenzy groups, etc.

But at the same time, not so much that the idea is inplausible. Thats why I like the idea of different groups 'cultivating' regions in different ways. Some might have only a single planet, others several, whilst the most powerful might have entire sectors under their thumbs, and actually have to worry about issues like pirates and rogue khornates disrupting their gardening.

I actually find the idea of them surging out to stop a Storm Kingdom explorer fleet from disturbing a planet thats been decades in preparation.

>>49749042
Eyes of the Warmaster fucking with doomed, hopeless resistance movement.

>>49749102
After yesterday's discussion on Faustus, wouldn't Luna be kind of a symbol to the Terran resistance? Assuming it's visible?

>>49749134
I'm a big proponent of the idea that the Warmaster tries to suppress all knowledge of Luna's existence. Maybe a story about a resistance band trying to climb to the surface of the giant ceiling he built so they can see the legendary unTerra in unground?

>>49749158
I very much dislike the giant ceiling idea. I think it should be hidden purely with orwellian groupthink where if you mentioned the moon to a Terran he'd get all sweaty and nervous and insist he didn't know what you're talking about because he doesn't want to disappear in the middle of the night.

>>49749158
Hiding the existance of the damn moon sounds like something Redac would do, but pretty much impossible to do for anyone living on the surface.

>>49749171
Well, I think it's hovering over the Imperial palace instead of actually in orbit at the moment, so you could hide it from people in the opposite hemisphere.

>>49749182
Right. I mean, I know it's 40k, so realism is kind of out of the window, but wouldn't screwing around with Luna's orbit and position be quite devastating to Terra?

>>49749195
Terra literally had its seas boiled away hundreds/thousands of years before 30k. What the fuck do they need a moon for?

>>49749171
>>49749182
>>49749211
Im all for the Moon to be in the atmosphere, perhaps able to be seen on rare nights where the smog fades enough.

Apart from that, I see Terra (or at least the habitable parts) to be akin to a hive world. The 'palace' is literally continent spanning. If you're capable of such mega structures I don't think its unreasonable to have the entire thing be roofed. Only those to see outside are upper echlon workers. Those that know of 'the moon' would never be able to prove its existance, so the warmaster doesn't need to actively hide it beyond forbidding people to climb on the roof at night, and a simple curfew would do that.

>>49749238
I just think having an obvious opportunity for the warmaster to do his niche thing and having him do something else instead is silly.

>>49749211
I dunno man, I'm not an expert. Doesn't the moon do anything else?

>>49749238
He could have to ceiling look kinda nice too. Give Terran citizens te idea the world is slightly less fucked than it actually is.

>>49749265
You mean having it be obvious but him being such a terrifying force of nature that people start sweating when a child looks up and says "papa whats that"
And the dad looks down and is like "nothing, nothings that. in fact, we are leaving the city. no the state, no in fact, im putting you immediately up for adoption AND leaving the planet. Oh god oh god oh god.

I'm all for that too.

Just saying that it can work plausbly either way.

>>49749288
I just can't help but wonder how you would start something like that. You can't just broadcast a message around the world saying: "THE MOON ISN'T REAL!", and expect the world to accept it.