/wmh/ Warmachine and Hordes General

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Whats everyone's favorite model visually ? gameplay wise ?

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>>49158448
First for Iosan supremacy.
HAIL TO THE DAWN

>>49158877
Imperatus, no question.
>>49158889
IF THE EARS ARE ROUND, PUT IT IN THE GROUND.

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>>49158898
I'm busy trying to mount a stripped and reassembled second-hand Imperatus on a scenic base at the moment. So far I've only knocked off his head and left arm in the process.

At least I'm not playing Khador circa 2005.

>>49158877
>visually
Abby2
>gameplay
The prime axiom

>>49158877
>Whats everyone's favorite model visually
Nightmare.
>gameplay wise
Also Nightmare.

He's the only non-deathjack heavy in faction that has any shot at beating up a Centurion without doubling up on armor debuffs, and he's got a little girl.

>>49158877
>Whats everyone's favorite model visually ?
Gunnbjorn
>gameplay wise?
Butcher 3

>>49158877
Despoiler

Blighted Bather

>>49158950

Yeah, the weight of the swords really fucked me. Hard to pose without a bit of help, and forget getting both of them on at the same time. Careful you don't make the back spines asymmetrical, either, the back grooves aren't real great at preventing that.

>>49158877
Molik Karn

pMorghoul

>>49158877
>Visually
Blindwalker

>Gameplay
Old Witch

http://conflictchamber.com/#b61b_-089p9q5Z7g60626ggK7A7m7yfi

Mercenary Army - 74 / 75 points

(Damiano 1) Captain Damiano [+28]
- Rocinante [18]
- Nomad [11]
Greygore Boomhowler & Co. (max) [17]
Steelhead Halberdiers (max) [11]
Steelhead Heavy Cavalry (max) [18]
Steelhead Riflemen (max) [14]
Stannis Brocker [0]
Kell Bailoch [0]
Orin Midwinter, Rogue Inquisitor [0]
Sergeant Nicolas Verendrye [4]
Rangers [9]

>>49158877
>visually ?
Shredder
>gameplay wise ?
Absylonia

>>49162127
You can take Rocinante in that theme list?

>>49162151
He has a bond with damiano, it's in the bonded rules in prime somewhere.

>>49162169
oh wow. I thought that rule died. They just took it off cards then?

>>49162127
>Kingmaker's
>No Trenchers
>No Buccanneer to make Damiano immune to ranged/magic assassinations forever

Bro what are you even doing?
The dirty little secret to Damiano is that Steelheads aren't actually that good even with him, sure as shit not as good as Trenchers.

You're probably also better off with min Boomhowlers, ambushing a full 10-man unit of medium based dudes is a pain, and they're basically just there for that one turn of flank threat anyway.

Try Croes, Damiano fixes their accuracy problem with Deadeye.

>>49162180
How does a buccaneer do that?

>>49162197
Did you even bother reading the theme benefits?

It gives all your dudes Feign Death. The Bucc can follow him around knocking him on his ass with the net so your opponent is never allowed to target him with ranged or magic attacks, ever.

Just don't be an idiot and walk into a spray assassination because you forgot he can still target other stuff and catch you in the template.

>>49162227
That makes sense. Not totally sold on croes vs pow 13 rifles though.

>>49162295
Pow 13 rifles that die horribly when anything looks at them funny. That's the problem with Steelhead rifles, they just fucking die.

Trenchers are your mid-pow shooting, CRA in 2-man pods if you need POW13. They also tend not to die easily because of native Tough and Cautious Advance.

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>>49158877
Cankerworm. He's such a creepy little model, and gameplay wise he exemplifies what I want in a Cryx 'Jack - fast, maneuverable, hard-hitting but unable to win in a stand-up fight.

>>49158877

>visually

Kodiak Heavy Jack

>gameplay

Holy Zealots

Not sure how many people read the fluff, but if you had to pick one faction to steamroll everyone else somehow and begin some sort of world domination who would be your pick and how would they do it?

>>49164869
Skorne forever

>>49164869
Cyriss. Everyone should worship interstellar math goddesses.

>Thread on forums asking for them to make more Lanyssa and AA models, since they've become such auto-includes
>After they made a big deal about ensuring models didn't become auto-includes

It's a great time to be alive.

>>49159317

You're bad and you should feel bad.

>>49166073
I like the way that they replaced cryx with cygnar after talking about balance.

>>49167747
In their defense, I don't think Cyngar represents such a meta bending threat as Cryx did.

>>49164867
Really zealots, even after this edition killed them?

>>49167763

You'd be surprised, it's sort of the exact thing in the opposite direction.

Cryx chased living infantry off the table, and rewarded support bloat (or at least, didn't punish it). Cygnar is doing the reverse of that pretty well; go bullet catchers R us or go bust.

>>49167888
I don't see lists losing support through, not that much. Maybe it's not half your list anymore, but it's not like people aren't taking that shit.

>>49162176
>>49162169
>Character jack/beasts can be included with their warnoun in theme lists if they have a bond
>Merc and minions warnouns can be used in any theme list for factions if they're Partisans

Neat, learn something new everyday.

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>>49158877
original, metal jugg

ice axe gon' get you

>>49167888
whadaya mean "bullet catchers r us"?
you mean gunlines?

>>49168766
He means instead of running your army on several key pieces, just flooding the board with models that can survive being shot and that you don't care if they die.

IE, like jack spam.

How does Menoth play in mk3?
I have:
Durst
pSevy
eKreoss
pReznik

Jacks:
Avatar, 2x Reckoner, FoS/Crusader, Vanquisher, Vigilant, Revenger, Repenter, Devout
Units
Choir
Exemplar Bastions (rip?)
KEE+UA
3x KE
TFG
Solos:
2x KES, Covenant, Vassal
Rhupert.

My Old go to for 50 points was either Crusaders of Sul tier 4 or psevy with errant star and jacks.

I'm not sure how to translate the old 50 into 75 and from what I see it wouldn't even be effective. Any Tips or advice?

>>49168766
It means that in order to get something - anything - through the sort of firepower Cygnar and chums can put out, your only option is flooding the board with cheap trash. Anti-shooting tech doesn't work because True Sight and anti-stealth abilities are extremely common, support-heavy lists don't work because key pieces can be easily picked off, and more elite armies don't have the numbers necessary to get across the board intact.

>>49158877

>Visually

Mountain King

>Gameplay

Ragnor

>>49169349
>It means that in order to get something - anything - through the sort of firepower Cygnar and chums can put out...
Are you sure you're talking about Cygnar and not Khador or Ret? Cause their ranged game is MUCH stronger.

>>49169724

Such good chums, then. Upstaging the front-runner.

>>49169724
>Such good chums, then. Upstaging the front-runner.

I'm talking about all three. It doesn't really matter if the guns pointed at you are red, blue, or white when you're trying to charge into them.

>>49169724
Khador and Ret has a burst of highly effective fire. They don't sustain a firefight like Cygnar does and skew towards it on a consistent basis.

Cygnar is the boogeyman of the meta because they play so unusually compared to everything else in the game. Cygnar's always been the consistent number two in the game because they always had answers when number 1 would start stomping around.

>>49169724

Unless Cygnar is building strange (which is to say, Stryker), they DON'T HAVE another plan. So if you can say No to ranged, you say No to Cygnar, and Bad Play Experience happens for the entire Cygnar faction.

PP deserves the endpoint of this situation.

>>49166073

Well, Lanyssa is off-design threat extension, what's the other one?

>>49174396
Alten Ashley

>>49174639
>>49174396

Who is just broken as fuck.

https://www.tiebreak.co.uk/warmachine-and-hordes-uk-nationals/stats

...as many Skorne as convergence :(

Well, at least we have the best win record.

>this is probably why PP thinks Skorne is doing fine- the handful of players that are sticking with it know how to play it

>>49175670
I don't think anyone beyond Circle(who can just block LoS) doesn't have the tools to deal with him.

He's most certainly an auto include, but I wouldn't define him as broken.

>>49176217
by definition, by being auto includes, they are broken.

>>49176217

...but Tiberion IS my shield-guard, anon-sama!

That's actually pretty funny, I think.

>>49176198

Huh. Swan sweep.

>>49176260
So then choir, beast handlers, and krielstone are broken?

>>49176365
If you didn't need to take 26+ points of jacks then choir wouldn't be an auto include.

>>49176260
Broken is only measured by their power per points ratio.

All Broken units are auto-includes, but not all auto-includes are broken.

>>49176198

If the Skorne community ever bounces back from the first 6 months of mk3, it's going to be a fucking weird group. Talk about a bottleneck; it'll be reforming around a cadre of toxic pessimists that are pretty much just hate-fucking their toys.

>>49176365
krielstone are hardly auto includes

>>49176892
I haven't bothered to play my skorne in mk3, I went back to khador. But I'm still holding on to my models until after the theme forces drop. They may make shit playable.

Ok, so I've kinda been thinking of getting into warmachine. I currently play 40k, so I'm wondering how the two compare price wise and model count wise? Also, 40k rules are a shit show, how does WM play in comparison?

Khador Army - 62 / 75 points

(Sorscha 1) Kommander Sorscha [+29]
- Behemoth [24]
- Rager [11]
- Reinholdt, Gobber Speculator [4]
Winter Guard Rifle Corps (min) [8]
- Winter Guard Rocketeer (3) [6]
Widowmaker Scouts [8]
Widowmaker Marksman [4]
Eiryss, Mage Hunter of Ios [7]
Harlan Versh, Illuminated One [4]
Kell Bailoch [5]
Orin Midwinter, Rogue Inquisitor [5]
Alten Ashley [5]

13 points left. I was thinking either Doom Reavers, or Great Bears + Iron Fang Kovnik. What do you think?

>>49177879
Doomreavers.

You need something to eat bullets to the face.

>>49177805
Model count's lower... say half a Spessmuhreen army. The eventual price will even out although starting cost is lower.

>>49177805
Cheaper to get into, probably looking at similar costs in the long run.

I much prefer the rules in WM, but you should check it out for yourself. The rules are free for download and you can watch this tutorial video to get an idea for how it plays: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGJqSUoJscU

>>49177934
>>49178057
So like, how big is the average army? Ballpark on startup?

I'm reading the rules now

>>49178220
A full-sized 75 point army is going to be a warcaster/warlock, 2-4 warbeasts/warjacks, 1 10 man unit (occasionally 2, rarely 3), maybe 1 or 2 4 to 6 man units, and a couple of solos.

Startup is a $40 box with a warcaster and 2-3 warbeasts/warjacks, and then around $40 for a unit and a few $10 solos. There are 2 player boxes that have 2 faction starter boxes plus a 10 man unit for each for $90 total, and is one of the best ways to start the game if you can find someone to split it with.

So speaking of the 2p box, are stormguard worth having?

>>49178220
$150 for a starting army at 75pts, though I would STRONGLY recommend starting small and working up as the learning curve is STEEP.

Warcaster, 2-4 jacks/beasts, two units and a few solos is basically every army, though it varies with faction and warcaster.

Don't expect ANY customisation of models as per 40k. Physically or in the rules. Or fluff really. The main attraction of this game is the ruleset and it makes no pretentions otherwise.

>>49176198
What is more interesting here is that they consider Cryx to be more playable than Retribution.

>>49167800
I'm in the same boat as >>49164867. For me, there's just something satisfying about blowing shit up.

>>49177879
>taking Winter Guard without Joe

C'mon now, what do you think you're going to hit with those RAT 5 rockets?

>>49178600
It's pSorscha.

>>49178600
Frozen stuff, and with range 14 I often get chances to aim with them. And rat 5 will still hit a lot of warjacks.

>>49178723
Great, they still need to do work before and after your feat turn.

>>49176515
What's your opinion on the hellmouth? Because the thing doesn't need to be in every list, but shit is busted as fuck. There's no 6pt module in the entire game that can trade effectively against it.

>>49178766
They got CRA. Only WG unit that NEEDS Joe is WGI.

Riflecorp get better yes obviously, but it's not a requirment

>>49178766
Freezing Grip.

Also, aiming is a thing. And the high ARM stuff you really want the boosted 12's for tends to be lower DEF anyway.

>>49178518
>https://www.tiebreak.co.uk/warmachine-and-hordes-uk-nationals/stats
Cryx has a proven aesthetic (zombie pirates).
On the other hand, Ipod elf terrorists and persian bdsm circus are obviously going to be less popular

>>49178766
Unless I'm shooting at warpwolves or something, an aimed 7 is fine. And I'd rather not drop versh for joe because purgation and blessed is highly fucking relevant in my meta. Lot of cygnar using troop buffs.

>>49178849
It's fucking nationals you retard. No one takes an army based on looks, they take it based on it's ability to win.

>>49178790
It is OP. I say this as a Legion player.
I also say this as someone that knows they will get nerfed.

I'm also quitting Legion. Not because of impending doom, but because the faction feels incomplete and fragile without pieces like the Hellmouth.

>>49178806
Rockets can't CRA. They also don't do as much damage to warjacks as the whiners would have you believe.

>>49178806
Depends on what you mean by "requirement". He's so criminally undercosted for what he does that the only legitimate reason for not taking him is you just want to be a hipster.

>>49178808
>Freezing Grip.
>Also, aiming is a thing.
Neither really help against something as simple as dug-in infantry, who will be DEF17 and thus Sorcha will miss them 50% of the time even on a boost, and even aiming they'd need a 3-man CRA just to brain one Trencher on 7s.

You gonna pop your feat just to clear an infantry screen?

>>49178891
Look man not everyone is a whaacfag.

>>49178892
Your core pieces are fine though. ravagores are ravagores and angels are angels.

Horde does feel very uncomfortable to build. I build my khador list and I feel happy with the list only to discover that I still have 12-15 pts left over.
Hordes list building always have me scrambling to figure out what I can live without.

>>49178910
They do enough damage given their criminally low cost.

>>49178927
Well, if she misses 50% of the time while boosting, Reinholdt gives her a reroll.

But you're right, the list does have a vulnerability to high def blast immune infantry. And vs def 17 a boosted shot from rat 5 is still going to miss.

>>49178967
I'm not saying they're bad, they ARE really good. But the dude said he's going to be shooting at DEF 12 heavies and they don't give a fuck about 3 boosted POW 12s

You take the rockets because with Joe they're super accurate solo/UA deleters. Not jack wreckers.

>>49179002
>And vs def 17 a boosted shot from rat 5 is still going to miss.
But you're aiming, remember? You said it yourself.

>>49178939
>Biggest tournament in the country
>Have to win multiple tournaments to be able to attend

I'm sure people are running their casual lists with PStryker.

>>49179002
Stealth will also wreck it.

>>49179044
It's not unbeatable. Reinholdt will unstealth single high priority targets, or if it's a large number of stealth infantry then the blasts can do some work. It really depends on the setup.

>>49179013
def 12 heavies are usually sitting at arm 18s naturally and likely arm 20s. It's enough that such a long ranged single shot guns can scratch paint at all for only 2 pts each.

Also it's not like Khador doesn't have means of buffing up that gun damage.

>>49172115
>It doesn't really matter if the guns pointed at you are red, blue, or white when you're trying to charge into them.
It does. Against Cygnar shooting you can just take a bunch of heavies and be fine. Doesn't work against Khador/Ret.

>>49173355
>Khador and Ret has a burst of highly effective fire. They don't sustain a firefight like Cygnar does and skew towards it on a consistent basis.
So Khador/Ret suddenly lose their guns top of three? Nice to know.
>Cygnar's always been the consistent number two in the game because they always had answers when number 1 would start stomping around.
Yeah, that number one is at the bottom of the field now. And Cygnar has quite the weakness against the new numbers one and two (and three if we're counting Circle purely as an attachment to Wormwood).

>>49179070
>>49179070
I think you're massivly over-estimating what the WGRC+Rockets can do. Especially a minimum unit without Joe.

But it's your decision so knock yourself out.

>>49178518
I think it's more to do with the fact that like nobody owned Ret outside of Australia in Mk2, and everyone owned Cryx.

So even after the mass-exodus a lot of people still have Cryx, and since nobody owned Ret they're harder to faction-hop to than something like Cygnar or Khador which tons of people owned even if they didn't play them in Mk2.

>>49179089
>Against Cygnar shooting you can just take a bunch of heavies and be fine.

I play Cryx, if the source of my butthurt isn't obvious. My 'heavies' are glorified lights that die to small arms fire.

>>49176198
The real take-away from this is that Trolls had the only 0-7 player. Disgraceful.

Also top 3 top kek:
>Cygnar, Cygnar, Cygnar

>>49179211
You under estimate the band wagoning that went on at the end of MKII and the leaks. People saw Ret and shit themselves, mass bought the faction.

>>49179334
And yet they all disappeared when tourney time happened.

Don't get me wrong, 5th from the bottom on the attendance list is a big step up for Ret, but I think you're overstating how many people seriously adopted the faction.

>>49179380
Chances are people realised that its nkt a point and click faction.

I think theres been a sudden expansion in the player base lately and the cancerous 40k and WHFB players jumped ship to Warmahordes and brought their power army bandwagoning with them. Unfortunatly you can't win on the strength of your list alone all the time in thus game.

>>49179451
Warmachine was created by people jumping ship from 40k and fantasy. There's nothing cancerous about it.

>>49179451
99% of wargamers start with a GW game dude. Warmachine is designed for tournament play so it just makes it look like you're a bandwagoning faggot who's upset other people are joining the game six months after you jumped on board.

>>49179737
>>49179781
Let's be realistic here, there's a 6-12 month chemotherapy period after someone ditches GW, and it isn't 100% successful.

>>49179039
>casual lists with PStryker
I've said it before and I'll say it again. pStryker is pretty damn strong.

>>49179013
>You take the rockets because with Joe they're super accurate solo/UA deleters. Not jack wreckers.
Until you add S+P. At which point the unit does something like 20-25 points of damage to a heavy per round from 14" away.

>>49179299
Well have you tried bringing like 10 of those with Goreshade1? Cause I'm starting Cryx because the jacks are really pretty and that's what I'll attempt. Can't do worse than my Skorne.

>>49179089
>Yeah, that number one is at the bottom of the field now. And Cygnar has quite the weakness against the new numbers one and two (and three if we're counting Circle purely as an attachment to Wormwood).
play Siege.

Cygnar's consistently performed at 2nd place beyond cryx matchups. If it was a meta where 2 lists were consistently winning, Cygnar was always ready to challenge. 2-3 years ago where list variety was huge, Cygnar suffered greatly since it was crutching on E Haley to solve the entire game for them and even she can't win against everything.

>>49179861
That type of list does a really poor job of answering most of the big questions the meta is asking right now. The list of things that won't care about a zillion Shadowmancer'd Slayers bearing down on them is actually surprisingly long.

If you want heavies in Cryx, you're primarily looking at the characters and Snapjaw.

>>49180179
Most factions are the same. Character jacks cost almost nothing on top of the original Jack's cost and out perform them in every way.

>>49180179
>The list of things that won't care about a zillion Shadowmancer'd Slayers bearing down on them is actually surprisingly long.
What exactly is that lis if you don't mind me asking. I know Sloan might be on it, depending on her list.

>>49180265
Sloan, a lot of Menoth, Wurmwood (and a lot of Circle in general, but he's the bogeyman), all of Legion, Cephalyx, and any random list that can crack armor while beating your melee threat range or timewalking you (which a lot will since Shade1 doesn't extend your threat or have a counter-timewalk).

I'd bet Ret has a way to casually not give a shit too but I'm not familiar enough with the faction to know it off the top of my head.

>>49180265
>>49180350
And don't forget that anyone with Reinhold can just unstealth Shade while his jacks still have stealth, making him very easy to kill at range.

>>49180350
>Menoth
Who exactly? Did they get such good anti-stealth tech in Mk3?

>Wurmwood
Yeah, he just fucks over everything.

>Cephalyx
How so? You mean because of the melee threat ranges?

>Ret
Ret has Riflemen, but I doubt they will take out multiple heavies. They also have that floaty woman, but I guess that would depend on the list.

>>49180350
Ok I just took a quick glance at the Ret caster cards and something like a full half of them wouldn't give even the smallest shit about a bunch of stealthed Cryx heavies with no movement accelerators.

>>49180440
>Who exactly? Did they get such good anti-stealth tech in Mk3?

Their Artillery piece is cheap as shit and does 4" Cont Fire.

>Ret has Riflemen, but I doubt they will take out multiple heavies. They also have that floaty woman, but I guess that would depend on the list.

With Ossyan, they will.

>>49180440
Menoth doesn't even need a particularly specific answer. Any random shooty list could have Reckoners+Rhoven for popping Slayers in the face from outside their threat range, and any caster with a movement buff will be presenting an alpha strike threat that Cryx heavies really can't soak.

That last bit is an inherent problem of Shade1 + lotsa heavies, Cryx heavies aren't good at gunlining without a ton of support (which he doesn't offer) and the only way they'll win a slugfest is if they get the alpha, and while SPD6 is good a whole lot of casters will buff their 'jacks to be faster than that.

>>49180229
For most factions I think it just seems that way because people are accustomed to Mk2 where a ton of character 'jacks were pure trash or niche playable at best, with a few exceptions.

Cryx is at the point where their generally viable heavy options are basically just Characters + Inflictor (which has only been tourney legal for a week), as far as I can tell most other factions can at least come up with legitimate reasons to put at least a few of their noncharacter heavies in competitive lists.

>>49181027
One of the problems there is that there are now so many characters they fill ever niche in most factions.

>>49181050
If you look at the lists on Discountgames non-character heavies are certainly being used by every Warmachine faction except Cryx. Characters are more common, but non-characters are indeed showing up in high-placing lists.

Then there's Menoth where despite having a bunch of really good characters it's just Reckoners for days, but that's to be expected I suppose.

>>49180179
>If you want heavies in Cryx, you're primarily looking at the characters and Snapjaw.

I've been experimenting with the Crabjacks and been having okay results. The Leviathan gives you some much-needed ranged threat. Yes, the gun can be unreliable, but I don't count on it being able to remove an enemy Warjack in one go - it just needs to reliably cripple systems and soften them up for other things to finish off, which it does admirably. The Harrower makes a right meal of infantry and the combination of Quick Work and Ghost Shot can be a great way of deleting annoying solos or putting some damage on squishier 'Casters. Haven't tried the Desecrator yet, but it looks workable as a cheapish body that can actually take a few hits.

>>49167623
pMorghoul is one of Skorne's best warlocks in the new edition. Because of the greater emphasis on jacks, his feat is even better than before.

>>49182066
>>49179861

There's a kind of Skorne player that likes beast-bricking a Heavy spam, and plays it well.

We need to crucify these people on the lawn outside PP (and go inside after the playtesters), because until we do the faction won't ever get fixed, and it won't end until its just them playing skorne and nobody else to so much as give them the evil eye.

>>49167800
>Really zealots, even after this edition killed them?

I still like them. They fight, they die, they fight again. They also remain a relatively cheap option in terms of pure number of bodies.

And pretty much everyone took a hit to defenses, so Rat4 isn't nearly as bad as people think.

And lots of people still forget that immunity to spells, which includes attacks made using the Magic Ability, and immunity to fire.

And tossing that many AoE templates is just damn fun. I always manage to get my points back with them.

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>>49169119

Menoth does well in mk3.

We don't have any BAD casters, but Severius1 and 2, Durst, and Thyra are pretty damn good.

We play a wider variety of jacks and are much less reliant on Reckoner/Vanquisher than before. Guardians, Hand of Judgement, Scourge of Heresy, and Blood of Martyrs are new all stars our cheaper beat sticks: Crusaders, Castigators, Sanctifiers, and Templars are all solid options. Vigilant is also a contender with Devout for the task of bodyguard jack.

Infantry-wise, Idrians have replaced the role previously held by Errants as our foward deployment, pathfinder, shooty/melee unit. Cinerators have replaced Bastions as premiere medium based infantry. The Sunburst artillery is also awesome as well. Cleansers are pretty good now too. Choir is still plenty useful for preventing magic/shooting and the damage buff. Rhoven and Co are much better now that they have Shield Guard and he has battle wizard. Daughters and KE are still solid.

Vassals are now more optional, while Mechaniks are much more effective. Vilmon and Paladins lost immunity to non-magic attacks, but gained Vilmon gained Shield Guard and they all gained Vengeance. Monks are now awesome, as are Reclaimers.

In short, expect to field a lot of models you didn't see often in Mk2 and still be competitive.

>>49181080
>Then there's Menoth where despite having a bunch of really good characters it's just Reckoners for days, but that's to be expected I suppose.

They're nowhere near as ubiquitous as before. I've seen Fire of Salvation, Hand of Judgement, Crusaders, and Guardians more often than I've seen Reckoners. I've yet to see a Vanquisher.

>>49158877
>This many replies
>No Archangel
Fucking plebians

FLGS will be starting a modified (12-week) Journeyman League later this month. I haven't played Mk 3 yet, and have pretty much forgotten all there is to playing Warmahordes.

What faction's battlegroup starter would be most forgiving for a beginner? I have several Khador models already (Grolar, Ruin, the basic jacks, Butcher, Scorsha, infantry), so I might just go that route, but it all depends if they're easy to learn with without being too weak. I'd also have to buy all new cards, so either way I'm buying new stuff.

>>49185127
Khador is easy and strong. Go for it.

>>49158877

gameplay wise
>Haley3

For sure, shes super cool

>>49184145
Thyra? Mind telling why?

File: Goreshade1_75 (1).png (188KB, 409x687px) Image search: [Google]

188KB, 409x687px

>>49179861

Giving the whole army stealth is actually a big deal, especially with the Star Crossed/Orin/Deathwalker/3xShield Guard/Lamentation denial chain. Reinholdt is a plague on the list, since you can't prevent his anti-stealth from just picking a model and having every gun in the list point at that model. That makes Goreshade have to play back in the matchup.

Obviously, don't play into Sloan.

>>49183836
But if Skorne does well spamming beasts, why don't you just spam beasts and win?

>>49185563

1) Power-up helps her run jacks where she was focus starved before.

2) Blood of Martyrs, her character jack, is now pretty damn good.

3) Daughters have innate stealth, ignore tough, and they no longer have to start in a target's back arc to get the back strike bonus, so they're much better (and they were already good).

4) Thyra herself now has stealth, and her Pursuit spell (an offensive upkeep) was replaced with Gates of Death, which lets her teleport up to 6" at the end of your entire turn. Also, since she and daughters have innate stealth, that frees up another unit to get Occultation.

5) With changes to overboosting, casters aren't as resilient when faced with multiple boosted pow11 weaponmaster attacks as they used to be.

>>49185127

Khador is the straightforward power faction at the moment. After people get a hang of the tricks and combos in other factions and get used to Khador's predictability, Khador's straight forwardness will see it drop a bit in the rankings, but until then, it's a solid faction.

And the army and its jacks are just so cool, which is why so many people get into it to begin with.

>>49173355

No, they weren't MK1 was all Cryx and Khador. Especially Khador with Sorscha pre nerfs, Vlad2 with his retarded feat, and Old witch,

In MK2 Cygnar was in a ghetto until Stormwall.

Cygnar's only saving grace was they generally have a good game into Cryx (who coruled early Mk 1 and Endgame Mk1), because Haley has always been the eternal fuck you.

Are Legion heavy + support solos lists still viable in mk3?
Or are units now a must include?

>>49187063

It's still viable. Infantry just isn't so shitty that you never want to take them. Good to have a unit if only to screen your beasts.

>>49185631
>But if Skorne does well spamming beasts, why don't you just spam beasts and win?

They're "balanced" spamming beasts and bricking up, anon. You do that and you're just dealing with bad design on a counterpunch faction. Do otherwise and it's that with a "why don't you just play true to our glorious vision for skorne!" punishment march.

>>49187521

So what does this mean?

That spamming beasts works for Skorne is a bad thing even though it works because it goes against the designer's intent?

Anyone have the spoiler info for Una 3?

>>49187593
In Mk2, they spammed beasts, and it was their best tactic, beyond some brick lists that started to come to the fore.

And PP nerfed most of it. Their statlines got worse, they lost Fury, they lost defensive tech, and they lost free charges.

So their Beast spam is pretty terrible now.