/cofd/&/wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness General

>>46439518
http://theonyxpath.com/prometheanmilestones/

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Why isn't this Gay Werewolves Edition?

I want Father Wolf to knot me and get me pregnant with wolf pups!

>>46439580
Because there is no contention on the subject: Everyone loves gay werewolves, and we need arguments for a thread to thrive.

>>46439562
>Making a new Arisen is fucking impossible, mate.
Take your candiate. Push them through a time portal into Irem during the time of the Rite of Return's preparation (God-Machine Infrastructure result maybe?).
Have them assimilated into Irem Society well enough that they get chosen as a Mummy candidate. Hope they survive the ordeal and become a true Mummy.

>>46439674
>Have them assimilated into Irem Society well enough that they get chosen as a Mummy candidate.
you could just use magic to force the ritualists to make him part of it

>Mage 2e and Promethean 2e likely this year, maybe Changeling 2e next year
>Hunter 2e next year, maybe Geist 2e gets announced at Gen Con

>tfw no Mummy 2e until 2018/2019

>>46439674

The Rite broke time, according to Book of the Deceived. I wouldn't be surprised if time travel to Irem is impossible.

>>46439518
Chronicles of Fagness

Which CofD gameline is the most vaporwave?

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>>46439687
>Mage 2e likely this year

>>46439706
Or easy. Maybe the rite survived in a hundred degenerative forms. Vampirism. Purification. Prometheans. Some legacies of mages. The aftershocks echoed through history and embedded themselves into the universe. I'll admit to being leery on the exact difference between Fate and fate, but the idea of it being rent and alteree to continually spew these degenerate forms of the rite as a result of the ritual doesn't seem too wonky, even if modern day Mummies can't scratch it

>>46439745
Innocents.

>>46439745
>vaporwave
Da fuk is dat?

>>46439580
I approve

>tfw i know the name of the bottom in that pic

>>46439819
Well... Do tell! Don't leave us hanging!

>>46439803
Anon probably means vaporware, i.e. an announced product that never materializes, but can't even force a meme properly.

>>46439819
Actually, wait, I know the top too

>tfw I know the gay werewolves and could actually find this clip if I wanted to

>>46439839
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaporwave

MtAs movie when?

>>46439745
Mage, maybe Changeling, Promethean, or Werewolf.

>>46439803
>>46439839
>Not knowing about Vaporwave

>>46439866
...Huh. I guess I stand corrected?

>>46439580
>>46439606

Hmm.. Considering the talking about it in Viking Werewolf, we do actually have enough material to whine about.

>>46439235
>mages are basically human

There's really no reason to get nasty.

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>>46439803
>>46439839

Vaporwave is both a musical genre and a visual aesthetic that relies on warped nostalgia and the empty promises of 1980s and 1990s consumerism/corporate culture. References are often made to the crappy CGI of the early internet and Japanese 80s culture. Dreamy and surreal if not outright sinister, vaporwave often aspires to the image of the 'virtual plaza,' a mental space reminiscent of a utopian or abandoned shopping mall.

>>46439879
>no mention of Demon, the splat most likely to have something unpleasant lurking beneath an office building or mall

>>46439580
>>46439606

At this point, gay werewolves are so ubiquitous and boring that they could demand their own pronouns, and we still wouldn't care.

>>46439951
He meant in that they have no supernatural banes, not that they're animals with no magic in their soul

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>>46439957
Vaporwave is dada for the modern age.

>>46440008

I know. It was sarcasm.

However, to some mages (*cough* Mysterium *cough*), calling a mage "basically human" is like calling a werewolf "basically a big dog."

>>46440066
If you instead phrase it as "only human" it's the Silver Ladder who'll spazz out.

And I'm not sure the Mysterium denies the human part. Only any accusation that they are the same as sleepers.

Are human members of Werewolf Packs sleepers or sleepwalkers?

>>46440107

Sleepers. If you don't have the Sleepwalker merit or a template, you're a Sleeper.

Though I'd argue that Mumy Witnesses probably count as Sleepwalkers.

>>46440129
But don't the humans benefit from the pack bonuses as well?

>>46438678
>Mages in a werewolf pack
>Can love bloom?

In the CofD, there's nothing like man-dog love.

"Who's a good girl,
Who's a good girl,
Who gives good head,
You do, yes you do..."

>>46439844
Share, please.

>>46439901
The ergi section sort of bothers me but only because it's codified rules and not fluff thing.

>>46440156
Cue Death Rage and genital mutilation.
That said, an Urshul would probably be the ultimate cuddle toy.

>>46440107

It depends on the human. Any person with the Sleepwalker Merit or any inherent supernatural ability is considered a Sleepwalker, including all supernatural splats, wolf-blooded, ghouls, psychics, etc.

Did anything come about the White-Wolf sell? Is OP still working on 4e for VtM?

>>46439978
Fair enough

>>46440187
Dale Cooper and Anthony Romero
Enjoy

>>46440107
>>46440232
Becoming a member of the pack does not make one a Sleepwalker, so unless they already were, they're a Sleeper.
Becoming a Wolf-blooded does make you a Sleepwalker, though.

Most people don't choose to join a pack knowing it's a Werewolf pack, anyways. Or, if they do, they've at least never seen the Werewolves.

>>46440188
>Referring to the murderous and powerful dire wolf form, the penultimate apex predator, as the "ultimate cuddle toy"

>more likely to incite Death Rage than doggy baby talk

>tfw discussing inter-species dating problems in the CofD

>>46440234

OPP is making the 20th Anniversary editions with Paradox oversight while the new White Wolf is handling 4e themselves.

>>46440187
>ergi

It's more about cultural "manliness" than "homosexuality."

The distinction is meaningful and important.

>>46440365
Any word on a release for any of this stuff?

>>46440365
Finally, there's been a Malkavian shaped hole in my heart for a decade.

>>46440409

What are you talking about? V20 has been going strong for years now.

>>46440150
>But don't the humans benefit from the pack bonuses as well?

All members of a pack receive Totem bonuses. However, this is not an inherent supernatural condition, and will not render a normal human a Sleepwalker.

In fact, as other Anons correctly note, many humans don't even know they're in a werewolf pack or receive any supernatural benefits.

>>46440409
Fill it with the glorious plague of madness of the Ventrue book.

>>46440478
>Mages are not necessarily under such as restriction.
Either are werewolves.
>They can also just enter (spirit, death or goetic) Twilight to escape combat.
Werewolves have ways to fight things in the other Twilights.

>>46440156
>>46440188
You just make sure to do it to one who has a pet-play fetish.

>lull in shitposts as they argue on forum

So our current campaign is having its finale next weekend, and one of my players is interested in trying his hand at running Mage. How likely is it that 2e will actually be out in the next few weeks?

I've talked about some of the lore to our group, but I've held off going into much detail on the mechanics in the hopes that we can just teach them the new rules from the get-go. I was also hoping we'd be able to grab a hardcover version of the book for reference, too—are those usually available right off the bat, or am I going to have to settle for the PDF if we want to get started immediately?

>>46440390
I know and that's not the part that bothers me. More that enforcing it with obligatory mechanics feels kind of cheap.

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>>46441011
>How likely is it that 2e will actually be out in the next few weeks?

>>46441011
Dude, we've been waiting for over a year. As of now, it's going through it's first proofing by DaveB. It has another round with DaveB before it goes to WW, which could take a week or two. That'll probably take a few weeks. Unless something happens that fucks everything up, again.

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We've had an antagonist we've sort of partly met who I think is an idigam. The only npc we've met who's met him before thinks he's a powerful claimed, but he seems to be building a Gauntlet that works (impenetrable).

We just explored what might be his origin place and lo and behold, fucking gator hosts. EVerywhere, too. Looking through to the Shadow is like looking through a cage in a gator farm, you can't really make out much beyond the gators. And while most of them are really small, we just found a particularly huge one. But they're all just in the gauntlet. And we don't know what the fuck gator hosts do, but it's fucking cold wherever they are, and whenever we lok through the gauntlet we just get hit with a wall of chill

>>46441141
End of April seems not TOO impossible to hope for.
Probably closer to the end of May.

http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/858523-cults-for-everyone

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Fucking Adamantine Arrow.

>>46441261

Oh, neat! Gonna keep an eye on this.

Deviant when

>>46441584
2017
If we're lucky

>>46441584
We'll probably have a Kickstarter late this autumn, and a release a year or so after.

>>46441656
They should at least announce the subtitle soon

At this point it feels like they came up with the idea but haven't bothered to write any of it yet

>>46439778
oh god I love this idea

>>46440400
The only thing they've said is 'there will be a release in 2016' but it didn't specify if it was TT, LARP or vidya. Though they are working with some company to make an Official White Wolf Slot Machine game so perhaps that's what we're getting.

>>46442049
>Official White Wolf Slot Machine game
You are kidding, right?

>>46443083

No. Almost as soon as he took the helm, Dracula whored the IP out to some video slots company.

>>46443092

If we've learned anything from Konami, it's that if you actually want to make any kind of money in the gaming industry, you do gambling and slots.

>>46443092
Link? Because what the fuck would that even be like?

>>46443273
Judging from other licensed slot machines i've seen your basic slot machine with a white wolf coat of paint.
So vampires i guess?

>>46443273
This is the company: http://foxium.com/project/big-time-journey/ Their games are super depressing, too.

>>46443338
>Their games are super depressing, too.
So, it's World of Darkness.
Great.

>>46443338
Depressing as in content or quality?

>>46443403

As in content. Even the guy standing there doesn't look excited about the game. And you get a cheevo for losing a certain number of times in a row, in the video.

>>46443419
So you get a cheevo for giving up your cash a bunch? Sounds about right for a shitty slots game.

http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/beast-the-primordial-aa/851139-the-final-download-has-arrived?p=858088#post858088

Guy blind-purchases Beast and the setting immediately encourages him to create an insane clown torturer/rapist. I'm fucking amused

just like his clown monster

>>46441141
I've been waiting since fucking Fall '14 when it was still called Fallen World fucking Chronicle.

>>46443544

I can't fucking believe someone used Beast to make Baron Von Tokentakker from CarnEvil.

Is the Beast anthology out for the public to buy yet?

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>>46443606
>waiting on Mage 2E
>assuming it will ever be released
>MFW

>>46439580
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mKNdS7Soo0w

Can a Werewolf and a Changeling ever find true love together?

>>46443711

Nope. It took like a month or so for Dreams of Avarice to go on sale, though, so just be patient.

So there was another thread where someone mentioned ghoul families. What's your opinion on them /tg/?

I think they're a great way to add a bit of a way for ghoul PC's to be more anchored into vampiric society while also amplifying the horror of being a ghoul.

>No Supernal Sunday again
>The Exarchs are winning

>overweight uggo jew tranny
>terrible writer
>okay fluff but nothing special
>got her job by begging, and lost it for leaking games
>fired, her work is being used and she's not being credited or paid
>nobody will hire her
>is hated by most RPG industry figures.

Just a friendly reminder that you aren't Amy Veeres to perk up your day. :^)

>>46444761
[highlight] testing [/highlight]

>>46444815

This is by far the worst and most elaborate attempt to commit negging I've ever seen. Just ask her out, dude.

>>46444761

Was that suppose to be weekly? I just figured it was a one-time-only deal.

>>46444883
>Was that suppose to be weekly? I just figured it was a one-time-only deal.

Not weekly, but every now and then. He dropped the Mage Sight one so we could understand what the Advanced Mage Sight stuff from SoS would be about. So presumably the next post will be out before MtAw2 drops.

>>46444761
>>No Supernal Sunday again

It's truly disappointing.

Dave's probably cruising a bit on all the glory and compliments he's recently received about The Sundered World in Dark Eras and the "Premeditation" short story from the Beast Fiction Anthology. I also imagine that he's prioritizing finalizing the proofs of Mage 2e and would much prefer to have it released before he spoils more of Signs of Sorcery.

>>46444883
>negging
>implying it isn't just amy having a pity party

>>46443544
Every game of World of Darkness I've joined online had some idiot who first wants to play a clown.

>>46439580
Didn't we already have gay werewolves edition?

>>46445303
Gay furries want every thread to be gay werewolf edition.

>>46445354

I don't even dignify gay werewolf posts unless the Anon demands special pronouns.

>>46445247
>Every game of World of Darkness I've joined online had some idiot who first wants to play a clown.

Sadly, almost every game has That Guy.

It's an occupational hazard of role-playing.

>>46445354
It's not furry unless you try to convince him to fuck in gauru. And then it's more suicidal than furry.

>>46443773
More of a werewolf/kitsune thing and we'll never have acceptable Changing Breeds in nWoD, so no. Any love they find would need heavy houseruling.

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So did they get around to doing Bloodlines yet?

>>46445412
There's been like 7, and they all have had different people wanting to play a clown.

And its their first choice. Not like their first choice was untenable and they decided to make a clown.

>>46445465
>we'll never have acceptable Changing Breeds in nWoD

DaveB included a changing breed cat in his excellent recent mage / beast crossover story, "Premeditation," and expressed an interest in revising them for 2e.

If anyone could turn the changing breeds from a weird furry fantasy into actual playable characters, it would be people like Dave and Chris.

>>46445539
Nope.

>>46445554
Ouch. Are they even playing that one Daeva bloodline or are they just playing a straight up clown?

>>46445554

I'm not surprised. Beast fans on the OP forums and rpg.net are like a support group for That Guys.

>>46445539
>So did they get around to doing Bloodlines yet?
Years ago. But it was released early, and it was buggy as hell. To top things up, the studio that did it folded, so no patch support..
But hey, there is a lot of unofficial support for it, so it is playable.

>>46445607
>Ouch. Are they even playing that one Daeva bloodline or are they just playing a straight up clown?
Straight up clowns. Clowns who turned into werewolves and mages, and normal people who decided upon becoming werewolves, mages, nosferatu, and hunters to become clowns. One changeling who was turned into a clown.

>>46444549
I am in love with the concept. Like deeply and profoundly.

I agree that it gives PCs more options and probably makes ghoul based games more playable.

I feel like you have to keep in mind, though- with a regular ghoul, they started out as a normal person- like anyone on this thread, probably. Then they got ghouled and that caused them to become somehow unhinged around their domitor. Someone from a ghoul or revenant family was never properly hinged to begin with. Everything you were raised with, all of that is normal for you, whether it's having family gatherings at a mansion in the middle of nowhere that could be on hoarders which consist of eating shitloads of roasted meat off whatever available surface you can find while your cousins fight their altered murderdogs to the death, or watching your younger siblings getting fed vitae breastmilk or visits from your great great great great grandaunt who is checking you every year to see if you might be worthy.

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>>46445646
>Straight up clowns

Jesus christ.

>>46445601
Is Changing Breeds even as bad as Fursona?

>>46445601
I want to believe in Dave and Chris. Please, hear my prayers, devs, all I want is slightly altered werewolf 2e mechanics. Just make it all compatible instead of renaming every fucking thing and over costing a bunch of shitty abilities.

>>46445646
Changeling forced into being some kind of clown at least seems reasonable, though that's the kind of Durance that you would probably want to distance yourself from once you get back. Unless you're Autumn Court and want to prey on all the fear at children's birthday parties.

>>46445465
I liked the corvids and some of the other weird ones.

>>46445721
>Is Changing Breeds even as bad as Fursona?

Changing Breeds has three major problems, as I see it.

1) The tone. The book is extremely self-congratulatory and smug.
2) The message. This book is all about how nature is better and purer than anything humanity makes.
3) The mechanics. It's a mess. I'm not even sure to say if it's over-powered or under-powered. It's simply so much of a mess that it would take too much effort to find out how it works.

>>46444997
I imagine he's waiting until he's done the proofs and Mage 2e's advancement toward production doesn't currently depend directly on him before he spoils more of its first supplement, yeah.

He wants us to be able to play the game, and he wants to get paid already.

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>>46445748
I played a Corvian for a long time in 1e and it still needed jury-rigging. But being weak in a fight was fine since there were a bunch of werewolves to get their hands dirty for me.

>>46445731
>I want to believe in Dave and Chris. Please, hear my prayers, devs, all I want is slightly altered werewolf 2e mechanics. Just make it all compatible instead of renaming every fucking thing and over costing a bunch of shitty abilities.

What I want is a new and improved Skinchangers.

The book would be split in three parts: The first part would be about skinchangers, and a lot of stuff about them as a lesser template, based on merits. The second part would be About the Changing Breeds. And instead of filling the book with page after page after page of examples, there would be broad categories of animals. The third part would be about the other organized races of shapeshifters, the ones who were presented in War Against the Pure.

>>46445716
You from the That Girl thread?

>I feel like you have to keep in mind, though- with a regular ghoul, they started out as a normal person- like anyone on this thread, probably. Then they got ghouled and that caused them to become somehow unhinged around their domitor. Someone from a ghoul or revenant family was never properly hinged to begin with. Everything you were raised with, all of that is normal for you, whether it's having family gatherings at a mansion in the middle of nowhere that could be on hoarders which consist of eating shitloads of roasted meat off whatever available surface you can find while your cousins fight their altered murderdogs to the death, or watching your younger siblings getting fed vitae breastmilk or visits from your great great great great grandaunt who is checking you every year to see if you might be worthy.

Yeah, that they're really damned fucked up is a given, but you can play that up if you want in a different way, especially if you're a ghoul getting scouted for 'joining' them and aren't from a ghoul family yourself. You can really play up the creepy factor as an outsider looking in and getting sucked deeper and deeper down the rabbit hole. They're just like you but at the same time not you. Pod people in essence. And that's probably the most fucking terrifying thing - these are the ones who are in the same situation you are, and don't find it unusual.

Plus it could be a neat goal for an Invictus PC to basically create a ghoul family like some bored noble would breed racehorses. There's a lot of options with just the concept alone that I find fascinating.

>>46445731
A changeling being kept as the court jester of one of the Gentry could be an interesting character. Especially if they're a fairest. Talk about lack of glamour when it comes to your durance.

>>46443544
this is the same faggot who made that terrible sex thread

>>46445844
I think devoting a section to Breeds and a different section to 'Breeds but with organization' is a little redundant. It would be nice if the third wing for that kind of book was updated Purified. Or, maybe, something that portrays the Pure themselves as anything other than reactionary racist assholes.

>>46445940
Can't be worse than that one guy who ended up making a demon abortion xp grinder.

>>46445601
>>46445731

I doubt OP will devote any time or resources to a revised changing breeds when there so much new material they want to explore. Dave also probably has his hands full developing both Mage and Deviant.

Maybe one day we'll get some small changing breeds updates within another project, similar to how skinchanging got a new merit system in Dark Eras.

>>46445971
>something that portrays the Pure themselves as anything other than reactionary racist assholes.
most of the books about the pure do that
2e especially
>honor the hunt
>honor your family
>honor the spirit
the cocks!

>>46445866
That sounds fun. You could have all kinds of crazy things happening and people are just shrugging. I just meant that a lot of the people I know who play aren't up for the blue and orange morality so we tend to play splats where you're more likely to have more humanlike morality systems.

And breeding your own custom humans sounds like a great goal for a variety of long lived characters.

Yes. Hi.

>>46446199
Glad to see you found me again. I don't have many people to discuss ghoul families with because most people don't seem to be very interested in them. Wouldn't mind running a one on one ghoul focused campaign honestly.

The custom humans thing is also part of the appeal, because ghoul families help reinforce just how inhuman vampires themselves are. It's something beyond the pale, the sort of treating humans as livestock attitude vampires have being taken to its logical conclusion. The mix of blue and orange morality needed for something like this is also interesting to explore too.

>>46445866
>Plus it could be a neat goal for an Invictus PC to basically create a ghoul family like some bored noble would breed racehorses.
New character goal

>>46446295
thats what solomon birch is doing
one of the other characters fucked him over by introducing HIV into the bloodline

>>46441426
Further improvement on the Cult Idea.
If you want to voice an opinion nows the time.

>>46446295
It's not an easy thing to do though, mainly because you need to find something really fucking rare - a fertile ghoul female. Usually the process of ghoulification renders someone sterile as long as they're on vitae. You can use rituals I suppose to get around this (blood magic like the stuff done for the creation of dhampirs) but for someone of the Invicus that isn't an option.

Read the ghoul splat for VtR for more info, it's really a fascinatingly fucked up segment of the lore and I love it.

>>46446403
Just use that method that lets the vampire impregnate anything, even men.

Create your strong clan of all-male ghouls living on a glorious compound of masculinity.

>>46446446
Except it doesn't work that way anon and the ghoul dude you knock up will probably die creating the hellspawn you made which won't be a ghoul itself but a Dhampir.

>>46446403
>>46446295
>>46446339

Yeah, for some reason long term selective breeding programs for human beings are my obsession. I blame Dune. It's not even like a magical realm, I just think it's awesome.

In VTM, there was this really cool part of the Tzimisce clanbook that implied that some people out there are walking around as revenant partbreeds (usually with little or no powers but often certain psychopathic tendencies or something) and that there is a group called "the Carpathian legacy foundation" who is trying to gather those people for some purpose.

>>46446446
Mpreg=glorious masculinity???

Who wrote To The Strongest in Dark Eras?

I know Dave developed the chapter, but the authors aren't listed.

>>46446546
>the Carpathian legacy foundation
I remember reading that shit and thinking "I need to use this somehow"

>>46446546
It's both magical realm and not magical realm at the same time; people have been proposing human eugenics programs since we had a basic understanding of inheritance. Vampires doing it too is just kind of logical.

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>>46446546
>Yeah, for some reason long term selective breeding programs for human beings are my obsession. I blame Dune. It's not even like a magical realm, I just think it's awesome.

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>>46446602
There's a lot of shit like this in WoD. I think the writers have some magical realm skeletons in their closets.

>>46446593
Yeah, I want to be in a campaign centered around that.

>>46446599
Yeah, I mean the reason selective breeding cults usually fall apart is because the members of the cult die out, but a vampire can just keep reinforcing their beliefs on their minions.

>>46446602
Nope, still my nonsexual magical realm.

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>>46446602
The Ivory Claws are also nice!

>>46446639
>I think the writers have some magical realm skeletons in their closets.
Sounds like projection on your part.

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>>46446706
And you don't?

>>46446693
Thanks for posting that
I wanna run a Werewolf game at some point and I was wanting that for inspiration in case it does happen, and it also works as inspiration for my Demon game in the meantime

>>46446693
Fuck... just fuck...

>>46446497
Not necessarily seeing a downside. And you can probably save the ghoul's life with the right tricks, you just can't save them from the psychological damage of being used for a vampire incubator. Makes it easier the next time, though.

>>46446546
>continuing the species without relying on women
>not glorious or masculine

>>46446860
>Gloriously experiencing weird cravings for fried chicken and vanilla ice cream
>Gloriously pushing an afterbirth out of your anus.

Sorry, Mpreg is something I associate with 15 year old slash fanfic writers.

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While browsing a used book store last week, I came across a copy of this game, Werewolf: The Apocalypse second edition. Given how the book was in good shape and only 7$, I added it to the pile of novels I was already planning to buy. While I am hardly the biggest fan of W:TA (and OWoD) in general and I do find the game needlessly pretentious and preachy (which it is) I've got to admit I've found a certain...charm...to it after having read my book. With a few tweaks here and there I know I could get some mileage out of this game, even if possibly just for a one shot. After all, I got the book might as well use it at least once, no?

That said I do have some questions:
A) How well does 2ed hold up crunch-wise? I know WTA got a 20th anniversary version which is presumably better crunch-wise. I've only checked that version for the fluff, which I know got updated/compiled/expanded.
B) How different is it rule-wise from the other OWOD splatbooks? The book mention vampires and the other supernatural splat as potential crossover material but how well do they handle when exposed to WTA rules?

>>46446851
I love that one. It's amazing. Hence the naming.

Adding to that the lore of the Sundered World, I wonder how large a piece of the Old Father they have down there. And if they, perhaps, have a part of his heart as well?

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>>46446693
Well that's fucking disturbing.

>>46446860
>Don't see the downside
You're creating a dhampir, not a ghoul. This is fucking why it doesn't work. The dhampir will end up killing you. It's how it happens.

>>46446910
I aquired the original Mummy, Demon, and Mage from a used bookstore in good shape too. Werewolf is metal as fuck when played right (ie not being a fucking hippy)

>>46446941
>I aquired the original Mummy, Demon, and Mage from a used bookstore in good shape too. Werewolf is metal as fuck when played right (ie not being a fucking hippy)
Yeah but its hard to not look at this game and shake your head when the 'heroes' are man-beasts who want humans to give up medicine and toilet paper.

>>46446851
The idea was them using their money and connections to try and recreate Father Wolf through breeding/science.

>>46446941
>Well that's fucking disturbing.

Which is why we love Chris.

>>46446910
20th Anniversary books are based off of the Revised/3rd Edition versions and then adjusted from there. They're more an omnibus than an entirely new edition.

A lot of people I know swear by the 2nd Edition versions of most of the games though, since it also has plotline and story that aren't 'right on the edge of the end of the world' for the gamelines.

>>46446955
>the Tzimisce gets "creative"

>>46447018
So should I use my 2e book if I was to run the game or am I better off using the 20th anniversary version?

>>46446995
Not all of them are, just the hippy ones (Children of Gaia) and the crazy psychos. Basically, the Viking werewolf guys and the hobo ones are the best. Honorable mention goes to the perpetually drunken irishmen.

Play werewolf like Captain Planet meets Dog Soldiers: You're stopping pollution yes, but you're doing it because fucking shit up is what you were BORN TO DO. BORN TO KILL CHARLIE PENTEX DON'T SURF YEEHAA

>>46447047
20th annivesary has a lot more than the book, including some of the changing breeds and lost tribes
you can run it with just the 2e book you got, though, the 20e is just more streamlined/comprehensive

>>46447047
Up to you. The rules are typically a little tighter in the later versions, so you'd have a bit more clean and defined rules in the 20th Anniversary edition. Which is also metaplot agnostic and doesn't assume that any version of the Apocalypse has happened. But the 2nd Edition version is serviceable for just a raw WtA game, no problems.

>>46447018
>since it also has plotline and story that aren't 'right on the edge of the end of the world' for the gamelines.
What if I really don't fucking care about metaplot and would rather just use the game as a framework/setup rather than follow the dumb as fuck metaplot?

>>46447047
20th Anniversary honestly; it updates everything, includes a lot of splatbook stuff, and has some fucking great art.

>>46447028
>failed attempt at vozhd.

>>46447081
I'm sending this description to my friend who plays Werewolf and takes it too seriously, thanks.

>>46447028
I have a working Tzimisce bloodline in Requiem 2.
If the players ever get into serious conflict with them, I think the Tzimisce will release... that.

>>46447176
...Failed?
No no. Just... Aesthetically groundbreaking.

>>46447090
>>46447141
Welp, guess even if I was to run WTA my physical copy would be gathering dust.

>>46447176
A friend of mine also once described Werewolf the Apocolypse as 'Mighty Morphin' Gaia Rangers' and I can't really argue with him on that. It just seems like the best way to play it, considering there's you know, fucking cyborg spiders with laser guns. I really can't take oWerewolf seriously, much like how I can't take Changeling the Lost as anything but an Otherkin wankfest.

>>46447239
Nah, you can still pop it open and read it. I do with my copies of mummy even though I'll never play it. It's amusing to note how much they got wrong about mythology and archaeology. I could make a drinking game.

>>46447241
At least, Werewolf's defense is that it can be manly and utterly metal as fuck. I mean, furry jokes aside, a Get of Fenris Ahroun in Crinos form is easily amongst the most hardcore blood-drenched monstrosity in tabletop history right next to a Khorne Berserker.

>>46447129
Then you'll be fine. Though you might get more mileage out of the 20th Anniversary stuff since it's an omnibus and has absolutely EVERYTHING included in that big man-murdering book.

If you were going to play in a Mage game but you had to pick a legacy (none off limits) which would it be?

>>46447241
I thought that Changeling the Dreaming was an otherkin wankfest and Changeling the Lost was basically Jessica Jones?

I think it's a shame that Changelings in Cwod can't be in a room with vampires. It would be fun to put some toreadors and some changelings into a room together and watch what happened.

>>46446904
Which, interestingly, makes it fit with Vampire's LiveJournal aesthetic.

>>46447362
They can be around Malkavians and Kiasyd for a short amount of time, as those have the least Banality. Also Ravnos, but then Chimerstry fucks up a Changeling's fae soul like normal Changeling chimerical weaponry.

>>46447362
>I thought that Changeling the Dreaming was an otherkin wankfest and Changeling the Lost was basically Jessica Jones?
hah, no, ctl is made for the people who have deviantart accounts to show off their true souls

>>46447309
Exactly, that's why despite all the furry shit werewolf is the better game overall. It's about hulking out and ripping things in half as a giant murder machine of flesh and rage and animalistic violence.

Plus you know, every battle scene would look like something out of a heavy metal album cover so there's that.

>>46447362
Yeah, I meant Dreaming. Forgive me anon for I have sinned. Lost is the only changeling I remember for the other is so terrible my mind has been forcibly purged of its knowledge.

>>46447427
>It's about hulking out and ripping things in half as a giant murder machine of flesh and rage and animalistic violence.
So basically angry 13 year old wish fulfillment.

>>46447441
Probably, but you could argue its no different than playing a Barbarian in D&D or a Space Wolf or Flesh Tearer in Deathwatch. Its all about playing a monstrous, feral killing machine.

>>46447441
>So basically angry 13 year old wish fulfillment.
That's not fair, that's basically every cWoD game.

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>>46447441
Basically, I mean that is the core audience of Classic WoD let's not kid ourselves here

>>46447481
That or edgy, 'tormented' and 'oppressed' teenagers.

>>46447426
I thought that was Beast.

Changeling is about people who got through something utterly terrifying, and when they came out they were alive, but forever changed.

>>46447510
>I thought that was Beast.
Beast is the shitty rehash of *Old* Changeling mixed with a dash of more modernized 'oppression'. I know they changed it since the leaked PDF, but the older version of Beast was cringeworthy.

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>>46447506
Hey, we all went through that phase at some point.

>>46447510
Dreaming and Beast are for the otherkin fags. Lost is alternately for the 'WHY DID THIS HAPPEN TO ME' emos and the paranoid schizophrenics who eat cookies while holding FAL's while in the shower. Lost can be a paranoia trip on par with a well done Demon: the Descent game.

>>46447410
So the homeless Malkavian's imaginary friend was actually a Changeling, and his derangement is something else?

>>46447510
>I thought that was Beast.
>Changeling is about people who got through something utterly terrifying, and when they came out they were alive, but forever changed.
nah, if you look carefully at the backgrounds of the deviantartfolk you'll see they're all victims of sexual abuse (some white female just couldn't resist raping his rolls of fat with her eyes)
since lost is also abut rape fantasies, it fits there, too

beast is more for the social justice warriors
mindlessly telling themselves "what I'm doing is right" without recognizing themselves for the monsters they are
its why there's no morality scale

>>46447569
Careful dude, you'll make some people annoyed with those three letters. Possibly even risk nuking this thread.

>>46447566
If you want it to be.

>>46447569
Except that's not what lost is. Lost is being, well, lost. Lost is about PTSD, abuse, and being trapped within your own psyche and not knowing what's just another flashback to 'nam and what's really going on. Lost is all about perception and how you handle losing so much of yourself.

Beast is more how you described that deviant art folks. Woe is me I'm doing the right thing shit.

>>46447625
Beast leak was pretty heavily SJW shit though.

>>46447688
>Beast leak was pretty heavily SJW shit though.
Yeah but we can't talk about SJW without people screaming they don't exist and that you must be a neo-nazi if you do. Now watch it, we'll either get these post deleted or we'll see this thread turn to shit.

When did /wodg/ transform into Furry: The Otherkin?

>>46447688
>Lost is about PTSD, abuse, and being trapped within your own psyche and not knowing what's just another flashback to 'nam and what's really going on. Lost is all about perception and how you handle losing so much of yourself.
thats 2e, which isn't out yet, we're talking 1e

>>46447714
its not new, every week some dumbass wants changing breds 2

>>46447329
>but had to choose a Legacy
Why wouldn't I want to?

Celestial Masters.
Because they're utter bullshit.
Turning the voice of a Seer into pure Francium from like 5 kilometers away.

>>46447714
WOD has always been a breeding ground for emo and furries.

>>46447734
1e had a lot of that as well, Clarity as a mechanic reinforced that.

As for changing breeds, they want a new one because the first one was godfucking awful in both fluff and crunch due to the writer. I read new changing breeds, there's pretty much only one or two things salvageable from that awful abortion of a book. Skinchangers was much better done, and War against the Pure was basically an apology for Changing Breeds ever being printed.

>>46447734
>thats 2e, which isn't out yet, we're talking 1e
Thank God, too. 2e looks like it should be aborted until they can find writers who are going to put some thought into it.

>>46447797
>1e had a lot of that as well, Clarity as a mechanic reinforced that.
Poorly.

>>46447714
When people won't shut the fuck up with the trolololing about it.

>>46447714
>>46447734
>>46447748

Have we run out of current OP/WW books to discuss, such as Dark Eras or the Beast Fiction Anthology or the upcoming Mage 2e, and some believe there's really nothing left to argue about by furry captain planet, pregnant male ghouls ERP fantasies, emo fishmalk, etc.?

>>46447714
Three options:
1) It always was.
2) When Beast began it's kickstarter.
3) When Mage had been delayed too long, and everyone got bored.

>>46447969
Could you maybe start a discussion of something instead of whining that other people are discussing things you don't like?

Also, would Furry Captain Planet, ERP Fantasies, or Emo Fishmalk make a better band name?

>>46448006
Emo Fishmalk, easy.

>>46447129
Btw, this is what I was thinking of doing if running Werewolf The Apocalypse. Keep in mind this is me interpretating the setting as I see fit. Some of this is just me stressing up some parts over others while some parts are fluff changes.
-The main theme is 'divided we fall': the Garou are supposed to be a pack, yet their society is incredibly divided. Not only did they purge the other shapechanger species, breaking the unity of gaia's children they now fight each others too much to properly combat the Wyrm.
-The White Howlers didn't all fall to become the Black Spiral Dancers. But this also mean that most, if not all of the shattered tribes have pockets of their population which are full-blown Wyrm worshipper for a variety of reasons. Croatoan and Bunyip are still extinct.
-Garou vs Garou conflict is complicated, ranging from territorial dispute over remaining Caern to major ideological split, which range from Pure vs Corrupted (as close as good vs evil it can get) to debate about the future of mankind and how to handle it. This was already there with the Red Talons, only its stressed more here. Some tribes, meanwhile, want to purge other tribes/Garou group because they hold them to be weak/impure (again, Red Talon but also bringing back the crazy neo nazi sub-sect of the Get of Fenris). Some packs are also Wyrm-influenced, althought this is different from going full blown Black Spiral. The former don't think they are insane, the latter go all GLORY TO CHAOS!
-The other shapechanger (those that remain) want to kill the Garou in acts of spiteful revenge. If the game already like to stress a lot of the guilt of the white man and western civilization over shitty actions in their past then I would definately stress up the fact the Garou have their own shitty history to account for, with some people wanting to hurt Garou which have technically done nothing wrong (but their ancestors did).

Continued in next post...

>>46448053
-Tone down (or make more nuanced) the childish 'civilization is evil'. I know this goes against a lot of the spirit of the game but garou come off as assholes for wanting humans to abandon all the good part of civilization. May or may not get ride of Pentex, not sure about this part. 'The Man' might exist, but I'd stress that to lives of many people its a necessary evil for them to live, something already there in the lore which I'd emphasize.
-Might ignore other supernatural splats unless I need them. Re-imagined vampires can and should be a thing as they very well represent the darkest and most twisted side of human nature and civilization.
-Overall move back the scale to something more NWoD, where the action is more regional and fragmented.

I'm well aware those would be controversial changes.

>>46447970

Of course for all the moaning and groaning about Mage 2e, it will be talked about for upwards of one thread and then we'll be back to the same old canards.

>>46448006
>better band name?

I'm partial to Patrician Snobwank from yesterday's discussion.

http://archive.4plebs.org/tg/thread/46424164/#46431543

>>46448083
need the fucking book to come out first
there's only so much you can talk about month old blogs

>>46448083
Oh gods no. We'll have endless arguments about whether it's overpowered now, and how mage supremacy works in 2e.

>>46439580
Literally a sin on OWoD that would cause you to lose renown

Your race is dying, having an heir was important

>>46448072
I approve and would play, and I really dislike WtA default. I've always been a fan of the concept of corruption of the Wyrm in some of the tribes that are liable to do it (and you might look at the Apocalypse book if you can get a copy of it; one of the scenarios describes what happens when various Tribes fall to the Wyrm or are corrupted by it).

>>46448072
>>46448053
I actually like this interpretation. It's a cool new way of looking at WtA.Getting a little more personal horror than the epic fantasy that WtA normally is

>>46448083

No, once Mage 2e is finally released, then the "Mage Supremacy" arguments will really start kicking into high gear.

I imagine the fury and ERP /wodg/ contingent will also offer ridiculous Legacies loosely based on Classic WOD groups and tropes.

>>46448122
>>46448133

Thanks: I've only read the core book of WTA so far. Like many (if not all) WW products, I liked and hated things in equal measure and this is my attempt at salvaging it without outright making the game a different game entirely. I'll look at that book...and I do exactly have a hunch on what Wyrm-corrupted Black Furies are like.
Another potential point: Homid Lost Cubs may or may not be increasingly a large % of Garou population. This mean A) maybe its a sign of the end time, as all the lost children are awakening B) maybe it mean its time for the Garou elder, who are bestial and disconnected from human society (except maybe Glass Walker and Bone Gnawer) to do some soul-searching about the place of the race in the world.

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>>46448053
>I would definately stress up the fact the Garou have their own shitty history to account for,
>how dare you enslave our people 15,000 years ago! GAROU MALE! GAROU MALE!

>>46448216
As Larpfag says, the Apocalypse scenario where the various tribes fall can help you out. Also, if you keep Pentex you can start including some of the "Mocking Breeds" which are man made shifters. There is one breed that I love, the roaches, because of the potential for redemption or just being the most insane fuckers ever

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>>46448254
tumblr - not even once.

>>46448254
Literally laughed so loud I woke up my wife.

>>46448254
God, I can scarcely imagine how fucking horrible that must be as a parent.

>>46448133
>Getting a little more personal horror than the epic fantasy that WtA normally is
I don't think the two are mutually exclusive. Such a game would still be about rage-fueled warriors with the power of man and beast, dealing with spirits and corruption. Reuniting the tribes with epic deeds and redeeming the Grou is certainly a worthy quest.

The difference is that here, the faillings of the Garou are emphasized. They become much more tragic in their self-destruction...and thus it make them a lot more like humans: in a way, Garou and humans are mirror to each others its just they would never admit it.

>>46448291
Lost it at bipolar junction transistor.

>>46448221
>welcome to the tribe of your blood, welcome to the fian-
>yeah about that, I don't feel comfortable culturally appropriating this obviously irish/scottish term, so I won't be called fianna I'm an Alcohol-dependent Redhead.

>>46448221
Except you conveniently leave out the part where I point out that this revenge fantasy is destructive because modern Garou are technically blameless.

>>46448332
Oh god no, I never would say they can't be mutually exclusive. It's just hard for most people to understand that and they just go full WOLFWOLF BOWWOW

>>46448287
Yeah, the Mockery Breeds are pretty interesting.

http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Mockery_Breeds

>>46448115
You can be gay and still have children. My aunt is gay and has like 6.

>>46448072
>>46448053
Normally I'm not into homebrew settings but yours looks good, would play.

>>46448102
Sneaker Pimps meets Glitch Mob

>>46448041
Panic at the Disco meets Rammstein

>>46448363
It was easy, because I didn't read that part.

It's a joke, relax.

>>46448412
>Normally I'm not into homebrew settings but yours looks good, would play.
Not really a homebrew (wouldn't need any new crunch), just a different way to interpret the setting.

So the players in my Demon game finally met up, sort of. 1 has met both of the other 2, but the other 2 haven't met each other yet(that'll happen at the start of next session, for sure, though).

The Chronicle started with/currently revolves around the fact that they were all summoned in the same Facility, an underground room beneath a neuroscience company's main office.(They probably own it, but there's no solid connection yet beyond an elevator going to the CEO's office.)

Considering this story has gone on for 5 sessions, now, and they still aren't really any closer to resolving it, I'm considering having the God-Machine decide it's time to move it, and stage a project to move the Facility across town to a different location, leaving a blown up ruin where the old Facility used to be.

Would this be too much of a dick move? So far they haven't done much investigation of the Facility, just the company on top of it; granted, one of them has plenty of info, and could probably get the CEO sanctioned if she told anybody what she knows.
I just really wanna move away from this story, since it's taking way longer than I intended it to, and onto one that could involve something besides INVESTIGATION.

>>46445975
Can I get a source on that?

>>46448903
Granted, I'm also working on the fact that one of them has the Hunted condition, and his Cover is basically just a hitman who sits in his apartment all day waiting for a phone call, then goes out and assassinates someone.
Current plan, barring the aforementioned spoiler'd one, is to have a Rank 2 Angel attack him in the first scene of next session, for which he'll be in the same area as the other 2 anyways.

>>46448990
I assume it's something along the lines of making a soul pact with a woman, getting pregnant, waiting long enough to get the beat for realizing she's pregnant, then getting an abortion or/and making a pact with another woman to start the cycle over again.
You'd get 2 beats per pregnancy, doing that, assuming you didn't do anything except adopt the cover, fuck a guy, wait a couple weeks, piss on a stick, then get an abortion.

Alternatively, find a way to determine if the women are pregnant beforehand, then make soul pacts with them and immediately realize you're pregnant then get an abortion.

The only limit is how many willpower dots you're willing to re-purchase.

>>46448122
I've taken a look at this book and this is perfect, exactly what I needed! Thank you, Anon.

Best way to run a game online?
Rolll20?

>>46449360
Some people have also used Discord chatrooms, but Roll20 is generally the best bet.

>>46448221
the idea of people being dragged into a situation or war they have no "personal" stake in because of an accident of birth is actually a pretty interesting one though. I really like Werewolf: the Forsaken's whole "children of a murdered God made to atone for it by their still-living patron deity."

>>46449125
the careful hand of a GM can eliminate such silliness before it begins tho.

like most of the silly "exploits" TTRPG players discover.

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>>46448903
>>46449043
Woah hold up, the players took 5 sessions to meet up? How long were those sessions running for? Is this standard for Demon games?

>>46449423
Amusingly, it might resonate more with today's society than White Wolf's own garbage.

Dear Deluxe V20 Lore of the Clans backers-
You'll be getting a 48 hour deadline notice from Kickstarter today for changing your shipping address as I expect your Rewards to ship in April.

Hello Wraith 20 backers!
RichT here:
RichD is now in the process of wrapping up the text chapter by chapter. He tells me the Dark Kingdoms are some of the hardest parts because he wants to get the tone just right and be respectful of those dead as well as stay connected to how they were presented in earlier editions.
We are working on a chapter per weekend schedule right now for those handful he hasn't yet finalized, and RichD tells me he thinks that he can make that happen.

>>46449498
5 hours on average.
It's far from standard, as far as I'm aware. I originally planned to have them ALL meet up at the start of the first session, but then one guy didn't get his character done and was too busy to work on it so he told us to start without him, then a friend of mine joined between the first and second sessions.
It's worked out well enough, I guess. I've only had to repeat information 2 or 3 times.

>>46439518
So, what's everyone favorite Dark Era? I'm really digging Bowery Dogs and The Sundered World.

>>46450022
>I'm really digging Bowery Dogs
y

>>46441584
I don't know. We at least new Beast was Primordial by that point. We had more to go on than the byline and cultural flotsam serving as inspiration. We had some ideas of their nature and how they might work and how they interact with nWoD at large.

What's the word, Dave?

>>46445940
Omniphiliac? He makes some interesting things than litters it with than kind of shit

when is mage 2e out

>>46450157
Yesterday

>>46450157
new books come out wednesday
so just check wednesdays on the site

>>46450202
April First

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Hey guys, I'm wondering how many of you guys use Obsidian Portal for chronicle management or just sharing your stories.
Or does anyone know about some good places to digest some storytime?

so is VtR a dead game or what

>>46450696
No, I think Rose has more responsibility then other developers though. Im pretty sure she's helping or running the development of exalted 3 and that dog game.

>>46446639
>think
>some
>in their closests

They practically throw a pride parade every book they write.

>>46450741
I don't think she has anything to do with Exalted, but she's doing Cavaliers of Mars.

>Prin interrupted, adopting a thinking pose with one hand on hir chin. “I know what it means. It means…” They waited. “She's in a bad mood. She didn't sleep well.” Hir raised eyebrows turned it into a question.

>Hir

Fuck me, of course, through in the bullshit pronouns in the Promethean story.

>>46451025
>Hir
Furfaggot herm pronouns ahoy.

>>46451025
What is your issue with it, this time?
At least it's not like the Mortal Remains sidebar where they accuse you of having issues if you aren't immediately okay with it.

>>46441890
Eh. Why should the mages be the only ones who fuck up hard enough to royally bone history and reality?

>>46451036
Yeah but they're literally a hermaphrodite so whatever

>>46451046
It just takes me out of the experience hard, man, there's no damn for it. It's a fucking short story in a anthology book of a game about people that pretend to be humans but are monsters.

>>46446941
I knew I was forgetting something about ancient greece.

The rampant homolust.

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>>46451097
>Can't stand weirdness in his stories about frankenstein's monsters

>>46451146
>describes frantic pandering to the thought police as 'weirdness'

Okay.

>>46451146
Yeah because bitching about an annoyance on a anonymous board equals someone not being able to stand something. Sure thing, senpai ;3

http://pastebin.com/NjH6gQqi
New pastebin, including links for the Beast stuff and Dark Eras, because SOMEONE had to link it

If anybody wants to add a link to Demon stuff, since that's the only thing missing(afaik), feel free

And if a new thread gets started soon/while I'm asleep, try to remember to replace the OP pastebin link with this one
Thanks

>>46451097

But Promethean has always been a game about people creating their identities and not feeling right in their bodies. There's an argument to be made that the whole damn thing is a metaphor for being transgender.

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>>46451179
>doesn't think that things invented by people frantically fumbling to define themselves are perfect for a game about frantically fumbling to define oneself

>>46451243
>implying that race, gender, sexuality, etc is ever the defining trait about anything or anyone and any attempt to do so isn't ludicrously shitty writing by a lazy fuckwit masquerading as an author

>>46451257
>Implying that a single usage of the word "hir" makes hir gender a defining trait.

I'd say hir expressive face is more defining than hir gender, based purely on that snippet given.

>>46451330
I'd say you didn't read the post I was responding to where shitstick pointed out that diving into identity politics was the best option for anyone who wanted to 'define themselves' as a way of avoiding developing a personality, despite promethean being about the journey to humanity rather than the diet self actualisation identity politics is.

>>46451257
This is true, but a promethan or something isn't going to have a gender by default, so nongender pronouns make sense if they haven't decided to get a gender for some reason. It's actually in favor of that argument- they didn't decide to gender themselves to make themselves more personlike, because gender is not a defining trait.

>>46451358
>"Oh man that shirt is perfect for you"
>wtf do you mean this shirt is the best clothing option for me and I shouldn't wear pants to the club???

>>46451412
>nongender pronouns
'Hir' is not a nongender pronoun.

>>46451418
That's purposefully disingenuous. What you're saying is that their gender, sexuality, etc is part of their personality. A fundamental part. It isn't. You'll see it on tumbler - people with a thousand labels attempting to define their personality. It's the same as people taking quizzes, and the INTJ horseshit. Bringing it into this game is a disservice to anything that isn't politics pushing.

>>46451425
think that anon meant non-binary

>>46451425
It's not?

Pronoun[edit]
hir (third-person singular, gender-neutral, objective case, reflexive hirself)

(neologism) them (singular). Gender-neutral third-person singular object pronoun, coordinate with him and her. [quotations ▼]

>>46451438
That's why I always play gender-less and sex-less beings.

>>46451446
Hir is a hermaphroditic pronoun, where are you getting that shit from?

>>46451438
>people with a thousand labels attempting to define their personality

Look me straight in the eyes and tell me that isn't exactly something a Promethean would do, Anon.

>>46451481
I don't even know why an Osiran would go by Hir and Sie (As comes up later in the story.) Osirans sometimes don't even FUCKING HAVE GENITALS

>>46451501
>Hir and Sie
Huh, I usually see hir being paired with shi.

>>46451481
wikionary and Urban Dictionary say it's a gender neutral pronoun. When I used to use tumblr for things other than porn, people who were using hir were saying they were agender and wanted to use a gender neutral pronoun. Where are you getting "hermaphroditic?"

>>46451516
FA and FP.

>>46451500
A promethean has their own personality that develops like a normal one. What they're missing is a soul, and the defining essence of humanity. Any promethean who delves deep into identity politics, and toxic identity politics at that, of a people who can't even stand him for more than a short period, is maladaptive and will likely never attain humanity.

This talk of gender pronouns and Prometheans is giving me a headache.

>>46451532
identity politics as a replacement for their missing spirit, rather. So no, a promethean who does that isn't in the psirit of their pilgrimage.

Has anyone here actually played Promethean before?
Or is it just one of the games tg likes to bitch about?

>>46451541
>>46451541
I'm still trying to mesh Heinlein's philosophical and political views in starship troopers with the Blood Bathers to create an alternate philosophy for them so they're playable. No reason why, and I'll never release it as homebrew in the mild chance that one person might ever use it or that OPath might recognise my clear and perfected genius. That's a damn headache.

Can anyone recommend some stories in the nwod/cofd books that are actually good? The ones in the vampire 2e core book are mostly really bad.

So mortals. They develop magic others can;t, and would be a sort of witch species if they weren't blinded by the lie. Has anything ever gone into the innate authority they seem to have over the universe?

>Prin crouched atop the speeding subway car until it dissipated into dust under hir, sending hir rolling across hard, slick ground. Sie'd reached the heart of Cora's Lair. A vast, barren plain studded with rocky formations opened its wide arms beneath a yawning sky, moonless, and choked with black clouds. Thunder rumbled from every angle and a deluge of rain pelted down to soak hir. Periodic flashes of lightning provided the only light, but Prin had no trouble navigating without it. Sie felt the presence of the Horror as though it had an Azothic radiance of its own, though sie'd never mistake it for another of the Created. Cora's power always seeped into hir senses like dirty rainwater, nothing like the bright, clear burn of the Divine Fire. Sie inhaled deeply under the raging storm that invigorated hir and kept moving.

Seriously the pronouns are activly harming this otherwise interesting story. Prommies an Beasts shouldn't hang out man, to different, Beasts should hang with the centimani or whatever.

>>46450110

Deviant has a subtitle, but we haven't said what it is yet (it took ages to say what Demon's was, too.)

>>46446577

Danielle Lauzon and Malcolm Sheppard

>>46444883
>>46444921
>>46444997

So Mage made it out of layout and into proofing, which means I actually have work to do on it, and getting the corebook out has higher priority for me than teasing its supplement.

>>46451696
Hey Dave is the merit "Extra Familiar" still excitable in 2E Mage?

>>46451741
I ment acceptable in 2E Mage?

So yeah, just finished Family Reunion from the beast story anthology and it's pretty good. It's bogged down by the pronoun stuff but not enough to ruin it completely. Lil odd that there's only women in the story for some reason, but whatever I'm sure there are tons of stories with not a single woman in them.

For short stories, try Inferno.

I miss Chicanery and Cantrips from old Changeling. Maybe it's just my love of the old Glamour system that gets about in a few free systems, but realm/art was neat. Gave the same feeling of 'power' as the Hekau without being "This rank 2 spell will raise water half an inch. This rank 2 spell will annihilate everythingi n 200 metres" discrepancy.

>>46451831
Wait, sorry, that's a seperate bitch. Freudian slip. Current changeling contracts are neat, but suffer from similar discrepancies.

>>46451741
>>46451774
>Is the merit "Extra Familiar" still excitable in 2E Mage?
>I meant acceptable

You can still find it excitable.

We won't judge.

>>46451882
I'm actually am kinda excited to use the merit.
I'm hoping to it in conjunction with a bunch of familiar to portable strike force/ minor spirit court.

>>46451438
>What you're saying is that their gender, sexuality, etc is part of their personality.

my irl personality has nothing to do with me being a man or bisexual i'm sure ;)

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i am getting sick of this sjw shit in my books. i don't care if you think of yourself as a anthropomorphic car just keep yourself away from my WOD.
this world only has 2 human genders males and females. males can't be females because there is no gene splicing in this fucking game or life that takes away the male gene (unless wizard) and same for females.
if your transgender say your trans and if your gay say it and its fine, but don't talk about it over and over again. i want to lose my humanity killing people in VTR not loss my humanity talking about your relationship with not edward.
>be me
>in VTR
>trans person comes in to play
>Talks about MLP
>wants to play werewolf
>we all played that last time and go mage
>we make cool power and it makes itself a man and then removes its penis with magic
>we all are like wtf and say why not pick a girl
>transformer here says its not a girl nor man and speaks like in a deadpool comic
>we say fuck it and go on.
>it then hyjacks the story and kills a dude for no reason because kik man.
>ask why
>talks about how girls are treated like shit
>one of the girls in the group says that everything it ( can't call it she or he because it doesn't like that) is a lie
>transbatman has a fit and punches her
>all fight it
> she calls the police
> they take the fucker from the movie it away and everybody in the group is called sexist .
> all but 1 being a new player is female

we are sexist for letting a hairy fat trans man in our game and
not letting him hurt us.


fuck i hate america

>>46452053
>i don't care if you think of yourself as a anthropomorphic car just keep yourself away from my WOD.
Unfleshed ARE a thing you know.

>>46452053
You know WoD/CofD has always been controversial, they have always been ahead of the curve in social progression. So they are not going to stop over something as trivial as this.
Get over it.

>>46451951
You're ignoring the rest of it. Being a bisexual man isn't the cornerstone of your personality. Your personality develops in response to external stimulus and your own thoughts. Your sexuality determines what you're attracted to. Not your thoughts on trees and flowers. If you're saying you're shallow enough and have that little of a personality that you base everything you do on being a man and being bisexual, okay, but I'd recommend speaking to a trained psychiatrist, an older and experienced one, about it because somewhere along the line you've gone very wrong.

>>46452053
You need to learn that stupidity is not related to gender or sex. Some people are just fucking morons, and stupid people do stupid things.

>>46452134
social progression....ha that's not even close to what it is. Humanity has a problem where they think you can just make up genders and say this is fact. gender is what your born with not what you think is right.


and yes WOD/COFD may have controversial shit but they know that you can't be a fucking Honda Civic
>>46452187
yes but there are too many stupid people in this earth

>>46452053
how's it going, bait

>>46452202
>gender is what your born with not what you think is right.

Yeah, but since gender is about brain chemistry and not about genitals sometimes we get it messed up.
Personally, I think we just have to develop an accurate brain scanning device for infants and assign gender based on that. It would solve a ton of bullshit problems and there'd be no more trans people.

>>46452202
>and yes WOD/COFD may have controversial shit but they know that you can't be a fucking Honda Civic
Unless you're a demon and know that exploit.

>>46452169
thanks for that reach but i was responding to the chump whining about nonstandard pronouns & "w-why does their gender or sexuality matter" because it does matter. A great deal of the way one lives day to day, and especially the way one is perceived socially, is predicated on one's gender & sexuality. Not that at no point did I claim it was the cornerstone around which i built my entire life ;)

>>46452202
>you can't be a fucking Honda Civic
Oh ye of little Magic.

>>46452225
There is no widely accepted research on gender.

The closest they've come so far is a persistent sense of bodily dysphoria caused by neurological damage/miswiring, which explains why so many transsexuals report they keep the feeling of dysphoria post-operation.
>>46452250
You were responding to me, and now you're moving the goal posts by ignoring selected pieces of the post. At least admit to trolling and move on to your next gambit. There's no shame in it, noone expects trolls to persist.

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>>46452053
a real story.

>>46452250
No but why does the not gender of a Osiran that probably doesn't even have genitals matter to a fucking story about why Prometheans and Beasts are bad together.

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And since we're deep in it, pardon my dump.

>>46452288
the gay agenda

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>>46452312

>>46452288
I'd think it's pretty normal for a Pilgrimage to involve a lot of practicing being things you aren't and can't be yet but will be when you're people. Gender stuff can be one of those sorts of things.

>>46452329
A pilgrimage is a quest for insight, not practice. It's an understanding of the human condition, and the subtle interplay of social expectations and conditions that relate to gender is too intrinsically tied to the human condition for them to experience without significant, sustained interaction with the same humans over a long period. Which they can't.

>>46452359
New things on pilgrimage here.
http://theonyxpath.com/prometheanmilestones/

>>46452329
But it's a Beast story. The Orsirans gender literally brings nothing an has nothing to do with the story beyond being the only person that isn't a female.

>>46452374
None of that gets into any human interaction. The closest universal milestone is forming a branded throng with other Prometheans.

>>46452377
why are you whining so much about this?

>>46452401
Was not trying to dispute your claim. Just thought you would be interested in this.

>>46452404
Because I'm mega triggered bro, like so offended an shit, my kneegrow. Like I feel the desire to re-write out all the pronouns, send it to the author an tell them I fixed it, since I'm just mega-super-duper offended. Hommie.

Anyone else notice how with the spoilered rules on 2e Mages affecting targets > size 5, increasing your size now looks to be the most effective way to increase your resistance to supernal magic?
You could try increasing your Withstand rating, but Withstand ratings can be ignored with an exceptional success. Unless the spoilers left something out, you can't use exceptionals to get around size.

Using that, Beasts seem to be able to become nearly completely immune to 2e supernal magic. With the Giant Merit + Looming Presence, a Beast has an effective size of 6+Lair*2. So size 12 for a Lair 3 Beast, for a total of -14 to any attempt to cast a supernal spell on them. If the Beast is merged with its Horror it gets even worse, effective size of up to 18 for a total of -26 on supernal casting rolls at Lair 3.

>>46452413
Not really. I've played one promethean campaign and I fucking hated it. Dusted off and never went back to that group after we finished up and everyone had their new dawn/annihilation. Appreciate the thought tho.

There's this weird slow drift toward an oWoD style of thought in design - everything is technically making its own universe this time, rather than the mortals. Not to get into the whole thoroughly explored mage supremacy argument again.

>>46452426
So much for mage supremacy

>>46452426
>>46452446

I imagine most spells are not affected by size, particularly things like direct damage and mental control spells. I believe size is only relevant to certain transmutations and related or odd matters like insta-kill Master-level spells. "Effective size" provided by certain powers also might not substitute for actual size in spellcasting.

Further, a single Reach allows access to Advanced Factors, including Area of Affect and Targets, to easily compensate for very large targets.

I would be very careful reading universal rules from stray or brief comments by Dave about singular spells or circumstances.

>>46452528
>I imagine most spells are not affected by size, particularly things like direct damage and mental control spells.
That's not really how the spoilered 2e magic works. If you want to affect another being of size >5, you need to apply spell factors. No exception.
As far as we know, there is no option to spend Reach on Advanced Factors for target size.

>>46447329
Why wouldn't you pick a legacy? It's just bonuses. Would be crazy not to.

>>46452562
Well, time to pony up, anon. You make the assertion, you give the piece of the rules to convince me and the bloke arguing with you.

>>46447329
Perfected Adepts.

Maybe replace some of the Forces bits with Prime, since it seems to work better for their theme. There are examples of 3-arcana legacies, but even restricted to 2 it works pretty well.

>>46452575
You can find DaveBs comments on size affecting spell factors in the OPP forum Hunter vs Mages thread, where it somehow veered of into werewolves vs mages.

The rest you can find in these:
http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/mage-the-awakening/437565-second-edition-development-blogs

>>46452562

As I stated earlier, I believe you've incorrectly inferred universal rules from very specific or unusual circumstances.

In fact, I believe the only time Dave has discussed size as an issue in 2e spellcasting was during the discussion of Master-level insta-kill spells in the thread about the mage and werewolf "white room" fight.

In any event, Mage 2e should be release shortly, and we'll finally see the new magic system in all it's detailed glory.

>>46452604
None of the 3 pages provided talk about spell factors. Unless you want to link to the regular thread and the specific post you're talking about that proves your point..

>>46452615
>None of the 3 pages provided talk about spell factors
If you actually found that thread you were willing to put in more work than I am. With 2e coming out sometime within the next century I am not really interested in digging through all 2e spoilers to find the important comments. They are way too spread out.

Let's revisit this when 2e is out, I'll make a post about it here when we have the rules to back up the arguments without requiring long internet searches. If I forget just comment here, I should see it.

>>46452649
I clicked the link. The link doesn't talk about size or spell factors at all. If you're unwilling to put up, it's time to shut up.

>>46452660
>The link doesn't talk about size or spell factors at all. If you're unwilling to put up, it's time to shut up.
I wasn't the one who claimed that direct damage spells and mind control aren't by size. How about you give some quote for that?
You are making the claim, how about you back it up?

>>46452677
Okay.
>>46452562

Here's the claim that I respond to, that starts this entire comment chain. Now back it up.

>>46452689
>Here's the claim that I respond to, that starts this entire comment chain. Now back it up.
You already found the posts in question. Now you are making the claim that the rules for spells being affected by size only apply to Master level annihilation spells, which is something YOU'll need to back up.


DaveB: "Once a werewolf takes war form, they a) have an unexpectedly high number of Health dots and b) are no longer Size 5, so the mage has to take more dice penalties to cast on them to start with."
http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/644997-hunters-vs-mages?p=656919#post656919

>>46452677
>>46452689

The discussion started by an explicit assertion that increasing size above 5 increases resistance to Supernal Magic. >>46452426

Although it's agreed that Dave at least once referenced size as relevant to Master instant kill spells, subsequent Anons contend that this one mention concerning a very specific circumstance hardly constitutes a universal rule about spellcasting and magic resistance.

If the original Anon believes such a general rule exists, we would welcome the actual cite to Dave stating so, not just an example of a particular spell.

>>46451501
>Sie
As a German, I feel that my culture is unduly appropriated.

>>46452724
I'm not making that claim, that's someone else. I'm asking you to prove "If you want to affect another being of size >5, you need to apply spell factors. No exception." in relation to any sort of magic.

There are exactly 7 uses of the word size in that thread, one is from a forum goer, another is Dave B sayingn that 'to cast on them' they need more dice penalties. That's it. He doesn't go about describing the magic, or the arcana, or anything used.

>>46452740
>Although it's agreed that Dave at least once referenced size as relevant to Master instant kill spells
No, it was not in reference to master level instant kill spells. did you even read the linked post?

>>46452740
>The discussion started by an explicit assertion that increasing size above 5 increases resistance to Supernal Magic
Which I backed up, so now it's up to you to back up the claim that
> most spells are not affected by size, particularly things like direct damage and mental control spells

That's a claim, and if you want it to be taken serious you need to back it up with something.

>>46452768
But you didn't. You've got multiple people telling you you're full of shit, using your provided sources.

>>46452752
>another is Dave B sayingn that 'to cast on them' they need more dice penalties
Which is explicidly because of their size being >5.

>>46452724

Again, that quote was in the context of casting a master-level insta-kill spell which has its own unique rules and limitations.

Dave has not asserted a universal rule that size always equals Supernal spell resistance.

Although Dave has been generous with spoilers and questions, we still know only a fraction of the rule and should be very careful making assumptions.

>>46452768
>But you didn't.
which part of "[Gauru are no longer] Size 5, so the mage has to take more dice penalties to cast on them" is not explicid enough for you?

>>46452751
What does it mean in your brutal language, German bro?