Eldritch Moon

>>45300178
yeah emrakul is probably fucking up innistrad or some shit

>>45300178
>More Liliana
SHE HAS NO FUCKING REASON TO BE ON INNISTRAD

>Lili and her zombie hordes
ids habbeding

I think everyone saw this coming.

While it's true that they could have saved Emrakul for a later set, they definitely would have given us a hint that she was leaving Zendikar in BFZ or OGW if they were.

Only by having her pop up in the immediate successor block could their silence on her whereabouts work.

>>45300294
I mean, it was the first plane she walked to.

Actually, shouldn't that mean Sorin knows about her? I have a hard time believing
he is fine with a crazy necromancer fucking with an already fucked plane.

>>45300294
She probably just likes it there. Aside the living guildpact duties and all, Jace loves Ravnica.

>>45300330
>tfw none of them love Dominaria

Whatifitsnoteldrazi?

Fuck. Sorin can't even headline his own plane

>>45300290
>>45300317
Why the everloving fuck is everyone assuming that Emrakul is on Innistrad? Seriously, we have absolutely NO reason to believe that it's there. Do you see Emrakul in any of the art for the set so far? No.

>>45300345
Well she was exiled from there, and her dead brother still wanders the land. plus that place is fucked.

Ooh, asian Lilliana. I like it.

I think it's just poor naming choice. Not that it's a bad name, but it might incorrectly imply an Eldrazi link. That splash art is pretty generic Innistrad.

I mean, really, would they fuck this plane up too hard? It's super popular, and the Eldrazi flavor text is probably their AWESOME NEW STORYTELLING FORMAT

>>45300345
None of them can love Dominaria, Kamigawa or Lorwyn because they were unpopular planes :^)

>>45300353
because everybody loves emrakul and he wasnt in the last block, wizards isnt going to not pander to the crowd

doesnt matter what makes sense you dont not crowdplease

>>45300353
>Eldritch Moon
>Emrakul is the Titan of Corruption, the largest and most fearsome of the Eldrazi. She does not affect unliving matter - rocks, water, etc...but twists all things living, be it plants, animals, or sentient beings. She causes silent terror wherever she soars, embodying desolation, emotional and physical distance, the chill of the void, and the terror of being alone.
>The Emrakul lineage is characterized by fleshlike lattice structures, uneasy bilateral symmetry, and tentacles that end in knobby, vestigial digits. Looking like spongy, alien baleen, the lattice respires independent of the Eldrazi itself, supporting a host of unseen mite-creatures within. Some within this lineage, including Emrakul itself, float above the ground, using unknown powers to alter the surrounding gravity.

>Corruption
>Tentacles
>Silent Terror
>Living creatures, not landscapes

She is Lovecraft as hell.

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Can we just collectively codename this set to EMO?

>>45300353
Because the word often is associated with Cthulhu
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eldritch

>>45300353
Are you too much of a retard to realize that both set names are Lovecraft references at this point?

Emmy is the Cthulu of Magic

>>45300362
With modern kiddies anyways, though I don't recall why Lorwyn was unpopular other than fae domination.

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>>45300382

Eldritch Moon - 2C
Enchantment
Nonbasic lands are Wastes.

:^)

>>45300421
give it tribal eldrazi so you can power it out easier

>>45300178
Lead Final Design
aka the guys deciding the numbers
Sam Stoddard
aka the guy who just wrote
>Lightning Strike is the right power level for Standard, but it is pretty boring.

I wonder how this will play out

>>45300409
IIRC Lorwyn was relatively unpopular with the American crowd due to it being mostly based on Euro folklore

>>45300421
Don't worry, Reddit already said this card can't exist

of course eldrazi don't give a shit about rules

>>45300353

Inb4 the Eldritch Moon is Emrakul herself descending on the plane.

>>45300442

As an American, I fucking loved Lorwyn.

>>45300178

God, I love that art.

I recently started playing Magic Duels and I was actually really impressed with how they did the back stories of all the walkers. Vryn and Kaladesh are cool planes and I even liked that they brought back Dominaria for Liliana.

I actually found myself getting interested in Jace, despite everything.

Since this is the closest thing to a lore thread, could you guys answer me some questions?

What was the war on Vryn about? And who was Chandra fighting back before Balal started chasing her?

>>45300421
Edlritchest Moon CC
Tribal Enchantment - Eldrazi
If a land would produce mana of any color, it produces C instead.

>>45300403
Niggah, I own his collected works. That doesn't mean that Emmy is there. Shadow over Innsmouth was a fucking fishmen story. By your logic Shadows over Innistrad should be about an invasion of Merfolk. Hell, Geralf is basically Herbert West, Reanimator. Eldritch Moon could be a reference to The Dreamlands with their moon palaces. Pisses me off when everyone assumes Cthulhu with Lovecraft. Bitch that's not all he fucking wrote.

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>>45300409
The fairy tale aesthetic was too saccharine, apparently.

>>45300442
>Most fantasy is based on Europe
>Most Americans are European
>Planes like Innistrad, Theros and Ravnica are popular

>>45300396
>>>/out/

>>45300475
Ravnica is based upon Jewish Mythology.
Innistrad is based (largely) upon American settler experiences in New England.

Your argument is flawed.

>>45300504
>jewish mythology

explain

>>45300504

I knew the Orzhov were fucking JEWS

FUCKING JEWS

>>45300504
Ravnica is based on general European mythology, and most Jews in America came from Europe.
Innistrad was based on Prussia.
Americans love Lord of the Rings, Lorywn's unpopularity had nothing to do with being Celtic.

>>45300475
>Planes like Innistrad, Theros and Ravnica are popular
Most americans are familiar with greek mythology and 'horror' aesthetic and ravnica has the most generic flavor out of any block in existence, to the extent that there might as well only be 10 people in the entire plane aside from the planeswalkers (the 10 guilds).

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>>45300178
>Eldritch Moon

>>45300504
I don't know where the fuck you're getting your info but Ravnica is based on a magitech setting.
And Innistrad is based on gothic horror.

>>45300546
Well I'll be damned. might just happen now that I think about it.

>>45300361
>might incorrectly imply an Eldrazi link.
>incorrectly

>would they fuck this plane up too hard? It's super popular
So was Zendikar

>>45300515
Nephilim, Golems, Sphinxes, etc.

>>45300527
Judaism (as is Christianity) are religions and traditions foreign to Europe. They are Middle Eastern.

Innistrad had a lot of German influence, but everything aside from the vampires was New England settler experience.

>>45300515
>explain

The Nephilim, for one.

>>45300577
>>45300575

The Jew is a godless creature, saying something is based on Jewish "religion" simply doesn't make sense.

>>45300504
>>45300515
>>45300527
I'd call Ravnica more Eastern European mythology than Jewish. There was some Semitic stuff but since it was all mostly secular it definitely wasn't ALL Jewish folklore.
Innistrad is Gothic Horror in general, which was a genre that saw representation on both sides of the Atlantic IIRC. Mary Shelley was from England, remember.

>>45300546
I hope Tamiyo comes back, but I kind of doubt it. Kamigawa was a long-ass time ago, would she still be alive?
Maybe she'll make an appearance as a visibly aged christmas cake moon spirit 'walker.

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>>45300178
>Madness in standard
>Jace in Standard
>Mfw they reprint Lili of the Veil

>>45300472
>Pisses me off when everyone assumes Cthulhu with Lovecraft.
The lesson R&D learned from Kamigawa, Innistrad, and Theros was to appeal to pop culture expectations, not accuracy.

Since the majority of people think Lovecraft = Cthulhu, that's what any Magic interpretation of Lovecraft will be built on.

Mountains of Madness and Shadow Out of Time are both better than Call of Cthulhu, and The Outsider and The Music of Erich Zann deserve far more attention than they get.

>>45300607
they straight up wrote an article about how lotv is too good for standard and powerful cards will only make it into standard by accident from now on

>>45300504
>>45300527
>>45300539
>>45300555
Ravnica is 16th century Prague, you numbnuts

>>45300613
Shadow Out Of Time is not better than Call of Cthulu. That story is retarded.

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>>45300472
>>45300613
Fuck you both
I serve the King in Yellow

>>45300613
>Shadow Out of Time
His best story desu

>>45300641
Call of Cthulhu is a snorefest. It's the among the most hack-and-slash of Lovecraft's stories, and one of the worst at building tension.

>>45300638
But 16th century Prague was a Central-Eastern European city with a large Jewish population! They can't just combine various diverse
elements into a new and unique world! There must only be one source that everything is based on!

>>45300618

The only reason they didn't put LotV in M15 was because of Monoblack devotion in standard.

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>we wont get emrakul until july
God dammit, I wanted to finish my eldrazi triad deck this spring. Whatever. At least it's 100% confirmed she's coming anyways.

Also someone at Wizards must have a huge hardon for Bloodborne and must have immediately pushed for an innistrad block in the middle of the eldrazi block.

>>45300442
Lorwyn was unpopular because it consciously didn't revolve around power-fantasies and focused more on worldbuilding. In other words it failed because most magic players are annoying little shits who would rather play yugioh.

>>45300474
This is why I hate every fucking try hard "cool" kid that shit talks Rebecca Guay or Teresse Neilson while jerking off the OMG so spiky and dark and Kewl Art of Ramond Swanland and Steve Argyle.

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>>45300613
>Mountains of Madness
>Shadow out of Time
>The Outsider
>Music of Erich Zann

Patrician tier taste good sir.

>>45300641
>CoC
>not one of his shittier works
Everyone knows Innsmouth is the best

>>45300638
I thought it was Ankh-Morpork...?

>>45300680
did you read the article because based on what you just said I'm going to assume you did not

>>45300290
>inb4 the only reason why Emrakul showed up to innistrad is because she completely tsundere for Sorin.

>>45300694
but everyone loves Nielsen

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AHH

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>>45300575
>Innistrad had a lot of German influence, but everything aside from the vampires was New England settler experience.
As I've already said, Mary Shelley was from England, not New England.

And if you don't think Frankenstein had an influence on Innistrad, you don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

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>>45300641
>Call of Cthulhu
>Better than Shadow Out of Time
Shit taste confirmed. How does it feel to have such shit taste?

>>45300646
An acceptable answer.

>>45300733
Kos, or as some say, Kosm.

>>45300604
Nigger, Tamiyo was in AVR, that's only a few years ago even in story terms.

>>45300709
>>45300662
I'm not saying CoC was good, I'm just saying Shadow out of Time was retarded.

But I am one of those retards who loves the Dream shit more than anything else, so what do I know?

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>>45300752
GRANT US ANNIHILATOR

>>45300694
Dude, if I could have my decks be entirely Neilson art, I would.

>>45300604
Tamiyo was in last Innistrad block, she's not from contemporary Kamigawa, not Kami War era.

And the last Checking In On The Planeswalkers article mentioned that she's still in Innistrad researching the moon with Jenrik.

>>45300604
She was on Innistrad last time. Kamigawa's STORY was a long time ago, but the plane still exists.

>>45300694
>Rebecca Guay

I'm still mad. Nowadays most art has zero personality.

>>45300741

http://archive.wizards.com/magic/magazine/Article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/stf/164

>Prussian military-inspired armor and Hessian soldier-inspired jackets.

>>45300790
>she's not from contemporary Kamigawa
She IS from contemporary Kamigawa, sorry for the typo

>>45300465
Anyone? I know we are talking HPL right now, but I'd love some insight without having to read five terrible Uncharted Realms articles.

Also, what sort of stuff did they end up retconning with Nissa?

>>45300803
I think she just moved on to better things. She now does big galleries, and sells her paintings for a lot of money.

>>45300714

I didn't realize they put out a second article that totally contradicted what they. Said last time about them being willing to reprint her.

Man fuck wizards.

>We're willing to reprint LotV into standard
Lol jk

>We won't print incomplete land cycles into a. Set
Lol jk

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>>45300777
>>45300790
Oh, damn. There I go again, forgetting simple shit.
Oh well. I still hope she shows up again. She's cute.
>>45300805
I'm not saying that Innistrad didn't have German influences, I'm saying that it's innacurate to claim it ONLY had to do with New England and Germany. Sorry, if I'd been a little more conservative with my quoting that would have been more clear.
It might also be worth noting that Hessians were mercenaries who are mostly famous (at least in America) for that time they were hired by the British.

>>45300604
Kamigawa block was like 1000 years before the current age. However Tamiyo only showed up 3 or so years ago timeline wise.

>>45300345
Urza

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>>45300825
>mfw I needed a fetchable b/w land that did not cause life-loss

>>45300825
Where did they say they'd reprint her?

>>45300819
That is great to hear, it's just that I don't understand the people who complained about her. I guess most players are content with generic fantasy artwork.

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>>45300178
>Gothic Horror plane
>Heavy elements of Cosmic Horror
>Emphasis on the moon
We full Bloodborne now

>>45300868
Most players who give a shit about the art like her. The ones who don't like her don't give enough of a shit to really care.
Marketing and Branding are the ones who wanted the art conformity we have now.

But don't worry, we got Nils Hamm, Bradley Noah and Yeong-Hao Han to save us.

>>45300868
I think it's because people typically don't like the Art Neuavo style in their hyper-cool power fantasies? Someone told me the reason they never liked Guay's art was because it didn't feel bad ass and was kinda girly, Swanland on the other hand was super bad ass and cool.

Basically nurgles don't have a clue how aesthetic and art works. I suspect a lot of them also look at Impressionism and go "lol so blurry were dey nearsighted xDDD"

>>45300942
I will admit that her choice of paints can come off looking... flat.

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>>45300960
>Implying this flat

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>>45300913
I liked Quinton Hoover's stuff

>>45300960
A valid critique. Especially of her early work, but as time went on and she did more and more cards (relatively speaking), her color choices become more dynamic and visually interesting; some pieces like Bitterblossom become almost a study of color, with rich
blacks and purples being offset by paler tones.

>>45300694
Funny thing is my favorite artists are Terese Nielsen, Magali Villeneuve, Chase Stone...and Raymond Swanland.

I don't even know what my taste is.

>>45300613
how can one person be so right?

>>45301022
What you like, not what shits say you should like.

>>45301022
Eh Raymond does do some interesting pieces, and his aesthetic certainly works for the planes that are meant to be artificial by nature. Besides you can have an outlier: for instance I love classical romanticism but I still enjoy Impressionism.
>>45300996
I adore Hoover's line work. Some of his pieces from the Dark are down right creepy to look at.

>>45300942

Swanland is literally the Par Olofsson of MTG. Has some good ideas once in a while, but the vast majority of his work is exaggerated and way too polished.

>>45300409
It isn't, MaRo is a fucking egomaniac, neurotic, lying kike.
Lorwyn has shown up in the top 5 most popular planes by flavor in every poll they've made.

MaRo hates Lorwyn because it celebrates creepy white people culture, that's why we won't be back untill he's gone now that Core-Sets are done and he can sink his paws into every set.

>>45301024
The Outsider and Shadow Out of Time suck. They have stupid premises and make a lot of ridiculous leaps. The amount of suspension of disbelief required is tremendous for those stories.

I agree on the rest. Music of Erik Zhann is amazing.

>>45300434
It's also got two cunts on design and only one of them actually knows how to play.

>>45301065
That's a super concise way to summarize him. Good job.

>>45300434
I mean, he is right.

>>45301073
>The amount of suspension of disbelief required is tremendous for those stories.

You can say that about most of his stories.

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>>45300942
>>45300996
>>45301022
>>45301064
>>45301065

Drew Tucker, bitches.

>>45301144
How could I forget Drew Tucker? I feel retarded, some of my favorite pieces are by him.

kev walker is pretty cool

Maybe Emrakul is a red herring and Liliana set out to summon Marit lage to Innistrad. Liliana would know of her, being from Dominaria.

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>>45301227
Kev Walker's new zombie tokens are probably my favorite.

Also Wrath of God and Damnation.

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Lets just hope the art quality is the same as last time.

>>45300992
That's Nielsen, not Guay.

>>45301137
Yeah, I know. I'm just surprised how fondly you guys like Shadow out of Time. I just found the protagonist's behavior completely unbelievable.

Whatever. I'm glad everyone here has read all of HLP, even if there's a lot of trash in there. A lot of trash. He has like, one good story for every five.

Does Emrakul even affect zombies? Can Eldrazi even deal with faith magic? All they've ever known is Elemental.

>>45301072
Online polls are not the same as actual market research. You don't get a realistic cross-section--just the truly hardcore invested types.

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>>45301322
Derp, my bad.
Well, she is a bit flat, but she often shows some contrast.

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>>45300881
>Emrakul is the Moon Presence
Ulamog is already the Amygdalas and Kozilek is kinda Kos-like I guess

>>45301370
I'd say that's got plenty of contrast. The orange/auburn of the hair provides a nice compliment to the subdued green of the forest. All of which work to bring attention to the paleness of the figure. Also it's entirely earth tones which is pretty impressive and feels Green.

>>45301022
>Magali Villeneuve
looked her up, I don't usually like cgi art and after looking through her stuff I don't usually like her (some good stuff though, I'll admit)
>Chase Stone
Same but worse, I like tibalt and caryatid.
>Raymond Swanland
Jesus, he is like the Anti-Guay he makes agressive streaks while she makes flowing streaks... It sometimes works (staggershock, maybe marrow shards) but not much of a fan in general, especially dislike it when he does blue spells. Has a few non-aggressive stuff, which has a bit better hit/miss rate.
In short: shit taste, I disrespect your opinion on all matters art.
Honestly though, I feel like your tastes are wrong but not without sense

>>45301340
I like Lovecraft because of his creativity. As a writer he sucks hard. His stories all start the same, he is awful at building tension, and tries to end most many stories in a twist that just doens't work.

But I'm still left thinking "how does he come up with all this stuff?".

>>45300178
So, is Liliana going to slowly become a Lich or something now?

Because I don't see another way to reuse the DMG art so flagrantly

>>45301355
Zendikar was not their first rodeo. They'd eaten countless other planes before that, presumably using all kinds of magic.

>>45301528
...well, I'll be damned.

>>45300694
I think my current favorite artist is Johannes Voss
Lyev Skyknight is such a pretty card.

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>>45300178
>>45300290
Despite what it the evidence may point towards, I'm unconvinced its Emrakul at Innistrad mainly because of pic related.

Do you really think they'd print this card in a set with the Eldrazi and NOT make it Devoid?, Plus, in the spoiled pack there were no Devoid cards at all. If the Eldrazi were in Innidtrad at leadt a good 30% of the set would be Devoid.

You could argue SoI is the setup ffor Eldritch Moon and that the Eldrazi remain hidden while the walkers investigate, with the Investigate mechanic an all, but I doubt it. It's kind of tough for a gigantic, airborne monstrosity like Emrakul to remain hidden after all. Kozilek did it, but Kozilek, unlike Emmi, controls space, time and is connected with Earth if the Merfolk legends are to be believed, so it'd be relatively easy for him, and even then plenty of members of his brood were sighted in BfZ (Skitterskin, Kozilek's Channeler / Sentinel).

Of course, Wizards doesn't care about such a thing, so they may still pull out the Eldrazi for Eldritch Moon after giving them a rest in SoI. But yeah, I won't be convinced until I see a Devoid card.

>>45301654
I would assume this is Nahiri casting this spell not an eldrazi.

>>45301654
SoI will just have Nahiri using her Lithomancy to fuck with the plane as a buildup to harnessing the already magical moon into a giant beacon to summon Emrakul.
Devoid shit and actual Eldrazi spawn will only start showing up in EMN

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>>45301448
I like Guay, but this one is definitely flat.

>>45301654
Emrakul is the sky goddess. Much as Kozilek hid within the earth, she could hide within the moon...

...and that's completely ignoring the fact that the Eldrazi normally exist within the Blind Eternities, not on planes. They were forced into corporeal form on Zendikar, but it's entirely possible that she's exerting influence on the world without entering it yet.

>>45301654
Mardu colored Nahiri confirmed?

>>45301733
Yeah that's definitely one of her flattest works. Like I stated earlier: Guay using flatness is a perfectly valid critique, especially in her early work. There's plenty of flatness to be found, but I'd still argue it doesn't detract from the overall quality of her work.

>>45300682
>At least it's 100% confirmed
You don't know how percentages or confirmation work.

>>45301544
Id assumed not but its quite immensely faithy as far as planes go x

Five-legged shrew HYPE

>>45301756

Could just as easily be Boros. We haven't had a R/W walker printed since Ajani Vengeant, and he's mono-W or W/G now so there's no recurring R/W character in the roster.

>>45301654
Maybe Devoid was developed by Umrakul and Kozilek on Zendikar whilst Emrakul was already gone.

I don't think that devoid necessarily needs to be in the set if it's Emrakul. I actually think it's preferable that it not be.

In any case, that card is from Shadows.

SOI is going to be "Oh, Sorin is looking for things and Nahiri is angry! What a clash of planeswalkers! But could it be, is there something creepy happening in the background...? Something with larger implications than this squabble..?"
Then Eldritch Moon will go full Eldrazi. If devoid is going to be in this block, it definitely won't be until Moon.

>>45301528
>DMG art
???

>>45300682
Reminder that original Innistrad's release was very close to Dark Souls 1's

Shadows' release almost coincides with Dark Souls 3's

So, what other monster mash cards could they add? Any flavorful cards you'd like to see much like Hundred Handed One?

I wouldn't mind getting some another thing from the deep.

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>>45301805
Forgot pic of course

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>>45301831

>>45301756
>>45301820
This. There's no reason to make her black, c'mon now.

>>45301828
>Ulamog*

>>45301654
I thought Nahiri was missing. Like, gone. Where was she when shit was going down? Why is she back now?

Ugin had an excuse for not being there. Sorin was there, where was Nahiri?

>>45301862
Wizards is all about muh diversity these days, though.

>>45301712
>start showing up...

There are only two sets in a block now. So that would be 1 set with just Innistrad and 1 set with Eldrazi.

All we know for sure right now is that there's some great evil present, the cursemute is down, and that the moon is fucked somehow- and Nahiri is the one fucking shit up. I do not believe that they would introduce Eldrazi only in the second set, as the draft environment would be stupid.

My guess is that it's either something new, or the true nature of the moon is being revealed- since, you know, Innistrad was a world long before Avacyn and Sorin. Moreover, there have been many clues that there was once more to Innistrad than Horror, such as Driads, Wurms and others, but all that got somehow stopped by the presence of Avacyn. Maybe Innistrad is returning to some type of primordial state, after Nahiri fucked everything up.

Maybe it's not an Eldritch abomination from outside, but from inside- just like demons were trapped in the Vault, who knows what's hidden in that moon- that's the most powerful magical object on Innistrad and a curiosity by other planes standards, after all.

Maybe Wizards were setting this up when stressing how strange the moon was?

>>45301833
shadows probably started development shortly after bloodborne was released which makes sense

>>45301793
>literally 2 lovecraft themed sets
>wizards pretty much doing everything but outright screaming at you "EMRAKUL IS COMING"
Technology these days sure is something, letting legally blind people play cardgames and all.

>>45301654
Ulamog and Kozilek were on Zendikar for a few years, and had a decent amount of time to establish their broods.

It's entirely possible that Emrakul only just got to Zendikar.

>>45301899
>It's entirely possible that Emrakul only just got to Zendikar.
Fuck, I meant Innistrad.

>>45301857
They're both purple necromancers. That's not reusing art, even if they look similar.

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Man can't these people in innistrad catch a break? First gothic horror, now cosmic horror.

The properly value there must be dirt cheap.

>>45301875
Ugin was off being dead and shit or something and Nahiri and Sorin had a falling out. There's a UR where Sorin starts feeling something like regret when thinking of Nahiri and when Ugin asks him where she is he just shrugs "Iunno"

Whatever happened she fucked off, is pissed at Sorin and is now just blowing up his castles because Sorin did something we don't know about.

>>45301885
Like how BFZ block only had one set with C symbol? Or how original Zendikar block only had one set with Eldrazi?

One set of cultists and dark summoning rituals followed by one set of the shit they summoned seems fine for a structure.

>>45301919
It's the exact same pose, and by the same artist.

>>45301926
So, we literally have no idea where Nahiri was? I assume she's mad for Zendikar getting fucked, but that doesn't make sense given that they managed to save it. Where was Sorin during BFZ block?

Hey, also, could you answer these?
>>45300465

>>45301654
I appreciate that you're thinking hard about it.

But I think we all have to dumb it down.

Basically there's a third titan missing. The player attention span can hardly handle skipping a block to explain where it went. Emrakul is on Innistrad.

You have to imagine that some player starts playing Standard during Innistrad and a tentacle monster comes out of nowhere - this can easily be explained by saying, "Look at the previous block, there was one missing. If you want more buy some of that product." However, if you skipped a block with Emrakul you'd have to say, "There was one missing TWO blocks ago, sorry, we no longer have that product in stock." This is especially true if you're buying all your shit from Walmart and Target - a sign that Wizards gives no fucks about their stores because stores actually would have that product.

There is inherent opportunity to disappoint a player if you delay Emrakul's whereabouts to the next block past Innistrad. Wizards can't be having that especially with young/stupid players.

And to me, why the fuck would Emrakul care about coming to Innistrad. Even if Nahiri blew up the moon and unleashed all the mana (*cough* Urza *cough*) to attract the thing Innistrad is obviously a low-mana plane still. The walls of Ravnica buildings are oozing mana and you're going to a plane consisting of backwater bumpkins who are using fucking pitchforks to fight back the monsters?

>>45301891
Perhaps a new tribal will be used for the eldritch abominations which will be discovered to be eldrazi in EMN.

The point is that Lovecraftian horror isn't Lovecraftian if you know what you're up against out of the gate. You have to start off with mystery and suspicion and gnawing fear. Once the bbeg is revealed the show is over for Lovecraft. They can't start SOI with "there are eldrazi and it's because of Emrakul and they are very spooky so just wait for her to show up in EMN." It's got to be paced.

They'll probably bring back the nightmare horror tribal, and it will be discovered in EMN that those are actually a new brood of special eldrazi made by Emrakul while Ula and Koz were developing devoid. Or something like that.

>>45301893
>>literally 2 lovecraft themed sets
>>wizards pretty much doing everything but outright screaming at you "EMRAKUL IS COMING"
>Technology these days sure is something, letting legally blind people play cardgames and all.

While I agree with you that it's pretty likely we're going to see Emrakul, "100% confirmation" means we've seen a leaked Emrakul card. Anything short of that is just speculation backed by circumstantial evidence.

>>45301921
For planeswalkers, sure. But they're the only game in town for normies.

While Emrakul presence is heavily implied, there's no evidence pointing to a devoid return. It wouldn't be smart to print the same non-evergreen mechanic in two consecutive blocks, even in this case. Also, think about this: Emrakul alters living matter, and Innistrad is the plane of flip cards. I'm calling for normal creatures flipping into colorless spawns. That would tie to the "colorless matter" theme of BFZ and to the slight artifact theme in SOI (Nahiri and cluestones), without Moon being a OGW 2.0 and still mantaining a strong Innistrad feeling.

>>45301970
>
And to me, why the fuck would Emrakul care about coming to Innistrad. Even if Nahiri blew up the moon and unleashed all the mana (*cough* Urza *cough*) to attract the thing Innistrad is obviously a low-mana plane still. The walls of Ravnica buildings are oozing mana and you're going to a plane consisting of backwater bumpkins who are using fucking pitchforks to fight back the monsters?

The Eldrazi weren't drawn to Zendikar naturally the first time, they had to be artificially lured by the Sorin/Nahiri/Ugin team. Sorin did most of the work on that part, but it's not unreasonable to speculate that Nahiri learned the trick while watching him; Ugin learned a fair bit about the Hedrons from her, so obviously the three of them shared their knowledge while working together.

>>45301970
I think an important factor is that there was no escape scene for Emrakul. They basically never mentioned her except that "she gone."
If they were going to hold off on bringing her back there would have been a big scary send off, with everyone knowing she was going to another plane (but not to WHICH plane). That way, each set would have free publicity and rumors flying around about "Oooh! did Emrakul come here? Did she go there? Where is she! ooooh!"
Just ignoring her for a few years without so much as a fart is bad marketing.

>>45301875

Someone can correct but I believe this is whats up

When the Eldrazi started waking up again, but before they got released.Ugin, and Sorin were supposed to show up to Zendikar.

Ugin was dead, and Sorin AWOL. So Nahiri decided to go hunt them down.


Apparently that pissed them off

>>45301756
>>45301820
>>45301862
She's probably Boros, the flavor text is eye-for-an-eye logic, which is consistent with Boros.

>>45302065
That's what I'm hoping for.
It low-key sucks that she's going to be the bad guy this set, but assuming she has more motivation than simple retribution I'll be happy to finally have a good RW walker to root for. That one UR kind of hinted that Sorin really did do something to Nahiri at some point that may have been worth vengeance, so I'm kind of actually hoping that's the case.

>>45300474
I love Lorwyn so much

>>45302062
pissed her off*

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>>45301891
I'm with you on that one. The first stop on Innistrad explored how humanity was going to be it's own downfall and extinction, as the vast majority of monster tribes that preyed on or killed humans came from humans(weres, geists, ghouls/skaabs, and vampires) or that their actions would lead to their end(demon and devil worship).

Maybe it's otherworldly and strange as the kami or eldrazi, but still of their world. Especially if it warps and changes things as well as having power over the nasty things that lurk in the night. There was some downright weird stuff in Shadowmoor and it'll be interesting to see what kind of horror can come from Innistrad that humans -Didn't- make to begin with.

>>45301654
She's probably deliberately trying to lure Emmy to Innistrad, the same way Sorin originally lured the Eldrazi to Zendikar as part of their plan. It's more ironic that way.

As the guy who desperately wanted a return to Ravnica, I think I regret my decision.

I feel bad that everyone's favourite planes are getting 'returned to' and becoming Theros or Tarkir-tier as a result.

>>45302045
What if Nahiri killed Avacyn? Destroying an old-walker creation would fuck shit up pretty badly, also considering the only magic-heavy theme of the plane revolves around it.

I can't wait until there are no Eldrazi in either of these sets and you hyped assholes die of aneurysms

>>45300613
I personally love Dagon.

>>45300881
>Emrakul, or Emeria, as some say

>>45302159
Come on, Tarkir was a good plane and Theros was awesome, at least lore-wise

>>45302159
>Tarkir-tier
Hey, the first two sets were fantastic, and they've publicly admitted that DTK was dogshit.

>>45301969
>So, we literally have no idea where Nahiri was?
Nope
>I assume she's mad for Zendikar getting fucked, but that doesn't make sense given that they managed to save it.
She's mad at Ugin and Sorin for not appearing when the Eldrazi once broke free and she had to deal with it. What Sorin did that made her hella mad is still unknown
>Where was Sorin during BFZ block?
Looking for Nahiri because Ugin was like "Nigga what did you do?"

>>45302159
>>45302189
Yeah, pre-dragons Tarkir was really cool. It was still cool in Dragons, just... less so. But anyway, they implied that some of the clans might overthrow the dragons again.

>>45302127
Maybe the nature of "evil" in Innistrad is that it takes makes human fears manifest, only stronger? As you said, all bad things of original Innistrad were of human origin, representing the mistrust between the Planes people.
Then a literal alien appeared and started blowing shit up, while talking about retribution for some other, unknown world that was besieged by horrors undescript. Assuming that Innistrads "evil" adapts to fears, and that the people suddenly start fearing other words and unknown powers, well...

>>45302166
I'll be happy not to see any tentacles in the next block or the one after that or the one after that. Zendikar was left to lie for a long while, so we can let Emrakul lurk out in the multiverse eating what she wants for a bit. Everyone wants their dreams to come true so badly and I'll be fine if the narrative shifts away from some world eaters to just not letting everyone get killed by something else we don't know about yet.

Same as all the whining about wanting to go back to Tarkir and go back to the "Biff Tannen wins with the almanac" future that was the Khans timeline. Face it, your tentacled Waifu ain't eating Innistrad, folks.

>>45302211
Well, they left completely open the "Great Khan" Sarkhan plotline. Yasova litterally told us that according to some Temur profecy a some guy was destinated to unite all the clans. I'd be totally down for a Return to Tarkir with Sarkhan realizing what he did and fucking some draconic shit up alongside his autistic gf

>>45302244
It just doesn't make sense story wise to build up these big baddies and immediately kill them off one after another

>>45301844
This, its not ermakul, its a five-legged shrew.

>>45302189

Theros was shit, but Takir was rad.

>>45302225
So... Theros or Kamigawa then. The way the gods came about. Faith or devotion either sharing power or converting to some greater thing that becomes real. Or how kami worship gave certain kami power or form or purpose. Let's hope this isn't Ashiok's next thing, because if it is then this might be pretty nasty. Making abstract fears into tangible horrors worse than what humans just turn into.

>>45300382
>he

>>45301891
>it is urza's bathtub

>>45302327
>implying she is right either

You people do know the word "eldritch" doesn't strictly mean it's lovecraft/deep ones related right

>>45301701
Yeah, I think its Nahiri too. But that's the point, if we were getting Eldrazi in SoI it'd be unconceivable for a card named 'Structural Distortion' that exiles not to be an Eldrazi card with Devoid.

>>45301712
I can see something along the lones happening.

>>45301752
I don't think it's hiding. WotC remarked Innistrad Silver Moon's sealing properties, that's a checkov's gun if I've ever seen one tbqh.

The Blind Eternities theory I see far more likely.

>>45301756
R/W I'd guess. Black doesn't really have an equipment theme.

>>45301828
>Maybe Devoid was developed by Umrakul and Kozilek on Zendikar whilst Emrakul was already gone.
I really don't think that's the case.

>>45301899
Yeah, that's a possibility. Still, we'd get Eldrazi cards all the same. A set with Emmi and none of its brood is unconceivable.

>>45301970
But there's a factor you should take into account, the attention span of platers is as short as it is fickle. Two consecutive blocks of Eldrazi would easily tire the playerbase and would cause a drop in sales. It'd be similar to what happened with Lorwyn/Shadowmoor, change of setting, continuous story. That didn't work once, which makes it that more unlikely for Wizards to attempt it again.

On the other hand they could delay the Emmi block a couple of years, by then the people will have forgotten and they'll be able to garner massive hype like they did with Scars or BfZ itself.

>>45302133
I can't see Nahiri doing that. She put so much work in creating a fuckton of herons just to keep the Eldrazi in Zendikar at all costs. It seems unlikely she'd let another plane be destroyed just for revenge.

Far more likely is that she'd lure it there to minimize damage to another plane richer in Mana. Sorin's plane is a good candidate seeing how he was part of the three that locked up the Eldrazi. When he agreed to participate he should be willing to sacrifice his plane like Nahiri did.

>>45302244
>Same as all the whining about wanting to go back to Tarkir and go back to the "Biff Tannen wins with the almanac" future that was the Khans timeline
Dragons of Tarkir is the almanac timeline. And you'll note that the almanac timeline is not where the movie ends, but the halfway point.

>>45300465
>>45300818
>>45301969

>spoonfeed time

Jace's origins:
http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/uncharted-realms/jaces-origin-absent-minds-2015-06-24

Chandra origins:
http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/uncharted-realms/chandras-origin-fire-logic-2015-06-10

>>45302284
They've been doing that for years. The names and faces change, but troubles keep on coming. There is always something next. Certain stuff hangs on, but not every villainous force is Phyrexia or Nicol Bolas. Sometimes it's just something that can be put down or an event that could be catastrophic but averted. There wasn't necessarily a single overarching villain in Time Spiral to an extent, just the 'End of the Multiverse' if someone didn't do something about it. Some villains get toppled and others win. And some others get a Xanatos gambit or chased off.

>>45302065
I'm hoping her redness isn't just because "AAARRGHHH, I MAD" and more because Sorin vamped her up and she's tapping into the redness of innistradi vamps

>>45302159
Ravnica was novel and unique for its time, returning without a real good reason (like rehashing the guilds only to play Maze Runner in the last set) really sours the perception of the plane.

Battle for Zendikar had good premise, but it came a little late and fucked things up by killing off the titans in an anti-climactic way. SOI unfortunately looks to be a rehash like Ravnica but with a pinch of lovecraft.

Mirrodin and Time Spiral are the only good return blocks we've had so far in my opinion, both mechanically and the self-contained planar story (Quest for Karn is of course terrible though)

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>>45302348
>Emeria was an angel
>99.9% of angels in MTG are female
>Emeria even has female angel statues of her
>Emakrul is Emeria
It checks out, dawg.

>>45302397
As far as I'm concerned, that world was coined by Lovecraft, while the name of the first set is a reference to one of his most popular stories.

>>45302448
And we still have reason to revisit Mirrodin/New Phyrexia to check out what's up with Karn and the Phyrexians.

>>45302397
It doesn't matter, Wizards branding department knows that most people associate that term with Lovecraft, they
chose that term for a very specific reason.

>>45302448
I agree. Ravnica was a fantastic setting that didn't need outside planar influence to be good, and the entire maze schtick was stupid. Also why the fuck Aurelia sitting on Feather's throne?

>>45302454

I wanna go on a date with Emrakul, we would go to the movies and then eat ice cream

That's what normalfags do right?

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>>45300613
You have beautiful taste, kind sir. I would also add Dagon.

>>45302458
*word, not world

>>45302497
If those normalfags are in 1956, sure.

A drive-in movie plus ice cream sounds like a 14/10 date, though. Those creepy-ass nuclear family fucktards knew what was up.

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>>45302406
>Yeah, I think its Nahiri too. But that's the point, if we were getting Eldrazi in SoI it'd be unconceivable for a card named 'Structural Distortion' that exiles not to be an Eldrazi card with Devoid.
Keep in mind that Nahiri is a user of white mana first and foremost. White exiles shit all the god damn time. This is could just be a sort of Boros hybrid of white removal in a red spell to allow land targeting.

>>45302472
Or they just wanted to set a tone, with no hidden meaning at all.

Hooray for speculation.

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>>45300694
FUCK ARGYLE, FUCK THAT EYE BLEEDING CGI SHIT HE DOES, IT'S FUCKING AWFUL

>>45302348
"She" is right. No, Emrakul doesn't have a gender, but "she" is the official nomenclature.

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>>45302532
Also to expand, she's a stoneforger. They just distort and warp and shape the materials for the weapons they create. Structural Distortion as a name makes sense. She's taking the foundation and making it into a pretty fuck you sculpture for Sorin to check out when he comes back.

I think Devoid might make a return to the set, I also think it might not. Emakrul doesn't need to have cards associated with devoid to appear in the block though if they just stick to straight up colorless eldrazi shit if it is a part of this block.

>>45302458
>As far as I'm concerned, that word was coined by Lovecraft

It wasn't though, and you're wrong, and nobody gives a shit what you think.

>>45301304
>Marit
yes please

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>>45302454
>implying Emeria isn't a false deity created from misinformation passed down from generation to generation
>implying because a bunch of misinformed denizens call a mountain with tentacles she they are right.

Even Mark is on recorded for saying they really aren't hes or shes.

>>45302675
They don't have names, either. How dare you call them Emrakul, Kozilek and Ulamog?

>>45300694
RKF FOR LIFE

EVERYONE ELSE A SHIT

>>45300805
>the archive is back up
>almost all the articles about Lorwyn and OG Mirrodin are gone

Why Wizards, why

>>45302710

You're being fucking retarded.

Everything from towns to geysers have names, that doesn't mean they have genders.

>>45302419
I was hoping for a tldr so I'd get to avoid reading UR's terrible writing, but I read Jace's story.

It wasn't as bad as I expected. Interesting, if a bit silly and campy. Why does everyone say UR's writing is bad? Do I just not have any taste?

>>45300294
i hope she fucks jace again

>>45302520
I've done drive in movie as a date. It was a lot of fun, even if we waited to canoodle once we got home.

>>45302432

She's Red because she literally spent THOUSANDS OF YEARS SLEEPING INSIDE OF STONE ON ZENDIKAR. It's not far-fetched that the red mana became a part of her during that time, especially on Zendikar. Being a Lithomancer, she was already connected to rocks and stone anyway.

Even in her UR, she was pretty fucking red, so seeing a WR Nahiri isn't just unsurprising, it's expected.

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>>45302925
A lot of it is pretty bland. Recent events with the Ulamog and Kozilek thing was just ignoring a whole lot of previously established stuff on them and going "FUCK IT, CHANDRA KILLS THEM WITH A BIG FIREBALL WHOA FUCKING RAD"

Also retconning the shit out of Nissa to make her a more superhero like character when she was more interesting as a Elf Nazi

Some are still good though. The recent UR about Meren of Clan Nel Toth was dope as fuck.

>>45302925
>I was hoping for a tldr
Do you also want a massage also, your majesty?
Those are ok-ish. 80% of the URs are shit the rest are good or ok.

>mfw I'm going to force curse decks in drafts once again

>>45302966

God I fucking the whole "We want Magic to be a superhero comic" thing Wizards has going.

It's so fucking lame.

>>45303025
They gotta make a buck out of the avengers and justice leage.
The worst part is that kids will love that crap, who cares if most of the players base is 20-25yo.

>>45302327
>HAS

>>45302966
The passage from three set a block to two set a block really fucked up battle for zendikar, the first set was full of shit cards and I'm pretty sure it's what also made them rush the ending.

>>45300178
Even though all this "eldritch" thing, i still think its not about Emrakul.
I really hope so too.

Now, the real question is:
Return to Alara when?

I want more fucking support cards for my Shards.

>>45303150
Alara is in the same group with Kamigawa and Lorwyn.

>>45303108
Actually, the change from three sets a block to two sets a block is why Emrakul wasn't in BFZ block. They didn't squish three sets into two, they actually cut out the third set.

>>45301360
Basically, plebs like garbage and Wizards caters to them because they have no creative integrity and are money-hungry soulless corporate kikes

And then Amerilard redditors say something retarded like "b-but companies exist to make money!" like the retards who flunked out of economics 101 for not understanding how enormously retarded that statement is, and Wizards is saved by shills yet again

>>45302932
But he doesn't have any friends on Innistrad. Who is she supposed to kill?

>>45302966
The Titans getting fireblasted did seem weird, but is it actually breaking some canon? I know Near Death Experience is depicting Gideon after he punched some of Emmy's brood, surely that means fire would work too.

I remember everyone HATING old Nissa. I had assumed her Nazi Nissa portrayal in fandom was people exaggerating her racism against vampires. Is new Nissa really all that different? I know she hugged some boggarts or something, which was weird, but was she actually racist against anything other than vampires?

>>45302972
I'll be reading more of them for sure. The last one I read was about the Dragon-Style Twins and completely irrelevant to anything ever.

>>45303025
That's been true for a while. Honestly, all of Weatherlight feels very nineties dystopian comic book to me.

>>45303207
>corporate integrity
What are you using this to mean? I'm unaware of any unethical actions on Wizards' part.

A company's first and foremost responsibility is to its shareholders. If you believe anything else, you're delusional.

A company's second responsibility is to its customers. If the majority of customers like the product, even if they are plebs, then the company is fulfilling that responsibility.

So, if the customers like the product and it's making money for the shareholders, all is well. The fact that you don't like the product is regrettable, but I don't follow the line of reasoning that you're trying to argue.

>>45302932
I just read Jace's backstory, how does that loser snag some demon etched snatch?

>>45303332
He had something Lili wanted

>>45303353
his virginity

>>45300818
The retconned basically anything even remotely non-80s comic books about her.

The woman who would only save the elves who were worthy of being saved with beauty and eyeblight kill-counts now rescues boggarts from the meanie elves who want to hurt them for no reason at all the horrible bigots :(

>>45303207
This seems entirely unrelated to his point. Whether or not the online popularity polls show Lorwyn as doing well--which isn't even true, as the latest poll had it knocked out in the second round--the fact of the matter is that the people taking the online polls do not necessarily represent a realistic sample of the playerbase as a whole.

This isn't about whether or not companies "exist to make money." It's about whether the collective opinions of that portion of the playerbase that follows Maro on Twitter accurately reflect the opinion of the average Magic player. And, by all accounts, they do not.

>>45300178
So Oath of Liliana incoming? Sorin notbeing the token black Gatewatcher is seemingly becoming more likely if Nahiri's involved

>"I ain't got time to join up in yo team, Jace. I got a crazy ass lithomancer fucking up my homeplane to deal with right now!"

>>45300575
>Judaism (as is Christianity) are religions and traditions foreign to Europe. They are Middle Eastern
That's a fucking retarded statement. European culture is intertwined with the Abrahamic religions and you cannot possibly have a discussion of European culture where they are somehow "foreign"

It's like saying everyone is foreign to Europe because primordial ooze. Yes at one point it was foreign, but it's fucking stupid to say that it's not an integral part and originator of European culture in basically any part of European history that matters

>>45303332
Bolas wanted to regain the Infinite Consortium, which Tezzeret had stolen away from him. Jace had recently been recruited to said organization.

So Bolas offered to help Liliana get out of her demonic pacts if she seduced Jace and used him to return control of the Consortium to Bolas. As a part of this, she ended up killing every single one of his friends on Ravnica, with the sole exception of Emarra, with the intent of framing Tezzeret so Jace would go after him.

She fucked him over six ways from Sunday and then, when he dissolved the Consortium instead of letting her present it to Bolas, she fucked right off.

>>45303421
Liliana has zero reason to join the Gatewatch. Jace already asked her to help with the Eldrazi when she came to him to try and make him help her with the Chain Veil, and she told him to go fuck himself if he wasn't going to do what she wanted.

>>45303316
Rabbi, what do you think of dredge?

>>45303207
>corporate kikes
This is how you plan to convince us of the depth of your critical thinking skills?

>>45301988
>I don't know what hyperbole is

>>45303434

>Ancient Rome isn't a part of history that "Matters"

Get the fuck outta here with your sandkike shilling.

Greek philosophy is far more fundamental to Western culture and ideals than anything brought in by Abrahamic religion, European society prospered IN SPITE of the caustic influence of Middle Eastern Bronze-age bunga bunga shit, not because of it. There's a reason that the Catholic Church had to steal 90% of their ideas from Aristotle.

>>45303481
>oh no, he pointed out that I don't have an actual argument aside from meaningless buzzwords!
>better call him a Jew!

>>45303353
>>45303387
>>45303447
Ah. Slut.

Does she actually like him? Emmara didn't exist when Liliana killing Ravnicans was written, right?

>Eldritch MOON
>Tamiyo will be absent from the set because "WHO IS THAT I DONT REMEMBER LOL" - Wizards

>>45303393
To be fair, original Nissa was a pretty terrible character

At the same time though, they could've easily remedied it by just giving her some character development rather than retconning it entirely

They also retconned Gideon to be Mediterranean (because Theros) and a lot younger, everyone else is essentially the same

>>45303546
Well, Gideon was always kind of brown, right? I thought he was Indian.

Nissa's original characterization was all in the novel, right? Not in UR, so I can't find it online?

>>45303421
>"I solemnly swear to not to ever be part of your gay ass Christian youth group"

>>45303533
Emmara did exist--the only reason Lili didn't successfully kill her, too, is that Jace was actually hiding out in Emmara's house and was able to prevent her death.

As for whether or not Liliana has feelings for Jace, that's a messy question. She contemplates NOT completely fucking him over at one point, but then goes through with it anyway. She then tried to use the fact that she even considered the option as an argument that she really cared about him and he should let her give the Consortium to Bolas. In Unkindness of Ravens, it's implied that she did sort of enjoy her time with him, but she isn't willing to make compromises.

Whether or not she cares about him, Liliana cares about herself much, much more. Jace understands the idea of responsibility--both in his role as the Guildpact and in his decision to return to Zendikar to clean up the mess he caused--in a way that she flatly doesn't. She sees him as a tool--maybe a tool that she's fond of, but still a tool to be manipulated and used.

A lot of Jace fans are actually really upset about Liliana being spoiled for Eldritch Moon precisely because Wizards has recently been retcon-happy enough that they might try to spin the two as tragic lovers, rather than actually exploring the consequences of abuse.

>>45303226
him

>>45303313
Fuck off Maro, fucking wotc apologiest

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Excited for this set.
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>>45300362

>tfw we will never get another set like Lorwyn
>tfw you realize the hobby you enjoyed as a child no longer has you as the intended audience

>>45303737
Maro hasn't had anything to do with the story since Tempest block, and he's still assblasted over how they fucked up the Weatherlight Saga.

>>45303687
I hope SOI has fuck all to do with Jace and company and focuses on walkers that were walkers prior to the mending, like Lilly, Nahiri, Ugin, Bolas, Sorin. Sure, they aren't oldwalkers like the classics, but at least they feel appropriate for the time scale were looking at when it comes to these fueds.

>>45303788
>>tfw you realize the hobby you enjoyed as a child no longer has you as the intended audience
Hit me really fucking hard over the past three blocks. From Elspeth dying to Tarkir getting fucked to the damn stupid killing of Ulamog and Kozilek, it's all been a downward spiral, but Magic is just getting more and more successful. And they're throwing away their best asset--each plane having its own story and characters--in favor of following the same superhero team around everywhere.

I've ended up transferring most of my affections to D&D, where I create and control the world and don't have to put up with this kind of bullshit and can

>tfw you realize exactly how much "no longer being the target audience" has left you a broken shell of a man

>>45302925
UR quality varies wildly. Feldon of the Third Path had a good one.

>>45303789
R&D and creative are basicaly blend together (read today's maro article) right now, everyone has an input on what's going on and what will happend

>>45303811
You realize that Jace is in the key art for SOI and is on the one booster pack wrapper we've seen, right?

He's gone to Innistrad to try to look for Sorin to get his help with the Eldrazi.

>>45303142
I'm willing to bet money it isn't. They've never carried a story through consecutive blocks other than Lorwyn, but that was more a 4-set block than two 2-set blocks, and I'm pretty sure they mentioned setting fatigue being an issue. Hell, They specifically said that part of the reason they were moving to 2-set blocks was that people got bored after 9 months of the same shit.

As for the people saying "oh they wouldn't just leave dangling plot threads like that," I'd invite them to look at literally every other block for an example of them doing exactly that. End of ROE? Oh shit, the titans are loose, everybody scatters, oh look Mirrodin! End of SoM? Phyrexia took over, Elspeth ran away to do something... hey look at this cool Innistrad place! End of Theros? Elspeth has been spending an awful lot of time doing things that have nothing to do with New Phyrexia, oh hey she's dead! what a cliffhanger! Remember how much Sarkhan loves dragons!?

People are getting all hyped up over Emrakul being missing from Zendikar as if it's not the exact kind of "Find out next time" cliffhanger bullshit that they always pull to give themselves options down the road. Hell, I'd say Bolas is more likely to be involved, given we really haven't seen him do shit since Scars of Mirrodin.

>>45303869

At least Rabbi of the Coast learned their lesson with Tarkir. Even Maro admitted that they may not have handled it like they should have. Maro admitting he is wrong is almost unprecedented.

>>45303954
>Maro admitting he is wrong is almost unprecedented.

Nigga, he does that all the time on his blog and also once a year in his "State of Design" article.

>>45303942
>I'm willing to bet money it isn't. They've never carried a story through consecutive blocks other than Lorwyn, but that was more a 4-set block than two 2-set blocks, and I'm pretty sure they mentioned setting fatigue being an issue. Hell, They specifically said that part of the reason they were moving to 2-set blocks was that people got bored after 9 months of the same shit.
Dude, one of the main talking points around Origins was that they were moving to a single, continuous storyline. Setting fatigue is why they want to change planes faster, but a story that continues across multiple planes doesn't run into that issue.

Whether or not Emrakul is on Innistrad, the face walker of SOI is explicitly there to look for Sorin to get his help with the Eldrazi. That's a continuous storyline.

>>45303954
>Maro admitting he is wrong is almost unprecedented.
I take it you don't actually read anything he ever writes, and only pay attention to all the memes on /tg/?

>>45303899
What? Why? As far as Jace knows, they beat the Eldrazi, right? Did I not understand OGW's plot?

Oh well.

>>45303954
I'd really like to know at what point they decided that eviscerating everything that makes that plane interesting and replacing it with Ravnica guilds with dragons was a good idea.

Oh wait a minute. plebs like guilds and dragons. carry on.

>>45304004
Sure, and Gideon went to Ravnica to look for friends to help against the Eldrazi. I didn't see any Eldrazi on Ravnica, though. Sorin went to Tarkir to find/rescue Ugin. There were no Eldrazi on Tarkir either.

I'm not saying the block will have absolutely nothing to do with the storyline, I'm saying that hamfisting Emrakul into Innistrad is completely inconsistent with all historical precedent, directly contradicts numerous statements they've made in the past, and defeats the purpose of having distinct planes in the first place. Emrakul ain't on Innistrad.

>>45304048

I mean, their literal reasoning was "people love dragons, we can't have them get fucked over"

>>45304048
I mean, clans are the same thing as guilds. They replaced guilds with guilds + guilds.

>>45303316
I wrote creative integrity.
You do know what creative integrity is, right?

Anyway a company exists to create value. If you believe anything else, you have a fundamental misunderstanding of what economics is.

The purpose of economy is to shift and trade value in a granular way.

Even high school economics will teach you that attempting to please shareholders above all other stakeholders (you do know what a stakeholder is, right?) is a short-term strategy because it warps your assessment of the value you're creating.

This is not a moral or ethical problem, it's a problem of putting the cart before the horse.

>>45303398
It only seems unrelated because it's structured in a poor way because it's a shitpost

Assumption 1: Lorwyn is good
Assumption 2: Lorwyn is liked by core customers, but not by the unwashed proletariat masses
Assumption 3: Sets like Lorwyn (and by extension, sets that are good for the reasons that Lorwyn is good) are not produced because Wizards prefers to wash themselves with cash rather than produce anything of value for the core demographic, and so have shifted their major stakeholders from the former core of grognards to kids and stockholders
Assumption 4: This is bad for you if you're that core gamer
Assumption 5: There are people who find no issue at all with this and find disagreement with it puerile or ignorant on the argument that creating value for stockholders is the purpose of all companies ever.

The second statement is angrily retorting against a hypothetical argument presented against the people in the 5th assumption neglecting the concern in assumption 4. It's a straw man, yes. Anyone who agrees with it is a fucking retard, which isn't strange for a straw man, but they exist on reddit nonetheless.

>>45303482
I don't need to convince you of anything, fuccboi

>>45304024
"MaRo admitting he is wrong" is essentially "MaRo admitting anything he didn't make is wrong".

>>45302850
But those are personal names, tjere's a difference.

By your logic they should be known as 'Eldrazi Titan no.1, 2 & 3'.

>>45303546
Terrible how?
Yeah she was flat and not terribly creative, but that's only because they had already done her character before. Every single Lorwyn elf was exactly like her, so she brought nothing to the foreground, but at least she represented that archetype of naturalistic social Darwinism

Unless you mean "terrrible" because she was morally objectionable in which case literally nothing wrong etc.

Leaks when? I just want Wotc to be a constant stream of butthurt over leaks.

>>45304065
>Gideon
Wasn't the face walker of Return to Ravnica. Jace was. Gideon didn't even show up in the block's story.

Kiora wasn't the face walker of Theros, and Sorin wasn't the face walker of Tarkir. The story on Innistrad is going to be following Jace--if nothing else, the art book description makes that clear.

>Historical precedent
Is completely irrelevant when they've completely changed the block structure and openly said that they're changing the way they approach the story. Having a planeswalker show up in a set without ever getting a card in the block was "unprecedented," but Ugin and Jace both did it in BFZ. Colorless having its own symbol was "unprecedented," and people like you argued that the new mana symbol simply could not mean colorless for that exact reason.

Besides, if you think that having the same characters and enemies show up across multiple blocks is "unprecedented," you really ought to look into the Weatherlight Saga and Odyssey/Onslaught.

>defeats the purpose of having distinct planes in the first place
I have no idea how you expect them to represent an interplanar threat if it isn't allowed to show up on other planes.

Besides, Eldrazi on Innistead is the perfect way to actually explore the "Lovecraftian horror" angle of the Eldrazi, as opposed to the "giant tentacle monster" angle. People were already talking about it and asking for it over a year before SOI was announced.

>>45300604
>Gothic Horror in general, which was a genre that saw representation on both sides of the Atlantic
I can't really think of American gothic horror

>>45303313
Yeah she went to Lorwyn and learned the glory of the Endlösung

now she's got the power of Heart

>>45304163
>You do know what creative integrity is, right?
Not him, but I think it'd be to the benefit of the conversation if you explicated the concept a little. It seems to me that you could use that phrase to mean multiple things.

>>45304163
Lorwyn/Kamigawa type of flavor is loved by a small but vocal minority then I think.

I could argue that the flavor of cards like Divinity of Pride and Godhead of Awe are more interesting than the Theros gods like not-Haphaestus and not-Hades, but the average joe is going to recognize the gods more and be like "hey it's greek myth on a magic card that's cool!"

It might be for the best that those storybook planes aren't returned to anyway, as the game's overall story structure is a lot different now.

>>45304229
Just that she was flat, yeah. To be fair I was ignorant of her Lorwyn escapades making her elf-hitler back when she was still elf-hitler.

>>45304228

>But those are personal names, tjere's a difference.
>By your logic they should be known as 'Eldrazi Titan no.1, 2 & 3'.

No?

Anything can be named, the Eldrazi titans have been given names which they are now known by, the fact that they themselves wouldn't recognize those names is immaterial.
Gender is a characteristic which the titans objectively do not possess, applying it to them is just silly.

>>45304256
Wizard completely destroyed the "old gods" image of the Eldrazi with BFZ.

Now they are just like any other race, except that they are devoid of any character.

BFZ was a mistake

>>45304317
Except Poe, I guess

>>45304317
Poe you motherfucker.

Poe, the OG spookmaster from the East Coast.

>>45304256

>The story on Innistrad is going to be following Jace

Just fucking shoot me already.

I FUCKING HATE JACE.

STOP THIS SHIT.

>>45304317
...Poe? Seriously? You don't associate Edgar Allen Poe with Gothic Horror?
How about Hawthorne? All those stories about Puritans getting spookified by devils in the forest.
>>45304381
I mean, I believe he's credited by many as the originator of the genre in the first place. He's hardly an exception.

>>45304029
He's looking for Sorin because they needed a cliffhanger to end the last issue of Ultimate Avengerwatch at

>>45301654
Eldrazi manifest differently on every plane. They aren't in a set form. Each time an eldrazi moves to another plane, that plane translates them for the sake of the sanity of those who inhabit it.

The eldrazi of Innistrad are probably mind-breaking horrors, since the plane has a much more Lovecraftian vibe. The eldrazi of Zendikar were just fuckin kaiju with crazy powers because it was the plane of adventure and, essentially, power.

>>45302532
>This is could just be a sort of Boros hybrid of white removal in a red spell to allow land targeting.
That doesn't hold up. If that were the case it'd be an hybrid mana or white spell. Still, that's kind of irrelevant. The point is its not an Eldrazi card and in an Eldrazi set it definitely would.

>>45302635
>Also to expand, she's a stoneforger. They just distort and warp and shape the materials for the weapons they create. Structural Distortion as a name makes sense.
Is there an UR or some kind of source backing up your claims?, Still, this is also irrelevant as I never claimed the name didn't make sense, just that a card named like that would 100% be a Devoid spell in an Eldrazi set.

>Emakrul doesn't need to have cards associated with devoid to appear in the block though if they just stick to straight up colorless eldrazi shit if it is a part of this block.
That will never ever happen for two reasons. 1st, because they can't have a set in which 50% of the cards are pure colorless. Not even Mirrodin did that.

2nd, because if they did make Emmi's brood all colorless they could only have 15 or so Eldrazi cards. In a set featuring the final battle against the most powerful of the Eldrazi titans that'd be infinitely anticlimatic. Its impossible for even Wizards to fuck up THAT badly.

>>45304404
You're playing the wrong game then bro. Jace is the face of Magic and has been for almost 9 years now.

>>45304404
Jace, the Investigator actually feels fitting for him.

The Eldrazi, in a more subdued and ominous form (as in pre-ROE), would've been a perfect fit for Innistrad from the getgo (imagine if Eye of Ugin showed up in Avacyn Restored and the payoff wouldn't happen until the final official spoiler for Shadows over Innistrad, wherein you get this big-ass tentacle monster's silhouette superimposed over the Silver Moon).

Making Zendikar the fuccplane for the Eldrazi was a mistake, the Indiana Jones adventure world was better.

Also technically you can punch Ctulhu's shit in, they literally ram him with a boat in Call of Ctulhu. It demands major ramifications though, and fucking up the titans in OGW would probably involve that down the line.

>>45304256
I never mentioned Kiora. Elspeth was the "face walker" of Theros, and yet Theros' story had nothing to do with the Phyrexians despite the fact that the last time we saw Elspeth was New Phyrexia. Sorin wasn't the "face walker" of Tarkir, but his reason for being there ended up being central to the block's story.

It's possible to tell a story that ties into a larger narrative without telling the same story over and over and over again, which is exactly what putting Emrakul in SoI would be. Yes, it's following Jace as he investigates strange shit going down on Innistrad. Yes, we know Nahiri is involved. Kinda seems oddly familiar to Tarkir where Sorin was looking for something and Ugin was central to the story, doesn't it? And yet there were no mechanical links to the Eldrazi at all in Tarkir, other than some minor colorless interactions. It's going to be the same shit here.

>Weatherlight Saga
You mean the one that WotC has admitted was a failure, and not a good way to tell a story? The one that they've mentioned was an issue because people got tired of seeing Gerrard and friends in every single set?

>>45304447
>The eldrazi of Zendikar were just fuckin kaiju with crazy powers because it was the plane of adventure and, essentially, power.
Objection. The original Eldrazi on Zendikar were ALSO mind-breaking horrors. The fluff behind Emrakul's "take an extra turn" clause is that you're reeling in existential horror. Seriously.

I do like the sound of Eldrazi taking on different forms on different planes. That sounds cool.

>>45304360
hell, ROE was a mistake in the first place. Zendikar was fucking awesome as Indiana Jones Adventure World, then they fucked everything up.

>>45304404
Jace admittedly wasn't the main walker of the last two sets.

We had Sarkhan for all of Tarkir.

>>45303528
Nice fucking false dichotomy and straw men you goddamned fat /pol/ack

I never said Abrahamic religions were the ONLY or even the most major influence on European culture. I never said they were good either.

But they are nonetheless important. You can't extract them and have Europe for the past two-thousand years, because they are an undeniable influence. What that influence was has no bearing at all at whether it's part of the culture, because it FUCKING IS.

I mean for fuck's sake you niggerbrained cock-addled shitstain, the Roman empire itself was influenced greatly by the presence of

Kill la fucking kill yourself moron.

>>45304163
>creative integrity
A meaningless phrase that has a variety of definitions. Searching for an actual meaning pulls up Urban Dictionary before any reputable source.

It's also a recent invention. Most of the great artists of history worked on commission, and tailored their works to their clients.

That aside, claiming that responsibility to shareholders and responsibility to customers don't encompass "creating value" is foolish in the extreme. There's a reason that the shareholder equities side of the accounting equation includes "fees earned." Your liabilities are important, yes, but increasing assets so that you can pay your creditors is most efficiently achieved through revenue. And, yes, the basic accounting equation of Assets = Liabilities + Shareholder Equity does cover all stakeholders.

Customers who purchase a product necessarily value it enough to exchange their money for it. To pretend that economic success is unrelated to value is insulting.

Yes, there's shortcutting involved here, but the point is not to debate the finer points of economic theory, but to examine the practical application of it. You cannot say that a company that manages to attract a loyal fan base and increase its sales year after year is somehow failing to create value.

All of this seems to be a rather convoluted distraction from the main point, which is that "creative integrity" and "the role of a company" are being used to shield the basic assumption--that Lorwyn was objectively good--from attack. There were several mechanical issues with Lorwyn, especially in Limited, and Shadowmoor broke the color pie with a great number of its hybrid cards. I love the flavor of Lorwyn/Shadowmoor, but it was also a block with a decent number of problems.

Moreover, the discussion of "plebs" and "the proletariat masses" as distinct from "core gamers" is fallacious and unsubstantiated. It exists primarily in order to exalt the opinion being argued and, again, shield it from attack.

>>45303869
>transferring to D&D
what a scrub

>>45304521
To be fair though, ROE was pretty cool draftwise.

But I would've preferred a true third Zendikar block rather than Eldrazi buttfucking ruining the finale and the return.

Though I do love the hilarious shitstorm it yielded in Modern with Diamond Stompy.

I wonder if MaRo and friends ever regret not using Innistrad as the launchpad for the Eldrazi arc.

>>45304503
They were mind-breaking kind of, but most of their spawn were basically just ASSIMILATE AND CONSUME.

Also, I thought Emrakul's flavor was basically that wherever she went physics distorted?

Like you saw her over the cliffside one second, then in another she was right over you.

>>45304521
Well, they won so in Return to Return to Zendikar, it'll be DnD Ropes and Backpacks World again.

>>45304332
But the point is, those are given names, not what they are. They are Eldrazi Titans, nameless ones, even if they have been give names by the people to make referring to them easier.

If everyone called you 'Lord Faggotron Maximus the Third' that wouldn't make it your actual name, would it Maximus?

>>45300178

It's a Ken Nagle joint

Kek, embrace for impact.

>>45304584

>But the point is, those are given names, not what they are

Literally so fucking what?

Are you insisting that I call my cat "Cat that lives in my house" because the cat doesn't inherently have a name?

>If everyone called you 'Lord Faggotron Maximus the Third' that wouldn't make it your actual name, would it Maximus?

Yes it would though.

That's what a fucking name is.

Unless you think a name is something that's stamped on your soul.

>>45301227
Mein nigger. I like Paolo Parente too.

>>45304405
>Hawthorne
Literally who to someone whose first language isn't English tbqh family

>>45304649
You're right, Lord Faggotron.

I think the other guy is just being dumb on purpose

>>45300474
That looks like some old school land art.

>>45304029
Jace knows there were 3, and that they beat 2. That's why he needs Sorin an Nahiri.

>tfw the residents of Zendikar didn't give the eldrazi insulting names out of spite
SHIT IT'S SPAGHETTI CUNT

>>45304550
There's no question that Lorwyn block had design problems. Tribal from the beginning was very gimmicky and subpar, we had a vanilla rare in Indomitable Ancients, and the mimic/hatchling/liege cycles from shadowmoor/Eventide were underwhelming. But it was, in my opinion, beautiful flavorwise. That was its truest strength.

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>>45304678
Even if you aren't familiar with his name, I'd be more surprised if you didn't recognize his most famous work. He wrote The Scarlet Letter, and earlier in his career he wrote a few short stories like "Young Goodman Brown" and "The Minister's Black Veil" which probably fit the label of "Gothic Horror" better than Scarlet Letter does.

These short stories featured, respectively, a good Puritan man taking a walk in the forest late at night and discovering literally everyone else in his town taking part in an immense Satanic ritual, and a mysterious minister who seems continually pained by an ambigious past sin (a theme he repeats in The Scarlet Letter). Hawthorne's depictions of pious if somewhat xenophobic frontier settlers probably had at least a little to do with the design of parts of Innistrad, such as Kessig, with more of a "wild" feeling to them than say, Gavony.

>tfw Em just wants to be comfy and the Silver Moon is the only couch big enough for her

You only want to kill her because you don't know her!

>>45304495
Big squid just reformed and went back to sleep, until the next time he gets rammed by a boat.

>>45304550
>A meaningless phrase that has a variety of definitions. Searching for an actual meaning pulls up Urban Dictionary before any reputable source.
It's not singular in meaning, but it would be disingenuous to claim it's meaningless. Even if it is not a concern for anyone, the concept of valuing quality, craftsmanship or the expression of the creator's intent in his creations enough to maintain it even as it contends with desires to the contrary from influences (e.g. patrons, media watchdogs et al) warrants a term.

>It's also a recent invention. Most of the great artists of history worked on commission, and tailored their works to their clients.
Ignoring the fact that you clearly know what I'm talking about, retroactively making your comment it's meaningless rather fastidious in hindsight, whether it is recent or not has no bearing whatsoever on whether or not it should be a priority from any perspective at all.

>That aside, claiming that responsibility to shareholders and responsibility to customers don't encompass "creating value" is foolish in the extreme.

It is, so I guess it's good I literally never said that.

I said that the goal of pleasing shareholders above all other stakeholders is unsustainable. There is a healthy balance, naturally, where you don't alienate your customers with short-term exploitation of them until a competitor manages to fill the demand you used to, and while Wizards is peeking towards the edge of that line they haven't crossed it yet, far from it.

The statement in the original post wasn't about Wizards per se, but the absolute statement "companies exist only to make money" in the sense of generating revenue being idiotic.

>Customers who purchase a product necessarily value it enough to exchange their money for it. To pretend that economic success is unrelated to value is insulting.

You're really good at seeing arguments that haven't been made.

>cont

>>45304502
This is still literally the argument people tried to use to "disprove" the colorless mana symbol.

Everything points to Emrakul being on Innistrad, but you refuse to believe that anything can change from how they've always done it, despite admitting that they've changed the way that they tell stories several times.

>>45304649
>Are you insisting that I call my cat "Cat that lives in my house" because the cat doesn't inherently have a name?
You really should, it might get offended otherwise.

>Yes it would though. That's what a fucking name is.
Ok Max. But the problem is that the Eldrazi probably already had names before they became what they are now.

>Inb4 the Eldrazi were born the way they are

In 'The Blight We Were Born For', Tazri's UR article, she lives her future having become an Eldrazi Titan while under Kozilek's influence, so Eldrazi Titans can be made and undone (Zendikar Vampires).

Plus, look at Ula and Kozi, they are incredibly humanoid while Emrakul doesn't resemble anything human at all.

So yeah, names are conventionalisms, but in at least Ulamog and Kozilek's cases these conventions are objectively wrong due to there being preexistent, right ones.

>>45304874
Kessig could very easily be somewhere in the eastern (central) European countryside. Just because you're more familiar with New England doesn't mean that is the more likely inspiration

>>45304649
>He didn't name his cat Cat
Pleb

>>45300400
The word Eldritch can also mean oblong if you are a reader of Terry Pratchett.

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>>45305059
>retroactively making your comment it's meaningless rather fastidious in hindsight

>>45301934
>artists have distinct styles that link each of their works
Wow! You are an art expert!

>>45305075
>Everything points to Emrakul being on Innistrad
People keep saying this, but "literally everything" is literally just conjecture and assumption. None of the artwork suggests this at all. Hell, the promo art for Eldritch Moon is Liliana with a horde of Zombies, with absolutely nothing pointing to Emrakul whatsoever.

>>45300733
What would the card for Micolash be?

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>>45302127
On a random note, I love the flavor of green cards on Innistrad and feel like they might be the main source of this non-human threat here. Essence of the Wild, Kindercatch and the like have this aura of primal fear about them that reminds me of Shadowmoor. Man, Hollowhenge Beast has one of my favorite artworks of the block, and it's just a common vanilla. I wish they would give them a little bit more spotlight, though that might take their strongest point from them.

>>45305140
I'm not sure you read my post correctly. I said
>Hawthorne's depictions of pious if somewhat xenophobic frontier settlers probably had at least a little do to with the design of... Kessig
As you can see, I am making a connection between Hawthorne's depiction of somewhat bigoted Puritan frontier-settlers in a Gothic Horror forest-type wilderness who are menaced by devils and Innistrad's depiction of somewhat bigoted Avacynite(?) frontier-settlers in a Gothic Horror forest-type wilderness. Does that seem unreasonable to you?

I didn't claim that Hawthorne was the only inspiration for Kessig, and it's wildly unreasonable to presume that Wizards only drew inspiration from one source -- which is why I've also listed Poe in this reply chain and Shelley on other posts ITT as additional likely sources of inspiration.

If you still think you read my post correctly, then I'm not really sure what it is you're trying to argue.

>>45305127

>but in at least Ulamog and Kozilek's cases these conventions are objectively wrong due to there being preexistent, right ones.

Disregarding the fact that this is entirely conjectural that still doesn't make their current names "wrong".
Even if they had names in some long forgotten past those names are long lost and if the Titans still remember them they're not interested in giving them out, if humanity encountered some new sentient race which either couldn't or wouldn't communicate with us we would still give it a name and that name wouldn't be "Objectively wrong" just because they probably already have a name for themselves.
The same is true of shit like old rediscovered ruins. We might not have access to what the people that built them called them, but that doesn't make our names for them wrong.

>>45305059
>all this back peddling and pedantry
Jesus Christ, no one cares.

>>45300178
Explain what this means like I've never heard of it before

>>45305305
The second set in Shadows over Innistrad block was announced today, named Eldritch Moon. Eldritch is a word frequently used by H.P. Lovecraft meaning strange, otherworldly, etc. I'm assuming you know what a moon is.