Shadowrun General /srg/

Ok I have a player who thinks he does not need more then one sin and uses his "real name" Now the type of game I'm running has them doing legal work but I wanted to know if there is any rules on tracking a sin or do the person in question just need to know the right people?

>>44199253
NOOOOOOOOO

>>44199756
Well there are rules for checking a fake sin, and if it fails once then it will fail any and all future tests of any type.
The SIN is used to track purchases at legal establishments, licenses and things like rent and bills. so if you have access to the SIN database you could see those things as well as when and where the SIN was checked for validity.
As far as tracking where they are right now from their SIN, I would say a matrix perception looking for a commlink broadcasting that SIN then you would have to get marks on it then run a trace.

If the person knows the right people and never buys things from "legal" places and lives in a place that doesn't care about sin (like an slum apartment for orks and trolls), then their SIN wont have much to track. or they might know a decent ID forger who can get them more than one SIN.

>>44199582
>Riggers

Simply put: More vehicle customization options.
As it stands, making a vehicle rigger is sub-optimal at best, and usually is a secondary role for a sammy. Preferably something that can make vehicles more stealthy, since they can get loads of firepower with mounted weapons.

>>44201949
This
Any decent cybered up Sammy with reaction enhancers can fit a control rig and data jack and put a few points into Pilot ground vehicle and instantly be a decent Vehicle Rigger in terms of driving.

>>44202025
>control rig
>and datajack
Omae, please.

>>44199582
Can you guys help me come up with cool bar name for my character to have worked at as a bouncer? I'm having trouble coming up with anything that's not cliche.

>>44202827
O right. Whoops my bad.

>>44202852
Pinball.

>>44202852
The Rusty Nail
Kirk's Place
2056
Hobart and Wayne's
Runner's Hideout
The Thirsty Dwarf

>>44203230
>Runner's Hideout
Little direct there omae

>>44202852
>>44203057
>>44203230

How about the Louphole, and the owner is a lycanthrope?

>>44202852
Bar names are supposed to be cliche. Could just be "Bar".

>>44203271
Like there wouldn't be a shadowrunner themed bar, where all the wannabes pay $8 for a PBR?

I just started Shadowrun Hong Kong for the first time the other day and Jesus fuck do I hate the Matrix. I'd just like to vent about that for a moment. I hate it like I hate going to the dentist.

Damn if it isn't *pretty*, though.

So how do you guys describe the Matrix for your deckers? Neon and Tron, or simulated rooms, or luminous abstract stuff, or what?

Can you add additional cyberlimbs (ie: have you're full natural set of arms/legs and then have an extra cyberarm), or do something like having cyberarms in place of your legs?

>>44203377
No to the former, unless you happen to have more than two arms to replace naturally.

For the latter, no but there are a couple of cyberleg options that give you upgraded feet. (raptor legs, for instance.)

>>44203377
no unless your gm says yes
no unless your gm says yes, or you could use the monkey foot gubbin

>>44203377
The nerve connections for limbs have got to be pretty specific, right? Would you need some king of arm-to-leg adapter to stick an arm on your leg stump?

>>44203344
>An upper-middle class poser who learned everything he knows about Running on the Matrix and hangs around a theme bar with a bunch of well-off hipsters and cosplayers

And I think I have a concept for my next character. God bless you /tg/.

>>44203344
I feel like you'd get more than one actual shadowrunner hanging out in the back room, though. After all, who would look for the real thing in such an obviously poseur-trap? It'd be the perfect place to actually hide.

>>44203461
>>44203474
>>44203457
Thanks. Also, is it possible to buy off a metagenic quality with karma during character creation, or to take an cyber/bio augmentation that would negate it? Specifically asking about Striking Skin Pigmentation here.

>>44202852
Moe's.

>>44204146
Mo-e or M-oh?

>>44203587
Anon had a pretty rad run idea a few threads back. Some corporate bigwig has a son that loves Shadowrunner movies. So he was having a Shadowrunner themed birthday party, with actors playing runners, all trenchcoated up and everything. Except he's learn that there's going to be an attempted kidnapping, and he's replaced the actors with the PCs.

>>44203348

Depends on the host. They're all sculpted, after all. I guess somewhat tronish underneath it all, but the interface varies from place to place, particularly in big name locations like AAA domains. Increasingly surreal when Technomancers are involved.

>>44202852

I have an idea for a Decker bar called Drown(Sorrows). There would be a sign that would look like

10 Get Nuyen
20 Get Drinks
30 GOTO 10

And each part of the sign would light up in sequence. All of the drinks would come with choice of White Ice, basic icecubes, or Black Ice, some kind of frozen liquor. The menu would have drink names like Dumpshock and Data Bomb.

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>>44203587
>Obnoxious K-Pop blaring
>Tables are packed with fresh-faced kids drinking ¥20 cocktails and answering to drek like "Razor", "Whiplash", and "Nightshade"
>They're all taking turns bragging about "runs" they just got off of and trying to impress the elf waitresses they think might be listening in.
>Just an Average Friday night at the Runner's Hideout
>Suddenly the door is blown open and the bouncer catches a face full of shrap.
>12 Lone Star tactical operators rush in and hold everybody at gun point
>"Okay, which one of you Panza?"
>This weedy little punk who thinks he's Fastjack janders out of the crowd. Laser sights track him all the way.
>"We ain't givin' you pigs nothing. So why don't y-"
>2-Leet (yeah that's his handle) catches a rifle butt with his skull.
>Rest of the customers immediately start with choruses of "Police brutality!" and "Do you know who my dad is?"
>The tac-team has them stunned, cuffed, and out of the bar in under 10 minutes.
>Sound the "All clear" about hour after we clean the blood and spilled drinks off the floor.
>Panza and his crew come out of the basement. toss me a cred stick with my fee, and extra for the door and Lonnie's face on it, and take off.
>Insurance is going to cover them anyway
>Between my fee, the drinks, tips, and a creatively written insurance claim, me and the staff have made a killing. Even with a bonus for Lonnie.

"A Runner themed bar will never work" they said.

>>44204458
>Lonestar too stupid to check the basement

>>44204593
To be fair, it has happened in real life, police officers not checking a basement, or at least not toroughly, and missing a couple of important things.

>>44204458
http://waifubartending.com/

>>44204593
>>44204651
I was going to put in something about how the Lone Star would be too busy (not to mention happy about meeting some arbitrary quota) collaring thirty-odd suspected Shadow Runners to notice the false wall behind all the beer kegs, but I ran out of space.

I also wanted to add a thing about how all the kids would be back next week because getting arrested would totally boost their street cred. Hell, they'd probably even bring new friends just so they could have the bartender tell them it was all true.

What's your loadout, /srg/? What kinds of different ammunition do you take for your guns, and how many magazines' worth of each?

I just watched a video about special riot ammunition from the 1920s for the Thompson SMG, which fires little balls of shot from a paper cartridge. The rounds required a special magazine because they were too long to fit in a standard Thompson mag.

>>44204907
APDS always
one mag of explosive rounds for pyrotechnics
3 bullets worth of tracker chip round

>>44199582
source? that dog is 2cute

>>44205039
Its a machine not a dog

>>44205058
just answer the fucking question

>>44205103
A reverse image search leads me to believe that it's from FLCL, friend.

>>44205113
Weeaboo knowsofts lead me to believe you are correct.

>>44204907
Gel rounds by default, 1-2 mags/speedloaders of APDS just in case.

If SHTF is expected, tracer rounds for suppressive fire, more APDS, even more APDS, one mag/speedloader of trackers.

>>44202852
Anthony's
Barracuda Bar and Grill
XPresion
Gay Homosexual

>>44202852
Kebechet
goddess, a deification of embalming liquid. Her name means cooling water.

It's a great name for a bar AND you're goth at the SAME TIME

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>>44204907
frankly

>>44205121
>knowsofts
Be honest with yourself, Omae.

>>44205416
It's just the chips, honestly desu

>>44204907

Whatever bullets I take, always thermal smoke, flashbangs, and narcojet grenades in addition. Beyond that, 4 regular, 2 gel, 1 SnS, 1 APDS. Ex gets expensive.

>>44205154
Is there a difference between APDS and AP ammo?

>>44205568
APDS is the actual name
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armour-piercing_discarding_sabot

>>44205599
I know what APDS is, I was just wondering if there was an actual AP ammo, and then APDS ammo.

APFSDS for snipers when? :^)

>>44205568

APDS is a needle shaped projectile that is stabilised by "sabots" so it doesn't tumble over when fired.
AP is a bullet that has a hardened outer layer so it doesn't deform when it hits armour

>>44205410
I'm deeply envious of Ian, it looks like he loves his job.

>>44205635
>Get APDS
>Add fins to the projectiles
>That's pretty much it

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>>44205635
I wonder if it's possible to channel spirits while sniping, to make all my bullets Finn stabilized.

So, can anyone explain all the different music genres that shadowrun now has? Has there ever been any actual writing on any of that?

>>44205883
Try Shadowbeat

Basically there's everything we have now and more, all turned up to 11.

>>44205644
Nah, bro', the "sabot" refers to the outer shell that gets discarded. It's the fins that stabilize the projectile.

>>44205883
The thing with art is, whatever you can imagine is a thing. By definition.

>>44205883
There's been some, but the good writing for it was written before half of today's genres were born and the Catalyst writing is sparse.

>>44205928
you only even need fins if you're firing a really narrow projectile, like in tank-fired APFSDS, not like the 7.62 APDS that has a much smaller sabot and still spins right and proper

>>44205928
There's a difference between APDS and APFSDS "bro"

>>44205938
In both case, the "sabot" refers to the same thing, and has nothing to do with stabilization of the projectile.

>>44200266
Fear not. In the city of Neo-Windsor, Ontario, Pizza is still revered, as it always has been.

>>44204240
Mo-e. Make it a maid cafe.

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How's this looking for a rather generic street sam?

Obviously not complete, I got about 30 karma and some more money up my sleeve to plug the gaps. Get some ammo, balance in a few qualities etc.

>>44206054
>it's called Moe's because ironic misspellings and engrish are popular with Japan enthusiasts

>>44206332

I'd recommend taking a specialization for your most commonly used firearm skill, in this case probably Automatics(Assault Rifles). It's an easy +2 dice, even if it does require breaking the skill group.

Looks pretty solid to me otherwise. Well-rounded, which is nice. I'd recommend grabbing the Agile Defender quality when you're picking those out, but I don't have much else to suggest.

>>44206332
If you still have the money, go for a full titanium bone lacing (used to be under 12 availability), and add an orthoskin on top of it. Your soak pool is low-ish for a frontline character. Take Agile defender to boost your dodge pool to 18 in case of SHTF.

Unarmed combat is rather wasted, although it will depend on what martial art you're going for. But your base strength is too low to make it a regular attack, even with bone lacing, and you'll need one major upgrade before having enough of an essence hole to install an augmented punching device.

I'd put spare Karma in boosting Etiquette a bit (a dicepool of 3 is risky), a couple of extra ranks in Sneaking and in Pilot Groundcraft (since you went the length to get a control rig) Disguise and First Aid.(that can always come in handy.)

>>44203348
Why do you hate the matrix chummer?
It's so much more fun than just lol kill everything.

>>44203348
Like a cheap version of reality, that's always ready to glitch and start peeling back at the edges. Once the hacking starts, things get chemical.

>>44206460
Yeah, this is a starting character so I thought I might do that as a very first improvement.

>>44206480
Ok, bump up the soak and a couple of those non combat skills. Got the control rig there to make it so he can drive, not just sit around outside combat.

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>>44206731
There. Cleaned it up a bit. Not too embarrassing I think.
Now I'm headed out to watch Star Wars

When will the recent 178 update for Chummer be available for update through the exe itself?
(asking because I have some players in my group who are pants-on-head retarded and/or tech illiterate to the point where it would confuse them to have to redownload it. Lord knows I barely get them to update through the launcher itself)

>>44204398
you golden god you
Stealing this

>>44203344
$8 for a PBR is porbably a good deal in 2075. You know the alcohol in that isn't an industrial byproduct?

>>44205635
You would need a special smoothbore barrel to even fire APFSDS.

>>44207458
Nah, the brits manage to fire APFSDS from their Chally's rifled guns just fine. They need to make a special adaptation to their rounds (don't ask me what exactly, I have no idea), but it can be done.

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I think I fucked up GMing this last time. Are shedim possessing bodies supposed to have Immunity to Normal Weapons in 5e?

>>44207650
Speaking of immunity to normal weapons, what else does have an immunity to normal weapons and what can then damage them?

>>44207707
>>44207650
How about you read the section on Immunity to Normal Weapons in the Core Rulebook first.

>>44206529
The controls aren't nearly precise enough for dodge-the-watchers to be anything but annoying, particularly when the best way to move forward is to plan carefully, only half the time you can't actually see anything because of all of the blocks in front of you. The Blocker IC puzzles are tedious, too.

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Can anyone advise me on building an unarmed Physical Adept in Shadowrung Returns: Hong Kong?

Usually just go with street samurai faces, never played anything magical, and want to do something different.

The only sticking point is that the Adept MC will also need to have like 4 INT and high CHA for dialogue check purposes. Also was thinking of making them a dwarf since I've only played Humans/Elves/Trolls.

Will not having to buy cyberware mean I'm swimming in Nuyen?

>>44207650

I bet you feel really stupid after reading the explanation of how that ability works.

>>44208077

There are a total of two fights you *cannot* avoid and they are easy ones. There might be three, but I know it's not higher than that.
Otherwise it's just a simple task of looking at patrols and clicking where you want to go.
I liked that you could invest a very small amount of points into Matrix stuff and still be good, as opposed to the previous games, where it was mostly "slog through empty corridors and then fight 4 things".

Besides FATE, have any of you guys run Shadowrun in a system that isn't, well, Shadowrun?

Is it possible to have a Corp SIN and a fake SIN at once?

>>44208272

Yes, but there's a chance that the other SIN will be picked up instead of your Fake one.

So, how well does(n't) dual wielding work in SR 5e? And where can I find the rules for it?

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>>44208316
The rules are in the core. Basically you split your dice pool in two, one for each hand (with -2 for your offhand unless your ambidextrous). Usually only good for prime runners with such honking great dice pools that they regularly blow past their limit.

>>44207824
>>44207650

Pg 397, right? I'm looking and it details how it works. However, it's not listed as a power for any of the spirits, and the possession power description in SG doesn't mention it. What am I missing here?

>>44205774
I literally did a spit take when I clicked that spoiler.

10/10 for making my roommate think I am crazy

>>44206000
Is it as much of a shithole as the real Windsor?

>>44208288
Only if something is checking your SIN based on biometric data or facial recognition (which you should get surgically altered ASAP)

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>>44208464
Well, considering Ares is based out of Detroit, I bet it's better off, at least economically; a satellite community where actual manufacturing is done, safely away from the executives.

It's also probably a bug hive

>>44208376
Don't Shedim inhabit corpses rather than merely possess them?

What would a Force 1 Great Form Plant spirit look like? Are spirit appearences even affected by their force?

I'm doing one on one intro sessions with each player to introduce them to the world and their rules specifically. So far, I've done a night as a bouncer for the troll Sammy, escape from the embassy for the face, and I'm planning on an assassination mission for the stealth-elf. What would be a decent 2-3 hour mini-mission for an ork technomancer in 4e.

>>44208130
>Will not having to buy cyberware mean I'm swimming in Nuyen?
absolutely not, i played a mage and had to buy only spells and clothing and the ocassional weapon and i was scraping the walls for a few nuyen

>>44208333
Thanks.

Another question for the thread: How do you protect your wireless enabled equipment from cyber-attack? My character has a pretty large amount of cybernetics, but I don't want to end up hacked and killing my own teammates. I was thinking an internal router would help, but I'm not sure how that interacts with my smartgun.

>>44209164
You invest in a top of the line comlink and leave your wireless off until you really need it?

>>44209164
Turn off your limbs.

Route everything through a commlink with a high Firewall/your friendly neighbourhood decker.

A router is explicitly compatible with your smartgun and any other wireless resources that don't need outside connections.

>>44209044
Assuming they are already a shadowrunner, they are hired to go to a university and gather intel. No decks allowed inside the research facilities, but a student shows up in a hoodie and crashes in a research cubicle for a few minutes? No one will notice.

>>44208936

There is a sense of power about the spirits which is tied to their Force rating.
A F1 Spirit could be huge and frightening, but it'd look like something from a dream, not particularly vivid or frightening, just sort of there.
As far as I can tell, nowhere does it say how big or small the spirit is, through presumably they're not smaller than a dwarf and not bigger than a Troll, since that's how the Matrix works.

>>44209044

A hacker tournament at the hacker bar! Stun damage stuff only, and some competitions to exploit, edit, and otherwise Internet things.

>>44209240
Except the smartgun does require an external connection.

>>44209302
You can plug a cable to your DNI and plug that into your gun. Everything has a USB slot you can use for wired shots.

>>44209344
Your Smartgun still needs Matrix access to get its dicepool modifier. All an internal router will allow is to eject a mag/change firing modes as a free action rather than a simple action.

>>44209510
Technically you get the +2 accuracy increase, as well as fire around corners, too. And you can fit vision enhancements on it if you want.

>>44209245
It says somewhere normal spirits are metahuman size, and Great Form spirits are giant versions of the normal thing (a walking hurricane/landslide and so-on).

>>44204301
Stealing this idea.

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Hey, /tg/.

Work buddies starting up a game of Shadowrun5, never touched it before. Looking at a Technomancer - maybe not the best choice to start, but the other players are largely noobs to RPGs in general, so I'm the best candidate to learn about The Matrix and Resonance.

Anyway - what do you guys use for inspiration, flavor-wise? I'm trying to get my head in the right space, and downloading some of the stuff in the pastebiin now. Cyberpunk stuff is in the right vein, but seems like it's missing something. What other art/media should I look for to get a feel for the setting?

>>44203348
>>44208077
so how would you make the matrix interesting in the HBS games? i liked the direction they were headed in HK's matrix but unfortunately the base of the game is not suitable for the gameplay they wanted, specially since it relies on that godawful pathfinding

i'm doing a UGC right now with some personal touches to the matrix like the fact that i have a matrix boss, a persona/black IC that replicates itself to spread out in various nodes to fuck the player over but i'd like to improve upon it as much as i can

i wanna add at least one place where there's a technomancer involved and it looks like a wicked maze but i can't grasp the concept of post-crash 2.0 matrix or how i would manage the whole thing to accomodate to the gameplay

it looks pretty good but it's boring as fuck

>>44209980
Flavor-wise for the Matrix and Technomancers, or Shadowrun in General?

>>44207020

Chummer's autoupdate is borked, unfortunately. Yekka was using Dropbox to distribute, but pushing an update gets him over his daily download limit so it's no longer reliable.

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>>44210106
I had initially meant Shadowrun in general, but anything is helpful.

>>44210173
Technomancers are like Neo when hes plugged into the Matrix, they can break all of the rules the Matrix has established. Except the Matrix is everywhere and integrated with the meat world.

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>>44210276
Yeah, I've got that bit sorted out.

Like I said before - really just looking for art/movies or even music/fiction that is really SR-ish.

Might pick up a Shadowrun game and play through it a bit, even.

One of my least favourite parts of the Shadowrun setting is the disproportiante amount of important metahumans compared to the actual metahuman population. Elves make up .6% of the population, but make up countless amounts of important characters and make it so that they're more prevalent in character creation than Orks, which are supposed to make up 17%.

>>44207458
>>44207539
Ball bearings on the sabot's to cause them to not spin.

Why are there desktop computers in shadowrun if everyone can do everything off a commlink?

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>>44203272
A+

We just had an AI join our group. Good, bad, or ugly?

>>44211748
why are there desktop computers in real life when nowadays you can do everything off a laptop?

why are there books in real life when you can read everything off a kindle?

>>44211782
Oh dear, you're in deep shit now...

>>44211813
That's what I thought. How do I salvage this situation?

>>44211748
Because the commlink being a universal smartphone is semi-new seeing as smartphones didn't exist back when the setting was originally made, but in-setting a good reason is because by networking desktop computer systems and allowing your workers to only use them during work hours you can create a closed system that's harder to access by outside intrusions.

>>44211782
Don't let it anywhere near the party van.

>>44211832
You could talk with the player if you are one, and it sounds like you aren't the GM.
Honestly I find it fairly amusing that you think you have ANY ability to control or "salvage" what this other player might do since I'm guessing you aren't going to physically force him to not play an AI and beyond that you're pretty much relying on him being charitable and listening to you.

>>44211832
Well, first thing first, you'll need two things: a portable device (comlink or deck) that can serve as the AI's home, and a Faraday-caged bug-out vehicle always ready to go.

If GOD ever arrives on scene, run for it. and remember, if everything else fails, handing over the AI is always an option.

>>44211911
I know it's probably hopeless from the get-go, and I am indeed a player, but I prefer to approach the situation with some optimism rather than giving up my character as screwed because another player decided to paint a big ol' target on our collective back.

I was thinking along the lines of limiting it to a single device that isn't connected to the Matrix by anything other than a hardline.

>>44211935
The player says since the AI was designed by a corp, it is outside of GOD's jurisdiction. I'm sort of new to SR, so I'm not sure about the truth value of that statement.

>>44211966
>The player says since the AI was designed by a corp, it is outside of GOD's jurisdiction. I'm sort of new to SR, so I'm not sure about the truth value of that statement.
Attempting to push the needle below 0%.

GOD's jurisdiction is the various grids of the matrix, and while it's possible that the setting has been faffed with enough that a corp could create an AI, it's not really something done on purpose at this point.

>>44211966
He's wrong. EVERYTHING Matrix-related is under the jurisdiction of GOD. They merely extend the courtesy to Host admins and local spiders to deal with the crap inside their Host the way they want.

The moment the AI is out of a Host, it's free game! And GOD really doesn't like pesky little AI's, even less than annoying little meatbag deckers and technomancers.

>>44212044
>>44212061

I guess the situation is now, how do I approach the GM, who should have known this information? How do I mitigate this potential disaster without destroying the group? This player was brought in by a player whose character is one of our few frontliners, in a sea of faces.

>>44211935
As an AI player, I'd sooner keep my shit on a drone or commlink / cyberdeck form factored into a drone. Leaving it up to you to carry around sounds sketchy as fuck.

Is there a way to random roll a Shadowrun's stats and special abilities?

>>44211748
High device rating terminals are cheaper than comlinks with the same device rating?

E.g. compare a gaming laptop to a pc with the same specs.

>>44209245
The size restrictions are something that was forced on the Matrix in the new revamp to make Hosts work for everyone. It's rules laid down by GOD, not actual limits.

I've seen spirits of all shapes and sizes (I think watchers and homunculi are explicitly smaller than dwarves), up to giant fiery serpents.

>>44212133
You'll need a meatbag handler to help you keep your 'home' out of trouble whenever you realign ("sleep") or worse, get disrupted ("heal").

Trusting a drone's autosofts to do that is... risky.

>>44212183

I was referencing it as a design decision on the part of the devs.
I'm sure that somewhere, in that lovecraftian amalgamation they call a core rulebook exists something telling us about the size of Spirits. But I don't want to risk falling into a corner, so I'm guessing.

>>44210148

mh

I'm getting stupid errors when trying to select a lifestyle that isn't advanced, as well.

>>44212229
No worse than any other PC sleeping, if you have a second lifestyle. Better, if you're smart enough to "sleep" somewhere both secure and inconspicuous.

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>>44210836
That's part of elves, though; they're naturally charismatic and personable, and they live a long time, so they rise to the top sooner or later in a lot of industries. This is especially true for media, where the large numbers of sexy elf movie stars in glamorous roles reinforces the cultural stereotype that elves belong on top. Meanwhile, the hardworking trolls and orcs who make up the backbone of society are unfairly prejudiced against, oppressed by media relations and encouraged to belief they are no better than minimum-wage work away from customers and lives of crime. It's all part of the elven plot to take over society from the inside. Just look at the Tirs; Elves start small, ask for some concessions, and pretty soon they're kicking down doors, declaring that everything belongs to them now and are willing to kill to make that true. They are a poison upon society, smiling to our faces and readying knives for our backs.


I played an orc rights activist who would make these arguments all the time to anyone who would listen.

>>44212238
>Great form spirits are well named, as they are larger than regular spirits in essentially every conceivable way. If you conjure a spirit of water and have it literally rain down on the opposition, then the best your spirit can do is give your obstacles their own personal rain cloud. Now, if you took your rain-cloud spirit and swapped it with a great form spirit, then you could order up a supercell storm—one of those storm fronts so dark, black, and massive that it feels like the world is coming to an end when it slowly rolls overhead.

This is from SG. I think it's enough to say spirit size isn't completely up to the PC.

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>>44212156
What?

If you want to randomly generate a shadowrun (i.e. the mission the player characters go on), there are tables in the back of the core book.

If you want to randomly roll a shadowrunner (i.e. a player character), there is none and you should be slapped if you try. Random rolls in SR work about as well as randomly rolling in 3.5 D&D (i.e. not at all, and used only by nostalgia-blind grognards and idiots who don't understand the system).

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>>44210836
Orks have a hard time surviving for half a century, and spend most of their lives getting in trouble with the po-po and being oppressed by the man. Their main role for minmaxers is street sammy, but it's already been established that you don't live in the shadows for too long if you are anything other than the generic discreet black trenchcoat operator with an AR and a ballistic mask #1,216,999,999, which doesn't give too many options for character development (as any semblance of a personality is bonus dice for memory tests against you). They don't even work too well as unconventional joke characters, since you have trolls for your super original idea of a low-Cha Face. About the only things they have going for themselves fluff-wise are Ork Rock, though unfortunately rock fell out of fashion sometime around when Shadowrun was conceived, and the semen demons that ork girls are often portrayed as. I feel like the latter are the only reasons why orks and dwarves still even exist.

>>44212422
Is that...Japanese Shadowrun?

>>44212453
I think it's the japanese translation of it yeah.

>>44212422
Can you post more of this? It's hilarious.

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>>44212549
>>44212453
You don't even know, omae.

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>>44212562
You can find a lot more like this if you look.

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>>44212453
>>44212549
Shadowrun got the Wizardry treatment in Japan. Too bad it didn't catch on.

>>44212422
>>44212562
>>44212582
Why are ork girls such qts? They're prettier than most elf girls.

>>44212829
I remember seeing a picture of an ork decker that could make you rethink that statement in one of the 5e sourcebooks, but for the life of mine I can't find it anymore.

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>>44204458
>Tables are packed with fresh-faced kids drinking ¥20 cocktails and answering to drek like "Razor", "Whiplash", and "Nightshade"
>answering to drek like "Nightshade"

A single, lonesome sob escapes my last character's lips.

>>44212829

Because they're physically strong and tall women. Nerds are all over that.

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>>44212851
I know the one you're talking about. Most drawings of lady orcs give them dainty little tusks, and don't reshape the jaw or face at all. They're humans wearing costume fangs.

>>44212829
Because metatype reduction is a thing.

>>44212957
Eh, still not even that bad. Needs a better haircut, though-- or a better artist. Also pants that won't make her fall over constantly. What the hell is that thing between her knees?

>>44213028
I believe it's supposed to be part of a security harness...

>>44205774
Markus, nyt vittu.

>>44213048
Worst security harness ever, then, but it makes sense that that's what it would be.

>>44213114
I figured it was some kind of suspender-type thing unhooked and hanging down. A fashion statement attached to the belt, not to the leg parts.

>>44212770
Wizardry Treatment?

>>44213166
Suspenders don't work like that, but it could theoretically attach to the belt. It *looks* like it attaches to those bands around her thighs, though. That would certainly make more sense as far as a working harness is concerned-- it would need additional straps around the waist, and also for the ring to hang in the front, however.

>>44213257
Got ported to Japan and got anime all over it.

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>>44213257
An american computer game series, Wizardry, got turned into something entirely different when it hit Japan and became a surprise success there.

Though it got popular on its own merits and didn't get injected with anime until after its original creators ceased to exist. And we owe it to Japan that the videogame analog of Tomb of Horrors received an amazing graphical remake on a home console.

>>44212119
So, uh, he's saying that GOD would actually hunt us down if we turned it back into the corp that designed it, because the AI is "off limits". Disregard and sell it if the player doesn't repair the concept, yes?

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>>44213942
Then clearly the GM and the player have worked out something, and he doesn't want you killing off a PC because you're paranoid. Relax, look at some pictures of cute trolls, and let the GM do his thing.

>>44214010
It has two personalities, one of which is comparable to GLADOS, the other being a little girl, and is named T.S.U.N.D.E.R.E. I'll put it on the GM's radar, and trust him to take care of it from there. Thanks for the cute troll though, omae. Appreciate it.

>>44214096

Oh, sweet Vishnu.
Well, on the bright side, if you prepare a bug out kit and vehicle your character ought to survive.

Hey srg has there been any books after chrome flesh?
I know that rigger book is coming.

Do you use dice roller apps, or do you actually roll 3 pounds of d6s?

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>>44214642
Half the fun of Shadowrun is taking a great big mitt of d6s and spreading them across half the table. Dice rollers are faster, but you can't put a price on fun.

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>>44210836
Your percentages are way off.

>>44214642

I let my players roll if it's <14 dice or less.
Extended tests, or more dice than 14 gets a dice roller.

>>44214703

He probably means Seattle. It's got something like a 6% Elf population.

>>44213942
>Disregard and sell it if the player doesn't repair the concept, yes?
Depends how much you want the shadow community notoriety of selling a team mate.

If I'm not a melee character, how much can I dump strength?

>>44214902
Low.
Get yourself a Monowhip.
Everything will be fine.

>>44214902

Your STR shouldn't be under 2. Not because you need it or anything, but because 3 is average. 2 Makes you weedy and out of shape.
1 is close to having a disability.

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>>44214956
that ain't how stats work in shadowrun, omae

1 in stats means you're no better than the average person in the sixth world regarding the stat in question

>>44215010
uh, no
1 is feeble, 2 is underdeveloped, 3 is average

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>>44215010
It's been just this way for ages, drekhead.

>>44215010

I just looked it up, even the Professional Rating 0 Grunts, described as "knuckle dragging, mouth breathing Neanderthals" have a Logic and Charisma of 2, with 3 in other stats and 4 in Agility.

>>44215124
>>44215133
what editions?

>>44214956
>>44215010
>>44215043
1 is fairly low, but you need to be playing with a particular type of group for it to be "close to having a disability".

It does essentially mean you need skill training, situational bonuses, or gear to succeed in related tests, though.

>>44215133
Separation of fluff and crunch, omae. Guess what Catalyst has never been good at.
The thing is, stats stayed at the same benchmarks since FASA, but Catalyst started power creep when they flooded the game with more magic, more metatypes, more splats and more magical natives. To keep any form of challenge without making it obvious that they were tearing open the corpse of Shadowrun and shitting into it, they had to crank up the stats of average goons even if it doesn't make a whit of sense.
As expected of a game studio whose primary priority seems to be how many special-snowflake metatypes they can cram in while completely eroding the mood, setting and themes of actual Shadowrun.
>>44215142
The one that matters.

>>44214902
I've got maxed-out strength on my Street Sam, even though she's a gunbunny with melee damage as a distant second priority. The first reason I do this is because high strength means high carry capacity, which is important if you like heavy weapons (which I do). It allows you to carry the gun, the ammo it provides, and even a backup weapon or two.


The second reason is because high strength values provide extra recoil compensation. In the 4e rules, it is impossible to completely nullify the recoil of a minigun with accessories alone. There simply aren't enough slots. So you need high strength in order to keep your shots on target; because miniguns are heavy weapons, their uncompensated recoil is doubled. I don't know if this is still the case in 5e, but I imagine it's fairly similar.

You can certainly get away with mid-to-low strength if you're a ranged combatant and you're not into heavy weapons, but high strength does have a niche it fills.

>>44215195
>Separation of fluff and crunch, omae. Guess what Catalyst has never been good at.

Both of them?

>>44215231
All three. Fluff, crunch and separating the two. Though I guess the first two makes the last one better - hard to ruin what's already shit.

>>44215142
Literally all of them.

>>44215195

The fluff doesn't have stats. Hell, the statement makes no sense. Your average runners aren't better than the average person in all things.

Mechanically, in 5e, the threshold for an Average job is 2.
This means you'd need to have 5 ranks in a skill to be able to do an average job if your stat is 1.
Hell, if you've got STR 1 you can lift 15 kg and carry 10.
I literally sit in bed all day and can do better than that easily.

>>44215195
The Catalyst editions are ones you have to treat like D&D 3.x/PF. The core rulebooks are serviceable, but you need to limit how many sourcebooks you allow or else power creep will do you in. It also shares players with those games.

>>44215299
>Your average runners aren't better than the average person in all things.

Your average runners are idiot-savants who are absolutely amazing in one particular field but have to default on everything else.

>>44215349

Allow me to correct myself then.
"The average runner..."
And then to point out that *your* runners might be this, but I find it to be a distasteful practice and look down on you for deciding to engage in it so regularly it seems the default.

>>44215372
It's not just me, it seems to be an attitude endemic to many Shadowrun players. And it's not hard to see why; character generation encourages minmaxing.

>>44215299
Split hairs if you will - I can see where the problem of definition lies, but it's still clear to see what I mean, and nitpicking it isn't going to change anything.
Twist it how you will, the facts are that Catalyst has introduced absurd power creep and special-snowflake metatypes enough to drown a troll in. The original cyberpunk-focused game with an interesting noir-Gibsonian vibe with the added touch of fantasy and magic to give a sense of mystery, change and the unknowable has been drowned in an infinite flood of ever-increasing metatypes, wanky gear, special splats (Technomancers - I admit Otaku were a mistake, but at least they weren't core) and a complete dissolution of the core themes (through the wireless Matrix, magic inflation both in fluff and crunch, gimping of cybernetics and the resultant complete dissolution of anything even remotely resembling balance).
It's really sad what Shadowrun has become. By now, the charm and detail of the original setting has become a playground for the kind of people who play nWoD to play free spirits, drakes and pixies in a universe that's completely lost its grip on what it used to be, and all because of a ame company that has no sense of scope, no idea of narrative and no respect for the intellectual property that they were lucky enough to be given creative control over.

>>44215349
>>44215433
/srg/ has a specific culture when it comes to PC strength. I'd take any advice or examples given here with a pinch of salt.

>>44215433
imo chargen simply doesn't STOP minmaxing, and bad players take that to mean they NEED to minmax, and then I have to hit them with newspapers until they know the error of their ways.

>>44215433
It's really because GMs let people skate on it by hand waving memory, lift/carry, judge intentions, etc tests.

>>44215466
I'd recommend for example an old Monstrous Manual. Those things have got got grip and heft, great for reprimanding players about the head and neck with if they start getting neo-roleplayer on you.

>>44215489
I've got one coming in the mail that should do the trick, I'll have to test it for myself.

>>44215444

I'm not being facetious, or derisive.
I literally don't know what you're talking about.
What changes they brought to the setting were needed to update it.
It's still punk, it's still about a futuristic dystopian world.
The setting progressed. It's the nature of living works.
You don't have to like it.
By all means, play the editions you do. Or customize and run your game so it feels comfortable to you.

The game, though? It's just changed to reflect the times.

>>44215553
Honestly, Shadowrun changed in more ways than that. SURGE was never something needed to "update" the game, the move towards offering everything as a player-character option wasn't either. Bringing the Matrix away from Cyberspace? Maybe, but fucking 2e's Matrix system is still more sensible and less gaudily retro than 4e's "Everything in the future will be a cellphone and there'll be no cords anywhere!" paradigm.

>>44215466
The need to optimize is a gameplay issue, not a chargen issue. You need those 18 dice in sneaking because the penalty for failure is so high. Sure they count as a professional infiltrator at 12 dice, but that only gives then better-than-average odds to succeed against standard fare security guards, which isn't good enough when the penalty for failure is death/mission failure. Being extremely skilled at something increases what you're capable of at your best, but the real value is shrinking the failure state on the medium difficulty tasks you need to perform regularly.

>>44215624
Well, that's where Shadowrun requires modifiers to make the slightest bit of fucking sense. Average guards versus a -1 penalty for distance and a -2 for having a wall in between, that's a fairly routine test (Depending, I suppose, on your definition of "average", and edition, and whether you trust book mooks, which is either logical or not depending on edition). If you're actually sneaking with no penalties on the perceiver, I feel like the situation is already one that should deserve Edge.

>>44215553
>needed
A work is a product of its times. Changing a work to reflect the times isn't a natural act and is mostly nearly impossible due to the large amount of themes that need to be changed, especially when it's games like the oWoD or Shadowrun that are most definitely a product of the age in which they were written. That's why the nWoD is a shallow, angsty mess of Stephen King ripoffs, Cthulhu Lite and The Vampire Diaries that manages "horror" solely through the pretentious belief of the players that they're supposed to be scared because the game is "deep" and quotes Twilight with a straight face. That's why 4th and 5th ed Shadowrun have almost completely lost the elements that made the previous editions /cyber/punk, because it focuses too hard on being "relevant". The wireless Matrix not only tossed the decker role into complete chaos and raised many more issues than it solved (hacking cyberware being a be-all end-all), but it also removed a key chunk of the cyberpunk theme of "how much are you willing to cut out of yourself for power", as it no longer requires a physical datajack and thus removes an important partial theme as well as a key visual element of cyberpunk. In turn, this shunted the priority over on magic, which could have been handled well if it hadn't suddenly ditched all the punk elements for "magical natives, fairies and free spirits".
It's not "the nature of living works". A work is a product of its time, and letting a good work rest is a sign of respect. "Fixing" something that isn't broke just because it has to be "cool and modern" is a failsafe way to mangle a lot of key themes as well as piss on the original creators, their hard work and their intents from a great height.

>>44215712
They could have rejiggered Shadowrun to make it more derivative of modern cyberpunk than classic cyberpunk. But then again, they didn't.

>>44215712

You realize that they're still releasing SR books, right?
That they're not retconing the setting?
That's what "living work" means.
All the old stuff is still out there. There's a timeline. The fluff changed.
The oppressive nature of the world now has constant surveillance it's cornerstone.
Honestly, you seem mostly upset that it's going for the new age approach to magic, which, you know, it's always had.
Are you just angry that there's SURGE and pixies and people can play weird things?

>>44215810
Well, I'm the other oldSR nerd, but there's a pretty distinct difference between the new-age magic in the old books and the new-age magic in the new ones.
but the bigger issue there is that they forgot to make magic dangerous to the caster in 4e and 5e.

>>44215735
Instead, it's not even derivative of cyberpunk at all.
If they wanted "modernity", all they needed to do was put down Mona Lisa Overdrive and pick up Idoru. That's post-cyberpunk done pretty well, and it's still Gibson at that.
It's not an issue of decisions as much as it's an issue of respect and understanding. Catalyst neither respect nor comprehend what Shadowrun was intended to be by the original creators, and it's an insult towards the people who worked hard on the game for years and years to see it mangled into a parody of a game that reads like what a 12-year-old boy who's just discovered the combination of CoD, porn and energy drink would think of when hearing "cyberpunk with fantasy elements". It's almost before I think that half of CGL had to look up "cyberpunk" on Wikipedia before working on it (or even halfway through).
>>44215810
I could care less if they're trying to please the old guard by symbolically not officially retconning the setting. By your standards, AoS didn't ruin Warhammer because GW didn't go out and burn old Warhammer books. The fluff is kept in the archives, sure, but it's not being properly used, and most importantly of all, CGL is still disrespecting the original work by shitting all over its themes and intents (and it makes it even worse that they don't even have the decency to split off the setting completely, but have to shit all over other people's hard work when they could choose not to).
I'm not mad that 4e and 5e have the new-agey magic that 3e has. I'm mad that it's gone too far. Magic is now everything that matters about the universe - even the Matrix feeds back into it, magical snowflake races flood the world and magic is becoming more and more of a game-breaking be-all end-all that's even tying into the SJW target group (because of magical natives).
I'm angry that people can play metatypes because they're an example of an unhealthy trend in RPGs that glorifies uniqueness and specialness over actual character.

>>44215887
Yeah. Eclipse Phase is modern and cyberpunk-derived. And based on Shadowrun, yet it kept the tone better. Somehow, I fail to buy the argument that the way the setting evolved is just a symptom of modernization-- It's obvious that Catalyst has its issues with herding writers. Maybe if they paid them. Or stopped publishing unfinished books because "muh gencon". The people at the top are obviously used to making shit like The Vikings(tm) TV Show Official Board Game, not carrying on franchises with a long history and a coherent tone.

>>44215810
>>44215887
And lemme elaborate on the last part.
The metatypes and special-snowflakery are part of a trend in modern gaming that attempts to appeal to neo-roleplayers who want to play what they've seen in movies, games and pop-cultural depictions of roleplaying games, and who have no interest in actually building a character. It caters to and enables people who don't understand and don't want to understand the need to put actual effort into how a character acts, thinks and talks - the things that make an actual living, memorable character - and instead just want to play something "cool".
The thing is, those players have always been there. They just haven't been a problem, because the community was there to teach them how to build a character and play them properly without trying to compensate for actual characterization with setting-violating uniqueness. Nowadays, though, the "geek culture" boom in the mainstream has bred a whole generation of neo-roleplayers who have overly pampered expectations of what roleplaying is supposed to be and how much effort they're expected to put into it. While before, most of these people would have been shunted out of a group for some thinking time and have had to figure out how to play roleplaying games in a way that isn't parasitic to other people at the table, now they can just create a group of their own. The worst thing is that companies like CGL and OPP cater to these people halfway in the name of quick profit and halfway because they're full of the self-same type of people, and they're oblivious to the festering, pampered mess they're turning the community into.

>>44215887

That's an absurd argument to make, though. People won't suddenly mature and develop well thought out characters if you restrict their aesthetic choice.
The game is supposed to be about outsiders. People who don't fit in. There's nothing clashing there.
Yes, bad roleplayers will inevitably pick something that looks or sounds cool to them and never really go beyond some gimmick. But if not races, then a style of dress, or subculture, or gadget.
As for magic being more important, well, I suppose. Though, you know, the Sixth World and all, the Awakening of magic, etc, seems like magic should be important, and more so as time advances. The end goal was, originally, to have Horrors show up and ruin everything.

Hell, if you read Gibson's latest trilogy (Pattern Recognition, Spook Country and Zero History) it feels a lot like SR 5e. Hell, there's this bit in Spook Country (I'm currently reading Zero History) were it feels like he's describing and Adept. Internet stuff feels like Prot-Wireless Matrix.

>>44215975

Damn, didn't see this.

> they're oblivious to the festering, pampered mess they're turning the community into.

Honestly, it feels like you've got problems.
Look, the "community" isn't some tight knit brotherhood of secretly great improv actors.
It's anybody who wants to roll dice according to the instructions in some book with whatever amount of fluff everyone feels like using.
The pool of players is expanding to allow for casual players who don't care enough to learn more than one system, or know much about a setting.
The people who are prone to caring about this will continue to care and play more intensively.
If you can't enjoy any other type of game than what you're used to, then you're the one with expectations who wants to be pampered.

I'm tired of reading about "normies" destroying "our community" or our hobbies, as if it's some terrible invasion instead of simple expansion.

>>44215975
I'd say the worst offenders haven't been geek-chic posers, but instead turbonerds who tend to get too caught up in the whole two-second elevator pitch of their character, and of course the optimization. I think /tg/ has a pretty invasive culture of these people, because of the 'storytime' thing making (a certain class of) people think they need to be the Epic Hero and the center of attention at their gaming table, and internet roleplayers in general having a really big culture around character optimization.

>>44216026
>The game is supposed to be about outsiders.
It was already about outsiders, but they felt the need to make an outside-er group of outsiders for many of the same reasons you can blame for sourcebook power bloat. SURGE never really had any flavor, it was just a toolkit for specialness. Shadowrun's races were all written pretty extensively, but with SURGE, it was all just token aesthetics like slapping elf ears and horns on things. Which, they could have just as easily done the aesthetics thing with cyberware, and then it'd be a voluntary choice that suggests something about the character who has it. Maybe they were trying to bring back some of the oppression themes they'd started to lose a hold of in 3e, but they could have done that with a plot event, like a race riot or something to remind people that race is a big deal. I don't think SURGE, or later, vampire PCs, or metasapients, or etc. ever really added anything to the game, it was just visual stimulation in a setting which already had it.

With wireless, though-- Wireless has always been in the setting, it's just that 4e apparently didn't know that, or they thought it wasn't enough of a fundamental part of the architecture.

>>44216026
Pattern Recognition and Spook Country were weird and great. I didn't realise they were meant to be linked, though. I admit, I read Spook Country first and a good couple of years before Pattern Recognition -- is there any continuity between them? I can't remember any, but that obviously doesn't mean much.

>>44216196

Bigend is the connecting factor between Pattern Recognition and Spook Country. If there were any other links I didn't notice them.
Spook Country and Zero History share at least two protagonists.

>>44216236
Neat. I'll have to find Zero History, now.

Actually, just typing that brought a half-formed recollection to mind. I turned my head left and there it was on my to-read shelf in a pile of second hand bargain books I bought like six months ago. Guess I know which of them I'm going to dig into first.

>>44203230
>The Rusty Nail
I had many a night in college spent there, watching Planet of Fun play covers.
Good times.

>>44207404
4th edition Parabotany, page 43.

"Most “real” beers are made by microbreweries. Keeping things local and eliminating
costs of shipping and importing ingredients makes beer relatively affordable to
the common man. Prices can vary from 5¥ to 15¥ a bottle depending on the quality.
There are some corporate breweries producing alternatives to synthohol, but their
prices are two to three times that of a microbrew. The tradeoff is that these corporate
products have a greater distribution."

>>44215444
It's like you hate the game.

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Oh, heh, sorry guys; I thought I was on /v/ for a second. It's almost as for a moment, we were talking about why the game was shit, and not actually playing it, and nothing else.

WEW LAD.

>>44215712
Sir, if you want you could just ignore all of it. Instead of throwing a fit on the Internet that is.

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>>44217055
Anon's been learning from other boards.

He killed the thread.

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>>44214010
More sexy trolls please.

>>44215167
>1 is fairly low, but you need to be playing with a particular type of group for it to be "close to having a disability".

I'm working on a character for Runnerhub, and I think for them 3 is average, 2 is stunted, and 1 is an invalid.

>>44217946
Runnerhub is... iffy. Especially when it comes to power level. But there, they're just going by what the book says, which is the same thing it's always said.

>>44199582
I see the mediafire in the pastebin is missing some books for 3rd and 4th edition. Namely: 10 Mercs, Euro War Antiques, Parazoology 2, Street Legends Supplemental, Storm Front, and the unpublished Shadows of Latin America.

If whoever is managing it wants to add them, let me know how.

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>>44218013
Oh, and The Rotten Apple: Manhattan. That too.

>>44217946
What makes the troll sexy to you?

What do spells like physical barrier use as a point of reference? is it anything the mage can see, or is it fixed to the planet? I ask because, for one, you can have a barrier on a vehicle or VIP for protection, and another CLANG

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>>44217946
>>44218491

>>44218553
I believe barrier spells are always static, they can't be fixed to moving objects. I can't remember an exact reference for it, but it might have been FAQ'd.

>>44218491
Well >>44214010 has a pretty face and a nice healthy body regardless, but I generally find tusks like that kinda cute.

I also like curly horns like >>44218491.

I guess I just like fantasy chicks in general though. Orks, goblins, trolls, demons/succubi, etc.

I actually wrote the character I'm submitting to Runnerhub as having a thing for Ork girls.

>>44212317
A replacement update mechanism's going to come up over Christmas. I've been busy with Fallout 4, getting to play in a PnP game for the first time in like five years and disagreeing with the other guy about fixing the problems with skills, so chummer's been a bit neglected. What's the error you get with lifestyles?
>>44208538
Shedim take over the bodies of anything that doesn't have a soul in it. This includes astrally projecting mages. The thing is, the shedim doesn't actually give a flying fuck what happens to the body it's riding in, save that a sufficiently destroyed one will forcibly eject them from it. In my games I give them ItNW to represent this.

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>>44212829
>>44212851
>>44212957
Found her, omaes. Anybody still would?

>>44219289
>he drew it for free

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>>44219289
That's not a great angle, but I probably would.

Feet are also my fetish.

>>44215940
>Yeah. Eclipse Phase is modern and cyberpunk-derived. And based on Shadowrun, yet it kept the tone better.

Transhuman Space does modern and cyberpunk far better than EP.

EP's a niche game, a near-future kitchen sink intended to provide maximum opportunity for posthuman horror. It isn't a coherent setting, and isn't supposed to be.

>>44219516
Transhuman Space is good too, but EP is a better example because it was originally written as a late Sixth World addition to the SR/Earthdawn universe. It's not so disorganized as you seem to think, IMO.

I play a human, and he's basically a skinhead. Hates magic users, elves, anything that's not a pure blooded human. I even adapted some American History X for him.

"My eyes have seen the glory of the trampling at the zoo,
We washed ourselves in elven blood and all the mongrels too,
We're taking down the Keeb machine two by two by two,
The pure man marches on."

Where's the section in 4e about people getting infected by ghouls? Is it core, or RC?

>>44219598
Lame and Gay. My weeaboo techie thats /R9K/ incarnate is better

>>44214883
Eh, just pretend it's a shard of DEUS, and you'll get applauded.

It's the same as with Technomancers, the less of those freaks there are running around messing the Matrix up, the better.

>>44215444
>"Stop liking what I don't like!", the post.

>>44221071
Now, let's be precise, here. It's "I don't like thing", not "Stop liking what I don't like." If you're don't say what you mean, what you say won't mean anything.

>>44219598
Humanis pls. go!

>>44221025
Who let Clockwork in?

>>44221519
You really want a Crash 3.0?

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>>44217946
There are qualities for disabilities. Talk with some people over there, and see what kind of replies you get.

A low rated civilian won't be able to do certain things on pure attributes alone, but they're not incapable of attempting those actions - they just need training, gear, teamwork assistance, etc - something situational that makes the action easier.

Invalids would be beyond assisting, and either have large penalties or are unaware in the related skills.

Pic unrelated; pre-reduction troll.

>>44221686
>9'1" feet tall
>264 pounds
That isn't heavily built. That's still heavily in the "spine's going to go like a twig" territory. I also think the devs have no idea how tall 9 feet is.

>>44221686
That information seems a tad outdated.

>Troll 250 cm 335 kg 45-55 years

>>44221686
That troll looks unfortunate. No big as horns, only one arm with decent dermal deposits making him look lopsided and not as well protected from harm. He looks like shit and doesn't get any of the major benefits of his metatype

>>44221756
>>44221759
Yes, ignore the data.

>>44221791
The arms aren't turned to the same facing. There are breaching and subcutaneous dermal deposits everywhere. As for the horns ... funny how they kinda look like Eiger's.

>>44221878
Eiger had shit horns too! But I'm a strong believer in trolls having big ass ram horns vs. a few tiny ones, so I have a bias.

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>>44221878
>Yes, ignore the data.
It isn't a matter of data. It says they're densely built, that they're 9 feet tall, and that they weigh 264 lbs which means they're not densely built.

This guy is 8'3" and weighs 302lbs.

>>44221965
>guy is foot and a half taller than me
>Weighs the same

Well if that isn't incentive to eat better and work out, nothing is. That's shameful.

>Joe Mean, professional middle class human.
>Have A rated money at creation (450,000 nY), and use that plus all starting karma to generate the 500,000 nY to purchase a permanent middle class lifestyle
How would you build off this to make a useful character?

>>44221791
Yeah he looks more like he's got elephantiasis and got hit in the face with a shovel. I guess I could see why people would be racist against them.

>>44221686
Not my fetish.

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>>44221686
superior tbqh

>>44219289
>cybereyes
>augmented reality

Perhaps, but she wouldn't look like that to me while I did.

>>44222593
Have him rent out his Middle Class home as a safehouse until he's got enough money to get cybered out and go on runs?

>>44221965
>It isn't a matter of data
The text is outdated and irrelevant. So what are you attempting to get out of talking about it?

>>44222600
Like I said, pre-reduction.

>>44221897
Aren't trolls noted as being the most varied metatype? They can have all kinds of different horns.

>>44221756
Shadowrun has never, ever, really understood the scale of trolls, treating them as being pretty much the same as big humans.

>>44222593
Take corporate SIN and day job as well and have him be a target of an extraction that you then play as a character afterwards. Forget how useful it is, sounds fun.

>>44222673
The size and shape of horns alone allows for more variance than any other metatype, I'd imagine.

>>44222655
Even pre-reduction, most ugly trolls look a bit more even than that. You get ugly monster faces sometimes and horns and rough skin, but they don't look like they have troll downs or whatever.

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>>44222699
Trolls vary a lot in art too. From humanish like her and the biker and bounty hunter in SE 4 / 5 to things like the lineup shot where the troll is very unhuman.

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>>44222731
Trolls are a hell of a lot more symmetrical in the new art.

I hate how they rarely look like monsters. It's a nine foot tall brute, they should fill rooms and look menacing.

>>44222756
I know this makes me a faggot and obsessed with his magical realm, but I'd prefer sexy waifu trolls

Like >>44214010
>>44218491
and to a lesser extent >>44218575
Even >>44222731 ain't bad if you don't mind death by snu snu.

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>>44222808

Sexy and monsterous aren't exlusive around here.

I like that this one at least tries to show some scale, though it dose make Troll's +STR and +1 Reach look like way the fuck too small a bonus. A nine foot tall creature could handle an adult like a small child.

Should trolls be stronger or shorter?

>>44222886
Shorter

>>44222886
Shorter probably. Extra strength would wreck the balance. 7-7.5 feet and built like a brick wall is still plenty intimidating.

>>44222886
Games can't really make leverage, reach and mass as important as it is IRL. A badass dwarf or halfling is fun to play even if logically you'd lose every fight forever.

>>44199756
Basically this is how it adds up from the different references:
1. Mega-Corps and Governments are able to pull up everything you've ever done with your SIN. They know where you live, who your parents are, what you like to eat and what you browse on the matrix. They frequently use this to advertise to you based on your likes. If you break a law and the law enforcement of that area is able to identify your DNA or has a recording of your face, they can pull up your SIN and your life is forever ruined. That's why having a real SIN is a negative quality.

Now, criminals tracing someone on their SIN? It's harder, because they don't have access to the database. But the solution to that is simply bribing the right person.
Alternatively, like already stated, SINs in use are publicly broadcasted, so if you know where to look you can find them in meatspace. Just rolling Matrix Perception for a whole city would be somewhat of a stretch, there's thousands of SINs flying around after all. You'd be looking for a needle in a haystack. But if you have some movement patterns, you can simply wait and scan everyone who enters a given locale.

>>44223113
A real SIN also means your real biometics and data are on file. If someone is trying to track you from your voiceprint and fingerpints you come up in the SIN database.

SINless just come back as NO ENTRY, even if they have a fake SIN with a rating high enough that their biometics should be on file..

For some reason.

>>44222593

You can only spend up to 10 Karma on Nuyen during character creation, chummer.

Oh wait, forgot about Born Rich. That works, then. Add in a National SIN, a Day Job, and Creature of Comfort (Middle), and you've got yourself a regular Average Joe.

Maybe make him an Edgeomancer?

>>44223150
It's less that they'll get an empty search return, and more that the "correct fake" will be buried in false positives. The GSR is huge; accumulated errors plus data reduction means corpsec need to cross reference to bring numbers down to a manageable level. This is also why you aren't being picked up as a criminal by simple agent software just by existing.

>>44218553
What the fuck was that?

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Would anyone be willing to tell me if my 4e decker is decent or at least setup correctly.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5qptczoQbI0akE5c2xPNWNoLTA/view?usp=sharing

So, how do you make an AI character? I've got the stats and skills laid out, now what? Do you just live on a cyberdeck carried by a friend? Get that cyberdeck transplanted into a drone? Live in a node somewhere in a host?

>>44224006
You're basically a technomancer without a body. You're like a super sprite. You just live in the matrix. No one single entity.

>>44224006
You don't absolutely NEED a home device, as long as you can find one to 'squat' to realign in each day, but making a device your home offers some advantages.

On top of that, operating from a home device that has the correct stats/fuction allow you to use it directly rather than use the "Emulate" power, which is both easier on you and doesn't gather as much overwatch.

>>44224212
Would it be more practical to live in a nexus and remote hack/rig from there or get it's home implanted into a drone?

>>44224556
Same as for normal deckers.
Being far away means you wont get shot, but you get noise from range penalties, and you can't do direct interface to bypass the host firewall.

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>>44225123

>>44225123
>That artwork

>>44225123
>.jpg
>not .pdf
Why even post this in the first place

So who is going to buy Rigger 5?

>>44225123
>>44225134
horrible artwork aside,
N I C E

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>>44224865
>Being far away means you wont get shot.

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>>44225262
Well, I'm certainly going to get it.

Whether I buy it or not depends on whether or not it's actually got good things in it that are worth bringing to a game, and whether Catalyst screwed the writers responsible for making it again.

>>44225262
>Actually buying from Catalyst

>>44225534
>>44225550
One person has to bite the proverbial dick and pay for it so the rest of us can get our hands on it.

>>44225123
Ill buy it and if it sucks then i can bitch about the edit and stuff again.

>>44219729
Runners Companion and Running Wild are the only ones I know of that have more than a passing section on the infected.

>>44225123
Yet another prime candidate for a little art swap, it seems.

Any advice for a first-time shadowrun DM? Thinking of setting a game in Neotokyo.

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>>44226390
Having some generic stat blocks on hand for enemies will make any combat encounters smoother.

Adjust the level of zaniness to your group in order to maintain the fun level, but not overdo it. Check out some of the pre-made adventures or missions to get some ideas.

Also, Food Fight! is a time honored traditional first start mission. Here's the one for 5E.

>>44226390

How familiar are you with the fluff?
Also: keep in mind this is a game set in a futuristic setting where everyone is talking to everyone else and everything, where your psych profile is being updated constantly based on your location, purchasing habits and social media posts.

Here's something useful:
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-34592186

The average Attribute for normal people is 3.
The Hits required to do an "average" job are 2, while under stress.

Having a dicepool of 12 is considered enough to make you capable in your field. 15 is enough to make you very good.
You don't need to have more than 12 dice, but it's a bad idea to have less, for skills you really care about.

The game offers you statistics for various kinds of NPCs, you should use those. If you do so, your PCs should rate somewhere above Professional Rating 4 goons (like the mafia), but below Professional Rating 5 (like the Red Samurai).

You can make vastly more powerful PCs in chargen with very little system knowledge. But you don't have to and I would recommend against it.

Think hard about the Major Criminal Gangs (clearly the Yaks for you) and what rivalries they might have.
Think about the more prolific street crime gangs.
Plan the local political scene.
Make sure to have a map, where you can note things down.

>>44226565
Thanks!

>>44226694
Not super familiar, but I'm working on my research before the game starts and I have an idea of what the setting seems to be like (I think), though I'm certain everyone's interpretation is a little different. Thanks - those numbers really help, and I'll take that advice. Do you have any advice on how nuyen compares to the current dollar/how much jobs should be paying?

>>44226769

http://shadowrun.wikia.com/wiki/Nuyen

Thankfull, a lot of stuff is available online.
Page 375 on the book gives you their advice on how much to reward them Karma/Nuyen-wise.
This'll depend on your own interpretation, though. Some people like to have runners living the high-life, with multiple 21k+ jobs a month, while others have them barely scrape by.

I tend to give them two or three jobs a month that overlap and pay bigtime, but that fuck them up and wear them down, while also not allowing them time to do any real legwork for both.
I remember people talking in one of these and one dude said he gave them one job every few months and it didn't pay out too much.

Oh, keep in mind the Awakened aren't supposed to be numerous.
About 1% of the world is Awakened. That means Adepts, Mystic Adepts and Magicians.
A much smaller percentage (I think Seattle said something like 5000 total ) have high MAG (we're talking higher than 4, again, by my interpretation, others feel differently). Adepts aren't included in the last one, by the way.

Oh, Technomancers kind of suck if they don't specialize in getting and registering Sprites.

>>44226910
Thank you!

>>44226769>>44226990
Pay enough to allow your players to upgrade.
They should be able to upgrade to high lifestyle (not that they SHOULD do it).
They should have enough karma to raise their lowest attribute, bond their foci, or to initiate/submerge.
They should have enough money for gear upgrades.
They should be able to purchase a high grade SIN.
I find that 30-45k nuyen and 15-20 karma per month (not per run!) is ok. Give more when they are more experienced.

Does anyone know where I can find a map of the entire sixth world? Does such a thing exist? If not, why haven't we fixed that.

>>44227118
My runners are poor because they are afraid to do corporate runs, and they keep having to do service runs for the Yaks to cover their mistakes. Its their first time playing Shadowrun, its a blast.

>>44227118

I'm super cheap with Karma, less so with money.
They're doing two big jobs at the moment, which is realistically gonna take them a long time to do right, probably a couple of months.
It's going to pay around 35000¥ and give maybe 9 Karma, 10 if they play their cards right.
I realistically expect them to all die during the second run, because it *has* to happen no later than two hours after the first.

>>44227222
Why do you bully your players?
>>44227155
Make them run multiple cheap runs then. Some quick and dirty robberies and kidnappings maybe? Hire them to do some cover job for runners who actually have balls to go big, too.

>>44227323

Ever since that accident with the cats, it's the only way I can feel erotic pleasure.
Besides, it's not like I made them take both runs.

They got greedy on a last run and the group Face died because of it.
More importantly, the got greedy, stupid and hasty.

I had their fixer explain, IC, what their mistakes where, and that they should be careful, money's no good if you're dead.

He then told them to act more professional, since they also betrayed their Johnson on that last run.

No, the current Johnson told them he wanted to hire two teams, to handle these highly coordinated runs, but they convinced him they could handle them both, even after he told them the details.
The players are new, though, and these were always meant (from my perspective) to be throwaway characters that help them learn the game.

Not like inexperience is an excuse.
I mean, Crazy Sasquach infested wilds where they have to attack a research station/critter training center *without* killing anyone and an hour later, extracting a prisoner from a corporate black site this time without leaving witnesses. Besides, they could always drop the job and get some Bad Rep.

What would be a good background for an average decker that moved to Seattle?

>>44228149
I.T guy who got washed into being a runner due to some mumbo jumbo corp bullshit

>>44228149
Classics work best: he had to cut and run after trying and failing to hack (isnsert thing/group from the place he came from) and came to Seattle to distance himself from (thing/group) and start anew.

>>44228149

Data Trails, P41 have hacker Life Modules you can use as inspiration.

>>44228149
>>44228205
Life Modules are a good choice for inspiration, but it basically boils down to growing up surrounded by tech and people interested in / working with tech, or being slightly better than average corporate and going to a decent school.

In 5th e what good and bad sides are there if you play as an AI.

>>44228309

Good Side: You're a decker!
Bad Side: You're just a decker with a gimmick and everyone wants you dead if they figure out what you are, which is immediately obvious if you use any AI specific power. And you're on GOD's shit list.

>>44228309
Bad sides: no Rigger book yet.

>>44228349
Can't i just hide in some cyberzombies body or pleasure pods?
Which rises a question, do i live somewhere or do i roam the net freely.

>>44228403

Not a cyberzombie, but you could custom order some kind of bunraku doll and live inside like a personafix. Hmm.
I think a Drone would probably be a better idea, though.

>>44228309
You're certainly not going to be doing your team any favors by painting a gigantic target on their back. Just play a decker.

>>44228349
>everyone wants you dead if they figure out what you are, which is immediately obvious if you use any AI specific power
Hmmm ... No.

>Corporations and Nations that issue SINs to AIs and e-ghosts:
>AA, Aegis, Apple, Cord Mutual, Denver, DocWagon, Eastern Tiger, ESUS, Evo, FBA, Fed-Boeing, Gaeatronics, Genesis Consortium, Global Sandstorm, Horizon, IndexAXA (and their Infolio intelligence corporation subsidiary), KITT, Kwonsham Industries, Lami Look Pagkaon, Lusiada, Maersk, Manadyne, Mesametric, Microdeck, PacRim Communications, PCC, Phoenix Biotech, Prometheus Engineering, Proteus AG, Providence Corporation, Regulus, Sioux Nation, Spinrad, Tablelands Software, Tan Tien, Tanamyre, Telestrian, Tír Tairngire, UOL, Virtual Reality Inc., VisionQuest, Warpdrive Systems, Zeta-ImpChem

>AIs are allowed to use emulation for legal actions on the public grid without accumulating an Overwatch Score.
>This courtesy is also extended to AIs with legal access to certain grids and hosts.
>The mark needed to enter a host counts as legal access, but provoking convergence makes any form of emulation illegal.
>Emulating on a grid where the AI doesn’t have a Lifestyle or SIN-based access is illegal.
>Illegal actions performed using emulation can significantly raise an AI character’s Overwatch Score [...]

My group is fleeing UCAS for Berlin. What's it like in 5e? Also, am I reading languages correctly in that I can only roll as many dice as I have in the language for social skills?

>>44228542

All correct, but, and this is the important part, you're a criminal AI.
You know, one being actively hunted down.

>>44228648
... with a fake SIN.

That's kind of the whole point (and more important part) of fake SINs. You know, that they misdirect the authorities.

Can you drone-rig from a deck (assuming you had all the appropriate and everything was connected to your PAN, and so on)?

>>44228752
IIRC, a commlink can control a single drone, so a deck should be able to do the same.

>>44228749
Not the anon you're replying to, but as he said in his first post there are a lot of tells for an AI.

>>44228752
>>44228776
You can command a drone from any persona-capable device. (and you can mod an RFID tag to hold a persona if you really want to)

If you want to *rig* a drone, you need a vehicle control rig.

>>44228793
Do tell, then. Mind Probes don't work without LOS.

Let's ask a question here.
Can people here give reasons why a specific edition of the game is better for a specific purpose? No cons or bashing, just pure positive aspects.
For example 1e to learn the origin of it all and some of the setting elements, 3e for the fluff and setting, 5e for seeing an updated setting and the like.
Basically, why would you want someone to play 1e? 2e? 3e? And so on.

>>44228829
According to a brief googling, it seems like there are only about 50,000 artificial intelligences out there. If a corp even got an inkling of one that turned runner, why would they not devote resources to tracking it down? Not to mention GOD. I don't have the book in front of me at the moment, so I'm not sure about what the AI specific powers the other anon mentioned are.

>>44228967
I think it'd be an interesting experiment to do a series of short games or one-shots, advancing through the editions. It'd be a real pain in the ass though, and nearly impossible since you'd have to unlearn a lot of material every time you advance an edition.

>>44228967

4e is a better Black Trenchcoat game where you're supposed to be professional (and where you can afford most things). Hacking is terrible here, because you can just splurge money and have a good agent do it all for you, making the decker obsolete.
5e is pink mohawk that really ups the prices, making bioware and cyberware far too expensive.
On the other hand, 5e has good Matrix rules.
In theory, limits will help cut down on dicepool bloat. I have have very rarely seen someone hit their limit threshold and you can always edge a roll and simply not give a shit.

>>44229018
Not to mention that it would be hard to get people to do it at all, since the editions are so polarizing.
The neo-roleplayers who play 4e and 5e would reel at the crunch and slightly aged, less over-the-top fluff of the earlier editions, and the grognards (like me, no prize for guessing) would hiss and vaporize at the first mention of the words "free spirit PC".

>>44229060
>neo-roleplayers
Thanks, grandpa.

>>44229057
4e might be black trenchcoat on the rules side, but then again it also introduced most of the drake/pixie/free spirit/AI player splats and all of the wanky metatypes that basically define pink mohawk nowadays.
>>44229068
You're welcome. I have other expressions, but this one is the nicest. I'm not talking about the age of the players as much as their roleplaying principles, though.

>>44229068
Hush, let the autist sperg in peace. It might be entertaining and the thread's going down anyway.

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>>44228566
It's very polluted.

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>>44229060
>free spirit PC
Rest assured, some of us whippersnappers hate that bullshit too.

before the thread dies, tell me about artificial intelligences or where i can read up on them

i wanna tailor an NPC around that

>>44229944
Data Trails pg. 128-161

>>44228967
>Fluff/Setting
2e had the most cohesive setting design, its group of writers was much tighter and more coordinated than in 3e or later (and more experienced than in 1e). All of my favorite fluff books, Fields of Fire, Aztlan, the fluff portions of Cybertechnology, came from 2e. Its rules were simpler, but better-explained, and everything from the rules tied into the fluff really well. It's the hardcore-roleplayer's edition, for those of us who don't like how nebulous newer editions have been with regards to stuff like what Essence might be, or how magic works.

3e is... strange. Basically, it's just 2e but with more rules, about absolutely everything. It's insanely complicated. But that means it's also got a lot of ideas, and at that point it'd be impossible for all of them to be bad. Some books (Rigger 3) just work best as super-in-depth physics simulators, and only 3e can really manage to make them like that. Some stuff just has a few clever ideas that'll stick with you. On the whole, if I'm going to suggest you play it, try not to go overboard on the sourcebooks. We need your mind intact for the brainwashing.

1e has a couple of books that didn't get direct 1:1 updates, like Shadowbeat. Shadowbeat is great, and everybody should read it.

4e, most people know. It was the 2000s 'streamlining' of the Shadowrun 3 Mandelbrot clusterfuck. It's different, and it's so complete a rewrite that you're bound to find changes you like, and changes you don't. The fluff is more iffy.

5e is a slightly less-complete rewrite than 4e, but it tends to be a lot more ambitious and clever with the rules they put in. Sometimes it works really well, sometimes they get in their own way a bit. Still, if you're the type to take rules from anywhere to make your game best, it'll have something for you.

>>44228998
>why would they not devote resources to tracking it down?
Runners exist because corporations as a whole allow the cracks and shadows they survive in to exist. You have to ask not just whether it's profitable to devote those resources to that cause, but also whether it's most profitable.
Generally, the corps have better things to do than track down runners, but for the brief period after a run, but before the runners hand over whatever it is they stole.

>>44230105
Eh, for an AI, they might be freaked out enough to actually try. But then, if you're trying to argue that player AI are a dumb idea, you should have a lot better arguments to make.

>>44230124
You might, but not in 2075 onwards. PC to critter grade AI have been around long enough that the initial scare has died down to wageslave scaremongering levels. There are a lot of non-sapient AIs essentially pollinating online, so the rumour of one being somewhere and doing something illegal isn't going to be enough to do more than write an incident log.

As for playing one ... I wouldn't recommend it unless the player & gm are good enough that there's no assumptions being made between them. Given the state of 5e, that's quite an effort.

>>44228353
not anymore. rigger 5.0 is out boys

>>44230390
PDF WHEN