Gender fluid and non-binary rate thread!

>>24679872
You mean mental illnes rate?

>>24679872
8/8 mental illness

>>24679880
>>24679895
Can we do without the hate this time? You're already talking about a marginalised group and your level of vitriol is actually shocking.

>>24679910
If that's enough to trigger you maybe reddit's your place. There's nothing wrong with being ill btw

>>24679916
What you're doing is denying the validity of trans and non-binary people by claiming their identity is nothing more than a symptom of mental illness. That mentality right off the bat is an invitation to marginalise and discriminate against any group you instrumentalise it against.

So yes, uncalled for hatred does "trigger" me.

>>24679924
Faggot

>>24679924
I'm not discriminating against a tranny, you're as equal as me, you just happen to be a bit ill, but aren't we all a bit crazy ;) ? Also OP image is dumb, even if you're male and identity female wearing dresses look dumb because they're made for female body shape

I have as many eyeballs as there are genders. 2

>>24679924
You still have no argument for why it isn't a mental illness. You simply have stated you wish it wasn't a mental illness so you don't have to deal with the consequences.

I don't understand how mentally disregarding what you biologically are isn't a mental illness.

>>24679982
You have to understand, scientifically you just asked me a question on par with asking a biologist - if we evolved from monkeys, why are they still around? It's a question which produces silence just by the sheer power of it's inanity.

You're labelling the lived reality of millions of people as mental illness, as a pathology. This is as fundamentalist as white supremacists who insist African Americans are genetically inclined to criminality.

>>24679872
fuck off fag
every time you try to start this shit thread (like yesterday) it gets shut down
just go to fucking tumblr

>>24680003
Seems you have other issues other than your dysphoria.

Those aren't alike in the slightest and your appeal to 'popularity' argument is weak.

File: 1328563179359.jpg (241KB, 1920x1080px) Image search: [Google]

241KB, 1920x1080px

>>24680003
>i should care about a literal 1% group whose biggest issue is being smirked at and derided for being fucking crazy

it sure is hard being in a first world country

>>24680003
Whether or not it is an illnes or neural diversity is still up for grabs, whether evolution is fact or not is not..

>>24680003
None of those connections make sense.

I asked you to defend your point and you respond by trying to belittle me and compare me to a white supremacist. Come up with logical reasons as to why it's not a mental illness. I would like to hear them.

You are what is wrong with the lgbt community. You want to feel like you can change the world but you are fighting for trivial, meaningless shit. And worst of all, you use no real logical points, but instead just shame your opposition.

Stop picking the lowest hanging fruit you can find to satisfy your hunger to change the world.

I'm laughing my ass off. Thanks trannies.

>>24679872
That third example just looks like poor fashion sense more than anything. Just wtf is going on with those pants?

>>24679910
>vitriol

Sulfuric Acid. The term Vitriol has been in disuse in the scientific community for almost 30 something years now.

>>24679872
fag/10

>>24679910
desu I'm more shocked that you find mean words on 4chan shocking.

>>24680175
Mask ?

>>24680168
Vitriol: the mythical acid in one's stomach that rises when enraged. People whose vitriol has been sufficiently agitated can spit patterns into metal.

>>24680175
Baka its not like I like you! Idiot desu. Senpai desu

>>24680225
>Baka its not like I like you! Idiot desu. Senpai desu
"To be honest" in contrasted form is filtered as "desu".

File: How_Dare_you_correct_me_,_You_Imbecile.png (9KB, 644x217px) Image search: [Google]

9KB, 644x217px

>>24680225

>>24679924

My gf is a transsexual and she thinks you're a mentally ill loser.

>>24679872
>>24679924
>>24680003
clearly you failed biology class,
and obviously you have never studied genetics or medicine

In Normal Humans there are 23 Pairs of Chromosomes
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chromosome#Human_chromosomes
Males are defined from females by having a mismatched chromosomal pair
Specifically an X and Y chromosome, in contrast to females who have a regular XX pair
these are the only 2 configurations that result in healthy and fertile Genders
any variation, especially those that result in infertility, are defined as genetic diseases
under the term Aneuploidy, meaning there's an abnormal number of chromosomes.
these include the Monosomy of 45,X also known as Turner syndrome
and the various Polysomy variations of both
XX - 47,XXX 48,XXXX and 49,XXXXX
and
XY - 47,XYY 47,XXY 48,XXXY 48,XXYY 48,XYYY 49,XXYYY 49,XXXYY and 49,XXXXY
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polysomy
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Y_chromosome#Y-chromosome-linked_diseases
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aneuploidy

a common symptom of those that suffer from Aneuploidy
is mental illness, mental retardation, and mental impairment
another common symptom is mild Physical deformity

>>24680318
Not OP and not meaning to defend their posture but, what about gender as a psychological component of a human?

>>24680350
People can be free to dress like girls in public and look disgusting and strange, but people will still think you're mentally ill. (also the demographic facts probably make it reasonable that it's not the best choice)

>>24680003
about 7.4 billion - 7,358,176,400
LGBTQ demographics
- Rural - 0-3%
- Urban Continental Conservative - 1-4%
- Urban Coastal Socialist- 4-7%
- Global - 1-2%
about 7,358,200 to 14,716,400 globally

out of total LGBTQ global community estimated
Bi or curious - at least 75% - 5,518,650 to 11,037,300
LGQ - under 20% - 1,471,640 to 2,943,280
Trans - under 5% - 36,7910 to 73,5820

Statistical Medically Genetically Diagnosable Sexual Variations
Estimated Affected Females - 4,415,035 to 5,518,762
Estimated Affected Males - 7,707,691 to 11,542,479

45,X-Female - 1:2000 to 1:5000 - 735,817 to 1,839,544
46,XXMale - 1:20,000 to 1:25,000 - 147,163 - 183,954
47,XXX-Female - 1:1000 - 3,679,088
47,XXY-Male - 1:500 to 1:1000 - 3,679,088 - 7,358,176
47,XYY-Male - 1:1,000 - 3,679,088
48,XXXX-Female - 100 cases
48,XXXY-Male -1:50,000 - 73,581
48,XXYY-Male - 1:18,000 to 1:40,000 - 91,977 - 204,393
48,XYYY-Male - 4 cases
49,XXXXX-Female - 30 cases
49,XXXXY-Male - 1:85,000 to 1:100,000 - 36,790 - 43,283

A Biological female is XX
and a Biological Male is XY
as such women that have more than two X chromosomes are Hyper-females
as such only people with the Male phenotype can actually be Trans-Gendered
To be properly Trans-Gender one must have at least two x chromosomes
and exhibit the Male Phenotype, single or multiple y chromosomes are optional
46,XXmale
47,XXY
48,XXYY
48,XXXY
49,XXXXY
Actual Trans-Gender Males - 4,028,599 to 7,863,387

>>24680350
if your psychological gender
doesn't match your Genetic Gender or Phenotype
you are psychologically insane, you have a mental disease.

the same also applies if you are not Heterosexually attracted
to the opposite Sexual Phenotype or Gender.
as evidenced by studies on Genetic, biological, neurological, and psychological differences
between Heterosexual and homosexual individuals.

File: image.jpg (179KB, 720x1278px) Image search: [Google]

179KB, 720x1278px

this thread is annoying, post pics to be harshly judged or shut up. I'll start. 20, agender, probably cuter than u.

>>24680297
Girls can't be Trans-Gender
only those exhibiting a male Phenotype can be Trans-Gender

>>24679872
I really really really want to believe you're a troll, but in the world we live in today it's not likely. I'm glad Daddy Trump is coming into office soon; maybe this shit will stop.

>>24679872
OP respond
defend yourself

>>24679872

Humans are a sexually dimorphic species. Anything outside of male or female is abnormal. Accept it.

>>24680524
You look like you're consistently the most annoying person in the room. That's the perfect "Mom said it's my turn to play" face.

Also pls shave that shit so it at least grows in thicker. Roll out a beard or dont but those wispy things are unacceptable.

File: IMG_6523.gif (2MB, 240x180px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 240x180px

>>24679924
And? They should be marginalised, the fucking mentally deranged degenerates.

>>24680524
I'd fuck you if you don't try to make pillowtalk afterward. Pick a hole. Maybe show us too.

https://youtu.be/EFjsSSDLl8w

File: gtfo.jpg (66KB, 687x787px) Image search: [Google]

66KB, 687x787px

dear faggots,

>>>/lgbt/

>>24681864
That's a blue board

>>24680524
Probably cuter than you, there must be alot of ugly people on 4chan the. And btw I'm not saying you are ugly , just saying you are full of your self and you don't even look that good

>>24680524
Why are you alive? How have you managed to not die yet?

>>24681984
Then don't post your non binary dick or pussy

>>24680524
Annoying. Crybaby cunt

>>24679880
>>24679895
>>24679916
>>24680965
>>24680553

Honest question... /soc/ has had trap and trans threads for ages. What makes this one so different?

>>>24682903
>/soc/ is one person

And trap threads imo are fine mostly because people exploit and feteishize traps

>>24682917
I'm not suggesting /soc/ is one person. I'm pointing out how other trans/traps/lgbt threads are clearly more accepted b/c they don't get trolled nearly as much.

>>24682917
Like, nobody is going to care if we have a gay hookup thread. Trap threads are even kinda glorified b/c of the possibility of camwhoring.

Why does this thread suddenly trigger everyone? Do we just hink it's gonna be boring b/c OPs picture kinda sucks? Do the words "gender fluid" and "non-binary" automatically trigger some anti-SJW jimmies?

I'm not hating, just wondering.

>>24682903
the people in the trans/trap threads know what they are.
gender-fluid is just some special snowflake bullshit because tumblr will crucify you if you're actually comfortable with your own genitals.

>>24683026
So in that case, it's just preemptively avoiding any "special snowflakes" from spreading to /soc/?

I mean, I get it. OP didn't really have a good response here >>24679910 This isn't a place where you should ever expect empathy... especially if you're trying to use a politicized "marginalized" argument.

But /soc/ is also a rabbit hole where mental illness is pretty much the norm. I mean, that's why trap threads could happen ~10 years ago when it was still a super underground thing. That's why there's still taboo fetish threads, /chub/, slut threads, DD/LG and so on.

I guess it just seems like, if this wasn't so politicized, nobody would really care.

>>24680003
Nobody argues that we came from monkeys. Science says monkeys and humans share a common ancestor. Take a basic anthropology course

>>24679910
>marginalized
Go back to wherever you came from.

>>24679872
Also, I think you mean "tomboys". They can dress and act girly from time to time, too.

>>24679924
And then it made a shitpost.

>>24683107
Nah, you are missing the part where trap threads or trans people in general are boys trying to be girls or girls trying to be boys. Boys and girls are actual sexes. "Non binary" or "genderfluid" generally signals someone who is trying hard to not fit into either, but is usually a hairy girl or a boy with makeup. Its transparent attention whoring and its cringy.

>>24683516
It just seems like an arbitrary point to start being offended.

Like, "Hey, it's totally cool if you want to change your gender, dress as a puppy and get peed on by a fat chick, but DON'T YOU DARE fall between genders."

If you're pissed about the preachiness / special snowflake status, then bitch about that. Don't pretend it's about biology.

>>24683516
How is it attention whoring?

I'm sad that this thread is just debating.
I always knew I was odd for wanting to not just dress like but be a boy some days. Ever since I was little and I never heard a term for it until recently. To see something that described me and to know other people went through the same thing felt so nice. And now it's just a sjw term no one will ever take seriously.
Instead I just simply tell people I like to cross dress sometimes. Luckily as a girl it's not so strange. Worst case someone thinks I'm a lesbian.

>>24679910
it never ceases to amaze me how you can act surprised that you frequently recieve abuse at the same time as you validate all the people abusing you by screeching like a howler monkey whenever it happens, which is what they want.

you will be happier if you focus on self-improvment, because others will not improve themselves just because you ask nicely (or not nicely)

File: 1447764012918.jpg (16KB, 428x364px) Image search: [Google]

16KB, 428x364px

>>24683553
Im not offended or pissed and I didnt say anything close to what you are implying.

>>24683599
>because others will not improve themselves just because you ask nicely (or not nicely)
Holy shit why is this so difficult for other people to grasp?! People will NOT change just because you ask them to change. They either accept you or not and there is nothing you can do about it.

>>24683602
We're not talking about what you personally did or said, but the fact that ppl are are clearly offended & pissed that this thread exist.

>>24683622
oh ok sorry i wasnt aware i was representing all viewpoints.

File: Untitled.png (143KB, 677x485px) Image search: [Google]

143KB, 677x485px

>>24683622
also i dont really think trap threads get less hate than this, they just are used to it.

File: Picture 20.jpg (77KB, 640x480px) Image search: [Google]

77KB, 640x480px

>>24683646
BS, traps aren't more used to hate, /soc/ as a whole doesn't even question trap threads existence anymore because they're used to it

maybe back in like 2003 there was still some shit about traps on whatever the precursor board to /soc/ was, maybe /b/

nobody is used to people calling themselves nonbinary.

Yet

>>24683628
If you don't think threads like this should exist w/o getting trolled to oblivion, then yes, you're representing that viewpoint. If you believe something else, you haven't made that clear.

>>24683646
Right now there's 4 trap/trans threads, one with over 400 responses & virtually no trolling: >>24646566

I agree that they probably get SOME hate & are used to it, but it's not as much as this thread. Also, OPs pic in the screengrab you posted is awkward as fuck, so I'm not surprised it got h8

File: 1453844174489.jpg (55KB, 478x640px) Image search: [Google]

55KB, 478x640px

>>24683685
The picture I just posted was from 5 minutes ago on /b/.
>nobody is used to people calling themselves nonbinary. Yet
when people are used to "nonbinary", there will be a new "nonbinary"

>>24683717
>The picture I just posted was from 5 minutes ago on /b/.

A thread on /b/ is not good evidence for a discussion about /soc/

>>24683610
it's too prevalent an attitude in (current year) to be attributed to individual actions, as far as I can tell it's just an effect social media has on people to lean towards instant emotional gratification and a vast overestimation of the importance of other people's opinions.

as individuals, these people do have the capacity to grow out of this childish phase and form a sense of self-worth that isnt dependent on a constant amount of validation, but as a whole, the group of people displaying this sort of behaviour seems to be growing ever larger and louder. maybe when they have children they'll realize how retarded they used to be by looking at how retarded their kids turned out

>>24679910
Its 4chan... what the fuck were you expecting retard cunt?

>>24679924
go back to tumblr then...

>>24680003
>as white supremacists who insist African Americans are genetically inclined
Well they have more testosterone which makes them more inclined to violence in general

>>24683866
source?

>>24683583
Don't feel bad man. It's uncommon but not too uncommon for guys to like your types. I have no issues with it when girls can be traps (Feminine appearing guys) then come back being extremely girly and amazingly gorgeous as well. It's actually pretty freaking great imo. I wish I could find someone like this. Usually people think such individuals are crazy because the usual group that practice this are either crazy mtfs traps / Femboy / crossdressers maybe just needs or socially awkward or sjw feminist tumblr cunts. Just keep doing your thing.

>>24680297
Your gf is an uncle tom

>>24680541
Are you literally retarded senpai

>>24683872
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3455741

>>24683873
Thanks anon. I actually got lucky and landed a sweet bi guy who thinks it's pretty great I can look like either when I want.

>>24683583
You should post!
Help turn this thread away from dumb debating

>>24683894
This is information from 1986.
How about a source that is less than 10 years old and talks directly about them being more violent and aggressive because of the higher levels instead of prostate cancer statistics? I know that all you have to give me is bullshit because you're wrong but you could at least try harder than a single paragraph that doesn't actually tell me anything.

Preface: I don't know much about gender fluid

So, I'm a male with a dick but for some reason I realized I feel uncomfortable being referred to as a man. I don't want to be a girl though. Maybe I just want to be an androgynous sexy being or something.

The fuck does it all mean

>>24684237
You need to be shot.

>>24684332

Oh okay

Cheers mate

>>24684237
It means that not many people will understand or care, so don't get butthurt when they don't. Other than that, fuck all if I know.

>>24684237
It means you aren't confident enough in yourself to think of yourself as a male.

However you also aren't confident enough to be a tranny either.

Solution? Be more confident and try to fix your mental illness.
Sticking yourself into this small group of androgynous people isn't going to make you feel happy. You will feel secluded from society and will start to hate yourself.

It's not worth it mate, just stick to society's norms, they aren't bad.

>>24684237
Nobody cares how you dress and present yourself. It's 2016. Just realize 95% of the population is only aware of 2 pronouns (he & she) and is gonna use the one you look closest to. Another 4% is gonna do the same thing b/c non-binary terms are awkward and forced.

At best, it's like when a stadium or landmark gets bought out and changes its name. The public resents it and keeps using the old name as long as possible. (It's not gonna be "the Willis tower" until everyone who knew it as the sears tower is dead.)

On the other hand, it may also just be a fad. While non-binary ppl have always and will always exist, there's never been this much obsession with identity. RuPaul and the 80s drag stars never cared what pronoun ppl used (the whole point was to fuck with identity afterall, not lock it in yet another category.) The idea of inventing your own pronoun and expecting others to adopt it is inherently narcissistic and counterproductive towards fluidity.

>>24685276
I disagree with the opinion that the norms aren't bad. They're not bad for you. There's a distinction.

>>24684237
I've got the standard female package but I don't like to be referred to as a woman. I take it as a compliment when people mistake me for a guy in public. I prefer my name, they/them or "hey, you" over she/her. Androgynous sexy being sounds pretty good to me.

I'm not asking people to use the zi/zir or whatever any of those are, just try to remember to not call me a girl and if you fuck up say "oops sorry" If a stranger at walmart calls me she I'm not gonna throw a fucking fit but I would expect my friends to remember eventually. We're not vegans. We don't go around telling everyone we're nb because we want to feel special. It feels important and it's not that hard for people to use different pronouns. I don't expect people to care. I expect them not to maliciously call me a girl after I've told them I'm not one. Who does that? Why? Why does it bother you so much that you feel like you have to "correct" people on their personal identity? Using shoddy science?

>>24685514
All due respect, buildings don't have feelings. If someone resents their friend for wanting to be called she instead of he they should just drop them and save the friend the trouble of putting up with them.

We're obsessed because we're constantly being told it doesn't exist. If it was just a normal thing, no one would be this gung-ho about it. Humans are pretty narcissistic, not just trans people. Maybe it is counterproductive, but so is the god damn binary.

>>24685940
>All due respect, buildings don't have feelings
It doesn't matter. If I respected the feelings of every living thing, I wouldn't be able to feed myself, let alone dress myself or drive w/o contributing to waste/pollution, child labor, etc.

We limit our compassion to our kin b/c, quite frankly, we don't have the capacity to care about much else beyond a superficial level.

I don't wish harm to any non-binary ppl... And if I become close w/ any, I'll absolutely respect their feelings. But as an anon on the internet, I don't need to respect your feelings. It's as simple as that.

I think it's absurd that this thread got shut down -- or rather, the fact that anybody cared enough to shut it down. (You can read my earlier posts on that.) But the way that OP and other's responded on here -- by trying to appeal to compassion and respect of a marginalized group -- OF COURSE that's not going to work on /soc/. Respect should never be assumed anywhere, especially on an anonymous image board.

>>24685940
You go girl!

I'm a girl who likes to wear jeans and a tshirt instead of a dress sometimes. Isn't that crazy. I'm glad a place exists for victims like us

>>24686795
You can eat a chicken and still respect it. You can respect the environment while using necessary evils like cars and even unnecessary ones like plastic bags.Those things you're citing are never so in your face as a nb or trans person standing literally right in front of you. Humans are complex, intelligent creatures. Some of them...You can handle it. What I'm saying is, calling another person they or whatever pronouns they prefer because they asked you to doesn't hurt you at all so whoever complains needs to shut the fuck up.

I don't want you to respect my feelings. Respect my pronouns. I don't give a shit about your feelings but if you told me your name is Anthrax Buttsecretion and you want to be referred to as zim/zork/zutz I would try to remember because there's no god damn good reason not to.

If you're not close with someone...isn't that when we're taught to be LESS rude? You wont become close with any nb people unless you respect all of them so don't worry about it. You don't have to actively do anything to respect anyone. Unless you have to actively tell yourself not to be a dick.

Like, if someone tells you to call them "Rachel" when you assumed they were a "Rob" How is your assumption her problem? Why is someones assumption of a persons gender more correct than what that person says? I don't care what genitalia you assume she has, just fucking call her Rachel it's not that hard.

>>24686824
I'm not sure if this is a well meant misunderstanding or someone going out of their way to be an asshole so I'll just....

>>24680524
It's a phase. It will pass.

>>24687154
Cringe

entire thread cringe af

>>24679880
Yes

>>24687154
Okay, I should start out by clarifying: I don't think many ppl ITT are opposed to using she for a transgirl or he for a transboy. (See >>24683026 >>24683516) The point of disagreement would be nonbinary terms... with most anon's here arguing that they're made up "special snowflake" terms used more for signal virtuing than legitimate identification.

My position is different from that, since I do think non-binary is a real thing, and I would actually use alternate pronouns if a close friend asked for it. Where I diverge from you, though, is the idea that I should be compelled to just b/c it's respectful or courteous.

To start with this question
>Like, if someone tells you to call them "Rachel" when you assumed they were a "Rob" How is your assumption her problem? Why is someones assumption of a persons gender more correct than what that person says?

Basic psychology. We rely on two things to interpret reality: Our senses & mental "archetypes" For instance, we store a mental image of a chair, so we don't need to fully analyze the object's contours each time we see one in real life. Instead, we immediately and subconsciously match the object with the mental image.

The same thing happens with people. When we meet a stranger, we scan their characteristics and match them to an archetype in our brain (human male or human female). Without necessarily knowing it, we begin addressing them and adjusting our behavior based on this assumption.

Now as far as who is correct (me for assuming they were a "Rob," or her for preferring "Rachel") there is a school of thought that would say I'm correct. "Reality" is a social construct determined by what the majority of ppl perceive. If the majority of ppl match think he's Rob, then he's a Rob. There's also a school of thought that both of us are right. Under postmodernism reality is subjective, so both my inner perspective and Rachel's inner perspective are legitimate interpretations of reality.

>>24689785
So what happens if Rachel says "hey, plz call me she, ze, they" etc.

I could do that to be courteous, but my mind will still be matching her to the archetype of a male. It would be a superficial gesture.

For us to *actually* accept nonbinary identites, we have to develop new archetypes. I'm sure there's ppl out there who have done it, but there's also a lot who haven't. You can't force ppl to develop them, because much of it forms subconsciously during childhood. You certainly can't shame ppl into forming new archetypes.

Really I find it disgusting how trannies are so easy to dismiss us who don't agree, claiming that we're all hateful bigots. Assuming that gets nothing done and it actually does make some people hate you because of your balatant narcacism.

I would like to post because genderqueer, but I have a beard and I feel like people code me as cis.

File: 1472581681441.jpg (30KB, 316x202px) Image search: [Google]

30KB, 316x202px

>>24679924

Trans person here, 4 years test and top surgery done

YOU'RE NOT TRANS. YOU'RE RETARDED. I HAVE TO FIGHT 5X HARDER FOR MY RIGHTS BECAUSE OF ATTENTION-WHORING IDIOTS LIKE YOU.

>>24691105
Seriously what rights are you missing?

>>24682903
Traps have always known they're just guys dressing as girls and want to get fucked by otherwise straight guys.

This is different for very obvious reasons.