Suicide

>>8173177
not being a pussy

Is there a rational argument to favor suicide?

>>8173194
incurable intolerable problems

>>8173181
Brilliant

>>8173177
Be greatful that trillions of chance events led to your stupid ass

There are probably very specific worldviews which, if we assume them to be true, make suicide either the most desirable or the most ethical action.

I have never come across such a view which seems to also describe the world which we actually inhabit.

Suicide obviously takes on a different role in contexts where any of the following exist: God, judgement, afterlife. In contexts where such things do not exist, one has to propose either (A.) some understanding of values in order to derive a system of ethics which can assess the ethical consequences of suicide, or (B.) one posits that such values do not exist (even if it is determined such values are ultimately arbitrary or a reflection of a subject's pleasure/pain). Absent these values it's impossible to say suicide is any better or worse than anything else.

If such a set of values is proposed which focuses on a subject's pleasure/pain, considerations will have to be made to assess the simultaneous existence of several subjects and the various obligations they have in light of each other's pleasure/pain.

Given these considerations I think the only case (again, assuming no God, no afterlife and no judgement, which is not a wise thing to assume) where suicide presents a compelling moral oughtness is one in which a person is bound to a condition which causes them to feel pain and prefer not existing to existing, and that any persons such an individual has a responsibility to care for (family etc.) is freed from such responsibilities by the mutual desire to see the person dead.

>>8173177
Mostly that survival instinct you feel when you get close to suicide.

File: C__Data_Users_DefApps_AppData_INTERNETEXPLORER_Temp_Saved Images_awesome-fight-club-quotes-if-you-feel-like-shit.jpg (20KB, 500x309px) Image search: [Google]

20KB, 500x309px

>>8173223
>incurable intolerable problems
Like what? And very few people got those really.

This article was very inspiring to me:
http://totalfratmove.com/guy-goes-to-mexico-to-kill-himself-spends-week-doing-coke-and-banging-hookers-decides-to-keep-living/

So unless you are already dying like in 2 days, are in horrible pain and can't even move yeah I guess you don't have much choice.

But in many cases you can just get rid of your problems: Beat up or kill your bullies. leave your job, school and family and go blow all your moneys on drugs and animu-pillows. Go to other countries. Change your appearance and personality.
Don't give a fuck about anyone or anything anymore!

You can always kill yourself later if you still feel like it.

You're going to die eventually anyway, and your life could always improve.

>>8173177
A rational argument could be a/b in z where z = e^(i(a/b))

Statistically speaking, you'll probably back out at the last second or otherwise fail. Best case scenario, you slightly injure yourself or wake up from a short coma with a killer headache, or get locked up in a psych ward and have to live with the shame and stigma of being a mental patient for the rest of your life. Worst case scenario, you end up disfigured, maimed, or crippled, or even retarded. If you succeed, the forensics and cleanup guys will probably joke about what a piece of shit you were as they steal your stuff.

>>8173321
Practically and experiencally speaking, you're correct anon. Screw statistics, practical application is where it's at.

>>8173234
I never asked for this

>>8173257
>You can always kill yourself later if you still feel like it
unless you're in prison

if you're dead you aren't producing
to kill yourself and end the rest of your days here and now instead of being productive hurts the country

even if you don't get paid for it
even if you suck at producing
even if it kills you

>>8173177
If you're a young person the rest of humanity has put a lot more time and resources into you than you've given back. Wait until you're old and useless before killing yourself.

>>8173495
You are an asset to your country. Your purpose is to bring GDP. If you are failing to bring GDP, you are a disgrace to your family and the entire human race. Suicide is NEGATIVE GDP. Suicide is NOT AN ALTERNATIVE. MAKE US PROUD.

File: Every single morning.jpg (89KB, 460x433px) Image search: [Google]

89KB, 460x433px

>>8173481
How does prison differ from anywhere else?

Drink bleach, stab yourself or swallow your tongue.

the impact on your friends (if you have any) and family is largee

>>8173549
>Drink bleach, stab yourself or swallow your tongue.
Those are shitty ways to die, compared to all of the relatively painless ways to die as a free man.

>>8173560
Prisoners can't be choosers

>>8173577
They could have chosen not to become prisoners.

>>8173177
If dying of any cause (including suicide) doesn't change the "after death" (wich nobody knows what shit happens) then there is none.

If for some reason, the soul exist, and is forbiven to kill oneself because "some god" comand it. Then for sure it would be rational to be against it.

If this is a simulation, then suicide would be like login out of a game, then it would be good given the circumstances.

The only arguments against suicide revolve around the people that keep living in this world. Pretty egotist in my opinion.

The day when we run short of people, sure.

>>8173177
>Having access to all of creation and its experiences
>Not utilizing it
end it

>>8173177
how bout, stop being a little puto bitch, for starters

>>8173661
>puto
Don't you have a wall to build, beaner

>>8173664
>trumper alert

>>8173670
spic alert

Wait do you actually think that if someone supports trump then that mean he's a bad person?


I can't wait for the US to vote him in and become nationalistic again. These fucking cancerous tumors know as liberals and illegals and welfare kings need to be cleansed.

>>8173676
>These fucking cancerous tumors know as liberals and illegals and welfare kings need to be cleansed

you're full of anger, friend, what's wrong

>>8173321
Nembutal. It and seconal are the source of the overdose on sleeping pills meme of last century. Painless, 100% effective at proper dosage, just difficult to get except in a few 3rd world countries and China.

I think that it was made illegal in most of the world just to slow suicides.

How is that a /sci/ question?

>>>/his/

>>8173257
>Like what?
Treatment resistant and/or recurrent long term depression.

>Beat up or kill your bullies. leave your job, school and family and go blow all your moneys

No bullies, no job, finished school last month, no family, no money.

I should be ambitious, feel great and look towards my great future. Instead I feel more incompetent and less happy with my life situation than ever before. I'm extremely tired all the time and can't bother to give a fuck, antidepressants is like putting a bandaid on an amputated leg.

Some people simply end up being wired in a way which makes them incompatible with modern lifestyles and society.

>>8173600
But then they wouldn't be prisoners, they are prisoners, they aren't choosers.

>>8173257
Like cancer, like most things slowly leading to death. What kind of ridiculous fantasy world do you live in?

>>8173177
>>>/r9k/

>>8173181
That's an argument for suicide really

You're implying life is a hard uphill battle

Now why not just quit if it is, why play the shitty game?

>>8174280
Underrated

>>8173511
This kind of argument makes me want to kill myself to spite anyone who actually thinks this way

but then I remember that hookers and blow exist and I snap out of it

I just tried my noose and some medium load.

It didn't feel particularly bad. Just some discomfort and pressure, but nothing like outright pain.

It's probably very possible to not put on a painful load and still pass out and then let my floppy unconscious body add the additional weight to make me good and properly dead.

>>8173177
Not at all. If someone can't handle things and wants to kill themselves let them do it, but make sure to send all children they had to the grave with them. Suicide genes shouldn't spread.

>>8175141
>suicide genes
I see /sci/ just makes shit up nowadays

>>8173177
The best argument against suicide is the moral one: e.g. Don't kill yourself because your friends and family will be sad. In nearly any moral system you choose, the good of satisfying your family will outweigh the bad of your shitty, shitty life. The only situation in which I would kill myself is one in which my friends and family are all either dead or such dicks that they wouldn't care. Then, go for it.

Until your friends and family all hate you, its your moral responsibility to others to stay alive. Otherwise, you're a pussy and a shitty person.

>>8175178
There isn't a single true statement in this post

>>8175104
Proper hanging doesn't kill by strangulation.

>>8175188
False

There are two kinds of hanging: drop hanging, which is what you are thinking of, and simple suspension hanging, which is how Robin Williams died

File: 1465065701079.jpg (46KB, 467x363px) Image search: [Google]

46KB, 467x363px

>>8175143
A combination of genes that prevents a person from being able to cope with life who then decides to suicide.

Bad gene combinations like that need to be removed from society.

>>8175239
explaining your fictional concept in greater detail does not make it less fictional

>>8173916
stop being a fucking faggot please

>>8173177
No because wanting to live is illogical.

Sometimes you get so far up the wrong paths that you have to make gigantic changes to get back to feeling alright. Some changes are so big that you cannot imagine yourself on the other end, like whoever is on the other side will be someone else. Changes like that can feel not much different than death to the you of right now. Some people choose to just die in a quicker and more practical way.

>>8173315
Get outta here /sci/!

>>8175308
What the fuck are you talking about?

>>8175247
lol moron

kys

>>8173177
Wrong board.
>>>/his/

>>8173177
>you ain't gonna be alive no more dude!

irrefutable argument

>>8173177

Don't listen to these clowns.

Some of the rational arguments against suicide have been mentioned already.

But the greatest argument against suicide is as follows:

You have about 80 years to live, and an eternity to be dead/nonexistent. Why the fuck would you voluntarily cut it short?

(Unless life is completely unbearable, in which you get a free pass from this argument. But even then, there are often unexplored ways to make life bearable again)

>>8173177
Being in a doctoral program

>>8176780
....thought OP said "for". As for against, I'd go with Martingale theory. If you're having a shitty day the getting black out drunk and trying again tomorrow lets double down. Presumably there will be a stopping time almost surely, so why rush it? Can't speak to meth or opiates.

>>8173321
there's a stigma against mental patients?
I was first hospitalized in fifth grade and I never noticed.

>>8173634
>Most correct and detailed answer in the thread
>No replies
Anyway, this pretty much

I just finished medshchool and I want to die. What now?

If I followed the teachings I would forcibly admit myself to a closed psych ward. I don't want to. I've spent all this time alone hoping and expecting I'd adjust myself to something resembling a normal person with a normal lifestyle but if never happened. It never happened. How much misery should I go through before I'm allowed to simply off myself. I clearly isn't wired to exist like this.

For all my classmates this is one of the best times in their life, they fucking made it.

For me it's fucking game over. After progressively getting worse I've finaly given up on the prospect of improvement and really want to fucking die.

Why should I continue? The majority vote argument doesn't work here because clearly I'm wired in the wrong way and fucked because of that.

File: tumblr_mgpw3f4elD1s1mae3o1_1280.jpg (16KB, 704x400px) Image search: [Google]

16KB, 704x400px

>>8177276
you're supposed to rewire yourself. that is, if you can. if you let other ppl try they will force drugs and weird values on you that will very likely find to be inappropriate and make things much worse.

currently there is no real cultural knowledge for this problem because we're still extremely uncivilized as a society. especially with the inhumane shit capitalism is giving us. you've stumbled into the literal bleeding edge. sadly no one is really finding any answers. ppl either slowly get better without saying anything or suffer until they die.

>>8176770
Bullshit logic.

Let's say a life is bearable but slightly more unpleasant than pleasant. That's still net-negtive utility.

Nonexistence is neutral.

You are basically saying we should prefer something net-negative to something neutral just because the net-negative thing is rare.

The argument you should be making is that all bearable life is net-positive, which is clearly untrue.

>>8175343

He's saying ego death is just as scary as actual death, except actual death is far easier to accomplish so that's what people default to.

File: 1428186093001.jpg (480KB, 1600x900px) Image search: [Google]

480KB, 1600x900px

>>8173177
No, it should be legal and easy for everybody to buy a deadly dose of nembutal. Even for minors, they are not born voluntarily after all.

This is the most fundamental exit option for a self-aware person and everybody should have it.

Of course, one could try to stay alive and prevent more suffering than one experiences + causes. This could be done by consuming lacto-vegetarian food and giving small donations so that the poor can buy painkillers. And of course not committing crimes, hate speech and so on.

But the reality is that most people have no clue what the world needs, and a lot of them could probably die in their sleep and there would be less suffering overall.

File: i-like-titles_o_831947.jpg (57KB, 400x612px) Image search: [Google]

57KB, 400x612px

>>8177404
>mfw commie detected
>get off my board fag

>>8173177
call the hotline and find out