Homegrowmen (Farming and Gardening) Thread #65

>>816003
US Farm Income and Taxes:
http://www.hobbyfarms.com/farm-marketing-and-management/farm-income-taxes-14991.aspx

US Grants and Loans for Small Farms:
http://www.usda.gov/wps/portal/usda/usdahome?navid=GRANTS_LOANS
http://afsic.nal.usda.gov/farms-and-community/grants-and-loans-farmers
http://www.nal.usda.gov/afsic/pubs/funding.shtml

Managing Risks on Your Small Farm:
http://agr.wa.gov/Marketing/SmallFarm/managerisk.aspx

Chicken info and forum:
http://www.backyardchickens.com

Rabbit guide:
http://www.agriculture.gov.tt/publications/manuals/rabbit-production-a-producer-s-manual.html

A public access seedbank for many types of rare or endangered plants; both edible and ornamental:
http://www.jlhudsonseeds.net/index.htm

Organic and heirloom selections:
http://sustainableseedco.com/
http://www.seedsofchange.com/
http://www.johnnyseeds.com/

Potato, Sweet Potato, and Tubers seed bank (free, but requires filling out forms and waiting in line):
http://www.cipotato.org/

Awesome interactive plant/gardening maps for USA, Canada, France, UK, BC (frost dates, temp zones, etc):
http://www.plantmaps.com/index.php

Sprout seeds and info:
sproutpeople.org

Insect Habitats for attracting pollinating bees, predatory/parasitic wasps, hibernating ladybugs, butterflies, etc.:
http://www.inspirationgreen.com/insect-habitats.html

Toad and Hedgehog Habitats:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JetkWtw7Jc [Embed]
http://familycrafts.about.com/od/frogcrafts/a/How_To_Make_A_Toad_Village.htm
http://www.bbc.co.uk/breathingplaces/hedgehog_home/
http://www.britishhedgehogs.org.uk/leaflets/L5-Hedgehog-Homes.pdf

Chili Peppers:
http://www.fatalii.net/
http://www.chilepepperinstitute.org/

More on Aquaponics & Aquaculture:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?&v=26xpMCXP9bw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?&v=_WgfaJjvfxA
http://www.appropedia.org/Aquaponics

Sourcing plants from the grocery:
http://www.diyncrafts.com/4732/repurpose/25-foods-can-re-grow-kitchen-scraps

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I'm posting an update to my corn and true garlic seed projects, and I'm adding in a bit about my NM chile (peppers) and why I want my own seed that is adapted the way it is. I'll start with the chile. Pic related was my chile beds back in the first part of June. The weeds got as bad as they did for two reasons:

Last year, we literally got double the annual average rainfall, which produced a bumper crop of weed seeds for this year and;

This year, my mother had a major surgery, and I had to pick and choose what got taken care of for a while due to having to take care of her. I picked knocking the Bermuda in where the corn is back. More on that later.

Further compounding the issue was the fact that the seedlings took 2-3 weeks to emerge, when they should have taken closer to 1 week. This gave the weeds an extra 2 week head start.

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Pic related is the bed where the plants are the least stunted from the early weedpocalypse. They should be more numerous and bigger.

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Yes, there are chile plants in the middle of this bed. They are still only a few inches tall, but they've finally recovered from the weeds. I think I actually caused some root damage when pulling the weeds initially. (Yes, I need to weed again, but at least it is under control now.)


Plans for next year, since the chile has kind of gone through a crucible here:

I will be saving seed from this year's crop, though the crop will probably only yield 25% of what it should have. Next year, I am going to pregerminate the seeds so that I can select for easier germination. The long delay absolutely killed me, and it probably killed half of what I had planted too. I prefer direct sewing because, IMO, you get a more robust root system, but I will be solo cupping these, in part because where they are going is going to have winter rye when it would be time to plant by seed.

They're all NewMex cultivars and crosses of NewMex cultivars. Once established, they're very hardy plants, but getting them established was the tough part this year. Next year, I should be able to start selecting for flavor and heat.

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Onto the corn:

That pic was taken on the fourth of July. You'll notice that it has tasseled, and is already producing silk. While I want a genetically diverse population, the timing of the tasseling and silking is something that could knock this plant out of the population, because it is less likely that the cobs will get pollinated, and if they do, it is more likely that it will be self pollination, which eventually leads to retardo-inbred plants, and it will not be able to compete with everything else.

OTOH, if it does get pollinated by another later blooming stalk, it could start to move its flowering time closer to the average. We'll see.

FYI, for those who are unaware, corn is wind pollinated. The tassels produce the pollen, and the silks are the part that accept the pollen.

Another issue with this particular stalk is that the cobs are forming down low. I have raccoons as pests, and raccoons just love low hanging cobs. This is becoming more and more the exception.

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One thing I forgot to mention in the last post is that most cobs are now forming 4'-8' off the ground.

Here, you can see a general picture of what most of the corn is doing. It is tasseling, and if you look hard, you might be able to find a few silks emerging.

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Pic related is one of the stunted stalks from the last time I posted. Yup - it's still stunted. That late germination really did it in. It won't get the sunlight that it needs to produce anything notable.

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Again, some of the corn gets a bit of afternoon shade. You can tell what gets it first largely by the average height of the stalks, and by the fact that it is tasseling later than the corn that gets little to no afternoon shade. I will be taking this into account when selecting seed, as this is a serious environmental disadvantage for those stalks. Corn likes full sun, even here in the high desert.

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One of the stalks that lodged last time has somewhat uprighted itself. The pic was taken on July 4th, but not much has changed with it. I still will not be saving any seed from it, or any of the others that lodged, despite the fact that we have had some brutal downdrafts. Corn that tends towards lodging can cause other stalks that would otherwise remain upright to lodge too. Just think dominoes.

If it produces, I will eat the stuff though.

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The corn is planted too close together for optimum per plant production. As a reminder, I did this on purpose to make them compete with each other, but there is an added benefit. In the pic is some bermuda grass that totally wrecked that bed last year. This year, once the corn got tall enough, all that I have had to do was keep it from going to seed, and the shade has kept it from getting out of control. That is what I was concentrating on instead of the chile. I fucking hate bermuda.

At this time, I spend maybe 5 minutes per week pulling little bits of it up from that bed. That is also why the winter rye is going in - to out compete it next spring.

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Now for the garlic:

If you don't recall, I have two lines of garlic going right now. The first one was a hardneck cultivar to begin with, and I have acquired seed from it in the past. That is what is in pic related.

Notice the greenish parts starting to show up in the flowers. Those are ovaries, and they are getting swollen. I probably have 15 or 20 other plants like that. This means that I should be getting seed from this batch.

The question here, is since I have gotten it to produce seed in the past, will it produce more seed this time around, or do I have to grow garlic from true seed to get that to happen. There is probably a lot of epigenetic stuff going on here, but there is also the issue of chromosomal damage that has built up over thousands of generations of cloning that would get fixed by sexual reproduction. I'm not sure which is going to win out here, but I will probably find out in a few weeks.

(For those of you who missed the last time I posted a flurry of pictures, garlic has almost lost the ability to produce true seed. Myself and several others are trying to reverse this, because cloned plants cannot be bred for more hardy cultivars, viruses can build up in your "seed" stock, and chromosomal damage also accumulates.)

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My second line of garlic was originally a softneck garlic that turned into a hardneck. Softneck garlic has forgotten how to bolt (produce a flowering stalk - which is what the hard neck is in hardneck garlic.) However, it can sometimes be reminded how to bolt with a little bit of stress.

It turns out that I had neglected some garlic for a month or two after I had harvested the rest of it. Living in the desert, I would say that counts as stress.

From this, I saved the bulbils, and planted those two years ago, and this year, they finally all bolted! Something got turned on or off in the original plant, and it passed that on to its offspring.

Bulbils are like mini garlic cloves that grow on the flowering head. See pic related for very developed bulbils. Most people trying to get true seed remove them so that the plant diverts energy to the flowers instead. I did not with this particular plant and a few others just in case I don't get any true seed this year, I can ship those off to collaborators and try again next year.

One thing to notice here is that the flowers haven't shrunk back. That means that the plant has put some energy towards them, but in the next post, you will see some plants where the bulbils were removed.

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When garlic scapes (bolts,) the flowering head has a sheath. My softneck turned hardneck had its sheaths start to open a couple of days earlier than my hardneck that already has ovaries that should have some seed in them, yet the flowers have yet to open. What is happening is that they are very slowly turning purple over the weeks.

Typically, a flower that is flat out not viable will shrivel away. The fact that these haven't even opened yet is somewhat vexing, but the fact that they haven't shriveled up is also encouraging. I'm not quite sure what is going to happen, but as I have never heard of somebody going from softneck garlic purchased at the grocery store to true garlic seed, I am determined, either this year, or in the future, to succeed.

If it does not work this year, I'm going to try a couple of things in the future:

Stressing the original caused it to bolt. Perhaps a bit of stress once it starts to bolt, or possibly once it starts to flower, could kick seed production into gear. Some organisms are like that: Conditions are poor so they reproduce NOW before they die.

Growing different plants with different soil amendments. I haven't worked this one out in detail yet, but this is uncharted territory for me.

However, if I do get seed, I will take care to get some of them to germinate, and I will have done something that I've not heard of anybody else doing. I'll take those bragging rights;)

Guy who tomato plant was dying. Added some coffee grounds to the soil and moved it into the shade more. Looks like it is recovering.

>>816063
Can sex really fix chromosomal damage from cloning? From within the same cloned population?

>>816157
That's what I'm told, though the from within the same population is something that I can't answer. Like I say, there are a number of people doing this, and once I have a supply of viable seed, I can start trading and getting other cultivars to cross with.

If you want the empirical answer, first generation true seed garlic (TSG) varies wildly in its fitness, and it becomes more consistent after that, and also produces better seed more readily. How it does five generations out if new genetics is not introduced is something that I do not know.

Some plants are A-OK with inbreeding (common beans and tomatoes for example,) and others get retarded fast. I'm not sure where garlic is on this spectrum.

>>816184
Pretty interesting, you make me wish I had the space to play Mendel. I guess we're not at the point yet where we can sequence entire generations and identify what happened at the DNA level.

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More peppers. A couple habs, a few serranos, a few cayennes, and a red bell for good measure.

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>go on vacation for 5 days
>come back to all your plants eaten, wilted and generally fucked up

atleast they left the tomato plants alone

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After 4-5 months of water cupping I finally potted the avocado seed

>>816374
Congrats dude
I've given up on my avocado
Maybe I'll try again in the fall and over winter it

>>816302
Will peppers produce viable seeds if they're not entirely ripe i.e. green peppers?

>>816378
Next time I'd just put like five avocado seeds in a pot with soil and throw away the "bad" ones i.e. the ones that take forever to sprout

>>816379
If the seed isn't mature, no.

Green peppers turn colors when ripe. However, success in getting them fully ripe without rotting is very difficult a lot of times. Hence people just calling them green peppers and picking them while still unripe.

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Peppergrowers? Anyone?

>>816379
Only if the pepper is about to turn colors anyway. If you pick the pepper while it is still green, and a few days later it turns red or whatever color, the seed is probably viable. It needs to be ripe or almost ripe for the seeds to be good.

I've never grown peppers before. I grew banana peppers and they're fully grown, but taste like nothing. They're next to tomato plants if that means anything.

>>816426
Full retard

Just bought my first house that came with a bunch of nice fenced in raised garden beds and a lot of room around the house for other stuff. This shit is thoroughly fun.

>>816452
Are they fully yellow?

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The first time I tried to grow from seed the seedlings couldn't establish roots and died. I think it was because my soil was too coarse so I'm looking at getting a riddle. Can anyone recommend one? I am a bit of a minimalist so I prefer things that are simple and easy to stack away. This is the most appealing thing I've found. Does plastic perform well compared to the steel ones?

My garden slops downward noticably. It's fenced on its north and east side and slopes down with the north being higher than the south. I had taken a good amount of dirt out of it which I'm returning to deal with it but that will only do so much. Water tends to pool on the south side a bit.

My question is how do I take this into account when planning my garden for next year?

>>816620
Plant stuff that likes water in the soggier area and stuff that doesn't like lots of water in the drier areas.

>>816628
Can you give me some examples of each?

>>816519
Welcome!

>>816023
>>816027
>>816034
>>816039
>>816045
>>816048
>>816051
>>816054
>>816059
>>816063
>>816066
>>816071
wow thats interesting, you seem to be quite experienced. would you say its worth having multiple types of plants in a space of 1x2m, or should I concentrate on one?

>>816302
>>816426
peppers looks quite interesting, do they grow well in pots?

>>816338
that indeed must feel bad, dont you have neighbours or family that could look after your plants? they might still fuck it up but maybe its worth a try

>>816374
damn thats a long time, when do you expect the first harvest?

>>816519
thats the dream, in what region are you?

>>816631
Come up with a list of things you want to harvest and eat first, then go by that. There's a lot of potential plants you could be planting and pretty much all of them like things either wet or dry.

>>816635
>do they grow well in pots?
My Serrano peppers have

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Wooo!

The first tomato of the season for my area. An heirloom tomato called, "Mortgage Lifter".

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>>816828
sleep tight t'mater

>>816842
I just wanted to let you know that you are a terrible person.

>>816842
ohh like a butt

>>816843
Sometimes you need someone to remind you that we're still on 4chan.

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>>816845
another reminder

>>816842
Kek

>>816842
Anon, this is great work. Love your vision.

>>816855
>>816842
>>816426

LEWD

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It's gonna be a bumper crop. Cherokee Purple. Highly recommended for le connoisseur or sales to yuppies.personally, I'm gonna rape these bitches

>>816921
My first year NOT growing them. I just never liked them as much as my striped german or brandywines. I only used them for color.

Nice looking plant,though.

>>816635
Yes, peppers are very easy to do in pots. Use at least a 5 gallon pot or bucket with drainage holes at the bottom; fill it with 3/4 high quality potting soil and 1/4 compost. Peppers are heavy feeders in pots and need regular but light fertilizer. Start with a 5-1-1 fish emulsion when the plants are young and switch to something with more potassium/calcium/magnesium later in the year. Pick off the first few sets of buds to encourage more plant growth; once the peppers set it stops producing foliage for the most part.

So the catalogue for the elderberries I bought said they would grow 3 feet across and 8 feet high. Aparrently by 3x8 what they really meant (in their own instructions mailed with the plants is 12 feet across by 12 feet high. Assholes.

No I've got these soon to be massive tree things in 5x5 boxes on either side of my garden stairs. Should I return them and get something smaller or just ride it out?

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>>817100
Talking to the owner no to see if its a mistake in the instructions or if he's a no good motherfucker who needs to die, go to hell, and stay there forever.

>>817100
>>817101
Calm down, it will normally takes years for elderberries to reach that size. They are kind of like bamboo in that they can expand quite a bit and have tons of stalks. but, they are not madly invasive like bamboo of course. You can merely keep them trimmed on the sides.

>12 feet high

I've never seen them more than 8 feet high and most are in the 5-7 feet range. I have some I planted near my pond like 5 years ago and they are only 3 feet high so far and this is their first year to fruit. But, soil here is all clay and shitty. I should probably give them a bit of compost at the end of the season.

>>816842
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goatse.cx
>
for those of you who didnt live in the early ages of the interwebs

Why would someone have a useless lawn that is Sisyphean to keep up when they could put their soil to good use and have a garden. Oh boy I sure do like looking at a yard I don't use and mowing it just because everyone else does.

Fucking indians I swear

>>816845
literally the only board i use nowadays evrething else has changed so much

>>817102
Do you have anything underplanting them to break up the soil? Also how far across are they? I've calmed down.

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>>817105
My pineapple is totally fucked
It did so well inside but since I put it out in June it has become all shitty. Maybe too much water? A lot of yellow or dying leaves or burned leaves
It is over 3 years old now, this is it's third summer outside (I live in Ontario)
I was expecting a shoot but nothing. I read somewhere to encourage a shoot I can put a banana next to it to release ethylene gas
Is this bullshit?

>>817116
Did you not harden it off? Did you just plop it outside after being inside all winter and expect it to do well in the June sun?

>>817105
This. I can't imagine having a lawn that I also had to water to keep alive. At that point I would grow food because fuck it I'm already breaking my back for this shitty plot of land.

>>817110
Sure but you also got older.

>>817102
Elerberries are supposed to grow 6' a year. Time to soil test and amend. Soil test are free this time of year in my neck of the woods because its off-peak season. Just got to your local Cooperative extension and they'll give you a kit and send it to a public university for analysis.

Also, if you're into organic growing I recomment The Holistic Orchard by Michael Phillips. It's literally written by god through the hands of a man.

>>817102
>but, they are not madly invasive like bamboo of course.
yes they are.

and they fucking reek.

>>817118
I mildy hardened it off desu
I brought it in at nights because it was still going less than 15°C
Will it recover though ?

If you were to grow a plant indoors with an LED grow light and zero access to sunlight would there be any detrimental effects for the plant?

Any recs for a species which would thrive in that environment?

>>817136
People grow pot like that

>>817139
I ain't into that sort of thing.
I was thinking more along the lines of golden pothos or a bonsai tree.

>>817126
Uh, elderberries really aren't as invasive as bamboo, few things are. And they don't reek, what the hell kind of plant are you thinking of?

>>817143
>I ain't into that sort of thing.
I wasn't suggesting you grow pot, I was just pointing out that it's very possible to grow plants to fruition with only artificial light

>>817154
>tripfags
>spews bullshit
pick two.
just filter the faggot.

>>817154
Correct. He has no clue what he's talking about. They merely spread in a similar manner as bamboo, via rhizomes and form small clusters. It is more like the non-invasive bamboo, not the crazy invasive stuff that takes over everything in 3 days.

And "reek" lol Maybe the term means something else to him.

>>817143
You should be able to do that fine.
Just remember about the inverse square law when positioning your light.

>>817164
Why do you even have to filter? Just don't respond.

>>817166
Alright, thanks man.

>>817121
>Elerberries are supposed to grow 6' a year.

I live in an area where they grow wild all along the stream/river banks. The only grow about 6 feet total in the growing season then die back to the ground, int he winter, and repeat next season. New plants tend to take several years to properly establish. Once they have enough rootbase they will grow rapidly every year and start the cycle.

>>817115
Mine are just getting started this year. Next year they should be growing much larger. They were just seedlings when they started and are now about 2 feet wide and 3 feet tall.

>>817154
they're worse, atleast bamboo doesn't seed itself.

sambucus smells really bad.
>>817165
I have 15 years of experience working with them, you have a single specimen.

they're the single most invasive shrub in western europe and you have no idea what you're talking about.

>>817173
I have over 40 years working with them since I live with them and see them almost every day of my life.

We are talking about Black Elderberry (Sambucus nigra.)

And, it is nothing at all like invasive bamboo's invasive nature. They grow on banks mostly but you can also find them growing in other trees as a epiphyte but that is pretty rare.

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>tfw planted WAY too much basil
Picked 1/2 kg of leaves today (wherever the plants wanted to go to flower) and made some pesto which supposedly lasts a couple weeks in the fridge if oil is on top

>>817143
You just need to be careful when you move them back out to the much more intense real light. I thought I killed my Adenium when I put it back out this spring.

>>817181
I'm talking about maintenance not just seeing them around, which I do as well, they're everywhere, cracks in concrete, wooden beschoeiing, gravel, you name it and they've colonized it.

they're terrible weeds.

Sambucus nigra is the most common species around here, maybe your climate is colder or hotter during the summer because it takes years to kill them here even if you dump roundup on them.

>>817182
Dry it out
It can keep for several months or longer

>>817194
I still have more than enough dried basil powder/flake from last year, don't use it too much in that form (loses/changes flavour quite a lot), I prefer fresh leaves most of the time

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>>817173
>Sambucus
>single most invasive shrub in western europe
It's native here though? Clearly you must be thinking of the similar looking Prunus serotina which is indeed invasive here

>>817126
Grats on being the first tripfaggot I ever bothered to filter. Yours is a special kind of vocal worthlessness

>>817167
After a certain point, when you grow up, you start to value your time more and more and get rid of anything that wastes it. This guy wasted valuable seconds of my life with his post.

>>817206
Prunus serotina isn't that invasive here, it's only a problem in disturbed areas.

natives can be invasive, ground elder for example is invasive pretty much everywhere where it's native as well.
>>817167
he can't filter me because he's using mobile internet to ban evade, there's 100+ perm bans pending against him.

>>817181
I'm talking about Sambucas Canandensis though. Because I live in North America.

>>817191
>using roundup
Opinion discarded.

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>>817206
Whoops wrong pic
>>817211
Well here "invasive" is only used for neophytes

>>817166
What is that?

>>817214
Aegopodium podagraria is native there, are you saying it's not invasive as fuck?

most 'weeds' are native plants.

>>817216
At 2m away you only have 1/4 as much light as at 1m away
At 3m away you only have 1/9 as much light as at 1m away
and so on

>>817172
>Mine are just getting started this year. Next year they should be growing much larger. They were just seedlings when they started and are now about 2 feet wide and 3 feet tall.

Nice. I just put some Adam and John Elderberries in 3 days ago. I put them in a small hole surrounded by cardboard. Do they spread from the stems present already or by shoots from below?

>>817199
Use it for magick and then dry the new basil. Or throw it away and dry the newest bit.

>>817219
Thanks. That's simply.

>>817218
Again, semantics. German "invasiv" only applies to foreign stuff like Fallopia japonica
We don't have a word for [extremely noxious growing native weed] that I know of
Thought Dutch and English treat it the same way (because it can only "invade" to where it hasn't been before)

>>817224
don't you call it unkraut as well?

>>817225
Yes, but this applies to all weeds, regardless of their status as native/neophyte, and mostly refers to smallish plants like dandelions, up to small shrubs, but rarely to trees
So while for example Acer platanoides is a very noxious native species, we don't have a word for it

>>817227
aren't invasive trees called pionierpflanze?

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>>816927
I have a German striped as well but the first few that ripened were tiny

>>816374

Got this far once and a squirrel mucked it all up. Good luck anon

>>817224
German occupation of the Netherlands was justified

>>817199
Make pesto and freeze it if your is any good

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>>817239
>freezing pesto.

>>817242
Sorry, forgot you guys can't afford freezers, window screens and seedless grapes

>>817244
it figures you've never eaten reheated pesto.

>>817230
Yet another concept.
This is used when for example there was a forest fire, clearing etc and those are then the first plants to resettle the area again, often fast-growing ones but won't reach old age (usually 100 years or less)
>>817239
It turned out alright, I used actual olive oil, pine seeds and pecorino cheese, you can't even get the proper stuff from the store (the pre-bottled ones always use sunflower oil, cashews and cheap cheese instead), so mine is somewhat more intense

>>817248
9 out of every 10 pionierpflanze are trees here.

>>817247
Are you legitimately poor?

>>817249
True, mostly trees, but they aren't necessarily acting weed-like, and can be either native (willows, birches) or introduced/invasive (Ailanthus altissima)

>>817250
I have 3 freezers, pesto made from basil always tastes like shit reheated.

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>>817255
>I have 3 freezers
Autism

>>817261
one for fish, one for meat, one for vegetables.

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>>817266
Fish is meat. You have 2 freezers just for meat.

>frozen vegetables
>mfw

>>817289
I keep them seperate because I catch my own fish.

>>816635
>when do you expect the first harvest?
Three years from now

>>817247
I would never heat or reheat pesto because I'm not an idiot and it breaks down the component ingredients

>>817312
if you freeze your pesto how are you going to get the temperature back up without reheating it?

do you eat pesto popsicles or something?

>>817234
Thanks

>>816855
I don't get it. I've seen a video of someone doing the same thing with a tomatoe plant using an electric tooth brush. Is it a joke?

>>817116
>this is it's third summer outside
Great

>I read somewhere to encourage a shoot I can put a banana next to it to release ethylene gas
I do the same thing with apples to make kiwis go ripe quicker

>>817182
>which supposedly lasts a couple weeks in the fridge if oil is on top
Mine goes bad after about two weeks. Maybe I'm not using enough oil

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Made my first crushed red pepper of the year. This is only 7-8 dragon cayenne peppers, the first ones to ripen. There are at least 30 more on the plant that haven't turned yet.

The late season harvest will be YUGE!

>>817314

>Reheating
that implies heating it twice you mong and pesto shouldn't be heated at all.

Maybe it's your lack of English. But i ((heat))) up frozen pesto by letting it thaw in the fridge. Then it can be placed directly on freshly cooked pasta which warms it to the proper temperature for eating.

>>817317
>I don't get it. I've seen a video of someone doing the same thing with a tomatoe plant using an electric tooth brush. Is it a joke?
The flower can self pollinate itself by vibrating the flower so the pollen from the male part of the flower goes in the flower vagina and makes a baby
Insects and birds do this outside

>>817349
He's autistic
You're talking to a wall

>>817349
if you've made pesto, freeze it, then bring it back to the same temperature before you froze it, aren't you reheating it?

Stop replying to plont/bugguy and filling up the thread with worthless horseshit. Don't even try to correct him.

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>still shoveling gravel for paths
>wild cherry tree stump appears

This is one of the few times I had some excavator. Normally, I burn these out with fire, but its location sorta prevents that. I can't wait for chemical stump remover to work and I'm not paying $250/day to rent an excavator just for this one job. Thus, all day is being spent on removing it by hand. This is like the 15th stump I've had to remove by hand and it has the largest roots I've ever seen.

*WARBLEGARBLE*

At least it isn't terribly hot today, just mindbogglingly humid. I stopped and tied up tomatoes for an hour, probably another hour's worth of tomato tying to be done. Just for 1 cherry tomato using Simple Layering.

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Alright faggots. Let me show you my plants.

You're looking at my 7'x4' plot in the foreground. Plots are supposed to be 8x4 but the jews stole four of my square feet.

The plot growing literally nothing is my lazy as fuck neighbor who i've never even met. I hope he gets kicked out next year so I can get a neighbor who gives a fuck.

(cont)

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>>817404
You might be thinking - "ppppsh what an amateur, my potatoes are way bigger than that," Well, you underinformed cunt, guess what. This is my second fucking planting of potatoes this year in this section of the garden. A already pulled out 12 pounds out of this 8 square feet, and I fully intend to pull at LEAST another 12. Probably more as I have a long season variety in now called Nicola

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>>817406
I'm almost tempted to stop here, because potatoes are the only plant I actually give a fuck about.

But something something crop rotation so I unfortunately have more to show you.

These are carrots. I hate these fuckers. Bitches won't germinate to save their own piece of shit species. I probably planted 4 times this but this is all I could get to come up.

Carrots are on my list of shit not to bother with next year.

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>>817411
You wont have heard of this one I'm sure, it's Jerusalem Artichoke. It's basically a sunflower that grows potatoes.

It's a really bitchin plant but it likes to take over. I like a plant that wants to take over.

Jerusalem Artichoke grows up to 15 feet tall and its tubers are extremely productive. We're talking 12 pounds per plant.

I double digged this section to get these to grow as tall as possible. I'm secretly trying to shade out all the gardeners north of me.

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>>817414
Why am I growing kale? I'm not, because Kale grows its fucking self. It's got a powerful will to live, so eating it will give you a powerful will to live.

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>>817416
I actually hate tomatoes but I'm still the best at growing them of anyone else in the community garden. We're talking an order of magnitude more fruit than my closest competitor. I swear this single plant has 10 to 15 pounds of fruit on it, maybe more.

>>817333
How did you dry them?

>>817414
>You wont have heard of this one I'm sure, it's Jerusalem Artichoke. It's basically a sunflower that grows potatoes.

I had enough to harvest three 5-gallon buckets of tubers last year. They are amazing and hardy. Only problem with them are leaf hoppers. You can store them int he fridge of in the ground. Just let them get cold for like 2 weeks then eat them and they will be far sweeter than when straight out of the ground.

....and their nick-name is "fartichoke" for all the gas they can give you due to the inulin content.

I no longer grow them because I simply can't eat enough of them to make a dent. I can only eat like a 1x1x1 inch cube and it will give me wicked gas.

>>817404 to >>817419 and probably beyond

That's a really good looking garden you have going on there. I've been graveling mine with paths the past few days. I'm thinking about adding just a few stepping stones here and there for when I'm barefooted and it isn't rain-slick.

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>>817419
I'm not sure if I'm more pissed at the snails for fucking with my beets, or at the beets for being so damn delicious to the snails. The milk jugs at least keep them out, hopefully resulting in mass snail death. I think next year I won't bother with beets, I'll just grow more fucking kale.

>>817404
>>817406
>>817411
Comfy. Looks good.

>>817400
Why do you use layering to grow one plant?

>>817191
Bruh, your thinking of something else. You do have a native species of elderberry, and it's not at all like what you're describing.

>>817382
Uh, no. It's called 'thawing'. Who in thier right mind would heat pesto?

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>>817426

And finally the trellis of lies. I ripped these sticks out of the forest with my bare hands, and tied them together using twine I braided from my own back hair.

But as it turned out the "climbing" beans I bought are actually bush beans.

The rest of the garden is a culinary herb bed. Nothing you haven't seen before so I wont waste your time with any pretty pictures.

Until next time

>>817432
no I'm positive that I'm talking about Sambucus.

go break a branch off your plant and smell it, it's terrible.

isn't thawing technically reheating?

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>>817424
>I no longer grow them because I simply can't eat enough of them to make a dent. I can only eat like a 1x1x1 inch cube and it will give me wicked gas.
Apparently if you can get your gut bacteria really healthy, they can deal with the inulin. Worst case scenario I can't process them and I just become a tuber vendor to other people wanting to grow the plant.

>>817428

Thanks bro. This hobby kicks the shit out of anything else I've tried. The self sufficiency is addictive

>>817423
oven at 170F for 3 hours.

>>817457
Thanks

>>817444
It has to do with having the right gut flora for the inulin in the first place. It doesn't have anything to do with actual health. Some are just better for it than others. for instance, I can't eat inulin-containing stuff due to gas. However, I can eat a mountain of any type of bean and never get any gas at all while friends and relatives can explode with gas after eating beans. The down side is that I digest beans so well that I'll gain pounds of fat like nothing. No other food does that to me.

If you have chickens you can grind up the sunchokes and feed it to the chickens. You can also use them to make alcohol.

>>817437
Technically. Technically the temperature outside right now is 299° in kelvin. But you a comically missing the point THAT NO ONE CALLS IT THAT.

People call this thawing not reaheating, a small plot of vegetables a garden not a farm, and it's 80° Fahrenheit/26° Celsius outside NOT 299° kelvin you pedantic bastard.

>>817494
yeah I forgot the word 'thawing' and used reheating instead.

>>817436
>Braided out of my own back hair.

Kek. I like you.

At least you aren't like me, I got a load of bush zucchini and they grow into big, viney fucks sprawling everywhere. It a jungle and its coming for meeeeee...

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Soo close...
Growth is no longer exponential and slowing down a bit, though the last to days were quite warm (highs of around 28-29°C and lots of sun) and I'm watering daily (hasn't rained in 16 days now - summer is going full retard after the drowning mess that was May/June)

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>>817541

>>817543
Sleep tight, meller.

>>817543
How long did it take to get to this point?

>>817444
That's not your house, I assume?

>>817566
no, it's a community center. The garden is an allotment system

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>>817562
November experimental seedling aside (this one still lives too!), for the rest of them I did the following
>Put the seeds in run of the mill flower soil in mid-March in a planter thingie (dunno if there's a name for it, basically a planter of 6 compartments of 5x5x5cm each, pic related some time after sprouting)
>Wrapped plastic foil around it to keep up moisture
>Placed on top of radiator for constant ~30°C
>Sprouted within 4-5 days
>Kept inside until mid-May with alu-foil coated press wood panel behind it for maximum natural illumination
>After some hardening-off, planted out in the garden (spacing roughly 0.5m^2 per plant) with black plastic foil cause it's still kinda cool here in mid-May (avg high/mean/low is about 20/15/10°C during that time)
>Removed black foil around early June
>Let them just grow after that, not caring about pruning tips etc
I'll continue like that, there's about 10 fruits in total so far and I'll let a few more come, but I think I'll remove any new fruit setting after early August because they won't ripen any more, so the plants can better concentrate their "powers" on the remaining fruits

>>817573
wait, did your winter watermelon survive?

>>817136
>>817143
This guy again, spent some time researching it but I'm kinda in over my head so I have a few more questions.

My plan was to basically create a tiny garden in a tray that's around 1ft squared.
In the garden I was going to plant a bonsai tree or two and cover the rest of the soil in moss however it looks like moss needs a lot of humidity which wouldn't be very good for the trees.

What would be a good substitute for moss (i.e looks similar) that can co-exist with bonsai?
Would a 40W CFL suffice for this?

Any resources would be appreciated too.
A ridiculous amount of the videos about grow lights on youtube are aimed at pot growers.

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>>817611
Yeah I posted about it earlier, tl;dr
>grew huge from November to late April indoors (pic is from its last indoor days)
>got massive sunburn after planting out (oops didn't harden off) so the main vine pretty much died away
>after being proclaimed dead it got side shoots from the base in early June
It's behind the other melons now, but it too has grown >1m long vines

>>817626
I let my indoor pumpkin die, but I kept the pollen so I am going to pollinate the first female flower I get once it starts vining out, and keep the seeds from it

>>817623
>What would be a good substitute for moss
buy shit that people use for miniature train sets and make your terrain with that and have live trees. If you're just going for the appearance, than who needs to know the moss isn't real?

>>817633
Always heard/read about melons apparently requiring manual (human assisted) pollination (with paintbrushes and whatnot) but I never did that with mine and they're still fruiting left and right, but maybe it's because I have strawberries (everbearing) and thyme shrubs growing next to them that are attracting bees like crazy (both still flowering now, strawberries might even flower until December), so maybe them getting "lost" to the melons is enough for pollination

>>817637
That's a pretty good idea actually, I'll probably end up going with that.

Can I eat vegetables with flower blossom rot if I cut the rotten end off?

>>817648
yes

>>816374
I tried to do this.

I put it in a cupboard when I was getting a carpet refitted and forgot about it for many months. Now it's just gone all shitty.

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>>817429
I took one plant and have turned it into something like a dozen plants. I'll know if I get around to tying them up tomorrow. They are all still connected to the main plant and I'm not sure I'll cut them off or not. Layering is the easiest way to propagate new tomato plant starts.

>>817646
cool, post your setup when it's done

>>817693
Is there a point to it if you don't cut them off?

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Here are two of my peppers (habaneros). I severely pruned them too late in the season so I don't expect a lot of fruits, though they're quietly recovering. Both overwintered for one or two years hence the woody stems

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>>817870

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ok so I started gardening about 2 months ago. I'm growing some herbs on my balcony and they're growing pretty good.

The thing is, I have a terrible phobia of caterpillars. I honestly didn't think about it when I started and I saw today that there were caterpillars on my Basil. I had to get my boyfriend to throw away some good plants because I was about to have a panic attack.

How so I stop them from coming? I saw a new one and I can't go back outside. I'm sweating really bad right now. I just need a guaranteed 100% method to get rid of caterpillars completely.

other bugs are fine. I can pick them off myself. Just please help with the caterpillars I'm desperate

>>817892
>Caterpillar phobia
Try getting over it, because honestly, that's outright silly.

>>817892
Immersion therapy, dude. Become the better you by fighting this fear.

But get some bt spray. Bacillus thuringiensis (Bt) causes caterpillars and other worms almost instant and assured death by disease. It hurts nothing but caterpillars. Spray it on before they show up and they'll steer clear-- spray after they arrive to end the party.

I'm interested in starting to grow both edible plants and flowers and want to start with something small that can grow indoors since I live in an apartment. What literature and techniques would you recommend?

Also, does anyone here have experience with the link below or other similar systems? Thanks.

https://www.amazon.com/ZeroSoil-Mini-Indoor-Garden-Watering/dp/B00H2Y1L2I

>>817623
Your going to need a couple of those to get enough lumens. Ypur probably gping to have to upgrade later but theyll do as a start. Also remember to buy bulbs in the 5000K / 6500K range unless you decide to use some sort of flowing plant. But my only experience is with pot as a medical marijiaha grower. I'm better a tree is going to be a little harder.

Oh and put you plant in as small of a box as you can. You want to maximize the light reflected off the walls. And flat white(nothing reflective) is you best bet for said box.

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>>817868
The extra roots strengthen the plant allowing for much more fruit.. If the layering is far enough away it will still have room to grow large.

This is what it looks like untied.

>>817902
As are most of phobias to be quite honest, though that doesn't make them easier to ignore

>>817902
I had a traumatic experience.
>>817954
I just ordered some BT powder online. I guess I'll post later whether or not it works.

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On what date do you trim off all flowers for beefsteak varieties? I heard beginning of August.

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>>818054
You're supposed to trim off the flowers?

>>818054
lol what? Beefsteak is an indeterminate variety. They continue to grow indefinitely. At the very most you trim the flowers of the truss back leaving only 4 developing tomatoes. Just make sure they are already starting to develop. This will increase the size of the tomatoes, that is all.

You don't trim off the entire truss until after you've picked all the ripe fruit off of it.

The tomato plant itself will last for several years so long as you keep it from frost damage and above 55F/12C.

Having new flowers developing at the end of the season won't affect fruit lower on the plant. The only thing that affects those fruit are how many leaves are below them.

>>818053
>caterpillar
>capable of causing trauma
I mean I guess if you're afraid of very clumsy, slow tickling

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Tell me all about goats. For a long time it's been a pipedream of mine to move back to the Tennessee/North Carolina border, buy some cheap land and farm goats on it. Goat milk and meat are my favorite respective dairy and meat products, and having a fresh supply sounds like the best hobby ever. I also married a farm girl who misses the land, so I think we could probably manage it. How retarded am I for even considering it? How do you manage a supply chain like that? I think you'd have to travel a couple of hours to Atlanta (possibly Chattanooga to the Mexicans) to find any real market. Am I retarded? Should I just stop now?

>>818102
find some cheap land, and then ask around the area to see if there is an interest in a speciality meat. A local butcher or something would be nice to ask

>>818102
No do it, goats are great and if your girl is into it you could have a nice life. Try to build some savings beforehand because I doubt you'll get rich but you might scrape by and like I said it will be a nice life. We had a few goats growing up and while I never liked the milk (picky little shit of a kid I was) they were fun to have around.

>>818102
>>818125
Naive question, but for people that were not in the job before hand, isn't it tough to kill animals you raise yourself? Or do you raise them, then make a third party do the slaughter?

>>817416
You. I like you. Nice looking green shit, man.

>>818128
Personally I'd send them to a slaughterhouse. The way my grandfather always did it was give names to milk animals and just numbers to meat animals.

>>818134
Thanks for your answer.
I heard about that thing in the naming process. This fact that usually you don't name what you kill or raise solely to kill is interesting to me. Do you do the same, or did you see a change between your practices and your grandpa's ones?

Also, anyone else about this subject? I'd like to hear several opinions.

>>818128
I felt nothing for our meat chickens, but they were mean bastards and it never left my mind that they were food. Our laying hens on the other hand were nice, I didn't mind them. We raised both sheep and Nubian goats though never many of either, they were for milk and wool though so I never considered them food. They did eventually go to the local slaughterhouse but we didn't eat them. I would feel a little bit uncomfortable killing a pig, cow, or other animal that I had raised, especially if I could tell it trusted me, but if that was their purpose I could do it.

>>818145
I meant to add that we slaughtered the chickens ourselves, and ate so much chicken that it ruined chicken for me

>>818059
So if you live somewhere that doesn't get cold, you could grow a tomato plant for years?

And if it doesn't stop growing, how big could it get over a few years? Some of mine get as high as 10-15 feet by winter, do people with no winter wind up with tomato trees?

>>818145
>especially if I could tell it trusted me

Yeah, it is a huge difference between raising fish to eat and raising goats to eat.

It is even worse when people start naming them and describing neat events and encounters with them. It really makes me like hunting and fishing a lot more.

>>817870
Very nice
Do the fruit produce viable seeds?

>>818156
>It is even worse when people start naming them and describing neat events and encounters with them

Once you get to that point, it's more a pet then livestock.

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Noticed these little creatures on some of my tomato plants yesterday. Can anyone identify and advise on a course of action?

>>818168
Can you get a closer pic? They look like some kind of aphid

>>818183
my phone camera wouldn't focus on them any closer. they are pretty small. I always thought aphids were green...

>>818168
Cabbage mites?

>>818191
I'm convinced now that they are aphids. Just hope I can get rid of them. My tomato patch is pretty thick so I doubt I'm seeing all of them.

>>818145
>>818148
Thanks for the input. If I understand well, when they're settled for meat it's once and for all? Did that happen that laying hens became meat ones (or the opposite), or was it avoided for productivity or attachment reasons?
Also, you tell the meat chickens were mean, so I "prejudged" you were not in good terms with them, though I don't have a clue about how you were acting. Were you more "sympathetic" to laying hens while in relation with them or did you treat them both equally (meat chickens and laying hens)? (You said "if that was their purpose I could do it", so I'm asking myself if you "actively" avoid being more intimately engaged with animals you raise for meat, or if it is more something in the back of the head, without much influence on how you're acting with them)

(That's a lot of questions)

>>818156
So for you the separation has to be quite clear between what you eat and what you pet as >>818165 implied, the less you know about their lives the easier it gets to eat.
Do you know about people who "bond" with fishes? (I'm thinking about people keen on aquariums or things like that and the fact that some fishes are quite smart)

>>818193
Just spray them with soapy water and/or water if there aren't too many.

>>818196
Not that anon, but I did get attached to the fish we had in a fuckhuge aquarium we had growing up. The weren't smart at all, not cute either (except for the clown loaches) and were really just moving decorations. Still named them though and was a little distressed if any died. Not, say, as much as a pet dog or cat, but still.

I think its just part of our social nature to get attached and sympathize with other living things, even if its not our own species, or heck, even an animal. I have fond memories of a jade tree my mom had growing up, for Christ's sake. Humans have to actively work NOT to get attached to things by not giving them names or other workarounds. And it doesn't always work, either, no matter how much you try.

>>818196
My roommate owns a fishtank, and while I don't care about most of the tiny school fish, the goldfish had individual personalities and behaviors and even cared for one another, which led to us naming them and having much stronger feelings for them then the other fish.

>>818128
I think most people only kill small animals like chicken or rabbits themselves, pigs etc to to a slaughterhouse.

>>818156
same for me, I couldnt raise an animal for months, feed it every day and then just kill it, I would emotionally connect to them no matter what. Fishing and hunting really is kinda different and easier on the mind for me personally.

>>818220
>>818223
>>818224
Thank you all for your replies, this is very interesting.

>>818165
Correct, but humans always humanize things.

>>818196
>So for you the separation has to be quite clear between what you eat and what you pet as >>818165 implied,

No, I have no qualms at all slaughtering, "pets". It is just easier to hunt because you don't have everyone in the family pissed off at you for killing, "Billy" for supper. What a lot of people do around here when they start raising food animals for meat. Most of the animals become family pets. They even dig graves for them when they die.

>Do you know about people who "bond" with fishes?

People bond with everything. It is part of human nature. However, fish tanks for fish raised for meat are not like the show tanks where you can easily see and "interact" with the fish. Thus, people tend to bind with them less because of that and because they are fish, which more people find to be "alien" and unrelatable.

>>818224
>I would emotionally connect to them no matter what.

There's nothing wrong with that. I'm a sociopath and I don't bond with anything or anyone. If you had no problem killing them then I'd say you have a problem.

Guys let's talk about plants

My girlfriend's mom cut down a cedar tree, so I took some small cuts from it. If I treat these with rooting hormones will they grow roots? They're about six, maybe less, inches tall.

>>818349
>cedar

Yes, but it can be difficult.

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So this is what my onion crop turned out to be. It isn't all of it but a good representation. Do the tops normally all die off in mid-july? I bought a bunch of about 40 young plants for $1.50 so I'm not disappointed. Anything I should do different next year?

Also what can i plant in that space. I live in MN so it would need to be harvestable by the end of September

>>818349
Very possible, especially with rooting hormone
You may as well buy small cedars from a nursery though

>>818360
green beans
carrots
beets

>>818361
>>818357

Yeah but I figured that since I have a shit ton of hormone and cuts I might as well. Do I just wound it and remove some branches like if I was layering? Will covering it with plastic and misting it be good enough?

>>818365
Google "cedar cutting propagation", and you'll find tons of examples for white cedar cuttings.

>>818364
k I'll try carrots again. I already have the other two started. Any advice on growing them? They always seem stunted. I dig up the soil and leave it loose, but after a few heavy rainfalls it is back to pretty hard.

>>817289
>I only buy what's in the store because all of my money goes to watering my lawn.

A new guy moved into the neighborhood and put some wood on the curb which I asked him if I could have and he help me cut it up when he saw the progress I was making with the thicker ones with my laplander bahco. I can't for the life of me figure out where he got birch when all I could see was pine and oak for miles.

But whatevs gonna make myself a mini hegelkultur. I'm praying for more so I can make it legit.

>>818372
sorry. This is my first time trying carrots and I have them in buckets.

>>818089
Dude, my sister once told me caterpillars were poisonous, then I managed to get my leg stuck in a caterpillar infested tree. I kept screaming my head off that the caterpillars were gonna get me, so yeah, that counts as mental trauma. Also, his memory was probably something like someone dumping a bucket of caterpillars on him or someone force feeding him caterpillars or watching wasp larvae erupt from an infested caterpillar, the possibilities are endless.

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>>818398
>watching wasp larvae erupt from an infested caterpillar,

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>>818398
There are poisonous caterpillars though. One of them can kill you.

I had Saddleback caterpillars on my corn one year. Holy fuck they hurt. It didn't look like much on my skin but it felt like a super bad muscle cramp, only in my skin instead of a muscle and it lasted for like 12 hours.

>Giant Silkworm Moth (Lonomia obliqua)
>It was also discovered that the toxin in the caterpillar's skin held potent anti-clotting agents. This anti-clotting agent would attach to another protein to the body's cells and cause them to leak as blood is unable to clot. This internal bleeding would fill the surrounding tissue with "bruised blood". This internal bleeding spreads through the internal organs and eventually leads to compression and brain death. This accounts for the minimum of 500 deaths resulting from contact with L. obliqua caterpillars. The poison only takes effect in fairly large amounts; in order to experience the extreme effects caused by the toxins, a human victim would probably need to be stung at least 20 to 100 times because each sting only injects a minute amount of venom.

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I got a few quick connectors for my garden hoses today. Now I can switch heads, sprinklers, and soaker hoses almost instantly.

>mfw using them

>>818059
>>818055

I guess it's an advanced concept to not grow 20 to 50 tomatoes that won't ripen and that drain energy from the plant

>>818434
we have similar things to this everywhere in straya known as spitfires, they dont bite but the squirt noxious liquid at you when threatened hence the name. i can see how people can develop a caterpillar phobia these niggas are creepy and have a tendency to drop down off trees at random times

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=crPJKAke3xs

>>817239
>>817242
>>817244
>>817247
>>817250
>>817255

I've been making and freezing pesto for years. I don't make it with parm anymore before freezing, and I think it freezes (and tastes) super good.

I also blanch the leaves which keep them green (instead of going that almost black color).

>>817333
Nice!
>>817400
Impressive. Why not just put your gravel where you want (around it, maybe) and deal for awhile? As in, do you regret all this work and wonder the same thing?
>>817404
>>817406
>>817411
>>817414
>>817416
>>817419
>>817426
>>817436
>>817444
I very much admire your passion and humor.
>>817424
I grow these for my pigs. Essentially have a huge patch, and let them into small sections. Leave enough to keep the patch)es) growing.

>>818485
Stop replying to bugguy, you might summon him

>>818485
Can you can it? I have decent amount and I was already planning to try canning some sauce this year.

>>818474
No, it is only to produce larger tomatoes. They ripen just fine.

>>818492
>Why not just put your gravel where you want (around it, maybe) and deal for awhile? As in, do you regret all this work and wonder the same thing?

Because once this is fenced in, a large stump would impede the wheel barrow. Not fun when the barrow is loaded.

>>818102
OP, if it's a hobby, then do it. If it's your way to make a living, then do the business plan, first. I raise a few goats, and a bunch of other animals for meat (mostly CSA, some restaurant and retail). There are TONS of people out there that will pay top dollar for good meat. You just need to find them and raise a quality product. Do it right and you;ll be psyched you did.

>>818128
Taking a life is tricky, no matter what. It just depends on who you are. All my animals are done at a slaughterhouse, but I still put a few down. I would do them all myself if it was legal (it is, but it's a hassle, and would be more expensive to my customers) because it would be my preference. But there's no enjoyment (well, mostly. IT's like crying at a happy part in a movie. I enjoy doing it because the animals deserves to go out with one shot while it's eating grass, not get loaded in a trailer and go to a slaughterhouse) in it.

>>818364
>>818372
I don't think carrots would get big enough by then. Bush beans probably, but I'm not sure of that. Beets maybe, but you;d have greens for sure.
I'd go with some greens, myself. You might get cukes, and maybe summer squash.

>>818495
I've never canned it. I only "can" with a hot water bath in mason jars, and I woudn't want to heat it up to that temp. If you have freezer space, I'm telling you, it freezes really well. Best without the cheez, but even with it's okay.

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My winter squash bed. I had to build a wall to keep them out of the soybeans. Cukes finishing up on left.

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>>818518
Pepper crop. Mostly "mild" hot peppers, a handful of big bullhorn types, a few small bells, and a couple really hot ones.

>>818517
>I don't think carrots would get big enough by then
Maybe, but they could just be "baby carrots" and the tops from those would be good too.

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>>818520
tomaotes. Most are sauce/paste types, but there's a few slicers, cherries, and some tomatilloes in there. Basket weave works well. just did a pretty massive pruning. second one.

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>>818522
Some of the broc getting ready.

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This is part of my deck garden. I'm trying to get the vines to make a canopy.

>>818168
Aphids, just spray them off with a brisk blast, but not too brisk

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>>818526
Garlic and taters.

>>818508
Thanks for your input, that surprised me and was quite on the opposite spectrum concerning raising and killing compared to what has been said on the thread. You said you prefer them to go out "while eating grass", so I wonder, do you have any specific gestures when you slaughter them yourself ? (by example, in what kind of moment, do you calm the animal, etc.). Also (and once again naive question), do you have any "rituals" when loading the trailer? (I don't mean magical summoning, more like ways of dealing with it)

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>>818530
Most of the garden.

>>818527
nice

>>818520
When do you think you're gonna be harvesting them?

>>818532
>do you have any specific gestures when you slaughter them yourself
Not really, just want them not to have any idea what's going on. I prefer them to not be nervous or upset. A bullet to the head while they're eating. Taking a chicken off the roost in the early hours of morning whiel it's still relaxed.

>do you have any "rituals" when loading the trailer
my animals will walk into the trailer on their own because I get them used to the trailers with grain. When it's time for me to take them, I put food in the trailer and in htey go. Sometimes I get a steer that I don;t want (would rather take a bigger one), but it's not a big deal.

>>817182
>1/2 kg
How many basil plants did you grow?

>>818538
>I'm in New Hampshire, and I tend to harvest right before the first frost. I alwyas forget when that is, but maybe mid October? I can get some color on some peppers, but many need to go into paper bags and sit for awhile before I can get a lot of color. I still make a LOT of green hot sauce.

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How are my Midwest bros going to deal with /heatdome/? Only getting low 90s here so I think my plants will manage but I'm curious what strategies you guys who hit triple digits use to keep things cool?

>>818540
Thanks for your reply. Your method of killing seems out of ordinary, do you know about other people doing the same, or in your neighbourhood it's more like "to each its own"?

>>818544
Great! I was asking because I don't have any fruits yet on mines (though I'm in 9a and I overwinter them, so I've got some more time)

>>818562
I've been under the impression that most people would do it this way of they could. Many I know can't, so they hire someone ot come and do it for them. But most bring their animals to a slaughterhouse because it's easy.

>>818558
I water plants

>>818497
Implying tomatoes mature when it's cold and no sun

>>818374
Is hunting and fishing more expensive the going to the store in europe?

>>818653
>implying Europe has anything to hunt or fish

well maybe fish, but the place has no wildlife

>>818660
......?

>>818653
yeah probably but I never did the math. Only fishing might be profitable in saltwater or large rivers since the licenses are cheap there.

>>818660
thats definitely wrong, I know some hunters and they need to decimate especially wild boars since they would otherwise destroy all the forests and fields. Obviously we dont have as much open land as NA, but deer and foxes are also abundant and even growing in population.

>>818530
Looks good!
Where do you live?

>>818727
NH

>>818639
hey if you planted your stuff late, or you have a short growing season, that is your problem.

Not only that but try fried green tomatoes.

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A bit out of the blue, but do any of you anons have any experience making/maintaining small automated greenhouse like systems (for instance the Personal Food Computer from MIT's open agriculture project)? It seems like the perfect thing for growing small scale plants in areas with ambient weather conditions not suitable to what you want to grow, seed starting, or for city dwellers with a dearth of earth to plant in.

Been thinking of trying to build one, but I have no idea if it's within my abilities to do so, and was hoping someone else might have tried it here and could give me a few pointers.

>>818517
>I only "can" with a hot water bath in mason jars

You can't do that with pesto, you'll be making jars of botulism if you do. You must pressure can. You can try pressure canning it but you may not like the results. Freezing is the preferred method for long term storage.

>>>/ck/

>>818653
>Implying hunting isn't more expensive everywhere

Why do you have to lie to yourself to justify your hobby?

>>818742
Never go full retard son

>>818783
Sorry to have offended you, but where I live we use double row covers, early-plant 2-month old tomato plants we started indoors, remove 1 row cover layer as it gets warm, remove the row covers completely when danger of frost is over, have a great season, put the row covers back on in the fall, put a second layer on when it gets even colder, and have a massive crop.

The growing season here is like May to September, but with row covers we extended it from as early as Feb and as late as November; all unheated.

The variety of tomato makes a large difference too. Cold hardy varieties do better for this than summer ones.

No one knows when your season ends or begins. No one knows what methods you are using. No one knows what varieties of tomatoes you are using (there's over a dozen or two of beefsteak, some are cold hardy and some not). Just asking "when do I butcher my flowers?" isn't a proper question. Try using google for such useless uninformative questions.

That answer is always, "never". Because new fruit on tomato plantsdo not affect lower fruit; only multiple fruit on a single truss affects other fruit on the same truss and you can always use green tomatoes in food and cooking in a variety of ways.

>>818812
>Missing the point in a 1000 words

>>818777
That was a question, not a statement or an implication. He obviously doesn't know. I don't see why it matters since that isn't farming and gardening.

>>818374
I don't water my lawn. I hunt, trap, and fish. I raise animals and have several vegetable gardens. I dehydrate, cool-store, water bath can, and pressure can a variety of meats & vegetables and various dishes like stews, soups, and stocks.

Only some gasoline to cut my lawn, ammo for hunting, electric for the water well pump, and chicken feed costs me money. The lawn clippings are composted into new soil for growing crops. I sometimes trade my vegetables and meats with family and friends for services or goods they grow/raise that I don't. The chicken eggs are so plentiful that I'm able to cover all costs by selling them and I still have enough eggs for myself.

For the ammo I use, it costs all of $1 per deer. The firearm, bow, traps, snares, and fishing equipment paid for themselves over 25 years ago. I rarely need to replace an arrow, the live traps never need replacing, the snares need replacing once every 8-10 years at most. I don't hunt, trap, and fish that much anymore. I mostly fish now. Farming provide most of what I need.

>>818817
You had no point. You don't know anything about tomatoes. When you were told correctly you started trolling defensively. Now you are angry. I suggest stepping away from the computer for a while.

>>818821
Why can't you explain how it's beneficial to grow tomatoes that will never ripened?

>>818845
That's already been covered. Learn to read.

>>818854
So you can't explain it can you friendo?

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>>818861
>>818845
>"green tomatoes are worthless" - Anonymous 2016

>>818653
Who said anything about hunting or fishing? I spoke of gardening.

>>818821
>i don't water my lawn...
You seem cool. No sarcasm.

>>818745
Where can I learn more?

>>818821
You are truly living the dream anon, keep it up.

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>>818845
To make green ketchup

>>818910
>Not being purple ketchup master race

>>818888
For the open agriculture project there's this site (http://openag.media.mit.edu/), and this github with instructions and software (https://github.com/OpenAgInitiative/gro-hardware)

There's also a few other designs floating around with a a few fewer sensors, for instance this (http://www.growmeg.org/build-your-own), and of course some more advanced contained hydroponic systems.

I hope that's enough to get you started, because that's about all I really know about it at the moment. Sorry I can't explain more thouroughly.

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>>818917
forgot pic

>>818935
Honestly that's grosser than the guy who collects his cum in bottles and posts annual updates on /b/

>>818872
>>818910
Mmmm yummy solanine

>>818954
You're confusing them for potatoes, doofus.

>>818957
Green/unripe tomatoes actually have a lot of it too

>>818960
Except that's just a common misconception. I'm pretty sure people wouldn't eat green tomatoes so often if they were poisonous.

>>818962
I dunno, it seems my (German) sources are different, claiming that solanine in tomatoes is often wrongfully labelled "tomatine" and that green ones contain 9-32 mg per 100g, so you should consume them only in small amounts, 100-150g already being toxic
And that tomatillos (different species) are sometimes mislabelled "green tomatoes" but are indeed untoxic
http://dgk.de/gesundheit/umwelt-gesundheit/informationen/nahrung/gruene-tomaten-und-gekeimte-kartoffeln-das-natuerliche-gift-solanin.html

>>818962
Truth,

While there is trace amounts of solanine, Tomatine is mostly what's found in tomatoes, and it is far less dangerous than solanine.

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So my work in the Bay Area has a couple raised beds and I inherited this one. I know jack shit about gardening, but I've been told the bed has two tomato plants, a basil plant, a pepper plant, and they think the vine is a cantaloupe. I have no idea what everything else is. Everything is surrounded by clover which is infested with these little red jumping bugs.

I'm at a loss at where to start. Should I remove all the clover?

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My melon has slowed growth even though it's been really warm here the last 2 days (high of 34C=93F today) and full sun. They got plenty of water, but only once per day, maybe I should've given them even more? Or maybe it's because a couple more fruits have appeared meanwhile so the growth is more distributed
Anyway, thunderstorms to be in the next few days and cooler, so let's see how that will work out

>>818971
I believe those are clover mites. You don't have to get rid of the clover, but a spritz of neem oil will get rid of the mites.

>>818981
There are a lot of mites, even underneath the clover, and they're on all the other plants. Additionally, the basil and pepper plant are starting to develop black discolorations on the leaves.

>>818978
Growth slows down slightly when the fruit sets. Be careful with the watering though, you don't want to drown them. Try sticking a full, upended water bottle with a hole in the lid into the soil near the base of the plant. Your cantaloupe will like the constant small trickle of water. And if it really gets bitchin' hot out like it's doing right now for me, a layer of mulch-such as straw-around the base of the plant will shade the roots and keep them cool and moist.

>>818983
Oh, wow. That's worse than I thought. I take back part of what I said: rip out the clover, and THEN nuke everything with neem.

>>818962
But people don't eat green tomatoes often. You just watch too many Julia Roberts movies you homo

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>>818988
Oh I don't have them potted but out in the garden (so roots should ideally be kinda deep and always have access to at least SOME water, plus it's definitely always dry again on top for hours before I re-water, so no drowning - it hasn't rained for 18 days here, and not properly for 26)
It's 8 (I think?) plants in total, the whole area is a sort of mess with vines growing all over the place, I can't even tell which vine belongs to which base, or where the bases exactly are without some investigating

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Fugggg, my corn is SJW corn. Look at the silks!

>>818996
Kek I expected some black intrusion somewhere (like fungus spots or so)

>>818996
One of my corn stalked is purple, the tassels are purple and the silks are purple. The leaves are green.

>>818992
Every person I know eats green tomatoes here. Fried green tomatoes are the go-to dish. People bring massive platters of them to events, parties, and meetings. I've had green tomatoes about 4 times this week. I also have tons of green tomato sauce pressure canned and sitting on my shelves. I use it in salsa and various sauces through the winters. I prefer it fresh though.

You're just being sheltered and missing out on some great food.

>>817520
>bush zucchini
Your own fault for believing that there was such a thing.

>>819054
Are those really unripe green tomatoes (that would otherwise go red if let to ripen longer on the plant), or are those cultivars that stay green even when ripe (such exist) or another nightshade family species often referred to as "green tomato", the tomatillo? BIG difference

>>818151
They don't grow into trees, they can't support their own weight after a certain point. There are definitely places where they can fill up an overhead trellis, though people usually pick plants for aesthetics rather than output in that situation.

Are green tomatoes a meme?

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Any of you guys build an earthtainer or a SIPs type system? I'm thinking of getting a rubbermaid tub and a couple of 8 gallon buckets from the homebrew store to make a few for next year.

>>816631
Off the top of my head a lot of medditeranean herbs like basil and rosemary are happier with less water than more "temperate" herbs like parsley or thyme.

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Something keeps digging up my watermelon so I've put this plastic cage on it
Fucking hell it's almost August
This is the third time!

>>819125
maybe you should keep it inside longer until its bigger and more resistant?

>>819132
I did for the first one and it was 30cm when I put it outside and an animal cut the vine

Hopefully this contraption keeps them out

>>819105
i was gonna schoop that so it said "tastykek" but i'm feeling rather poorly tonight and i'm not up for tinkering with anything. i'll save it to my desktop and see if i can get'r done tomorrow. check this space in a day or two.

>>819148
Build a fence, you barbarian. Pretend you're chinese and the animals are mongolians and buy a sex slave and have her/him build you a wall.

>>819155
I live on a ravine
Rabits go under the fence
Racoons climb over it
And squirrels are fucking everywhere

>>819158
C'est la guerre.

>>819158
Then build a wall to keep them out, and make the animals pay for it. Or set up automated turrets that shoot everything that moves, I mean there's plenty of potential solutions here. Geeze anon, do we have to think of everything for you?

>>819065
They are unripe tomatoes of any variety. Like you go out and harvest some beefsteak tomatoes or cherry tomatoes before they are ripe. Tomatillo are not the same thing, but I sometimes grow those too. They are great for salsa too.

>>819158
>Rabits go under the fence
Put a board down. Few things will go deeper than three feet, but make it four just to be sure.
>Racoons climb over it
Razor wire. Or an electric wire along the top. Or electrified razor wire, to be on the safe side.
>squirrels
Electrified razor wire will do pretty well against them, but you could also get a small rifle or shotgun and turn a pest into a resource. They're not bad in stew. This applies to rabbits as well, though raccoons should only be eaten if you need to for economic reasons, they don't taste good.

>>819150
>hoping for dank philadelphia meams

>>819187
>Razor wire. Or an electric wire along the top. Or electrified razor wire, to be on the safe side.
both are banned by my city's bylaws

>>819196
Then do an electric wire atop a wooden fence and use staples to keep it flush. Wood doesn't really conduct, so it'll work fine, but it'll be visually hidden from any tattle-tale neighbors.

>>819201
I think I'll just keep my plastic cage on top of my watermelon until its bigger.
It did fine last year after it got going

>>819187
>>819158
Use a fencing skirt. It extends out from the main fence and is laid flat on the ground. If something tries to dig, they just hit the fencing. This is what I use.

>>819209
It may solve one problem now, but a more thorough solution would solve it indefinitely for your whole garden.

>>819210
This should be in as a given, but doesn't handle squirrels and isn't a sure thing for raccoons.

>>816003
FYI, kickass torrents is dead at the moment. The "owner" was arrested. So, torrent links in the OP for that site won't work at the moment.

>>819216
No, but an electric fence does.

>>819196
>He obeys the law
Psht, get a load of this nerd.

NEW THREAD: >>819254
NEW THREAD: >>819254
NEW THREAD: >>819254

>>819257
>making a new thread when we're only on page 3
Why?

>>819106
Switch basil and thyme. Basil needs a good amount of water, much like parsley. Thyme is the only thing I've seen grow in the sand in my front yard better than in a pot of soil.

>>819281
>being this new

This is literally how its been done since thread 1.

>>819330
>it was done stupidly in thread one so we must do it stupidly forever
Why?

>>819239
He might not know about the cheap electric wire that's exist now is thinking about the Hollywood type.