Why aren't electric toy trains as popular as they used to be?

In the US at least, passenger rail has almost disappeared, and kids aren't likely to be interested in toy trains when they've never ridden on a train or even gone to meet passengers at a station. Watching a freight train go by through the window of your parent's car is much inspiring.

Video games.

>>1028136
This, train simulators ware way better

Also, I suspect a lot of it had to do with a relative working for the railways, but railways are no longer common

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>>1028130
$200 for a basic starter set. Steamers instead of fourth generation diesels. Lack of advertising. Seasonal sales at Christmas.

>>1028239
>Steamers instead of fourth generation diesels.

This. When are we gonna get Life-Like sets with cheapo AC44s and P42s?

>>1028130
>>>/toy/

>>1028131
This.

Also, the trains themselves are less appealing, I think. Locomotives are just blocky rectangles instead of steam monsters and sexy streamliners, rolling stock are all intermodal stacks of boring rectangles, and the wide variety of cool liveries from around the nation and the world are long gone. We may find them interesting, but we're adult fans who understand a lot more about them than the average kid does.

Also, I think a lot of us probably got into trains through our fathers, who were old enough to have been kids in the heyday of toy trains and maybe even remember seeing steam on the mainline. (That's certainly the case for me, as my dad was born in '47, and in an area with heavy rail activity.) Almost every kid born these days has parents who are far too young for that.

One more thing is that trains have always been expensive toys, and middle-class parents have less disposable income these days than they did in the glory days of toy trains.

>I'm not letting my kids play with that blue collar trash!
>here kids play with this doctors kit and space ship
>you must be those professions or you'll be poor forever :^)

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>>1028130
you could say the same about many hands on hobbies that had their heyday in the 50's and 60's - things like flying model aircraft, slot car racing, or building scale model kits. Two reasons i can think of - they all ask for a fair bit of technical finesse, time, and concentration, and the allure of technology that these things offered has been replaced by computers and gaming etc...

>>1028243
I got a MTH Amtrak superliner set pulled by a P42.

>>1028333
Good let em keep thinking that. The less they know about how much we really make the better. It's not doctor level but it's nowhere near poor forever

>>1028130
>Why aren't electric toy trains as popular as they used to be?

I'm not fully convinced that's true. It has peaks & troughs.

Here in the UK in the 90's we used to have a total of three manufacturers. Lima had gone bust. These days there's been three or four new manufacturers enter the market in the past two years alone. There is clearly a large enough market to support these companies; it may be there are fewer people, buying more stuff, but "Less popular" depends on how you measure it.

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>>1028130
My time to shine!

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>>1029027

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>>1029027
Cool. GG1s,2-8-4,ZW. All together.

Television, the internet, video games.

If those three weren't in my life I'd probably have some. I today find them interesting but it was maybe because my dad had a set and I remember having my "own" traction unit and 2 cars. Used to watch that shit run in circles for hours imagining scenarios.

Actually if I was rich I wouldn't think twice about acquiring my own set.

Indeed the costs are somewhat prohibitive.
A model of this costs AU$600.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0OW7nYTnMi4

>>1029822

The cost of everything in AUS is prohibitive

>>1028136

This.

>$20 on Steam for 100+ hours of highly engaging, interactive experience
>Hundreds for plastic shit that goes around a track

Come on son.

For me the appeal was always building the world around the train, and that requires investing time and effort over a long period to produce something that ultimately wouldn't get you any additional attention or reward, which is something modern kids just aren't into.

>>1028131
>>1028321
>implying
I still see shit loads of kids go crazy every time I go by on a train. School buses filled with children all waving at you, parents with toddlers that will pull over just to watch you go by, fathers with their sons waiting to catch a glimpse.

Kids still love trains.

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>>1030885
Built two different layouts before doing the permanent one. Got the Christmas layout up. I'll build the supermarket Saturday.

>>1028130
because trains themselves arent as popular as they used to be

New Christmas layout up.

https://youtu.be/49UXYQlDyA8

electric toy trains aren't really toys, they're a time consuming hobbyist project

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>>1031942
>Ithaqua got a new camera

>>1032003
Yep. Here's one with my late lamented Kodak.

https://youtu.be/UMdaPwV8Axw

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>>1028131
I grew up in a small town in Florida with a single rail line that's extremely quiet. There's not even any signals on it. For most of my life I did not see many trains at all unless I visited family in Chicago, but I've always been huge on trains and I don't even know why.

>>1028321
>Also, the trains themselves are less appealing, I think. Locomotives are just blocky rectangles instead of steam monsters and sexy streamliners,
I like the boxy look myself. It's all opinion I know but outside of incredibly fast trains like the TGV and Shinkansen, I didn't particularly understand the need for aggressive streamlined styling.

>rolling stock are all intermodal stacks of boring rectanglesf
When have railroad cars ever been much more than huge rolling rectangles and cylinders?


I will agree that it's always been an expensive hobby. I did it when I was younger and had a hard time affording it, but I had fun with my small layout. I've actually made a hobby out of going out and photographing trains, and to my surprise people have actually been buying printed copies from me. Pic related is one of my more successful shots this year.

>>1032423
great shot. some skill there.

Man, I had a blast playing with electric trains growing up. I still get excited watching them go around and around to this day. There's just something really fun about them that I can't put my finger on. Lionel Trains will always hold a very special place in my heart.

Sad to see the toy train industry on a decline. Fucking kids these days and their dumb little gadgets.

>>1032438
You still have companies like MTH and Williams making trains. Menards the hardware chain puts out rolling stock. Not dead yet.

>>1031942
Neat.

>>1028130
Seems like most types of "physical" toys are declining in popularity, especially amongst older children who would play with model trains.

Thomas the Tank Engine still generates interest even as real-life trains have become rare, but you'd be lucky to get further than that first toddler's wooden train set before your average kid is won over by Netflix and your iPad (or his iPad, which you only gave him so he'd leave yours alone).

Same deal with die-cast model cars, lego, and most of the other old childhood staples... only of interest to very young kids now, for about as long as the parents can keep them away from the electronics.

>>1035098
my 12 year old nephew is using his ipad to control his Lego robot and his model train layout

>>1035098

I think it's a matter that they need to get to grips with how they reach younger markets, the impression I get at the moment is they just don't know. I'd suggest two things:

Develop entry-level ranges that are as cheap as possible to get into the hobby with. The quality of the proper ranges is constantly going up, but then so is the price, can't see what bad introducing a sub-line but one that's easy to afford will do if it eventually gets new hobbyists into buying the proper stuff later on.

Also need to look at how you can integrate them more with the sort of technology that kids use now. App controlled system? I think both generations would enjoy the convenience of having an entire layout controllable from an iPad, trains, points, signals, everything. DCC especially is a natural fit with running everything off an app and a lot more convenient than the controllers.
but integrated with technology kids use now.

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>>1035249
DCC is common in HO. O has different systems because the companies don't see eye to eye. Lionel has had several systems while MTH has one. They are n ot compatible with each other. That's why I run on regular transformers.

>>1035256
>DCC is common in HO. O has different systems

Maybe in America. DCC is getting more common in O here in Europe.

>>1035113
His parents did something right, or maybe they're just lucky.

At Thanksgiving we were watching my 4 year old nephew use Netflix:
>Damn, he scrolls through the episodes so fast!
>Why wouldn't he? He can't read the fucking captions!

I don't think my sister intended for it to turn out that way, but it's the same struggle that parents have always had with TV... screens hold kids' attention better, so it's the easiest way to keep them occupied. Before long, it's all they want to do.

>>1035249
>Develop entry-level ranges
Seems like the way forward, if for no other reason than simplified sets would better suit the younger customers who still play with real toys.

>integrate them more with the sort of technology that kids use
This seems risky to me. It's too easy to make the jump entirely into software, or otherwise let the device itself become a distraction.

All those silly mobile games are developed with the help of behavioral psychologists now, to be as attention-grabbing and addictive as possible. Even adults get drawn in... kids don't stand a chance, and it's nearly impossible for conventional toys to compete for their attention when they have access to that stuff.

As much as I hate to sound like a luddite, I'm thinking more and more that young children should just be kept away from screens entirely, at least until about school age. We have our entire lives to waste staring at screens, why start so early?

>>1028130
Because they're completely gay and so are you.

>>1035280
O gauge two rail in Europe?

>>1035351
Of course. 3 rail died in the 60's, as it should have.

>Wife, kids, and myself move in with grandmother to take care of her in final years
>Find six boxes of electric trains in attic
>Memories come flooding back
>Twin sons age 2 obsessed with trains
>Watching grandpas old "six hours of trains!" VHS tapes
>Making notes of all the trains he had and setting up track

Quick tally has me at around 10k in trains. I bought some of the fancy ass new clicktrack and some cheap locomotives for $48 for track and $80 for engines, spent $40 on the throttle.

Fun as hell. Was talking with the guy at the local hobby shop about getting some repaired. As he was putting my name down he said
>Wait, are you Ken's grandson?

Fucking feels man.

Also, more people own flats rather than full houses now so often feel they don't have the space for anything.

>>1035314

I'm not sure bigger companies would adopt it given their size and concern if they develop a good entry-level range people will use it to substitute a lot to save money where they could have things from the more experience main ranges.

Hornby do entry level sets and a couple of expansion items, but it's just a bit expensive, bit shit, half-arsed and uninspiring. Their thinking feels a bit like 'it's bright coloured plastic or Thomas the Tank, that'll do, kids like that right?'. Totally misses the market for older children, teens and young adults. Bachmann aren't much better either. A brightly coloured plastic lump steam loco on a OO gauge circle or small oval just doesn't do it any more.

I think you'd have to start it as a standalone brand, probably take crowdfunding or something to get it off the ground but it'd sell better than the alternatives. For starters I'd do it in n gauge so you could have bigger layouts with more going on in them. Make the rolling stock basic, cheap and easily made but more interesting and modern ones you see regularly irl.

Develop a cheap track system that's like Kato and as convenient but much cheaper to make and sell. Make sure all the starter sets have sidings or passing loops and put the focus as well on being double-track rather than just a single track oval so it's clear it's expandable and meant to be added to and have more going on. Then you can chuck in other bits like clip-on platforms, tunnels, bridges, loading cranes for containers and signals etc.

>>1035480
>Develop a cheap track system that's like Kato and as convenient but much cheaper to make and sell. Make sure all the starter sets have sidings or passing loops and put the focus as well on being double-track rather than just a single track oval so it's clear it's expandable and meant to be added to and have more going on. Then you can chuck in other bits like clip-on platforms, tunnels, bridges, loading cranes for containers and signals etc.

Um ... have you ever typed 'plarail advance' into Youtube?

>>1035449
10/10 cool story bro. When you say >10k in trains, do you mean that's what you've inherited or that's about what you've spent now?

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Because trains as an interest is seen as only an autistic thing in the eyes of the public.

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>>1035256
2-rail O is DCC everywhere.

Lionel has three systems--and the first two (Trainmaster CC and Legacy could be considered to be one since the latter is merely an expansion of it's predecessor, with additional command codes not accessible under the older system).

Lionel's newest 'system' (LionChief/LionChief+)is essentially 2GHz radio control for mid-range starter sets and separate-sale mid-range locomotives. The "+" denotes an ability to run conventionally without the dedicated remote (limited to separate-sale locos). While LC/LC+ will run independently on any command layout, there are no plans to make it controllable with anything other than LionChief remotes.

MTH's DCS is it's own system. Second-generation units (Protosound 3) include DCC receivers integrated into the electronics and can run on either system out-of-the-box just by flipping a switch. Every MTH loco, from starter set units to finescale is equipped with this system.

(some MTH diesel locomotives are also available as 2-rail or 3-rail with trucks equipped to accommodate separate-sale 2-rail finescale wheelsets. MTH European units are similarly convertible, but is mostly 2-rail with a small number made in 3-rail for the US market.)

"incompatible" implies (to the uninitiated) that the two systems cannot co-exist. DCS and Legacy/TMCC can operate in tandem on the same layout (photo), and DCS can operate a Lionel control box to control their equipment with the functions common to TMCC and Legacy.

Both platforms now have WiFi/smart-device control options that will eventually allow operating both systems' functions from either platform. (except LionChief/LionChief+)

>>1035314

My kid gets bored watching TV so I guess I am lucky in that sense.

We have the advantage of being in a house on the beach between a pair of other beaches with small islands all around within swimming distance and all our neighbors have medium sized properties with lots of vegetation. Tropical environment so outside is always inviting.

All he has to do is see a crab on TV then he wants to go find real crabs. I had a pretty good imagination when I was young despite my father having everything techy as he was in the comms business.

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Decided this afternoon to throw together an Inglenook style track. So far pretty shit but will see how far I can get after work tomorrow.

https://youtu.be/Bf5y4m81OFY

>>1035113
That kid gets it! :thumbup:

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>>1028130
In around 1986 the MR club I belonged to was invited to set up a display at a money management show that showcased investment opportunities.

Curious as to why we were invited to something like that, it turns out they couldn't fill all the exhibitor spots so they looked at what was then (still is???) the most popular hobbies in terms of dollars spent world-wide.

#1 stamps
#2 model trains
#3 coin collecting

Surprised us (but with todays prices totaly believable heh). But the neat thing were all the suit types that loitered around the displays and portable layouts with HO, S, O gauge, and classic Lionel. Due to their ages the Lionel was most popular. Many of the suits would wait until no one was around to ask if ..uh.. if someone still had a box full in the attic..you know.. how much would it be worth. kek! Or do people still run them or where to buy more. Lots of closet model railroaders out there.

In my community model railroaders are lone wolves who do their own thing.. no clubs & very little fraternizing. Which sucks as I don't have much room and miss having a large club layout to operate on. I really should just put up a shelf layout along a wall I have that's about 15 ft long. Having a brass passenger set and a pair of my favourite locos stashed away in my "toy box" isn't really fun at all.

>>1038141
Yeah, you live in a beautiful environment. Why would a kid go outside when there's only shitty suburb houses or kilometers of apartment blocks outside? The only exciting thing outside in the city I've ever done as a kid was breaking into construction sites. Of course a screen is magical.
Honestly, having a kid that plays video games or watches TV isn't that bad. Just make sure he plays some kind of sport, preferably outside, and make him take the bike to school (if possible).

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Continuation from the other thread

>>1039471
My best friend is going to pick up a several thousand dollar 3d printer. I am unfamiliar with the whole thing but we will custom make all of the cars for the line. The only new trains I have (by that I mean not from my grandfathers 20-40 year old connection seen in other thread) is two 40 dollar santa fe diesels and a cheapo small smoking steam engine. I am going to pick up a sound yard switcher in the next week or two for the shunting puzzle.

Update on shunting puzzle, having issues getting the cars to stay hooked up to the engine when taking the sharp corner when exiting the switch. Think the coupler on the loco is too close to the body to allow proper function. Unsure how to go about fixing this.

>>1039506
Your track radius for the switches look wide enough. Go to a HO forum like Model Railroader. They might help.

>>1039506
Looking good, is that a Family Lines switcher on the layout too? Modeltrainstuff.com probably has the best prices for HO and you can pick-up some decent DCC-equipped HO locomotives for less than $60 per unit.

>>1039510
From what I can tell I need to oil/graphite the wheel set rotation mechanism. I think it is causing issues. My new locos do not have issues (the sante fe) although the turn should be too tight (12in radius).

>>1039512
I know there are cheaper online, but I have been buying local because I like having a bunch of experts close at hand. Usually they can get within 15-20 of online prices. Fun because the old guys there knew my grandpa better than me so when I take them old locos they recognise them. I am not home but will confirm what is written on it later.

I think a lot of issues will go away when I switch to the knuckle style couplers instead of the T. Might modify the loco to get a better range of motion on the coupler.

My knowledge is limited. Ths is my 4th day of doing anything model train related since I played with track when I was five 20 years ago. Few weeks ago bought some of the easy click together track and things kind of went from there.

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>>1039512

Can confirm that it is a family lines system. Any significance to this? I always loved the grey and the metal rails. Ideally this would be the switcher I would use.

I found an old chesapeake bay diesel loco that has the coupler as part of the wheels. This gives it a much greater range of motion and the cars do not derail as it leaves the switch around the corner. Unfortunately it 'pops' as it drives. I cleaned the wheels but the problem still exists. Need to figure out the cause here.

>>1039506
That's a great pic, btw. :^)

I'm assuming you're using horn-hook couplers as Kaydees too short tend to derail the freight cars based on my experience. There may be a coupler height issue? Unfortunately I don't know anyone using h-h's so I am not sure if you can extend the coupler boxes further.

>>1028130
Prices.
Video games.
Short attention span.
Single mothers.

>>1040139

I am over in the general thread now, more pictures there. Currently using the horn-hook because all of my cars are that way. They are also too short for part of it depending on the engine. I just bought some of the long kaydees and some new cars that are shorter (iron ore cars) so we will see how that works out. I have some old engines with the coupler built into the wheel sets, those work great on this setup. But they have broken gears so I will need to get some 3d manufactured to use them.

>>1040578
>single mothers

Not an argument.

I am really considering buying this set to re-experience my youth.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004NHEQWY/ref=as_li_tl?ie=UTF8&tag=marketorder-20&camp=1789&creative=9325&linkCode=as2&creativeASIN=B004NHEQWY&linkId=1bca49fff3c3ed892569a232e729ec9b

>>1035098
I'm going to blogpsot but whatever.

I grew up having Thomas the Tank Engine toys, which over the years progressed into LEGOs, RC cars, and an electric train set. I had vidya too but it was always secondary to these things in addition to playing outside and riding my bike.

The Xbox 360 came out when I started high school and I got a personal computer and a cellphone by then too. This was the point when technology, vidya, and the internet took over my life. A decade later and my life is still dominated by computers.

>>1035113
A rare breed of kid, he was raised well.

>>1043203
Not an argument?

Do you know how expensive those O Gauge trains are?

https://youtu.be/GU2YDGBUR6s

>>1043239

This. I am a mid-middle class buyfag with very little expenses and starting out O or G from scratch seems nearly impossible. Cheapest o or g they have at my local hobby shop is 500 for a locomotive

>>1028131
I loved trains from a young age, and I never lived close to any rail lines. Seeing a train was a rare and special occurrence for me.

>>1028130
takes up way too much space

>>1043203
>Acknowledging the unfortunate realities of a family situation are an attack on my lifestyle
What are you, a single mom?

While I wouldn't use "single parent household" to describe the later half of my childhood, there was definitely a noticeable financial impact after my parents split up. Even with both parents still in my life, their two incomes were then running two households instead of one- so there was a lot less disposable income to go around. I wasn't into model trains so much, but nicer stuff like that (large-ish lego/k'nex sets in my case) were pretty much out of the question after the divorce happened.

Not that I'm complaining about my circumstances, specifically- but I can definitely see model trains being less popular in single parent homes. Along with the cost issue, there's likely not as much space at home, less access to tools and materials to build with... the list goes on.

Of course there are exceptions, but I saw the same patterns in most of my friends growing up... those whose parents stayed together could more expensive hobbies (including the one friend who had a couple model trains).

>>1043791
Lionel's 027 tracks were made for small homes and apartments. You can put up an oval at Christmas around the tree or screw the tracks on plywood and store it in a closet.

Because every fucking 8 year old has an iPad now.

>>1038355
>
Middletown New Jersey.

HOLD THE FUCK UP.

I'm from there.

Mater Dei HS

>>1028130
I'd give away my ho scale train set that I got yeas ago, I dont have the ime to use anymore and it just collects dust in the storage unit...

>>1036877
I honestly don't see why that would be the case. People act like tards over their cars and trucks so why not about trains? A train is more powerful and tows far more than any lifted brotruck too but I never see engineers bragging about their loads like truckers brag about pulling a really big trailer.

>>1032438
I'm not actually sure it is in decline...

It's always been a pretty niche market, but it's still developing and diversifying. Things are still happening! It takes a pretty large organization to put out some kinds of standardized locos, but there's some really cool stuff going down with the advent of stuff like ShapeWays. I recently got a powered commuter car for about $40 that you just flat out cannot buy from any of the major manufacturers by getting the car shell from a specialty shop on shapeways and mounting it an a Tomix chassis. Cool new things are happening, just not through the traditional avenues, and it's making it possible to do all sorts of cool new things, and while a lot of it is still pretty expensive, it does seem like those new options are making some things cheaper.

And as for the future of the hobby in general, I think there's definitely enough kids who are in to trains to keep the trains running into the next generation...

>>1035319
Someone's just mad because they can't afford the new MicroTrains Weyerhaeuser Logging Train Set with the EMD SW1500 switcher.

>>1045946
>I recently got a powered commuter car for about $40 that you just flat out cannot buy from any of the major manufacturers by getting the car shell from a specialty shop on shapeways and mounting it an a Tomix chassis

Pix pls.

>MicroTrains Weyerhaeuser Logging Train Set with the EMD SW1500 switcher.

I really do want this set along with one of those WP SW1500s they are planning. I've never pre-ordered anything before though, do they bill you immediately or only after the set comes out? I don't have that kind of cash if it's automatically processed.

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Kids play with this for hours a day.

>>1045975
>hours
more like 15-20 minutes tops.

>>1045997

Not an exaggerartion. When they get up from naps at 5 they play/fight over the trains for a half hour til dinner, then play/fight with the trains until 730. One of them when he wakes up in the morn always says chu-chu and will play with it for two hours before he considers the world around him.

Absolute train autists.