I've heard it mentioned off-hand in several books that North

Think of all the centers of art and trade in Italy during the city-states period
Genoa
Venice
Florence
Milan
Bologna
Verona
Rome

Where are they all located.

>>2866449
>had

Nigger, the divide is very real and still exists. Northern Italians see southerners as little better than niggers, there's a reason a part based on the idea of the North separating from the south is so powerful and well-supported there.

>>2866449
Can confirm. I was in Italy and northeners say that Italy's southern border is Bologna. Everything south of it is Africa.

>>2866473
>>2866653
Any academic writing on this subject (in English) to recommend? Also what was the north-led Kingdom's policy towards the south in 1866-1945 economically and socially?

>>2866708
what in particular do you want to know about?

>>2866720
How the south was treated economically and how its people were viewed in the north.

>>2866746
>were

You keep using the past tense, the divide is still very real. Go ask literally any Italian, try the /ita/ thread on >>>/int/

>>2866746
in the 20th century or since unification?

>>2866774
I'm more interested in the historical context than the modern one.

>>2866777
Both, but preferably pre-WW2.

>>2866783
off the top of my head denis mack-smiths book on Sicily since 1715. i'll find others for you tomorrow if you can hold out

>>2866821
Got all the time in the world. Thanks anon.

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Milanese here.

>>2866472

This information is not completely accurate: some of the most flourishing cities were in the Neapolitan coast
>Naples
>Amalfi

While Sicily at the time was a very important cultural, artistic center, as well as an economically flourishing city.

>Palermo was for some time, under Frederick II, the capital of the Holy Roman Empire

>>2866449

Southern Italy started declining little before the unification of Italy, under the Borbonic rule, when it completely missed the industrial revolution train. Although in 1839 the first Italian peninsula railroad was opened in the South, to connect Naples to Portici, industrial revolution in the South never happened.

In 1861, after the unification of Italy, you would see three highly industrialised regions:
>Torino in Piemonte
>Milan and surroundings in Lombardy
>Genoa in Liguria

You would also have some city living off beautiful decadence, like Rome, Florence and Venice.

The rest of the country used to live in poverty; notably, the North East (Veneto and Friuli), the islands, and the South

>>2866879
Veneto was poor?

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>>2866774

Again, still the Milanese guy.

No northern Italian, unless maybe some uneducated "North League" voting twat would unironically call Southern Italians Africans or ("terroni", meaning basically rednecks, land workers) nowadays.
Still, I admit that the Southeners still have a feeling of inferiority when meeting especially the Milanese, as many still picture us as hard-working, cold-hearted, rich snobs who can't enjoy life and who look down on them.

pic unrelated

>>2866884

Since the 50s and the 60s Veneto was home of one of the greatest economic booms of the world, and it is now one of the richest regions along with Lombardy and Piemonte. However, since the fall in disgrace of Venice, Veneto got poorer and poorer every year.

A huge percentage of the Italian emigration of the 1910s and the 1920s came from Veneto, and, in the North of Italy, probably 90% of emigrants came from the North-East (Veneto and Friuli).

Basically Venice was doomed the moment in which the Vasco de Gama reached India, or when Columbus reached the Amercias. That didn't prevent them from beautiful decadence, living off past glory and tourism (toursits were flocking to Venice since the 19th century). However, by the 19th Century, the Most Serene Republic of Venice, was a broke State, its people emigrating to the Americas and Norhtern Europe, fell under control of the Austrians without much fuss, and the Austrian preferred to invest on the port city of Trieste (Trst) instead of anything in Veneto.

>>2866449
>economically exploiting the region like a colony
I wouldn't call wasting billions in infrastructures and financial stimuli "exploiting the region like a colony". The south is shit because their leaders are cancerously wasteful, lazy and corrupt, and the populace is no better.

>>2866884
Veneto was basically destroyed by the austrians, half on purpose (nationalizations of profitable banks and insurance companies and redirection of sea trade from Venice to Trieste) and half due to oppressive and incompetent government. Then came the Savoia who basically refused to develop any regions outside of their own heartlands and taxed the everliving shit out of everything and everyone. Then came the great war, which was basically fought at Veneto's borders on the italian front.
It's actually quite remarkable how outstanding the venetian economic miracle was in the 60s. They didn't have any particular help or advantage, yet they still managed to outdo everyone else save Emilia Romagna.

>>2866915
>Basically Venice was doomed the moment in which the Vasco de Gama reached India, or when Columbus reached the Amercias.
Outdated as fuck view. Venice was actually still quite wealthy even with the americas taking trade away from the Med. Venice was still an extremely active port all the way to Campoformio.
>However, by the 19th Century, the Most Serene Republic of Venice, was a broke State,
Wrong. They were just a local power who couldn't compete with the outright world powers that bordered it.
>its people emigrating to the Americas and Norhtern Europe
That only started towards the end of the 19th century, due to the austrian and italian mismanagement.
>fell under control of the Austrians without much fuss
They fell to Napoleon actually, kinda hard to blame them for getting rekt the same as the rest of the continent.
>and the Austrian preferred to invest on the port city of Trieste (Trst) instead of anything in Veneto.
Because Venice was considered (not unfairly) a constant rebellion risk and it was seen a better decision to favour a loyal port instead. Also Napoleon burning down a lot of the city's port and shipyard infrastructures.

>>2867001

>due to the austrian and italian mismanagement

Veneto nationalists are the worst. They are absurdely convinced that if Venice stayed independent (which, by the way, was impossible) they'd be KANGZ.

Reality is that they stopped counting anything from the 17th century, and by Napoleon's time, it was already an undefendable poor land. Italian irredentism at least made it fall under Italian control instead of foreign German/Austrian domination

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>>2866839
back OP
well this survey is useful
http://libgen.io/book/index.php?md5=7825D5B9AB5AE2A00C7DC3CF1AFEEBB9
the following pictures are from the annotated bibliographies of this book

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>>2868760

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>>2868764

>>2866893
What are typical Milanese phenotypes? Would you say Northerners have lighter features and hair?

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>>2868767
last pic here

>>2868774
most people in milan are terroni, so subsaharian phenotype

>>2868774
Northerners are a bunch of godless fems they can call us nigger all they want , but all the crime and corruption comes from the north and the island

>>2868774
>What are typical Milanese phenotypes?

Literally the fucking same. There's very little actual genetic variation between the south and north. It's less than the difference between north and south Germans.

>>2868774
a shit ton of southerners migrated to northern cities after world war ii and assimilated (though not without many years of persecution from northerners). ironically these assimilated people came to adopt the prejudices of the northerners and began to look down on the southerners as though they hadn't once been southerners themselves.

>>2868787
Gotta say buddy. Based on the Sicilians and Neapolitans you sent to America and the resulting beachnigger bastards thay spawned from them, I dont have a very favorable opinion of Southerners.

>>2868829
Italian-Americans, being almost entirely of Neapolitan and Sicilian descent, are one of the highest achieving ethnic groups in the USA and have average incomes significantly higher than the average "white". Like the Jews and Chinese, despite their initially shitty treatment.

>>2868841
And yet I have never met a cruder, trashy, more intolerant, racist, ignorant group of whites. Take this from someone who lives in Guinealand who gets along with Polish skinheads.

>>2868866
i don't think that's most italian americans though. that's just the most vocal group which also gets a lot of media attention (especially after it was popularized on jersey shore). there are plenty of poor trashy whites of different ethnic roots but they're not as reported on or visible because they don't live in major urban centers as the italians do (this is all speculative)

>>2868866
Half my family is Italian-American (paternal grandparents side came from Sicily as kids around WW2) and I lived in this city's Little Italy for a while. Haven't seen this.

>>2868906
Mostly the tradesmen types, subcontractors and the like, construction foremen, union workers. They're a lot more prevalent where I live. I've had bottles and racial slurs thrown at me from trucks driving by more than once. Most of the ones I met from middle school haven't accomplished much with their lives and will likely live the lives of their fathers.

>>2866839
Another anon here. Lucy Riall has written a few good books on the beginning of the north/south divide. I suggest you check her out.

>>2868928
Where do you live?

Could be that my city is just very nice in general. Coincidentally my grandpa also worked in construction for a while, though for most of his life he was a manager at a resturaunt where my dad also worked for most of his childhood.

>>2868802
Can't talk from a scientific viewpoint but in my personal experience northeners are nothing like southern italians both phenotypically and culture wise.

>>2868774
>What are typical Milanese phenotypes?
Straight dark hair and slanty eyes, or alternatively curly hair, thick lips and dark skin.