Christmas Gift-bringers in Europe

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>>1978297
False. The historical giftgiver is a man dressed as a goat, specifically a furred man with a goat's head.

>>1978297
That diversity in former Yugoslavia is pretty funny.

Finnish autism claims another victim. No one is safe.

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>Holland
>Christmas man

In Romania we have both Saint Nicholas and Old Man Christmas as gift bringers.

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>>1978297
fixed

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>>1978297
Not that surprising, the Yule goat was a thing in Sweden as well even if it have pretty much died out.

>>1978322
>Holland
Netherlands

>>1978312
That's Krampus right?

>>1978297
>Christmas lads
What the fuck?

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>>1978358

The correct one is Saint Basil, since saint Nicholas doesn't have any relation to that gift giving tradition. But anyways, live it to the Catholics to put paganism in Christianity through the back door, and for Protestants to make Coca Cola commercials out of it.

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>>1978358
Nah. Concept art for the Finnish film Rare Exports.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RQlikX4vvw

>>1978297
As far as im aware Finland tends to have some hickups to old european words in their language. For example kuningas is an old germanish loan word they still use for king. I think there was a bunch of goat like santa claus clones in europe back then and most of them had goat horns so its probably one of those kind of leftovers.

>>1978368
WTF that picture

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>>1978371
The name comes from St. Knut (Nuuttipukki), it's a Swedish tradition originally. Christmas itself is as well. Kekri is the original Finnish celebration, but as it was tied to agriculture it's pretty much disappeared by now.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kekri_(fest)

>>1978375
It's Santa Claus.

>>1978355
>yule goat

Any relation to Amalthea? Are goats regarded as symbols of plenty in european tradition?

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>>1978297
>Christmas lads
do their gifts consist of cans of beer, packs of durries and rolls of condoms?

>>1978368
wtf I love Finland now

>>1978297
>Ireland
>Father Christmas
We just call him Santa. Or Santy.

The only people I've ever heard say "father Christmas" are English people on TV.

Also
>Christmas lads

>>1978297
Doesn't Santa come before Christmas in Finland? Like in Central Europe where December 6 is Santa day but on Christmas baby Jesus brings the presents (which is hilarious to picture).

>>1978405
On the 24th.

>>1978404
No one in Ireland calls him Father Christmas, it's been Santa Claus/Santy for as long as I've known
Unless it's a south Dublin thing
>tfw it's not Christmas lads

>>1978383
Not that I know of.

>>1978297
In Serbia it's either Grandfather Frost (Deda Mraz), but Christmas Bro is also used (Bozic Bata)

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>>1978297
Wrong

Here in Spain the children wait Three Wise Men.


Los tres reyes magos.

You got Spain wrong, we have 3 different giftbringers, the three wise men in Castile, the cagatio in Catalonia and the olentxero in the basque provinces

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>>1978297

In Spain the Three Wise Men are very important, on the night before January 6.


Pic:

In Catalonia, on Christmas Eve, they have the Tió de Nadal (Christmas log). It is probably related to the Yule Log. Kids hit it with a stick, and it "shits" gifts.

Traditionally, the log is put to burn before starting to hit it (it has to be in flames to give gifts), but this is becoming less common due to people living in cities and not having a fireplace in the house.

>>1978473

It is not the "cagatio". It is just the "Tió" (which means "log"), or Tió de Nadal (christmas log).

"Caga Tió" is what you sing to it during the "ritual". It is an order, a command, which means "Poop, log!"

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>>1978486
Still not as weird as a coal digger that turns his coal into gifts for kids one night a year.

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>>1978297
>Christ child (baby Jesus)
The Christkind is not Jesus.
Wtf.

>>1978504

Is he a tricky metaphor for a coalburner cheater?

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>>1978297
>Iceland
>Christmas Lads

>>1978322
>sinterklaas
>kerstmis
20 days too early, fag.

>>1978364
>hollander being hollandcentric again

>>1978297
>that Poolish influence in Ukraine

>>1978467
Is Jesus okay?

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>>1978297
Not really Europe, but here in the Philippines, before the Americuckening, the traditional gift givers were the Tres Reyes (Three Kings). The three magi who visited babby Jesus and gave him gifts.

That said, in the Philippines, they still have their special holiday a few weeks after christmas, and the traditional depiction of them are 3 dudes - one black, one white, and one red & or Asian dude- riding on horses, wearing crowns. They were meant to symbolize the kings of the earth bowing down to Jesus, or something. They ride around town in a parade and hand candy to children.

>>1978297
It's father winter in Albanian though, not father Christmas.

denmark also use gnomes

>Poland
>St. Nicolas
St. Nicholas comes on 6th December. Christmas is domain of Little Angel/Starman/Baby Jesus

After reading this thread, we can safely conclude that that entire fucking map is wrong

>>1978528
sinterklaas is the original winter gift giving holiday here in holland retardo

>>1978551
im from overijssel

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>>1978620
>Starman
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRcPA7Fzebw

>>1978620
haha, waht?

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>>1978355
We still put out the jul goat but it isn't the one giving presents anymore.

>People bet on how fast this will get torched.

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>>1979019
Every year they put it more shit to make it less flammable.

Most people have a few of these around the house, gotta represent Tor.

>>1978404
>>1978422
It's in reference to Daidí na Nollag most likely.

>>1978405
In the evening of the Christmas eve. Often he actually stops to talk with the children for a while.

>>1978364
Based Holland.

>>1978467
Technically not in christmas (25th december).

>>1978486
This, only filthy charnegos say cagatió like it's the proper name. And not even all of them.

>>1978520
No because nobody fucks in basqueland.

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>>1978297
>>1978620>>1978862
>>1978659

In Poland it's far more complicated. Pic related.

>>1978576
>one red

What the fuck pinoys

>>1978342
Sinterklaas (saint Nicholas) is on the fifth of December (also my birthday but that's purely coincidental), the Netherlands essentially didn't have a tradition of a gift giver around Christmas as Sinterklaas was already doing that stuff three weeks before Christmas, but in the last decades we are also introducing Santa Claus here

>>1979019
Isn't that a Swedish tradition, not Finnish?

>>1979093
Are Star-man and Little Baby Jesus connected with the Kashubian and Silesian communities, respectively?

>>1979111
They are definitely parts of regional traditions.

Starman is as much linked with Greater Poland as with Pomeranian groups like Kashubians and Kociewians. Baby Jesus is from formerly-German part of Silesia, while Little Angel is from formerly Austrian part of Silesia.

>>1979093
lol, pagan "star-man" still alive in Greater Poland and corridor

>>1978297
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yule_Goat
Somehow this fused with Saint Nick

>>1979108
>, the Netherlands essentially didn't have a tradition of a gift giver around Christmas as Sinterklaas was already doing that stuff three weeks before Christmas

that makes sinterklaas our traditional wintertime gift giver. Most central europeans don't celebrate their gift givers on the 25. This map is not really about christmas, but about wintertime/solstice gift giving.

Christmas is traditionaly a foreign concept to holland too.

>>1978297
>Christmas Man

Why are Germans so literal and unimaginative?

>>1979019
>>1979023
I love the yule goat, but I don't get why they don't update the tradition to _include_ the burning of it.

It's a spectacular finish, it's symbolic, and everybody wins. They could set an official burn time of Dec. 26 or something.

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Fucking Metal

>>1978297
Not true
t. fingol

>>1978297
>Christmas lads

>>1978422
>>1979041
>>1978404
I think it has less to do with what you call him, and more to do with the folkloric grouping.

>>1979108
He has his helper, Nigger Pete, too, right?

>>1978508
It absolutely is.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christkind

>>1979110
Yes.

I responded to someone talking about the yule goat being a swedish tradition that has died out in sweden by saying that we still have it as a tradition just not as the same role.

>>1979251
Well every other god damn holiday in Sweden has a flame to celebrate so why not.

>>1978297
In Spain the giftbringers are the three magic kings.

I demand to know what the Christmas lads are

>>1979869
Basically like 10 santas.

Tragically it's not a bunch of British teenagers giving cans and Nandos to the good children.

>>1979876
i kekd

>>1978364
>dutch people do not care
hollanders do not care

>>1978297
yule lads a best

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>>1978389
they're homeless troll people who will steal your shit over several days if you don't perform certain tasks.

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In the Netherlands, the Bishop of Turkey (who lives in Spain) shows up with 6-8 black men (used to be his slaves, now just "good friends" and "it's not a racist tradition") who beat the hell out of kids. (if the child is young, they just beat them with switches instead)

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>>1980270
dude what

>>1980272
Okay basically Sinterklaas is derived from St. Nichola, a Turkish bishop from around 900-1000 who's relics were moved to a place in Southern Italy that eventually became part of the Kingdom of Aragon in Spain until the 1700s. Thus, Turkish bishop from Spain.

His helpers were originally depicted as Moors, but later this changed to Africans, representing devils that Sinterklaas had enslaved and used to beat up naughty children. Extremely bad children are stuffed into sacks and carried off to Spain. In the late 1800s to 1950s this changed (like attitudes of the time) to Sinterklaas rescuing some African children from a evil "Emperor of Babylon" and they became his charges.

Also he arrives in the Netherlands via steam ship, no sleigh or reindeer.

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Finland is the gift that geeps on gibbin :DDDD

>>1978576
We do the same in Spain, senpai. I'm pretty sure you adopted that festival because of us.

>>1980270
I'm not even dutch but for some reason those assholes who want to ban Zwarte Piet piss me off endlessly. Americans used to have minstrel shows where white men in blackface made fun of niggers, and somehow, the Dutch now need to feel guilty about that and do away with this tradition even though it has nothing to do with slavery or Jim Crow. Talk about cultural imperialism.

>>1980596
Actually minstrelsy lasted longer in Europe than in the US.

>>1978528
except Santaclaus is literally the coca-cola version of Sinterklaas

>>1978297
>>>/int/

>>1980952
also "Santa Claus" is the bastardization of "Sinterklaas" because anglos can't into pronunciation

Will the Swedes manage to burn gavle goat this year?

>>1981000
The one in Iceland got burnt last week, so the gauntlet has been cast.

>>1981010
Heh, yea. I'm watching the video right now. They threw a damn molotov at it, haha.

>>1978339
Also had Old Man Frost during communist times.

>>1980496
>turkish
>10th century

Saint Nicholas also called Nikolaos of Myra, was a historic 4th-century Christian saint and Greek Bishop of Myra, in Asia

>>1980540
Yeap. Now that you mention it, the OP Map is wrong in terms of Spain.

>>1980496
>a Turkish bishop from around 900-1000
triggered

>>1978405
5th or 6th is st. Nicolaus day. Mostly 6th in germany and 5th in austria i think.

>>1978646
>im from overijssel
>provinciaaltjes

>>1978576
This sort of exists in my country too. They go door to door and collect donations for charity.
>Tfw small children in blackface

>>1980496

And has a staff and rides a white horse, which is what Wodan used to do

>>1981999
That's basically Rome's modus operandi of spreading the faith desu

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>>1979390
>He has his helper, Nigger Pete, too, right?
Yes, straight from Africa. You can tell by the earrings, hair and big lips as well as the Moorish slave costume.
Originally it might have been something else.

>>1982052
SOEWARTE PETE IES RASIESTISCH

>>1982020

It really follows the textbook formula of a European tradition, a pagan festivity, which was then Christianized, that remains now in a more secular form.

I wonder if the Muslims will one day celebrate the arrival of Saynn al-Qulaaz

>>1982094
What you described is a Western path and Muslims within a Western society won't celebrate native Muslim celebrations in a secular fashion. Same goes for Muslims in Muslim cultures. The Muslim world seem to lack the critical self awareness that allowed the Europeans to end up with secular celebrations. Maybe if the ba'athists remained in power long enough would they have done this.

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>>1978297
Santa doesn't bring gifts in the Netherlands, Sinterklaas does

>>1981997
What country, famfam

>>1978297
Belgium and Netherlands don't have someone bring gifts on christmas, it's more a family feats where people give gifts to eachother.

>>1978297
>Muslim countries
>Christmas
What the fuck?

>>1982158
sinterklaas brings gifts on the 6 of december on christmas it's mainly this
>>1982187

>>1982191
>turkey is and always was completly muslim
conquored lands tend to have some remrants of the people that used to live there

>>1982052
the traddition of black pete (zwarte piet) is older then black slavery in the west. He looks black because he has coal and ash on his face from going through the chimney, his hair is also curly because it's burnt.
Black pete and saint nicholas are christian version of wodan and his shadow.

>>1978646
>North of the rivers
You are Holland, unless you're Frisian

>>1982209
>You are Holland, unless you're Frisian
Literally the same

>>1980868
>minstrelsy
>in Europe
Baka

>>1982214
have you ever heard a frisian talk?
they aren't the same

>>1982221
It's all the same to my ears
t. Glorious Southerner

>>1980496
>Extremely bad children are stuffed into sacks and carried off to Spain.
A fate worse than death

>>1982197
It's the 6th in belgium, the 5th in the netherlands

>>1982229
6th is becoming more popular in Holland tho. 5th is done in the evening, 6th is usually celebrated in the late afternoon. Because kids.

>>1978646
Gelderland boi

>>1980496
To give some more info; while Sinterklaas is a tradition that goes back for multiple centuries, the modern concept of Sinterklaas developped halfway the 19th century. That's the reason why he comes from spain with a steam boat, because that stuff was the cream of the crop for travelling at that time. Also Spain was still seen as 'a place far away' to the average dutch person.

So Yeah guys, we literally have an old bishop arriving in the country on a steam boat filled with presents with moorish slaves/'people who are black because of the chimney ( as the deliver presents through the chimney). Sinterklaas literally walks on our roofs while riding his horse, and indeed if you are naughty you will go into the sack and be taken to spain ( this literally happened with my grandfather, though they dropped him in some village like 30 km from where he lived)

>>1982232
True, but officially it is on the 5th.

>>1982064
Can all Black people just fuck off
I mean kids dont give a shit, they dont even link it to Black people

>>1982240
Nah, social media has given a voice to the eternally disenfranchised and forever ruined it.

Also, kids dont give a fxck if they're black or not. Just pick one and stick to it. Instead of poldering between red lips/completely black make up/curly black hair/earrings and some blonde cunt painting her face a different colour or pattern and not putting on a wig/earrings.

Just go full zwarte piet or don't. pick a side and stick to it.

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>>1978297
>Christmas Lads

BRING THE GIFT OF SPICY FUCKING BANTER AND PLANE TICKETS TO MAGALUF!

U WOT!
U WOT!

>>1978297
>that little bit of Scotland
>Christmas Old Man

Highlanders are a different species

>>1978364

Spanish Netherlands.

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>>1982201
Keep telling yourself that, there's no reason for the exaggerated lips, earrings and hair. The blackness is not the problem.
Both anti-pete and pro-pete people are retards.

All we had to do is change the hair, paint the lips black as well and remove the earrings and there would be no connection to slavery. Not sure about the costume but whatever.

>>1982400
look dude it doesn't matter how butthurt you are, the tradition is older then black slavery and that is fact. At the time the only black people common folks vagely knew where the moors.

Sure there could've been a more meet halfway instead of just wanting it banned.
>also your pic is not a pick of black pete

>>1982421
>look dude it doesn't matter how butthurt you are
I do not care about it. I just don't like it when nonsense is being spoken whatever it is from the pro or the anti retards.
The pic is about a stereotypical picture of an African and shows the earrings and red lips.

But please do not respond again, I do not wish to discuss this because I know how cognitive dissonance works.

The intent of black pete was never to be racist but it was based on racial stereotypes for some time.

>People associating "Christmas Lads" with British drunkards
Ain't our fault your limited language doesn't have a male version of the female word maiden.

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All this talk about zwarte piet reminds me of an old dutch verse where some kids are making fun of a black kid.
St. Nicholaus appears and punishes the kids by dipping them into a giant pot of ink, making them look like niggers.

>>1982238
And here I thought Germany was taking the piss when they did the whole "take a fir indoors and decorate it" thing and made it popular.

>>1979092
>>1978504
Onenzaro "The good season" That's the actual Basque name for Christmas, but latter the name degenerated into the character we know today.

>>1978297

>Italy
>Not La Befana

I always thought she brings the presents

Italybros please explain

>>1982636
That's quite nice.

>>1979093
Funnily this is one of the few maps where you cant see the old border between Germany and Russia

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>>1984075
It has nothing to do with it.

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>>1984082
what about the boar population?

>>1978312
Literally satanic.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=287kBg-qEVU

>>1978297
>Christmas lads

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>>1984096
I have better ones

Enjoy

>>1984107
Lmao that pass rate difference is like 6% at the most and proves nothing. A bad map.

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>>1984137
t. butthurt easterner

His name is Santa.

>>1978297
In the German speaking part of Switzerland we actually use the babby Jesus and Santa Claus ('Samichlaus') equally often. Santa travels with a donkey and a dickhead called Schmutzli.

>>1984184
Also it should be noted that we have a separate Saint Nick's day (Samichlaustag, a fucking mouthful innit) on the 6th of December

>>1980596
That's pretty much my opinion on zwarte Piet as a person who grew up between the US and the Netherlands. The main reason people think that Piet is racist is because they're projecting American values onto him. It's understandable, especially given how American culture and stereotypes have become global, but it's pretty stupid. Yes, it looks like old American racist stereotypes, but it's not. The character didn't start out as a minstrel character or a golliwog; he has a long, complex history, and just happened to end up looking similar.

The character himself had pretty much nothing to do with those stereotypes and isn't viewed negatively (or as racist) by the kids who grow up with the tradition. It would be like if midgets started protesting Santa Claus celebrations and claiming that his elf helpers are hurtful stereotypes of little people. It would sound ridiculous because everyone would know it wasn't the intent and that no one sees them that way.

>>1978316
Yugoslavia is split between three different civilizations and that's been the cause for all the wars and ethnic and religious tensions there.

Slovenes, Croats and some Bosnians belong to the western Catholic Latin civilization with very strong Germanic influences, Serbs, Montenegrins, Macedonians and some Bosnians belong to the eastern Orthodox Greek civilization with strong Russian influence and some Bosnians belong to the Muslim Middle Eastern civilization with strong Turkish influence.

>>1978297
Just to be clear with you heretics.

Saint Nicholas brings presents on the sixth of December.

The sixth of December is the feast day of St. Nicholas.

The day St. Nicholas traditionally gives children gifts is the sixth day of December.

t. Pole

>>1978364
United provinces.

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>>1978322
You forgot his nigger

>>1978322
Recently, a sort-of Americanized for of Christmas has come to the Netherlands, complete with Santa Claus and everything. Probably to avoid confusion with Sinterklaas, who is the figure for a different holiday, they call him the Keerstman, which literally means "Christmas man."

To Dutch children, Sinterklaas brings them presents on his feast day and the Christmas man brings them presents on Christmas.

>>1980206

And their mother is a witch.

>>1978297
>christmas lads

I'm pretty sure Iceland has a christmas cat, too. Never heard of the lads.

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>>1982636
I think I've seen that movie.

>>1985240
most of western europe is getting Americanized as fuck. When I was younger we didn't celebrate haloween heck I didn't even know what it was. But now kids are going out trick or treating every year

>>1986356
Not where i live. You're a britcuck aren't you?

>>1985240
you only see the "kerstman" in advertising. It's not like any child believes Santa brought them presents instead of their parents, see>>1982187

>>1978380
>The name comes from St. Knut (Nuuttipukki), it's a Swedish tradition originally.
no it doesn't. nuuttipukki and joulupukki are both local traditions inspired by completely indigenous kekripukki after christian influence.

We have baby jesus here, and in January we have three wizards day.

>>1979023
>Every year they put it more shit to make it less flammable.
Wonder how long till some Heisenberg has to blow it up with thermite or something.

>>1978467
We
Wuz
Wizemen

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>>1987662

>>1980496
What's the deal with Dutch people and Spain?
>No! Anything but Spain!

>>1988430
We were ruled by Spain( or better, the Habsburgs) until 1581. The Eighty Years' War was against the spanish empire

>>1988448
Don't you guys mention the king of Spain in your anthem?

>>1979093
Fucking Silesian crypto-krauts

>>1978312
holy shit that's based

That dude needs a kantele

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>>1978312

>>1978297
>that tiny sliver of Scotland

?????

Any Scottish anons able to comment?

>>1978297

Why did st. nick catch on in the states? AKA santa claus

>>1978422
south dublin here. I've always called him "santy", though im from the shit part of south dublin

>>1988582
One of the earliest colonists in the US were the Dutch. They also introduced the word "cookie".

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>>1988605

b-but clearly the map says they call him "Christmas Man"

>>1988574
That's where they speak Scottish Gaelic. I assume its something along the lines of Bodach na Nollag, which in Scottish Gaelic would mean Old Man Christmas but in Irish would mean Christmas Prick/Dickhead. Instead we (I'm Irish) say "Daidí na Nollag" which basically means Daddy Christmas.

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>>1978322
No. Krampus is from the Alpine region. They essentially have the same function as Zwarte Piet in the Netherlands.

>>1988683
fucking metal

>>1985285
>lads
I'm Icelandic, the Christmas lads, or Yule lads give small gifts (usually always candy) in exchange for good behavior for thirteen days before Christmas. Kids who are not on their best behavior get a lump of coal or a potato instead of candy. The really bad kids get kidnapped and eaten by their mother Grýla, she is a troll. Grýla also owns a magical cat that kills children who don't dress up nice on Christmas day.

>The Christmas Lads
>Star Man
>Christmas Man

el oh el

>>1988460
We do. It is actually a complicated line. Translated it says 'I have always honoured the king of Spain'. The anthem is narrated from the perspective of William of Orange, with it he tries to legitimise the rebellion by saying it was never an act of betrayal, but that it was done because of the unfair treatment of the Dutch people by the Habsburg policies

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tarvisio krampus

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>>1989047
St. Nicholas against them

>>1988612

We imported Coca-Cola Man back as a representative of Christmas.
Saint Nicholas has nothing to do with Christmas, his day is on December 6 and he's celebrated the evening before.
In America St. Nick was just ported over 20 days.

>>1978383
>Are goats regarded as symbols of plenty in european tradition?
Well, Thor's chariot was pulled by two goats which he could cook for dinner and then resurrect like nothing happened. It's probably related in some way to that, it's sure as hell not from christianity.

>>1978508
>Christ is not Jesus

>>1982636
>old dutch verse
Didn't Heinrich Hoffmann wrote this, or did he base his version off an older dutch story?

>>1982238
>( this literally happened with my grandfather, though they dropped him in some village like 30 km from where he lived)
You can't not elaborate on this, anon.

>>1989327
Sounds like he was a little shithead.

>>1978312

can't tell if based metal or fucking furries

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>>1984107
t. Mufti Miśkiewicz

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XcREe-raj_U

>>1989327
Well >>1989354 is right, he apparently misbehaved as a 7-year old, so Black Pete put him in a sack and dropped him in a village 30 km from his own. I do think his parents were informed on it though, but yeah it still functioned as a sort of punishment. Yeah the 40's were different time.

I have to add that Sinterklaas has only been a figure of pure kindness since the last decades. Before that he was giving toys, but he was also used as a figure of authority by parents, definitely able to punish the naughty kids, hell black pete would even hit the shit out of you with a switch if you were naughty

>>1985284
*slag

>>1978297
In Austria St. Nikolaus brings the presents at 6th December (sometimes at the 5th which is Krampusday) and on the 24th December the Christkind (female baby jesus from the forest) brings the Christmas presents.