IDE discussion. No text editors allowed (these are very useful

Visual Studio Code + vscodevim is GOAT

>>60459896
for C++ and C# VS+VA is the best tool hands down
Netbeans is better than Eclipse
CodeBlocks is amateur tier which crashes when you debug thousands of lines of code.

but still, I havent installed the latest VS because it's kinda bloated with gay JS stuff, I still run 2013 and I got no problems with it.

>>60459979
VA?

IDEs are normie tier shit kill yourself. I would say to use VIM but you are probaly too retarded to use it.

Why use an IDE over a text editor and terminal?

What's the benefit?

>>60459961
Not an argument

>>60460098
DELET THSI

>>60460107
The only argument I think holds weight is graphical debugging. I haven't used Visual Studio for years now but I still miss debugging with it sometimes. Not having to maintain a makefile by hand is nice too, but hardly a game changer.

>>60460107
youll understand once you write more than fizzbuzz in C

>>60460083
Visual Assist extension

>>60460140
>"Nobody will ever need to code anything more complicated than fizzbuzz in C"
- Bill Gates, 1979

>>60459896
>2017
>ide/text editor dichotomy
vscode has integrated terminal, debugger, source control client and task runner. it's a pretty integrated environment for software development, I would say.

intellij+ideavim and vscode+vscodevim are the best code editors

>>60460274
shit, you hit me in the nostalgia

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>>60459896

Visual Studio is hands down the best IDE in existence. I just wish I could do my web app development in PHP/ReactJS on there easily. I'm sure there may be some hacky ass way, but it seems gay and annoying. And fuck paying for any of that shit.

>>60460098
>luxury cars are shit! i would tell you to buy a beater from junkyard youd have to fix everyday but youre probably too stupid to do that

>>60459896
I just use pluma and Linux command line

xcode

>>60459896
>Is there a better IDE than Visual Studio?
no. visual studio is the best thing ever created by mankind.

>>60460171
I'm using resharper c++. I couldn't find pirated stuff for visual assist.

I like anything from jetbrains

Anyone using early build of Rider? Is it any good yet?

>>60459896
vim

>inb4 hurr durr it's not an IDE
I have the ability to autocomplete using gcc as indexer, jump directly to definitions with ctags and cscope, open a web browser to the autogenerated doxygen definitions for the project with my custom-built plugin, use vim as the front-end to gdb, and build/rebuild using custom parameters with a press of a button. I'm also able to auto-compile on file save, allowing me to do static code analysis

How is vim not an IDE?

>>60461058
vim plugins are terrible. it is a shitty IDE. happy now?

>>60461105
>vim plugins are terrible
The ones I use are great.

>it is a shitty IDE
That's, like, your opinion.

Anyway, it's still an IDE, that's the point. Making arbitrary distinctions based on what is considered a plugin and what is considered part of the core is just stupid. All modern IDEs allow you to extend their functionalities with plugins. Visual Studio, for example, is fucking unbearable without Tomato's Visual Assist plugin.

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>>60460274
>product :registered

>>60460098
Spoken like a true basement hobbyist neet

>>60461539
your just jelly because you have to work

t. hobbyist neet

>>60461058
>I have the ability to autocomplete using gcc as indexer
>use vim as the front-end to gdb
Please elaborate on this

>>60461607
Use Google

But to give you some pointers, you can halt GCC at various linking stages, and force it to spit out intermediate files that point to symbol definitions. With proper scripting and a little hacking and some underlying assumptions regarding naming conventions, you can extrapolate source file names from those files. Simpler option, of course, is to use ctags and cscope alone and have keybinding shortcuts for jumping around.

As for vim as a front-end to GDB, Google has about 1 gorrillean step-by-step howtos on how to do this.

>>60461058
so after spending hundred hours finding working plugins you have a product thats not even close to a real, bone stock IDE. good job?

Is it really that great?
I was going to install it to play around with developing windows programs but the installer said that VS was spyware.

>>60460098
Building your own IDE seems like a waste of time.

>>60460128
>maintain a makefile
You don't have to with an editor, just use cmake.

As I see it, an IDE is an editor + some developer tools but with every feature of an editor, you get more.
An editor can give syntax highlighting which shows language related syntax.
An IDE can give syntax highlighting which shows project related syntax.
Refactoring > text substitution, function navigation > file navigation etc.

A lot of people seem to use vim, but there isn't many people who are capable of documenting the setup, and I am not sure which graphical frontend you need to use in order to make it as fast as other editors which comes with all the features enabled.

>>60462156
>hundred of ours finding working plugins
I didn't even spend 20 hours, and most of the plugins I scripted myself.

>bone stock IDE
I don't know if you've tried any actual IDEs, but Eclipse CDT for example is sluggish and uses 4 gigabytes of memory and the git plugin frequently segfaults. It takes literally 30 seconds for it to even start up.

Code::blocks is basically Notepad++, it provides extremely limited functionality and I can't even use it as a front-end to remote GDB --> useless POS. Not to mention that the built-in editor is shit and doesn't allow regex search or any advanced text functions at all.

NetBeans is unusable as a C IDE.

CLion doesn't support autoconf or autotools (or even raw Makefiles) out of the box, and require you to use CMake or maybe automake now.

QtCreator essentially offer the same functionality as Code::blocks, and doesn't support remote GDB.

>>60462401
>Building your own IDE seems like a waste of time.
See >>60462403

Building and customising your own IDE is definitively the most powerful, but there is a threshold you need to overcome if you're not already comfortable with vim and plugins (or Emacs and plugins)

>>60462403
Let me counter that with my experience switching to kdevelop
>I didn't even spend 20 hours, and most of the plugins I scripted myself.
I spent maybe 1 minute installing the application, then a few minutes setting up the hotkeys to my liking (used the search function for the functions, no googling required) and found that the comment declaration didn't really work like I wanted, so spent 20 minutes writing a script for this.
If we are generous, I spent maybe an hour on the setup.
>>bone stock IDE
>I don't know if you've tried any actual IDEs, but Eclipse CDT for example is sluggish and uses 4 gigabytes of memory and the git plugin frequently segfaults. It takes literally 30 seconds for it to even start up.
Kdevelop also takes the "30 seconds" to analyze the code.
The editor starts instantly, so you can edit right away. Worst case, you don't get the contextual syntax highlighting right away.
>Code::blocks is basically Notepad++, it provides extremely limited functionality and I can't even use it as a front-end to remote GDB --> useless POS. Not to mention that the built-in editor is shit and doesn't allow regex search or any advanced text functions at all.
>CLion doesn't support autoconf or autotools (or even raw Makefiles) out of the box, and require you to use CMake or maybe automake now.
I use cmake anyway, I don't see that as a problem. It makes the IDE recognize the files you have included while allows you to compile it on any platform without much setup.
>QtCreator essentially offer the same functionality as Code::blocks, and doesn't support remote GDB.
What do you mean remote gdb?
When I launch gdb, I navigate using the text in the text editor, but usually I just use the gdb in the terminal, I am not sure if I am missing out on any features.

>>60462401
>not even 20 hours
>this is actual achievement in freeshitware

>>60462465
>Building and customising your own IDE is definitively the most powerful, but there is a threshold you need to overcome if you're not already comfortable with vim and plugins (or Emacs and plugins)
Vim is too slow for me.
Take something like search and replace.
Move a line.
Block insert.
Comment out a block of code.
Stuff like that should not take a long time and taking time introduces mistakes as you expect an editor to be working in real time.

>>60462592
>If we are generous, I spent maybe an hour on the setup.
But the difference is that this is a job you repeat every time you install kdevelop on another machine, whereas I simply pull my vim configuration down from github and have everything up and running as soon as I can do

git clone <git url>; mv vimstuff .vim

>The editor starts instantly, so you can edit right away. Worst case, you don't get the contextual syntax highlighting right away.
That is an overhead though, and an annoying one every time you open another project.

>I use cmake anyway, I don't see that as a problem.
I work on a bunch of different projects, most of them use autoconf because of legacy reasons and no one being willing to remake everything in cmake.

>It makes the IDE recognize the files you have included while allows you to compile it on any platform without much setup.
I'm not familiar with kdevelop, but on eclipse, defining build targets manually was in essence the same as manually configuring bash scripts in a gui where you literally dragged and dropped environment variables into a box.

>What do you mean remote gdb?
https://ftp.gnu.org/old-gnu/Manuals/gdb/html_node/gdb_130.html

>When I launch gdb, I navigate using the text in the text editor, but usually I just use the gdb in the terminal, I am not sure if I am missing out on any features.
You miss the feature of being able to navigate your code while stepping through the program, and you also miss out on features such as clicking on a variable name with your mouse and seeing the current value.

>inb4 memes about using vim and a mouse
It is convenient as fuck, which is why I use it.

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Vim is the best IDE

only cucks use ms products

>>60462633
>Vim is too slow for me

You're just making things up now. If you have to lie to defend your argument it's a shit argument.

>>60462633
>search and replace
>move a line
>block insert
>block comments
None of these are non-trivial. Search and replace:

:%s/replace-this/with-this/g

Move a line:

:<line no>d<line no>p

Block insert: block visual mode

Comment out a block of code:

map ,/ :s/^/\/\//<CR>:nohlsearch<cr>

Now I can select a block in visual mode and press comma + / to block comment it.

Everyone at my work uses eclipse, I can't stand it.

>>60462718
Except you spent 5 minutes searching that in the manual and on stackoverflow

>>60462718
I was mentioning cases where vim is unbearably slow.
None of these require plugins, yet they take more than 10 times the time to do than with my editor.

>>60462754
Even if you know how to do these things, THEY TAKE MORE TIME.
This is what I mean with vim being slow.

>>60462680
>can't even write anything substantial in world's most used language.
no thanks, I'll stick with other software + vim mode plugins. unless I want to edit a small config file

>>60462633
everything you listed is actually easy in vim and takes less time than grabbing the mouse and clicking around

>>60462754
I know them by heart, because I've been using vim for 11 years anon. The last one is straight out of my .vimrc.

Anyway, if your argument is that you don't use vim because you'd have to learn vim first, then you don't have a real argument. I could use the same argument against any IDE I'm unfamiliar with.

>>60462772
>take more time
Compared to what, exactly? This is obvious bait.

>>60462754
yes. you do that 5 times and then you remember for the rest of your life. I'd say the time investment is worth it unless you plan on dying next month

>>60462772
but they don't

>>60459896
ides are bloat and only bad programmers need them.

>>60461058
>implying that a visual studio/basic "programmer" understands what you said

>>60462801
You have to press more keys.
There is a greater delay from when you press the keys to the words are printed to the screen.
There is a real time feedback to the user, you press a key and it gets printed on the screen.

Take something like block insertion.
In kate, holding shift is the equivalent to visual mode, then you type stuff and it gets written to the buffer.
In vim, you need to switch back to insert mode with shift+i, wait for the mode to change, then type the thing you want and then hit esc. waits a few years and vim eventually prints the thing.
But if you make mistakes along the way, you have to redo the whole thing and if you press something while you wait because you thought it didn't respond, you crash everything.

>>60462827
What setup do one need in order to make it instant?

>>60462917
>You have to press more keys.
You can map all of those to whatever key shortcut. Hell, you can even map those to modifier key + mouse click if you want.

Also
>he is unironically saying that kate is better than vim
Obvious troll

>>60462917
vim is shit but it becomes tolerable when you force yourself to use it.

>>60462917
>wait for the mode to change type to buffer copy buffer and change mode
Nigger, wtf?

You go to visual insert mode and insert right away, you fucking illiterate cow.

It's like you literally never used vim

>>60462917
>>60462970
Fucking kek, anon is using recorded macros in order to do block insert.

>>60462970
that is not what I said.

block insert:
ctrl+v
mark area you want to modify
shift+I
type words
esc
waits for 10 seconds
words you typed gets printed.

Am I just using it wrong?

>>60463005
It literally happens in an instant for me.

>>60463102
It doesn't take 10 seconds for me unless I do it for a lot of lines, but if I do it for 3 lines, it takes close to 2 seconds, far from instant.

What setup do you need in order to make it instant?

>>60463133
I just tried in an out-of-the-box vim setup on Ubuntu... And yes, I tried an area with 20 or so lines.

Jetbrains's IDE plus ideavim plugin is GOAT. I can keep the speed of editing text with my vim's shortcut while having the /comfy/ness of a high level IDE for refactoring, version control, etc.

>>60463144
I have tried it with different terminal emulators, on different hardware and with different vim configurations, they all have the delay.
Anyway, my point is these things are instant in kate and since the interface makes it instant, I make a lot less mistakes and I can do things faster.
There is several situations where I find it easier to close down vim, open it in kate and edit it there.
Vim is considered advanced because there is a lot of small hacks that expand the functionality, creating a huge feature gap between vim and other editors.
But something like kate has most of the key features without doing any setup, the interface is faster and more natural to use and you can just as easily make plugins for kate as you can for vim to scratch that very specific itch you have.

>>60463422
>There is several situations where I find it easier to close down vim, open it in kate and edit it there.
Sounds like you're just new to vim then, to be quite frank.

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>>60463422
You're a liar. webm related. Now lets see a webm of your editor (you won't post one).

kill your self.

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>>60463540
I am not usually recording my desktop, if you know of a way where I can improve the framerate, maybe it is a better example.

Here is what I use:

ffmpeg -video_size 1920x1080 -framerate 60 -f x11grab -i :0.0+0,0 recording.webm

>>60463474
How many years do you have to use vim before it gets nearly as good as you were without any training on other editors?

>>60460274
>windows
>cortana
>c++ builder
consider suicide

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>>60459896
this one is the best

Emacs

>>60460098
>"/g/ i posted it too!!! am i 1 of u guiz now xDDdDDxDXd"

>>60462680
>developing web shit
>calling others cuck

Good shit.

>>60463938
>nearly as good
30 seconds to enable mouse support and you're good to point and click like a pleb

>>60465452
I've been using vim for a year now and I just found out about mouse support like a week ago

>>60464222
Started using AS for an android job I'm working on, been pretty impressed so far, so yeah, intelli J is dope.

What is /g/'s opinion on VS Community? Why do you all insist on VS Code when it just appears to be VS that can be run on different operating systems?

>>60459896
dumb frogposter
>>>/out/

>>60466003
VS code is a bridge between autistic text editors and IDEs.
most people wont install VS or use C# because its muh non free software

>>60459896
Emacs and before you start crying about it not being an IDE I can make it have more functionality than your shitty IDE can and more.

>>60466107
>good thing out of the box
>shitty thing you have to spend hours to make good
hmmmm... tough choice my friend. maybe when ill be unemployed ill have time to fiddle with autistic linux distros and editors

>>60459896
i need to work with tensorflow and most tools are more or less useless with it. so yeah sublimetext all the way

>the year of our Lourd and Saviour 2017
>using anything other than vim
For shame

>>60466003
vs code is nothing like visual studio

>>60461058
that's a fucking mostruosity.
If you need that level of complexion you should use emacs

>>60460140
this, coming from someone who used to pretend that a terminal and a text editor was all I needed

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>>60460098
WOAH, WATCH OUT GUYS!

>>60466389
>Changes screen code
>Emulator or browser immediately reflects the change
>Edits image or vector file directly inside IDE
>God tier auto-completion
>Lint in real time
>Integrated debugger and expression evaluation
>Templates
>Integrated 1-click control version
>Support for unit-testing out of the box
>Official support from Google/Apple/M$

You Vim cucks don't code much more than hello worlds and scripts, right?

I had a professor at university who lost an entire practice session helping students setup a Vim-based "toolchain" and losing the fucking whole 2 hours on this. I had a portable liclipse ready in 15min.

IDEs are superior in every sense.

>>60462718
So what when I need custom scopes on projects that have over 30k files? so lets say I often use find/replace but I want to skip over all files located in "vendor/*./Test/*. " - and I want to share it between projects. I want mapped syntax method that will sort all the indentations and editing rules I have set by a simple keybind. What when you need FIG standards analyzers in real time as you code? What when you want the same editor with all this features for C, C++, Java, Python, Php, Js, Html, Css, Ruby. What when you need just this few things and you dont want to lose your weekend, instead 10 mins to find the keybinds and configure the edit rules and you are done with the glorious IntelliJ Ultimate

>>60459979
Same, really like VS functionality with C++ frameworks

>>60462680
>using go
cant wrap your brain around generics yet, anon?

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>ahh, IDE thread
>time to shit on these wincucks and their VS
>done
>now back to repairing my arch/gentoo third time today and configuring vim
>need to write that fizzbuzz and read ANSI C

>>60459896
I really like flat assembler. Might not really be an IDE though, but it does have some useful tools in it.

>>60467320
generics simplify programming at the cost of abstraction, bad programmers rely on generics.

>>60462680
I have the same plugins shown in that webm and it is shit.

>>60469417
what the fuck did I just read

>>60459896
>CodeBlocks
When I started CS course I thought they wanted to make new students get used to do stuff manually so they get comfortable to get shit done regardless of software.
Boy was I surprised when they kept pushing this garbage for several semesters

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Kdevelop 4 Master race

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>>60459896
Stupid fucking frog poster >:(

>>60471174
>wojakposting instead
hello reddlt!

>>60459896
gnome-builder is nice

>>60470978
do you use that as a space heater?

>>60459896
>Also can we all agree that Code::Blocks and Eclipse are objectively shit?
YES god dammit. Code blocks is old as fucking dirt and it's been stuck in development for years. Eclipse on the other hand is good for Java.

CLion is the best IDE I've used as it's not as bloated as VS.

What is it with autists and wanting vim to be an IDE? It's an editor, adding a million plugins to emulate what other text editors already do out of the box doesn't make it an IDE. That doesn't even make sense.

>>60459896
Visual Studio is great! I keep Windows 10 in a virtual machine with no internet connection JUST for that rare occasion where I want to do some stuff in C#. Visual Studio is always a pleasure to work with.

Emacs.

>It's not an IDE! WAAAAH!
https://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/EmacsCodeBrowser

>>60460803
*jewkind
http://windowsreport.com/visual-studio-2015-function-telemetry-call/

hurrr durrr nothing to hide hurr im owrthless hurr

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Redpill me on eclipse. pls

>>60466159
>good thing out of the box
Please tell me how Eclipse, Netbeans, Code::blocks etc are "good things out of the box" and how they require zero plugins and zero customisation.

>>60465493
Then you are fucking retarded, tbqh.

>>60463938
Anywhere from a couple of weeks up to a few months, depending on how fast you learn.

Visual Studio

The Cyka Blyat stuff from Idea seems not too bad but it's Java so NOP.

Vim is not an IDE

>>60465452
>30 seconds to enable mouse support
Mine came with it working out of the box.

>>60466159
>wants good product out of the box
>uses linux

>>60459961

That's not an IDE, hackerman.

>>60473103
it is an ENVIRONMENT that INTEGRATES all the DEVELOPMENT tools I need

>>60472568
I was just guessing since I never even tried to use my mouse in vim