/dha/ - Distro Hoppers Anonymous

when i realized linux is shit

When I bought a mac

When I installed Gentoo

When i have to work.

>>59303385
When I realized what I'm really choosing is repo size, security policy, stability, package format, and update schedule. So I decided to judge distros based on that and not how they look or what programs(apps) they come with.

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>>59303517
Let me guess! Are you a debian user?

>>59303606
No, I really hate this "Free as in freedom" bullshit. I wish linux would just drop the whole opensource obsession it has because all it does is hold it back from being a real operating system. That's why I like linux mint. Shit should just work and I don't need religious zealots telling me what software I can and can not use.

>>59303385
When I grew up and installed Debian 8

>>59303642
manjaro is kinda like mint but based on Arch right ?

>>59303385
When I installed devuan. Full freedom from systemd and SJWs.

>>59303679
desu most distros that aren't corporate backed just work with codecs and shit (except ubuntu being the only exception) so yeah manjaro is supposed to be a just works arch, I havent really used it though except maybe four or so years ago so I don't know how it's current state is.

>>59303606
The only sane choice desu

>>59303679
It's arch based it has nothing to do with mint
>>59303692
Noice played around a little with it, looked cool

Arch FTW

>>59303749
How does arch compare to tumbleweed so far as rolling distros go (not muh minimalism)

>>59303679
Don't use Manjaro. Use Antergos.

>>59303385
Ubuntu. A month ago.

>>59303795
Tumbleweed is better.

>tfw I don't distro hop that much only because I've gotten too used to working in Debian-based distros
>tfw basically just switch between *buntu and Mint distros
>tfw Fedora, Manjaro, and Antergos will forever remain on my virtual machines

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I chose to stay with arch when I installed it about six months ago and found out that all of the negative shit said about it is bullshit. I have had zero problems with it. Before arch I used Xubuntu and Fedora pretty extensively.

>>59303962
That's sort of what I figured based on tumbled weeds testing process alone, I've heard the arch is unstable thing is a meme. I don't use rolling releases but tumbleweed is interesting me.

When I installed OSX

even in hackintosh format it is far superior to any linux distro

>>59304173
I don't think I believe you. No.

>>59304038
Same with Manjaro for me.

>>59303385
when I started using AUR
filesystems are more influential anyway

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>>59304173

this lmfao

macOS = MASTER RACE

>>59303679
Yes. It's popular and uses the sacred Arch packages, so /g hates it.

Tumbleweed > Fedora > Arch >>> Debian > Ubuntu >>>> Shit >>>> Mint

>>59304383
Prove it dummy

>>59304449
>hint: use induction

>>59304483
yeah you is stupid. Mimt is not a bad distro. It's about as much same as is ubuntu if not better since its much more simple for people like me to know how to use

>>59303385
I haven't, moved from arch to Qubes on my laptop yesterday thinking of switching my desktop

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>>59303385
when my shitty hardware forced me to use debloated shit, like #!, then I needed less outdated packages and start compiling every shitty software, then /g/ memeing me into arch and AUR, and it worked ever since,
I'm lazy mofo and install every shit I found on AUR carelessly, and upgrade without reading for compatibility issues and arch keeps working, just pokerstars and qutebrowser are broken in the last update that was huge cause was procastinated for >3 months, pretty stable imho senpai

Every time I distro hopped I'd come back to Debian when something broke. With Linux, because there is so much choice you always think there's something better you could be using, a better experience. Well, you have to try things until you find something comfortable for you.

For me that is Debian + awesomewm. For someone else it might be Fedora and Gnome 3, or Arch and KDE.

Distro hopping stops when you find something that works for you.

>>59304657
Does you use stable or is you using testing?

When my prof asked me to do shit that wangblows and mac can't do
He said Ubuntu and Debian
I said ok, copy that

>>59303385
when I found the

A U R

U

R

>>59304629
Your image is top 9gag my friend
>apple fags have to shop at goodwill to pay the debt

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>>59304671
Everyone who isn't running on a server should use testing

>>59304724
Testing doesn't get security patches as fast as stable or sid, testing is a shit. desu

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>>59304733
>security
>admitting you're a pedo with something to hide

>>59304733
Stable won't work with modern hardware, tho

>>59304804
Yeah but who has modern hardware? Most people can't afford to keep buying hardware each time a new one comes out? Am I misunderstanding what you are saying?

>>59304820
Skylake + Polaris won't work on old kernel

>>59304834
backports solve this for the most part. I just don't understand not using stable because who would want unstable? I guess I come from the old windows ideology of use the OS until it is EOL

when i realized that every distro is shit

I had 40 something sessions active on facebook from my distro hopping days. I finally settled for arch after i got good. Now i use ubuntu cause it was installed on the laptop i use at work. No complaints.

>>59304671
I is using testing.

>>59304733
Testing gets security patches with a delay of about two weeks.

>>59304852
"Stable does not mean bug free" is what convinced me to go rolling release. And I don't run a server. Really want to like Debian, but it's not for me.

>>59304921
fair enough

>>59303385
I tried like 30 distros in a VM and also on live CD/USB 2007-2008

liked ubuntu until 10.04 came out so i switched to Xubuntu. i'm still there.

And no, i didn't simply test all ubuntu variants. I tested various different distros with different package managements etc.

Used gentoo for years, finally settled on Bunsen Labs, which is a continuation of Crunchbang. Just nice comfy Debian basically. Its nice not having to fight the system to get every little thing to work for a change.

I use Fedora KDE after distrohopping nearly 12 distros.

I really like it. Best kernel updates, better package manager than pacman, RPMs are bettter than deb imho, and it feels solid.

>>59305060
I heard kde sucked on fedora. How is it.

>>59303385
obanto mate is the shit

>>59304269
Before enlightenment, rivers are rivers, and mountains are mountains.

After enlightenment, rivers are rivers, and mountains are mountains.

>>59305093
It's mostly a misunderstanding. A dev stepped down from his leading role, but that dude was obsessed by perfection, and shit never got off that well.

It works really fine, no deal-breaking bugs.

>>59304269
>>>/lgbt/
>>>/lgbt/
>>>/lgbt/
>>>/lgbt/

>>59305186
I'll check it out, I've been looking for a good kde distro that wasn't rolling and wasnt ubuntu.

>>59305186
Im not sure KDE has been especially stable in its entire existence. Tried it on F24 and in the first 15 minutes of ricing things, broke it. Changed the fonts, and the sizes, and it fucked the menus all up. But f24 was a buggy mess anyway, so whatever. Lots of kde shills, so maybe its ok now.

>>59303385
>tfw forced to use Ubuntu/Debian because the esoteric programs I need only have win, Mac, and .deb versions

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>>59303679
It is poop. They suggested changing the system time.

>>59303385
I don't commit to a single distro. I use what is best at that time for what I am doing.

Right now, I need to collaborate with the most people with the least amount of effort and only use Linux on my work laptop, so I use Ubuntu because everything just fucking works without any effort on my part.

Macbook doesn't have this problem

>>59303385
Installed Arch, stayed on Arch.

>>59305404
True, some issues arise, and configuring KDE can be annoying at times, but reboot and it's all fine.

>>59304985
You don't have to fight the system if you basically made the system.

I N S T A L L G E N T O O

I never did, and I never will
Ubuntu > Debian > Arch > Gentoo here, like everybody else.
I'm trying void instead of arch on my laptop for muh unix philosophy.
Living without AUR is hard, tho.

>>59303941
this.
Using it rn
Came back to it after #!

I'm still not entirely sure. I installed Ubuntu GNOME a few months ago and loved it, but I recently discovered that Cinnamon can do everything I love about GNOME, plus more. So now I have Ubuntu GNOME + Cinnamon. I'm wondering if I should just install Mint, since that's where Cinnamon comes from, but you know that distro-hopping image that shows up every now and again? How everyone eventually just ends up back on Ubuntu? I want to skip that distro-hopping process, if possible. Plus, there's the whole Wayland versus X thing. As >>59306060 said, I guess my ideal scenario would be Ubuntu + Cinnamon + Wayland. But since that's not possible (at least for now), what's the next best thing? Or should I wait until Cinnamon and Wayland play well together?

>>59309340
I have yet to test wayland. Apparently some distros will switch to it soon. How does it differ from X?

>>59309392
I haven't used it either, but apparently it's more secure and stable than X. X is supposedly outdated and shoddily-coded, while Wayland is the modern solution. As far as I know, Wayland is only on Fedora + GNOME for now.

>>59303385
Can we all agree that Luke Smith is /ourguy/?

>>59303385

peyton on the broncos like jordan on the wizards

hang with your team and don't switch over nigga

>>59303385
when i found a job

>>59303941
Agreed. Use Antergos. Manjaro sucks.

>>59303941

/thread

lubuntu nigga

>>59303385
when i bought a surface pro.
WSL is good enough for coding and shit.
was a void linux user before.

>>59304269
since windows 10 included ubuntu, macOS has lost all it's appeal to me.
fuck js coded 3rd party pseudo repos.

>>59312300
>>59303941

Give one good argument ?
"mhmhmhmh manjaro sucks" is not a valid argument

I never distrohop. I just stick with Ubuntu since 2005.

The different distros aren't SO different that it's actually worth it

Since WSL.

Now I get to use the tools I ear money with in a decent OS that actually supports the latest hardware.

>>59314672
There is no argument. Antergos is just as autistic as Arch. Manjaro can be fully installed offline which immediately makes it better.

non retards would use solus

>>59303795
>rolling distros
KYS
They are cancer that will brick your system.
Literally a toy OS not to be used in a production environment.

>>59304038
Do you only use the CMD or do you use some graphical things like audio and video? Do you even run a DE on this thing?

>>59304383
The funny thing its the other way around so mint is actually better then anything else.
you need to read the >>> like arrows not a greater sign.

>>59315312
Care to explain your reasoning? I'm considering switching to Mint because I like Cinnamon. What of all the common complaints about it? Is it actually dangerous to accept kernel updates, or is Clem just being paranoid?

>>59315331
I just dropped Mint because all the fucking packages in the repos are incredibly out of date. Switched to Fedora + Cinnamon and it's all good.

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>>59315331
Works great.
Never bricked my system.
And I decided to use it to the max!!!
>Install the XFCE version?
>Switch to cinnamon!
>Someone recommends for me to manually to install his home made script?
>Here I go!
>Updates can brick your system?
>Upedate without thinking!

Never bricked my system, there are its quirks like
Did you know you can create a user with no password in the GUI?
Like literally has no login password ever, he can not self change his user password.
However you can login into root and manually give him a password.

Audio works perfectly same with video.
Only once did I get the audio turned off.
Turns out somehow my audio settings in the GUI where reduced to zero.
Needed to turn the GUI nob up.

>>59303409
>>59303642
>>59304173
>>59304657
>>59306018
Linux is the name of the kernel that Linus Torvalds developed starting in 1991. The operating system in which Linux is used is basically GNU with Linux added. To call the whole system “Linux” is both unfair and confusing. Please call the complete system GNU/Linux, both to give the GNU Project credit and to distinguish the whole system from the kernel alone.

>>59315375
>muh I need my autismo video player to have the current year number on it
>Even if it literally makes no difference
The post.
Who gives a shit about updating packages?

>>59315458
I'm naming the system cinnamon because its more important to the end user then the kernel or some obscure utilities.

>>59315460
when you gotta hope that WebUpd8 has a PPA for every single application you need to install, it gets overburdened quickly.

>>59303385
I'm just into xubuntu and windows 10 now man. Nothing fancy for me dude. that shit is rough. That's not the kind of life I want to lead.

>>59315458
Just because GNU is the biggest contributor to the linux project doesnt warrant changing the name. Get over it autist, people will use a convenient and short name that is Linux

>>59315061
kevin pls

>>59315473
>the car's upholstery is more important than its engine
kek ok bud

>>59315935
Xubuntu is a very solid choice.

>>59315458
I use openrc+plan9port+linux, cuck.

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>>59315295
it's i3 daddy-o

How does stable/rolling release shit affect me as an end user? (not a server, etc.)

Kind of confused as to differences between Arch, Debian testing, sid, tumbleweed, etc. What are some trade offs you guys look at?

>>59316668
i stick with arch because of the tight integration with the AUR and the fact the wiki directly relates to any questions or problems i come across

basically if i want a program its 99% of the time on the AUR and just a pacaur -S away, and the standard repo packages are updated frequently enough where shit doesn't randomly break but you still get new features

i havent an arch distro break on me after updates in like 2 years, at least not through my own fault, the worst that can happen is you havent updated in awhile and need to refresh keys


my distro progression was like ubuntu > debian > crunchbang > arch > antergos > fedora > arch

and im back to arch because I can make sure with relative ease that everything i have installed and configured is the exact way i want it

>>59316668

When it comes to release cycles you have two choices, rolling or release-based cycle.

Hypothetically a rolling distro is easier to be broken, but I've never used one and many people say otherwise.

If you use a release-based one you have to upgrade your distro every once in a while and, supposedly, when staying with the stable version or LTS releases everything just works. But I'm on debian testing and everything is alright.

The popular distros barely have any differences for the (capable) user. It all boils down to their package manager and some political stances (or lack of) in certain aspects of the FLOSS ecosystem.

Debian is sort of an standard and you'll se plenty of deb packages to install on ubuntu/debian when something is not on the repo. Arch and derivatives instead have the Arch User Repository which is huge and has almost anything you'll need. Ubuntu and RHEL/centOS are also huge in the enterprise environment.

>>59315962
This.
GNU is a retarded name if they wanted people to adopt it RMS should have named his project Posix.
Posix sounds cool while GNU is a retarded acronym that is unpronounceable in every human language.

No one would complain saying Posix Linux .
However RMS wanted to have a joke unpronounceable acronym, if you treat your project like a joke people will disregard you.

>>59315458
>>59316062
Its interesting to see this.
What exactly are the GNU tools?

They are NOT a operating SYSTEM!

If you want to be anal the kernel alone is the only essential part of the OS since it can run itself. Yes its perfectly useless however other parts are added on to it to make a human usable OS.

GNU compilers are not the fucken OS!

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>>59303437
This

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>>59315962
People who think that Linux is an entire operating system, if they hear about GNU at all, often get a wrong idea of what GNU is. They may think that GNU is the name of a collection of programs—often they say “programming tools”, since some of our programming tools became popular on their own. The idea that “GNU” is the name of an operating system is hard to fit into a conceptual framework in which that operating system is labeled “Linux”.

The GNU Project was named after the GNU operating system—it's the project to develop the GNU system.

It only takes a second to say or type “GNU/”. If you appreciate the system that we developed, can't you take one second to recognize our work?

>>59317293
>GNU compilers are not the fucken OS!
that's right, gcc isn't an os, but GNU is.
GNU is the operating system since '83. Linux is a kernel developed in '91, wich was then added to the GNU operating system.

>>59317394
>>59317436
Name what the GNU parts are.

Also its a retarded name see
>>59317260

>>59317455
>Name what the GNU parts are.
The operating system.
>retarded name
Erm, things have names, deal with them?

>>59317394
Yet Posix sounds more cool.
Fun fact RMS invented the name Posix.
GNU sounds like making myself fart with my mouth.

Work on your branding.
Rename your project to the Posix project.
And the OS to Posix (previously GNU)

>>59317436
this all just pedantic linguistically prescriptive bullshit

people naturally call it linux because its easier, catchier, and at this point more widely known

>>59317471
>The operating system.
HAHAHAHAHAHA
So linux is GNU?
The fucken kernel is GNU?
NO?
How about the DE?
Is KDE/GNOME/Unity/cinnamon GNU?
Name the actual parts you sound retarded if you say there is some magical operating system it is.

>>59317499
Would you name it Posix Linux if GNU was re-branded with the name Posix?
Or simply Posix if they start using a different kernel in the future.

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>>59317514
What we say is that you ought to give the system's principal developer a share of the credit. The principal developer is the GNU Project, and the system is basically GNU.

If you feel even more strongly about giving credit where it is due, you might feel that some secondary contributors also deserve credit in the system's name. If so, far be it from us to argue against it. If you feel that X11 deserves credit in the system's name, and you want to call the system GNU/X11/Linux, please do. If you feel that Perl simply cries out for mention, and you want to write GNU/Linux/Perl, go ahead.

Since a long name such as GNU/X11/Apache/Linux/TeX/Perl/Python/FreeCiv becomes absurd, at some point you will have to set a threshold and omit the names of the many other secondary contributions. There is no one obvious right place to set the threshold, so wherever you set it, we won't argue against it.

Different threshold levels would lead to different choices of name for the system. But one name that cannot result from concerns of fairness and giving credit, not for any possible threshold level, is “Linux”. It can't be fair to give all the credit to one secondary contribution (Linux) while omitting the principal contribution (GNU).

>>59317530
if the various distributions using GNU tools stop using the linux kernel then its fair to stop calling it linux

posix? sure, it sounds better and if they did use a new kernel youd have the chance of branding and marketing before the kernel name overtakes the tools surrounding it

>>59317499
Although the developers of Linux, the kernel, are contributing to the free software community, many of them do not care about freedom. People who think the whole system is Linux tend to get confused and assign to those developers a role in the history of our community which they did not actually play. Then they give inordinate weight to those developers' views.

>>59317536
I understand contribution.
However the name is unpronounceable.
I rather name it GPL linux for the license you invented.

Also what is wrong with renaming it with a better catchier name?
Posix sounds better.
GPL also sounds better then saying GNU.

>>59317572
no ones conflating linux directly with free software

open source software though? absolutely, since it was one of the major projects that really made that 'mainstream'

problem here comes between the difference between FOSS and just open source, not because of names

>>59317394
>They may think that GNU is the name of a collection of programs

... and they would be correct.

>The idea that “GNU” is the name of an operating system

... is usually incorrect. If a GNU distribution include GNU/Hurd, then that distribution is, in fact, an operating system. But usually GNU is not distributed with Hurd -- and in that case GNU is not the entire operating system -- it is just a collection of programs that comprise a part of the OS.

>>59317572
I understand it however RMS also fucked up with using autistic names like GNU and insisting on banning words like
>Alternative
and
>Ecosystem
So remember you can not say GNU is a alternative to windows ever.
This is RMS doing and people who simply don't invent a cool name to use for their project.

>>59317621
Linux is aswell an incomplete OS.
>>59317621
>it is just a collection of programs
same with UNIX?

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>>59317621
I have seen RMS say that GNU runs linux.
And this is fucken wrong on so many levels its not even funny.
The GNU tools is a collection of programs.

Also don't conflate GNU the project with GNU the tools.

>>59317623
He doesn't ban words, he asks not to use them in some context because they would be misleading.

>>59317647
incomplete sure but its still magnitudes easier for branding to call the combination just linux and the name has stuck

trying to change that just makes the community look like idiots, its not like anyones rewriting history and trying to say GNU is irrelevant to linux's distribution as an OS

>>59317667
>>59317658
Linux is a kernel senpai. Nothing less, nothing more. Why do you call Android "Android" instead of Linux? It has the same Linux inside, with some tools added, called "Operating System".

>>59317712
because its not about being technically correct, its about branding

android fulfills a completely different purpose from linux(with gnu tools) desktop distributions

again its about branding

>>59303385
Currently settled on xubuntu
Still trying out the extreme light alternatives like tiny core and slitaz for a variable alternative.

Small ones are good and all but the lack of dpkg+apt (I'm used to that) bites me too hard, hard enough to use a minimal Debian subsystem in an IMG file to mount and chroot into.
The problem with smaller distributions is that their repositories are small and their package managers are all weird to use

>>59303430
This.

>>59317741
>it's about branding
It's about selling views and lying.
The Linux foundation tries to push the Linux name, Canonical avoids GNU and Linux entirly (see Steam crap like "for Windows, Mac and Ubuntu")

The name "Linux" was basically bought with adversement and misleading.

>>59317293
>If you want to be anal
Why would anyone want to be anal?

>>59315458
call it what you want, it's all still shit.

>>59303385
I still hop between Ubuntu, Debian (media server at home) and Porteus (for absolutely fucking computers up)

>>59303642
Enjoy your insecure peace of shit!

>>59317846
>The name "Linux" was basically bought with adversement and misleading.
The name Linux sounds better then the unpronounceable word GNU.

It might be a little confusing however windows has windows the OS and the windows kernel.
Also don't conflate GNU the project with GNU the tools.
This is more damaging then naming the OS the same like the kernel.

>Canonical avoids GNU and Linux entirly
Did you think for one second this might be do to the autistic shitfest RMS is doing?
RMS is 100% kosher with endorsing distros that don't have GNU in the name, if they don't have linux in the name.

Also RMS is enforcing retarded language that requires you to talk in the most autistic way not to say forbidden words see:
>Alternative
is banned
So remember you can not say GNU is a alternative to windows ever.

And saying the GNU tools run the kernel is retarded beyond help.
Its like saying the web browser runs the OS.

>>59317660
I love you to explain how his autistic monologue is more non confusing for anyone:
> We don't describe free software as an “alternative” to proprietary, because that word presumes all the “alternatives” are legitimate and each additional one makes users better off. In effect, it assumes that free software ought to coexist with software that does not respect users' freedom.

>We believe that distribution as free software is the only ethical way to make software available for others to use. The other methods, nonfree software and Service as a Software Substitute subjugate their users. We do not think it is good to offer users those “alternatives” to free software.

https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/words-to-avoid.html#Alternative

VS saying yes linux mint is a alternative to windows.
Be hones here.

>>59317658
>I have seen RMS say that GNU runs linux.

Yes, occasionally RMS makes mistakes when he speaks. For example, he has claimed that Linux should be considered to be a part of the GNU operating system, which Linus says is nonsense.

>>59319401
Also there is massive conflation of what exactly the word GNU is.
Its used confusingly for different things
1) the GNU tools
2) the GNU OS
3) the GNU project

>>59319401
>which Linus says is nonsense.
I don't really give a shit what Linus is thinking. Its wrong because without the kernel the GNU tools will literally not start.
This software compilation can not be considered a OS in any way.

And saying GNU the tools run Linux is literally like saying Firefox runs Ubuntu.

>>59317592
Then that's your problem. The only way to fix this would be to come up with a collective name for it that is "fair" to all contributors, either by giving them no credit at all or credit to them all and again, you have to draw the line for that somewhere since thousands of projects have developed programs commonly included in today's GNU/Linux systems.

They all deserve credit for their contributions, but they aren't the principal developers of the system as a whole. Either way, GNU is different because it is more than just a contributed program and more than just a collection of contributed programs. GNU is the framework on which the system was made. Hence why GNU/Linux is "fair" and the more approrpriate name.

Then again, you can always make the statement that other projects don't do this. Should Minecraft be called Java + Minecraft because the core of it is Java?

>>59319401
He never said that. He said the opposite, which is the reason of the slash in GNU/Linux.

>>59319401
>lying on the internet

>>59303437
Basically this

>>59318721
>is banned
you fucking retard

>>59315458
>both to give the GNU Project credit and to
... dismiss all the other imporatnt part such as MIT, BSD, X11 that RMS never had anything to do with.

Come back when they complete HURD. Or is that GNU/HURD? Mwahahaha.

>>59320960
read the thread before posting

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>>59320960
Thousands of projects have developed programs commonly included in today's GNU/Linux systems. They all deserve credit for their contributions, but they aren't the principal developers of the system as a whole, so they don't ask to be credited as such.

GNU is different because it is more than just a contributed program, more than just a collection of contributed programs. GNU is the framework on which the system was made.

>>59320960
https://www.debian.org/ports/hurd/

>>59317514
But Gnome IS GNU.