To harsh?

>>57398384
Are you autistic by chance?

>>57398603
He probably is yeah.

Jesus christ that was cringe. I'll bet in about 30 minutes you'll seriously regret that. Have fun with that aspergers syndrome.

>>57398384
based anon.

>>57398603
>>57398628
>>57398660
>>57398664
Have you ever had to deal with recruiters?

Guy sends me an extensive coding evaluation for an entry level position that pays dirt cheap for the kind of things that not even someone who makes 200k would need to know.

And this isn't some "sure thing" its a chance that they'll even talk to the recruiters for the actual job in the first place.

So no, I'm not taking some stupid fucking 5 hour coding assessment so I can sit at a desk to debug bullshit code some Russian guy didn't even bother to comment.

>>57398682
>not even someone who makes 200k would need to know
wew
Maybe next time you should pay attention in class. I fucking hate retards that try to pass a degree off as knowledge.

Nah you did the right thing OP. I can't be arse to do shitty puzzles and assessments for every job I'm interested in.

ITT: Self-overestimated babby's first employment

>>57398711
It was specific library based stuff for Oracle that you had to have used the calls to know in the first place. I ain't got time for that shit.

>>57398682
Have you ever had to recruit someone? 90% of applicants are garbage and couldn't write working code to save their life.

>>57398384
You did what I wish I would do, but not what I know is the best to do.
Don't burn bridges.

I mean, do it now, because you're not me and I don't care about your future

>>57398384
good job getting blacklisted, retard

asking for completing an assessment means they think you aren't a programmer. proper way is to have a web portfolio/github that you link them to that will show them that.

>>57398737
>To [sic] harsh
>you'd need to use the Oracle thing they require experience in to know how to use it!
wow, they sure let go of a good one.

>>57398716
Srsly.

>>57398738
I believe this.

>>57398771
I mean, god forbid I yell at one recruiter company out of the bugillions.

>>57398803
Maybe

>>57398806
Which means they didn't even look at my resume. What a buncha pricks.

>>57398808
Dude, tell me on the job or before hand which lib's I'm using in oracle. Don't fucking sit there and ask textbook questions like I actually need to know all that junk.

>>57398384
ooooooh babby's first job interview fresh out of the grad school nursery

>sir please write a simple fizzbuzz and a bubble sort
No

>>57398806
>proper way is to have a web portfolio/github that you link them to that will show them that.
I have a patch in the linux kernel, I've contributed to various open source projects such as ffmpeg and tcpcap in the past, everything is on my github. I've also all my code from my master thesis on it, and I've published several papers about my implementation. I also have three years of work experience as a C++ programmer, 1 of them as an embedded developer (I had financial issues and had to make a living while doing my masters).

I was still asked to reverse a string on a whiteboard when interviewing for a senior developer position.

>>57398384
of course it's too harsh you idiot. you could have been polite and gotten what you wanted, but instead you were an asshole and guaranteed you will not get the job.

>>57398865
>>57398806
Not OP btw.

>>57398857
lol, if only that was the case XD

>>57398865
I can do a whiteboard problem. That's no sweat. I just don't have the whole Oracle Library memorized and like I said, it's not even assured that they'll talk to the company if I do do their ridiculous assessment.

>>57398865
Just wondering,
What other things do they ask in a senior dev interview?

>can't just respond like a normal person

>le power drill to my temple

you know where to go

Throwing a temper tantrum about the recruiting process is probably the worst thing you can do. If you legitimately didn't think it was worth your time to take their assessment you could have just professionally said so. Fuck, if you were professional about it they might have waived the assessment for you. But no, you had to act like a child.

>>57398932
To home depot.

>>57398384
I'm sure that they will hire somene who even refuses the recruting process.

>>57398384
Your name's definitely going on an HR blacklist. Good luck finding a job anywhere.

>>57398901
>What other things do they ask in a senior dev interview?
About the same as a junior position, but they assume that you know how to program. I was asked how I would go about designing a protocol for reliable data transfer with flow control, where I basically just recited my knowledge about TCP step for step and they were extremely impressed. I was also asked elementary socket programming stuff.

Funny thing is though, the position requirements were a MSc in CS and 2-5 years of experience in network programming, but they still expected complete tools that didn't know even how elementary socket programming works.

I didn't go back for a second interview because it seemed like a place I wouldn't like to work at, to be honest.

>>57398954
Not a job I wanted, this was more fun. I had just gotten an offer for double the pay for a job that's actually enjoyable.

>>57398955
HOW DID HE KNOW >O>!!!!

>>57398968
I think I'd giggle.

>>57398976
God forbid.

>>57398865
That would upset me in that case.
Last interviews I did had no such tests, because a lot of my code is public (they actually told me that).

Welcome to the real world b8tch

>>57398992
Yeah, I've had recruiters approach me on LinkedIn because they've seen my code on github and/or seen my activity on the the Linux mailing lists and/or actually read one of my papers, but they have always asked if I was willing to relocate to Ireland or Germany or France or something like that and I always have to tell them that I'm not really interesting in moving too far.

I don't understand why you would offend your recruite with some bullshit offhand comment like that. Your recruiter didn't write that assessment, he just forwarded it to you on behalf of that company. And assuming he does a lot of forwarding between companies and clients like you, he can't himself read through and evaluate all of the assessments himself.

Go job hunting yourself then if you think all you receive is garbage.

>>57398384
Considering the grammar of the last response, you would have failed the in person part anyways.

>>57398979
This is what scares me, there are so many places interviewing, that place really intense requirements. Some entry level positions asking for 2-4 years experience, where the fuck do I start.
I mean I'm just working on my CS degree and really need to start working some entry level job.

>>57399021
I'm in France and get spammed to move to the UK

You did the right thing OP. This recruitment madness has to stop.

These tests aren't only here to evaluate you, but also to lower your salary expectations.

I've once applied to the same WPF position as my friend (we know pretty much the same, we go to the same conferences, hold the same workshops, write a rather popular blog regarding everything XAML related... all in all, same thinking process and knowledge in 2 bodies).

We decided that during the assignment one will use MVVM Light, the other Prism and we will both tell we don't know much about the other framework.

I get bashed for using MVVM Light and how that isn't what they expected, and bla bla and how Prism would be preferred and they expect experience with it... but they like me, so they would hire me but with a lower salary.

Same story with my friend, just opposite. All of a sudden the company standard is MVVM Light bla bla...

That's just one example. On another I've been told "we can't pay you as if you had 3 years of experience, your assignment didn't live up to that..." which is funny, I had so many networking related questions I solved for the sake of solving (for example, they gave me 2 random IPs and told me what subnet has to be set for those two to see each other, I wrote 255.0.0.0 and they said "Oh, we expected you to calculate the one with the smallest range").

All in all, you did gods work. I hope they never ever find a competent coder while pulling this bullshit.

I go so far, I even told companies it's 1k/month extra on my expected salary, for every stupid test they force me to solve.

>>57398981
>Not a job I wanted, this was more fun
Gee, you sure know how to have a good time. Next time you should just shit your pants in the middle of an interview.

>>57398384
>>57398682
Recruiters get hundreds of applications. 90% of these applications are genuinely trash at programming:

-"I can copy/paste from stackoverflow"
-"I went to Koding boot Kamp for 2 weeks!"
-"My favourite programming language is HTML"
-"A loop? I am sorry, they did not teach us loops in CS."

Asking you to take some programming assessment tests will help the recruiter determine whether you are a programmer, or just one of the above.

Guess which category you put yourself in!

>>57399061
Well, I got my jobs while I was still doing my masters (because of financial issues + wanting to work with programming).

I started getting a part time menial programming job and then worked my way upward. Got a job as a front-end nigger through a recruitment company that specialises in finding relevant part-time jobs for students. The company I worked for saw my knowledge about networking and stuff and decided to hire me for their back-end C++ stuff once I completed my first year of my MSc. I worked with them full time for 2 years while writing my thesis in the evenings and weekends, and after I completed my MSc I got a job through a friend from my studies at a company that did embedded stuff.

>be in 3rd year of uni
>try to get a part time job
>get a group interview first, it goes alright
>second interview with the HR guy
>third interview with the team leader
>team leader tells me if you get to the final meeting you basically have the job
>finally have the last meeting, with one of the founders of the company
>get asked the same shitty questions in all interviews, the founder even has my answers on his computer
>at one point he tells me that I'm being "too serious"
>dude wtf I'm in a job interview what do you expect
>still it goes fairly well, founder says I'll get the results in a week
>one month passes, no news
>at this point I know they hired someone else obviously
>call the HR guy and tell them that his company is a piece of shit, that they didn't even have the courtesy of sending me a fucking email after making me go over there FOUR TIMES to answer THE SAME QUESTIONS over and over again
thanks for reading my blog, please subscribe

Reminds me of when I recently applied to a junior position and they sent me the programming assignment for a senior position using a an API (Node.js) and a database application (Node.js) I had zero previous experience in.

What did I do? I straight up told the recruiter that this was going to be a lot more work than what programming assignments tend to be when I have to learn both Node.js when JavaScript is my weakerst language and I've previously never used MongoDB. After that I actually did the programming assignment and sent it to them for evaluation even thou they told me that they admit that this was the wrong programming assignment for the job I was applying for.

So let's see if they get back to me over the next couple of weeks...

>>57399087
>only know half of the required knowledge
>gets surprised when he gets told he only knows half of what he's supposed to know

>>57398711
I fucking hate places that disregaurd actual knowledge and opt for degrees instead

>>57399101
I made some tools for the hunger games "communities" on 4chan, would this be worth mentioning in a job application or is it too unprofessional?
Check em http://hgtools.neocities.org/

>>57399152
Meh that happens in all work fields, a friend of mine went to 3 interviews last week and got told before the third one that he was pretty much in if he got called again for the third one.
He ended up receiving a shitty sms this week thanking him for taking the time for the interviews but that he wasn't picked, if it was a phone call at least he could've asked why they didn't pick him.

>>57399152
upvoted, I even disabled adblock for your posts and subscribed to them

>>57399120
Alright, well it sounds like me getting a basic ass programming job now is a good idea. Maybe I'll look somewhere I can do database management or something. I honestly don't have any work on a github so maybe I should work on more independent projects.

I never did this stuff when I was a kid like so many of my other friends, but I enjoy the application of math and theory in real life. I mean this faggot helped me build my first fucking PC >>57399101

>>57399192
Should be fine for a junior position. Did you program the tools, or just made the website? If you did the tools, what do they do?

>>57399157
Your reading comprehension is weak. If they told only me that, but the other guy passed with flying colors, we wouldn't give a fuck.

But they will use every tiny shit to ruin your self worth, and lower your salary expectation.

And that's why I don't do assignments any more. If a recruiter approaches me after I gave a conference talk or workshop, I just ask when we can negotiate salaries and when I can start. If they mention any testing or shit, I tell them they know exactly what I know and what I'm capable of, and in case they don't, they didn't do their homework and I wouldn't like to work with them because of that.

But hey, I might be wrong, if those assignments suit you, knock yourself out. Happy coding! :)

>>57399224
The benefit of working part-time while still studying is not only getting an income, but you also get to put some actual experience on your CV after you graduate.

>>57399239
>If they told only me that, but the other guy passed with flying colors, we wouldn't give a fuck.
You just wrote that he just used the OTHER half?

>>57399243
Here in the third world, the rule (that has been in place for at least ~10 years) is that you are not allowed to graduate unless you take 4-6 months as in internship.

>>57399274
Here in America you can graduate without actually writing any code yourself, and somehow get decent jobs from coding bootcamps

>>57399255
MVVM Light and Prism are 2 different frameworks to achieve the same thing (one uses a messenger for observer pattern, the other event aggregation). Both solutions were textbook examples of MVVM pattern along with dependency injection for testability.

The only difference is that these two are so opinionated, it's on the level of religion. If you use one of em in a company you'll never mention the other one.

So using that as a leverage to lower salaries is just showing that, no matter what you did, you'll always fail something on assignments and get offered below what they originally searched for.

Now go write some generic offers for your potential new recruits, mr. recruitment shill.

>>57399120
Where did you work before you got your first programming job?

>>57398384
congrats on entering the black list of this recruiter and every recruiter he has contacts with.

not technology
>>>/biz/

>>57399152
Reminds me of my recent experiences applying to junior positions:
>Respond to a job advert by a local startup company
>Get an interview with one of the founders
>Pass the interview and get a programming assignment sent to me
>Solve the assignment and wait for a reply
>A month after the initial interview they ask me to come over for a second interview
>Meet a whole bunch of the team, pass the second interview and get a second programming task
>Before I have time to get it done the co-founder emails me that they've decided not to hire me because they think they're not the right place for a recent graduate

>Send in application for MariaDB
>Get invited to an interview with a recruitment company
>Told that this is a rush recruitment and that they'll send me a programming task in the next couple of weeks
>Never hear back from them so I contact them
>A month after the interview they call me to tell me they "Couldn't advance my application" because I supposedly wasn't experienced enough
>Job was literally for a recent graduate or someone about to graduate with with 0-3 years of professional C++ programming experience when I had a full year of it and was a recent graduate
>Notice that the job advert is now listed on the recruiting company's (Academic Work) website as only being two weeks old
>A month later it's still, or again, being advertised as only being two weeks old

One of my more recent recruitment rejections was at Nvidia where they literally had me come in for an interview to see if I could be someone they might be interested in recruiting in year or two in the future. Recruiters really deserve their own special place in hell. They never get back to you anywhere near on time and they always just jerk you around while keeping you in the dark as much as possible.

>>57399315
I've never getting an offer below what was stated. In fact, I'm always offered more than I'm asking for.

It helps to have a current job with a relevant salary though.

>>57399238
Did both, they're automating and greatly speeding up various things you would do when hosting hunger games (on 4chan).
They have about 40 users each, but keep in mind there aren't many people in the community and it's very niche.

Autocropper is for automatic cropped screenshot generation. It automatically goes through the hunger games website, takes fullpage screenshots and crops them to the correct size. There is some detection going on because they always have different sizes. There are also a lot of settings. So basically you activate it once and over the course of a minute or so get ~30 cropped and labeled images in the folder you specify.
If you wouldn't use this tool, it would take you 10 to 30 seconds per image and a lot of repetition.

Next program is Hosthelper, which lets you click on 4chan posts in your browser which you want to enter into the simulator. It copies the names and image URLs and creates an editable list out of them in the GUI. With the press of a button it generates javascript out of the list which you can paste in the browser console to instantly enter all the posts into the simulator which you had in the list.

EventManager lets you save and load events out of the simulator locally in a formatted .txt file as backup and easier editing/writing of new events. When loading them back into the simulator, it takes the cookies out of the browser and sends multiple POST requests at a very high speed, because there is no API. Check Help Pages

>>57399318
I initially had a part time job at a ferry company where I first worked in the ticket office and later worked on the docks with managing passengers' cars and stuff.

Later on I started working at the university IT help desk support and did some TAing, but I got a programming job pretty quick and only worked there for like 1 or 2 months

>>57399292
I have talked to 4th year CS students who cannot place a simple button on a page, even with the help of Mr. Google and 6 hours of time. USA is not leading the world in producing CS/IT graduates with vegetable-tier skills: It is a global epidemic.

>>57399322
It is fine. Pay is low, but prices are too. I can rent a small-but-decent-sized apartment for the same price you pay for a pricey meal.

>apply for Windows Store developer position
>mention I have 3 years of Windows Phone experience, and that it's the same tech stac
>"Oh oh, the guys warned me, Windows Forms and Windows Store aren't the same"
>wonder whatthefuck for a second
>explain I said Windows PHONES not Forms
>"What phones? What do you do on those phones? You program on a laptopt, don't you?"
>show her my dev device running my apps
>"Yeah, whatever... any other experience?"
>tell her about working with Xamarin for the past 2 years
>"What? What? You program submarines?"
>stand up
>thank her for the coffee
>leave

2 weeks old story, still can't believe who they put in charge of recruitment.

>>57399238
>>57399365
(post limit)
They can also all check on the neocities website to notify of new updates (by default checks once a day on launch) and are capable of updating themselves.

>>57399315
>>57399239
>>57399087

If you consistently get offered less than what you are asking for, then maybe you aren't as good as you believe you are.

I always get an offer that's at least 15-20% higher than what I currently have.

For my first full time job I even got an offer for 10% more than what I initially asked for, which probably means I could have asked for a lot more.

>>57399152
Hey man I'll give you a story about my first job and why what you did was stupid.

>Get called by a headhunter who says "anon we got your resume from your university and want to see if you're interested in a position at [fortune 500 company]"
>Tell them yes and they conduct a phone interview
>Week later we do a second phone interview and they send me a email with a url with a form that I have to full out for a background check. The background check included one conducted by the fbi and they actually called my references and interviewed them.
>One month goes by and I hear nothing
>getting pissed because I spent a lot of time researching the company and products so I could be well informed during the interview as well as going through all the headaches with the background check.
>Was getting ready to write a FUCK YOU email to HR
>Same day get an email from HR apologizing for the wait and that the background check always takes forever. Ask to meet in person for the final interview.
>Conduct final interview and was offered the position

I don't work in tech, I actually do sales and I can see why the background check was so indepth. My company gives me a company credit card with $40k spending limit, a company car, laptop, iphone and $500/month gas card. If I had sent that fuck you email I would have blown in all. Don't burn bridges, if someone pisses you off just leave it be and continue with your life.

sorry for the shit grammar I'm on my phone and the thing is a pain in the ass.

>>57398384
pseudo-intellectual: the reply

>>57399376
Which country?

>>57399365
>>57399389
Host these on a more professional looking (less plain) site, and add them to your resume. We are on 4chan, so I have no idea if you are telling the truth or you just copied some else's code. But for real-life interviews, if you can show that you did program those applications, you can easily pass any entry-tier programming job.

>>57398384
Lol poor anon thinks he's sticking it to the man but he's just going out of his way to ruin his career. Have fun on the black list. I hope it was a small company and not a recruiting agency.

they probably didn't even review your resume op.

>>57399392
absolute bullshit but hey this if 4chan. the place of bullshit.

>>57399392
When interviewed by agencies (rather common in Sweden) they always try to find something to lowball me.

When recruited by team leaders to get specific shit done I can ask pretty much anything I want, specially in specific enterprise settings (it's rare that I work for less than $100/hour as a part time dude).

I know what I know, and I know how much it's worth, and I'll rather push my own shit and pitch projects to potential investors, than work for peanuts just because assignments.

>>57399451
It's perfectly common to be given an offer that's higher than what your current salary is, you nigger.

How else would companies motivate people to change jobs?

>>57399463
Well, I'm Norwegian so the differences shouldn't be that much.

>When interviewed by agencies (rather common in Sweden) they always try to find something to lowball me.
Literally never happened to me.

But of course, working freelance and work your own projects is the most profitable. You should keep on doing that anon.

>>57398384
don't burn bridges you moron

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>>57399438
>We are on 4chan, so I have no idea if you are telling the truth or you just copied some else's code
pic related, but of course that's no real proof.
They're written in AHK, which is probably not very professional, but I think it's the language that is the best for the job, because it takes a lot of work off you with built in functions. It's pretty much made for automation, which is what I was going for.
I didn't know any AHK before this, and I only learned it to make them, so this is all I made.

I'll be honest though, I'm not aiming for a programming job. I'm going for mechatronics/automatisation. Since these are automatisation tools of repetitive tasks, I wonder if this would be worth mentioning in that field. I program purely as a hobby.

Another thing that led me to this question is that many years ago, when I was like 14 years old, school forced me to check out some companies. I got invited to a programming company and they asked me if I had any programming experience. I said I used some AutoIT and they asked me what that was because they didn't hear about it before.
One of the interviewers googled it at the same time while I was explaining and then loudly read "AutoIT is mainly used to create bots and hacks for video games". Which was true. That was embarrassing as fuck, but they still took me in for 2 weeks of work experience. I wonder if these would create a similarly negative reaction, since they're about 4chan and and a game simulator, not professional.

>>57399554
This

It doesn't matter how retarded the other end is, never burn bridges.

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>>57398384
Have fun with them blacklisting you. It's almost like you don't realize how the internet and employment works.

That's alright, though, it opens up spots for people that actually give a shit like myself.

>>57399557
You do not have to say that the applications are for 4chan. Lots of people are completely convinced that 4chan is "hackers on steroids" or whatever scarey bogeyman is currently in vogue. Say that they are for your friends on "an online forum".

>I'll be honest though, I'm not aiming for a programming job. I'm going for mechatronics/automatisation.
Mechatronics is a fancy way of saying robotics. You can bet that that will involve a lot of programming!

>>57399397
This is a good piece of advice. Even if you're boiling over with rage at them ignoring you for a month, just write a concise but professional email along the lines of "Just wondering if you have any updates" sort of email. Because 9 times out of 10 they're probably just a bit disorganized and were planning to let you know soon enough. If you write a FUCK YOU email you don't get anything out of it and you could have been just about to get the job when you ruined it with one angry email.

>>57399557
Hey, i have that windows theme too.

>>57399638
Alright, then I will probably keep them as hobbies and not mention them. Besides, I have learned a lot about programming because of them and I kept improving them with my new knowledge, so even if I don't mention them, they're still helping me in the future.
For example, I'm in second semester now and the programming classes barely teached me anything new until now, since we're only going through the basics. Other students are impressed. I'm sure I'll write something professional in the next 5 semesters which I could then mention.
>>57399713
I like it, too bad some people think it's darkasmysoul

>>57399061
Just go ahead and apply anyway. The companies don't hire people based on CVs, they make a decision after they meet you in person. All you need is CV good enough so that the company doesn't think that by calling you for 15-30 minutes they would be wasting their time, and after that it's all on you if you get the job or not.

>>57398384
So this is the state of CS in 2016
Jumping through multiple hoops so you can even get a chance to say hello to a recruiter for some shit entry level position

>>57399957
CS hiring is completely retarded.
Every other field would laugh if you mention that you should have to provide a portfolio of things you work on in your free time, and then still have to program yourself through shitty tests, just so you can be considered.

God damn I'm glad I didn't choose coding as a career. Can you say over saturated?

>>57400254
>just so you can be considered
that's what seems to be the most ridiculous aspect of all this. It could be understandable that they would expect this from a candidate much later in the interview process but asking for all that this early on is a joke. Cancerous workplaces like that should be avoided as they show from step one that they have no respect for your time.

>spill my spaghetti whenever i talk to anyone who might be older than me
>read recruiter horror stories
>go to a school with people infinitely more knowledgeable/employable than me
>almost guaranteed to be laughed away if I apply for a job during campus recruitment
>never do because i'm deeply afraid of rejection and failure
Thank god for nepotism and previous work experience, otherwise I'd never get a job.

Recruiters are middlemen.

The web made middlemen irrelevant.

So recruiters spammed the job listing websites to the point where you need them again.

I have no love for the cunts.

Same applies to property letters.

>>57399152
>halfway through school
>get an interview for an internship at a company my cousin works for
>interviewed by the it staff
>they really like me, and they know my cousin well so they want to skip the formal hr interview and hire me straight up
>super excited
>still have to fill out all the paperwork and whatnot, but i've been extended an official job offer
>because of this I turn down a different offer for a less desirable internship (it's like an hour away compared to 5 minutes)
>hr guy takes fucking forever but eventually gets the paperwork to me
>fill out a shit ton of paperwork that's incredibly annoying and complex
>whatever, it's worth it to finally get an IT job
>hand in all the paperwork, hr guy tells me i should be good to go
>don't hear back for over a month
>call my cousin and ask why?
>he doesn't get any info for weeks because they pretty much ignore him
>they don't have my drug test info
>look through all my emails and paperwork, there is no mention of a drug test or instructions of where to go
>email hr rep
>he never gets back to me
>it's been nearly two months at this point
>my cousin keeps asking, nobody ever gets back to him
>eventually, almost three months later HR tells him they never got my drug test so they assumed I refused and moved on to a different candidate
>they made no attempts to contact me
>i'm pissed and so is he, since we both were positive I never got any drug test info and we both reached out multiple times to get it
>hr says there's nothing they can do, sorry
>i turned down a decent internship offer because of this
>i'm now stuck in a shit job and still struggling to break into the industry

I was so mad. There was nothing I could do either since I signed paperwork that said they could rescind the job offer for any reason whatsoever. It was utter bullshit and I have no idea how it's even allowed

>>57399091
I'm writing this down.

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>>57403024
No love for cunts? They're my favorite!

>>57399101
They didn't wanna look at my github, instead they just assumed I was retarded. K.

>>57399377
>apply for Windows Store developer position

can smell the poo from here

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>>57398384

>>57404853
You clearly are retarded though.