CS job interviews

is everyone really that dumb

maybe I have a chance then

>>56965164
Lol I bet they think they are in Silicon Valley or whatever hacker tech show.

>>56965164
Hey OP, can you please elaborate what is considered well dressed and groomed, and what is not?

>>56965228
Not really, some of the weirdos were good, but I'm not gonna hire someone who hasn't respect for his own body.

>>56965241
Yeah, I'm pretty sure some of them thought "Hey, I'm so good I might as well go to the interview dressed like some Mr. Robot haxx0r".
Pathetic.

>>56965331
If I have to explain it to you I guess you already are in the "weirdo" category.
Anyway, just dress like some normal person and try to shave your face.
Dress like you were going to court, does that make sense to you?

>>56965164
>manager at boring company
>wants boring people

amazing.

>>56965500
> dressing like a filthy animal makes you not boring

stupidity.

>>56965419
>Dress like you were going to court, does that make sense to you?

No, I don't go to court. I'm not a criminal.

>>56965164
Because maybe not everyone wanna look like a corporate sheep?

Its ridiculous how much people give a shit about people bitch about people who rather wear tees instead of granpa looking shirts. my friend applied for a job at retail chain and he dressed as he was a CEO for the interview.

>>56965558
Look clean, have your hair groomed and your face shaved or cleaned up and dress like a normal respectable human... Clean collard shirt with some nice pants and belt plus nice shoes. It's really not hard to look semi professional...

>>56965419
Who the fuck would want to work at a company with that formal dresscode? Must be shitty company culture overall.

>the same degenerates that don't even have the mental capacity to be able to dress formally are the same subhumans that feel entitled to have a job

lol

>>56965614
Then then get back to flipping burgers for minimum wage Jamal.

To be honest even formal wear couldn't save most of the smelly unhygienic basement dwellers that are the foundation of this board.

There is a reason companies want people who dress well. A proper dress code increases productivity amongst other things that boost moral and employee relations. The saying dress for success isn't just something "boring" professionals say to newbies, it has a real meaning and effect on the company as well as your career.

>>56965659
Accenture and other shit companies require a suit.

Microsoft, Dropbox, Google etc. are okay with a tshirt and shorts.

>>56965739
>a proper dress code increases productivity

Care to provide a source?

>>56965831
He won't because he works for HR (i.e. he's useless)

>>56966050
That person is not me (OP).

1st: I'm not a sjw-hr ""manager"". I actually do work.

2nd: It's not about productivity, it's about self respect. If someone doesn't care about himself he won't care about work either.

>>56965659
Most software companies let you wear whatever you want, times are a changin pops.

>>56965164
I refuse.
I'm in that group of 2 that you speak of.
I somehow waded my way through university and realized far too late that my prospects in life were shit.
So I quickly got recognition within the university by volunteering for special projects and research, and got myself known amongst the staff. I also asked professors with industry connections (almost all professors that have been around for a while are ``trusted" and are called by managers that need students) for work opportunities.
Now I'm miles ahead of everyone else at my school.

Would I help them? Not even if they asked. I look at everyone else in my university CS track and I see braindead retards. There are only a handful of people I consider competent, and they don't need my help to get their shit together.

Company OP works for must not be very big, relatively. Major companies don't have dress codes for software engineers. Technicians maybe.

>>56966117
>self respect
>dresses to please others regardless of personal taste or comfort

>>56965164
Dude outside of the person smelling or looking like they don't bathe, what someone wears has nothing to do with their competency. Wearing a monkey suit does not make you a good worker. In fact many of the most successful companies don't have a "dress code" like people are going to fucking middle school.

>>56965558
>only criminals go to court

Think before you type, anon.

>>56965614
>>56966171
>>56966215
Looks like you don't undestand the difference between "formal dress code" and "dress like a normal, decent person".

Nobody has to come with a suit or a shirt, some of the guys in my team come with just a t-shirt and a pair of jeans.

The important part? Their t-shirts are ironed and they come clean and shaved.

>>56966173
Yeah, that's the right decision. Always try to be ahead. I was ironic in the OP. Those people wouldn't change even if you wasted your time explaining everything to them.

I don't know if this is bait or not, but if it's not, you're one stupid faggot, OP. I can understand the smelling like shit part, but the whole dress code thing is kind of absurd for a junior dev position.

>>56965765
>>56966171
their work dress code has nothing to do with how you present yourself in the interview
holyshit exactly the people OP encountered

>>56966288
Well what they wear to work everyday probably doesn't matter and I doubt many companies have strict dress codes for their software engineers.

But if you come to an interview in shorts and a tee then you will look like you really just don't care and you shouldn't be surprised when you get passed up for some guy with comparable skills who chose to dress like he gives a shit.

>>56965659
What are you, a regional manager of Denny's? Jesus christ.

The only people I've ever met that insist that "appropriate work attire" is a suit, or a button down with a tie, and slacks, are people who work in shitty managerial positions for weak shit companies.

>>56965419
>Dress like you were going to court

court is a public space where your appearance can affect how you are judged by others, and so affect the outcome. sitting at a desk in a office typing into emacs is not an appropriate comparison, since the end user will never see my jorts and tank top.

>>56966340
Bruh, I went to my interview in a plaid button down, and some slim fit torn jeans. I mean, I looked nice, because it fit, and I didn't smell like shit, and looked decently groomed, but still.

>>56966274
>>56966288
>>56966339

Read my reply: >>56966328

Again: we don't have a formal dress code, but I won't hire people who come to an interview with an iron maiden t-shirt and some destroyed chucks.

>>56966343
Good point. I guess really all that matters is that you look good, like, everything fits and doesn't looks sloppy.

>>56966373
There's no way 16/21 people came in looking THAT bad. And even if they did, are you reporting to anyone, or are you the head decision maker when it comes to hiring people? If you have some asshole boss, I could understand, but if not, why the fuck would you care what some autist is wearing?

>>56966371
like >>56966373
said i >>56966340
didnt mean to dress formal but decent, and maybe a bit more decent than everyday work imo

>>56966373
>Again: we don't have a formal dress code, but I won't hire people who come to an interview with an iron maiden t-shirt and some destroyed chucks.

read: I want someone who will suck dick on the daily for a low pay junior position at my no-name firm

sorry, bud, no one gives a fuck if you don't hire them as an entry level shit shoveler, they will just get their requisite 6 months of bullshit experience somewhere else

Wew I'm glad I don't work for OP's company. Why the fuck should I make an effort to iron my clothes? Is that somehow going to make me program faster?

>>56966348

>a public space where your appearance can affect how you are judged by others
>affects the outcome
>interview, not day to day job
>outcome based on how you are judged by the dude hiring you

are you dumb

>>56966397
not him but nobody wants to work with somebody whos smells first of all, especially in an office

>>56965164
OP, did you consider that perhaps the quality of candidates you attract is reflection of your company?

>>56966431
I agree with the smelling part, just not the attire.

>>56965164
Theres so many companies that are willing to pay ridiculous amounts of money to software devs that why bother with some some stuffy that makes you wear a suit. Especially since most of those companies have the software devs in middle tier positions raising up the MBAs on their backs

>>56966347
That's not me.

>>56966348
It can actually change the outcome because I can decide not to hire them.

>>56966397
Not all of them were really that bad, some just looked like they didn't give a fuck.
I don't report to anyone, we are just 75 people in this company. The boss trusts my decisions.

Looks like /fa/ is leaking. I just wear jeans and a T-shirt/polo.

ITT: Anons revealing their age by typing

>>56966487
its a LARP thread you dingus. you really think a manager is going to be shitposting here during business hours?

>>56965164
not technology

>>>/biz/

>>56966518
Yes because they're not actually coding adding anything meaningful to the business.

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>>56966518
>He thinks that people with jobs are always working

>>56966518
It's lunch hour.

>>56966414
Not a low pay position.
If someone is stupid enough to hire them, then good for them.

>>56966416
> what is self respect
> there is nothing more to life than programming

>>56966460
3rd time I'm writing this: we don't have a formal dress code

>>56966444
No.

>>56966535
>he thinks that IT can't see what you browse

it's cool though, I'm sure no one will mind you looking at cartoon kiddie porn at work :^)

Probably because you're offering 40k salary

>>56965164
>opening for web dev position
>50% of applications show no programming knowledge - thrown out
>of the remaining 50%, half look like they were written by 6 year olds - thrown out
>call and email the remaining 25%, half do not pick up or respond
>of the remaining 12.5%, more than half are do not pass the phone interview, incapable of communicating, cannot answer SIMPLE questions:
>"What did you like and what did you not like in your previous job? "Huh?"
>"What did you enjoy and what did you hate in your previous job? "Huh?!!??!"
>"What made you happy and what made you sad in your previous job? "What does that mean?"
>Those that pass the SIMPLE phone interview are invited for a face to face interview
>...half do not show up for the interview.
>...the other half cannot solve FizzBuzz
I have been trying to hire a web developer for over a month. No dice.

>>56966487
This.

>>56966518
It's evening in Europe.

>>56966531
I do code from time to time.

>>56966554
>>No.

Sorry to tell you this, but your small firm probably has never produced anything of note, and so isn't good enough to attract top tier people. Accept the shitters or work harder yourself to build a better reputation.

>>56966601
See above

>>56966555
> implying IT guys at my company don't visit this website.

>>56966588
Again: not a low pay position.

>>56966601
The sad truth, which is actually a good news for competent people.

>>56966653
How much denari?

>>56966708
7k €/month (- taxes). This is Europe, so 7k a month is quite a lot.

>>56966653
>which is actually a good news for competent people
I remember that I used to think I am extremely lucky, because I needed to go to only 1 or 2 interviews to get a job.

...they call me asking if I am free, I say ok.
...they ask questions on the phone, I answer.
...they set an interview time, I show up.

I thought that these things are normal things that everyone does. Turns out, picking up the phone and showing up for interviews is enough to put you in the top 5%, and that is without taking your actual skills into consideration.

No joke. Being able to talk on the phone, and being able to present yourself at a specified time and location, puts your MILES ahead of the competition.

>>56965164
>tfw i wouldn't even get called in for in person interviews

>>56966733
Ignore the faggot comment from earlier. I will work there and suck your dick every lunch (no homo) and I can wear a suit everyday.

>>56966733
>This is Europe

theres your problem

>>56966117
Do you equate wearing jeans and a t-shirt with "not caring about your body"? You seem to have some pretty specific programmer dress-code in mind but when someone itt asks you just reply "hurr if you don't know you're a retard without a job"

>>56966518
>the entire internet is in the same time zone as I am

>>56966777
its just an excuse to reject most people so that he can feel self-important without actually applying any reasoning

>>56966733
where in europ
also what type of software, crud shit, webdev or more advanced?

>>56965164
>hiring people straight out of 3 year visual studio courses (ie american "CS")
>expecting competence

stop asking for degrees, start asking for portfolios.

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>be me
>be smart, pretty and congenial
>dress well
>have a kickass resume
>can give a good handshake, smile, and look interviewer in the eye
>didn't study CS in college and have minimal coding experience
>get multiple interviews and job offers for dev jobs anyway

Got a second round with MS later this month, bois. Y'all should really try cleaning yourselves up and selling yourselves better to prospective employers. Nobody wants to work with rude, standoffish dudes who think they're such ~pro hackers~ or whatever that they don't need to bother wearing deodorant or nice clothes to interviews.

>>56965603
>shave
oh, how about you go fuck yourself?

though I assume you're talking to people w/ scruff or neckbeards, not actual beards.

>>56965522
Did they come in furry suits? Yea I wouldn't hire them either

>>56966944
How can you have a kickass resume with minimal experience

>>56966777
>>56966850
Do you even read what I write?

> Looks like you don't undestand the difference between "formal dress code" and "dress like a normal, decent person".

> Nobody has to come with a suit or a shirt, some of the guys in my team come with just a t-shirt and a pair of jeans.

> The important part? Their t-shirts are ironed and they come clean and shaved.


> Again: we don't have a formal dress code, but I won't hire people who come to an interview with an iron maiden t-shirt and some destroyed chucks.

>>56966746
Not with a loser's attitude.

>>56966753
Top kek.

>>56966774
I don't see it.

>>56966872
Sorry, not gonna give more details than in the OP. There is some serious weaponised aut. on this website, I woudln't want to get doxed.

>>56966735
I'd wager people don't pick up because they got offers elsewhere and are too awkward to tell you directly.

>>56966653
The bad news for competent people is HR.

>>56966733
Woah, what state?
I'm european too, Italian.

>>56966909
> Europe.

>>56966987
I'm not HR, so I don't know for sure, but this could be true.

>>56966984
I'm fresh out of college but I worked on a lot of research projects. Plus, "computational physics" sounds a lot fancier than "janky Python sims".

>>56967061
Alright I interpreted "didn't study CS in college" as you not going to college.

what if people can't pick up the phone because they are at their current job?

>>56966984
>>56967061
Also, it's literally just a well-made resume that's precisely formatted and visually appealing. I print it on heavier stock off-white resume paper when I hand it into people in person because I care about how I'm presenting myself to prospective employers.

>>56966945
(You)

>>56967116
Yeah I figured it was also just a physically well put together resume, the experience thing just threw me off

>>56967090
"Hey, Mr. Goldbergman, my grandmother in [POOR EUROPEAN COUNTRY] is calling me. Do you mind if I take the call outside? It's kinda private. Thank you, sir."

>>56967116
Are you this guy?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cISYzA36-ZY

>>56967130
Yeah, oops, sorry if that wasn't clear enough friend.

>>56966173
Holy shit that's the douchiest thing I heard all day

>>56967160
No it totally made sense once you first explained it.

>>56967161
Not if you want to reach the top.

wagecucks dont belong on /g/

>>56966944
>Nobody wants to work with rude, standoffish dudes who think they're such ~pro hackers~ or whatever that they don't need to bother wearing deodorant or nice clothes to interviews.

>hiring people for how they dress/smell instead of coding ability
No wonder windows is so shit.

>>56967182
>want to reach the top
>spend free time shitposting on romanian basket painting forum

>>56967182
That's a smart use of resources and I do wish everyone in college would make the most of it like that. But the second half of that post was so pretentious that I was waiting for that guy to cum on the mirror.

>>56966555
>he thinks IT gives a fuck

If it's not blocked on the company firewall, it's fair game. Also you do know how https works, right?

>>56966944
I showed up to a MS interview with a shirt with ketchup stains on it and they still gave me an offer.

>>56967204
>hiring people for how they dress/smell instead of coding ability
it's both, actually. have you ever worked in a small office with 4+ other dudes?

>>56967259
Did they offer you napkins?

>>56967259
Nice

>>56967190
>he doesn't want money for nice technology

>>56965164
>Not hiring the hobo coder.
How cruel.

>>56965164
what kinds of questions do you ask at interviews?

>>56967342
>Show me your fizzbuzz, boi.

>>56966944
>2nd round
It's fucking nothing

>>56965614
An interview's dress code is not the day to day job's dress code

Interviewers do shit like that to weed out the autists with the social intelligence of a goldfish, because they'd shit up the workplace if hired

see: SJWs, the herald of the nu-male

>>56965164
>Do they even teach you something at college?
Yes, they taught me computer science and mathematics. I went to a good school to actually learn. Not train for a job.

This is just the home board whenever i load up cover but your interview is the nicest you will ever dress for your job. Like unless your specific job involves wearing a suit you will almost never dress that nicely for that job again if you are hired

So are people with beards just written off immediately or what?

>>56967494
Clean shaven will always be the professional look.

>>56965164
Where are you located op? Jus curiois

>>56967508
Well, yeah I get that but all else being equal, you'd put a guy with a good beard below a clean shaven guy in an interview?

>>56965739
Thank you, now I can actually use this.

>There is a reason companies want people who dress well. A proper dress code increases productivity amongst other things that boost moral and employee relations. The saying dress for success isn't just something "boring" professionals say to newbies, it has a real meaning and effect on the company as well as your career.

If someone trying to hire me asked me why are you dressing formally or something related. I would reply

"Some would say - what you said- but personally I chose the most positive standard option and let myself be easygoing if the situation requires it.

>tfw there are people who manage to graduate college without having ever heard "dress well, test well"

Dress nice for yourself, dummies. You'll come across as confident and as taking the interview seriously.

>>56967227
senpai, all I meant to say is that I'm ahead of everyone at my own university.
I'm still garbage compared to people who got their shit together early enough to go to places like UCB, Caltech, and MIT.

Fact is, a large amount of people don't have the resources to take themselves to such places.

Even so, you have to work with what you've been given. I might consider myself competent, but it is nothing more than the truth that a staggering amount of people at my university are braindead.

>>56967560
not him, but it's more often than not the dunning-kruger of the beard world. people with shit beards can't recognize that they have a shit beard, so it's just better to go in clean.

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>>56965419
>Anyway, just dress like some normal person and try to shave your face.
Trusting developers without a proper beard.

>>56967394
>you must conform to my arbitrary standard that has no relevancy at all to the position you applied for

sounds like the interviewers are the autistic ones here

>>56967016
>Italian
>European
pick one

>>56967671
Interesting perspective. Now I'm having doubts in my beard..

They don't build you up to be the perfect job candidate in the CS department in my college like they do with the business school.

>be senior, introverted guy with deep social anxiety
>finally started going to networking events, hackathons, job fairs, etc. basically taking of the actual opportunities given to me in college
>realize that no one in my major is taking advantage of these things
>Out of 50 people that registered for a job fair prep seminar, only 10 students showed up
>Basically get one-on-one training on how to interview and present myself to employers, and they also helped me write my resume
>Go to job fair and do pretty well
>notice that a lot of my peers are fucking up hard
>get interviews with 3 out of 4 companies I talked to
>got a job offer from a fortune 100 company, which I took

I'm not even good at programming. I just was slightly less autistic because of all of the networking and preparation events I went to. Take advantage of that shit while you're in school. You don't have to be perfect, but just be better than the next guy the talk to. I'm just like the tallest midget here. Also wear a suit.

>all these nasty basement dwellers getting triggered itt
kek

>>56967770
I live on the top floor of an apartment. I'd love to live in a basement.

>>56967758
>got a job offer from a fortune 100 company
>I'm not even good at programming.

THIS IS HOW WINDOWS 10 HAPPENS

>>56967816
Kek. Luckily for you, it wasn't a tech company.

>>56967796
Nah man having the sounds of feet over you all day fucking sucks, top apartment is the best spot

Can I get away with knowing fuckall if I dress good enough?

A friend talked his supervisor into giving me an interview for a fairly respectable company; the position is about developing embedded software for cars in C. I haven't touched C since sophmore year

>>56967724
take a long hard look at it in the mirror. if you can see your chin or jawline through the hair, you'll want to put more work into it. a little self doubt isn't a bad thing. what's that old quote?
"the problem is that smart people have doubts and idiots have confidence"

>>56965164
I don't understand why people are bashing you for this. It seems like a totally reasonable approach. If people don't understand that they should dress up for an interview and present their "best self" that means they don't know how the world works. If you don't understand that, it means you probably don't interact well with other (read not going to be team player/work well with others). Strict dress codes are stupid but to say that the way you dress has no prediction to they way you work is absolutely false. I've never interviewed for a coding job, but God damn I've never been to a job interview and not got the job so apparently less and less people my age get that.

>>56965164
>how to shave
why would you turn someone down for having a beard that is dumb

>>56965164
i prefered to be dressed nicely and all but i would rather have a badly dressed hipster that knows his shit instead of the nicely dressed guy that just knows less. i think you are doing a non optimal business decision by not regarding people who just dind't fit the dress code.

>>56967928
Are you referring to the thickness of the hair? If so, mine blocks any light from hitting the skin. It's not Stallman tier yet but, in time.

>>56967937
>being so desperate that you samefag your own OP to agree with yourself

>>56967937
As a side note, the last interview I went to I was told that I was told by the interviewer that I was the only person he had ever interviewed that came wearing a tie, shook his hand, and looked him in the eye while we talked. To a 50k a year job(not huge I know, but not fucking McDonald's). Got the job on the spot. Go in looking nice and you'll get jobs people. It really works.

>>56968024
Wut?

>>56967724

Unless you are literally Ryan Reynolds or some other 10/10 aesthetic af, shave your beard if you're going for an interview.

The fact that you're questioning this about yourself because of an anonymous post on 4chan is evidence enough that you're not.

>>56967937

They're bashing them for this because they've been raised as special snowflakes in their safe space. Take a look here, the amount of autistic REEEs who are getting assblasted about keeping their appearance up is astonishing.

Employers would rather hire an 80% efficient guy who improves workplace morale and is fun to be around over a 90% efficient assburger who makes the workplace awkward and nobody likes talking to them. Yet of course they'll say "WELL I'D HIRE THE PERSON WHO IS BEST QUALIFIED FOR THE JOB REGARDLESS OF HOW THEY DRESS", without understanding that humans work better when the workplace is more comfortable and enjoyable, and the vast majority of humans are highly social.

When you're sitting across from someone you could potentially be working with, you don't want to hire the guy who smells bad and can't take care of themselves. You want the professional one who is easy to talk to and won't embarrass you when some other manager asks why the hell you hired a cave troll. If you control the people who make up your work environment that you'll be interacting with every day, you want that interaction to be as easy and laid back as possible. Work is stressful enough already, there's no need to make it even more stressful by filling the workplace with autists who only respond in single word sentences and wear My Little Pony 4XL size shirts.

I don't get why people ITT associate dress code with smell. Not to wash is one thing, dressing is another.

I wear nothing but blank t-shirts and jeans, and only failed 1 interviews out of maybe 6 or 7 I've had.

>Work for a relatively large IT company

Dress code is casual. Wear what you want as long as it's not offensive etc. I normally rock up in t-shirt&jeans and a jacket or hoodie.

Interview however expects you to dress formally. I wore a suit. This is pretty standard throughout the entire industry. Stop being autistic about it.

>>56968051
How do you explain all the programmers with beards? Seems to me like you can't grow one and so are shitting on people who can.

>>56968051
>8 new posts
>0 new IPs

come on OP are you even trying at least get a proxy for one of them

>>56966945
or any sort of styled facial hair
it looks stupid, why would you allow the hair of your living body to invade your face? and be somehow proud of that?

>>56968091
No, the professional look has always been clean shaven. Most stereotypical "nu-male" types think that because they have a patchy beard they're the best thing in the world.

>>56968051
How does questioning myself due to a post on 4chan have any relevance to anything? I trust what I read here more than what I read on YouTube or social media or (insert shitty website). Where do you suggest I get my beard in the workplace information from? Kek

>>56968130
My beard isn't patchy nor am I a numale but I see your point.

>>56965164
Hire more of your precious pajeets and then come back crying in 5 years when your ebin enterprise has shit tanked stupid faggot

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>>56968127
Bitch please, I'd walk out of an interview if they said anything about shaving. We have a word for men without beards: women.

>>56965164
>Guys teach your classmates at college how to dress, how to shave and how to shower.

And give them a possible advantage? As if.

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>>56965164
The thing with physical appearance is that in itself it holds no value, but it will act as a multiplicator, in some way, or whatever people think you are.

pic related pretty much.

If you look nice, most people, especially females, will be more biased toward having a positive opinion of you, more so than if they had just read about you on paper. The opposite is true if you are physically unattractive.

Clothing not considered, if you are attractive and look confident/healthy/kind/etc., being dressed originally may actually play in your favor. Since people will have positive bias toward you, they will rationalize anything unexpected from you as something good, they will think you are authentic or confident, or whatever they may think.

If you are actually ugly, you better meet their expectations, because as soon as anything in you is slightly deviating form the norms, they will associate it with something bad.

There are people out there who fall in love with famous, televised, very dangerous criminals, without having ever met them, and want to meet them once they get out of jail. It doesn't happen that much, but it is definetely a thing. If these criminals aren't attractive, it never happens though.

>>56968215
I like the cut of your jib. You can fuck my sister.

>>56967867
>Basement - flooding
>Top floor - rain
Luckily I got a 2nd floor apartment during the flood

>>56968215
Kill yourself please.

>>56968215
Radical islamic terrorism may put an end to that fashion, soon.

>>56968256
t. nu male

>>56968283
>you're amazing at programmer and your body of work is clearly impressive
>but you are wearing a shirt and jeans instead of a suit so we're going to have to ask you to fuck off

I wouldn't want to work at such a corporate shitty meatgrinder anyway.

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>>56965164
>turn up to a customer support interview for some tech firm
>get up at 5am, ironed and drycleaned clothes, black shirt, tie, dress pants, nothing really obtrusive or try-hard but still formal
>clean shaven, hair cut
>travel for 2 hours on public transport
>arrive 30 minutes early, end up waiting 2 more hours in lobby
>hiring manager appears and apologises
>asks me to take a "typing test" on some ancient beige crapbox on the customer service floor, disappears to his office
>literal "spell the word 'cat'" shit
>everyone around me is eating pizza from tupperware boxes, wearing meme t-shirts, covered in grease, eating chocolate, playing on phones, shouting and cackling about tv shows etc
>finish test and wait another 30 minutes
>enter office
>asks a bunch of questions, i try to be friendly but it seems like i'm giving the wrong answers or something
>shakes my hand, thanks me for coming
>never heard from them again
Well, okay.

>>56968215
t. Reddit

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>>56965419
>Dress like you were going to court
?

>>56968296
I'm inclined to agree with you. People just entering the tech field don't really have that luxury though.

>>56965164
Because you don't know how to recruit worth shit.

>>56968296
If you are really good, and all other applicants are bad or at best mediocre, the clothing will be irrelevant. Except if the people deciding are HR people who couldn't understand anything technical out of your mouth, of course.

>>56965419
>>56965419
>some of the weirdos were good, but I'm not gonna hire someone who hasn't respect for his own body.


Hiring people based on smell rather than efficiency at their job is incredibly stupid.

>>56968364
Idk anon I don't think it's too much to ask someone to shower if they're going to be around others.

>>56968296
Did you ever consider that you can be talented and simultaneously not look like a slob? If I'm choosing between two equally talented candidates in all other respects and one showed up to their interview looking serious about the job and the other looks like they walked in off the street, you'd better believe I'm going to pick the one who puts in the extra effort.

>>56965164
If you're a manager trying to recruit you need to get off your ass and network. The only people that job hunt in computers/software/IT are people that have no place in it.

How many of you guys actually have a job though?

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well what woulds you prefer mister interviewer something like this?

>>56968376
I do wear suits to interviews and I am
>>56968296
why are you equating wearing a tshirt and jeans to being a slob. It's not the same. You're an idiot. I'm just saying that if that is your final comparison criteria for choosing a candidate you're an idiot and are doing them favors by not hiring them and forcing them to work for your retarded ass.

>>56968398
no you fucking fedoralord dress like a regular human in business casual clothes

>>56968296
>>56968215
>>56968342
>>56968340

neets

>>56968382
That's a ridiculous statement.

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>>56968404
so more something like this then?

>>56968301
They already had someone, I'd say. But since no one ever gives a shit about anybody else, of course they won't bother saving you time.

Chances are the hiring manager didn't even know they had someone. I'm always astounded at the poor communication occuring in some offices/businesses.

I'm a translator for the government, and I was in-house at one of their organisations this summer. I translated a 30000 words 2015 report in may, and then last september they asked me to translate the 2016 one, but they told me "we don't have the 2015 one for a template you could base the 2016 on".

When I told them I already had it, they were confused as fuck. I had to send it to them again, 4 months later, as if it was new. It never got published back in may, and no one noticed or cared.

Basically, taxpayers money would have been completly wasted, should I have stopped working with them before september.

Don't overestimate the corporate world. No one really gives a shit in there. People work to go home at 5. Most of our economy is in the service sector, our economy and our money is virtual, most of us never produce anything, we just are facilitator for someone else's work, which is as useless as our work.

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>>56968422
>neet
yeah, no. currently employed and currently bearded.

>>56968435
do you really need to dress like the doctor? pick the tenth at least

>>56965164
What the fuck is hipster clothes?

I thought everyone years suits

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>>56968538
>tenth
>buisness casual

and i am only citging examples maybe something like max normal is more your speed?

>>56968296
I've come to conclusion that I will not go to any interview in a suit nor will I ever work at a company with a dress code of business casual or above. Even if I would get the job it's not worth the shit that I'd have to endure on a daily basis.

>>56968628
>wearing a suit is uncomfortable
Wew.

>>56968628
Stop being autistic. Most jobs even with the most casual dress codes expect you to attend the interview in business attire.

>>56968682
He might be fat or something

>>56968682
It's not about the comfort. It's just a sign that the company is shit.

>>56965164

This was probably my worst experience in a job interview.

>drop out of university after 4 semesters CS, spent most of my time smoking weed and jerking off
>move in back home, need to find a job
>see advertisement for a security/pentesting company
>oh neat, I've got basic knowledge about linux and I read alot of papers regarding security in my freetime, definitely interested to learn more
>get invited to interview
>sit down with ceo and hr manager (small company so it was one fat guy and his ugly ass wife)
>the usual chit chat begins (mind you at that point I was still anxious as fuck around people and I'm not good at holding conversations).
>since they do alot of monitoring for clients he asks me "what do you know about SMNP"
>shit, this is the moment I knew would come
>totally spaghetti
>red face
>start stuttering
>"w-w-what did you say?"
>"SMNP, do you know something about it ?"
>"I-I-I'm sorry do you mean the mail protocol ?"
>"SIERRA MIKE NOVEMBER PAPA"
>at this point I'm thinking about just running out of the office
>manage to explain that I've never heard of it.
>"Ok I don't think this will lead to anything anon".
>almost in tears now because social anxiety is kicking in
>"w-w-will I hear from you again?"
>"maybe as an intern"
>said goodbye, left, and spent the next hour sitting my car staring at the steering wheel thinking how I could fuck up like that.

>>56968756
Even if you're fat, wearing a well fitted suit is far from uncomfortable. Clearly trying to get away with wearing the one he wore to prom 3 years ago.

>>56968767
>having a dress code means your company is shit
You have to go back.

>>56968772
>drop out of university after 4 semesters CS, spent most of my time smoking weed and jerking off
Kinda hard to emphasize with with you there bruh

>>56968772

fuck, oviously I meant snmp

>>56968823
>going to prom

>>56968862
Good point.

>>56966944
>that they don't need to bother wearing deodorant

well, I'm not a smelly Pajeet, therefore no pocket chemtrail for me

>>56966944
>being non social is rude now

well i guess im one of the biggest assholes on the planet then just cause i am not much of a talker

>>56968940
>well, I'm not a smelly Pajeet, therefore no pocket chemtrail for me
for the longest time i thought this was an exaggeration, but for the longest time there wasn't a single pajeet within miles of me.

ive moved to the city and they're everywhere, and holy shit they smell like sweat, curry, and axe body spay. what the fuck.

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>>56965164
Based on your grammar, i have high doubts you ever hired anyone

>>56968840
Go back where? To my current job where I can wear whatever I want?

>>56969048
ever think maybe he knows he is on some silly image board and just doesnt care? 4chan is about as important as the shit in your toilet

>>56968467
Do you know if there are any tells that a company is that inefficient from the perspective of a job seeker?

>>56969087
why does he bother then?

>>56968695
I usually wear business casual to interviews. I do try tomake sure what their dress code is before the interview and skip the places that demand suits. And I live in northern Europe where business formal has never really landed outside top management and people who deal with customers, where it can be the appropriate thing to wear.

>>56968682
>>56968756
>>56968823
>>56968840
It's not that I find suits uncomfortable. I have a well fitted suit that I don't mind wearing for the occasions where it's appropriate. However working in an office with the same people every day isn't a reason for wearing a suit. And no matter how well the suit is fitted it isn't as comfortable as t shirt and shorts/slacks/jeans. Especially when I'm in an office full of freezing women who insist on cranking the heat up so that even t shirt feels a bit warm.

>>56968767
>>56968840
It's a sign that the company has tons of middle management that does everything in their power to seem important. Enforcing a dress code for office workers is one of the ways they can make themselves feel more important. It's also a sign that they're stuck in archaic ways and are very strict in how things work. Yes it's possible to work in a company like that but it comes with the cost of your soul.

You guys are retarded
You are only supposed to wear a suit for the interview
Are you telling me you dont have a single suit in your wardrobe?

>>56969122
maybe he is bored? why would anyone post here other than that?

>>56965571
then don't apply for a job working as a corporate sheep.

you fucking imbecile.

a manager's biggest fear is being outed as an incompetent
they're not in a production position anymore for a reason
they weren't valuable enough to stay there

of course they avoid hiring talent

>>56968215
N U M A L E
U
M
A
L
E

>>56969113
I think the bigger some company is, the more disorganized it will be. Not because people are incompetent or idiots, but really because people don't care and don't have an incentive to care. When your company is 5-6 people, if someone isn't working properly, the consequence will be strongly felt, either on profit, or some project will have 20% of it badly done, etc.

When your company is tens of thousands of people, some branch is making you lose a bit of money, but the guys at the top are well-living enough to let it go, at least for a while.

I have a hard time conceiving how people who created companies that bring them millions of dollars per year can still care as strongly as when they started, when their own decisions had a direct impact on their profit at the end of the month. When asked, they will all say that they still care, because it looks good, but I doubt so many really do. They are set for life and they know it, so they are probably much more tolerant of the bullshit going on in their own company. Kinda like when you write a huge program, at first you plan your code thoroughly, comment everything and put everything in an uniform manner. But after 20000 lines of code, there are some messes in your code, you know it, but it just werks, so you don't bother polishing it. I'm not talking about optimization here, mostly aesthetics and consistency things.

The truth is also that many employees are only partly essential, or too specialized, so they end up not really working 60% of the time. Not everyone has something to do all the time, but they are still paid to come in 9 to 5 everyday, because micromanaging their exact, optimal schedule would be a pain in the ass. Tasks will come up unexpectedly, and you can't get rid of them altogether, because then no one will do that task when it comes up, if it does come up.

I've been applying to co-ops for this coming spring and this thread makes me feel much better.

>>56969048
>>56969122
English is not my first language but what's the problem with my grammar?
Are there mistakes in my OP?

>>56969087
>>56969144
This. I was bored after work.

>>56969230
>numales sayng bad or insulting things about women

you dont even know what a numale is do you?

>>56965164
Always wear a well fitted suit. It shows you have at least some concept of social convention.

just watch how baby boomers and gen X parent and you'll find out

>>56969375
you missed a comma or two - just reads like a native speaker that's a bit lazy, it's not exactly a big deal

>>56966171
True, but for an interview you dress up, and in general you need to dress well if you ever want to be promoted to a position that matters.

>>56969448
I think it's an american thing mostly. Here in Canada, only some old fields like finance and law push the traditional suit, tie, briefcase.

In other fields, you are expected to dress like people on TV ads for domestic products, basically what you'd imagine an "average person" wearing.

>>56967306
dumpster diving gives great rewards

>>56969444
Ok, thanks. I wanted to be sure I don't write like an idiot or something.

>>56965164
>Been involved in hiring 5 different devs now.
>~60% of applications tossed out by hr for not meeting the minimum requirements/general alphabet soup word search they do
>Of the remaining 40% many of the resumes have horrible grammer and spelling errors everywhere.
>We select the best of them and proceed to phone interviews
>Many of them cannot answer simple questions like
>Why should the id field on a database table contain unique values/no duplicates.
>What is the difference between a strictly typed language and a dynamically typed one.
>Describe the difference between a depth first search and a breadth first search.

Life is hell

>>56967232
>I'm le anonymous because of https
Wew

>>56969530
Strict typing is completely orthogonal from dyanmic typing. I'm sure glad I don't have to work with you.

>>56969578
do you or do you not?

>>56969530
I bet there were some self-taughts with many projects under their belts in that 60% who weren't as idiotic.

>>56969530
>Many of them cannot answer simple questions like
>Why should the id field on a database table contain unique values/no duplicates.
>What is the difference between a strictly typed language and a dynamically typed one.
>Describe the difference between a depth first search and a breadth first search.

What the fuck? Is this really true? t. student

>>56969301
I've thought to myself for a while now that I'd like to work in an SME rather than some big multinational player. I think your speculation is probably true for the most part, thanks.

>>56969530
How fucked would I be if i knew that stuff but couldnt explain it?

>>56969667
Nope. All the non idiots already have jobs.

>>56969707
That's part of what they're testing. If you can write code, but can't explain it to your coworkers, you're not a particularly valuable team member.

>>56969667
Probably, but the unfortunate part of working at a large company is the bureaucracy. EVERY applicant must make it through the HR process before anyone else can even look at it, so I have no idea why the 60% were rejected, but most likely you are right, experience that many would consider similar to the requirements, but not close enough for people that have no idea what the technical jargun actually means.

That is why you need to customize your resume for EVERY company and position you apply for. Use the same language as the job description. If you don't, you may get rejected due to fucktarded HR.

>>56969707
Do the best you can to describe it, or better yet say something like, "not sure quite how to describe it but...".

However, if you don't know don't start rambling off some bull shit. That is an instant no hire if the person starts to try to BS in the interview.

>>56969707
if you can't even superficially regurgitate a sentence or two about it, you probably don't know it that well.

>>56965500
>>56965571
>>56965614
>>56965765
>>56966171
>>56966215
>>56966339
>>56966347
>>56966348

ITT: fucking millennials

>>56969582
Thinking about this, is there any way to do dynamic typing outside of an interpreted language (built in a strictly typed language)?

>>56969901
Yes. It's called casting.

>>56969961
How is that not still strict typing?

>>56965419
>Dress like you were going to court, does that make sense to you?
Are you sure you're not one of the weirdos you keep going on about? You can't even answer a simple question about how a normal person dresses. Fucking weirdo.

>>56969984
Do you even know what strict typing is?

>>56968083
Yup, same where I work. Most people just wear jeans and a tshir to work every day, the managers and lead engineers only wear suits when they have a meeting with vips.

But everyone is expected to wear a suit when they show up for an interview or we wouldn't hire them. It is important to show that you own a suit and can clean up. It shows that you could be invited to an important meeting without embarrassing the department.

>>56969984
strict typing means a type can never be changed.

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>Get asked to assist with technical interviews
>looking through a candidates github
>find a repository called "/g/ programming challenges"

mfw

>>56970043
shoulda put nepotism to work mate

>>56968301
Sometimes the hiring manager already knows who they want to hire, could be a friend or family member, whatever. But they still need to go through the hiring process so they can pretend that the best candidate just happened to be the one they wanted to hire.

I grew my majestic UNIX beard out once I was already established in my position. Nobody cares what I look like anymore, as I've proven I know what I'm doing.

>>56970043
I gave him the green light but it was not entirely up to me. He didnt get hired because he didnt answer his phone when we tried to schedule a second interview. I was right to suspect him of being a sperg

Reading these threads is not good for me. I'm never gonna get a fucking job after graduating.

>>56968772
You should of asked about the intern thing. See if they would let you come on as a minimum wage employee so you can learn for a year or something.

>>56967182
Reach the top, then die like all the rest. Good effort, but it means jack shit.

>>56970017
Literally been on a meetings with the CEO and other top brass of multi billion dollar company I work for wearing t shirt and jeans. And so was everyone else who wasn't top management. No one batted an eye. Got the job after showing up to interview in slacks and a button up.

>>56970043
That's when you go in the interview and grill him on memes the entire time to see just how well he knows his shit.

>>56968823
>Prom
>Suit
Bitch you wear tux to prom, not a fucking suit.

>>56970140
Dress nice, take a shower and make sure you resume isn't shit. Also, apparently bringing a pen helps.

>>56970147
This is just being pedantic. No one is saying you have to wear a suit to every interview, but we are saying you need to at least dress like it's important to you.

>>56965164
I would definitely not hire anyone who couldn't be bothered to make themselves not smell/look like shit for an interview.
It's not very much effort, and it just says that you don't care much.

Even if normal work attire is t-shirts and shorts, you should dress up for an interview.

>>56970412
I just wore a suit and tie to all mine. Seeing as I have a job, apparently that was a good idea.

>>56970521
I would think that's all you'd need, but I don't have a job yet so I'm not speaking from experience here.

>>56965164
My employer takes in about 5% of applicants.
wcyd. Needs to be a "fit" I guess.

>>56966050
>HR (i.e. he's useless)
I know that feel.

>>56965558
>No, I don't go to court.

>what is jury duty

>>56966307
criminal, corrupted politics, parrots are both

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>>56966944
just be yourself :^)

>>56969893
So fucking retarded.

"Ayy lets have people who have no idea what they're looking for in a hire, look for a hire, instead of having the people with expertise do it!

>>56968364
No. He isn't the only person in the damn building. Nobody wants colleges who fucking stink.

If I don't have to leave the house for a few days I don't bother showering either, but if you leave your damn house fucking wash yourself.

>>56968682
Suits are comfy as fuck.

Now ties, on the other hand...

I looked pretty shitty when I got my senior developer job, so I can't relate.. Maybe it's an American thing

Don't get me wrong, I showered and smelled fine, but didn't shave, nor cut my hair, nor wear any special clothing whatsoever... I don't think I even cut my fingernails

Real talk: my quality of life has gone down the fucking shitter since I got my web dev job, fuck working, I just want to be a neet again no lie

Most college students are basically still children. I'm sorry but they might do well in a classroom setting, but most are just extremely sheltered, probably just go to school and hang out with friend for 4 years.

>>56971678
I think they smelled a no lifer and knew you'd put up with weekends

>>56971860
Meh whatever, I learned a lot in a short period of time, and have a great salary

I'm happy

>>56965558
>>56965614
>>56966348
>>>56967672 # >>56968324 # >>56968364 # >>56969990 #

Maybe I actually have a chance at an interview after all.

>>56971972
Not with quotes like that you don't.

>>56965558
>never had jury duty
underageb& detected

>>56972163
I'm 30, have voted every election, and have never been selected for jury duty.

Happens when you live in areas that aren't high in crime, you should probably move.

>>56971972
epic simply epic

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>the suit meme still exists

>>56972163
you sure as shit dont dress up when going to jury duty, the last you want is to actually be picked.

although when i lived in california i straight up never showed every time i got the letter. never got in trouble for it either

>>56965331
Not OP, but if you're interviewing for an office job, wear a 2 piece suit, tie, and make sure the outfit isn't clashing. If it's your first suit, get navy and look up shirt, shoe, tie, belt combos that go with it. And for the love of God, make sure it fits correctly

I don't get why people can't dress and just keep their hair in order. We've had the disasterously shit fashion from the 00s and now teenagers give in to shittier haircuts and beards as if they think this will grant them originality while wearing suits and cutting hair short is the oppsite because le 'tear down the wall' meme. I fucking hate western civilization if the trends keep going that way.

>>56965164
Agreed
Here's a story from a co-worker
>we work in a company that does small scale IT projects for small sized corporations, nothing too grand but we do good what we do
>don't have too many employees since small company, just some very good ones
>co-worker goes with HR people as technical advice when they go to the local university to hire computer science engineering students for recruitment
>most CS are fucking retards with no knowledge, theoretical OR practical
>most have problem figuring out simple bitwise operation problems, which isn't that big of a deal but it does show their detachment from what they learn
>most had generic, bland and synthetic as fuck projects. I mean 4 people in the class made a bank management software as project. Who the fuck would make a bank management software out of their own free will?
>guys with whole bundles of certificates from certification courses couldn't explain simple concepts
>there was even this girl who claimed "Linux" was a programming language when asked about what programming languages she knew

In the end they ended up hiring two guys from electronics engineering department. They were surprisingly better programmers than CS fuckers for some reason

>>56972648
>didn't hire CS people
>"our people were definitely better programmers"

>>56972648
I can believe this. I've taken advanced math and CS courses from average colleges and good colleges. There is a huge difference in how the courses for CS were taught while there isn't as much of a difference in how well the math courses were taught. I think the main problem with CS education is that there is no widely used standard way that CS courses are taught because of how new the field is.

>>56969900
get off of 4chan grandpa

>>56972740
This
I believe this is what makes the difference. Half the colleges think CS is about solving math problems and proving algorithm efficiency, which it is, and the other half of the colleges think CS is about knowing a programming language, which it is but not limited to.

>>56972673
Results talk anon
Actually, even talking to a well read wise person will tell you the difference between him and a less read one

>tfw it's happening

I have to update my résumé and probably take out the lies

>>56972920
Same boat. I might have pretended too much on my resume.
Now they're going to ask me about it.

Stop bullying me please.

>>56972740
>>56972916
this is a pretty big problem imo. not a lot of people use the same definition of CS. Computer Science /should/ refer to the theoretical foundations that make computers possible. A lot of people, though, think the reverse, that CS is about the things you can do with a computer.

It's kinda understandable there's a lack of consensus since the field blew up into literally running the world ~100 years after its conception, but that just shows the importance to standardize.

>>56965614
>Who the fuck would want to work at a company with that formal dresscode? Must be shitty company culture overall.

You're just trying to impress the interviewer. I'd wear a suit to just about any interview.
>>56965765
>Microsoft, Dropbox, Google etc. are okay with a tshirt and shorts.
>>56966171
>Most software companies let you wear whatever you want, times are a changin pops.
>>56966215
>Major companies don't have dress codes for software engineers
>>56966328
>Nobody has to come with a suit or a shirt, some of the guys in my team come with just a t-shirt and a pair of jeans.

I'd still wear a suit to the interview.

>>56966343
>Well what they wear to work everyday probably doesn't matter and I doubt many companies have strict dress codes for their software engineers.
>But if you come to an interview in shorts and a tee then you will look like you really just don't care and you shouldn't be surprised when you get passed up for some guy with comparable skills who chose to dress like he gives a shit.
This.

>>56966348
>court is a public space where your appearance can affect how you are judged by others, and so affect the outcom
Basically, so is a job interview.

>>56966397
>why the fuck would you care what some autist is wearing?
Because he doesn't want to hire autists to be part of his team. He wants coders who can be part of a group and not need special handling like some unique snowflake.

You don't need people you can drink with (plenty of managers hire that way and it builds terrible dev teams) but you do need people you can deal with without having to put on your 'dealing with Dave again' hat. You need to just tell people that shit has to happen and have it happen. Eccentrics that reject corporate culture probably reject time-sheeting, task-tracking, deadlines, coding standards...all things that matter to managers and make their jobs easier.

>>56966414
>suck dick on the daily for a low pay junior position at my no-name firm
90% of IT jobs.

>>56973108
>time-sheeting, task-tracking, deadlines
Jesus, there are people who seriously put up with this bullshit? If not wearing a suit saves me time in not dealing with such bullshit companies then I'm sure glad that that's what I've been doing my entire life.

>>56965164
>hiring a CS graduate to program

I would fire you for not going after software engineering students.

>basing your selections off of what they wear

what is this, business/management? it's almost as if applicants are actually educated in something technical and in demand so they don't have to desperately cling onto illusions of "soft skills" to try to convince people they're worth anything

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How would you interviewer folk feel about someone turning up in some fresh jays?

>>56973108
why did you quote only my posts?

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Nothing wrong with dressing well, I don't know why it gets such a bad rap.

>>56973150
>Jesus, there are people who seriously put up with this bullshit? If not wearing a suit saves me time in not dealing with such bullshit companies then I'm sure glad that that's what I've been doing my entire life.
IKTF...

But time-sheeting is how you charge clients and how managers manage team performance. They want to know how long tasks take and whether they're being done in the quoted time. This improves future quotes/estimates and lets managers know how long work takes to do. This lets sales accurately quote for work.

Task tracking means the PM knows how the project is doing and what tasks are outstanding, how much longer stuff will take and whether to divert senior people to salvage a task that's going badly.

>Deadlines
If you can't handle deadlines then you're the type of special snowflake that nobody wants on their team.

>>56973748
>why did you quote only my posts?
Apparently I only agreed/disagreed with you?

Assuming you're OP, I think you backpedalled too far on what is acceptable attire for interviews. No interviewer cares if someone overdresses for an interview, they just say "Oh sorry, meant to tell you not to dress up for the interview" and move on. The opposite though...

Of course, for your second job, "What is the dress code?" is a question that you ask on the phone interview and you turn up dressed appropriately.

>>56974167
>But time-sheeting is how you charge clients and how managers manage team performance. They want to know how long tasks take and whether they're being done in the quoted time. This improves future quotes/estimates and lets managers know how long work takes to do. This lets sales accurately quote for work.
>clients
Wew. I'm sure glad I don't work at a shitty outsourcing company.

bros ive got my first interview with cerner in a few days for an internship. its on hirevue basically skype . any tips or just like general advice on interviews. do i need to suit it up even if its online? i really wanna land this job

>>56974230
First thing, relax a little. Just wear a dress shirt and nice pants. Something comfortable.

The most important thing as an intern are projects you did outside of school. Chances are that they are also interview your classmates and have heard them talk about doing the same boring projects every time. If you can differentiate yourself with cool personal projects, you will land a job.

Source: landed a 16 month internship making 60k a year

>>56965164
>picking up software developers based on looks
you deserve to be fucking fired for incompetence

>>56969018

it was always rude, how have you not realized this

>>56974377
thanks anon. I'm a computer engineering student but i applied for software development. i've got a portfolio with some decent projects that i did for fun. along with random shit i did on github. im just nervous that they'll think i cant make up my mind on why i'm not looking for work on my major and they'll think i cant stick to something.

>>56974176
>clients
>outsourcing
Even internal clients are still clients.

No PM wants to run a project and not know how long it's going to take.

>>56974983
It's impossible to estimate how long a project is going to take. I'm glad I work for an employer that lets me work at my own pace instead of constantly breathing down my neck trying to micromanage everything that I do.

>>56974377
>dress shirt and nice pants
Perfectly adequate for a skype interview.

>>56974230
>do i need to suit it up even if its online? i
The more professional you're dressed, the more professional you'll feel. Half of wearing a suit is kidding yourself that you're a grown-up now.

>>56974987
>It's impossible to estimate how long a project is going to take
It's impossible to KNOW how long a project is going to take. It's totally possible to estimate, that's what an estimate is, it's your best judgement, based on experience and provided data, on what something will turn out to be. Timesheets, project burndowns, all that shit...it's data on what is happening now and useful experience to improve accuracy on future estimates.

I mean, I hate micromanagement too and I push bac, but it's a reality. If you can't internalise some professional discipline then you're not going to be a top-notch software engineer, you'll just be a code monkey that managers hate using on important work.

>>56975035
Nope. It's not a reality. Not every company is like the sweatshop you work in.

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>>56965419
>Dress like you were going to court, does that make sense to you?
<- Like this?

Jokes aside I agree with you

>>56975083
>my employer sets timeframes for myself/team to output work
>fucking breathing down my neck sweathshop

lol cmon man

>>56965164
Well I'm sorry my interview clothes are from the goodwill because I'm a poor college student looking for his first job asshole.

>>56975105
If you have to fucking fill out timesheets on what you are doing every day and clock in and out then you are no better than a sweatshop worker.

>>56972163
Wait you're supposed to dress nice for jury duty? I just wore my normal street clothes.

>>56968772
>see advertisement for a security/pentesting company
>oh neat, I've got basic knowledge about linux and I read alot of papers regarding security in my freetime, definitely interested to learn more

Yeah, walk into an interview for a job you admittedly have zero actual experience in performing required duties for and expecting to nail it. Brilliant fucking plan anon!

>>56965419
>If I have to explain it to you I guess you already are in the "weirdo" category.
You can't just call people out for being weirdos then not offer advice to someone genuinely asking. Don't be a cunt. Shirts? Pants or jeans? Etc.

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>tfw gears are in motion

It's getting real
Is this what it feels like to be alive?

>>56965164
>Guys teach your classmates at college how to dress, how to shave and how to shower.

Why? This just decreases how good I look in comparison.

Being in shape, well dressed, well groomed, and well socialized in this industry is so fucking rare that it makes arguably makes you a hotter commodity than someone who is a naturally gifted programmer. Coming off with a reasonable amount of normalcy (even if you're a degenerate shut-in when you're not on the clock) is a great way to put yourself ahead of the herd in this field.

Being articulate, and actually being able to hold a conversation without exploding in spaghetti is huge, if only for the fact that so few people in this field seem to have that skill.

If you think climbing the corporate ladder is strictly about competency, you're sorely mistaken. People naturally get promoted to a level just below one of their own incompetency. The reason a lot of people can't break into higher positions is because they often lack the people skills necessary. And despite what you dumbasses might think, people skills DOES include things like:

1. Not dressing like a teenager
2. Not smelling like a prostitutes asshole
3. Not being able to tie a fucking braid in your disgusting facial hair
4. Not being a fat disgusting piece of shit

Quite frankly, if you haven't figured this stuff out on your own already, you've probably already fucked up. Showing an ability to think about things like "Do I look, smell, or sound like I have a severe case of autism?" (even if you do) is basic stuff (even for an autist).

>>56967204

I don't know where the fuck you're from, but in my experience all of the best programmers are also the best dressed/actually hygienic/have other interests than anime and 4chan.

The faggots who got into this field because they "want to work on video games" or they want to be "uber hackers" are usually fucking shitters who couldn't code their way out of a wet paper bag, and couldn't talk to you about anything other than the boss their WoW guild is working on.

>>56975560
fatness has no correlation to position on corporate ladder

>>56969018

Are you fucking dense mate?

Yes being "non-social" is rude. You daft cunt.

Example:

I've got two identical resumes, both honors students from a uni with a good CS program. Both candidates nail the technical interview. The personal interview is a different story.

Guy A is outgoing, social, smiles, looks you in the eye, answers questions directly, and just generally seems to be a positive, upbeat person.

Guy B, while not outright rude, is quiet, looks at his shoes all the time, answers questions defensively, and seems to have serious self-esteem issues.

As an employer, it's my job to pick someone not just who's the best for the job, but also someone who is the best for the company as a whole. Why on earth would I pick the guy who can't talk for shit? Why on earth would anyone hire some anti-social, aspie reject? Seriously, even if you're not Rico Suave, you should be working on getting some baseline social skills ASAP.

>>56975658
I'm so sure that you just have a long line of perfect candidates with 4.0s from MIT just waiting for a job offer at your no name shitty company.

>>56975594

t. Lardo McButterboy

Nice try fatass.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/freekvermeulen/2011/03/22/the-price-of-obesity-how-your-salary-depends-on-your-weight/#70cc547461c7

Men who are a healthy weight (not skeleton, not snorlax) do considerably better than their counterparts.

>>56975683
nah i'm a rail
managers are fat shits

>>56975658
Guy A is already accepted his job offer at Google making three times what you're offering.

>>56975673
>Example

Good reading comprehension moron. You've totally dodged the point because you're angry that you're some no-life, fatass neckbeard who slaves away all day in a cube farm writing code for some horseshit subroutine that you couldn't give two fucks about. All this shit just so you can go and cry yourself to sleep while you rewatch EVA and shitpost on 4chan.

>>56975707
You seem really triggered by the fact that someone really doesn't feel like discussing the football game last night and would rather focus on doing work instead.

>>56968242
>that pic
Truth hurts.

>>56975658
Oh, and Guy B also accepted his offer from Google as well because they don't care how "social" you are.

So in reality, you're now stuck with Pajeet from Mumbai and Chad who went through college copying off some Chinese dude.

>>56975473
Best of luck. Remember: Being selected for an interview means that you are in the top 10% of the all the candidates that apply. Be a professional, and they will hire you.

(Unless someone else is also a professional, but has more experience than you, but that is out of your hand)

>>56975125
>If you have to fucking fill out timesheets on what you are doing every day and clock in and out then you are no better than a sweatshop worker.

Well, it's on Jira and it's a task estimate vs time taken but whatever.

I'm clearly not going to sell you on the idea of gathering performance data and using these to make rational decisions and estimates about future work.

>>56975132
>Wait you're supposed to dress nice for jury duty
Nah, wear comfy for Jury Duty. Street clothes outside of jury duty aren't a good idea unless your name is Omar.

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>>56975727

For your sake, I really hope you're just "trolling" me right now. I've met plenty of people who seem to have this line of reasoning that "I'm a hard worker and that's all that matters, I SHOULDN'T HAVE TO BE PLEASANT TO BE AROUND BECAUSE I'M SOOOOO GOOD AT WHAT I DO".

No one said anything about needing to become some ultra-normie, football loving type. But the fact that you think that "I'm just focusing on my work" is a reasonable excuse is laughable, and shows how little you understand about how workplaces actually function.

Guess what? If no one feels comfortable talking to you, you're not going to do well in any workplace environment. I don't understand why there's so much resistance to such a simple idea here? I'm not even the one who enforces this system, I'm just telling you guys that being social autistic isn't good for your career. If you don't want to believe me, then don't. It's literally only your loss.

>>56975802
I'm doing fine in my career mate.

>>56965164
>Guys teach your classmates at college
Not my job to teach them.
>Or don't and have less competition when you apply for a job.
Thats the plan, but I'm not even going into a tech field because idiots like your interviewees are flooding the field with pajeet and drove down pay to the point that it isn't worth my time.
Do they even teach you something at college?
My english and history class taught me that white men are evil, and white people need to integrate better into the global community, but the fact that spanish people have a hard time living in america after the illegally move here is very problematic so therefore we should learn spanish because afterall.. america doesnt have an official language.
Not making it up either. This is the light version.

College has made me not care about anything anymore.

>>56975106
What did you wear to your high school graduation and prom? Jeans and t shirt?