Lex vs Zemo

>>87241912

Their respective studios.

Zemo.

>>87241925
/thread

>>87241912
Zemo wasn't a villain. He was just some dude with a chip on his shoulder and a lot of free time.

>>87241912
Do you think Zemo used Bucky as a human dildo?

>>87241939
Zemo had no personality, he was just a plot device.

>>87241967
villains are plot devices beside i rather have no personality than autistic manchild lex

>>87241912
Zemo was more bearable as an antagonist.

>it's yet another poorly discuss /tv/ capeshit thread

>>87241912
Zeno won so there's that

>>87241984
Lex was way more fun to watch as a villain, also more evil.

Zemo's plan, while absolutely fucking ridiculous and convoluted, still has a consistent purpose and goal.

Lex was basically just jumping from scene to scene doing fuck all to advance the plot to get "Trinity" to fight a CGI baddie. In the end, Lex wasn't even a villain, he was a pawn.

>>87241912
Gus Gorman

>>87242030
Lex's plan is to kill Superman, it's not complicated.

Zemo wasn't a villain.

Hard to choose. They both have their moments.

https://youtu.be/O1hkEqMcn0M

https://youtu.be/SS3uXgGGPPE

I'm gonna go with Lex. Eisenberg is great to watch.

I can't remember anything about Zimo

>>87241912
Zemo drowned one Hydra agent.
Lex drowned nobody.
Pa Kent drowned all the pretty little horses.

>>87242110
>Takes off vibranium helmet to confront armed enemy.

Why?

>>87242059
So why did he go crazy in the end?

zemo has a much smaller hatedom from the general public

>>87241912
Lex but he was so fucking annoying. Zemo was boring as fuck.

>>87242155
How did he go crazy?

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>>87242114
Yeah, Lex had a lot of really fantastic and memorable scenes

>>87242182
>when BvS defenders don't even watch the movie
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHEiArM3lHw

>>87242183
He did though. In his father's study where he said "Devils don't come from hell beneath us, no they come from the sky." The scene with Superman on the tower, the scene in jail with Batman.

>>87241912

Lex was actually a billionaire who hated Superman and used his vast intellect in the attempt to defeat Superman.

Zemo wasn't even a member of Hydra, or a Baron.

>>87241923

Top kek

>>87242193
How is that crazy? Darkseid's coming. He's just being a weird asshole like most of the movie. It makes more sense in context.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eTI_CYrATpo

>>87242009

Lex's plan led to the death of Superman, you could argue he won too.

>>87242233
Superman didn't even stay dead through the movie though. Fucker was probably killing Lois with his super-semen before the credits were rolling.

>>87242256
>Superman didn't even stay dead through the movie though

Yeah he did, he's still in the ground in Justice League.

Why even call him Zemo?

>>87242361
Nobody cares who he is until he puts on the mask to lead the Thunderbolts.

>>87241984
I don't even like either of those, but this kind of thinking is cancer and the reason why MCU villains suck.

>>87242401
Loki is the only one with an actual story, which I guess is why they keep him around instead of killing him like the rest.

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>>87242446
>only one

>>87242451
I was thinking about the movies.

>>87241912
Batman was the better villain.
He had a plan, he had motivation, we see him execute the various phases of his plan and he almost won.

>>87242474
>he almost won.

No Luthor almost won. Batman was being manipulated, if he'd killed Superman he'd have lost.

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>>87242474
>and he almost won.

What do you mean "almost won". Batman spared Superman of Batman's own freewill.

Batman straight up won!

>>87242182
that was after he talked to a hologram of one of the apokolpitans, and he wasnt being THAT crazy, I mean the whole "mannors on the wayne" thing right before is kind of ridiculous, but everything he said had a point.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-MUzvASr8s

>>87242206
man that scene with the pictures and superman is just so good

>>87242219
He never explained what superman did to him to garner such hate. Just that he had daddy issues. He could have gone after a billion other symbols in his lifetime but he suddenly starts up with superman for no apparent reason

>>87242161
Lex is more liked by those that do like him than Zemo though


if anything Lex is an even better villain BECAUSE so many real people hate him. You should hate a villain.

>>87242182
>How did he go crazy?
By creating a monster that he can't justifiably able to control?

I mean for fuck's sake, they could have used some superscience to explain how he planned to mind control Doomsaday. But no, just "it has some of my blood, that would do"?

>>87242603
he hated him for the same exact reasons he has always hated him in the comics (sans him being turned bald by superboy, but its the same motivation in subtext).

because he has a god/power complex. he doesnt like that superman is more powerful than him and morally superior.

Lex flat out says (and repeats many times) that "no one can be all good and all powerful" and Superman is portrayed as both by a large portion of the population and media

>>87242590
this was meant for
>>87242155

>>87242619
he didnt give a shit about controlling Doomsday, he just wanted to prove that Superman wasnt all powerful and he did.

>>87242491
Lex was manipulating Batman into doing something he already planned on doing.

This movie gets more stupid the more you think about it

>>87242650
it was shown many times that Lex has backups on top of backups incase something (like Batman) failed. God, BvS haters get more retarded by the day.

>>87242232

This scene is so damn stupid. But it'll make a fanboy wet their pants over the references.

a lot of the movie is like that. Admittedly cool yet completely fucking stupid, scenes.

>>87242611
he seems to be hated for reasons not relating to his villiany

>>87242678
how is it any stupider than any lead in to a sequel?

>>87242627
That first part is head canon anon since the comic =/= the movie. Like I said , he could have picked a billion other people to throw his daddy issues on since superman did not wrong him in any which way yet he suddenly chose superman to put some long held grudge into action without showing any previous tendencies to do so. Zemo at least explained himself and why he was assblasted

>>87242650
>Yes. Because you, my friend, have a date! Across the bay. Ripe fruit, his hate; two years growing, but it did not take much to push him over, actually. Little red notes, big bang – "you let your family die!"

Lex was stoking Batman's hate to force him to act.

They're both shit. Marvel just can't have good villians. As it seems DCEU can't either. This autisto lex jr is fucking disgrace to character.

>>87242689
You realise he explains exactly why he hates Superman right? It's all there in the movie.

>The problem of you on top of everything else. You above all. Ah — 'cause that's what God is. Horus. Apollo. Jehovah. Kal-El —Clark … Joseph … Kent. See, what we call God depends upon our tribe, Clark Joe. Because God is tribal. God takes sides. No man in the sky intervened when I was a boy to deliver me from Daddy's fists and abominations. Mmnnn. I've figured it out way back: if God is all powerful, he cannot be all good. And if he's all good, then he cannot be all powerful. And neither can you be. They need to see the fraud you are. With their eyes. The blood on your hands.

>>87242603

Have you even seen the film?! The conversation on the helipad of Lex tower has Lex monologuing about why he hates Superman

>>87242677

Because him having backups discredits anything i said. Please read.

He can have as many back ups as he wants. Fact is Batman already wanted to kill Superman before Lex got involved. The fact that Batman somehow falls for the manipulation with the court bombing is even more stupid. How can he not figure out Lex is pulling strings when
1: Superman doesn't write letters
2: Superman was in court himself
3: a guy he used to work for was in the court room in a specially made chair.
4: Superman is seen helping people afterwards so HE CLEARLY KNOWS SUPERMAN IS NOT AT FAULT

So either he figured out it was Lex, and decided to kill Superman anyway, or he's so fucking stupid in this universe that he fell for that dumbass plan.

>>87242689
how is it head canon? its right there, he keeps saying superman cant be all powerful and all good over and over again. the father beating was just an example of it, not his motivation. it only comes up once while he keeps telling people that superman can be killed and cant be trusted.

>>87242114
i hate to admit but yeah me too

>>87242722
>he doesn't like golden age lex with silver age lex's mad scientist thrown in

>>87242738
Bruce doesn't believe Superman caused the bombing, he believes that Keefe did it because of what happened to him in the Metropolis event, because no one listened to him about the danger of Superman.

>>87242738

To be fair, if i were someone like supes but evil, i could imagine doing something like that to fool people.

I mean you know that you are immune to the bomb so it poses no danger to you. And you can help people afterwards to deflect suspicion.

>>87242738
>1: Superman doesn't write letters

what letters? you mean the returned checks and the letters in red? no one thought it was Superman sending them, he thought it was the wheelchair guy Wally.


> Superman was in court himself
He doesn't think Superman blew up the court room, he thinks it was someone REACTING to superman that did it (the news even says it in the next scene!)


>3: a guy he used to work for was in the court room in a specially made chair.
Batman had no idea he had a special chair, but he does think his ex-employee WAS the bomber BECAUSE of the returned checks/letters he thought were from that same employee.

>>87242803
>>87242738
how can you guys be THIS retarded

>>87242772
>he likes mix of downgrade versions of character
>he likes LOOK IM FACEBOOK SEO AGAIN LMAO
Pathetic

>>87242820
>i never read superman comics from pre-2000 and base my opinion on the animated shows the post


he was nothing like he was in The Social Network either, much more controlling and sure of himself.

>>87242810
Yeah this is how I thought it went down. Except for when they said they thought Superman was a co-conspirator? Unless they meant he could have stopped it but didn't (which was actually because he couldn't see it.)

>>87242725
And yet he had shown to put his plans into action the moment after the invasion started when superman was first revealed. Once again his only explanation is daddy issues and without the existence of superman he showed no tendencies to lash out at anyone else with such poorly thought out plans. He had his entire life to lash out at people and he didn't. Everything was riding on superman existing .Then of all the people he picks to kill a GOD with years before the gods arrival worth of research, he picks not the world's fastest fast,or a demi goddess, or a space tech machine God, or even some mythos lord of the sea, no. He picks some other rich guy with time on his hands. What would batman do with his money that the ever smarter lex could not?

>>87242792
>>87242803
>>87242810

>Batman had no idea he had a special chair
They explained who the bomber was and the source on the news afterwards, unless Bruce just decided not to pay attention. Another thing that brings up, if Batman somehow knows Superman can see through lead, why didn't he connect the dots with the chair?

Basically the whole point of doing that court fiasco was to get Batman to somehow get offended at Superman not being able to stop a bomb from his ex-employee and take it out on Clark......but that's stupid.

Who in their right mind says "Hey you know, people died when he was around, and even though he's clearly not responsible at all, i'll kill him". Logic? It doesn't make sense. Hell even the fight doesn't make sense. Superman is in isolation before he saves Lois (yet couldn't save his mom, which is more bs). Lex plan just like Zemo's hinges on some pretty shitty logical decisions made by Batman and Superman. Only difference is Zemo's plan as unnecessary as it was, made sense.

>>87242848
Post-crisis Superman and Lex are best versions. They're the most developed. Your silver age and golden age garbage become obsolete long time ago. Even Morrsion couldn't make a proper Golden Age Supes. Sure, old characters can make appearences as side-characters and as tribute. But they just don't work in comics and especially on the screen.

>>87242881
they were just randomly speculating that he was a co-conspirator to illustrate the split opinion on superman (some are paranoid some embrace him)

>>87242738
It's not like batman is anywhere near as good as a detective as Sherlock Holmes or anyone of that nature. He's just your average joe

>>87242913

But thats factually wrong. One of his skills is being a great detective and strategist. Thats the entire reason the prep time argument exists.

>>87242895
you know there is a scene where they go to the ex-employee's apartment and lex framed him to make it look like he had a bunch of bomb making shit in his apartment, there was no reason to suspect anyone was involved other than the wheel chair guy.


and like you said Batman already hated Superman, and as Alfred says he was blinded by his rage. He wanted to believe Superman would bring only bad things, he wasnt particularly pissed that Superman didnt stop the bomb, just that his existence is what caused the bomb to exist in the first place (having no knowledge that the whole thing was rigged by Lex).

>>87242762
Superman never showed himself to be that. Fucking cops and fire firefighters did what superman did on the daily and were praused for it but you don't see lex attacking them. The movie gave no setup for what lex what doing. All of Lex Luthors hate rode on the chance of superman falling out of the blue

>>87242913
why do you indulge the retard when he got so many plot points factually wrong?

>>87242902
well I can respect that opinion, I personally have a soft spot for mad scientist lex, and I can see him growing into something more akin to post-crisis lex after his jail time.

>>87241912
You posting this on /co/ and not on >>>/tv/

>>87242888
>Once again his only explanation is daddy issues and without the existence of superman he showed no tendencies to lash out at anyone else with such poorly thought out plans.

Yeah because there's no version of the film where Superman never shows up so we can see what Lex would do then. Are you an idiot? Of course none of it would have happened if there was no Superman, it's a Superman movie.

>Then of all the people he picks to kill a GOD with years before the gods arrival worth of research, he picks not the world's fastest fast,or a demi goddess, or a space tech machine God, or even some mythos lord of the sea, no. He picks some other rich guy with time on his hands. What would batman do with his money that the ever smarter lex could not?

None of those people except Batman had reason to hate Superman, and what Batman can do that Lex can't is actually fight Superman.

>>87242938
you are right, like I said in my posts it was the MEDIA and the populace that were treating him like some kind of god guy that is all powerful and all good (you know like the people touching Superman after saving the girl from the fire). And firefighters and cops are obviously not all powerful. Superman saved the world and did things previously thought impossible.


And the movie has LEX REPEATEDLY mention this as his motivation throughout the movie

see>>87242725


>>87242888
before Superman arrived Lex practically WAS the most powerful person on the planet so he had no one with which to invoke this idea of someone being portrayed as all good and all powerful. you fucking moron.

>>87242888
>Once again his only explanation is daddy issues and without the existence of superman he showed no tendencies to lash out at anyone else with such poorly thought out plans.

It was implied that he murdered his father.

>>87242932
>you know there is a scene where they go to the ex-employee's apartment and lex framed him to make it look like he had a bunch of bomb making shit in his apartment, there was no reason to suspect anyone was involved other than the wheel chair guy.

Great. So why is he mad at Superman over this?

>and like you said Batman already hated Superman, and as Alfred says he was blinded by his rage. He wanted to believe Superman would bring only bad things, he wasnt particularly pissed that Superman didnt stop the bomb, just that his existence is what caused the bomb to exist in the first place (having no knowledge that the whole thing was rigged by Lex).

So basically this is a "Im so asshurt over Superman that anything bad that happens has to be his fault because i saw him fight some guy years ago" Batman, and he gets snapped out of that by Martha.....

If anyone other the Ben had tried to do this character we would've had the worst Batman ever made.

>>87242989

>It was implied that he murdered his father.

Show me that scene please

>>87243003
>"Im so asshurt over Superman that anything bad that happens has to be his fault because i saw him fight some guy years ago"

As Bruce says "He brought the war to us" all this death as a result of the battle in Metropolis he lays squarely at Superman's feet.

>>87243025
I think it was in one of those tie in articles about him that got published before the movie came out.

>Batman being manipulated by austist
>Batman being deteced by Lex's assistant
>Batman's secret identity is not secret to anyone
>Batman losing his flash card
>Batman is not capable to solve what is "White Portuguese" is.
>Batman didn't do full research about his enemy for 2 years
>Batman didn't know about his relations and family
World's greatest detective and tactican, lads!

>>87243028
And thats STILL a terrible judgement call, knowing he's done his research on the kryptonians and more than likely saw Zod's warning to Earth like everyone else.

Thats not a good character. And regardless, if he has this viewpoint already, then Lex is manipulating him for entirely no reason.

>>87243003
Batman flat out says that he blames Superman for everything thats happened since he got here, but he was pushed over the edge by Joker killing a Robin and Lex manipulating him. Batman in the comics has done far stupider with no manipulation (like Tower of Babel).


Also he is snapped out of it by finding out that Superman had a mom like his own AND that he had a wife that cared about him. He didn't really stop until Lois got there. Basically once he realized he was a real human bean.

>>87243053
He's just a fucking meathead, that's all. But look at his suit, so comic accurate so that makes up for his shortcomings.

>>87243040
Because its not something thats firmly established, calling BS on that. Lets leave it to dad abuse issues.

>>87243067
Lex was manipulating him to push him FURTHER so that he would actually kill Superman, not just be weary about it. And you are right it IS a terrible judgement call, Alfred says as much. But this is just another fall after having a Robin killed. Alfred flat out says he was blinded by rage. Batman is an antagonist for most the movie.

>>87243053
but he did solve what the White Portugese is, we saw him solve it on screen


he did do research on his enemy, thats why he knew he couldnt see through led and why he was weak to kryptonite


batman just didnt know he had a human identity, he just thought he was alien mode all the time.

>>87241912
Zemo
> Why should a rag tag team of heroes with super powers still be running around without a leash for any misdeeds they do manage to commit while my wife lay dead from those very misdeeds. You've pushed me too far

Lex
> My daddy hit me and God didn't stop him so now I'm gonna lash out against a guy who didn't exist until just a few months ago because daddy. I'm also gonna use alien tech..errr God tech to call even more alie....errr gods to earth so that batman can kill them too

>>87243069
Batman flat out says that he blames Superman for everything thats happened since he got here, but he was pushed over the edge by Joker killing a Robin and Lex manipulating him. Batman in the comics has done far stupider with no manipulation (like Tower of Babel).

Past stupid doesn't justify new stupid.

>Also he is snapped out of it by finding out that Superman had a mom like his own AND that he had a wife that cared about him. He didn't really stop until Lois got there. Basically once he realized he was a real human bean.

Which is still incredibly stupid. How do you "research" Superman for years, figure out his identity but not his mother and Lois?

>>87243091
the tie in articles are canon. and you are the only one saying its daddy issues, he only mentions his dad twice in the whole movie. Once to the senator and once to Superman as an EXAMPLE of God not being all good and all powerful you autist.

>>87243121
the same way most people havent been able to figure it out in the comics

>>87243078
What does meathhead mean?
>look at his suit, so comic accurate so that makes up for his shortcomings.
What comic? It's not even accurate to Miller's shit, not to mention good costumes. Ears must be a little longer, and bat is not that fat.
Also
>character is shit, but, at least, he looks cool!
Nah, mate.

>>87243094

And. That. Is. Not. Good. Writing.

Batman already was planning on going to war with Superman and killing him well before Lex. He literally told Alfred in the movie that he'd take Superman out, and that was before any of the Lex interference.

>>87243122
LOL WHAT? DID YOU PEOPLE NOT JUST BREAK DOWN LEX'S DAD ISSUES? THIS IS KANGAROO COURT

>>87243150
>And. That. Is. Not. Good. Writing.

Writing. Like. This. Makes. You. Look. Like. A. Fuckwit.

>>87243136
Batman isn't most people

>>87243107
Yeah, my bad about White Portugese. I wanted to write
"Batman is not capable to solve what is "White Portuguese" is for a half of the movie"
Well, Batman SHOULD do research about every possible solution to stop alien not in a fucking fist fight. He could even realized his his wrongfulness when he somehow met Martha and talk to her as Bruce.
But BvS Batman is retard.

>>87243122
Which is his only explained reason for hating Superman in particular . Cause God didn't stop daddy from touching him. 3 hours to flesh out lex and WB still made fans pay twice to fix their bad writing problems with the dvd

>>87243163
What's you point? He hated his father, he blames God for not rescuing him from his abuse, and he projects that hatred of God onto Superman.

>>87243187
>Which is his only explained reason for hating Superman in particular

Other than the whole explicit laying out of his reasons he gave in the film.

>>87242155

He was always looney, discovering the New Gods just pushes him off the edge.

>>87241912
Zemo. Infinitely. A normal guy that managed to take down the most powerful group of people out there just by being clever and tenacious. Probably the best part of his movie and one of the best, if not best, superhero villains out there.

>>87243187
Damn, "muh daddy has beaten me :(((" is so shitty and generic motavation.
Is there more poorly written villian than Lex in modern capeshit? I mean, all modern capeshit villians have lack of pesonality, but, at least, they don't act so cringy and disturbing.

>>87243247
>A normal guy that managed to take down the most powerful group of people out there just by being clever and tenacious.

Wasn't he like some secret police black ops shit?

>Probably the best part of his movie and one of the best, if not best, superhero villains out there.

He's too boring to be a good supervillain.

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>>87242738

Batman had his hate for Superman stoked by Lex throughout the movie.

For example the letter that he constantly received about the Metropolis incident kept him in a perpetual state of guilt and rage, and after Wallace Keefer's suicide bombing coupled with the returned checks Bruce felt even more responsible about it since he failed to pay attention to a employee and victim of Superman under his care and now more people were dead because of him and Superman.

Because if he had done something about Superman sooner then Keefer wouldn't have killed himself along with all those people. This finally propelled him into putting a stop to Superman right there and then.

So Lex made 100% sure that he'd have Batman as a weapon by preying on his rage and guilt.

>>87243257
>disturbing.

Why is this bad in a villain?

>>87243202
That was his only fucking reason for angles and demons. His dad touched him. That's it. You can't add comic canon to this universe to fix how bad a movie it was

>>87243189

My point is it is Daddy Issues. Thats his whole motivation.

Lex is an egotist who was abused by his father, which put a stigma in his head that those who are all powerful, cannot be all good, such as his father and God for not helping him.

He see's Superman as his father/God, because he is all powerful, but wants to prove himself right in think Superman cannot be all good. However where this logic completely dies is according to the movie people aready question Superman and believe he is Evil. After the court bombing, they really dont like him. So his plan of either having Batman kill him, makes no sense because then it makes Batman look evil which gets him no where, but his plan of having Superman kill Batman is pointless because the public already dont like Superman.

This is bad villain 101.

>>87243265
Well, depite fact that CW is generic quipfest, it had Tony as beter villian than both autismo and baron boredom.

>>87243272
>For example the letter that he constantly received about the Metropolis incident

What letter?

>>87243277
Well, you can be disturbed by villain in a good or bad way. Here is a bad way. The key word is - cringy af.

>>87243265
Only thing that made him good was to attack a group of "heroes" he saw getting away without repercussions for their actions was him using Bucky as the center piece of his plan. A terrorist that cap let free and didn't get punished for. The guy just wanted full circle and he managed to make it happen. Finding out that full circle hurt more than 1 of them personally was probably icing on the cake

>both villains plans revolve around daddy issues

pure pottery

both were shit

>>87243291
>So his plan of either having Batman kill him, makes no sense because then it makes Batman look evil which gets him no where, but his plan of having Superman kill Batman is pointless because the public already dont like Superman.

If the public already don't like Superman why would Batman killing him make him look evil?

>>87243109

Zemo placed his own family in danger, that fuckwit, and he didn't care shit about regulations or shit. He wanted revenge.

>>87243322
Well, it was different because Zemo was an actual dad.

>>87242738

Stop being retarded batfag. Lex was taking advantage of Batman's own fucked up middle age crisis of faith and stroking the flames so Batman would be his unwitting pawn and fight Superman. Batman had a bad case of butthurt tunnel vision and was too blind to see he was being played the entire time. This type of thing happens all the time with mastermind villains.

To reiterate, Lex didn't orchestrate everything to make Batman hate Superman, he took advantage of the hate and fears Batman had about Superman and turn it up to eleven so he'd be a weapon Lex could use without having to get his own hands dirty.

>>87243178

Comics Batman is a fucking retard.

He created super-alien computer to watch and study all meta-humans in the world, including ways to infiltrate their bodies and take them down, then let the thing be hacked and used against his wishes almost destroying the world.

All of this because his child-hood friend erased 10 min of his memories, because he wanted to fight the JL to save a rapist.

>>87242144
Fast enough to dodge bullets even at close range

>>87243353
But if Tony wasn't a little baby about his dad not loving him the film would have wrapped up nicely and everyone would have been friends and no one would have to fight

I swear the only one with any sense in either of these movies was cap and then alfred

>comics Lex is genius megalomaniac who has raisen from the dirt to use his potential and wealth to be praised by Metropolis and the whole wolrd, by being superior human being. All his plans goes to shit since Superman shows up and steals all his glory. His motivation is to destroy disgusting alien who stand on his way.
>BvS Lex just twitchy autist who inherited daddy's company, but daddy abused him. His motivation to destroy alien because he reminds him of his daddy.
Fucking pathetic.

>>87243282

You guys fixate too much on the dad shit.

Lex only gave that example because he was trying to illustrate a fucking point. He could have used any other example.

The point was that Superman isn't this powerful and good force that has come to rescue us. He won't be there for everybody (thus the dad mention) and he'll take sides, precisely because he's not all good. He's selfish like everyone.

And to prove that he forces Superman to kill Batman to save his mothers. Forces Superman to do a bad act to save someone he values.

The dad shit was minimal.

>>87243389
Comics Batman is paranoiac.
BvS Batman is just stupid retard.
Brother Eye was bad idea, but genius one.

>>87243150
>And. That. Is. Not. Good. Writing.

Because you don't like it? There is nothing wrong with Lex manipulating Batman's rage to suit his own purposes. That's Lex being smart and Bruce being too blind to see it due to his own flaws and weaknesses, which he is ultimately able to overcome.

>>87243455
The ONLY explained reason for why he hated superman was he questioned God's intentions because......wait for it.........almos.......HIS DAD BEAT HIM. His disposition stems for daddy and daddy alone. It's poor writing

Daddys beatings> Why God why> let me kill an alien that I have no direct beef with

He has no other reason to hate superman be him God or not.

>>87243506
>He has no other reason to hate superman be him God or not.

Superman is a challenge to his power.

>>87243389
but that wasn't the reason
the reason was that the League stepped out of their boundaries and started abusing their authority

Kind of a toss up desu. Both were pretty underwhelming but Zemo felt like a real character.
Lex was just some wacky thing in a mess of a movie.

>>87243291

Because Lex has spent two years slowly destroying Superman's reputation. The bombing of the courthouse was the final piece on his plan before the coup de grace where Superman a) either dies or b) kills Batman. It doesn't matter which because he had other contingencies at place like Doomsday and the point is to destroy Superman and prove he can be corrupted and kicked down from his high pedestal. Either way, Lex wins.

>>87243525
They never once showed him talking about superman stopping his international crime ring and him hating sups for it. That's head canon anon. It's why critics hated the movie so much because unless you could head canon away all the obvious faults, the movie made no sense. At least Zemos lore is based off previous movies

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>>87243291

You're wrong, m8. It's not about daddy issues or religion.

Lex grew up believing that goodness is something you project to fool the suckers.
He believe that because that's something that his father taught him. His father named the company on his son's name, to look like a good family man for the investors, and basically used his son as a publicity stunt, projecting a false image of a wholesome man worried about family and social issues, when in fact he didn't.

Lex did the same with his Google-esque company giving this image of a approachable and funny guy worried about people's lives and national security, when in fact HE ISN'T. He learned with his father and he conducts his life this way. In Lex's world only idiots believe in goodness. This is something that his father and people like him use to fool others. What matters in life is POWER. WHAT LEX WANTS IS POWER. THAT'S WHAT THE CHARACTER IS ABOUT: HE WANTS POWER.

So here comes Superman flaunting all his awesome powers and saving Metropolis from his own kind. Everyone regarding as a good person and a savior. Lex looked at that and felt small. Felt played by someone superior at his own game. Superman had true power and everyone was clamoring him as a saint.

When Lex sperged like a freak in the gala talking about the meaning about power, Lex felt angry because while he has knowledge, which he regards as power, he doesn't have the same kind of powers that Superman does. That shit close to home and that's why he made an ass of himself. His facade crumbled momentarily because he got angry when he realized how small he is when compared to Superman.

So throughout the movie Lex is trying to steal Superman's power and prove to the world that Superman is like him: just another smart-ass playing everyone as a fool by putting out an image of good Samaritan.

It has nothing to do with daddy issues or religion.

>>87243590

You're really... i don't want to be offensive, but i've to say... obtuse.

>>87243590
>They never once showed him talking about superman stopping his international crime ring and him hating sups for it.

Superman is a challenge to all earthly power, not just his in particular.

>>87243602
I think this review has a good take on it.

>http://www.audienceseverywhere.net/batman-v-superman-dawn-justice-peak-comic-book-movie-experimentation/

>Lex Luthor on the other hand is hopeless. Jesse Eisenberg delivers a Luthor unlike any we’ve seen. He’s fragile, awkward, and lacking all the charisma we typically associate with the character. He is a child of abuse and that comes through in every seething line, and every shaky gesture that points at a thinly tethered grasp on reality and his self worth. He’s compelling to watch because he is inherently odd, but is even more compelling when compared to that of our heroes because he lacks the masculinity of our muscle-bound icons. Though he may believe Superman poses a legitimate threat to the human race, there’s also a fair amount of jealousy when confronted with the image of something he can never be. His near obsession with myths displays a desire to be seen as something grand and legendary, when as a scientist and philanthropist he most certainly is not. But as a villain? As a villain he can cast himself in marble for all the world to see.

>>87243590
>all the questions I had about the movie can be solved by thinking about them

is what you're saying when you put it like that

>>87243746
>movie is shit for normies and cuckritics because it don't explain shit, also lex is autist
>movie is shit because all characters in injustice mode which is shit

>>87243626
Keep moving the bar
>>87243525 clearly says his power

>>87243746
> everyone should have read action comics since issue 1 to be able to understand how stupid this movie was since it can't stand on its own merits

Is what you're saying.

>>87241923
First post best post

>>87243874
How is that"moving the bar"? If anything the second one is a stronger claim you idiot.

>>87241952
Yeah he only bombed a UN meeting and killed dozens of people because he was butthurt about something Ironman and CapAm were indirectly responsible for.

>>87241967
you mean a Main character like all the Former CIA/FBI movie?

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Thunderbolts when?

>>87243602
I love how Snyderfags will complain that Lex's motivations are completely obvious and everyone is willfully ignoring them when even they can't agree on what his motivation actually are.

>>87244161
That's what happens when you have complex characters instead of cartoons.

>>87244211
>snyder
>complex

Choose one and only one.

Zemo "breaking up" the Avengers won't mean shit because we all know they'll be friends again for Infinity War.

Luthor actually succeeded in killing Superman.

>>87244241
Snyder doesn't dumb his movies down for the mass audience like Disney.

>>87244252
>Luthor actually succeeded in killing Superman.

We know Superman's coming back too. So pretty much the same thing as Civil War.

>>87244252
Which doesn't mean shit because we know he'll be back for Justice League

>>87244136

In fifteen movie's time when every single member has been introduced and developed.

>>87244288

Yes, but his death had lasting meaning and impact on characters. Batman fundamentally changed. WW stopped running away from humanity's problems. The League is being built.

>>87244285
But Superman's death will have consequences on the world. The Justice League never would've been assembled had he not died. Meanwhile, what does the Avengers splitting up do? It's nothing

>>87244270
he doesn't have to, they're already dumb as hell

if anything he should try smarting them up for general audiences instead

>>87242233
So, he succeded for 20 minutes?

>>87244394
As opposed to Zemo succeeding for zero minutes, sure

>>87244330
>what does the Avengers splitting up do?

Faux sense of consequences for the dumb masses.

>>87244412
He broke the Avengers.
The only way for them to come back is for a threat bigger than anything in the planet to pop up, and I bet Zemo wouldn't want to see Earth destroyed.

>>87244420
And we all know Thanos is coming, so yeah, him breaking up the Avengers is meaningless. If they hadn't broken up, they'd still have the same interactions in the next movies. Tony and Steve being at it with each other but working together. WOW, ZEMO BROKE THEM

>>87244330
>The Justice League never would've been assembled had he not died
And that's one of the most disgraceful things to source material.

>>87244451
Regardless. Luthor's done way more than Zemo ever will in these movie universes

>>87244451
>And that's one of the most disgraceful things to source material.

Why, because it doesn't recreate a sixty year old comic book story?

>>87244463
They both failed. Superman will be alive and Avengers will be together. But Luthor failed from the begining, because Superman will reborn despite any reasons. Avengers will work together only because of world's threat.

>>87244484
It could recreate their post-crisis team-up or new52 team-up. It could be much better and not direspectful to the whole point of Justice League.

>>87244517

So wait, you're mad because they don't accidentally team up when Apokalips invades, that instead the team is built on purpose in preparation of Darkseid's arrival? Broheim, come on.

>>87243896
>Is what you're saying.

Fuck you. The charactaters are 70 plus years old. If you don't understand the basics of them you're an illiterate faggot.

You're the kind of person who complains about spoilers if someone talks about the Iliad and mentions that Achilles kills Hector.

>>87244035
>Ironman and CapAm
>Cap

Don't try to redirect blame here. Iron Man is a supervillain who's greatest feat is making everyone forget he's a villain.

>>87244560
I'm mad because no one of them wanted to be heroes from the begining except Bat who lost hope because "muh Robin died :(((" . And they needed one of the greatest DC hero to die to begin to do shit.

>>87244735

But they're heroes individually already.

Maybe not Batman and Wonder Woman, but the rest, yes.

>>87244832
Who? Flash haven't do shit except stopping robbery only because he was in the same store. Aquaman gives FISH to one village. What a heroes they are!

>>87244445
At least it'll last more than 20 minutes.

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>>87243453
exactly

>>87244445
meanwhile Lex decided to call on Darkseid for no other reason than the lulz. He killed one god and called another to take its place

>>87244953

The bell had already been rung, friend.

>>87242881
Have you seen American cable news? Within the first 24 hours any wacko theory gets airtime

>>87242183
All his scenes with the senator wer fucking fantastic though. They hate each other's guts so much you can feel it. Shame they didn't have more.

>>87242738
>more stupid. How can he not figure out Lex is pulling strings when
>1: Superman doesn't write letters
And as far as Bruce is concerned the letters were from the bomb guy
>2: Superman was in court himself
And he doesnt blame superman for the bombing, he thinks superman is responsable for this kind of shit happening
>3: a guy he used to work for was in the court room in a specially made chair
And?
>4: Superman is seen helping people afterwards so HE CLEARLY KNOWS SUPERMAN IS NOT AT FAULT
Superman existence created the conditions for that, for a desperate guy bombing the court, THAT'S what Bruce wants to stop by fighting superman.

Lex doesnt make batman hate superman, what lex does is trying to push hatred for superman in the world, make superman look bad, get rid of his political enemies, and push Batman even more into the fight, make him focus on superman and superman alone.

Your plotholes are only in your head.
>>87244953

You till push the idea Lex is an atheist with daddy issues, stop being retarded and taking everything Lex says as the true, he LIES, and JUSTIFIES himself, Lax has no problems with EVIL gods as they are just like him, Lex at that point is just desperate and trying to do something to "win", Lex would sell the earth if he could as long as he "WINS". Lex being an absolute insane idiot is something we have seen countless times in cartoons and comics.
Lex wants a victory, and Lex has always been the kind of person in all his versions that will try to kill a fly with a hammer, and care how to fix the hole in the wall later.

>>87245223
>Shame they didn't have more

Yes, this and more Clark is what i wanted. That and having more time between the BvS/warehouse fight and the final fight for pace reasons.

Lex being an absolute cunt is one of the highlights of the movie. Sadly many here want a Sexy lex like the one from cartoons and Johns intepretations. And forget that Johns was balding so he made every bald character sexy.

>>87245656
bald is beautiful, anon.

>>87245656
>Lex being an absolute cunt is one of the highlights of the movie.

I always found very unsettling the shuit he does to make people feel uncomfortable, like the Jolly Ranch thing or tapping his fingers on the table.

>>87244420
>He broke the Avengers.

Yeah right, like they are not getting together by the next movie.

>>87246411
Batman and Superman got together because MARTHA on the same movie.

>>87241912
Luthor.

Zemo was so generic that they could have changed his name, origins, looks, etc and it would have been the same thing.

Also his plan was depending on the Avengers arguing like retards and acting like retards

>His plan is to make us fight!!!
>5 minutes later they fight

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>>87241912
Snyder Lex is just a meme that people mock for being so shit.

Most comic writters have done a better take, Landis would have done better.

>>87243321
>sing Bucky as the center piece of his plan.

Too bad that every plot point involving Zemo and that retard is what makes the movie fall apart.

That and dumb politics

>>87243109
Zemo's plan was based on luck and shit that he couldn't have predicted like only Tony Stark going to find cap during the last fight instead of him and a ton of soldiers.

Cap not telling Tony about winter soldiers...why?

Tony not believing Cap... why?

And the politics in general make captain america act like a terrorist

>>87244420
>He broke the Avengers.

The movie ends with everyone free, and a letter saying "don't worry m8, we are still friends" While War Machine is recovering using robot legs.
>>87246452
>Snyder Lex is just a meme

I have no idea what you mean

>>87246231
I love when he spergs in the party, he can't really hide the hate he has for superman, all the taunting.

>>87246510
He made the plan as he went and adapted it.

Terrorist cap is the intention, this is why he is still on the run.

Snyderfags can't grab basic stuff.

>>87246543
Are you autistic or objectivist?

>>87246580
>objectivist
There's nothing objectivist about the movie you dumbass. NOTHING.

>>87241912

Zemo gets about a dozen superheroes to fight in an airport. Lex almost destroys the planet and kills Superman.

Um Lex.

>>87246580
>using big boy words

>>87241912
Zemo, I didn't cringe in embarrassment for the movie whenever he was on screen

>>87246562
>He made the plan as he went and adapted it.

That means that he had no plan.

And, again, part of his plan counted on Cap acting like a retard, not trusting his team just for...Bucky?

Gayer than gay orgies.

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Some men are just Born Better.

>>87246231
>unsettling
There it is again. None of capeshit villains are unsettling in any way and you have shit taste if you believe otherwise.

If it weren't for that scene where he gets Tony to fight Cap, I wouldn't have even remembered that Civil War had a villain in it aside from Iron Man.

>>87241912
Zemo is average but Lex is just pathetic.

If Lex, who hates god, already knew about Wonder Woman, the literal child of a god, why didn't he go after her?

>>87243069

But being a human being doesn't preclude Superman from being evil, nor does loving one's mother.

>>87248111

Because he doesn't hate god. He was just trying to illustrate a goddamn point.

The God speech was just to show that everyone, including concept like deities, are tribal by nature, because deities are a man-made concept and we're tribal. We take sides. Us vs. them and shit like that.

Anyway, he wanted to point out that Superman was selfish and would put his own self interest above everyone's else.

>>87241912
Zemo.

Synder Lex the opposite of threatening. He's a cringe theatre.

>>87248163
And is not about being evil, batman doesnt kill evil people, it was about bruce seen himself as the bad guy, bruce was fairly insane and that shocked him.

He doesnt undertand how good superman is until superman sacrifices himself TWICE.

>muh dead family
>muh narcissism
Both were shit and had shitty motivations.

>>87241912
Luthor was the best
no competition

>>87246450

>Luthor
>Not generic

He's several Batman villains rolled into one, stop defending him

>>87247021

If he had no plan and still did a better job than Luthor that says a lot

>>87246510
>Zemo's plan was based on luck and shit that he couldn't have predicted like only Tony Stark going to find cap during the last fight instead of him and a ton of soldiers.
Zemo was obviously improvising and adapting. He only started the Winter Soldier manhunt because he couldn't get the Siberian Base location from the Colonel. If Iron Man hadn't shown up he could have just left with the tape and tried setting up something else.

>Cap not telling Tony about winter soldiers...why?
He did.

>Tony not believing Cap... why?
Because he was more concerned about Ross's deadline and also angry at Cap.

>And the politics in general make captain america act like a terrorist
That's not the definition of terrorism.

>>87248351
>He's several Batman villains rolled into one

No, he is Lex Luthor. Pure and destilated.

>>87248286
I can agree with this.

>>87248474
>>And the politics in general make captain america act like a terroristThat's not the definition of terrorism.


Well, he is, he is no different to the IRA or to Patria and Libertad

>>87241912
Zemo is what Luthor should have been. Cold, calculating, behind the scenes, actually had a motivation, wasn't autistic etc

>>87248550
>Luthor
>Cold

Kek.

Luthor has NEVER in ANY interpretation been "cold".

>>87244653

Whoosh.

>>87248689
Better cold than autistic

>>87242637
>he didnt give a shit about controlling Doomsday, he just wanted to prove that Superman wasnt all powerful and he did.
Then he is a suicidal lunatic who is of questionable intelligence. Some Luthor he turned out to be.

>>87247189

If you do your job right, no one will know you did it

>>87248479

Then you are unfamiliar with the character

>>87246712
>almost destroys the planet

when was this?

>>87248180
its because he had daddy issues and god represented his daddy. he clearly stated that in his helipad speech

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>>87241912
Lex was annoying
Zemo barely qualifies as a character

I guess I'll give it to Lex. The first half of his plan was good (frame superman so everyone hates him)
Nothing in Zemo's plan was good

>>87242474
Replace batman with lex during the opening sequence and the movie would have been great
Just remove all the bat stuff

>>87249088

What is Doomsday? Nobody had to nuke Zemo.

>>87248912
I'm actually familiar with Lex, you on the nother hand are a casual that thinks cartoons and Johns are the onlyu valid takes on Lex.

>>87248747
>Then he is a suicidal lunatic who is of questionable intelligence
Just like luthor in the comics, how many monsters and plans turn

>>87241912

Zemo was in under 10 minutes of the movie and his character wasn't explained until the last few minutes of the movie through expository dialogue...so I vote Lex. Atleast he was entertaining to watch and half of his plan was interesting, getting the public to hate Superman.

>>87244161
everyone defending lex is pretty much agreeing on his motivation, no one has said that his motivation STEMS from his daddy issues, it is just another element, another example of his core belief.

>>87248747
Luthor did the same shit in the animated universe when he brought Darkseid to earth. Or in ASS when he made a deal with the giant sun creature. Lex regularly deals with powers he has no hope of controlling because he is IGNORANT.

>>87249668

That strawman argument is so stupid it's costarring with Dorothy

>Lex is entertaining
>Lex is fun
>a broad, loud overacting caricature that can't go 5 seconds without mugging for the camera

I guess there's some overlap with the Rob Schneider audience here