Prehistoric civilizations

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>>19241641
Bump

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>>19241641
Has ever been looked into? Like all conspiracy theories aside,

This is a very interesting and, there is some, although by a very large stretch of imagination, possibility it could've been, although not much more advanced then the earliest paleolithic hunter-gatherers at best, far more possibly something akin to groups of early Homo genus hominids. Anything more advanced would've probably left some indications, at least in the fossil record (just look at how many different hominids exist today, from all of them, only one achieved expansive civilization).

The most probable answer, however, is no, although it is possible that some troodonits and/or avialians might have used some rudimentary tools along the way (think how crows tend to use various twigs and so forth for solving conventional problems), though it is dubious if they could even pass on such techniques.

>>19241676
Why dubious? Brain capacity and supposed hunting practices don't preclude inheriting tool using, but actually seem to encourage it - observational learning tends to spring from societal groupings, and, with two "hands" in front of them, certain two legged dinos could easily have had tool use.

>>19241641
The Flintstones is a documentary dude

>>19241641
There's been tons of floods and catastrophes over the last tens of millions of years, i'm sure many civilizations have been completely wiped out and some possibly covered up by (((archaeologists)))

>>19241695
Their hands aren't exactly as versatile in the way our (or that of other primates) are. They're great for grasping and holding onto things with both arms stretched around, but aren't ideal for efficiently grasping smaller tools. I said dubious because I wasn't aware of modern birds which pass on the technique of tool use. For forming a stable hunter-gatherer society, just observational learning isn't enough, the method of passing on the knowledge is great for enhancing solidarity of the group and through that ensuing higher chances of collective survival.

>>19241744
What would (((archaeologists))) possibly have to gain from that that they wouldn't by being the first to break the limits of our current understanding of (pre)history?

>>19241746
There are so many animals that not only have tool use but also social learning - from alligators to dolphins, ravens to otters. Hands aren't a prerequisite, societal groupings are.

>>19241795
I imagine it's like how an aquatic species can't progress to any form of metallurgic stage. Without fire no metal. Without hands, with the exception of like and octopus or other multi limbed creatures you can't interact in a way to step out of the realm of animal and into proto artisans

>>19241641
>>19241655
Great pictures. Love the smart raptor motif.

I have a thought experiment that occurred to me on a related matter once. Imagine if human society today were to discover a quick and easy way to go interstellar, and then for some very good reason (whatever, man, make up your own) they decided to wipe all trace of humans off of the earth as best as they could without wiping out the ecology. How much archeological destruction could be wreaked if the resources of humanity were turned to the deliberate destruction of the entire human archeological record? Would we be able to render ourselves invisible to the archeologists of a subsequent civilization?

(If such rampant destruction makes you feel unwell, perhaps imagine that they're not destroying it, but taking the entire human archeological record off-world to the NEW heart of human civilization elsewhere - an endeavor of the uttermost in dedicated archeological research.)

>>19241795
Agreed, but they're for the most part observational learners, they require some kind of a regular, internalized practice of learning tool use and more importantly, tool manufacture. I'd argue that the second is more important. As anon pointed out, this is also a huge factor: >>19241807 I'd argue there are alternatives to proficient tool manufacture outside of metallurgy, but they'd require very specific factors to be fully utilized. There is a chance troodonits or avialians had a spark of proto-artisans in them, but there is no reason to believe they wen't anywhere with it. Again, we know far too little of their social behavior and it's possible that the brainiest of troodonits might've been mostly solitary hunters.

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>>19241751
But they have!!! The journals simply will not publish them for absurd reasons.
It's really disgusting.

>>19241843
What are these alerternatives you postulate? Forgive me for seeming closed minded. But metal urge seems to be about as required as the wheel in terms of basic civilization starting unless they are some sort of bone singers like elder from warhammer 40k I could easily see a raptors race making things I recently heard they thought they were making trinkets, but I don't have the source but wearing shiney baubles would not be outlandish to me

>>19241641
>>19241645
This drawing is actually really interesting in that it was hypothesized by a scientist, because the dinosaur it is based on was evolving with a consistent growth in brain size iirc.
In my opinion the best and most interesting view on evolution is the one offered by Ra in the law of One. With seven densities matching the chakras macrocosmically (we are third of self-awareness) going on in the universo so that each entity, or individualized portion of the creator, can experience itself and then reunite with the creator.
>lawofone.info

>>19241641

Scorpions and cockroaches have been around for millions of years, you don't see them kick-starting any civilizations anytime soon, do you?

>>19241931
I'm not very knowledgeable of W40k lore, but imagine, for example, a system where a species cultivates their domestic organisms into tools of their need. For many obvious reasons, such a system hasn't appeared (yet) on Earth, although there are signs of it in rudimentary practices between some plants, ants, coral colonies and even in our very own domestication practices. Although not as flexible as metallurgy, it is a somewhat viable alternative to early tool manufacture for, for example, aquatic species.

>>19241852
Please anon, if you can recall any more details, even anecdotal, my dick can only stay hard for so long.

Also, OP, excellent thread!

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>>19242483
I don't have the links, sorry, so you have to take my word. Shit I know. :P
They previously published archeologists found some shit that would change human history quite a bit, mainly previously advanced humans (though not to where we are). Before we got blown to shit (possibly) and reset.
The (((journals))) denied the papers, NOT based on bad data, but because, "the subject matter was inappropriate"... WHAT THE FUCK??!?!?!

My novice guess, could be completely wrong here. Ayylmaos accidently blew our asses up, whoopsy, and then came back after things calmed down and tried to give us some helping hands to speed up. This has caused its own complications. We'll see. I'm probably wrong.

>>19242934
In the ancient days, droughts and famine destroyed quite a few comparatively advanced civilizations, especially if they were tightly concentrated. Though I am wary of ancient nuclear civilizations, I find it more then likely there were few short lived technologically and socially (if that is even appropriate) city states or concentrated civilizations. Gobekli Tepe goes to show us how far means of monolithic production go.

Also check out a recently backed hypothesis that our Homo Erectus ancestors might have been boat (rafts, actually) builders as far as roughly half a million to 800.000 years ago.

>>19241641
Bipedal dinosaurs would have been the most "fit" choice for usage of advanced tools (making hand tools, creating writing, etc) - but out of all of them many had appendages that were too short for adequate usage in those regards.

One of the roman emperors was a hobbyist mechanic, and he built a steam-powered ship on a lake as a personal project. He wanted to roll out more as naval tools, but his advisors convinced him that his plans were uneconomical. The ship was later scrapped for its valuable metal, leaving nothing in the archeological record save the official correspondences that prevented Rome from launching steamships.

More broadly, the Greeks were even more scientifically advanced than they're given credit for, with substantial advances in steam power and chemistry. Their culture fucking prevented them from industrializing. Their religions soaked up scientific talent to work bullshit miracles against the public, and their industrial/agricultural leaders had slaves to do work, so who needs machines for it?

Human technology isn't that advanced. The rudiments were invented many times before they caught on.

>>19244730
Can you link me that stuff?

>>19242934
It's believed by some that pre-great flood (Noah's Ark) human civilisation had a high level of technology. An alternate interpretation of the Tower of Babel would mean that there was in fact greater technology at that point. The story goes thus:

>And they said, Go to, let us build us a city and a tower, whose top may reach unto heaven; and let us make us a name, lest we be scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth.

>And the Lord came down to see the city and the tower, which the children of men builded.

>And the Lord said, Behold, the people is one, and they have all one language; and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do.

Now it is often understood that a tower that can reach unto heaven is simply a very tall tower in the sky. However this does not account for why "now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do." It is entirely possible that this tower was some kind of advanced technology that would allow us to manipulate reality. If this was the case then their technology would far surpass our own.

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Remember, humans went from tree shrew to man in 3~6 million years... Dinosaurs were around for hundreds of millions... It is highly possible they may have formed intelligent life...

Pic related had (confirmed) opposable thumbs...

https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn11047-birdlike-dinosaur-boasted-opposable-fingers/

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I just wish there was more on this topic, it's very interesting

>>19241676
>left some indications
think about how long they roamed the earth for and just how many dinosaurs would have lived over that period, now think about how many fossils that have been found. you think there was under 10000 dinosaurs over a multimillion year period

This is my favorite "conspiracy theory" since I was a child, and the reason I'm obsessed with dinosaurs.

I've always felt this is something I shouldn't be talking about, I've had dreams, hallucinations, and it all seems to fit just right.

>>19245023

If they reached a higher level of technology but most likely they got there by accident, without proper understanding and no care for the unforeseen consequences, there was a high probability they fucked something up along the way. Probably the opposite of what we are doing now, we start with an idea, we theorize it, research, start doing some tests and then release it, if they knew somethign we don't, they could've started building something without knowing about the basics.

>>19241931
niggafish don't need wheels they can swim

>>19241641
are ya fuckin dumb boy

dinosaurs>reptilians

so to be short, yes a branch of dinosaur did evolve to an advance state.

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>>19245023
This is getting boring and now it's time to fap.

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>>19241807
>be digging around sea bed
>find shiny rock
>bring shiny rock to thermal vent
>shiny rock melts
>mfw i discover underwater metallurgy

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>>19241641

>>19241641
Extraterrestrial? Why not.

Terrestrial? Nope.

>>19245023
Nah literal tower from mud bricks like mesopotamian ziggurats.
>"now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do."
They can do anything, the sky (isn't) the limit.