Alan Watts Thread

Fairly realistic, I'd say. He had cool friends, too, like Gia-Fu Feng.

>>18113256
And Carl Sagan

i have listened to as many lectures on this man as possible. the things i have learned altered my life and thought process in such a profound way. listening to this man eventually ended my depression (albeit i was also experimenting with lsd and psychoactive chemicals and had undergone ego death) i would asssume allan watts lectures to be. i have learned that peace and love is all you need, because in reality its just one big game.

>>18113358
*i would assume allans watts lectures to be slightly on par with ego death. apologies if i type incorectly, currently on 3 mg xan and dank weed bruh

>>18113362
>on par with ego death

What do you think that means? How can something without any permanency die?

>>18113192
just finished a lecture of his
it's getting hard to find new stuff,
his view sin't groundbreaking at all considering it was first articulated something like 8000years ago but it's indeed pretty fucking depressing how still marginal it is today.
is it because lots of people subscribing to those kind of ideas can't find any other way to express them than by using new age vocabulary and forcing it like highschoolers?

>>18113397
>his view sin't groundbreaking at all considering it was first articulated something like 8000years ag

top fucking kek!

Kudos. It's hard to stand out in a place like this, but you've done it, kid.

Comfy as fuck philosophy. I dig it.

>>18113192
>He was an esteemed scientist and philosopher

My keyboard is soaked in coffee.

>>18113438
I mean, that's at least half true.

>>18113438
He was invited to a meeting of some of the greatest scientific minds to discuss how to improve society for the coming centuries. Explain why he isnt esteemed?

>>18113440

He was just a showman and said so.

>>18113444
He's also an actually esteemed philosopher.

>>18113440
>>18113441
He isn't even in the top 500 influential philosophers, in the 20th century alone.

>>18113454
Regardless of one's opinions on him, he's undoubtably a great mind

>>18113449

I take him at his word and think no less of him.

>>18113456

He was a drunk. He was up to a bottle of whisky a day, by the end.

>>18113444
>and said so.
source?

>>18113456
Soothing voice, good at rhetoric and all that shit. But he is no Wittgenstein or Heidegger.

>>18113470
Jeepers Batman, that's some next level cynicism.

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>>18113470
You forgot to tip your fedora, sir.

>>18113467

I read it in an interview with Gia-Fu Feng, as I recall. Watts's alcoholism was discussed in the same place.

>>18113362
LMAO

Alan Watts was to Eastern Religion/Philosophy as Carl Sagan was to Science.

>>18113461

Learn the deepest secrets of the universe
If you don't kill yourself afterwards
You will find something fun to do.
Lsd , weed and alcohol will become true friends to face eternity.

>>18113855
Is life really that bad?

>>18113192

His voice also goes well with music

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RMHHwJ9Eqk

>>18113842
pretty much this. he dedicated his career to popularize eastern religions in the west

>>18113965
Only if you can't handle it. It's basically just like achieving chim, you either can accomplish whatever the fuck you want or you collapse in on yourself realizing the fact that whatever you do has no permanence.

He's an entertainer, who's subject matter happens to be eastern philosophy & religion, much like how top gear was a light entertainment show that happened to be about cars.

>>18113965

Not, life is not bad ,either good, just is.

>>18114006

What is chim?
When I google it ,a video game appears.

>>18113968
u da real mvp

He basically took Eastern philosophy and shared it with the west. He's a great speaker and inteligent guy, everyone should listen to some watts, he articulates a lot of huge ideas in an understandable and entertaining way. I don't know how people can rag on him for being too mainstream and entry level, that's missing the point of everything.

In 1987 Alan Watts admitted indecently assaulting three boys, one of them 9 years old.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/UK/england-london1239045

>>18114239
Stop fucking up a good thread

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>>18113256
>friends with Gia-Fu Feng
Hence the Fu-Manchu style goatee

>>18114359
Fuggin loved that movie. Really made me worry less about smoking softpacks

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>>18113192
slightly off, but fairly correct

>>18114478
Extrapolate?

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>>18114239
404

>>18113192
Why do people feel the need to play music during his talks? It completely kills it.

>>18114101
It's stupid bullshit from the lore of the Elder Scrolls games. Basically the idea is that the Elder Scrolls world isn't real (in-universe, that is), and neither is anyone in it. But achieving CHIM (it's always in all caps like that) means you realize the world and yourself aren't real. When that happens, you either become all-powerful or cease to exist.

It's really fucking stupid because it means everything that happens in the games doesn't matter. I have a hard enough time giving a shit about saving the world because of the bad writing and the total lack of any characters I actually care about, and now you want to add "It's all just a dream" to the list? Fuck you.

>>18113855

You'll never learn the deeper secrets of the universe.

>>18113984
So he was the original weeaboo?

>>18113192
Alan Watts struggled with psychosis and cognitive dissonance.

>>18116244

I already know them
I try to help people with it
No one is interested in knowing , I feel a little cheated ,but the world is the way it is.

>>18116264

This is science trying to explain enlightenment,

Mhu psychosis
Mhu cognitive dissonance
Mhu cotard illusion
Mhu depersonalisation.

Science is the illusion of understanding.

>>18116331
>I already know them

kek

>I feel a little cheated

top fucking kek

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>>18113358
ego death ego death
makes you lose all your breath
as you watch, from a far,
how reality is all ajar
Ego Deeeaaaath
Here comes the psychosis.

>>18116410
aaah damn
i just thought of a better last line
Here comes the ubermensch

>>18116410
>ego death

Still looking for a definition of this.

>>18116420
this link was the first thing i ever read about it.
Tbh its always going to be difficult to understand. But just keep in mind the absence of 'yourself' is closer to who 'you' are, than what you THINK 'you' are.

http://krishnamurti.abundanthope.org/index_htm_files/Brutal-Beginnings-ebook.pdf

>>18116431
>Tbh its always going to be difficult to understand.

kek

Well, just do your best. What does "ego death" mean?

>>18116437
well, if we start with what the ego is, it is the subjective representation you have of yourself. The absence of this, the absence of your imagination of yourself, presents you with what you are, the universe experiencing itself. It's sort of a divide and conquer scheme. your mind divided you from the rest of 'itself' conquering you in the process with its thoughts. when you realise what it has done, then you realise that when you act on your emotions based on these thoughts in anger, in rage, in regret, your actually harming none other than urself.
Realizing this you are plunged into a enlightened sadness. (well i dont know about this but i was anyway) because you realise your happiness and sorrow are reflections of yourself.
'ego death' is deceiving because the ego doesn't die. it will always be there. its a constant battle

>>18116437
>>18116456
i feel like i just babbled and that may opinion itself might be a subjective interpretation but i hope it helps

>>18116461
take this as an example, when i wrote this i thought 'i am being confusing', but what should be thought is 'at this point in time, i am confusion'

Never listened to him much.

I went straight to the harsh truths of Buddhism, which few people are interested in hearing, let alone practicing.

>>18116456
>'ego death' is deceiving because the ego doesn't die. it will always be there.

Which is rather my point.

The ego is an illusion. It has no permanence. It disappears, forms, and reforms all the time. It can't die, because it was never alive.

Also, you would have a very hard time getting around without one.

But is it always there? No, it's shattered by samadhi and actually takes a while to reform and, when it does, it does not reform in quite the same way.

>>18116461

Thanks. I understand what you mean.

>>18116471
>what should be thought is 'at this point in time, i am confusion'

Not quite. More like, "At this point in time, there is confusion or there is an experience of confusion".

>>18116496
>I went straight to the harsh truths of Buddhism,

kek

>>18116508
>kek

The bottomline is that practically no one wants to do what it takes to leave samsara. These people suffer and die and are reborn again countless times. This goes on endlessly until they're finally sick of it for whatever reason.

No one wants to hear or think about that.

>>18114080
He's not an entertainer. He used to be a church minister who eventually realized that Christianity kinda sucks

>>18115643
Elder scrolls does feel that way. There's no main characters in that world.

>>18114080
>much like top gear
not really. yes you may say he was something of an "entertainer" but not in the same fashion as broadcast television nonsense.

He was more closely something like Timothy Leary or Terrence McKenna

>>18116530

Its said that enlightenment is only really possible from a humans existence, and out of the billions of living humans on the planet, only a very very small amount give this any importance. On top of that, rebirth as a human is considered to be an extremely rare occurance. Its not like one dies and automatically comes back as a human again.

The general six realms of rebirth according to one's karma are: Deva (heavenly), Asura (jealousy), Manusya (human), Tiryak (animals), Preta (hungry ghosts), and Naraka (hell). Out of all the desire realms, the human realm is the least distracting in terms of desires which cause attachment and imprisonment. The work required to break free is still highly demanding, but at least it isn't impossible in that situation.

Many humans who neglect this work create attachments in their life, and upon death proceed to fall to the animal and hungry ghost realms, not just the hell realm. Even the heavenly realm is a nightmare because it is only a temporary situation wherein one accumulates increasingly weighted karma over eons, which eventually drags one back down to lower desire realms with increased suffering. One gains nothing there.

>>18116596
>six realms of rebirth
so are those the only options we have?
none of them sound particularly attractive if even Heaven eventually leads us to a hellish existance

>>18116608
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sa%E1%B9%83s%C4%81ra_(Buddhism)#Realms_of_rebirth

>>18116530
>These people suffer and die and are reborn again countless times.

You don't have to drag this into woowoo land. The ego suffers, dies, and is reborn countless times over the course of a lifetime. The solution is the same.

>>18116584
>He's not an entertainer.

Watts believed that he was.

>>18113192
He is one of that rare breed that is genetically incapable of a coherent thought.

>>18116676
>You don't have to drag this into woowoo land. The ego suffers, dies, and is reborn countless times over the course of a lifetime. The solution is the same.

That comes straight from the Buddha (Tripitaka). Where are you getting your information from?

All I know about this guy is that a sad self hating druggie I know won't shut up about him.

>>18116720

Experience.

>>18113192
>groundbreaking perspective on the meaning of the universe.
Literally all he did was explain Eastern philosophy to a Western audience that had never heard it before.
He's a great teacher, incredibly intelligent, and a great orator.
I wouldn't give him the title revolutionary, or groundbreaking though.

With all that said he has done a lot of good in this world seems like a cool guy that doesn't afraid of anything.

>>18113381
ego is seperate from the self

>>18113397
no its because the concepts are completly alien in western society and even as eastern cultures are becoming more westernized they too are loosing it

>>18114239
died in 1973

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>>18116530
>The bottomline is that practically no one wants to do what it takes to leave samsara.
That's probably because the ultimate goal of Buddhism is an existence that sounds terrible. Becoming an empty, emotionless being with no passion or enjoyment for things isn't something I consider a worthwhile goal.

He still rings true to Heidegger's Casein for the most part..
http://www.azquotes.com/picture-quotes/quote-dasein-is-a-being-that-does-not-simply-occur-among-other-beings-rather-it-is-ontically-martin-heidegger-110-37-25.jpg

>>18116977

Empty doesn't mean emotionless, a more accurate description would be "mastery."

In Buddhism, form-based phenomena (such as physicality, emotions, thoughts, etc.) and formlessness (emptiness, pure consciousness) both simultaneously exist.

When you realize emptiness, worldly form does not disappear, instead you experience it in completely controlled manner. Another way of looking at it is once emptiness is realized, forms do not unsettle your mind: instead there is perfect balance and tranquility at all times.

This means one no longer suffers: one is free from it and now experiences life from the position of self-mastery. Here the unruly mind is now tamed.

What is not real, is the illusory perception of form as being something it is not. This is what is referred to as ignorance (which leads to perpetual suffering and rebirth). When the unruly mind encounters an object of perception, it attaches preconceived labels to such an object, instead of experiencing it as something inherently empty and naturally at rest.

Again, this emptiness is devoid of false labels tacked-on by confused minds. This why its often described as "pure" and "luminous", or "absolute truth" (even though its ultimately indescribable).

>>18116923

It really depends on how you're defining those terms.

>>18116977
>Becoming an empty, emotionless being with no passion or enjoyment for things isn't something I consider a worthwhile goal.

Straw man.

>>18117188

This is where the idea "you are not your thoughts" comes from.

When crazy thoughts enter your head, you don't have to get caught up in identifying with them at all. Instead you can just let them pass away as if they never even touched you.

In sports we see the greatest athletes revel in big pressure moments completely unflappable, whereas lesser players mentally crumble and choke like dogs. If you've ever been in "the zone", its the best feeling. Never falling out of "the zone" would be something else.

>>18117188
I'm still having trouble understanding what all that means in practical terms. Do I still get to have hobbies? Can I still enjoy eating a good meal, playing a video game, etc.?

>>18116264
Any human with a significant understanding of the world around them struggles with psychosis and cognitive dissonance.

Knowledge is not an opinion solidified by concrete proof, but rather the acceptance and eventual embrace of a universal system in a constant state of flux.

>>18117252
Yes. The difference is that you're not attached to anything. You can enjoy things to their fullest and will no longer suffer and grasp for them when they come to an end. There is no craving or "hole to fill" in order to feel completely satisfied. You can live completely carefree without losing or missing out on anything you would normally consider enjoyable. Its a moot point anyway, because your total satisfaction is unconditional and with you at all times.

>>18117308
Your comment reminds me of an adage I once heard:

Happiness is not a goal to achieve, it is a state of being.

>>18114467
You lucky mang in the UK we hafta go to specialist tobacconists to find softpack ciggies. We had a wicked little shop in my (small) hometown but it closed down in like '99. No more soft pack Luckys for me :(

>>18113484
Not that guy, but there is a germ of truth in that Alan Watts more or less was a scholar in terms of comparative philosophy and religion of which a great amount of modern scholarship is indebted to him as he popularized these ideas. However he was primarily a philosopher of synthesis and comparisons whereas Heidegger and Wittgenstein, while indebted to their philosophical forebears to some extent, were quite original in their philosophy and hence were fundamental in that they established new ways of thinking within the Western tradition of philosophy

>>18113454
I finished his book "The way of Zen" (exellent book by the way, would recommend it to everyone)
First thing, making a list of the top 500 most influential philosopher is well.. pointless ?

Also I'd say he'd really threw bridges between the eastern and western philosophy, made those philosophy comprehensive for the western folks being one of the first to do such a work on the matter (zen buddhism among other things)

Also he gave classes in a few Universities in California and had an influence on the hippy movement and philosophy..

>>18113440
Which half? I'll buy the second half.
>>18113441
I also got invited once to one meeting with other scientists, am I a scientist now?
Did he published something in a journal or something? I'm asking genuinely.

how was alan watts a scientist?
nigga was a public speaker at best.

>>18113358
You are still depressed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOJ6MDwL2jY

>>18113968
my nigga

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>>18121019
He acquired and catalogued knowledge.

Are anthropologists not scientists because they don't tinker around with atoms? Are historians not scientists, because the knowledge they catalogue was first discovered by someone else? About the time you quit referring to science as the natural sciences, you sort of lost any right to pretend you're an authority on who qualifies as a "real" scientist. You should consider reading something that wasn't written in the last 50 years for once; especially in regards to the natural sciences.

Because I know what you're *trying* to say, but the way you're phrasing yourself is just plain incorrect, if not a little cute.

>>18122957
To do science, to be a scientist, you must use the scientific process. Anthropologists use this - they are scientists. Historians do NOT. They are NOT scientists.

Alan Watts was not a scientist.