what happens after death?

>>17782409
you

>>17782409
you remember how it was like before you were born? Thats basically how it is

>>17782412
I would say that I didn't feel anything, but what if I just don't remember anything?

>>17782427
you had no body or brain, how could you experience anything to remember?

You disrobe and the line connected to your robe of flesh is snipped, you leave the short life and enter into eternity

>>17782409
I'd imagine it's just like going to sleep. Except no dreaming or feeling since your brain is dead too.

>>17782444
Our existence is not based on our body. The most important part of ourself is our consciousness, our soul. And it is not bound by weak and temporary enclosures like our body. But for the moment it is the only way we know to express our soul and to experience matter. But, once the body dies, where does the soul go?

>>17782472
the soul is not real dude. you are your brain. sorry.

>>17782489
why are you even on /x/ is you believe in such things as our soul?

>>17782472
I dunno if you realize this but philosophers back then thought the soul was real too. But they soon quickly realized it was our brain and CNS that they mistook as the soul.
Science works. Its fact. Don't be a spiritual nut that denies science.

>>17782492
how are you alive and able to breathe/type if you can't think of a good answer to that

I think it's just like going to sleep and never waking up...obviously. I'd like to think there's an afterlife but no one knows.

I nearly lost my sister last year so I hate talking about death. I'm scared of the unknown. And if there is a God I'm going to hell. Probably!

In a serious note though I don't think anyone knows what dieing is like.

You hear all these stories of people having near death experiences and seeing the lights etc. And they believe what they have so.

>>17782500
Ok so if science works. Then how does the em engine work? How's it breaking every rule of physics if it's so right?

You stop living

are souls even real?

>>17782489
If you're your brain, explain how there's one guy who's a math genius with a "high IQ" and he's missing 75% of his brain. Maybe brain (like eyes) is just a way to recieve information in your body, cave fish don't need eyes, jelly fish don't need brains, peanut butter don't need fish

>>17782528
Maybe we don't remember anything before we're born becuase we don't have a brain to remember with, think of it like a gaming console without a memory card

>>17782522
If its so wrong, how do you own all of the things you have now which exists only because of science? Did a guy construct a computer using the bible or scientific research?

If I die, maybe, I will revive the old good days again.

If you accept God's free gift of eternal salvation by believing on Lord Jesus Christ then you go to heaven forever
If not, then you will pay for your sins by burning in hell for eternity

>>17782528
>knows nothing about science
>talks like he has a masters in both Bio and Chemistry

>>17782542
>doesn't realize he is already in hell

Why do you think we need to be constantly suffering?

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> talking about science on /x/

>>17782557
this guy gets it

>>17782544
What do I need to know to say something obvious? The guy is missing a slab of brain tissue, still functions. I forgot his name but he's mentioned in this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y5RpbveVC_4

Also, science is just theories, they make theories to support other theories. To be honest, anon I am kind of a scientist because I helped discover a way to make the bone structure of humans malleable. Stop being impressed by fancy titles, science changes rapidly.

>>17782566
>Why do i need to understand biology to understand what is happening inside of a human brain? I can obviously do brain surgery with no credentials in any scientific field
>I completely understand what theories are. And science is wrong because it always changes

Ill explain to you what theories are but you really need to understand how stupid you are.
Theories are the understanding of how things work at the current moment. It points you in the right direction but you won't get exact results when trying to manipulate some workings based on that theory. The reason science keeps changing is because more research is being done to further the understanding. The fact you think that you can understand something completely as fact shows how little you know about science. I think there are only 3 laws in science actually but you sit there thinking you got everything figured out.
Good luck in life, i hope you don't take your dumbass way of thinking out into the real world.

>>17782566
You realize that different parts of the brain perform different tasks? Such as picking up stimulus from the surrounding environment, interpreting and processing information, sending out signals to various parts of your body, etc.
>im actually kind of a scientist
LOL

Can we just have a discussion on what a soul is (if you could say it even exists) and what happens to it when your body dies?

>>17782602
Like i said earlier, philosophers from early days thought souls existed. That soon changed once they figured out it was the brain and CNS. If you think you are smarter than philosophers/scientists, then go out there and prove them wrong.

>>17782557
>doesnt realize its the easiest way to shut up all these dumb ass paranormal spiritual ass nuts

>>17782585
Thanks and no, I won't force my opinion on anyone unless I know about it, I don't know enough to talk on the level of real scientists but just assumed you'd need at least half a brain to be a math genius

>>17782601
then explain 1 thing: I know a little boy who touched fire with his finger and he didn't feel pain, he even rolled it around the fire. it didn't even burn his flesh or nails. How is this possible? That is a miracle imo, nothing can explain it, if you don't believe me then suit yourself but science can't explain how a child felt fire without getting injured

on the verge of huge career, drug overdose.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LTCyZvb2Uzw

>>17782614
You believe in magic because a little kid stuck his finger though a candle?

Jesus christ, anon. You really need to reevaluate some things in life.

Why do fedora tippers come to /x/

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>>17782614
>literally retarded or in elementary school

I really hope you are just some kid from grade school. Its really spooky how dumb you are

>>17782614
>I know a little boy

Go find that little boy and video record him putting his finger in fire for 10 minutes. Or maybe you are talking about someone just waving their hands through flames? Holy shit you are stupid as fuck

you're no longer alive

>>17782662
What is alive

>>17782646
>Why do social outcasts come to anonymous imageboard in which paranoia, superstition and the belief that there is "more" to their neet existances are sustained by the raving delusions of the fat schizos who frequent it?

Jee whiz, anon. I don't know

>>17782665
Damn I don't know either

>>17782602
Okay.
If you're making a simple distinction (soul vs body) then the soul is where you keep your personality and awareness.
You can complicate that greatly by more complex distinctions (soul vs spirit vs body), where the soul can be the highest self and other aspects of your personality aren't included therein. The Ancient Egyptians divided a person into like five parts, only one of which was the physical body.

>and what happens to it when your body dies?
If there's an afterlife, the soul may either remain as a ghost or progress. If there is no afterlife, then the soul dies with the body, or at least goes dormant.

There are some that say the concept of a soul is a misinterpretation of certain concepts, that there's only body and spirit, and spirit in this sense is the animating force (life, as symbolized by breath).

Honestly, I see little value in discussing the subject. We're going to die and find out, and then whatever happens is what happens. Having expectations is a great way to be disappointed.

>>17782655
The kid was 5 years old and he didn't do it to prove it, I was watching him, he found a lighter and out of curiosity flicked it on and rolled his finger in it like it was nothing, he kept it there comfortably.

If any of you anons can explain how anyone at all can touch fire and not feel pain, then call me a retard. But last time i checked, everyone reacts the same way the first time they touch fire and this kid didn't even flinch.

>>17782690
okay okay, we get it. You are retarded or just baiting.

>>17782690
>A small child has nerve damage in one of his fingers
>Probably because his parents let him play with lighters at 5 years
>This concept is so alien and impossible for me to comprehend that I would rather believe in magic

Okay anon

>>17782683
if we were to make a sythetic human, would it have a soul? Or would it just be a robot reacting to stimuli? (Inb4 we're all just robots reacting to stimuli)

>>17782710
No, even if he had nerve damage I touched it and it wasn't burned.

Why do you insist you have all the answers? Just accept something happened that is by definition a miracle, or don't believe and ignore it.

I saw it so I can't not believe it.

>>17782717
>Just accept my story of a 5 year old sticking his hand into fire and nothing bad happening as MAGIC

>Just accept that this insignificant act from a 5 year old is a miracle comparable to the healing of cancer patients and the parting of the sea.

>I saw something I didn't understand so it must be SATAN

I can't decide, so I'll let you pick one anon.

>>17782717
Literally everything that exists has a scientific explanation, whether or not we humans are able to comprehend or even attempt an explanation for it.

>>17782551
I think God sets you on fire so you're not bored. You people don't like being bored.

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Daily reminder Nihilism and Solipsism are the only objective philosophical viewpoints

>>17782712
No, that's the Abomination that Brings Desolation spoken of by Daniel and John; AI, life, without a soul, unveiled in the Holy of Holies by the Antichrist. Life without a soul. And the basis for the Antichrist's claim to be God.

>>17782743
Solipsism?

>>17782728
What's the scientific explanation for God?

>>17782743
Both are profoundly subjective.

>>17782746

Solipsism is the philosophical idea that only one's own mind is sure to exist.

>>17782725
You're angry though, you can't explain it still and I'm just telling you what I saw.

You're a victim of science imo. This conversation has been really pro-science for a board about the paranormal. Do you not realize scientists want to completely stamp out any paranormal/dogma/religion? Doesn't matter to me, I saw proof so I believe it happened. Simple as that.

>>17782743
Tell me more about this solipsism of your, mister Stranger

>>17782750
> whether or not we humans are able to comprehend or even attempt an explanation for it

>>17782750
>Both are profoundly subjective.

No. They are the only two which are purely objective.

Everything else is subjective and varies from person to person, and throughout history.

These two viewpoints cannot be refuted in any way. They are the ultimate truths.

>>17782754

> I believe everything I see

>>17782754
People thousands of years ago thought the stars were magic, Anon. Believing with only your eyes is deceiving only yourself.

You saw a 5 year old stick his finger into a small fire and suddenly believe in the paranormal. Does that sound like a healthy life choice?

This has nothing to do with science, religion or dogma. It's about logic.

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>>17782409
Does Death exist as an entity?

Like, the stereotypical Grim Reaper we see in popular culture?

>>17782756

Your thoughts and own existence, are all that you can be sure of.

>>17782769
Deaths entity is whatever killed you

get killed by a bear? It was death, for you

>>17782409
you know that feel when your asleep?
no?
well any time your asleep and not dreaming its nothingness, that would just be your whole exhistenace

>>17782791
You.. you don't feel when you're asleep, Anon..?

That absent feeling of floating in the void. Of knowing you're in the nothing but still knowing you know.

It is the ultimate comfy feel.

>>17782791
you do many things while asleep, you just don't remember becuase your brain doesn't bother as its unnecessary to

>>17782602
Soul= consciousness.

You're welcome.

>>17782539
>you own a computer
>therefore your argument is wrong
wat

>>17782816
What about the subconscious?

you just become another form of energy :p

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> literally living an absurd, borderline meaningless and fantastical existence

> precious science still doesnt prove answers to anything, only creating the new iphone and snapchat technologies for the plebs to keep occupied and contained

> science widely based on "probability" and "theories"

> but le science has all the answers! we just die! there is no soul or afterlife! its just like falling asleep bro!
ITT: human ignorance in its purest form

I wouldnt rule out anything 2bh

So many enlightened gentlesirs ITT. Keep those fundies off our board! Only euphoric engineers are allowed to post on /x/

>>17782409
Whatever was happening before, just without you.

>Near Death Experience

And for those who think the brain explains it

>Shared Near Death Experience

^ When nearby people have the same experience as the person who's dying

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This is for real.

and i can assure you that it may stand as a theory but can't be proven as fact.

The idea of reincarnation:

1. For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.

-As you release your last breath during death your soul goes on to a new born who takes in his first breath.

2. The soul transfer happens instantaneously; therefore, your soul doesn't skip a generation.

3. you may remember parts of your past life or even past lives.

4. The soul from a male will go on to another male and never to the opposite gender

5. Remembering your past life only occurs at a young age from 3 to 8

I will givean exmaple of a man who has experienced this

Part 1

>back in 1975 lebanon had a civil war.
>In 1990 a boy was born in our village.
> at the age of 5-6 he always looked depressed and never wanted to be called by his name [he either ignored the name or got angry]
>one time as his family took him for trip around the country, he started to cry and demanded the car to stop.
> After his parents stopped the car he began stating that his home was nearby and that he must be taken there.
>his parents who didn't know what was going on and wanted him to stop crying followed his orders.
> finally they stopped by a random house.
> the young kid got out of the car and ran towards the door knocking on it.
> an old woman opened the door.
>the little kid hugged her and asked her if she remembered him
>she was confused and invited the family in for a coffee.
> The little kid began to speak about his past life, stating how he was a combatant in a militia group and how he had fought in several battles.
> After ending his war stories he told the old lady that he was her husband.
> He stated his name, the date of birth, and the day they got married.
> The lady got angry and she couldn't believe how disrespectful he was.
> However, the little kid couldn't take it anymore, so he looked at her and told her if she ever found his Hi-Power Browing pistol.

Cont.

>>17782712
We pretty much are just meat robots. The cutoff between a synthetic human and a convincing android would be whether or not it possesses "the ghost in the machine". And that dividing line is pretty nebulous. Where after passing a Turing test is the point of genuine comprehension?

There are a lot of kids on here that are barely literate. Do you want to blame stupidity on defective hardware or shitty programmers? Because it's effectively sub-optimal AI.

So your question is essentially a theistic one. If mankind makes a thinking being, does it have a soul, or can only deity do that? We create life with souls all the time through procreation, what makes this different?

Don't bother asking me if animals have souls. If you want to split ever-finer hairs, I have more productive things to do.

>>17782712
Think of it this way
Jesus said you need to be like a small child in nature
Children have imaginary friends, play with toys, talk to stuffed animals

So I think a soul would be given to a fake human, it's more complex and individualized, God hears every thought (idk why even pray, you're talking to God by just thinking.)

>>17782522
The EM engine doesn't break physics, it just generates thrust in a way unlike current technology. Here's a basic explanation of how it works

http://www.space.com/26713-impossible-space-engine-nasa-test.html

>>17782557
This really

>>17782712
We don't even know if authentic humans have souls

>>17782764
You're the " I'm kinda a scientist" anon, so this is funny.

>>17782864
Similar objects react similarly under similar conditions

>>17782877
Energy needs to go somewhere, dude

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>>17782877
>She said that her husband lost it in battle.
>the little kid got mad and walked out of the house running down the street and being chased by his parents, he ran into another house yelling out a mans name.
>as soon as the older man appeared, he [the little boy] started swearing and cursing him, saying, " I had entrusted you with my side arm to return it to my wife if i died during battle and that's what you do.
>The old man began to cry and remembered a promise he had broken.
> The old man let the boy sit down and told him how it was the only remanence of his closest friend. so he kept it.
> the Old man went to his room and took the gun out showing it to the child.
> The child demanded that he would follow him and take it back to his past wifes house.
> After proving this story to his wife and explaining that he was her husband they all believed him and so did I.

There is a specific part in our brain that we dont use.
Socrates once stated in a philosophical manner that we do not actually learn; however, we remember. Reincarnation was the metaphorical meaning

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>>17782877
What the fuck? So you can never escape life? You just keep being born even against your will? Nice hell.

>>17782929
>>Energy needs to go somewhere, dude

Elaborate ?>>17782941

>>17782939
What if reincarnation is sharing the thoughts of recently dead souls?

>>17782929
>>Energy needs to go somewhere, dude

Elaborate ?

>>17782941

The idea of justice and a choice to perfection.
Unlimited chances till judgment day.

>>17782951
You can't make or destroy energy, only move it or change its form.

>>17782948
doesn't function. A body is a machine that only holds one soul. Memories of your life can only be seen by you, but told to others.

>>17782958
It was already stated but i never mentioned it.

The number of souls is limited so the population doesnt grow or decrease. it was stable from the start.

Note that population of the world 90 years ago was never specific and still isnt there are lots of hidden civilizations and many people dying that we dont even know off; however, the swarming of people into cities gives the illusion that population has increased.

>>17782819
What about it?

>>17782951
whats judgement day ?

>>17782976
>population growth is a hoax
Anonmus please

>>17782409
nothing much. assuming you're not cremated or w/e, then you'd probably just end up decomposing in the ground over time.

there's no scientific evidence for souls or anything. everything so far has basically shown that consciousness is just a temporary product of your physical brain that is destroyed upon death.

>>17782472
The soul goes nowhere, because it doesn't exist. Consciousness comes from the mind. You didn't have it before your mind formed and won't have it when your mind dies. This above all else is why you should just enjoy your time here instead if worrying about it.

>>17782412

no, AFTER death.

>>17782929
>Similar objects react similarly under similar conditions
What similar conditions? The other person in a shared NDE doesn't have any physical trauma. Their brain is fine. If NDEs are caused by a dying brain, a brain that isn't dying wouldn't have an NDE.

You realize that your brain functions have slowed to allow only the vital nerve functions including sight and sound but not muscular. You literally witness yourself being autopsied until they yank your brain from your skull, then.. who knows.

>>17784284
sight and sound go first, then breathing and feeling. Then you go shit it's quite.

>>17783416
>Consciousness comes from the mind.
Has not been scientifically proven.

>>17784792
Souls confirmed

Study the "bardos" of the Tibetan traditions. There are six bardos(states), three in life and three in death.

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>>17782409
You become a spooky skellington.

>>17785016
Not if your family opts for cremation.

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What if when we die, time just restarts again? Assume that the Universe is cyclical, or biocentric. Also think about how nonexistence, technically, is not possible. There is nothing in existence that does not already exist. So what happens when you stop existing?

>>17782472
Most of it dies with it, fragments remain in information you've created, which lies dormant until it is absorbed into someone elses.

>>17782489
>>17783416
The soul does exist. Its the software the brain is designed to run.

>>17784792
And souls have been?

>>17785071
>There is nothing in existence that does not already exist

Depends what you mean by that. Sure everything is just rearrangements. But there are arrangements that are yet to be made. There were no cars a thousand years ago though there were things that would eventually become them, both physically and in abstract.

>>17785213
hm so what are we rearranged from?

>>17785256
What can't be created or destroyed?

>>17782458
And then your crazy ass does it all over again

>>17782665
One away dude.

>>17782472
I wish. But life isn't that meaningful. You do not continue on after death, you simply cease to exist. There is no such thing as a soul.

Souls and death are names that describe that which we havent yet experienced or don't remember experience.
Tomorrow is death and tomorrow never comes.

Don't fear that which you can't understand. Seek to know death, imagine you have power over it (your own at least) which you cant possibly understand. Only death can tell you if you're wrong. But death lies.

>>17782516
oh yeah i forgot, nice bait summerfag ;)

We remember.

We've forgotten

But I lie

>>17784792
when someone gets brain damage, they may become like a whole new person. that yields support for the "soul"=temporary brain product.

you need calories to even think, which is of course energy from food. your emotions are fluctuations of chemicals in your body.

so without energy (or from destruction), these physical life necessities are removed, no thinking, no emotion = no soul

>>17782877
>The soul from a male will go on to another male and never to the opposite gender

Yet that can't explain intersex births and how new sex classifications for it were found recently?
Or are you talking about the tumblr version of 'gender' because the idea of trannies existing adds to your idea of reincarnation?

>>17782906
In the bible it says your thoughts,everything that is on your mind is "secret" and not even god can see it,get the fuck out.

>>17785071
since you're just a temporary arrangement of atoms and subatomic particles, these particles eventually get scattered around by various means means over time.

>>17785203
software also needs the physical equipment to run on. your "soul" (emotions + thinking) need a living body to run on

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>>17782409
You finally get to sit down and get the peace you always wanted.
Nothing to worry about anymore, no commitments anymore, no thinking or moving or anything concious and subconcious, no feelings or sensory impressions or anything.
It will just be perfect peace, and it will be great, for all time and forever until the end of even that.

Why busy yourself with thoughts about your inevitable demise?
Enjoy your short life. For all you know, it is your only one.

>>17783887
Rebirth. With zero recollection.

>>17785555
True.
Sticking with the allegory though, that doesn't make the hardware and the software the same thing.
And as information your soul can exist, it just won't have anything to run it.

>>17785500
What about terminal lucidity?

>>17782409
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FDy-otJDlO4

You are your brain and when you die, your brain dies. You will just not be conscious ever again.

Intelligence is a function of the soul. A brain does not produce intelligence. If you cut open Einsteins brain will his intelligence be there? No. Just a bunch of molecules.

>>17786367
your "soul" is a bunch of atoms and subatomic particles. a brain does produce intelligence. it takes calories to be able to think, which is obviously needed when learning anything. even the most brilliant of people would be literally unable to think if their body had no calories (energy) to do so.

and of course you can't literally see "intelligence" even if you cut open a brain, because intelligence is an abstract noun like love, hope, beauty, etc

>>17782877
Wait a minute, the human population is constantly increasing. If souls are just recycled from human to human, then how are there more peopke than before.

>what happens are death
the rest of eternity.

>>17782409
In the case of burial, decay.

>>17786424
The soul is 100% spiritual. Not physical. Man has an animal spirit and an animal body but also a divine soul from the creator. This divine soul gives man all the special abilities he has. Such as the power of speech,logic and reason.

>>17786436
Good point m8

>>17782472
Nice evidence to back up that statement.

>>17786480
that's easily refuted by points stated above. if someone gets brain damage or even by being malnourished, their speech, logic, and reason can and often are easily distorted and/or reduced.

the fact that changing something in the physical body can so greatly change someone's thinking and behavior is powerful evidence that your soul is a temporary brain product

>>17786436
because animal life is decreasing.

>>17786515
it only changes the faculties of your mind and not the awareness itself

>>17786522
your awareness also gets reduced by things such as being sleepy and again, undernourishment

>>17786515
The soul is the animating factor in the body. The brain and body are the temporary limiting factors to the soul.

>>17786537
that's an interesting perspective. but i believe that would require a soul to preexist before the physical body in order to be limited by it. however, since you can't remember things before being formed or born physically, that seems to go against the idea of a preexisting soul.

Can more than one soul occupy the meatsack that is the body?

>>17782690
>Obviously my personal anecdote is true and I don't need to back up my claim with any evidence.
You made a positive claim so the burden of proof is on you to prove your claim. Otherwise I'd be able to say "the Flying Spaghetti Monster exists and watches over our ever action and no one can say otherwise because I say so."

After you die, people fight over your stuff. It becomes their stuff. As long as they remember you, you are "alive" in that sense. Once the last person dies who knew you, your living memory dies too. The sun rises and the sun sets. Life goes on.

>>17786480
But animals habe speech and have demonstrated logic and reason

>>17786588
>I don't need to back up my claim with any evidence.
No, he doesn't. You're free to believe him or disbelieve him or ignore him or something else. This isn't James Randi's Paranormal Challenge or a debate. It's people talking on an imageboard.

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>>17782412
you didn't have a brain or mind before you were born.

>thinking the soul is the "software" of your brain instead of the "electricity" feeding up the circuits

shiggy summer

real question is: does this "electricity", produces by itself in some sort of atomic/molecular arrangement when we're just a mere cell in our mothers womb or is it an energy that exists permanently in the universe and transfers between vessels? and if so, what patterns obeys?

>>17786738
That's the point. Everything after death is comparable to the span of time from the big bag to the instant your consciousness kicks in. The only difference is you won't spawn in again after this.

>>17786515
Then explain terminal lucidity.

>>17786568
>you can't remember things before being formed or born physically
Past life memories/regressions are a thing. You can believe them or not, but they're there.

>>17782409
>asking living people who have never died on an anime image board what life after death is like, when they've never had a life

gnomesayin'

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In a National Geographic magazine, there was an article about Near-Death Visions. The article went over people who have had them; it was an experiment. I guess that a conclusion was the rise of Carbon Dioxide in the blood caused them. This one guy claimed that in the heart attack patients there could be no cerebral activity coherent enough to support a Near Death experience claiming that it actually might of happening outside the body. I am skeptical. Sounds like wishful thinking, but it is cool.

>>17786767
not that guy but your consciousness already spawned from nothing once, who is to say it won't happen again?

actually I would prefer that mine didn't, I don't want to live on this gay earth a second time, but it seems to me no more or less possible than my current incarnation's existence

>>17782409
other assholes keep living

>>17782409
Why does anyone assume that something happens after death? We have to evidence to make a sound decision on whether something does or doesn't therefore theres no reason to assume that there is. I think its a fools hope to hope that something does. We come from nothing and we go back to it.

>>17785587
I'd like to think that. Eternity is a long time, though. Hypothetically speaking, anything can happen in an eternity.

>>17782976
What about schizophrenics? Maybe more than one soul was trapped in one body.

>>17782412
Before I was born, there were the circumstances that led to me being born.

So basically reincarnation.

>>17783416
I disagree. Through strong entheogens, artful meditation and other ways humans have been able to capture glimpses of consciousness outside of the body. I know because I've experienced it myself.

>>17786568
What does it matter if you can't remember before you were born? I can't remember what I had for lunch last Wednesday. Does that mean I didn't eat?

>>17786505
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duncan_MacDougall_%28doctor%29
Measured an unexplainable weight-loss of 21grams in the early 20th century in the moment a person died.

Dr. Zaalberg van Zelst and Dr. Malta Did similar tests and also measured an explainable weight-loss of 69,5grams in the moment of death of a patient.

It seems like in all cases where people did the experiment of measuring the weight of the body of a person during the moment the person is dying, they lose some weight and no one is able to explain where that weight went.

Might be the soul?

I think I'm gonna start a new thread on this particular thing.

>>17786522
But a dolphin is not going to sit down and write a thesis. Animals and humans have a lot in common. The difference is the divine soul in the human being.

>>17782409
the quantum information that is your consciousness that governs your brain and body decoheres into the vast sea of quantum information before being recohered into another life form. retaining memories maybe an option if you recohere into a human.

look up "orch or" and "the case for the soul" by inspiringphilosophy on youtube.

these threads really bring about the retardation

>>17782472
Pretty much all of neurology operates under the premise that the 'soul' or consciousness is completely neurological, and there is quite a lot of evidence in favor of that. Some mysterious unknowns, sure, but it's extremely well-founded.

>>17787702
Just because you break the body and it doesn't have the same capacity it did before does not prove there is no soul.

>>17787710
But there is no necessity for a soul to explain things like consciousness. It kind of renders the idea irrelevant.

pool party

>>17787731
What produces consciousness? Brains?

>>17787731
you obviously have not had an out of body experience. How do you account for so many people being able to view themselves in the third person as they are dying? Consciousness is a non local function. The brain is not the origin of consciousness, it is like a radio in a way, a conduit through which consciousness has space to expand and exist.

>>17787747
How about you read a book? In a word, yes.
https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=Neurology+and+consciousness

>>17787751
Yeah, no one has. Less than 1/4 of people who temporarily die experience them, and studies suggest that it's linked directly to their religious/supernatural beliefs, which is why you see crap about people constantly making up experiences, like that kid who said he went to Heaven, or other out-of-body experience where the person reported they didn't actually experience that.

>>17787758
Only brains? What about vegetation? They exhibit consciousness and they don't heave brains and certain marine life.

>>17782409
>what happens after death?

Probably a funeral, burial, then just chillin in the ground until the Earth is destroyed or Jesus comes and brings you back to life.

>>17782409
I had an interesting thought a long time ago which isn't an answer to your question but is somewhat relevant. It takes time for sensory information to reach our brain and be processed, so everything we experience actually happened in the past, even though it's a very short amount of time. Because of this, you won't experience "the moment of death" because you will be dead before the sensory information reaches your brain.

Just something weird to consider.

>>17787767
People in vegetative states will normally have some brain function, they'll almost always certainly have at minimum activity in the brain stem. There isn't much of any evidence of consciousness being regained after complete brain death, but there has been small evidence of restoring extremely limited brain activity in them, albeit extremely few and the success cannot be characterized as, well, a success. They still end up being vegetables and becoming braindead once more. The only cases of it are completely dead immediately after or the family is stupidly fighting a hospital to keep them alive. The activity is no more 'alive' than stimulating a dead body's muscle.

>>17787188
There is evidence of an afterlife and/or consciousness existing outside the body. Jeffrey Long, Bruce Greyson, and Pim van Lommel are just a few people whose work looks at that evidence.

>>17782409
Well I'm Christian so you either get anally raped in hell for all eternity or smoke a joint and watch netflix with Jesus Christ in one of heaven's hotel.

>>17787758
>Yeah, no one has. Less than 1/4 of people who temporarily die experience them
So no one has had the experience, except for the people who have.

>and studies suggest that it's linked directly to their religious/supernatural beliefs
There have been atheists who had NDEs with an OBE component.

>>17787826
I keep bringing up terminal lucidity, and no one has addressed it. What do you think of it?

>>17787925
No one has had an experience out of body. So, yes.

Exceedingly few, plenty of nonreligious people have asinine views. The fact of the matter is the highest estimation is 20% of people have, with the lowest estimation being 8%, and 90% of the time their experiences stem from their religious beliefs.

Why is it that such a tiny minority experience them, do 3/4 of the world not have souls?\

The leaps you're jumping to to accept such obvious junk psuedoscience. Forget the intellectual infancy of this board's userbase.

There's something I find odd about discussions of NDEs.

If we were talking about anything else, the die-hard materialists would agree that a severely compromised brain couldn't produce any kind of normal consciousness. But when we get into NDEs and the possibility that they're proof of an afterlife, suddenly even the tiniest spark of brain activity can produce hyper-real experiences of enhanced consciousness that make the physical world feel like a dream in comparison.

>>17787826
He meant plants anon

'You,' in the individual sender, are an illusion. You are just a ray of the one light. In this sense, death is an illusion . Your individual consciousness ceases to exist after death, but then it never really existed in the first place.

>>17787941
So once again, as long as we ignore everyone who has had an OBE, we can conclude that no one has had an OBE.

>The fact of the matter is the highest estimation is 20% of people have, with the lowest estimation being 8%, and 90% of the time their experiences stem from their religious beliefs.
Even if those statistics are true and not pulled right out of your ass, that still leaves at least some people whose experience can't be accounted for by normal means. And that's not even getting into the idea that having an experience be influenced by one's religious beliefs doesn't necessarily mean the experience is a delusion.

>Why is it that such a tiny minority experience them, do 3/4 of the world not have souls?\
Arguing this is a dead end. If they happened to everyone, you'd just conclude that THAT was proof that it's all biological, since every human has the same basic brain, so of course every dying human brain would cause that experience.

>>17787962
>Your individual consciousness ceases to exist after death, but then it never really existed in the first place.
Then who or what is typing this reply? And who or what typed the post that this post is replying to?

>>17787963
If we accept a tiny minority as telling of a fundamental truth that negates all current understanding of neurology? That's what you're asking, not that I'm "ignoring" anything.

Those statistics are from the Wikipedia article on the topic ffs.

>>17787966
If we find even one unicorn, that proves unicorns exist. Likewise, if we can find even one irrefutable case of consciousness existing outside the body, that proves that consciousness is not material in nature.

>>17787990
Okay, dude. In the meantime compare the trivialness of the studies that suggest that contrary to these real scientific review journals.

http://archneur.jamanetwork.com/article.aspx?articleid=774701
http://www.nyu.edu/gsas/dept/philo/faculty/block/papers/BerlinTreatment.pdf
http://www.jneurosci.org/content/33/5/1757.full
http://psych.stanford.edu/~jlm/papers/PublicationFiles/90-99_Add_To_ONLINE_Pubs/McClellan97TheNeuralBasisOfConsc.pdf
These few journals/articles alone refer to dozens upon dozens of studies to draw their basis. You won't find anything contrary to this in a scientific journal since the 1800s since we know better.

>>17787966
>muh beloved and unwavering science

it's funny you are so convinced and talk so highly about this "current understanding of neurology" when it's one of the medical/science fields that we know less about

sciencefags are truly cancer desu, why is it so difficult for you to leave room for the unknown and accept that you don't really know shit about the world you live in? putting things in a human logic/perspective doesn't mean you can control them or even fully understand them, stop trying to confine your own knowledge you are just sabotaging yourself

>>17788020
Because you act like there's a rational basis when there clearly isn't and the prevailing consensus and evidence suggests the exact opposite of what you suggest. There isn't anything wrong with rationalism. I'd love to believe in the paranormal, but it's fundamentally asinine, albeit intriguing, for the same reason I enjoy being scared or studying cults.

>>17782412
Most retarded argument ever used
>remember how you were driving before learning to drive ? It's going to be the same after you take lessons

>>17782409
>people hear are defending it like it's a religion (it's)

Just because "science" says it's right now, does not mean it's true.

Do you know how many times "science" has been wrong? A lot more than you're comfortable with probably.

And you think it has the answers to what comes after death, what a joke.

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>>17785016
but what if

we already are a spooky skellington???

>>17782743
Damn Lexi got fat

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Doesn't life sound like Hell
a. We're kept alive by a burning ball of fire
b. We live knowing no matter what we do we will all just die
c. We have no choice in what or who we are on this planet
d. We look out into space and there seems to be nothing out there or within our reach
e. We are forced to enjoy ourselves sexually right where we also vomit, urinate and defecate
f. There is no limit to how horrible we're all allowed to be to each other
g. We grow old and have to deal with that on top of knowing we have nothing to look forward to but death
h. Being human seems to be the worst form of punishment because we're self aware and conscious about death
i. We have to constantly find eat or drink just to survive

>>17788401

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vA4WrejvOHo

>>17782409
you probably go to hell and get assfucked by demon skellys

>>17782409

In the few seconds before losing consciousness, you remember everything that happened in your life. Those few moments feel like they are forever. That's the closest you can get to eternal life.

Moments before death your brain is flooded with DMT, and you basically experience the most intense drug trip in your entire life.

It's like sleep.

You won't never wake up.

It's literally heaven. No mind, no memories, nothing.

I don't know why so many people are afraid of this or think this is pointless?

You are still here, here in this universe, just not thinking, not feeling, not seeing.

You are just there.

>>17782409

Those of us who asked for salvation go with Satan our saviour and enjoy eternal life like it's worthy of Satan, while jesus the deceiver and his "holy" angels go to hell.

>>17782409
I go back.

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>>17790159

Just don't be dumb, the devil is a deceiver and the people of jesus literally murdered thousands forcing conversion and his priest rape children, that's not a good entity behind them.

Say it with your mouth: Save me Satan.

Pic related, looks demonic, but that's a fucking healer.

And frankly, the only reason why people think Satan has anything evil is because some liars have been spewing bad fame.

>>17790183

In fact, I'm going to go ahead, fix the bible and show you why I'm asking you to precisely say: Save me Satan.

"Everyone who calls on the name of --->name of God here<--- will be saved."

Romans 10:13

We are silly demons, condemning ourselves to hell, don't mind us...

The Universe, this timeline, the big bang, it created life.

Life like we are.

We experience the universe, but the universe could never experience it'self.

That's the scary thing.

If we can observe the Universe, aren't we than the universe?

We are part of it. If we die we just return back to this multi dimensional retarded madness fest called Universe.

So many dimensions, so many unexplainable things like gravity, nature laws, wormholes, blackholes, starting and ending, time etc

I myself don't believe that our mind, our memories, etc could live on after dead, that has just no logic in it.

But who am i, to think about life after death.

The universe has so many possibilities, it's beyond our understanding.

But one thing i am sure of is that vibration is some weird fucking shit.

Remember the string theory? That beyond the atoms weird fucking little strings of nothing dance around in madness? Just driven by an un measurable vibration that comes from nowhere?

The bible says ' in the beginning was the word'

Word, aka vibration.

Everything is vibration, even Tesla thought that if you want to understand the Universe, think in vibrations.

There has to be an god, or an stone that got thrown in the nothingness, creating with his impact tour Universe.

You could think about this for decades, but for myself i think after dead you will cease to exist, no mind, etc. But being, being inside this beautiful universe.

>>17788237
>not understanding what science is

Science literally can't be wrong. Theories and interpretations based on observations can be, but science itself can not be wrong. If it is wrong it is not science.

>>17787459
>Birth rate drops rapidly
>Not enough human bodies for souls to reincarnate into
>Have to start sharing
>Planet becomes completely populated by raving schizos who smear their shit on everything they come across

Basically, the entire planet becomes 4chan.

>>17790628

I call bullshit.

Anyways, I think we can sum up the whole entire question of "is there an Afterlife" with a simple conjecture, the First Law of Thermodynamics. Energy cannot be created or destroyed.

For the universe (including all alternate realities and possible alternate universe(s)), there is a set "level" of energy, and this level will not change. While there are things like Black Holes that supposedly turn energy into an infinitesimally small point (which theoretically means that energy will be lost/destroyed because of other physics laws, such as the conservation of mass), Hawking theorized that instead of the energy getting crushed into a tiny little microscopic speck, that all Black Holes are actually Wormholes (as in, energy when sucked into a Black Hole actually comes out on another side, where & when the other side is unknown) which not only explains what happens to energy in Black Holes but allows for micro-wormholes to happen as quantum events in every day life, and re-proves the first law of thermodynamics (also, micro-wormholes and "black holes" happen all the time, it's like a reaction of quantum events).

Thus, this technically validates (but not proves) the concept of the afterlife. What happens to our energy when we die?

>tl;dr

Noone really fucking knows, but afterlife is (theoretically) scientifically possible.

>>17786537
>temporary limiting factor
>limiting
Bullshit. A soul requires a body to function.

>>17786424
>You're soul is a bunch of atoms
No it is the information and programming written using a bunch atoms.
A bunch of atoms are a bunch of atoms.

>>17786367
If you open a book will a story be in there. No just a bunch of molecules

>>17782492
What?

Wtf do you think this place is?

>>17790683

Wait a second, then what are Ghosts? If you believe in the afterlife, surely you believe in ambient spirits.

>>17786288
Unless the patterns contained within are remade in a new body. Then logically you could return.

>>17790703
Other Anon here. There are a lot of theories on ghosts. The most basic two would be

>An actual human soul that couldn't "move on"
>A resonating energy, an echo basically, of a former emotionally powerful event

The latter of these doesn't necessarily require the belief of the next life

>>17790728

Sure, 2nd one makes sense. I'm just wondering why the anon I quoted says that the soul cannot function without a body (if theory 1 is true).

Kinda annecdotal, but I have seen spirits (I've actually seen the ghost of Owen Hart in Kemper Arena, I went there in 2007 to see Cirque Du Soleil, and there was a dude up in the rafters who never came down, then he just wasn't there anymore, I can also understand that with the weirdness of Cirque that noone noticed), I do know (for myself) that they do exist.

>>17786436
http://personalityspirituality.net/2012/02/29/reincarnation-and-world-population-do-the-numbers-add-up/ i found this with the googles. i read most of it. i still don't think it answers from the beginning of human existence only more recently.

>>17787680
That's air\CO2 being released from the lungs

>>17790768
Blow up about 1.5 cubic feet of balloons and weight them. You're not going to get a quarter of an ounce. The entire atmosphere above you weights something like 16 pounds per square inch.

I'm not saying the MacDougall experiment was legit, but you're dismissing it out of hand.

>>17790183
gilfoyle shitposts on 4chan

>>17790299
9/9 post and dubs

>>17790728
I fail to see how the second one is any less "woo" than the first.

>>17790728
>a resonating energy
I wish new age retards would stop abusing the word "energy".

>>17786738
are you retarded?

>>17787826

He meant actual vegetables

>>17782409
Heaven, hell, or something else in between.

You are your brain. When you die, you cease to exist. The "energy" of your body feeds microbes that make you decay, you put off stink and a little bit of heat. Thinking is entirely a function of the brain. We know this because you can change personality after suffering brain damage. Not to mention there isn't even a competing theory to where the mind resides, other than the physical brain.

>>17782409
Your body decomposes.

>>17782609
It isn't, though. Mentioning the ''s-word'' on /x/ is basically kicking a hornet's nest and then running into the woods full of bears smeared in bacon grease, and God help you if you actually try to support you argument with verifiable facts rather than "I'M RIGHT, YOU'RE WRONG, WAKE THE FUCK UP TO THE JEW-MINATI MATRIX VIBRATIONS!"

your body decomposes, and other meatbags keep living out their objectively meaningless, pointless lives until they do the same.

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>>17791352
Pretty much this.

Was /x/ always so full of committed materialists? I wonder why they even come here in the first place.

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Can we please have just one of these threads going at a time? It's bad enough that there's one basically every day.

>>17790863

oh how far away from Satan have fallen the satanists of 4chan

>>17791844

They get hard when they come to places like this to debunk. That's how they live their lives without feeling like pieces of shit. The same exact bullshit that happened here started happening to ATS years ago. Now look at that place. Damn.

>>17791352
>>17791357
*tipsy wipsy*

>>17782717
>just accept that it happened

That is Christian logic, right there.

You cannot be taken seriously.

>>17782690
assuming he didn´t keep his finger in the fire until he got an actual, you got literally tricked by a 5 year old. we used to do this all the time when we were kids.

>>17794518
*burn

>>17790611
>not understanding what quotation marks mean

Objective truth is objective truth, no argument there. But our current understanding of how things work is what we have by way of science. If it's proven wrong, it gets removed from science. Until then, the people who speak for science will teach children that it's true.

If you start treating it as an infallible ideal, you're essentially talking about God by another name.

>>17782412
Do I get to be a failed abortion after death though?

>>17782472
There's a proposal that consciousness (and therefore, "you") isn't a soul, or your brain, but rather just a function of your brain; it's a behavior that your brain does.

A good analogy dating back to the ancient Greeks is harmony- it's not an entity in it's own right, but rather a function of the plucked strings of a harp. When you stop plucking, the harp stops doing harmony. So when you die, the brain stops doing consciousness.

Personally, this idea makes sense to me and I like it.

Wait until you die.

>>17794940
I really can't understand people who actually *like* the idea of consciousness ending forever. If you think that's what the evidence indicates, then fine, I can respect that. But to think it's a good thing is stupid.

Sigh, ok listen here, souls 101.

1. Your soul is eternal and almost indestructible (not relevant for now), as is everything that belongs to the real world that the demiurge crated (the capital G one).

2. When an immature soul leaves it's curremt incarnation the spirit guides lead to it's next appropriate one. That happens till you become mature enough an be granted "operational autonomy".

3. Souls may reincarnate immediately or linger between lives it depends on many factors.

4. Souls may enter any organism advanced enough to possess the ability of consciousness,

5. A soul may incarnate in either gender but depending on background it may have difficulties adjusting, that explains some gay cases but the homoerotic phenomenon cannot be attributed solely to that.

6. Animals and plants and shit do NOT have souls, a soul may incarnate in an animal only for special learning purposes.

7. Mentally handicapped people usually don't have souls for obvious reasons,

8. A soul is not required for a physical body to live and function as we know it.

9. Souls don't like robots and AIs because no matter how advanced they are, they are always a bunch of predetermined algorithms, in that way they feel pretty stifling.

Bonus. 5 out of the 7 billion humans living today do not posses a reincarnated soul but rather the spark that may or may not produce one. Only 1 billion terran born souls exist on this planet today and the 1 billion left are extraterrestrial souls in origin.

Don't care if this fits your scientific or religious models( they are a bunch of crap anyways) but it is the basic truth, also don't care if you believe it or not because you will when you die, or remember it , for "repeat customers"

I've never given much weight to that whole idea of "If there's reincarnation, how do you reconcile that with population growth?"

Reincarnation necessarily requires souls to exist, so they had to have come from somewhere, so there's no logical reason why new souls couldn't be created.

>>17782409
have you ever been so drunk you blinked and woke up the next day? imagine not waking up

>>17782409
Your consciousness is transferred either by innate nature or external will

>>17795395
prove it

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>>17795395
>Mentally handicapped people usually don't have souls for obvious reasons,

>>17795395

I like this but would very much appreciate sauce for further reading.

>>17795395

>7. Mentally handicapped people usually don't have souls for obvious reasons
Yes, they do. They just have learning difficulties, hence the name. They are limited by the form they were given not the other way around.

>9. Souls don't like robots and AIs because no matter how advanced they are, they are always a bunch of predetermined algorithms, in that way they feel pretty stifling.
Recommend you watch Ghost in the Shell. We aren't there yet but if we could create a good enough artificial replica of a brain and really figure out what consciousness IS, then we could put people in artificial bodies. There would be pros and cons to doing this however.

4. and 6. contradict each other. Animals and plants and even inanimate matter have the capacity to be aware and experiencing things, just not in the way we experience it, probably.

Agree with the rest of what you said.

>>17795395
>extra patronizing
>badly spelled
>pseudo gnostic roleplay
>bullshit.
Sigh

>>17787465
>Before I was born, there were the circumstances that led to me being born.

This is the Law of Dependent Origination, and you figured it out yourself. Good job.

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>>17796211

>>17792478
>I accused the other guy of having headwear most people consider bad, so I win this and every other argument

>>17795395
You got a whole 1 out of nine right (A soul not being a requirement for life, because souls aren't real)
You don't even get a consolation prize.

>>17795395
>Mentally handicapped people usually don't have souls for obvious reasons
Translation: This is so I don't have to explain why mentally handicapped and brain damaged people act differently despite my claim that consciousness comes from the soul rather than the brain.

>>17782877
>-As you release your last breath during death your soul goes on to a new born who takes in his first breath.
>2. The soul transfer happens instantaneously; therefore, your soul doesn't skip a generation
dumb ass, the human population is growing, not staying at a steady rate, explain where the new souls come from? face it, we are just complex bio-machines

>>17799576
Uh, Jew shekel magic?

thats when i fuckd your bitch

>>17799618
make money, make money

>>17782409
You float around for a bit, then you enter a new body. If you died suddenly, unexpectedly, or violently, you enter a new body quickly. In that scenario, you are also more likely to remember aspects of your previous life, but this if only true while you are very young.

>>17782409
One can't be concious of being unconcious

So in my opinion dying is like dreaming forever

>>17782409
other people bury you in your grave

>>17799537
Fair enough. Now you explain terminal lucidity.

>>17799576
>explain where the new souls come from?
The same place the old souls came from? I don't know why the creation of new souls is so outlandish if you accept the existence of souls.

>>17797852
1. Yes because i'm tired of all the bullshit i'm reading all these years.
2. Yes because tablet and because just before falling asleep. (What's ur point?)
3.Meme lvl of gnostic beliefs knowledge and as i said i don't care if it fits or agrees with your beliefs because it is the truth.
4. Roleplaying... Top kek.

I despise roleplaying in any context outside of an rpg.

>>17799537
Why you conveniently ignore the line where I said that an organism must be capable of self consciousness?
Gj you found the hol- oh wait...

The point is that souls in such bodies cannot be held fully accountable for alla actions (if they can ac at all) during the incarnation.

>>17799520
Plz go and stay go.

>>17796239
Oh my god people why is so difficult to understand what consciousness is and how it differs from sensation?????

Animals have senses but are not self conscious, people have both senses and the ability to be self conscious ( the ability to realise that the self is seperate from others), souls do not bestow self consciousness to an organism they inhabit.

Why is this such adifficult concept to grasp.

Yes i have seen ghost in the shell and although i enjoyed it very much, the concept of an AI does not work as humans imagine it, as with many other things that humans imagine.

But tell me if you manage to uplift an animal species to the same mental state and capability of humans haven't you artificially created intelligences...?

>>17796217
Zetatalk.com

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>>17795395
How do I know if I have a fully-fledged soul or a spark

>>17800030
no u

>>17799942
No evidence to suggest it's supernatural.

>>17800024
You explicitly said "Mentally handicapped people usually don't have souls", and now you've changed it to "They do, but they aren't responsible for their actions." Which is it?

you lose your memories and your life starts over from the beginning.

>>17800024
They are, though, it's just that their brain fucked up somehow and didn't mature properly or otherwise let most operate on the same level as a non-handicapped person, so you don't get to discount it as "They just don't have a soul because it doesn't support my claim"

>>17800128
Masturbate furiously.

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>>17786436
who says there are a finite amount of souls? who says every soul is incarnated in flesh at any one time? who says all the souls in existence reside on this planet alone? ever hear of starseeds? ayy lmao souls from other planets come here too

Retards, retards all around!

>>17782409
I assume it's like being put under for a surgery. you drift out of consciousness with no dreams or feelings except you don't wake up.

>>17800180
>No evidence to suggest it's supernatural.
So what's your explanation? People just spontaneously regrow parts of their brain and then lose them again after they die?