Best videogame based in DnD mechanics/settings? I played my first

>>3846550
You might be disappointed since all the retro ones are based on earlier rules that were quite a bit different from how 3.5 works. I love D&D, but not so much computer D&D. Planescape Torment is is about the most widely praised though.

>>3846554
I'm willing to adapt.

>>3846550
>Best videogame based in DnD mechanics/settings?

They're all pretty garbage since THAC0 is such an awful system..

>Player 1 attempts to attack goblin, but misses
>Goblin hits Player 1 for 4 damage
>Player 1 attempts to attack goblin, but misses
>Goblin hits Player 1 for 3 damage
>Player 1 attempts to attack goblin, but misses
>Goblin hits Player 1 for 1 damage
>Player 1 is dead

>>3846556
Sweet, just didn't want you to go in expecting 3.5 in video game form.

>>3846550
the capcom games are pretty good, but they aren't rpgs

>>3846550
Eye of The Beholder 2
Pool of Radiance
Dark Sun
Baldur's Gate

>>3846559
Being able to miss has very little to do with whether the system is THAC0 or not.

>>3846559
Even at level 1, missing 3 times in a row against a Kobold is just terrible luck.

>>3846692
>Being able to miss has very little to do with whether the system is THAC0 or not

Unfortunately it does. THAC0 is simply not very well balanced. Your character would need to have an exceptional DEX bonus to attain the kind of accuracy you'd normally see in (non-D&D) RPGs.

D&D players complained about this shit for decades. I was one of them.

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>>3846876
I always thought low hit rates were the point of Thac0. I never bothered me a ton, but also D&D was never one of my favorite table top systems in the first place.

Also that's what house rules are for.

>>3846550
BG2 is by far the best D&D-based game out there. If you're looking for 3.X-based games, though, go play NWN1, NWN2, and Temple of Elemental Evil. Do be warned that they'll teach you exactly why 3.X is kind of shit if you play them directly after BG2.

Is Icewind Dale Enhanced Edition any good? I didn't pick up BG EE because I saw many unfavorable user reviews.

>>3846550
Eye of the Beholder is a very good beginner dungeon crawler.

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>>3846550
Not quite retro, but this

>>3847609
IWD:EE is pretty much a straight port but in the BG2 engine, so it's quite a bit better than BGEE but not quite as good as the original due to having lots of kits the game wasn't balanced around.

>>3847692
Is it like BG then where I'm better off getting the classic edition and modding?

>>3847710
Perhaps, but there are fewer mods available for IWD1 compared to BG2. I still enjoy IWD1 (with Heart of Winter and Trails of the Luremaster) quite a bit however.

>>3847721
I'd only want mods to make it support HD and fix bugs though, which I heard that for BG 1 and 2 do a better job than the EE.

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>>3846550
FRUA -- it's the gold box engine for fan-made games.

Then play the classic module conversions in this guy's campaign

http://therealm.flopsyville.com/Menu.htm

I always loved KOTOR. I guess that counts as retro now.

>>3847681

How is that D&D rules at all you fucking idiot?

>>3848192
Based on how much of a headache it is to get the first game running it gets a honorary retro status.

>>3848751
GOG?

>>3848837
I got both KOTORs through Steam. The second ran like a charm though.

nethack

>>3848192
>Not dnd at all

>>3848848
>Still not dnd

Wtf is wrong with you? Are you an illiterate retard?

>>3846559
>THAC0
Is second edition man
There are games with 3e and 3.5 and probably 4th and 5th editions
There might even be a CRPG with Pathfinder rules

I just picked up NWN2 Gold from half price books for $3. 3rd edition rules and there are lots of mods

Baldur's gate and Neverwinter nights are some of the best. Dragon Age Origins was pretty good, bit avoid the shit sequels.

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At their hearts 2e and 3e are very similar they just flipped a few mechanics (to-hit, ability checks) to make higher-always-better and they flattened out all curves so there's fewer difficulty humps players have to struggle over.

That having been said my favorite retro D&D game is pic related

Warriors of the Eternal Sun on the Genesis was fun as hell back in the day

The original Pool of Radiance series from SSI:

Pool of Radiance
Curse of the Azure Bonds
Secret of the Silver Blades
Pools of Darkness

These are the "Gold Box" games. They were written for every platform but are easiest to emulate in DOS or C64.

They fucking rule. Simple as that.

Word of warning: you need physical schwag from the boxes to start the game (their low-tech but surprisingly effective version of copy protection).

>>3849056
>implying KOTOR isn't run on D&D mechanics

>>3849056
Not that anon, but KOTOR is a based on d20, and it's basically a bare-bones 3e built for modification.
KOTOR is a giant D&D homebrew in some way.

>>3848745
Like classic Wizardry, it's pretty much Not-AD&D with a few tweaks.

>>3849483
No, not really, they look similar at first blush but they play almost completely differently due to differences under the hood. Compare IWD1 and IWD2 - the only reasons they play anything alike are because the engine and UI are similar, but in practice everything means something completely different.

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>>3846559
Thac0 is a fine system. The major advantage at the 2e table is that no player ever has to worry about it. Only the DM ever had to deal with thac0 and that's okay because its simple anyway. You'd roll your die and the DM, who knows your Thac0, knows if you hit and will tell you.

This is one of the ways 2e was more approachable for newcomers. All of the hit calculation takes place behind the DM screen so very seldom was a new player tasked with adding or subtracting anything to their roll. They got to focus on the action.
As a result, when you DO get to add numbers onto your roll it becomes more special, as in the case of a fighter with weapon specialisation or when you are enchanted by magic. At the same time, having to make subtractions is more dire and dramatic. All this just because its not rote. The modern RPG player can expect to modify every roll they make in and out of combat from day one. There is fun in that too, mind you, but I favour the old way.

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>>3850465
I am a DM and you are awesome and I hope that your players appreciate you.

>>3847681
Dark Spire is extremely good, and I'd gladly play by its rules on the tabletop.

>>3846550
Im playing wizardry 7 and it seems pretty gud

>>3850465
But that advantage becomes completely redundant in the context of video games.

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>>3850550
Nay. It's maintained in video games because you still don't have to worry about your calculating your own attack roll.

Strictly from a player's point of view, all video games are using thac0. You roll and the referee tells you the result.

>>3850317
https://www.scribd.com/doc/15600502/Conversion-Manual-AD-D-to-D20-3-0

Dungeon Hack

>>3851013
Which does less than nothing to disprove what I said. It doesn't matter if you can convert from 2E to 3E when anything you convert ends up functioning and playing very, very differently. Even shoe-ins for playing the same, like Fighter, aren't because 3E's Fighter is pure shit and 2E's isn't.

>>3846550
Without qualification, the best D&D game for 3.5 mechanics is Temple of Elemental Evil. No other title before or since has captured the sheer autism of all the mechanical nuance that goes into playing the actual game. From 5ft stepping, coup de grace, readied actions, reach and AoOs, everything is as close to an actual game as it conceivably can be.

It just unfortunately is set in the blandest of D&D settings (Greyhawk) and has one of the lamest stories. The Circle of 8 has done an excellent job keeping it fresh all these years on that front though.

>>3852225
Actually ToEE uses different rules for AoOs for some reason. They're only supposed to provoke once per movement action, but obviously that's not what happens in it.

>>3846876
THAC0 was better then 3.5's AC

Its why 5th edition severely limits AC to where its pretty much THAC0 but easier to understand.

Icewind Dale 2 prolly has the best combat.
Planescape Torment prolly has the narrative.
Baldur's Gate 2 is the perfect blend of both.
Just remember to stay away from the remastered version on Steam. Buy off GOG and/or pirate it instead.

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>>3852574
I really enjoyed Icewind Dale 2 but I could never shake the sense that the game would have worked much better if the times had not forced them to implement 3rd edition rules.

>>3852705
You'd be right.

>hp bloat out the ass, many monsters take multiple rounds of 3 melee characters wailing on them to take down, and that's on normal
>garbage full attack rule that does nothing but fuck melee over
>dumb as fuck class balance, with garbage classes like Monk and Ranger juxtaposed against godlike classes like Cleric. It's so bad that the best melees and archers in the game are Clerics, not any of the actual dedicated combat classes.
>Rogue is pointless for anything other than Sneak Attack because Rogue 1/Wizard 19 is better at skill monkeying and isn't even delayed in spell levels like they should be because of how long it takes for spell scrolls to catch up, and Sneak Attack is buggy and hard to use because of the aforementioned full attack rule
>3E save system makes SoLs overpowered straight up until HoF, which isn't even interesting as it's all about cheesing encounters

99% of what's wrong with IWD2 can be blamed on the system they used for it.

>>3852757
Aye. But it was the system they wanted to promote so to hell with the game, I guess? I dunno.

>>3852762
They should've left that to NWN1.

>>3852762
Incidentally, this was the attitude toward the actual D&D game as well.

>>3852776
Aye, it would be fitting.
NWN is a game set firmly in the dung era of polygonal graphics were everything looked god awful compared to the lovely sprites of BG and IWD.

Everything is square and spotless, snapped to a grid and lifeless. The inside of peoples houses are cavernous spaces with rooms hundreds of feet across because the combat system demands it. And the computer game isn't any good either.

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>>3851512
>3E's Fighter is pure shit
Actually, I found it much more difficult to balance the 3e 2-handed Power Attack than I ever did balancing Weapon Mastery and had to dogpile fighters much more heinously to offer party challenge

>>3852545
There's very little difference mathematically between THAC0 and hit bonuses it's just like I said flipped to where high-is-good both on AC numbers and to-hit rolls plus the bell curve for AC got flattened which is what you've noticed. It became easier for any melee character to achieve ACs of 20+ while it was only defensive-oriented characters who ever got sub-zero ACs in 2e. The THAC0 system had already flattened the curve from the to-hit tables found in 1e which combined with armor-type hit modifiers truly was too complicated.

>>3853037
Did you miss the parts where HP is nearly tripled in 3E and therefore 2H Power Attack is actually necessary to keep up with runaway HP inflation, full attacks, which stop you from making all of your attacks unless your target was within 5 feet of you when the round started, and iterative penalties, which stop any attacks after the first two base ones from mattering anyways? If you think Fighters, who are inarguably one of the worst classes in the system without ACFs, are broken? I'd hate to see your response to a Batman Wizard or CoDzilla.

>>3852349
No, you can provoke multiple AoOs from a single movement action. It just means that you're provoking them from multiple targets. For example, if you're in melee with four gnolls and move through their threatened areas, you provoke a separate AoO from each of them.

Also, someone with Combat Reflexes can conceivably gain multiple attacks depending on how you move past. For example, you're fighting a Hobgoblin with a Longspear. He gets his AoO for you entering his threatened area. You then proceed to move adjacent to him where he doesn't threaten because of his weapon's reach. Then you move past him again back into his weapon's reach. Normally he only has one AoO a round, but with Combat Reflexes, this second trigger happens as well.

Temple is a great game to make AoO builds on. Like a pure Fighter with a Mage buddy. Have the Fighter take Combat Reflexes, Improved Trip, Spring Attack, etc. and use a Spiked Chain. Then have the Mage Enlarge Person him. He'll individually threaten a target at 15ft, 10ft and 5ft.

I love how true to the mechanics ToEE is. Half the fun of the game is making autistic builds like that.

>>3853112
The problem is that that's not how AoOs work in the actual game. See:
>Moving out of more than one square threatened by the same opponent in the same round doesn’t count as more than one opportunity for that opponent.
Getting an AoO for each threatened square they move through is a ToEE-only thing.

>>3853063
I'd been doubling module HPs and making liberal use of classed monsters as a result of splat books long before 3e but the solution to broken characters should have never been to break monsters to the point that only broken characters are playable because that fucks casual players until you basically can't get girls or non-nerds in general to play.

Batman Wizards and especially CoDzillas are both direct consequences of the flattening of the AC bell curve.

>>3853164
>that fucks casual players
That was 100% intended by the dev team, see Ivory Tower Game Design, and at any rate, some longsword-toting sword and board Fighter tossing out their 1d8+5 a round vs 60 HP monsters that smack them back for half of their health while their shield isn't making a bit of fucking difference because the monster attack bonus curve makes AC one of the worst defense mechanics in the game, is getting fucked no matter what.

Batman Wizards and CoDzilla also have nothing to do with AC at all. Batman Wizards are the result of every major limitation on spellcasters getting removed, the new save system meaning that everything has an exploitable weakness instead of saves steadily scaling to the point where those kinds of spells couldn't hit, and spells that ignore anti-spellcaster mechanics being everywhere AND being overpowered(see Solid Fog). CoDzillas simply overpower martials at their own game while not being beholden to magic items so it doesn't really matter what happens to AC.

>>3853190
Well wizard spell tables also had their curves flattened and PHB spells were overpowered bad enough from the beginning as a crutch to get converting wizards to let go of their stupid precious splat books that when supplemental wizard spells started to be released that shit snowballed.

High level wizards were ALWAYS more powerful than equivalently leveled melee classes that was the point of the followers system. With the notable drawback of spells-per-day, wizards held their own in combat beginning around level 5 when they got their first third level spells it was the fact they were basically useless up to that point that proved a barrier to entry. Of course then 3e generously provided a system for creating pre-leveled PCs which is another of its flaws.

>>3853164
This is why one of the important things I emphasized as a DM is that the rules are just a guideline to go by. Depending on the group dynamics and what kind of games the players want, what works best can change. A power gamer party and a roleplaying party are very different to deal with.

>>3853117
Ah, I see what you're saying now. Yeah, that's why I mentioned the Improved Trip. You're only supposed to get one movement-based AoO, but triggering actions like standing from prone, or an unarmed attack because your Spiked Chain bonus stacks with a size and two-handed bonus for disarm all stack with them moving into your threatened area.

>>3846554
>disappointed
>earlier rules

You sure swallowed the WotC-pill hard, eh? What'd you do, take a bunch as a suppository, crush a bunch up and snort them, then mainline the rest? They want you to think that earlier rules are inferior because they know that True AD&D™ is superior, both in content and in breadth. No way will they let TSR, Inc. compete with their inferior rules, so they brainwash shills who do it for free.

2nd Edition. Basic Editions. Original edition. 1st Edition. These are the building blocks of True AD&D™. All other editions are false. Only those materials and rules produced prior to the autumn of 2K are viable and True.

>>3853271
Monte Cook and Skip Williams, the writers for third and 3.5 edition were former TSR employees. Hell, Williams was a personal friend of Gygax.

Fourth edition was the soulless sell-out. Third edition was the ultimate culmination of everything AD&D got correct but refined to its purest form.

>>3853278
Holy shit, Skip Williams is the biggest piece of shit from all of TSR. Not even reading the rest of your post. You know nothing. Muh skills & powers. Muh changing the 2E PHB to prevent proper dual-classing. Muh giving Jean Wells a case of Hep C so bad it blew off the back of her fucking head. Muh Sage Advice that's always wrong just like Jean cunt Wells'.

>>3853226
Outside of the tiny handful of non-shitty PrCs for spellcasters and DMM, splatbooks didn't really make spellcasters that much more powerful than they were in core. Shivering Touch and Celerity are stupid and deserve to be banned, sure, but the problems started all the way back in core with dumb as fuck spells like Polymorph, and when you consider that classes that aren't full casters had even less options in core, splatbooks are obviously not the problem here.

>>3853271
lol nice angry tirade, but I was just pointing out it was a very different rule set. I've been playing D&D and other table top RPGs for over 30 years. >>3846886

>>3853287
>muh Penny Williams editing people's work to appear as if a retarded 3rd grader wrote it

Great taste in women

>>3853287
Skip Williams was one of the original playtesters for the original D&D. You having a wrinkle in your foreskin over him doesn't change him being ten times the authority that you will ever be.

>>3846886
>>3853291
Thinking that THAC0 is part of 2E means you're a WotC shill whether you know it or not. It was a part of AD&D since the very beginning, and part of OD&D before it. Appears in the 1E DMG by Gygax himself. WotC invented THAC0 being part of 2E to split the True AD&D™ community, turn them on one another, and maintain superiority with inferior rules.

>>3853278
Monte Cook was a writer who's strengths lie in flavor and Skip Williams was a useless fucker who didn't even know how his own system functioned 8 years after the fact and REEEEEEd about how Sorcerors were overpowered compared to Wizards because he didn't like spontaneous spellcasting. Then there's SKR, who royally fucked the Monk in three different editions of the game because he didn't like it.

Real all-star cast, that.

>>3853298
The First Council of Geneva declared ALL writings of Skip Williams non-canonical and apocryphal. He is excommunicate from the Body of True AD&D™. He has no power and neither do adherents of false editions.

>>3853307
Thac0 is, always has been, and always will be a pointless nonsensical system that BAB puts to shame. There was literally no reason to inverse the numbers and have negatives represent positives other than to slow the learning curve for new people. Same with AC.

>>3853310
As opposed to?

>>3853318
Pre-3E AC was taken from a naval wargame. First class ships are better than second class ships and all that.

>>3853318
>no need to inverse the numbers
And yet piece-of-shit false-edition-producing WotC did it anyway. AC descends with quality. Quality descends with WotC.

>>3853290
I mean that 2e splatbooks being way way way too good had already spoiled spellcasters and placating them enough to switch is why the core spells right at the 3e launch were alllllmost broken - or outright broken in the case of polymorph. Of course it was easy to keep the balance since you could write about any damn spell and as long as it wasn't completely broken it probably would go right in the trash since the core spells were so good.

>>3853325
WotC has positive AC.

>>3853321
Literally anyone who worked on any prior edition of D&D.

>>3853321
Eric L. Boyd is a Real Man who creates real rules. It's a shame that he had to degrade himself by producing "3E" content after WotC killed a Real Man's game.

>>3853331
No fucking shit. Because they inverted the True nature of AC, which is to descend negatively.

>>3853340
Again, pointless nonsense. There's no good reason to have a negative represent a positive. The weaker your Armor Class becomes, the stronger your defense is!

Anyhow, it serves as a good litmus test for trolls. AD&D fags who can't admit the superiority of third edition BAB and AC are usually just looking for (You)'s.

>>3853307
>Thinking that THAC0 is part of 2E means you're a WotC shill whether you know it or not.

You're fucked in the head. I've barely even played D&D since WotC took over, I only know 3E enough to know how different they made it. Other than that I've barely cared about the setting compared to other games.

But again, nice vitriol.

>>3853332
Can't name anyone, huh? I don't blame you. Must be frustrating that a lot of those titles have Cook's name on them too, I'll bet.

>>3853334
Boyd was a contemporary of Cook and Williams and worked on largely the same titles. You can't condemn their work and idolize his when it's almost entirely the same thing.

>>3853329
It was really more "okay, X Y and Z made spellcasters unfun, we're removing them or lessening their impact", then there was overpowering Clerics because nobody would play them in playtesting until they were in their current form, and overpowering Druids because the people who playtested them had the IQ of a fucking refrigerator and didn't even try to use the class' features or spells and instead fucked around hitting monsters with scimitars with their gigantic 12 STR...

Except the people who designed 3E obviously had no understanding of why those limitations existed in the first place so all they did was fuck the game up really hard, which is even more obvious when you see garbage mechanics like full attacking or 3E stat checks.

>>3853351
The AC of your target is a modifier to your attack, you idiot.

>>3853307
>It was a part of AD&D since the very beginning, and part of OD&D before it. Appears in the 1E DMG by Gygax himself. WotC invented THAC0 being part of 2E to split the True AD&D™ community, turn them on one another, and maintain superiority with inferior rules.


Also how did you get the idea that I wasn't aware of this? lol Were you just looking for something to get huffy about?

>>3853307
thac0 didn't start universally applying, including to rolls above 20 with modifiers until 2e. See >>3853037. You can actually see where the slide began even earlier than 3e. Every edition is simpler and more generous to players than the previous.

>>3853362
Only in shitty inferior forms of D&D. In proper, well-tuned ones, it's a defense that needs to be overcome by your attack.

>>3853356
I would even take Zeb Cook over the gaggle of tards that made 3E - and I specifically dislike him for making 3d6 the baseline again after a game that cautioned AGAINST using 3d6 with supporting evidence.

>>3853360
>the people who designed 3E obviously had no understanding of why those limitations existed in the first place
Yeah that's it you really arrived at the heart of it, but that's what always happens when anything's natural lifespan gets artificially extended for profitability.

>>3853365
Read the appendix of the 1E DMG sometime. See how many hands it would take to count how many times THAC0 is referenced. Hint: monsters

Holy shit all this salt from 3tards, 4rries, and 5-iqs.

Reminder, babbies: this board is for games from prior to 2000. Your ᵢnferior ₑditions aren't allowed here.

Baldur's Gate for life. Throne of Bhaal / Heart of Winter / Icewind Dale II are false editions.

>>3853392
Technically, none of this shit is allowed here, including and particularly your autismo.

>>>/tg/

>>3853392
lol

>>3853396
Stay mad. I'll be laughing when they take your permanent and immutable 5th edition from you just like I was when they took your 3.5 and your 4. Fucking weeb.

>>3853384
Because monsters were more powerful than players. They got to apply their modifiers to their thac0s instead of as bonuses to their roll versus a table that got stacked against them. It was easier for a monster to get a lucky hit in against your front line than the other way around. 1e demonstrates that design philosophy everywhere. "When in doubt, make it harder" because it's better to make an unfair rule that players work around than to make an too generous rule that breaks the entire game

>>3847676
just wish scummvm supported the japanese music

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ELDER GOD TIER
3.5

GOOD TIER
3rd Edition, AD&D 2nd Edition

OKAY TIER
AD&D

PLAYABLE TIER
OD&D, Fifth Edition

UNPLAYABLE NONSENSE TIER
Fourth Edition

Anyone who disputes this only outs themselves as edition fanboys who have not played the breadth of what's available and are allowing their narrow view of what they're familiar with to color their opinions.

>>3853554
>breadth of what's available

I see you learned a new word from me. You should have looked it up though. The breadth of True AD&D™ spans 30 years. That of your "elder god" 3.5E spans several. I believe we'd call that a dearth.

>>3853554
>no B/X
>no BECMI
>literally every game in the wrong position

>>3853640
>i invented the word "breadth"
>i only love ad&d

Confirmed for edition fanboy. Your D&D card has been revoked. Please refrain from posting again in the thread.

>>3853554
I can more or less agree with this, especially for moderately experienced players.

inb4 my phrasing pisses off both new school and old school players