Do you like Klackons , anon?

>>3677432
Gnolls are better.

Their bases produce more energy. They get galleys to cross the ocean at a respectable speed. They have bowmen to capture phantom warrior sorcery nodes.
They are not totally despised by other factions. Their units are cheap. They can rush other bases faster than anyone else: Granary>Stables>Wolf Riders.

When I conquer Klackons I build a few engineers if I don't already have them then then I disband the base by rushing colony pods.

>>3677432
Klackons are cut off from most of the tech tree and it fucking sucks hard once you're actually past early game. It's great to have 1 or 2 Klackon villages from conquering but having them as your main race is a huge pain.

What >>3678018 said

Klackons, Gnolls and Lizardmen are the three races that are designed around early rushing because bad building trees, but Klackons have terrible unrest unlike the other two, so while the others can transition into actually buillding up a good race after the initial conquer period, Klackons just kinda peter out unless you have some abusive magic build going on.

Their advantages really needs to be a lot higher to support their very "self-centered" theme going on.

>>3678338
>It's great to have 1 or 2 Klackon villages from conquering
Dat Unrest though.

>>3677432
At the risk of seeming foolish, what game is this? Sounds interesting.

>>3679075
Master of Magic. Hands down the best fantasy 4X of its generation and is arguably still the best.

>>3678018
Klackons are overpriced though. And I found that if you use the Warlord pick, Orc engineers have the same stats as the Klack version once they've reached Ultra-elite rank.

Unforturnately dwarven towns don't always show up in every game.

>>3678559
>>It's great to have 1 or 2 Klackon villages from conquering Dat Unrest though.

Only good way to deal with Klack unrest seems to be with certain white magic spells.

>Klackons, Gnolls and Lizardmen
Lizardmen also seem to dislike all races, but not as much as Klackons. For some reason, Lizards are okay with being ruled by halflings, but not the other way round.

Gnolls combined with orcs and trolls are best bros, but I rarely get all 3 in 1 game.

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>>3679075
>>3679141
Take Master of Orion and Civilization, mash them together and set them in a magical fantasy setting and you have Master of Magic. It is really one of the greats and is still quite playable to this day.

To answer OP, no.

This is the best answer:
>>3678018

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Those Halflings tho

Such absolute madmen

>>3680261
Halflings are ridiculously strong due to the extra attack. I was just finishing up a Warlord+Life Halfling game as I got Crusade and pushed my slingers from Ultra-Elite into Champion with it. Fuckers were blowing up melee units in one shot.

>>3680283
Life magic in general is OP in MOM.
If you want a decent challenge you'll avoid taking any life books or the portraits of any AI wizards that use life magic (otherwise they won't be able to show up).

Sorcery is the second best magic but only in the hands of the player. The AI doesn't know how to use it well.

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Alchemy skill or no? Also general skills discuss!

>>3680283
They can also build most of the buildings,and get along with most number of races. They're good in both early and lategame. Increased food makes them grow slightly faster than the "standard" humies and orcs. Luck and more numbers in their units also make up for their lower HP.

Their only real weakness is no galley ships, which is no big deal if you chose sorcery books. You can just replace them with floating isles, flying triemes or wind walk.

>>3680327
Alchemy with Warlord worked well with Klackons/Lizardmen/etc. If only because they can't build Alchemist's Guilds.

And combined with Dwarves, you basically get extra mana if you convert gold>mana every now and then.

Also works well with the Runemastery+Artificer exploit for more flexible in your budget, but you're better off getting more books so you can imbue more stuff in your hero equips.

>>3680428
>works well with the Runemastery+Artificer exploit for more flexibility in your budget

>>3680428
>Lower HP
My bad. Halflings have reduced Swords not HP.

>>3680327
Not a bad pick, but usually overrated.

>>3680428 lists the situations it's particularly good for.

>>3677432
According to the manual. High-elf longbowmen are suppose to have the longrange ability, but I don't see it in-game. Did they remove it in patch 1.31 or is it another bug?

>>3680327
Alchemy gives great boosts to your economy and military.

1:1 gold to mana is not only twice as good as default, it also lets you revert back losslessly if you change your mind.
A neat trick for early rushes is for your wiz to focus on mana generation, convert it to gold, and use it to rush build strong units and the buildings they require.

The military benefit is that all military units you build (not summons, heroes, or mercenaries) get magic weapons (+1 to hit except for ranged magic attacks which are not physical weapons).

This pick is especially good for Gnolls, Trolls, Klackons, and Lizardmen who cannot build alchemist`s guilds and cannot otherwise get this bonus except by special magic which can be dispelled.

This pick is also great to use with ranged units like bowmen and javelineers because it offsets the distant shot penalty.

Compare Alchemist with Channeler which costs two picks instead of one and only gives you an economic benefit (save on mana spent in battles, reduced spell upkeep).

Or with Warlord which costs 2 picks and only gives a military benefit (albeit somewhat stronger than magic weapons).

>>3680770
The manual was finalized before the latest official patches.

Check masterofmagic.wikia.com for the most correct info.

The Halfling thing is because of Lucky having all kinds of undocumented behavior that makes it very hard to damage Lucky units. The swordsman-sempai in >>3680261 can wipe out any neutral city garrison... not that I'm complaining...

>>3681220
They get an extra person per stack on top of Lucky, too.

>>3681220
>>3681696
Kinda wished they had halberdiers too.

>>3680807
Channeler works well with Conjurer, but 11 books seem to give better mana discounts for 1 type of magic?

---

Also realised Draconian Bowmen are a cheaper way to guard cities against raiders and take out melee ground units, compared to summoning Sprites which cost an upkeep of 3 mana each.

>>3682784
The real reason you want that is for the lessened upkeep on your 500 summons. 11 books gives you a huge discount on casting but nothing when it comes to upkeep, as far as I know.

>>3680770
>>3680808
Oh well. Nevermind. My 8-stack of adamantium ultra-elite longbowmen(with a weaker Shuri hero supporting) still killed several cities full of halfling shamans and stoners, while losing only 1 longbowmen unit. Their ranks were much lower though, and no magic weapons for them.

In theory longbowmen should do more damage than slingers but their luck should make their defence superior to elves.

>>3680808
http://masterofmagic.wikia.com/wiki/Shamans

Barbie Shamans are the cheapest? That's not mentioned in the manual or in-game help.

That makes them superior to all bowmen for taking out sorcery nodes, by spamming a whole lot of them. Same upkeep as bowmen!

>>3677432
http://masterofmagic.wikia.com/wiki/Ranged_Magical_Attack#Ranged_Magical_Attack_Subtypes

Never realised "normal" magic shots had 3 elemental types. I assumed they were all chaos-related since the icon was a fireball. Which means Zaldron is has the best type since it's sorcery and not defended with Resist Elements or Elemental Armor? Not very useful since Zaldron is weak and the enemy hardly seem to get Elemental Armor. Aerie's armor-ignoring illusion attacks is more useful but she hardly shows up.

I've always been more of a Death War Trolls guy.

>>3685912
more weird shit, is I think they are all physical damage. They are not fire or cold damage despite possibly looking like firebolts or icebolts (so those immunities don't apply)... just plain old damage with a realm alignment

>>3677432
For playing Klackons, be an alchemist. Also, check out the Aureus mod of MoM, there Klackons can build most of the buildings and the Stag beetles have merging.

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>>3684964
Also remembered most spearmen have 8 figures just like halflings, making draconian and barbarian spearmen surprising strong after promotions and stuff. They can potentially do as much damage as a Hydra?

>>3686474
Been there, done that. I'm more of a melee guy, so I'm trying out other unit combos.

>>3686715
I tried the link to Aureus Mod, but it seems to be dead? That makes Klacks way too powerful imho, though I'm not sure how that mod balances out other things.One thing I hate about fanmods is that they tend to make the game too hardcore for me.

>>3686776
Yeah in the Aureus mod, Klackons are somewhat overpowered. Beetles do however require a fantastic stable thus being a very late unit and not suitable for an early rush anymore. the Mod should be here: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1430...MOM200.zip
Unlike the Caster of Magic mod (which I do not like) this mod does not change too many things, apart from race and realm balances.

>>3686796
>Unlike the Caster of Magic mod (which I do not like)
What's wrong with CoM other than (optional) anime wizards?
The AI is stunningly intelligent compared to the original and impossible difficulty is fulfills its namesake.

>>3687305
Well, given what he typed - he probably doesn't like that it changes a lot of things

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>>3677432
I unexpectedly made one of my heroes achieve Demi-god rank even with without the Artificer/Runemastery combo.

I guess Warlord makes it a lot easier. Probably requires a large world with weak nodes so you can have enough enemies to grind for XP.

>>3687305
Call me a pussy but impossible in patch 1.31 is impossible enough for me. Unless you can find the enemy wizards in early game and rush them, the AI's production bonus will totally overwhelm over time.

>>3687972
>achieve Demi-god rank WITHOUT the Artificer/Runemastery combo.

Also Ultra-Elite Adamantium Longbowmen did most of her work for her.

>>3686494
Magic immunity gives the unit 50 shields against any magic ranged attack(not sure if armor piercing ability or illusionary weapons affect it though).

Source: I tried hitting enemy paladins with a stack of magicians and they dindu nuffin.

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Aerie's ranged illusion attack will bypass paladins' magic immunity. But it will not bypass Sky Drakes' immunity, because Sky Drakes are explicitly immune to illusions. Armor-piercing is overwritten by magic immunity but jet fuel can't melt steel beams.

God, the rules in this game.

>>3688095
>jet fuel can't melt steel beams.

Lies. Double-U Bush bombed those buildings so I can't play vidya without listening to shit about IRAQ. Is conspiracy.

>>3677432
>Do you like Klackons , anon?
Meh. They are OK for one of the vanilla races.
I'd rather play Silicoids or Psilons to win, or Humans for a challenge

>>3688108
It took me a while to realize this was Master of Orion 2.

>>3688108
>Humans for a challenge
Humans are overpowered in MOO 1? Diplomacy bonus, extra trade bonus, research bonus for shields and flight(i think). They have no penalties for anything.

>>3688129
>Humans are overpowered in MOO 1?
Yup, which means he's probably talking about MOO2

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>>3688108

>>3688184
>Furries
Yuck. Also not-retro.

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>>3688234
Only retro-furries allowed here.

>>3688108
in moo1 Klackons are my 2nd favourite, after Darloks

>>3687305
>What's wrong with CoM other than (optional) anime wizards?
Uh, where do we start? While being a really ambitious project, the changes basically fuck up the gameplay so bad, that it's just annoying to play. The AI is by no means smarter. It just expolits all the AI boni better.

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>>3688435
>Darloks
There's a Darklord in MOM too. Darlok's stealth bonus is pretty lame though. Why spy hard when you can bomb hard?

>>3688541
lost to filename

>>3688541
>Why spy hard when you can bomb hard?
Challenge race / Change of pace, I guess.

I remember playing the shit out of this game. In the end I always just summoned super powerful champions, summoned gear to straps them up and pretty much had solo champs running around running everything over.
The end game global spells in this game are just so epic, don't see that nowadays. All the modern day 4x4 games I've played have being a Civ clone with spells as flavoring on top.

>>3686776
Drac spearmen are particularly nice because if you Chaos Channels them they'll always get +armor, and CC is bugged to give +6 armor when it should only give +2.

>>3690097
Ah yeah. If I'm not wrong it could also work with flying ranged units(not units enchanted with a flight spell). However that means it works well only with hi-elven Pegesai and dark elven Nightmares, besides draconian units.


That's exploitable but chaos books as a whole are kinda underpowered compared to the other books. Doom Mastery also takes forever to research, if you wanna zergrush with a ton of CC-ed draconians. There's no guarantee that global spell will show up even with11 books.

>>3689486
>The end game global spells in this game are just so epic, don't see that nowadays. All the modern day 4x4 games I've played have being a Civ clone with spells as flavoring on top.

Yeah, most strategy games try too hard to "balance" shit instead of being fun. Zombie Mastery is spell I like casting when I'm winning just for shits and giggles. Muh ARMY OF DARKNESS!!!

> solo champs running around running everything over.
Solo champs are too risky for me. If you set the nodes to "strong", you sometimes get ridiculous shit like 9 Sky Drakes. No way a solo hero can take that out.

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>>3688541
>Why spy hard when you can bomb hard?
Ever played Moo1 on impossile? There is no way to compete in research, not even as Psilon. As Darlok however, given you have early contact to 2-3 other races, you can basically research Computer tech only and steal the rest. And fuck up the enemies alliances and make them declare war on another. Works best in medium galaxy size. Be sure not to expand to fast, one must be 3rd or smaller in pop size. Otherwise the voting will always be against you.

>>3690239 yes chaos is my least favourite. The summons are shit and there are no nice overland spell. Sorcery has awesome overland spells and nature or life have great spells to boost production and units.

>>3686776
Well,adamantium Barbarian Spearmen cut down normal units well enough. Ranged units still wreck them and their resistance isn't quite high enough to deal with poison.Still, a pretty cheap way to early-mid game.Took over several towns and cities without spending any gold on unit upkeep.

>>3690417
>chaos is my least favourite. The summons are shit
Hellhounds are nice. Mid-tier stuff are crappy. The real powerful summons like Hydra and Great Drakes can't be obtained by 11 books. Their summons are overall meh.

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So is it canon that the Klackons won Master of Magic, eventually renamed Arcanus to Kholdan at pre-warp, and began Master of Orion?

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>>3691978
Doubt it. The Orion guy pilot found in MOO2 looks human, so you can assume High Men , Nomads or Barbies won MoM, and invented Magicky Science to create lostech weapons.

BUT since MOM was developed after the 1st MOO, maybe MOM is an alternative universe where Klackons got sucked into a Blackholesun and ended up as minions for wacky wizards.

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>>3677432
Fun fact. Merchants can sell items that should be impossible to find in nodes, or make yourself.

>chaos is my least favourite. The summons are shit

By the time you get very rare spells the game is already decided and you are just playing around, unless you are lucky enough to get it from a tower.

A school of magic is judged by its 10 common spells. These are the ones you will be casting constantly in all phases of the game.

Hell Hounds are the best common summon in the game.
Fire Elementals are a practical combat summon; good if small garrison is suddenly attacked.
Eldritch Weapon is a great buff for all normal units and heroes.
Wall of Fire is useless unless you are zerged by stacks of halberdiers.
Corruption is amusing but it's better to conquer cities than reduce their output.
Fire Bolt is only for hitting sprites and casters in the back row.
Warp Creature is useless because resistances are too high in this game. No unit has less than 4.
Shatter; ditto, might be worth trying on Stag Beetles.
Warp Wood neutralizes Javelineers, Longbowmen, Slingers, and Bow heroes.
Disrupt is the best kept secret of Chaos magic. If you are playing on a reasonable difficulty all enemy cities will have walls by the time you get to them. By breaking the wall, disrupt gives a -2 defense penalty to the entire enemy army for only 15 mana. -As long as you only kill 1 unit at a time and wait for the next unit to go to the gate.

>>3692817
>Warp Creature is useless because resistances are too high in this game. No unit has less than 4.

I beg to defer. Warp creature is great if you're not using it in a node that dispels it and you have a lot of casting skill to spam it until it works. If you get the 0 resistance effect, it combos well with Shatter to practically disable a unit. Also works well if you abuse Runemastery+Artificer to create cheap -4 Staffs and "free" spell charges.

>>3693306
And if you take into account immunities, there are far less fantastic creatures that are immune to Warp Creature, compared to other resistable spell effects from Sorc and Death books.

There're a lot of undead creatures immune to to both illusionary and death spells, while smaller number of illusionary creatures are also immune to both. For death books, I think there's only 2 spells ,that are resistable and not area-effect ,but still work on undead. Not certain, but 1 of them should be the basic Weaken spell.

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>>3693306
I too, would be willing to consider the decision deferred. There aren't many spells out there that lower resistance.

>>3692817
>Disrupt is the best kept secret of Chaos magic.
Oh and Crack's Call is basically an improved version of Disrupt, it can also break walls in addition to the 25% chance of killing the unit behind the wall.

>>3693341
I see, Warp Creature is the only unit curse to work on undead summons.

Warp Creature is especially good on Zombies which only have 3 resist, giving you an 80% chance to affect them, although if you get the resistance penalty it won't help you any unless you have units with stoning ability because zombies have immunities to everything else.

Is Age of Wonders a good MoM spiritual successor?

>>3694940
AoW has less "stuff" (magic, units, possibilities, mechanics, interactions between these) to explore than MoM.

It does have better balance, better diplomacy, music that doesn't drive you to mute it, and many fanmade scenarios to play.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9o-7rPnZhXo

>>3696281
It also has multiplayer unlike MoM.
Age of Wonders: Shadow Magic is considered the best in the series but they are all good.

>>3696281
>better balance
though it also means you couldn't do crazy fun stuff like in MoM

>>3696289
Got 3 of the games from GOG. Haven't got about playing them because RPG backlog. I heard it's closer to HOMM??

>>3679075
+1 to the other comments. A true GOAT contender, can be played in original form today and remains amazing. There are some mods for it, though nothing incredible, and the GOG version is patched so a lot of the broken stuff in the original actually works - diplomacy, for example.

>>3697336
HoMM and AoW are both closer to each other than MoM.

They have more challenge, strategy, and balanced gameplay than MoM.

MoM is best for roleplaying a mighty wizard lord and crafting your own story.

>>3697909
Not him, and not trying to be offensive, but don't +1 here please. We give out (You)'s. Just tag their posts, mate. Or take it back to 2006 when we handed out Internets as an award.
I like 4chan, it's been a good home to me. Please don't bring those other sites here, whatever they may be.

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>>3697909
>>3698960
And here's your first Internet, if you've never been awarded one before.
Forgot to add it before.
Granted, this one has gone by the wayside. So it's not as well known anymore.

>>3696281
>music that doesn't drive you to mute it
MOM doesn't have that.

>>3700646
The overland background muzak doesn't change, but you do get different music for certain spells(mostly global enchantments) and the battle music does vary a bit.

Anyway if you want koolaid classical and ambient muzak, you should be playing Civ2 and above. Civ IV even have them in MP3 format in the game's assets folder so you can easily copy them to your mobile or whatever, or play them in winamp while playing your MOM.

>>3677432
Bump.

Playing a Runemaster+Artificer+Alchemy+NodeMastery game. Recruit 3 heroes, give them each a weapon enchanted with Web/Confusion/Warp Creature charges. Nothings gonna stop me now! ...Except maybe a stack of Warlocks or Slingers.