LCD Monitors for Retro

>that aspect raidou
>that fucked up colors

Guhokk. I threw up a little.


>They are heavy

What a pussy.

>>3643152

That was a really round-a-bout way of saying "I don't know"

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>>3643220

>playing SD games on HD screens

I know the only thing that needs to be known: OP is a faggot.

>>3643146
>lets face it, im a little girly boy who couldnt carry a crt into my moms basement even if she would let me
FTFYK

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>>3643146
Dell 1708fpf
LG L1960TQ
Samsung SM931C
Viewsonic VX922

all 4:3 all 2 or 5 ms

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>>3643226
>Dreamcast
>emu
>small room
>want a low power bill

Thread backfire. Shitbin this.

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LCD screens are cheep and abundant. You are a moron for not securing a quality one while they are available. Especially one that can do old consoles.

Playing nes through an emulator on a CRT is light years ahead of how any pvmeme looks.

>>3643226

>> Doesn't know about emulators, Dreamcast or upscalers.

No LCD is good for retro games. It will always, ALWAYS be a sub-par display.

Some are surely more terrible than others but I've never seen a reason to learn which ones.

>>3643362
>I can't find/afford a PVM

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>>3643146
I'm eventually going to get a Framemeister but they're still so damn expensive. Not to mention that just getting a good automatic Scart switch costs almost as much as the framemeister itself, and you have to get on a waiting list and hope you get in soon enough.

I've given up on finding an RGB monitor. I have a nice 32" Trinitron TV with component inputs that I paid $5 and a cute little 10" one that I paid $3 for. I think as far as CRT goes that's enough for me, and if the choice is between a $300 CRT monitor and a Framemeister I think the Framemeister is a better long-term investment since the CRT will die eventually.

>>3643146
I carried a 23 inch CRT around when I was 13, so I bet I can carry a 30 incher by myself now that I'm 27 and been gyming for 10 years.

Of course, it's not so much the weight, but it's cumbersome.

I have a few little 13" I have around and I like them.

I'll get a 27+ one day, but for right now I like my little crt's.

>>3643394
I am 150lb and can carry a 27" by myself. The 36" jvc I have I couldn't even pick up though. maybe if they had fucking handles. i still dont know why

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>>3643367

>emulators
>upscalers
>thinks vga= hd

>>3643376
http://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/samsung/ks8000

Slap a Framemeister on it and enjoy.

>>3643146
Get a gaming projector.

I have a 648x480 native 4:3 lcd edtv with component inputs that's been sitting on my porch for like a year and I still haven't plugged 480p or 240p sources into it to see how it performs. It's a Sharp.

>>3643376
>It will always, ALWAYS be a sub-par display.

This couldn't be more wrong.

>>3643391
That SCART switch you're talking about is stupid overpriced. I mean, I'm not gonna talk you out of buying it if you have your heart set on it. It's certainly a quality unit (I bought one myself on impulse after getting my tax refund) but you could make do without one. If you're going the scart route, one of the advantages is that it's super easy to just swap the cable around, since it's all-in-one plug.

>>3643391
I hate the "SCART meme" meme but of you're going to dish out for a Scart switch box you might as well make/buy the appropriate cables and get a BNC switch

>>3643460

It couldn't be more right.

go here, this site is a godsend: http://www.displaylag.com/display-database/

I've been thinking about using projectors but I have no idea if they would work at all.

>>3643391
you could always just get an SLG3000 as an alternative.

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I don't live in a shoebox and I don't make silly complaints about how heavy something is. I use my 27 inch CRT with my pre-7th gen consoles (and Wii emulating NES, SMS, Genny and Sega CD) and Mednafen (PS1+Saturn) and BSNES via retroarch on my 1080p 27 inch 1ms monitor, with CRT shaders. I'm not really satisfied with what the Wii can do for Saturn, PSX and SNES emulation and I can't be arsed to build one of those specialized rigs for TV video inputs.

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>>3643532
Oh, and the monitor is an AOC2757.

I've done both. I've played my retro games on my Retron5 on a big LCD flatscreen TV in HDMI, and I've also played them on an original NES on an old Commodore 1701 CRT with a composite cable, and here's my opinion

Original hardware on a CRT feels better. I grew up with an NES. It feels more nostalgic, and the controls are more responsive, but it's less reliable. My NES gives me more trouble reading cartridges, and it's more prone to freezing or giving me a grey screen. Cons: nostalgia aside, its kind of ugly. A lot of games have that bar on the side of the screen. I'm not sure what the technical term is, but games like Super Mario Bros. and Kirby's Adventure have a blue bar.

Emulating on an LCD looks fantastic. There's no bars on the side of the screen. The colors are a bit brighter than I remember them being as a kid, and the music sounds a lot cleaner and less fuzzy, but I do miss the fuzz and hum of a CRT. Games don't play nearly as good, though. There's a little bit of input lag. Its barely enough to effect gameplay, but its there and its noticeable.

Conclusion: I prefer my CRT and my original hardware when I'm alone or if I'm speedrunning and I need the controls to be perfect, but if I'm inviting friends over to have some beers and play some retro games, and it's going to be a casual experience, I break out the Retron and play on my flatscreen.

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Just get any VGA CRT monitor for "240p" and use BFI.

>>3643448
VGA and YPbPr (component) are both analog signals, but they can both easily support HD resolutions.

If you're using an LCD monitor, make sure you're using an integer scaling mode. Makes the difference between crisp and blurry shit. Also don't play in the wrong aspect ratio, obviously.

No LCD.

Get a 4:3 plasma by Pioneer or LG.

>>3643448

>>Still dosent know that there are 480p LCD TVs

>>3643741
>480p LCDs
Piss poor black levels and ghosting.

Where did everything go so wrong?

LCD
>Here, have this native resolution, hope you enjoy it cuz it's the only res that doesn't look like fucking shit
>Black? you mean gray
>Native motion blur, so modern :^)
>Native latency because fuck you

CRT
>Any fucking meme resolution that you want will look amazing
>Shitload of refresh rates to choose
>Actual fucking contrast
>Pristine motion
>Pretty much no input lag

Why did everyone fall for the meme?
Why do people keep buying those 4K meme screens when everything that isn't exactly 4K is going to look like shit?

>>3643146
That aspect ratio is wrong, faggot.

>Heavy
Get a Plasma TV while you can still find them, they basically all the advantages of CRTs and they're only slightly more heavy than a LCD/OLED

>>3643793
>>Native motion blur, so modern :^)
That's the correct way to emulate Gameboy games, 12 year old.

>>3643803
>emulating handhelds
6 y/o

>>3643532
>RA shilling on my 1080p 27 inch 1ms monitor, with CRT shaders.

You're the cancer

>>3643805
I was born the 80s when they were rad, child. I probably fucked your aunt too.

>>3643809
>I fucked your aunt
This is literally what a 6 y/o woud use as insult

Ignoring cost, is there some inherent reason that they can't make a LCD screen with the responsiveness of a CRT?

I mean, most consoles handled all their logic during the rendering period and updated graphics for the next frame during the vblank. A LCD monitor with vsync on effectively does the same thing, and yet there's a delay involved?

>>3643391
>Framemeister but they're still so damn expensive.
This maymay again.

Get a half decent PC videocard that can output 240px. Most of them can. Then plug into a CRT with relevent cables. Lot cheaper, more fleixible.

>>3643814
Post your age, anon. Then get banned.

>>3643817
Good luck finding a RGB CRT in the states for a reasonable price. The second you need to convert that RGB signal to composite or YPbPr component you're forced to buy hundreds of dollars worth of equipment unless you're happy with 200ms latency from chinese shit.

>>3643146
You can get a CRT TV really cheap at any used electronics store, a pawn shop, or stores like goodwill. No excuse for playing retro consoles on a LCD.

>>3643817
Know what you're talking about before you post. It's not the resolution, it's the frequency. You feed that 31khz signal into a typical CRT and you just fried it. Most videocards can't output 15khz and those that can usually require hacked drivers.

>>3643828
>Need to buy the actual console
>Need to buy the carts
>Have to use shitty composite cable

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>>3643547
adjust the h size to hide the overscan on a crt, easy
>>3643823
analog to analog transcoding doesn't introduce lag.

hook up a usmc, scart cable, shinybow rgb to yuv converter, component cable, trinitron. Flash the card with atom 15 and use crt_emudriver 2.0

If you're not a total pleb you can probably fab a cheap sync combiner and save some cash.

>>3643836
my 1989 tv is s-video and still looks great

>>3643829
>>3643823
Plug into a cheap old DVD player(S-Video or whatever), then output composite into the CRT then.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enhanced-definition_television#DVDs

>>3643764
see >>3643320

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>>3643510
>Testing Method & Grading Scale
>no VGA
>everything is 9 ms or higher
Not good for Dreamcast users.

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>>3643793
Al Gore

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>>3643803
>not using a early 80s monochrome amber CRT via composite

>>3643146
>dealing with huge CRTs can be a pain in the ass.

So buy a modest sized one. I got one in my bedroom and unless you got spaghetti arms it shouldn't be an issue to place on top of a shelf.

>>3643793
Because most people like watching movies with clarity on their TV you dumb fuck.

>>3644001
Nobody is talking about TV you dumb retard faggot

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>>3643979

>>3643823

RGB to YPbPr transcoders and the necessary cables can be found for less than $100, maybe $140 if you're in a rush. It is a great option, in a very sweet spot of price vs quality.

I agree with you that it is very difficult to find displays that will take RGB 15 khz natively (and aren't blown to shit and/or tons of money)

CRTs are great for one player (small screen, sit close), but I feel for OP regarding multiplayer. Owning a CRT big enough for comfortable 4 player is a fucking major hassle and you have to structure your apartment and any moves around it, major boner.

>hook up 1080p projector
>hook up classic games via scart

>everything works fine, lag doesn't bug me, not even noticeable

lullies!

I would kill to be able to play nes on a laptop with minimal input lag. 20ms or so would be great. I wonder how emulation is on x86 windows tablets.

>>3643152
>>3643226
>>3643314
>>3643341
>>3643362
>>3643376
>>3643473
>>3643532
>>3643562
>>3643793
>>3643798
>>3643803
>>3643805
>>3643806
>>3643809
>>3643817
>>3643828
All this elitist cancer and /vr/ says /v/ is a shit board.
>Your personal preference is wrong and I'm right because anyone that disagrees with me fell for a meme.
Just use whatever the fuck you wanna use. If someone wants something else then go your own way like a person who isn't autistic and doesn't spend all day in a basement.

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>>3644015
He would need a flat tube CRT like the early to mid 2000 trinitrons for groups of people. Probably a 36-42 inch screen about a two hundred pound beast.

Playing Dreamcast alone all he would need is a quality lcd and a vga cable. I've listed four earlier in the thread.

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>>3644031
you can have this back

buy a quality 4:3 lcd while you can

I've never tried it myself, but using an HDMI monitor with a Framemeister could be the best solution for minimal lag. Of course a setup like that could be very limiting, but you may already have a monitor like that around.

>>3644031
>Do whatever you want
>If you do this you are an autistic neckbeard who lives in a basement
>which is also wrong

>>3643391

Get a transcoder. I have a consumer 27" Trinitron, with an RGB -> Component transcoder I like it even better than my 20" PVM for multiplayer and some games.

It's pretty rare to find a PVM over 20", so if you want more than that you're almost certainly better off with a transcoder setup.

There's nothing really that goes bad inside a transcoder, so it'll probably outlast that specific CRT or when you have to move or whatever you can just buy/get another huge free CRT where ever you move to (instead of having to haul a fuckn PVM and baby it the whole way cause $$$)

>>3643516

They used to make CRT projectors. They're hard to find nowadays. Apparently they're a maintenance nightmare, the parts are all impossible to track down, and you'll never find any documentation.

I want one so bad.

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>>3644038
There are gaming lcd and LCDs with 2 ms
ViewSonic X Series VX922 Black-Silver 19" 2ms LCD Monitor 270 cd/m2 650:1 <-google

>>3644039
I'm not sure what you're trying to say, but if you're claiming I'm criticizing the setups of those who I responded to, I wasn't. I was criticizing their elitist mentality, and refusal to accept whatever setup they don't prefer.

>>3644056

2ms?? Let me make sure I understand..a CRT frame is 16.67ms and this LCD is 2ms?

>>3643798
Isn't plasma absolutely awful? Or am I falling for a ruse?

>>3644064
Extreme 2ms Video Response Time
With an extreme industry-leading 2ms video response time and innovative Dynamic Structure and Amplified Impulse technologies, the ViewSonic VX922 delivers digital HD broadcast-quality full-motion video and gaming without blurring and ghosting.

>>3644085

Am I somehow bring spammed by 4chans new advertising?

>>3644064
Correct.
>>3644056
Idk if a monitor of that resolution or aspect ratio could handle the Framemeister's output well. Again, I haven't really tested my Framemeister on monitors.

>>3644091

Well holy hot damn

>>3644073
I've had bad experiences with large plasma screens. Good brands. They are easy to break and expensive. Plasma blacks look like smudgy ink sometimes. input lag

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>>3644089
Keep giving me a you

>>3643741

The original post was talking about Sd and hd.

480p is SD

>>3644114
It was talking about CRTs and LCDs. There are HD CRTs and SD LCDs.

>>3644091
you don't need a framemeister with that screen

>>3644120

No it was not:
>>3643226

>>3644114

>> Can't read

>>3644127

can't read what?

>>3644121
Unless it accepts composite/rf and you're ok with the image being utter crap you'll need some sort of external processing.

>>3644126
Oh, you're right. I was being dumb and thought you meant OP.

>>3644148

Yes, you were being dumb. Faggot.

>>3644146
VGA/Dreamcast
Computer/emu dvi
4:3

>>3644165
I assumed we were talking real hardware. If not then this might as well be a /v/ post.

>>3644156
I love you too.

>>3644191

Says retro games in the OP. Does not say original hardware in the OP. Way to go.

>>3644197
My point still stands. Also,
>used in place of a CRT for retro gaming?
Seems to imply a desire to hook up real systems, though it wasn't blatantly stated.

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I've never read many comments about emulation on PSP vita. How is the lag on that? How is the lag on the original PSP for that matter? Less lag than an HD TV I would hope...

You don't need a framemeister to play retro games on a lcd. There are gaming lcds.

>>3644224
If you can find an LCD that handles 240p well, let me know because as far I know they don't exist. A Framemeister isn't necessary but it certainly does make the picture look better

>>3644109

Yup, definite spam bot

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>>3644231
>>3644228
how hard does this trigger you?

>>3644234

I love that show, who could be triggered by that? The DS game was fun too

>>3643798
>>3643738
>>3644073
Plasma screens are quite vulnerable to burn in.

One time, someone here came across one on craigslist that had a porn scene burned in.

No, wait, that was an LCD!

Way too many people in this thread are confused and think GTG response time is the same thing as input lag. No, your monitor does not have 1-2 ms of input lag despite what the box claims. It just means it shouldn't have noticeable ghosting.

For actual input lag, if you're under a frame (16.67 ms) you're doing damn good, especially for an IPS display. Most IPS monitors and TVs are in the 1-3 frame territory, with TN displays generally being a bit faster. Some TVs that try to do fancy things like motion enhancement are over 100 ms. Avoid those, and turn off all the image enhancement options you can. Use "game mode" if your monitor has it.

Now, you might be lucky and have a TV that can natively handle 240p signals properly with relatively low lag and make them look good, but most can't. If your TV interprets 240p as 480i and tries to deinterlace it, it will look like crap and probably add several frames of input lag. That's where upscalers come in.

A Framemeister adds around 1.5 frames of input lag, which isn't bad at all - better, in fact, than any other 240p-compatible upscaler I'm aware of. Simple line-doublers like the OSSC or the XRGB-3 in B1 mode don't add any lag at all, at the expense of compatibility, lower-quality deinterlacing, and fewer output options. A line-doubler connected to a good low-lag monitor is the closest you'll get to lag-free retro gaming on an HD display.

(PC emulators typically add 3-5 frames of input lag as well, so yes, it's still worth it to use real consoles if you have the option.)

>>3643969
>Azure Dreams
>Kagero: Deception II

Holy fuck, this is a sexy page.

>>3644234
Not really at all. I'm the guy who ranted about the elitism cancer.

>>3644402
What is an accurate way to find out the input lag on a display without purchasing it first? What is GTG response time and how does it relate to input lag?

>>3644447
>What is an accurate way to find out the input lag on a display without purchasing it first?
Look for someone who's tested it. That's the only way to be sure.
http://www.displaylag.com/display-database/ was already mentioned as a good resource.

>What is GTG response time and how does it relate to input lag?
http://www.displaylag.com/exposed-input-lag-vs-response-time/ sums it up pretty well. Basically, the response time is how long it takes for the pixels to physically change color. Input lag is the total lag from the input signal to the picture being displayed.

>>3644032
Jesus fuck. I had one of these. Does yours have that terrible anti-glare screen on it too?

if you like lcd, then use it
if you like crt, then use it
easy

>>3644593
I don't like you.

>>3644795
Then don't use him

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>>3643146
if you're that worried about lag, your hipster enough to go to a fucking goodwill and pick up a shitty crt.

can't have it both ways anon.

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>>3644972
Basically, these are the options for no to minor input lag

CRT
framemeister
gaming class LCD, LED screens

Cheap options are gaming LCD or CRT.

>>3644337
I've never seen one and I have 12 right now.

>>3644337
They aren't going to burn in. Plasma are fine for retro gaming. Panasonics can use low resolution component video.

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>>3644447
Test stuff for yourself. Most of these guys just listen and believe. I'm am telling you over and over in this thread that LCD gaming is a thing.
>>3644463
Do you play your gameboy emulator on it?
>>3644438

>>3643146
The only real downside to CRT is that all the high-quality manufacturers stopped making them a long time ago so it gets harder and harder to find good ones.

>>3645187

And that is a huge downside. Ordering a PVM dosent solve anything because it will have 10s of thousands of hours on it which means it can die anytime. Cheap/free consumer CRTs have the same issue.

>>3645207
Are there any CRT still made outside China?

>>3644972
Oh man, he's such a hypocrite. Thank goodness you proved to him that he doesn't want what he wants.

>>3645207
>Ordering a PVM dosent solve anything because it will have 10s of thousands of hours on it which means it can die anytime
sourgrapes.png

>>3645239

>> dosent know that new CRTs aren't sold in North America anymore

It dosent take a genious to realize that a used CRT can have unknown problems. Also, shipping a CRT from China in bulk cargo is more reliable than a normie on eBay dumping it in a shitty box with little protection and having it kicked around in the mail.

>>3645249

You do know that electronics don't last forever, right?

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Am I the only one who likes using 2x integer through component? Here's Raiden DX in tate.

>>3645369
Using the OSSC and PS2 component?

>>3645419
Using the new Popstarter that has 480p built into the module, don't need to use GSM to do it the dirty way anymore.

>>3645361
But a CRT you buy on Alibaba is probably an lcd they stuffed in a large box with a fake screen and sandbags to add weight to it.
They are very sneaky.

>>3645363
With that logic, anything can die at anytime. Most PVMs are more reliable than modern LCD TVs, which are practically designed to die within 5-7 years. Meanwhile, PVMs were built to be punished. Even if you get one with tens of thousands of hours, it might very well last for another 100 thousand hours.

You make it sound like these things crapping out is the rule, rather than the exception. With that logic, you may as well not buy a new LCD tv either, because it could die anytime as well.

>>3643146
Only play them in OAR, no filters, and in 1080p. ZSNES and such. Or just Windowed.
With a black wired 360 controller.

>>3645518

Lol, that sounds like shilling now

Some latops are cabable of less than 30ms lag via emulators

I just hook up my consoles to my HDTV, change the aspect ratio and call it a day desu.

>>3645853

Fine for some people. Lag kills me more than slightly shitty picture quality

>>3643806
Please tell me you are not retarded enough to use higan.

>>3646109

Not that guy. I wanted to know what issues you had with Higan. I haven't tried it yet , but I read that its a pretty accurate emulator for nes and SNES.

>>3646334
Not that guy, but Higan is kind of annoying to use with its weird game folders and such. RA with BSNES is just as accurate and less autistic (and reportedly has less input lag, though I have no way to confirm that myself). And last I heard, Nestopia UE is much better than Higan for NES.

>>3646351

Ever have any luck with input lag when playing emulators? Have you ever played on a machine that made you feel it was worthy of being Called crt worthy?

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LCDs are fine.

Fine.


They are....fine.

Trust me. This is coming from someone who has devoted an unreasonable amount of time, money, energy, and space to CRTs. Who has owned the crème de la crème of CRTs like Sony PVM/BVM and NEC XM series. And various arcade monitors. And old console television. And old CGA monitors. And just a bunch of fucking old-ass tvs. And grew up with them.

I tell you: LCDs are fine. Especially with the advent of good shaders. When properly set up they will communicate the beauty of the game to you 99.9% as well as a good CRT can. With a ton less hassle.

I still love CRTs and will continue to collect them and play with them, but for people who just want to play games the LCD is

Fine

>>3643376
what about if it's a handheld game? then if you're playing it on an emulator it would be more authentic to use an lcd.

>>3645843
which ones?

>>3646445
I dunno, I don't even have a CRT to compare with. I just remember some people tested various emulators for input lag and RA with either BSNES or Snes9x cores had slightly less lag than Higan.

As someone who games on a 2001 Trinitron and an LEDTV with an XRGB mini

Do whatever you want they're both fine you weirdos.

I kinda prefer using the LED since it's easier for newer HD content and adjusting resolutions and scaling and such. Plus proper widescreen for laserdiscs is nice.

>>3645363
You do know that starting a post with "You do know" just shows everyone you're a massive cunt who doesn't know what he's talking about, right?

>>3646619

Being this mad

>>3645564
>Only play them in OAR, no filters, and in 1080p. ZSNES and such. Or just Windowed.With a black wired 360 controller.


11/5 bait.

>>3644337
Only a few flawed batches were found. They fixed them.

>>3644009
Ok, that's pretty cool, /crt/ fag.

>>3644031
>Autism bucks

>>3646109
I used higan for Der Langrisser, FM1 abd Civ.

>>3643146
>What are some great LCD displays or monitors that offer <30ms lag that can be used in place of a CRT for retro gaming?
There are none. Unless you're emulating with shaders and running at 120FPS with black frame insertion.
Still not as good as a CRT but getting there.

>>3643793
http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/graphics-card-myths,review-32882-4.html

>Human reaction times to visual inputs vary. According to a 1986 U.S. Navy study, the average F-14 fighter pilot reacted to a simple visual stimulus in an average of 223 ms. And it might not seem correct, but human beings actually react faster to sound than visual inputs. Reactions to auditory stimuli tend to be in the ~150 ms range.

Input lag is a meme. Audio lag is more import. That's why I only play on an audiophile PS1.

>>3647903
http://www.humanbenchmark.com/tests/reactiontime/

If you're not twice as fast as the superhuman chinese(100 ms response) in the above rankings, input lag is meaningless to you, slowbro.

Are there legitamently a lot of retarded people on this board who's reaction times are too slow to notice input lag, or are there just a lot of shitposters?

>>3648075
See
>>3648061
>>3648054

Also stay in your containment /crt/ thead.

>>3648061
>>3648075
I think there are a lot of people making a mistake similar to the recent 24 FPS one. That argument went that the human eye can only see 24 FPS, therefore no display panel with a higher refresh rate will look any different to one with 24FPS. Which of course is absolute horseshit.

This time we have people claiming that human reaction time is, at best, 100ms. That fact is unarguable. Going on to claim that a display with less lag than this is not going to have any noticeable effect on play is a fallacy like the above. Look at it this way - a game gives you a 250ms window to react while your display has 50ms of lag. That means as soon as the display shows what's going on, you only have 200ms left. Added to which, the effect of your actually reacting is on a further delay. It's not about reaction time, it's about delay. What this delay is doing is shifting the window of cause and effect, and to imagine your brain doesn't notice that immediately is absurd. It does, and it feels like you're playing mush.

I'm not actually sure how much flexibility there is about this. The audio-lagger above is half right, just not when it comes to video and speech, for example. We have roughly a 50ms window each side for that - try it with your player and see. So it's possible that input lag is a little like that, and you teach yourself not to notice it. It's not that you haven't noticed it, it just falls into your acceptable range.

>>3648094

See >>3648115

And then fuck off back to v

How about the 3ds? That has an LCD screen and emulators. Is the input lag on that so low that one could never notice?

>>3648335
A lot of the problem is that TV makers don't give a shit about input lag, as they don't for upscaling. Nintendo probably did, it's not scaling anything, and there's no other digital image processing for vibrancy or anything. Those last two factors alone help immeasurably.

>>3648383

Makes a lot of sense.


I wonder if the 480p, 4:3 LCD TVs I keep seeing for cheap on Kijiji would have any input lag if I played emulators through Wii on 480p mode

>>3647903
>emulating
OP wanted low lag.

>>3648171
>>3648115
That just means if the game is badly programmed to make up for slow human-only reaction speeds, and no good audio cues, you're fucked anyway.

Have fun with your maymay placebos. >>>/g/ >>>/crt/

I don't post on /v/. My "home" board is /a/.

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>>3649131

>>3645132
>Panasonics can use low resolution component video.
my 51" samsung plasma handles 240p over component decently.

not enough for me to want to actually use it, but it was nice to test thigns once in a while

>>3644114
480p is ED in /vr/

>>3649821
480p is considered ED everywhere.

240p and 480i is Standard Definition. What CRTs outputted for 60 years.

480p is Enhanced Definition.

720p+ is High Definition.

>>3649968
I understand.

>>3649821
480p is actually HD. It is DVD.

>>3650247
It is not, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-definition_video

Since we're talking about LCDs, anyone know where I can get a XRGB-1? I don't need all the bells and whistles of any of the newer XRGB models, but there's basically nothing on eBay that's not basically the price of a Framemeister, which doesn't make sense.

>>3650250
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-definition_video
you're joking right? 2nd sentence on the link you gave says 480 is hd

>Pixels have definition
No.

Pixels are single pieces of color information. They can be upscaled and modified to be any shape or resolution you want.

a 240p image of just pixels doesn't lose quality. they aren't like some set of "pre-rendered" frames in a 3D image.

How are they a pain in the ass. Get a 29'' and set it on a stand. Not that heavy and you don't need to move it very often.

>>3650282
>a tiny little 29" outdated blurry screen

haha

>>3650282
How are Model T's a pain in the ass.
Get an old one that you have to crank and drive side roads to work. Not that hard, you don't need to worry about gas.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luddite

>>3643823
any pawnshop, goodwill. Most times free on craigslist.

>>3643532

nice ikea desk you got there

>>3650298
>pawnshop and goodwill

Do not carry RGB CRT tvs, moron.

>>3650296
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lazy

>>3650306
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amish

>>3650270
Standards change, 480p isn't HD anymore. If you continue reading, it has a nice handy chart of what is now considered HD. I'm sure in 50 years 720p won't be 'High Definition' either.

>>3650304
fucking poorfags, you live in europe or something?

>>3650315
480p was never HD. It was always referred to as ED.

>>3650312
Seriously, if you can't lift a 30lb TV with ease you need to go work out and maybe stop playing video games little boy.

>>3650323
I know that, but >>3650270 is really serious about this and I don't have the heart to argue with him.

>>3650270
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enhanced-definition_television

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enhanced-definition_television
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enhanced-definition_television
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enhanced-definition_television
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enhanced-definition_television

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>>3650341
Thanks, hombre.

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Lots of fags trying to act alpha with "I can lift a 72inch crt with one arm!". Great job but you're still pussies. The real issue is having a giant crt dominating a room in your house when a lot of anons just want something sized appropriately for personal use. Pic related is my favorite. A comfy desktop monitor.

>>3650535

You still have a small dick.

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>>3650559

Still tear the hole off of you with it. Remember, you can drive a 3 inch nail pretty far with a 200 pound hammer. Now point your little puddin' pop this way.

>>3644009
Why doesn't /vr/ get all autistic about games made for these systems played on other screens?

>>3650606

Vr is autistic about everything. Just gotta wait for the right fag to read the right post and Bango....triggered.

>>3646465
I find it rather amusing how the Sony BVM series is held in such high regard these days when the image it provides is essentially the same as what you will get with an LCD monitor + shaders. That's how razor sharp and perfect it is.

The only big difference is the CRT will have much better response time, so I guess that's something.

>>3651120

Lag means a lot. I love how great an LCD can look, but if I can't tko mike Tyson on it, I don't want it.

>>3643146
>some great LCD displays
None. At best there's usable. There are no great LCD displays.

>>3644064
It is not. Never trust any LCD specs that state a general response time. They merely pick the fastest of any non standard grey to grey and use that. So, yeah it gets 2 ms going from 180 luminance to 185 but it'll get 16-50 and so fourth for the rest of the damn pixels on the screen.
LCD specs are generally bullshit, if you don't see a review that actually measures it assume it's well beyond reasonable. There really hasn't been an LCD on the market to date that actually updates it's entire screen at 2ms or anywhere close. Even those fancy 144hz LCD monitors you'd say well that's updating 144 times a second and that's 7ms... no they're refreshing 144hz times a second not updating. The difference is they're changing from one blurry not set pixel to another making the entire thing a shit show in motion.

>>3652004
10ms average seems to be the best LCDs can currently do, I've never seen anything tested to be faster than that.

>>3652020

I've got a Panasonic 1080p LCD from 2008 with an IPS panel... It was tested at 6.67ms at the time when I bought it. Are response times getting worse now??

>>3652004

Thanks for the advice, I may have fucked up and trusted manufacturers specs. Which is stupid of me I know considering everything from game consoles to cellphones lie and pump up their specs. If a CRT is indeed 16.67ms, do you you know of any LCD monitors that can come close to matching that?

>>3643146
The main benefit of CRT is the low persistence. This can be achieved with a strobed gaming LCD or RetroArch + 120Hz + BFI.

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>>3652260

How about using a 480p, 4:3 LCD monitor with a Wii attached via component cables? I'd definitely settle for playing emulators this way if this setup could achieve about 30 ms lag. Is this at all possible or do the older style LCDs still have a certain amount of lag? I was thinking about picking up pic-related from Kijiji.

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>>3652269
Besides any possible lag you'll have smearing, ghosting, poor viewing angles, dim and off-colour backlight, generally awful contrast and black level...

Not really a route to go down if I'm honest.

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>>3652293

Thanks, you've probably just saved me a lot of heartbreak. Guess I'll stick to CRT televisions until hopefully LCD lagtime improves.

For emulation the Dell 2007fp is probably your best bet. NEC made a 4:3 monitor that's slightly bigger/better but that's an expensive holy grail of a screen.

They take composite inputs but it looks pretty shoddy. Native res looks very nice though.

>>3652306

I was thinking about getting one of those, but I didn't think there was any advantage vs just using a standard widescreen LCD monitor that I already have but setting it to 4:3 mode. Is it possible that these things will have ~30ms of input lag? My lg monitor that I use now has about 70ms when tested with Higan via the 240p test suite. I was also using a USB keyboard for that test, no Bluetooth mumbo jumbo.

>>3652405
They do have a few advantages. Above all else, they have nicer colours than your run of the mill 1080p screen.

Aside from that, they are 1600x1200 resolution, i.e. 5x 240p. This allows you to get a really good, full screen integer scaling with a lot of games.

Mine certainly has less than 30ms lag but not much less. Probably around about a frame of lag which is pretty darn good for an LCD.

Aside from all that you can pick them up for almost nothing these days and they make very good monitors just generally because of the low glare, adjustable stand and USB hub. Would wholeheartedly recommend.

>>3652293
really miffed I had to get rid of my CRT in the move

sure, it was a real piece of shit, but the games outright looked better on it vs my LCD (which copes surprisingly well with 240p over s-video, but it really, really, really sucks when fed 480i)

too lazy to go walk around looking for a little CRT with inputs better than composite though

>>3643320
I'll need a good reliable vga/s-video adapter for these

>>3652423

You've got me near convince to pick one of these up.

>>3652569
If you need a monitor for emulation then absolutely go for it. They're around £40 in the UK but just be careful you get one with low hours as one of mine has yellowed in the 8 years I've owned it. The other looks perfect strangely enough.

>>3650303
Contrasted by the several thousand dollar Herman Miller table I put my dusty old CRT on in the other photo. Priorities, eh?

>>3652580

I can typically find then used for about 15,, so I guess its worth the gamble.

>>3652405
Higan has a lot of lag all on its own, like 3 or 4 frames IIRC. You're not going to get anywhere near 30ms with Higan even with a CRT. RA with BSNES cores has a small lag advantage over Higan, and ZSNES has about half the lag. Not that that's a valid excuse for using ZSNES, obviously. Real consoles are always best.

Someone should produce SD LED panels with decent blacks and low latency.

They have a built in customerbase for retro gamers, arcade machine builders, retro PC fanatics.

Even at $400 im sure a lot of people would buy a decent one.

>>3653815
>a lot
That's like a fraction of a percent of the total market. Never gonna happen.

>>3653815
I dont think you know much about panels.

The best someone could do is source 4:3 oled panels then build custom circuitboards for the cabinet that minimized lag and shit. Maybe have an integrated framemeister type device.

>>3653880

There eventually will be a market for such a thing though.

>>3644031
/vr/ is full of autistic wealthy youngsters, who believe just because can spend a load of money in vintage and expensive hardware, somehow makes them better than the rest.
We have to encounter them I'm afraid, you should either try to ignore them, or join assemblergames / digitpress who are mostly alright people.

> dealing with huge CRTs can be a pain in the ass
then buy a smaller 13-20 inch one
>They are heavy
so is your fridge, you don't move it every day you idiot
>no longer in production
oh no the millions of free ones around the world don't exist apparently
>and have other isues
learn to take care of your shit

>What are some great LCD displays
nothing

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>>3653983

>> Hurrrr, you don't like shitty things that I like!!

>>3653983
>>and have other isues
>learn to take care of your shit
Every CRT has a whine. It might not be noticeable to you older fags with broken hearing, but as soon as a CRT television is turned on there's a constant buzz and it doesn't go away until it's turned off.
It's grating and it doesn't matter how well you take care of your things, the "millions of free ones" weren't taken care of (even the newest CRTs in pristine condition have the whine) and those are your only option, second/third/fourth hand.

>>3654278

Agreed. And those millions of crt TVs won't be around forever. Look how quickly crt monitors disappeared.

>>3643793

The whole "any resolution besides native looks like shit" thing is a meme

>>3654426
Good picture quality is a meme.

>>3654426
It's not a meme, learn how an LCD displays lower resolutions.

>>3654440

It'll upscale...fuck it. A crt will have geometry issues and it's analog inputs will have some form of signal degradation no matter what. Pick the screen that works for you and have at it. There are good things and bad things about both.

>>3643146
This is disgusting. How the fuck do people play like this?

>>3654509

I paid for the TV and I'll use the Fullscreen of I damn well want to. I'm not wasting perfectly good pixels.