Seiken Densetsu 3 thread

First time playing, I'm doing a Duran, Hawk, and Angela combo.

Pretty awesome game so far! I've already played Secret of Mana, and Seiken Densetsu 3 basically improves everything from the story, to the combat, to the menus. My only complaints so far are collision detection and art style. The characters are so big, sometimes it's hard to know if an enemy is in front of them. The art style (specifically colour) looks a little dull when compared to Secret of Mana. Also, the character animations are waayyy too exaggerated.

Kevin >>>> Hawk > Riesz > Duran > Angela > Carlie

>>3627065
>What's the best character combo?
Hawk and Kevin are just much better as physical attackers with their Double Basic Attack, the latter much more so and he can probably just win the entire game by jamming the Y button so that's two slots filled.

I can see the 3rd slot as being just about anyone who isn't Angela - Duran offers Sabers and some good Techs, Lise offers Stat Up/Downs depending on whether she's Light/Dark so you use her to cover if Hawk isn't going Dark (unless you want to buy a lot of Black Market buff items) and Carlie is a Healer with some debuff options on Dark too.

>Also, general thoughts on this game.
Great waifus.

Not really that great gameplay.

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>>3627076
That's a pretty solid first time combo. That was mine too.

Play as many different combos as possible, and play the characters differently everytime; the game has a lot of replay value because the team toss ups can be so different.

As for the best, there is only one: Hawk, Riese, Kevin.

Both Hawk and Kevin are the only players that hit twice per attack. Hawk has some of the best end classes in the game (Nightblade comes to mind), while Kevin turns into a werewolf at night to boost his already insane damage output.

Riese has stat buff/debuff magic, which may seem boring, but in this game is devastating.

Throw in some Poto Oils from the black market for 10xMulti-target Cure spells, and maybe some claws for elemental attacks, and you have a team that can waste any boss in just a few minutes.

The key is that while magic is fun, and the animations are badass, the DPS is really low, and unlike SoM, SD3 pauses the game during spell animations, which slows combat down A LOT.

> The art style (specifically colour) looks a little dull when compared to Secret of Mana. Also, the character animations are waayyy too exaggerated.
If you play the game enough, you'll realize it is one of the greatest achievements on the SNES from both an graphic and music perspective. Not to say SoM isn't great, but SD3 has some seriously good sprite work and special effects, and really pushed the system hard.

Damn straight.

kevin hawke and riesz are the best, kevin is just broken in general, he will excel at anything you make him into, and can be the parties main healer while still being its main damage dealer, also he has a bug that lets you keep his werewolf strength in his human form and can reach max damage effortlessly

Hawke is also good for his damage and debuffs, not much else to say there

Riesz is a great buffer and solid damage dealer

Overall this is the best party, though you can clear this easy as shit game with any party comp, and if you use kevin in any party comp he will carry it because he can basically solo the game without even trying

>>3627106
>If you play the game enough, you'll realize it is one of the greatest achievements on the SNES from both an graphic and music perspective.

This. The game is fucking gorgeous.

Kevin to carry the party, Angela and Liese for waifus

Never played this game before, growing up I thought Secret Of Evermore was the bonafide sequel to Mana.

From what I hear, there's a lot of replay value in this game due to the choice of different characters.

How long is the main quest roughly?

>>3627065
Shits on SOE but pales next to SOM.

>>3627065
The only bad team is light Duran, light Kevin, Carlie.
Make Carlie light and it's the most boring run you can get.

>>3627639
>Duran, light Kevin, Carlie.
>any team with Kevin
>bad

The objectively worst team is
>Angela
>Carlie
>Duran

Duran hits hard, but sabers are rendered obsolete as a spell by Black Market items -except Saint Saber, and Moon Saber-. Carlie is not a bad character, but you actually don't really need healing that much, and if you have 9 honey drinks, 9 angels grails and 9 chocolates, you're equipped to deal with pretty much everything.

Angela is in a very strange place mainly because she's totally reliant on spells. This would be fine except a good number of bosses like Bill and Ben or Lugar counter attack spells with very potent tech attacks (like Shadowdive, or Seiryuu Death Fist). This includes a lot of late game enemies and bosses like Koren. That alone makes Angela the worst character in the game, even though she does really well against some bosses like Gorva, and Freigmund who are hard to hit physically.

God party is Kevin, Hawk, Lise.

Kevin trashes everything even if you use his objectively weakest classes. He's fundamentally broken in the best ways possible.

Hawk is like Kevin except not as powerful, and he gets some debuffing magic if you go Ninja (go ninja) and Nightblade can get Deadly Weapon which can deal about 10k damage to the final bosses if used at the start of the fight.

Lise gets access to buffing spells which are more reliable than Black Market items (you only ever need 1 type of saber for a fight, but Lise gets 4 buffs whcih are all immediately useful and that takes a lot of inventory space) .

Realistically you can beat the game with any combo, and it's designed that way. The game is just really easy but if you want the best team its Dark-Dark Kevin, Dark-Dark Hawk, Light-Dark Lise.

>>3627065
best combo is Kevin, Hawk, and whichever one of Duran/Lise/Carlie you personally prefer. Duran for sabers/healing, Lise for buffs(or debuffs), or Carlie if you are new to the game and want better healing earlygame.

Really, the black market can give you all the spells that matter, so you've got some flexing room.

Angela sucks.

>>3627367
20-30 hours.

>>3627830
Dark-Dark Kevin isn't Death Hand, and that's his strongest class. Also, all of Lise's buffs can be storebought as well.

>>3627065
>general thoughts on this game.
Nice graphics and sound. Awful writing and rubbish battle system/gameplay.

>>3627878
Dark-Dark Kevin is Dervish, which may not be the most powerful, but Moon Saber is infinitely better than Energy Ball and the damage difference is so minor that it's obsolete.

>20-30 Hours
Maybe for a first time, I'm sitting at like 13 with the shitty party (Duran as Paladin, Angela as Grand Divina, and Carlie as Necromancer) having just killed Darkshrine Knight on my way to Koren.

>>3628176
I was referring to first runs, yeah.

What are good classes for Carlie/Angela?

>>3628219
>I was referring to first runs, yeah.
>What are good classes for Carlie/Angela?

Well honestly, Carlie and Angela are probably the characters that benefit the least from class changes.

Angela has spells at first class, Carlie has healing and remedy at first class.

Carlie going for Bishop is good for largely undead enemies which I think the Mirage Palace is full off, but it requires her to be a higher level than them, which kind of sucks.

Black curse on Necromancer is an enemy all stats down which is very useful, her healing is still really good while going dark path.

Angela is weird. You get tier2 magic as Light path, where as Dark only gets tier 2 shadow magic. Dark-Dark gets ancient, the most powerful magic in the game, but honestly, she's the worst character regardless of choices.

>>3628236
>Carlie and Angela are probably the characters that benefit the least from class changes.

Need that waifu tho.

>>3627097
Close but wrong. Duran > Riesz

The best party is without a doubt kevin, hawk, duran. Kevin godhand or dervish or whatever u want. Hawkeye nightblade alllll the way. With a nightblade, riesz's abilities are pointless so its smarter to go with duran dark for more damage and sabers. Black market items make riesz abilities pointless so its all about damage.

Dont listen to anyone who says riesz/lise > Duran . duran owns her thxto black market items. Who gives a fuck about inventory space. That's irrelevant because u only use stat abilities on bosses anyway

>>3628236
So Carlie is more about which route you are on.

Angela light sounds more useful because having one element seems like a bad idea.

I'll keep that in mind if I ever go with em. I'm pretty sure I've never done Hawk/Lise path before so there's certainly another reason to play.

By the way, co-op in this game is a lot of fun. I need to try the 3 player patch some day.

>>3628219
Are they on the same team? Dark Carlie is Angela's best wingwoman because of Black Curse/Demon Breath. Not a fan of her Light classes except on Kevin/Carlie main.

On Angela, ultimately she doesn't really gain any new tactical roles with her class changes and it all depends on your favourite kind of Math.

Details might be off
Grand Divina: Best strength (mostly for Sabre purposes) Double Spell is really cost effective.

Archmage: I think this is highest Spirit if you don't already have someone else throwing Poto Oils.

Runemaster: Only class with Tier 3 spells but they're not as good as they sound because cast time. Deathspell has some niche usage but needs grind.

Magus: Highest INT. Ridiculously cost effective if you can memorize weaknesses. Can't even multitarget the 2nd tier spells though so it feels more micromanagey.

>>3628297
>Carlie
>Waifu
Anon...

>>3628371
Duran is slow as fuck though.

>>3628503
Speed doesn't actually affect anything outside of spell learning and everyone's attack timer is the same.

>>3627830
>The objectively worst team is
>Angela
>Carlie
>Duran
Actually it would have to be Angela, Carlie and light-Hawk.

>>3628081
This.

>>3628772
The battle system has it's flaws, but I've played the game dozens of times and still have fun with it whenever the mood arises.

What are your complaints?

The dungeon crawling formula being too repetitive?
Spells taking too long to fire off?
Something else?

>>3628773
secret of mana and densetsu 3 are both clunky combat wise, the original game felt more zelda and basic, these 2 games kinda go overboard with the pseudo turn based feel what with the arbitrary "recovery" time after attacking and shit, and all kinds of weird and clunky interactions it ends up having with enemies I frames after being hit and what not, especially in a game with 3 party members, it leaves you with a lot of "missed" attacks and thusly even more recovery time

You spend a lot of time just kind of standing around in these games

>>3628782
It's no different than Secret of Mana because in SOM you have to wait for 100% otherwise yout attacks whiff, so you're basically doing the same thing.

I agree. The engine is just fucking terrible. Hits whiff, you can stunlock enemies, enemies get stunlocked, a character can die, but they'll finish casting their spell.

It's a mess and I agree, but it's still a fun game for the most part.

>>3628081
the auto aiming ruined it for me.
>surrounded
>press left and attach to hit the enemy i wanna kill first
>it attacks the one in the other direction

dropped it so hard.

>>3628735
>Angela, Carlie and light-Hawk.
Honestly this seems kinda doable if Carlie's a Dark class and Hawk is Rogue. The mid-game is going to be a bitch though.

>>3628371
Black market makes sabers pointless since you can just buy all of the actually relevant ones anyway.

You can finish bosses faster by bringing Lise since you can buff the entire party in one go.

SD2 and 3 are fucking unplayable in multiplayer. Having to pause the game every time you have to use an item or cast a spell.... and some characters are useless without spells.

Retards complain that Zombies Ate My Neighbor has no inventory screen, but that's exactly how these games should have been too.
Thankfully Crystal Chronicles, which is the direct 'spiritual sequel' to SD3 came out and fixed all that shit.

>>3629127
>some characters are useless without spells

then don't use them you retard

It should take a second to pause and select spells anyway

>>3629171
You obviously haven't tried to play the games in multiplayer.

>>3629181
I've played both in multiplayer. Never had an issue with it in SD3. SoM's issues relating to spells are mainly because spells are just broken in general for bosses.

>>3627065
Kevin pretty much obliterates anything the others mights as well not exist, it's ridiculous.

>>3628081
Pausing all action for every spell animation ruined everything about the combat for me. Square was so fucking shitty on the SNES.

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>>3629676
>Square was so fucking shitty on the SNES.

>>3629676
is this bait?

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>>3629676
>Chrono Trigger
>Live-A-Live
>Romancing SaGa
>Bahamut Lagoon
>shitty

>>3629819
>unironically replying to /pol/-tier bait

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>>3628371
Its already been argued time and time again Riesz > Duran.
The Convenience of Star Lancer is too good to pass up, and the difference in their Damage is negligible compared to how fast Riesz can buff up everyone and rebuff when its taken down or overridden. Marduke is also an option thats extremely useful since Silence in SD3 is actually really strong. Duran misses out on the 1 saber that would be neat to have going Dark, and can miss the convenience of team casts to get Dark Saber and better damage. Honestly Duran is only even mentioned because you need either him or Angela to access Black Rabite, dude just has too much working against him.

Hawkeye's really only in the god team because Nightblade is crazy good,and its fortunate multiple target debuff's aren't near as convenient as multiple target buffs are. Deadly Weason is Lunatic that does extra damage on top. He's pretty mediocre otherwise outside debuffing, which Riesz actually does better anyways(gets them earlier and does not proc counters). Wanderer has its uses, but Light Hawk hits for absolute dogshit for some damn reason. Going either way his midgame is going to suck hard. Then he gets Nightblade and starts doing shit and doing shit good.


God team is pretty much Kevin/Hawkeye/Riesz. But amusingly enough, the speedrun team is just Kevin murdering everything and Riesz debuffing and facetanking everything, and a corpse of Charlotte being dragged around as the 3rd.

>>3630130
The fact that the speedrun exclusively rapes shit with Kevin is telling how easy SD3 is.

They take Lise entirely for the debuffs, and use black market sabers and Drake scales for str buffs and Charlie is just there since it's free healing in between areas.

>>3630243
The game is a lot harder than SoM ~desu

>>3630267
Secret of Mana is only a joke because of chain casting spells.

If you actually try and play Secret of Mana "legit" you will get your ass handed to you by bosses with broken hitboxes like Spring Beak.

>>3629819
You forgot Mario RPG...

How do you guys allocate stats at level up? I was doing it evenly then got lazy and only focused on strength and agility.

My team is kevin, hawk, and lise.

>>3630278
I didn't know about any of that when I first played it and never really used magic at all. It was still a pretty easy game.

>>3631160
Each character and class has it's own key stat that abilities depend on . For someone like Hawk, it's agility. If you don't pump him full a agility, then you don't get his magic. Others characters work differently. Magic is also tied to different stats (for instance, Piousness/Wisdom makes heal light work better, while intellegence makes black magic more potent).

>>3631160
dump enough points to get all of your magic then blow everything else on your main offensive stat.

>>3631160
vitality, then strength, then whatever

I like spirit on anyone who can heal. Maybe Luck if I feel like it. Int too. Agility exists just for Hawk to learn moves

>>3631160
you can mostly hit your caps for each class, but generally a few of the stats are broken, like hawke doesn't get any benefit from agi or dex, I forget which one, but he still needs it to learn his spells regardless so you still drop points in it

basically strength is most important for physical attackers and int for magic casters and with half the stats being broken or useless cept for spell requirements, its a pretty thoughtless game when it comes to stat allocation

>>3629196
Opening the menu for spells and items just break the flow of the game in multiplayer. It's especially awful against bosses if you want to actually do something against them, and all it does is fuck the action for the 2nd player. This guy gets it too, as on top of that, the action is paused a 2nd time when the actual spell is cast >>3629676

>>3627065
>>3627262


Secret of Mana and Secret of Evermore is better.

>This. The game is fucking gorgeous.

Terranigma is a better game and sexier.

>>3629801
>>3630042
>>3629772
>If enough people agree with me it must be true and everyone else are just contrarians, trolls and retards

>>3629819
Know what, I sometimes forget Square made CT, that ones actually pretty good. I haven't played RS or Rudras yet either so those get the benefit of the doubt. But it doesn't look good considering how BORING the Final Fantasy that gen are.