Sega Master System Love

Shit tier system overrated by Brits and BRs that had NOGAEMS since all the developers wanted that NES pussy.

>>3552416

So I guess I am right. The fact that I see no love here either just confirms it but still the question is WHY. How did it come to this? Guess Sega had a bad start from the beginning.

What are the best SMS games? Alex Kidd and THE END because Sonic on SMS is awful.

>>3552421
Phantasy Star 1

I'm surprised it was released here because I never knew anyone who had one when I was a kid and I grew up in a rich white suburb where everyone had a NES then bought a genesis and then bought a snes when it came out. Even today I never see them in retro shops or on craigslist, just nothing it's like it never even existed here.

>>3552436

Yeh I am hoping for brits and other euros to reply. i've also heard it was popular in Brazil. I am European myself so Sega was big here. It took me ages until I saw an actual NES. All the people I knew had Sega consoles.

>>3552448
Bong here
Only niggers and poor people had sega, both master system and megadrive eras

The meme that no one had nintendo in england didnt apply where i grew up, we all had nes and snes

>>3552448
Sega was huge here too and everyone I knew had Sega consoles. Just not the master system.

>>3552454
You're right that poor people had Sega, but not that Nintendo was popular. We all had either an ST or Amiga by 1990.

>>3552421
>because Sonic on SMS is awful.

sorry, I'm not going to have a serious discussion on what makes the SMS great, when you're obviously a trolling moron

The SMS did have a few good games, but the majority of its library was watered down genesis titles for people who couldn't afford a 16 bit console. Remember, they were making games for this system until 1998.

Wonder Boy Trilogy
Ninja Gaiden
Master of Darkness
Transbot
R-Type
Phantasy Star
Alex Kidd in Shinobi World
Sonic 1, 2, amd Chaos
Zillion
Rescue Mission
Aladdin
Teddy Boy
Robocop vs The Terminator
Alex Kidd in Miracle World
Streets of Rage 1 and 2
Ys
Golden Axe Warrior
Golvellius
Castle of Illusion, Land of Illusion, and Legend of Illusion
Psycho Fox
Ghouls n Ghosts
Miracle Warriors
Kenseiden
Astro Warrior
Populous
Shadow of the Beast
Columns
Cloud Master
Penguin Land
Spellcaster

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>>3552448
Brazilian here. It's still popular with hardcore Sega fans and poor families. Pic related is the last model of Master System by Tec Toy. Sadly, the hardware is really, really cheap (well, it was made by ATGames, so, yeah...) and some games don't work very well.

Personally, i'm not a big fan of this console but it was a part of my childhood. I grew up with Nintendo (SNES was the most popular 16-bit console here and I rarely saw Genesis or MS catriges in rental stores. Every normie knew what a SNES was) but my Sega friends had Master Systems and I used to play some cool titles like Sonic the Hedgehog, Ninja Gaiden and Kenseiden with them.

>>3552621
Do the controllers have the Atari inputs?

>>3552631
Nope. You can only use these pseudo Genesis controllers.

>>3552375
The Master System was brilliant little machine.

But it was pretty much fucked from the get-go due to Nintendo's shiftiness during the 80's. Nintendo had crazy licensing deals which forbid 3rd party developers from releasing their games on other machines.

SEGAs only hope was courting western developers whom Nintendo hadn't yet shackled and - dare I say it - making their own in-house ripoffs of Nintendo most popular games.

So it's a shame that the Master System had it's back to the wall but I agree that's it often criminally overlooked as a great game console with tons of stellar games.

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>>3552531
Yeah, embarrassing thread full of misconceptions.

When I think about the master system I always remember all those awesome 16 bit conversions:
>Golden Axe with those big sprites
>Mortal Kombat
>Road Rash
>Dynamite Headdy by Tectoy
>Earthworm Jim

I also think about one of my favorite trilogies, Wonder Boy. Those were great times for anyone fan of action games: Fantasy Zone 2, Shinobi, Kenseiden, Master of Darkness...

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>>3552621
lol, both MS and MD were properly advertised in Brasil: tv ads, magazines, celebrities, exclusive games, translated games.
No one ever gave this kind of treatment here.
Sadly Saturn and DC weren't as popular.

And yes, this Master is pretty bad (lag, bad sound, fragile). The worst offender was those selection of games - Atari 2600 games by tectoy. Still, I find their mega drive handheld very charming although the sound isn't that good.

>>3552698
They did have a lot of western developers on their side once the system took off in the UK. Lots of arcade games, from the likes of Taito and Data East, which had been licensed to British publishers, started to show up on the Master System.

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>>3552758
>No one ever gave this kind of treatment here.
>No one
I'm not saying that MS and MD weren't popular in Brazil but, after some time, the SNES really exploded here. Donkey Kong Country was one of the most sought after cartriges in rental stores, Super Mario World was a fucking fever, any videogame (including Sega games) was called "Nintendo"...Sega still had a amazing market here but the SNES was getting a very strong wave of popularity in the 90's.

>>3552375
It was big in Australia right into the 90s anon. There's some great games on there

>>3552375
When I was growing up, I was a Nintendo kiddie. But, luckily, one of my friends had a SMS. So I also got some exposure to SEGA goodness, too.

I loved Phantasy Star and Pit Pot, and preferred certain games on the SMS over the NES. Ikari Warriors and Alien Syndrome, in particular, but really any arcade port, usually. Except for Double Dragon, anyway.

Never really understood the console war BS as a result.

>>3552375
I had a Master System growing up, it does have some good games but overall its pretty unremarkable. The Ninja, Ninja Gaiden, Master of Darkness and 8 bit Sonic are pretty cool though.

>>3552375
#1 reason?
NES got Famiclones

Really, really love the hardware of the Master System. Great aesthetic, good [model 2] controller, everything hardware that isn't the pause button or model 1 controller is great.

The library though, can't say why but it just doesn't do anything for me. The only game I can really think of enjoying on the SMS was the Sonic games and Fantasy Zone. Most of the arcade stuff I like got better ports later on.

>>3552698
Yeah, like I said, SEGA managed to court a lot of western developers who Nintendo hadn't gotten their claws into yet. As a result, a lot Amiga porta ended up on the system. I remember playing Populous and Shadow of The Beast on the master system back then and both were great ports.

I fucking the console. It's so comfy for me. Muh nostalgia.

>>3552758
Adventura covered a lot of different genres back then

>>3554642
>SMS Shadow of the Beast
Is it different from the Sega Genesis port? I really hate that game but I'm used to see positive reviews about this version.

>>3552454
>Only niggers and poor people had sega
Uh, no. That's completely false.

>>3554663
No it's almost identical.

Shadow of the Beast was always a example of style-over-substance. The game got a of praise for it's graphics. In that regard, the sms did an exceptional job of replicating those graphics on 8-bit hardware. The game itself is okay I guess but I can understand why it doesn't click with many people, especially now in 2016.

>>3552375

I love the SMS but the library is kind of limited. To say there are no good games is a huge fucking stretch, wonder boy 2 & 3 are amazing, the sonic games are pretty good, there's that castlevania style game I don't remember the name of that was damn good, Phantasy Star... All the driving games were great too. Chase HQ, Out Run, great ports for a 8-bit console.

As a kid I was lucky, I had the SMS at home, and I could play NES almost every weekend at my uncle's who was a huge nintendo nut.

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Youre right OP.

a few things:

1) A bunch of shitty, arcade game ports with no difficulty adjustment. 3 Lives, 1 hit death, no continues. sounds fair.

2) The base font they provided looked like ass and is still blurry in a perfect setting.

3) Horrible, horrible sound effects. Just grating. Developers also didnt put much time into the music, compared to NES games.

Nintendos licensing also punished it, which didnt really break up until the early 90s, too late for SMS.

Also, wtf with the Left handed Control Stick & Sports Pad!!?

SMS still has the best 8-bit port of Double Dragon. Yeah, I said it.

>>3552426
This.

>Master of Darkness
I played the first few levels so far. Is there anything redeeming about this game? All I can think about when playing this is how Castlevania basically does everything better.

>>3552375
Nintendo had all American and Japanese developers on tight leashes so Sega was stuck with Brits used to cranking out ZX Spectrum shovelware.

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Who Monica here?

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The Master System has less good games than the NES. But the very little good games it has are legitimately good

Even though I had a SMS as a kid it's obvious anyone would be better off with the NES back then. But then again the NES was so full of shovelware that was pretty hard to navigate what were the good games back then.

Today it's kind of a pointless discussion since you can already ask what the good games are and just enjoy basically all consoles. Pretty sure something like the 3DO that was universally panned back then actually has a couple of games that's worth trying out.

Hardware wise the pause button is its biggest flaw, and even though a couple of dudes did some magic with it (Yuzo Koshiro most notably) I'm not a big fan of its sound chip. Really wish the FM chip was the default.

Console War babbies need to gtfo.

SMS was an amazing machine.
Sonic 1, 2 & Chaos
Wonderboy III
Cyborg Hunter
Golden Axe Warrior
Shinobi
Shadow Dancer
Phantasy Star

It had plenty of exclusives and plenty of big arcade hits. It was massive here in Blighty, almost everyone I knew had one.

>>3561748
>3DO that was universally panned
Just plain wrong. Don't learn your history from the AVGN, kids.

>>3561971
Ah yes how could I be so blunt
The 3DO was a huge success that destroyed all the competition and wasn't pulled from retail stores in just a few years

>>3562041
The console itself had a fairly mixed reception. It was not at all universally panned. It was praised for many things. The reason it was "pulled" was because they lost their manufacturers. The 3DO business model wasn't very good, but that doesn't detract from the console technically.

>>3561971

dude, the 3DO was expensive as hell and the main attractions were FMV "games".

A friend had one cause his dad worked there. Useless unfun piece of shit with no games. Incredibly boring.

>>3562631

It had a few good games and at the time had the best home port of SSFII Turbo, in Japan it also got some more games, but yeah 3DO was really unsuccessful and because of that had very little support from developers.
The console sold about 2m units worldwide.
I had one with Gex and Total Eclipse, and quickly traded it in for a PlayStation, or maybe it was the N64, either way I didn't look back.

>>3562547
And I'm not saying the console technically, I'm saying it failed as a successful commercial product

>>3562631
The FZ-1 is one of the nicest looking consoles though

>>3562658
It sold over 2 million units. If they had been able to find another manufacturer it would have sold more.

>>3561762
I already bought two Sega Master System titles off the Virtual Console (Phantasy Star and Wonder Boy III: The Dragon's Trap) and I really liked them.

Ignoring Sonic 1 and 2 (which I have already played elsewhere), what other games would you Sega Master System fans recommend off of the Wii's Virtual Console selection of Master System titles.

Here is what's left ignoring the two Master Systems titles I bought and the first two Sonic games:

- Wonder Boy
- Fantasy Zone
- Alex Kidd in Miracle World
- Space Harrier (I already have an arcade accurate port of this though)
- Enduro Racer
- Wonder Boy in Monster Land
- Sonic Chaos
- Alex Kidd: The Lost Stars
- Fantasy Zone II
- Secret Command
- Alex Kidd in Shinobi World

So I'll bite -

I had a really good friend who had a master system in the early-mid 90's. He was really poor and his worthless shithead alcoholic father somehow acquired it. We played SNES at my place, but at his house we would play the master system.

The controller was so weird as it was left-handed. We played through one of the wonderboy games and also played Choplifter and some other games on it. They were good, but not great especially compared to the 16-bit consoles of the era.

We called up Video Game Exchange a year later when PS1 came out and asked if we could trade it in with the games towards a PS1. The asshole sales rep laughed and said they don't take that garbage.

Then he moved away to foster care...fucking sucked

My rich godparents bought the master system for their kids and then they bought one for me. It was my first console. I had Zillion, Alex Kidd in Miracle World, Choplifter, Space Harrier, Outrun, Transbot, Afterburner.

I don't really have fond memories of any of those games. I couldn't even beat the first stage of Alex Kidd. I'd like to try Zillion again though.

The biggest flaw for me was the music. Was there something particularly limiting with the hardware? On paper, it should sound like a Game Boy, and that thing had excellent soundtracks. Was it a case of no composers to make it shine?

>>3563146
There's lots of good music on the Master System.
>>3563127
What do you mean "left handed"? It has the d-pad on the left like all controllers. How is that weird?

>>3563173
the two controllers we had featured a small joystick on the right side of the controller and the buttons on the left

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>>3563254
You mean this?

>>3563261
That's it! It sucked!

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The master system was my first console ever. Lets face it... an 8bit system without wonderboy isnt worth bothering. I gotta say that i traded it pretty quick for a megadrive since the 8bit thing wasnt my thing really. Conclusion: the master system is a piss poor console as far as hardware performance goes, but its still miles better than the NES. 8bit never did anything for me.

>>3563328
NES has 4 Adventure Island games. Which are more like the original WB than WB's own sequels

>>3563287
It's one of the better joysticks. for its era. But it was only competing with the C64, Spectrum, and NES sticks, so it's not a hot field.

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>>3563173
No. The majority of the US list has shit music. Go to youtube and start listening, not just top ten shit. I mean listen.

>>3563261
<< This too.

>>3563361
1. Name some of the games you think have terrible music
2. Whylimit it to the US releases? That's like limiting the NES to just Korean releases

>>3563361
Looks like it would be good with Marble Madness

>>3552793
The UK made games are amongst the best made on the system. UK programmers knew the Z80 inside out due to the Spectrum.

Road Rash and The Flash on the SMS have to be seen to be believed.

Most American gamers have no idea how many games were on the SMS, alot more than they think, a heck of alot more.

>>3554642
Populous on the SMS has 10 times more levels than the Amiga version.

SMS has best versions of:
California Games
Rampage
Choplifter
Spy Vs Spy
Penguin Land

Great Ports of:
Speedball 1 and 2
Populous
Shadow of the Beast
Pacmania
Golden Axe
Road Rash
Hang On

Exclusive Classics:
Kenseiden
Phantasy Star
Wonderboy 3 Dragon's Trap
Alex Kidd in Miracle World
Alex Kidd in Shinobi World

>>3563125
>Ignoring Sonic 1 and 2 (which I have already played elsewhere)
Not sure if this is what you're implying, but just for clarity's sake, Sonic 1 & 2 are completely different games from the Mega Drive originals. The only relation they have is the name. They also play like a pretty straightforward platformer, speed and momentum are rarely emphasized.

Also from that list I would recommend:
>- Alex Kidd in Miracle World
>- Alex Kidd in Shinobi World
>- Fantasy Zone I & II

Sonic Chaos is kinda okay, but a little too easy. If you haven't played 1&2 I'd recommend trying those instead.

Wonder boy in Monster Land there are probably better versions out there, maybe the Arcade or the PC-Engine, but I haven't actually played the game.

Also not on that list I'd say Golden Axe Warrior is one of the best games the system has to offer, even though it's a blatant Zelda ripoff, it's just that it manages to do it right.

>>3563808
Man, Kenseiden's music is really hard to listen to, what a shame

>>3562631
>Useless unfun piece of shit with no games. Incredibly boring.
Just coz your mates dad had shit games doesn't mean they were all shit.

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>>3563446
1. Actually, I will. but I also just watched my first comparison from standard SMS audio to FM chip mod. Holy shit. It was like night and day. I will have to rethink my statement. It actually sounds like real music with an fm mod.

2. Why? I dont know; you make a good point. I often think of the sms in terms of being stuck in the original timeline when it was in direct competition with NES for the us market. it is pointless to not include all of its releases.

I dont know where im at. well im at 101 of 114 of my US collection (only vg collection), and im asking myself wtf i have done, did i waste my time on this whole thing, am i happy with what i got?

>>3563818
>Not sure if this is what you're implying, but just for clarity's sake, Sonic 1 & 2 are completely different games from the Mega Drive originals.
The SMS versions were ported to the GG, or maybe it was the other way around?

>>3565315
SMS ported to GG, though I'm not sure about Chaos.
Triple Trouble and Blast got unofficial reverse ports to SMS though.

Holy shit man.
Pardon me for being slow, but I found out about this today on SMS.
Wonder Boy Dragon's Trap has more equipment drops than I realized.

"Here are all the equipment drops

jungle_tower_6: SparkB at (480,56) drops Shogun Blade 1/16

temple_inside_4: NinjaG at (544,144) drops Muramasa Blade 1/16

temple_inside_2: SamuraiG at (912,144) drops Tasmanian Sword 1/16

jungle_tower_6: SparkB at (480,56) drops Shogun Shield 1/16

ship_2: ShadowG at (184,144) drops Aqua Shield 1/16

temple_inside_4: NinjaG at (544,144) drops Master Shield 1/16

old_castle_6: CyclopsB at (1312,176) drops Legendary Armor always

jungle_tower_6: SparkB at (480,56) drops Shogun Lamellar 1/16

canyon_3: FireAntB at (1120,176) drops Dragon Mail 3/16

temple_inside_2: SamuraiG at (912,144) drops Hades Armor 1/16"

Fucking Bock, man.

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>3d gaming
>MOOT
This should be the official console of /v/

But seriously, there are some really great gems on this console and it's sadly overlooked. Sure, it doesn't have the flood of quality games the NES had, but holy fuck, this list >>3552549 right here. More good games than the entire modern generation of consoles.

>>3552549
>>3565919
>Ninja Gaiden
>Ghouls n Ghosts
I honestly liked the different takes on these two. GnG especially, since it added more of an adventure style to the game.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_3WL9N-_oE is also tight as fuck. Too bad Tecmo-Koei never acknowledge it. Guess because it was more of a Sega/SIMS thing, maybe.

>>3565315
The SMS versions were ported to GG but the GG has way smaller resolution so you'll just get a smaller view area

>>3552375
>implying wonder boy in monster land is bad

The sms was compatible with U.S. carts no mod needed had britbong bought games from Murica through the JC Penny's and Sears catalogs can confirm Double Dragon was superior to the NES port

>>3563146
Oh god no. What the fuck are you talking about. 3 pulse wave channels which couldn't do low octaves and white noise should not sound like 2 pulse waves, noise and a wavetable. There are worlds between the SMS and Game Boy. It should sound like the atari st, zx spectrum and other home computers, as they have pretty much the same chip, but European composers gave a shit while composing for these systems.
SMS easily one of the worst sound chips.

>>3567875
I still find it amazing that some composers managed to get good music coming out of it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mv0JeyS1KCM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qYJkol00JCE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BdUnTqvxuDw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhEHBVCZe7Q
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSUZZXGbipc

It really is a terrible sound chip and half the games just sound like fucking ass, but damn there are fucking wizards that could tame the fucking beast

As stated 50 times in the thread the SN76489 sounds like condensed audible shit. Just sounds like a shitty ZX spectrum. I have a friend who writes music for the YM line of chips and he's been trying to convince me to get into the SN76489. There are a lot of cool tricks you can pull off but having tried writing for it the rules are annoying. Channel 4 can have special modes but then you can only play certain notes or even no notes at all in channel 3 and I've never been able to get it down. I'm not a huge fan of a ton of 50% duty cycle so I obviously don't like a system that only uses it.

That said when I heard this i was very surprised at how good it was.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xKrAfspQ5QI (channel 4 magic)

also:
https://soundcloud.com/marcb0t/tarzan-boy-sms-version (more channel 4 magic)
https://soundcloud.com/marcb0t/demo-r0bot-in-action (cpu timing tricks to get c64 style phasing)

Nintendo fanboys like OP are such huge faggots. Your thinly-veiled jealousy of Sega disgust me.

>>3569861

>implying it's not a Sony fanboy falseflagging as a Nintendo fanboy falseflagging as a Sega fanboy

Who cares faggot, at least you got a Master System thread going.

>>3569809
>Channel 4 can have special modes but then you can only play certain notes or even no notes at all in channel 3
It could produce a very bassy pulse wave, used very rarely. Here an example from Cool Spot visualised:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXVD6MiJTRo

>>3567905
Most tracks sound bad due to the weak notes, but the Sonic soundtrack sounds good due to those limits. It's beautiful. But you still missed the very best song on the system:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gCk6-6q8Bl8
You even missed on of Sonic's best:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dot0iGpUL5I
And other stuff:
https://youtu.be/Tpr772y8GbI?t=59s
https://youtu.be/GYa5kDZnAk0
https://youtu.be/T-vOMO-XD6Y
https://youtu.be/b7VuuP-d_Bw

I really don't know how someone came up with such a pathetic soundchip and then everybody decided to use it. I mean, fuck, even the NeoGeo Pocket Color had it!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_GgRWEPd8xc
Why?

>>3569879
>It could produce a very bassy pulse wave, used very rarely. Here an example from Cool Spot visualised.

Neat. I'm not too firmiliar with any good SMS soundtracks so it's nice to see these.


>I really don't know how someone came up with such a pathetic soundchip and then everybody decided to use it. I mean, fuck, even the NeoGeo Pocket Color had it!
>Why?

Rob Hubbard interestingly talks about this in a talk he gave. Apparently in a consultation he did with IBM he suggested a YM chip and said the AY-3-8910 (which is really close to the SN76489 if you believe wikipedia) was shit but then IBM ended up going with the shitty AY-3-8910 to save money.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90YE4G3ze-E&feature=youtu.be&t=341

Funny thing is I've written stuff for the Yamaha version of the AY-3-8910 and it's actually a really neat chip to write for. Still has some neat tricks but they're much easier to play with.

>>3569917
But by the time of the neogeo pocket there should have been other cheap and still good, at least better chips.

Cool interview though.

>>3563361
Works well with Bomber Raid

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>mfw seeing Mortal Kombat 3 for SMS in the Reject Shop.

>>3569917
>>3567875
Wait, wait wait wait wait. Do I understand this right. The SMS could only do square waves and not general pulse waves? That would be pathetic.

>>3572028
I remember this.

>>3574228
Just square waves are fine. Most systems do this and you can get some extremely advanced sounds out of it by modulating the duty cycle and doing pitch modulating.

The SMS can only do a 50% duty cycle pulse wave, so that takes out the most important tool in getting more timbre out of your pulse instruments. As stated before you can get a really neat bassy square wave out of the 4th channel and some other oddities in that channel but then you loose the 3rd channel or can only play an A in channel 3.

Other neat effects are possible through CPU tricks but I'm not aware of any video game that used it because it's super expensive on the CPU and leaves no room for anything other than the sound.

So yeah the SMS can sound good, I've been trying to get it to sound nice but the lack of the ability to change duty cycles and the stupid rules makes it difficult. Only 50% duty cycle really does sound pathetic when you hear it.

>>3574329
I know of no other system that only does square waves. The least they offer is a pulse wave with varying duty cycles.

>>3552375
another terrible console by a shit tier company, enjoyable only by literal autists. Sega!

>>3555530
Some of the music was great:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UoJDzCXc8nk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tVNrRwtDzwg

There are more I'm sure but cant think of them cause its 1am and I'm going to bed

>>3552375
I literally only touched a SMS to play Phantasy Star but damn! That game was incredibly good and probably my favorite among that gen's.

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>>3552621
>I rarely saw Genesis or MS catriges in rental stores.
Jesus, nigga... Stores, rental stores, magazines, Tectoy everywhere - even producing some titles... Nintendo? LOL. They arrived here by Gradiente 5 years later and did a shitty support. My god...

>>3552416
>Shit tier system overrated by Brits and BRs that had NOGAEMS
>>3552375
>The only good SMS game I can think of is Bubble Bobble
BEYOND RETARD. Obvious bait.

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>>3578385
>T-they aren't sucking my favorite console's dick so it must be b-bait!
Everytime.

>>3578417
It's not my fault if you and your autistic friends didn't play the system or just knew it from some emulator, 10 minutes ago. Bitch.

>>3552436
Only the richest rich kid in my town had one.

>>3552621
Can you still get MS hardware like that in Brazil? Or are they churning out megadrive/genny clones now? I've always found the MS situation in Brazil fascinating.

i grew up with it too and had fun with it. mortal kombat, renegade, jurassic park, road rash, streets of rage, winter olympics 94, rescue mission... what's not to love

>>3580405
Yes. You can find these new SMS models on brazilian sites and popular stores like Casa&Video and Casas Bahia still sell them. There's even a Plug and Play version.

Tec Toy made some Mega Drive/Genesis clones in the past but they are just a terrible waste of money.The portable version (by ATGames, not very good too but kinda decent) is still on the shelves, though.