What exactly made BW2 so good?

>>33366786
>lose interest
For the story or what? Because every gen has a shit story.

>>33366786
P O S T G A M E
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>>33366786
The post-game content. Whether you like post-game content in Pokemon or not, it's what brings players to play the game again and again. Between Medals, PWT, Black Tower/White Forest and among other things, it's a game that's practically full of things to do. It doesn't get interesting until after the end of it.

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>>33366795
>>33366798
I will never understand postgamefags...
Postgame is never interesting to me unless it's story related. (Like XY, ORAS and SM, all the ones everyone here hate)

>>33366826
Postgame adds longevity to the game. Story-based postgame is a one-and-done deal, unlike things like Battle Frontier and PWT.

>>33366826
>I will never understand
>Postgame is never interesting to me unless it's story related

Of course you won't. You have terrible taste.

Unova bias. It's also why BW1 isn't considered as trash as Gen VI or VII here even though it suffers from all the same problems.
Everyone hypes up the postgame of BW2, but it's average. PWT has less unique modes than both Emerald and Platinum's Frontier. Medals are also fucking garbage, achievements should never be in a game like Pokemon that normally encourages players to play how they like. The real winner in terms of postgame is HGSS.

>>33366826
Post-game is made for those who still feel like just completing the game is not enough. Since Pokemon is technically a game with no real end, it would be boring if post-game content wasn't there at all. So GF adds it in just in case people still want to play more of it, but not get rid of all of the progress the player has made.

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But how does post-game content make a game good when the rest of the game is a bore?

Postgame and side content rankings:
>Elder God Tier
Co-op Battle Frontier (Platinum and HGSS, worked online too when that was a thing)
>God Tier
Multiplayer in any game, but specifically VI if casual online
Emerald Battle Frontier
Underground
White Treehollow/Black Tower
>Very High Tier
Solo Battle Frontier (PtHGSS)
Rematches
Kanto
Sevii Islands
>High Tier
PWT
Contests
Pokeathlon
>Mid Tier
Secret Bases
Pokestars
Legendary hunting
Battle Tower and clones
>Low Tier
Looker Quest, Delta Episode and UB Quest
>Are you serious?
Restaurants
Medal Collecting/cheevo hunting
Rematching the E4 in a game with no rematch teams
Amie and FRLG minigames

>>33366907
>Looker Quest
Was that the X/Y one? I hated that so much.

>>33366912
Yeah, the one with Emma and Xerosic

>>33366907
You forgot FRLG's Trainer Tower. I'd put that in mid.

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>>33366786
Leaf is a cute

>>33366887
because players will end up spending more time playing the postgame than the actual game

>>33366786
neither do I. Sure, i enjoy and it's quite refined in its accumulated incremental improvements, but I don't see the breakthrough be all end all that everyone else seems to see. Even its postgame wasn't as rich as previous games for how much people like to hype that shit.

It also has the laziest/most obnoxious roadblocks in the franchise.

>>33368747
Wasn't that just a small "dungeon" that had nothing new after easily beating it once unless you used e-reader or some such shit?

>>33366786
Black and White were what made them good.

After starting out with a game with a decent yet incomplete feeling story, a complete lack of old Pokémon (AKA Pokémon people playing the series already liked) during the main game, a completely linear map main story map and very little post game it was easy to make something far better as a follow up.

All they had to do was listen to players, which they did for B2/W2 (ran with the story, added old Pokémon for the story, made the region slightly less linear, added difficulty settings which we'd wanted forever, added old characters in the PWT as extra post game content, did more with Hidden Abilities to make for more exploration and to not lock them all behind the Dream World).

Then decided to never do again because apparently it was too successful.

Though I'd wager a lot of the things dropped was the Game Sync's fault. You know they're tracking the data to see what features people are using and deciding to drop the less used ones because they're idiots who are trying to grow their player base and don't realize removing/heavily changing features changes/shrinks your player base, it doesn't grow it.

>>33371628
>incomplete feeling story
Nigger what? Literally everything was resolved in BW1. N learns his ideology was wrong, Cheren does the typical Blue/Silver arc where being strong isn't everything, and all is well. You even arrest the other Sages to make sure they never form another cult-like organization, but of course BW2 undoes that to write its own drivel.

Also funny that you mention difficulty settings, because I remember a shoddily implemented feature that only ever unlocks once you beat the game, and is version exclusive, and the PWT, which has less new features to offer than the Frontier and doesn't even have the streak, but is sucked off here just for the nostalgia pandering that BW1 tried so hard to avoid.

>>33371628
>made the region slightly less linear
Barely though

>>33371697
>Cheren does the typical Blue/Silver arc where being strong isn't everything
Rather comes to terms with him being a jobber against you. He was otherwise pretty calm and analytical.
>and doesn't even have the streak
And it was all the better for it. Fuck streaks. After so many generations of all "hard" playmodes being once and again streaks against semi-random teams, a Stadium-like mode was refreshing and much more fun and satisfying (although the train was still there for those who must see a number go up). I hope they return to that kind of thing soon.


My biggest disappointment with BW2 is that after hyping BW's protagonist so much, you never get to find/battle them. That put a damper on my experience with the postgame.

>>33366907
Secret Bases as Mid-Tier? C'mon, man. They're at least High. I loved finding comfy af spots for secret bases in ORAS.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLVr0VfeLmk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9PsOUyH2fs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ieqfBfE1iqQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dMsnxraYN4c

i feel the same way about platinum and HGSS

>>33366786
Postgame.
Some prefer their games have a beginning, a middle, and an end after which you're done, some prefer that the end go on forever, because they like repeating the battles. BW2 provides that. The reason you hear so much praise for them is because the latter group, the ones who prefer to repeat the battles forever, are an extremely loud minority. If someone is playing a Pokemon game, and stops playing after the end, then they don't really have anything to complain about. They don't really care whether there's an endless facility or not. But if a postgamefag plays, he reaches the end, if there aren't multiple endless facilities that will go on forever, they complain and bitch like monkeys forever.

>>33373586
But come think of it, BW2 doesn't really have that much of a postgame. Sure, it has a lot of tasks to complete after beating the league that could just as easily have come before, but once they are complete they're no different than the league. And even that considered they really aren't more extensive than the previous generation.

All you're left is that same as always Battle Subway and the PWT, where there isn't much of a reason to replay after beating the champion competition (other than having better encounters than the subway).

Might it be that BW2 is popular because its postgame is large compared jsut with what came AFTER?

>>33366826
We don't hate XY/ORAS/SM because they don't have enough post-game content solely, we hate them because they're rushed, are filled to the brim with blatant money-grabbing and marketing-centered "content" (for the lack of a better word) and have poorly written stories that are over in a flash. The characters are flat and annoying (see Tierno, Trevor, Shauna, Zinnia, Hau, Lillie, etc.), the legendaries do nothing other than make for pretty boxarts (see Xerneas/Yveltal and Solgaleo/Lunala) and the difficulty is unbalanced as fuck. They don't live up to the finesse that previous generations had. Games like RSE, DPPT, HGSS and BW1/2 all shone with content and polish, you could feel just how much love and effort went into the making of those games. But since XY, the games have not had any of that. They've been barebones, with poorly written stories and characters, and all the content that made previous games stand out cut. XY/ORAS/SM only exist to make money, and nothing more. And Gamefreak aren't even trying to hide it. That's why we hate those games.

>>33374204
>Lillie
>flatter than anything in BW2
In bust only
>DP
>polished
That thing was so rough you could shave yourself with it.
But are you REALLY going to play the story and character card? When BW is the ONLY game in that lot with anything somewhat remarkable? Are you going to defend the manchildren causing a catastrophe in Hoenn? Are you going to defend Cyrus or what is pretty much a soulless, watered down repeat of the RSE plot? Are you going to defend BW2 being once again the same shit with yet another megalomaniac villain? Because all of that is just as bad as Lyssandre and Team Flare
As for characters, what can you really say? Wally had a very good arc, true, but it was still pretty barebones. DPP had nothing, and as far as characters go in DS games it's all in BW with Cheren, Bianca and N which are quite probably at the peak of the series but not by that much: Cheren is a less antagonistic repeat of Green, Bianca is a better explored Wally and N... well, N is cool, had a good arc and there isn't really anything I could compare him with.

Also I want to point out the irony of defending the story and characters of RSE against the ones in ORAS.

>>33372154
>My biggest disappointment with BW2 is that after hyping BW's protagonist so much, you never get to find/battle them. That put a damper on my experience with the postgame.
Exactly this. Seems weird to me they'd have the ability to link with a copy of the previous game (ex. Black 2 links to a Black), but NOT have the protagonist be brought over. Maybe like, with the team you first beat the game with, but leveled up?
But no. Let's get N's Pokemon instead.

>>33374293
>Are you going to defend the manchildren causing a catastrophe in Hoenn?
Literally the same happens in BW. Maxie/Archie think they're helping humanity/Pokemon, end up hurting them. N/Ghetsis think/pretend they're helping Pokemon, end up hurting them. If you're going to call BW remarkable, then RSE were just as good.

>>33374307
We've been crying for another Red-like encounter since forever, we finally get the perfect seamless chance in BW2... and they flub it. I still don't understand it.
It'd be lovely if they did it in USUM with all the wormhole stuff going on, but if they dropped the ball in Unova I doubt it will be any better here.

>>33374308
Well, for starters N is an actual sheltered, gullible kid unlike those two grown men running organizations. Then, the fuck ups of the dragon-controlling plot weren't as self-evident as the dangers of causing floods or droughts.

Actually, did the dragons serve any practical purpose other than beating Alder? Weren't they just a symbol to justify what they were doing with their own power?

>>33374308

You just proved you don't remember shit about B/W's plot.

>>33374334
The Dragons were just there as figureheads/emblems of the chosen Heroes of Unova.

>>33374334
N wasn't a kid. He was an adult. He only acted like a kid, that's why I called him a manchild. And reason of him being that way doesn't really change the end result you got. Maxie also didn't want to cause drought everywhere, he only wanted to expand the land. As far as being self evidently stupid goes, that's no more stupid than thinking every Pokemon is abused and the only fix is to somehow, do the impossible and separate every human from every animal, bug, insect, fish and bird there is. In fact, the latter is more stupid, because Maxie at least had a plan. He just didn't think the Legendary wouldn't listen to him, which was just an unexpected accident, not a fault in his plans.

>>33374308
>thinking that Archie actually cares
>not realizing that Archie's whole schtick is from him just wanting to fuck over his ex's legitimate idea
(Japan is tiny, ergo expanding the island is an actual idea with reason behind it)

Are you even 18, anon?

>>33374397
I do think Archie cares. He's just too retarded to realize how retarded he and his plan is. If you imply that he actually cares, then that would mean he realizes what he's doing. That requires some form of intelligence, something Archie lacks.

>>3337440
>I do think Archie cares
>If you imply that he actually cares, then that would mean he realizes what he's doing. That requires some form of intelligence, something Archie lacks.
wut

>Team Magma wanted to expand land by evaporating water
Did they not learn how water works in elementary school?

>>33374293
>Lillie
>A good character

>DP
>Less polished than XY/SM

Nice bait, how about you actually look at things from an objective standpoint, moron. Lillie is extremely poorly written, and DP have more content than both RS and BW (and obviously XY and SM too).

>>33374424
Obviously, I missed a "doesn't" in the latter one. Pointing out or reposting to correct simple mistakes that can still be understood is just a waste of time.

>>33374439
They're using a Pokemon that does create Land for the job. It was a strong possibility, it just didn't work out.

>>33374444
That makes me remember when they tried to expand land by making an inland volcano erupt. Flawless plan.

>>33374441
How about you do?

>>33366786
The campaigns in Pokemon are pretty much all the same. The post game is what makes them different.

>>33374449
Not him, but Lillie isn't a good character. She doesn't actually develop very much throughout the game and actively inhibits gameplay. Furthermore she also steps all over established information in the series in order to forcibly progress her plot.
>but she stands up to her mom!
She already did that when she stole Nebby away.
>but she dresses herself and gets over her fear of heights!
Wow, amazing. Both of those are fucking worthless because they're not related to Pokemon at all which is the only thing that determines how strong you are in the games. It was fucking pointless.

Lillie sucked, man. Take off your waifu goggles.

>>33375793
>Furthermore she also steps all over established information
Like what?

>>33375793
I remember there being direct contradictions at certain points, too. At one point, Lillie is in Melemele Garden, scared because Cosmog is on the other side of the area, and she has to go through the flowers. You have to go through for her. But later on, Lillie's able to go through all sorts of tall grass/flowers/etc. because she reveals she's carrying a large supply of Max Repels. If she has all those, how come she can't go through the meadow?

>>33375793
>because they're not related to Pokemon at all which is the only thing that determines how strong you are in the games
Maybe that's why her character didn't suck.

>>33375806
See >>33375814
Also, the fact that you need Pokemon with you to go outside. You could say "but levels are a game mechanic" but the games ever since gen 1 have pretty much said "dude, you need Pokemon with you to be safe no matter what" every time. Lillie however can bypass the game mechanics and the traditional story-based mechanics with Max Repels for some reason just because the story needs to progress.

You can argue that Cosmeom lets her avoid those Pokemon but she never actually caught it.

>>33375828
Anon, that's why her character sucked. Development is pointless if it doesn't amount to anything. Lillie getting over her fear of heights (which is only ever previously referenced once and only then) and picking out new clothes doesn't actually do anything. It doesn't impact the story at all. You could cut out the bridge scene and the clothes scene and nothing would really change.

In the games you need Pokemon to do things. That's almost entirely the point there, but Lillie shits all over that because the story needs to progress.

>>33375814
The whole point of her act was that as she becomes more independent she find ways about her limitations. Realizing she somehow can use repels would be one of those. Specially after the ganbaririe moment. Or at least that's how I interpreted the max repel thing.

>>33375837
I thought it would be something more important. It's very clear since the first game that rules don't really apply equally to you and NPCs, Lillie is far from the first character to do stuff like that. Most noticeable is that you are the only person in the world that needs HMs to reach places.

>>33375871
Make up your mind: is it because her grwht doesn't change anything or is it because muh pokemon?
For the former, the point os Lillie changing is for the sake of Lillie herself, so she can do what she couldn't before.

As for forcing pokémon in somehow, so what if she didn't have pokétools? Everything she did from start to finish was to help one single pokémon, which more strongly resembles the "bond between human and pokémon" theme this series so much likes way better than any other main character in the past. Incidentally, thanks to that I gave a shit about the cover legendary I was forced to catch as something else than a mcguffin for the first time in the series.

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>>33366786

>>33366826

>I like wasting $60+ on games that I only play once and never look at ever again

And don't kid yourself about replaying games that are story-heavy with no branching paths, because that's absolutely pointless.

>>33376924
All Pokemon games are very replayable, due to all the mons that are at your disposal. You can play Platinum or ORAS multiple times with different teams every single time, and that's not even touching the Battle Frontier/Maison. With Bank being a thing it's only gotten easier. Deposit everything you have, then reset.

I loved the cities, routes and landmarks. I do the same thing. I get to Undella (if that's what it's called) and I just stop. I usually reset and play it over. It's a long game desu

>>33375934
Not him, but the story revolving around Lillie's growth implies that the player gives a shit about her in the first place. And what if they don't care about her? Then you end up playing a Pokemon game that tries to hide from the fact that it forces the player to stop playing a Pokemon game under the guise of cutscenes.

I'm not even a storyfag, but if they're going to make a game that interrupts you from playing the game, don't make the story seem pointless and hinge on the idea that the players like the character it revolves around.