Cosmic and Light Types

>>33309339

Light is dumb because there's no real "dark" type, just an "evil" type, which already has Fighting as its opposite, and Cosmic could work, but they just throw every space-themed Pokemon into Psychic and call it a day.

Fairy is the de facto light type

They're all dumb. Cosmic specifically is dumb because it doesn't actually mean anything relevant to type relationships in Pokemon.

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>>33309339

>>33309410
Cosmic could be an opportunity to nerf whatever type ends up super broken after the powerscaling in gen 8 makes us need another new type in gen 9. It's basically aliens/alien life/ufos/pretty much whatever, so you can justify giving it whatever strengths and weaknesses you want.

I still think it's stupid that instead of making Dragons weak to Poison, they introduced the Fairy type and made them one of the strongest and most shilled types, then made Dragon moves ineffective on Fairies, THEN made the faries weak to Poison.

>>33309339
>Are those two fanmade types a joke?
Light type maybe, since it's mostly there just to go against the ''dark type'', but honestly, i can hardly see it work.

>Why those two, specifically, and not dumber ideas like "Sound-Types" or "Wind-Types"?
Because sound is very hard linked to normal type and so is wind with flying type, like, we already have ground and rock type, which many people dislike because they're so similar, do you want there to be even more confusion between very similar types?
Also cosmic type makes the most sense because it's ''everything that looks otherworldly'', and with the introduction of ultra beast, that whole category got a big boost to their numbers and lore.

>>33309414

Plastic is fucking retarded

>>33309339
Light is considered a joke because it more or less tries to fill the same niche as Fighting or Fairy, that being an opposite to Dark-type. Plus Dark-type is "Evil-type" in Japan so in order to fill that role light-type would have to be "good-type" or "hero-type" in Japan. Which is even more retarded.

Cosmic is looked at as a joke because, frankly, it fucking is. It's just as stupid as Sound-type when you put even a modicum of thought into it.

>>33309433
If they want to buff or nerf types they can do it directly. Introducing a nonsensical type only distributed to a few Pokemon as some poor attempt at balance would be retarded. At least the Poison to Fairy relationship actually makes sense.

>>33309339
>cosmic and light
What are psychic and Fairy?

Sound is the only option that doesn't step on any other types toes

>>33309489
Also aquatic

>>33309375
To be fair, fighting really isn't the opposite of evil.

When you think the opposite of evil, you think of Xerneas not Conkeldurr.

>>33309535
>Psychic as mind powers being the same as cosmic as in outter space and the universe
There's a huge difference there

Igglybuff Sound/Fairy
Jigglypuff Sound/Fairy
Wigglytuff Sound/Fairy

Politoed Water/Sound

Misdreavus Ghost/Sound
Mismagius Ghost/Sound

Whismur Sound
Loudred Sound
Exploud Sound

Chingling Psychic/Sound
Chimecho Psychic/Sound

Kricketot Bug/Sound
Kricketune Bug/Sound

Chatot Sound/Flying

Arceus (while holding Sound plate)

Woobat Psychic/Sound
Swoobat Psychic/Sound

Tympole
Water/Sound
Palpitoad
Water/Sound
Seismitoad
Water/Sound

Seismitoad
Could get a new ability like steelworker for ground type moves

Audino Normal/Sound
Mega Audino Sound/Fairy

Maractus Grass/Sound

Meloetta (Aria form) Sound/Psychic
Meloetta (pirouette) Sound/Fighting

Litleo Fire/Sound
Pyroar Fire/Sound

Noibat Sound/Dragon
Noivern Sound/Dragon

•Moves changed to Sound type

Boomburst
Echoed Voice
Growl
Hyper Voice
Noble Roar*
Perish Song
Relic Song
Roar
Round
Screech
Sing
Supersonic
Uproar
Heal bell

>>33309576
Solgaleo and lunala are psychic. If they wanted cosmic type to be a thing they would have done it already

>>33309576
In the context of those moves it means the same thing.

>>33309445
I personally always wanted a Light Type, but not to be an anti-Dark Type.

Sandstorm teams have Rock, Ground, and Steel-type Pokemon, everyone else taking damage.

Rain Dance teams have Water-Type Pokemon. and Ludicolo. And Electric-type Pokemon.

Sun teams... Sun strengthens Fire-type moves, but Grass is also somehow supposed to benefit from sun.

Making the Light-type the sun team type would be a way to fix the weather team imbalance without having to hope your opponent is cool with you bringing out a Primal.

>>33309585
what would Sound even be resistant/effective against? Nothing makes sense. I mean the only logical thing for sound to be effective against is glass, and that's not a type.

>>33309603
>inb4 "What is Clorophyll/Solarbeam/Synthesis"

I'll tell you what they are. Moves and abilities Fire-types don't get.

>>33309489
Better than aquatic

>>33309576
Psychic includes mysticism. Also astral projection, star readings, etc. are commonly associated with psychic powers, especially in Japan

Theyre the same

>>33309615
Have it be weak to rock, steel, and ice
SE against flying, fighting and psychic

>>33309615
Ground is close enough. Also water.

>>33309615
Let it hurt water, ice, and probably normal. And maybe fighting, since kung-fu masters get hurt by flashbang grenades just like everyone else. And Ghosts, since EEG readings seem to let people detect ghosts. And flying-types, because radar. NVE against ground, and a bunch of other shit.

>>33309635
what are those even based on? are birds and MMA fighters more damaged by loud noises than anything else?

>>33309414
Aquatic is water
Wind is flying

prove me wrong

>>33309635
The opposite way around

>>33309615
If Sound becomes a type you pretty much get rid of almost 90% of the Normal type special moves. It's dumb.

>>33309653
I figured beings with ears might be weaker than a tree or a mountain

>>33309733
>sound is the first type that doesn't deal super effective damage based on type
>any mon with ears is automatically weak to sound type moves

>>33309676
aquatic is dumb because there's basically no move potential not involving water

wind has some argument to be made because you can distinguish between Wind attacks (gust, whirlwind, hurricane etc) that are air based and Flying attacks (wing attack, peak, brave bird) that are based on parts of a flying creature

the old touhoumon hacks actually have the wind/flying split, with flying types exclusively being things with wings, and most wind types being grounded, justifying them being different types with different weaknesses (i.e. vulnerable to ground, flying actually weak to wind, etc)

that said, the same game also put thunder and shit into wind because there weren't enough wind using things to support the type, so it basically merged with electric, and the same would probably be the case with normal pokemon

-Sound effective vs-
Water (sonar, sounds spreads through water)
Flying (radar, sound spreads through air)
Dark (echolocation in darkness)

-Sound not effective vs-
Rock (insulation)
Ground (insulation)
Grass (plants like music)
Sound

-Sound resistant to-
Sound

-Sound weak to-
Steel (tuning forks)

Can't think of anything else that makes intuitive sense and doesn't shit on already weak types (e.g., giving ice another weakness).

>>33309830
Sound being strong against dark wouldn't make sense in Japan since it's called the evil type

>>33309759
nah, we just need an Ear type

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>>33309339
I'd say the type chart is set for a few more generations. There's still a lot of unexplored combinations. They'll add new types when it gets stale or the chart starts to become somewhat imbalanced again.

I will say that, in terms of Cosmic and Light, those are sort of already covered by Psychic and Fairy respectively. Maybe Normal as well. Functionally, Cosmic is just "space faring" and, especially after Gen VI introduced Fairies, Psychic types and their trainers took a hardline into being the "metaphysical" or "spacey" type. Fairy assumed the role of being the "magical" type, which also covers Light by virtue of them being the more "angelic" type of the whole lot. Normal picks up any leftovers as it includes Pokemon like Chansey and Arceus still, who could easily fill in the role of being "virtuous" as Normal, in some sense, is the "unaligned" type -- which I can imagine a being of Light would most likely fall into as well.

On the flip, Dark-types are dirty fighters, scoundrels, creatures of the night, etc. That's not exactly the "opposite of Light." When people talk about a Light type, they really mean something "heavenly" -- not actual physical light. The types that oppose Dark, for now, seem to already fill that role or something else anyway. Fighting is "heroic" and can take on badguys; Bugs kind of are "heroes" too (if you take their association with tokusatsu into consideration); and Fairies, as I said, fill in the "magical creature of light" role.

Psychic is weak to Dark because Dark clouds their judgement, it blinds them, it blocks out the cosmos, etc. The only weird bit with Dark types is Ghost because fuck if I know why they're weak to Dark-types.

Fairies throw in the mythology of Fairies as well with their weaknesses/strengths, so they're not purely a Light type. And neither is Psychic purely a Cosmic type. But, again, my point is that those two types are already "covered." There's no reason to include them unless they get desperate.

>>33309759
Naw just fighting psychic and fairy due to noise being distracting

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>>33309339
Also, while I'm on my autistic roll here:

Sound-type wouldn't make sense for a few reasons. It's really treated more as a descriptor for moves than an actual "element" of those moves. It already exists as a "subtype" for a lot of moves in the game, and retyping them as Sound-type would mean removing those attacks from other types that might really benefit from them. It's kind of like saying that all moves that involve punching should become "Fist-type" attacks. It's not really something elemental to a creature and, on a technical level, sound is a "waste energy" if we want to get into the physics of it. It's a byproduct, not the main intent.

Other RPGs do have "sonic attacks" but IIRC it is typically a secondary effect in them as well, rather than the main one.

Also, what would a "Sound-type Pokemon" look like? There's not a very clear theme. We have loud, sound-based Pokemon already, some who fit the theme of another type much better already. Should we retype Pokemon like Noivern, Jigglypuff, and Loudred to be Sound-types? How are they more Sound-types than Dragon, Fairy, or Normal? Is Chimecho a Sound-type? How about Pyroar? It's not a very clearcut "theme" on design. We know what a Fire or Water type looks like. It's very obvious. Sound... not so much.

As far as Wind, it's kind of covered by Flying-type now having special attacks. I would also say that moves like Razor Wind, Silver Wind, and Ominous Wind work better as the types they are currently -- rather than becoming Wind-types. And what would a Wind-type look like? How is that different from a Flying-type? Admittedly, Flying is a shitty name. But we have types like Bug and Ghost. Flying suits the Pokemon world, honestly.

And before the argument is made, Ground and Rock, while similar, are different enough. Moreso than Flying and Wind. I agree it's weird they're separate, but from a design standpoint they are pretty different. Wind really has nothing to offer that Flying can't already do.

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>>33309339
Finally, because I'm on a roll now, I will propose one type that maybe could make sense in Pokemon. Back when Fairy was being speculated, there were rumors about this type and I sort of fell in love with the idea of it: the Saint-type.

This touches on something that isn't really done with Pokemon, and that's "Holy magic." I said earlier that Fairies sort of have the "Light" and "angelic" thing down, and I stick by that. But it's a harder stretch to come out and say that they are also the "Holy" type. Fairy is probably one of the least defined themes for a type still, regardless, so I think that adding a more defined type to fill the role of the "heavenly" one might help place Fairies into a clearer box (much like Fairies did for Psychic types, who were previously all over the place).

Saint-type would cover the bases of the "holy element" that is probably the only traditional RPG magic class not seen in some form in Pokemon. It would include Pokemon that represent a strong sense of justice, the side of clear "good," and use heavenly magic or skills to attack foes. Think the spells "Holy" and "Raise" from Final Fantasy, and you have a rough idea of this type.

Not sure where the type would fall within the type chart, but I think it would make sense for it to be strong against Dark and Ghost-type, both offensively and defensively. It could be strong against Fairies, potentially, but maybe weak to Dragons to give them at least one plus in the current meta. Poison and Bug could somehow be related to Saint in the type chart as well, though I'm not sure how. It could maybe get a weakness to Rock or Ice as well, if only to give those types some much needed buffs.

I will admit it sounds extremely edgy. Visions of "Saint/Dragon" and "Dark/Saint" Pokemon burst into my head, all looking like something puked onto a Yu-Gi-Oh card 15 years ago. But I'm just speculating. IMO, "Holy" is probably the only logical type left for the series to include. That's my two cents.

I honestly have never heard a sufficient argument against light-type

>It's gay. Pokemon doesn't need a gay holy/angelic type
These things already exist, and have existed since literally Gen 1, since Togetic was invented way back then.

Plus Light could just mean pokemon that produce light. For example, Starmie, Ampharos, Volbeat, Luxray, Chinchou, etc. There are already dozens of moves that you could retype like Solar Beam, Signal Beam, Aurora Beam, Flash, Light Screen, Detect, etc. Plus the argument loses all water when you consider how long Fairy must've been considered.

Plus for types that lose important coverage they could just replace them with expys. The difference between Ice Beam, Hydro Pump and Flamethrower is fine, but there isn't much difference in execution between Play Rough and Return, or Iron Head and Head Smash, that dictates why A should be B-type and X should be Y-type

>It's unnecessary
This franchise is unnecessary

>>33309339
>wind type

you mean flying

18 types and enough

>>33309830

Maybe effective versus Ghost instead? Most of the shadow/darkness moves are of that type.

>>33309572
Well, "evil" is more like "asshole" in this context. Fighting-types fight with honor or some bullshit like that. Dark-types do underhanded shit and pull dick moves and sneaky shit.

>>33309830
Sound should be se against fairy for balancing and steel because it moves faster in it. Also water

>>33309759

Sound type? what's next? Smell type? Ear-type? paw type? tail type? furry type? lol, soundfags are truly delusional

>>33310339
Sound waves retard

Sound = special normal type moves. It doesn't need its own fucking type and if you're going to suggest this you may as well introduce a bite type. It also makes the options worse for bypassing Substitute if you're just going to throw every fucking sound move into one type.

Cosmic is so vague that I don't see the point. Something coming from space doesn't give it different physical properties. And the "mystical" element of it is already covered by Psychic so it's pointless.

Fairy type makes a theoretical Light type almost completely redundant.

>>33309339
We'll get shadow type, I would know Masuda told me at Denny's after our conversation about the solar eclipse

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for there to be demand for a "light" type, you need to actually have a type that's about elemental darkness to begin with.

so here's both

>>33311831
i like this idea

>>33311831
>you need to actually have a type that's about elemental darkness to begin with.

Dark type exists already.

>abloo bloo bloo muh underhanded techniques
The Z move is literally called Black Hole Eclipse for fuck's sake. It includes literal darkness.

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>>33309414
>nerfing flying
Into the trash it goes.

>>33311870
Plus, what the fuck is Dark Pulse then too

>>33309615
The resistants/effectiveness would be whatever the hell gamefreak decided they should be on that given day. The fans would be the ones to make justification based on their weird headcanon.

I never understood this argument. Do you know how retarded trying to figure out Fairy's resistances and effectiveness were before the leaks? Now they just makes sense because we're used to them.

Not saying Sound type is a great idea but it's not so farfetched from anything else they've done. Plus it at least has some groundwork already built for it.

>>33311870
Darkness =! Dark as in the opposite of light anon. It's evil. How do you not know this by now anon?

>people still argue for sound type

So where's my Punch Type, Bite Type, Ball Type, Bomb type and Aura Type?

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>>33311953
>Fighting
>dark
>???
>????
>???????
Why would any of those exist? What would retroactively become "bomb" or "aura"? What would become "Punch" that wasn't fighting?

Sound is already a thing that makes sense in the games, it just falls under Normal and usually special catagories.

>>33311947
Wow, it's like you didn't actually read my post so you can continue spouting the same flawed argument!

>>33311947
that being said moves like Dark Pulse, Dark Void, Night Daze and Black Hole Eclipse still exist. The majority of dark type moves are trickery/villianous but it doesn't disclude "power of darkness" attacks

>>33311970
they're all attack attributes, not types. Sound goes in with Punch, Bite, Ball, Bomb, Dance, Powder and Aura/Pulse as an attack attribute.

>>33311971
Wow it's like you didn't actually point out any flaws in that argument! I read your post. You claimed "dark" means not light. Which is incorrect.
>>33311979
Yes, again, claiming "because the word dark is in there it must mean not light" is just literally wrong. It's evil or malice. What exactly would be inappropriate about an evil creature using a move called "Dark Pulse"? Is The Force literally the absence of light because it has the Dark side?
Black Hole Eclipse is literally the only name that remotely implies anything to do with light.

>>33311994
You didn't answer any of my questions. Sound isn't JUST an attack attribute because it's also a design choice, Exploud and Noivern are literally designed around the fact they create sound in the same way fire types are designed around the fact they create fire.

>>33311900

Dark Pulse is literally called Evil Pulse in japanese. The description says it's an aura imbued with horrible thoughts.

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>>33312005
Punch and Kick types when? They're literally designed around the fact that they punch and kick.

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>>33312026
Yes. Fighting type is based around that. Well done. Now actually make or dispute a point. What "type" is designed around making sounds to attack?
It tends to be normal, but that has absolutely no inherent tie to sound as punching and kicking do to fighting.

>>33312026
Holy shit are you retarded?
>Fire types are designed around using fire
>Fighting types are designed around fighting
>Sound types would be designed around sound
Comprendé?

>>33312062
Not the same guy but I don't get that logic.
If you wanna be hyper anal and claim "sound" is something that deserves it's own type I could maybe get that, dumb as it is, but then to say Punch/Kick is too specific?

Normal is literally designed as a catchall for things like that, and for good thematic reasons.

>>33312048
> What "type" is designed around making sounds to attack?

None, because it's an attack attribute. There are several moves of different types that stay in that type because they're more attributed to it.

Bug Buzz is obviously bug type. Clanging Scales is Dragon. Sparkling Aria is water. What the fuck happens when you make these "Sound type"?

>>33312048
So we also need an explosion type because it's normal for no reason, has no ties to it, and has several pokemon(voltorb, koffing, and geodude lines off and on, etc...) designed around doing it?

>>33312068
I'm not sure how anymore can make such a stupid argument.
Punch/Kick is retarded because we have a type for that. A type that is utterly inseparable from it. To make Punch/Kick it's own type would absolutely shatter the Fighting type and split it into three.
To make sound it's own type would be to change a handful of normal moves and a half dozen secondary types. There is nothing already in game that is utterly inseparable from sound.
I'd sort of get saying that about Cosmic or Light, because we have things that are tied to those even if it's just because the games say so.

I'm not saying Normal doesn't do it's job as a catch all fine, I'm just saying that looking at the catch-all, there's a huge handful of designs, moves and even MECHANICS that all share one thing, the use of sound. Normal wouldn't be neutered by that change and it would objectively improve mons like Exploud and Noivern.

>>33309433
I still haven't heard a logical type effectiveness chart for Cosmic. It means nothing.

>>33312097
You can keep calling it an attack attribute but you've already been corrected on that point.

Now you're actually making a point with the latter part there. That's a case by case basis though, why would you change Bug Buzz when Fire Punch is only Fire type?
Clanging Scales I would say maybe makes more sense as Sound, since the important part is scales and not "being a dragon".

>>33312107
What are Explosion type Pokémon? What exactly ties Geodude, Koffing and Voltorb together in your mind in the same way you can tie together Exploud and Noivern?

>>33312108
You are letting your bias cloud your reason here.
None of those things have anything to do with Sound being a type, but instead point to it being a major subsection of normal.

If anything normal is better for these than some o the other things we get for normal(physical strikes overlap with fighting, moves like defense curl have no special need to be normal, explosion, etc...)

The only thing you make an argument for is that normal should be what you call soundtype and have things, like strength, removed from it to have more fitting typings

>>33312097
>Bug Buzz is obviously bug type. Clanging Scales is Dragon. Sparkling Aria is water. What the fuck happens when you make these "Sound type"?
>There are several moves of different types that stay in that type because they're more attributed to it.

You answered your own question fagtron, they'd keep their original types. You know, like how Fire/Ice/Thunder Punch aren't Fighting-type.

>>33312154
I'm not bias at all. I don't even think it should be put in the game at this point because fuck huge retcons. It's still a perfectly logical idea and comparing it to "Punch type" is brainmeltingly fucking stupid.

You're missing the point I'm making. There is absolutely nothing about Noivern that makes it "Normal", probably why they didn't make it normal. It's 100% inherently about sound though.
There is no type that could do a better job of defense curl, slash or explosion, that already has moves, mons and mechanics in the game.

Why in the flying fuck would "Normal" become "Sound" That makes the exact same problem but for EVEN MORE moves/mons/mechanics.

>>33312138
>What exactly ties Geodude, Koffing and Voltorb together in your mind in the same way you can tie together Exploud and Noivern?
Pokemon that tend to be round in shape that often carry the same explosive moves?

This alone seems to be more rational than grouping a walking pipe organ and a bat together.

>>33312175
I think you mean I answered YOUR question.
>There are several moves of different types that stay that type because they're more attributed to it
Yes, that's NOT the case for Boomburst. What exactly about sound is so "Normal type" that making it Sound is fucking retarded but you can still have a mermaid singing NOT be normal type?

>>33312181
You don't get to use "carry the same moves" because apart from that being the thing we're trying to qualify. Noivern and Exploud don't both simply happen to carry moves about sound, it's an inherent part of their design

>Round in shape
>More of a link than "Bipedal Mammal that's main feature is primarily making incredibly loud noises" and "Flying creature that's main feature is primarily making incredibly loud noises"

>>33312178
Then i'm not sure of the point you're trying to make?
If moves like this have no type that can do them better why would you pick "sound" moves of all things when they are the most normal of normal type attacks? Should we arbitrarily add secondary typing to pokemon that don't need them for similar reasons, like snake type because ekans/onix/coul/wrap/constrict/etc..,?

>>33312206
>"Flying creature that's main feature is primarily making incredibly loud noises"

So we're talking about Zubat suddenly?

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>>33309414
>plastic

Sound is still a delivery method, which is why it's not a type.

Ball is a delivery method. Pulse is a delivery method. It dictates how the attack comes out, not the type. It can have abilities that affect these types of moves but thinking they should be types is pretty gay

>>33312235
less gay than fairy type

>>33312243
and yet Fairy is a type and Sound isn't.

>>33312243
We were lacking a homosexual type and thats real trendy now
>we will never have an akbar type

>>33312211
Most normal type attacks don't have a better, inherent tie to them that is already in place in terms of designs and mechanics.

>More reductio ad absurdum
Are you even trying? Once again, that would be an argument if the idea was making a new type based on "Pokémon that are based on animals in the real world" not designs, attributes and mechanics that are already in the game and currently sit under an umbrella that has no tie to them

>>33312219
No, Zubat is inherently flying and inherently poisonous. It uses ultrasound. That would mean it has a design reason to HAVE sound type moves. You know, like Supersonic. Noivern entire design is around sound and it has more ties to Sound than Dragons

>>33312235
Punch is a delivery method. It's inherintly tied to the fighting type. There are no Pokémon designed around "ball" or "pulse"
There are no mechanics where Pokémon that use "ball" or "pulse" are resistant to other Pokémon that do in a similar fashion to immunities/resistances. This argument has already had points against it made, if you'd like to say something without sounding retarded try rebuking some of them.

>>33312211
It's weird when somebody posts a valid argument against a guy claiming his headcanon to be a thing.
You have my respect.

>>33312291
>Claiming his headcanon to be a thing
>Literally have stated sound shouldn't be a thing
>Mocking a retard for saying "snake or punch" makes as much sense as "sound"
>Zero arguments for why they do, just claiming "Why not"
Rite

>>33312263
You say this about punching moves and while the majority are fighting type, there are many that aren't. Fire/Thunder/Ice Punch. Bullet Punch. Meteor Mash. Shadow Punch. Ice Hammer. Comet, Dizzy and Mega Punch are normal types. Because the punch is still the delivery method.

Sound is still also the delivery method with most of them being normal because they don't inherently aspect themselves to an obvious type, with exceptions like Bug Buzz and Sparkling Aria

>>33312263
>No, Zubat is inherently flying and inherently poisonous.
I can give you flying, but how is it inherently poisoning when being a bat that attacks with sound would make more "thematic sense" by your own argument.
Meanwhile you have the, subjective, opinion that Noivern doesn't look like a dragon when it clearly does.

Look i'm actually a supporter of the whole sound type but it's strictly a headcanon thing, for reasons like you are laying out. You have yet to state any, objective, reason why sound should be a thing.

You have yet to disprove the biggest hurdle here, and that being normal is bad for sound based moves.

>>33309339

Cosmic comes off as plausible but improbable given that there are a multitude of Pokemon directly connected to forces beyond the Earth [Clefairy line, Deoxys, Solrock, Lunatone, Beheeyem line, etc.] and the idea of a foreign threat upsetting natural balance is one often used in sci-fi. Thing is, the concepts behind it have been split between Psychic and Fairy [possibly Fighting as well given your personal interpretation of Aura] so there's no real need fr the type anymore.

>>33309585
Fuck off with this sound meme.

It makes no sense. By your logic every Pokemon has the possibility of being sound type just because they can vocalize.

>>33312107
Yanno this actually makes a lot of sense.
There are abilities that pertain to exploding, damp for example, moves that attribute to explosions, and mons that you can look at and clearly think "yeah those are going to explode"

>>33312211
I wouldn't go with snake type, but probably something like coil type, but as a theme it's very consistent. We have things like fairy, evil/dark, normal, and fighting so it would fit right in.

>>33312334
Binding moves are too niche to consider having a type for especially considering they all do the same thing.

>>33312291
The problem with the Sound argument is that some people see it as a consistent theme when it's really not.
Sound moves bypassing subs are proof this was always intended as a niche within normal time, and a pretty neat one at that. Normal has a lot of gimmicks, like stockpile, but honestly when I think of attacks like "sing" and the like normal type comes to mind as an amazing fit. These are things without types that anything can do, fitting normal's theme.
The problem seems to be that people can't be objective in the argument and only apply their own, singular, logic to this.
>>33312334
Explosion and sound very easily overlap, this would be more of an "impact" type between them which, while neat, takes us right back to normal...

>>33312360
>this would be more of an "impact" type between them which, while neat, takes us right back to normal...

Shit. I can kinda see that now.

>>33312305
We've already discussed that. There's also "Bug Buzz" and such. Just because it IS a delivery method doesn't mean it can't HAVE a type. Punching is a delivery method. There are still fighting types that are only so because they are about punching. Just like there would be moves that are delivered via sound that aren't sound type. Bug Buzz on a Sound type would be no different than a Fighting type using Fire punch.

>>33312314
Zubat doesn't attack with sound. It uses ultrasound (because it's blind, the rest of it's line gains eyes, so even if you made it flying/sound it wouldn't make a difference) It attacks with flying and poison. It only has one move that's remotely sound based.

I didn't say Noivern doesn't look like a dragon, I said Sound is more of an inherent part of it's design than Dragon is. As someone already pointed out, it's a bat that (unlike zubat) uses sound in every way and is explicitly designed/evolved/whatever to be inseparable from sound. If you take the sound aspect away from Noivern it makes more sense in it's current typing and the opposite is true.

You don't get to just claim I haven't made any objective reasons when I have and you haven't debated any of them. There is no other headcanon type that is already in place in design, moves and mechanics that makes nearly as much sense as Sound. There are design and mechanics that would make more sense and conform more to the rest if Sound was a thing and few reasons not to and very few exceptions to the rule (See Bug Buzz being an exception that already has a precedent set by another type)

This isn't a debate to see if the type is going in. Once again this was telling someone they're retarded for comparing "sound" and "punch".

The only thing bad about sound moves being normal is that they are the only thing that can be made their own type that has more improvements than negative changes.

>>33312367
again, punch is an actual move base though, and has an ability that affects it. Punch isn't a type, it's a move base, and so is sound, because those same rules apply.

>>33312367
>Zubat doesn't attack with sound. It uses ultrasound (because it's blind, the rest of it's line gains eyes, so even if you made it flying/sound it wouldn't make a difference) It attacks with flying and poison. It only has one move that's remotely sound based.
It's lore in, and out, of series is based on that one thing.
>I said Sound is more of an inherent part of it's design than Dragon is.
So we're back to opinions.
>You don't get to just claim I haven't made any objective reasons when I have
Opinions aren't objective.
>There is no other headcanon type that is already in place in design, moves and mechanics that makes nearly as much sense as Sound. There are design and mechanics that would make more sense and conform more to the rest if Sound was a thing

ob·jec·tive
əbˈjektiv/
adjective
adjective: objective

1.(of a person or their judgment) not influenced by personal feelings or opinions in considering and representing facts.

>>33312334
>>33312360
>>33312364
Still missing the part where there are no "explosion type" Pokémon. There are no Pokémon who lore-wise or design wise are inseparable from exploding.

>>33312375
And you're still under the misimpression that moves and mons can not be or use other types or bases. Punching is a move base, it's still inherently fighting type, despite it's exceptions. Sound is a move base, it can stlll be a type despite exceptions.

>>33312360
>but honestly when I think of attacks like "sing" and the like normal type comes to mind as an amazing fit. These are things without types that anything can do, fitting normal's theme.
Look at it from another perspective though. How normal is something like Relic Song, Boomburst, or Perish Song?

Why would something like Meloetta be legendary if it's just literally doing something that every other Pokemon can do? Why should Jigglypuff be notable if every Pokemon can sing?

It's the same reasoning as fighting type. Every Pokemon can fight, but having a type specifically for fighting isn't bad at all.

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>>33312385
>There are no Pokémon who lore-wise or design wise are inseparable from exploding.

Impact type seems more plausible since >>33312360 made the point sound and explosion types are redundant.

>>33312383
>It's lore in, and out, of series is based on that one thing
Sorry I didn't quite follow this one.
>So we're back to opinions
No we're not. Noivern is the Sound Wave Pokémon. It's attacks are primarily sound based. It's dex entries primarily talk about sound. There are 0 explinations given for it being dragon type and it learns ONE dragon move by level up, one that many dragon-esque mons that aren't actually dragons learn.

You keep saying I'm spouting opinions but I'm not, my OPINION is that sound shouldn't be a thing. You are letting the fact you think Sound is a stupid idea cloud your judgement.

>>33312397
What about being electric type and imitating an inanimate object that doesn't explode screams "My design is inherently about explosions"?
There would be no reason for it to be explosion TYPE. It would be the zubat thing, if for some reason Explosion was a type then it would have explosion type moves.

>>33312396
It is the same sort of damage, impact damage if you will, just through different means.
Relic-song shouldn't be normal at all, I can give you that, but boombust and perish song fit perfect(though there is a strong case that the latter should be psychic).

Why would something like like Arceus be legendary when it can literally do something that every other pokemon can do?

Unlike sound, fighting fills a niche that hadn't previously been filled, while sound is just a larger aspect of normal being force or impactful, be it strong in body (Regigigas) or strong in voice (Meloette).

>>33312413
Just because normal fits doesn't mean Sound wouldn't fit BETTER. What about Boomburst makes it more appropriate to be Normal than Sound?

>>33309414
>plastic type seems to be anything stretchy
>Breloom with canon 30 foot stretchy arms not made into plastic

>>33312410
>What about being electric type and imitating an inanimate object that doesn't explode screams "My design is inherently about explosions"?
The fact it looks like a bomb?
You could count Koffing as well since it's unstable gasses.
>>33312410
>There would be no reason for it to be explosion TYPE. It would be the zubat thing, if for some reason Explosion was a type then it would have explosion type moves.
This isn't about sounds viability as a type, it's about giving things arbitrary typing because their "lore" doesn't line up with what people think their "type" should be.
Explosion is every bit as viable as Sound because, like sound, it has moves and an ability dedicated to it. This goes alongside mons with lore that is dedicated to self detonation and actually looking like they're ready to explode.

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>>33312431
>The fact it looks like a bomb
It's a fucking Pokéball. Is this the level of fucking retard I'm talking to?
>This isn't about sounds viability as a type
That is literally the only thing this is about. Once again, this was at absolutely NO POINT about sound being put into the game, it was about calling out a retard that said "Sound and punch make the same amount of sense"

>>33312424
Because it's a rather typeless attack that is sound based.

>>33312424
>Just because normal fits doesn't mean Sound wouldn't fit BETTER.
Actually int his case it does. Taking a page from explosion-anon, lets look at a few things:
Normal moves, are categorically, moves that are strong impacts or things that otherwise don't have a classification. For lack of a better term, they have nothing to them that makes them stand out like fire or bug attacks.
You can argue against this, but that's a mark against normal type rather than anything supporting sound.

A strong force expelled from a pokemon!
What am I talking about? Is it boomburst? Is it explosion? This accurately, and perfectly, sums up both and if we wanted to get technical then things like explosion, and even things as pants on head stupid as punch, would also apply.
Just like punch moves would fall under fighting, they would fall under punch BETTER, you see...

>>33312444
You don't get to say "It's typeless" in a hypothetical scenario where there is a type that it has. For your argument to be valid you have to make a valid reason to take OUT sound if it was already in the game.

>>33309414
>self-destruct is plastic but explosion isn't
>octazooka is plastic for no reason
>extremspeed, double team and agility are wind
>aquatic type

>>33312442
>It's a fucking Pokéball. Is this the level of fucking retard I'm talking to?
So koffing, stated to be leaking dangerous gasses and has a skull and crossbones DOESNT strong you as somthing that will explode? I mean the bomb with eyes? Totally wrong there! It's not like failed pokeballs are use and done or anything.

>>33312442
Based on your argument they DO make just as much sense. If neither can of you can be objective about this then why is one retarded idea somehow not retarded because the other one is more retarded?

>>33312453
>Taking a page from explosion-anon
I like that name, but it's nice somebody here can think logically.

>>33312454
Except the point is it makes more sense to be typeless, and even being hypothetical doesn't mean sound would be a good no matter when it was implemented.

>>33312453
>They have nothing to them that makes them stand out
Except being sound based, primarily made by sound-focused Pokémon.
>A strong force expelled from a Pokémon!
You're right, that could be Boomburst or Explosion
Or Aura Sphere or Overheat or Eruption or god knows how many more or in Japanese.
>Just like punch moves would fall under fighting, they would fall under punch BETTER
And just like Sound moves fall under sound better than normal

>>33312468
Koffing, the poisonous gas Pokémon with the poison warning on it? Yes, it makes sense it COULD explode. It's not part of it's design that it's inherently explosion type.

>>33312479
But it doesn't and you can't make a single argument for that case without comparing it to a retarded hypothetical that's already been answered.

See >>33312454

>>33312485
>But it doesn't and you can't make a single argument for that case without comparing it to a retarded hypothetical that's already been answered.
see: >>33312479 and >>33312468
>Based on your argument they DO make just as much sense. If neither can of you can be objective about this then why is one retarded idea somehow not retarded because the other one is more retarded?

You can change this goalpost all you want, but you should really think more before posting. Saying "because I think so" is not a compelling argument when we're trying to be objective.

>>33312497
>Saying "because I think so" is not a compelling argument when we're trying to be objective.

You'd be best off just dropping the...debate right now. Intelligence doesn't work on people like that.

>>33309489
I actually don't hate the idea. The theme of articial Pokémon isn't captured that well at the moment.

>>33312501
The problem seems to be he has a misconception about what fighting type represents.
It's more of a catchall "justice" sort of thing, further referenced with how they defeat the "evil" dark types. Justice doesn't make sense thematically, just like sound, so moves like this are combined with attacks typical given to jap super heroes(Rider Punch! Rider Kick!) and things like Ultraman's beams could be seen as Focus Blast, a trick of a focused/honed mind. The kick/punch variant is weak to psychic, as you'd assume mind over matter, but it's also a reflective of crazy things that just can't be punched no matter how hot blooded you are..,

The problem with the punch/kick type is that those aren't as practical nor the intent, which makes sound only slightly better because it also misses the point.

>>33312497
>You can change this goalpost all you want
One goalpost, "Sound is as logical as punch" is a retarded thing to say. You've been taking a lot of random ass shots at goals nobody is using.

>Because I think so is not a compelling argument
That's what I've been trying to tell you.

>>33312510
Yanno artificial type makes so much more sense than sound it hurts.
The guy ranting about exploding mons can use this as their type, and things like Porygon and the garbage mons could also double as this.

The best we have is steel and that's not really specific at all, and normal has proven to be far too broad here.

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>>33312520
>Which makes sound only slightly better
>Confessing you know you're wrong to somebody else whose agreeing with you
Annnd we reach the resolution that was inevitable.

>>33312531
>One goalpost, "Sound is as logical as punch" is a retarded thing to say. You've been taking a lot of random ass shots at goals nobody is using.
I would agree if you weren't trying to apply logic almost as dumb to justify sound type.
>That's what I've been trying to tell you.
Yet your entire argument is based on this, just like the one for punch type. You don't have to be that aggressively retarded to still be retarded.
>>33312520
>(Rider Punch! Rider Kick!)
Huh. Didn't realize that until now.

>>33312520
No I would argue sound type is just as stupid, since both miss the point but in different ways.

One misaligned headcanon is no better than another, anon.

>>33312551
The problem is less the validity of the typing itself but more the asinine "logic" behind it.

One is every bit as stupid as the other, but one person has just thought about their hypothetical situation more.

>>33312551
>>33312563
No I would argue it is less stupid, but only slightly so. Don't be mistaken, there is flaws in both, but punch type misses the type in the same way as sound type but merely...harder?
I can understand somebody confusing sound for something that could be a type, just as I could see somebody confusing punch for one as well.
The anon trying to argue sound should be a type doesn't understand the Japanese meaning behind what normal should be, just as the one trying to argue punch should be a type doesn't understand the meaning behind fighting.

The different is one made the wrong turn, and the other is going around in circles. At the end of the day neither will reach the goal.

>>33312579
I'm fairly sure the sound guy was a shitposter anyway.
The second you backed him into a corner he posted a smug reaction image and ragequit.

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This bothers me so much.

Light type does t stand for anything. Fairy type is light type. Hence moves like Moon blast. Plus fairy is more themed and interesting. GET OVER LIGHT TYPE - ITA ATUPID AND NEVER HAPPENING. Dark type has nothing to do with darkness, it's another word for evil, hence it being called evil in Japanese.

Cosmic type is the same as psychic. Cosmic type moves can only make use of current elements. Being cosmic is a characteristic not a type.

The only new type they could ever make that would be valid is if they combined rock and ground into Earth type.

Or the Sound type. But if you make a sound type it would take a lot of characters and moves away from normal type and it's just not needed.

>>33309339
Sound type is way dumber than Cosmic or Light.

>>33309414
>Aquatic type

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>>33312243
Fairy aint gay

You callin sylveon gay

>>33312624
Still a better idea than plastic or aquatic

>>33309414
I don't get thematic difference between Flying and Wind and between Aquatic and Water.

>>33312675
We literally had an entire thread where an anon was proven wrong when he tried to claim Sound was, objectively, better than something as stupid as punch or plastic.

Stupid is stupid.

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psychic is cosmic
psychic is cosmic
psychic is cosmic
psychic is cosmic
psychic is cosmic

>>33309824
Problem is that the only two Flying moves that wouldn't become Wind-type are Chatter and Oblivion Wing, moves that are available to exactly two Pokémon each. Stuff like M-Pidgeot, Skymin, Togekiss and Yanmega (off the top of my head) would get a hell of a nerf from losing STAB on those moves.

>>33310094
> they already exist

Correct. As a foil to the Dark-type, Fairy is your holy/angelic type and Fighting is your heroic/good type.

> they can be stuff that produces light

So basically any Fire, Electric, Psychic, Fairy etc. type can now be Light-type.

> you can add more moves

Why just for the sake of a type that is so broad and vague? Light already works fine as an aspect of another type.

> the whole franchise is unnecessary

Then why do you give a fuck about your shitty idea being shot down?

flying is the true retarded type
look at that amount of mono flying type lmao

>>33312708
This has nothing to with my post.

>>33310339
A literal strawman from a literal retard.
>>33311979
Physical dark moves are usually sucker punches and trickery, special moves are usually shadowy stuff.
>>33312728
GTFO tumblr, repeating something on your blog doesn't make it a fact.

>>33312708
O RLY?

Post your "Objective proof".

It'll probably just be some kid getting insulted by a shitposting retard hivemind for saying something The Mob doesn't agree with. Then the hive mind will create and applaud their own "Better version" of his idea.

>"Fuck you my dumb idea's just as good as your dumb idea"
>"Fuck you my idea isn't dumb"
>"Fuck you your idea is dumb because I said so"
>"Fuck you my idea isn't dumb because I'm putting thought into it, unlike you"
>"You don't need to put thought into an idea to make it good! A shit idea is shit because it's shit because it is!"

When do the faggots stop going in circles and moving goalposts and yelling insults at each other and start responding to actual points made by non-shitposters that take their ideas seriously, like
>>33309603
>>33309618
these?

>>33312385
>Punching is a move base, it's still inherently fighting type, despite it's exceptions.

There are more punch moves that aren't Fighting type than moves that are, your argument is invalid.

>>33311999
>Wow it's like you didn't actually point out any flaws in that argument!

Yes I did.

>You claimed "dark" means not light. Which is incorrect.
No it's not. I literally pointed out an example which explicitly refers to literal darkness. Night Daze also refers to literal darkness.

>Yes, again, claiming "because the word dark is in there it must mean not light" is just literally wrong
But it's not wrong because the type includes things that are not light.

>Black Hole Eclipse is literally the only name that remotely implies anything to do with light.
And this doesn't count because why? It goes against your headcanon? Stop being a retard.

Wow, it's like you can smell the fact that I don't come here often, and I haven't degenerated into mindless shitposting like the "Punch should be a type" guy over there "Pretending" to be retarded.

>>33313533
No it was just disproving an anon's headcanon and showing that all of these "better" versions are just as bullshit.

>>33312990
It's pointing out that people who suggest types like this rarely have anything other than their own headcanon to back it up.

Stupid happens, anon. >>33312990

>>33315527
>Punch should be a type

Literally no one said this bait-kun

>>33315544
Aquatic/Punch type: Fucking stupid
Sound type: Could only work if all the retyped Normal moves worth a damn are replaced with equally-powerful normal-type variants.
Cosmic type: Could work
Light type: Could work, AND would make sun teams less shitty. Rain teams have one primary type, and one other type that benefits from rain being up. Sandstorm teams have two primary types and one extra-primary types in the form of Rock types, who get a Spdef boost. Sun has Grass and Fire-types, two shit types with little synergy beyond fighting over a metahporical blanket too small for either of them.

>>33315654
>>33312708
>>33313733
Life comes at you fast.

>>33315654
>>33312708
>>33313733
Life comes at you fast, "Bait-kun".

>>33309414
>>33311831
Ideas that stupid people ruin.

>>33315734
>>33315734
>Literally too stupid to follow the thread

No one was sincerely arguing that Punch type should be a thing; you'd have to be a literal retard to have missed that it was being used analogous to a supposed Sound type, as both are a property of a move, not an elemental type.

The idea of a new type being made is already fucking slim. The point of the thread was to see what the most likely new type could be. Sound is the only possibility that isn't just an already existing type of branded like wind and light and cosmic.

>>33317466
Even if there is a new type added someday in the future, its not going to be any of the popular guesses that you see on /vp/. Sound and Light type have been the popular fan picks for ages now yet Fairy, a type virtually no one considered before Gen 6, beat out both of them.

>>33317642
Fairy kind of is the light type to a degree that's why I brought it up in my post along with wind and such

>>33316503
Are you retarded?

A sound type could work, but not well. A punch type is fucking retarded, just like the strawmanning faggot that came up with it.

Have I made this clear enough? Or do you want to keep hiding behind "I was only pretending to be retarded, because I want to show that kid how retarded I think he is!"?

>>33317890
>this obvious lack of reading comprehension

You're literally arguing with yourself at this point. Whether or not Sound could work as an actual type is irrelevant to its existing and future status as a move property.

>>33317780
The difference is that Fairy is less limited in scope and therefore has a lot more space for move design and what Pokemon can fit into the type.

My theory is that Gamefreak had considered a Sound type as early as Gen III (given the Whismur line and Chimecho) but then realized that it was too limited in scope as an elemental type and scrapped it.