Was this the trough?

I feel the games were very much carried by the fact that they were the first 3D core games, something people have been dreaming of since the series inception. The story was mediocre and literally every character was forgettable.

That said, I do not consider them bad games, merely games that were happy to settle for being average and let the pretty graphics do the marketing, which is a shame given that the previous gen (love it or hate it) was at least bold enough to strike out and try new things.

Well, as much as Gamefreak are prepared to do that, anyway...

>>32807560
>the previous gen (love it or hate it) was at least bold enough to strike out and try new things.
Implying Gen 6 wasnt bold enough to try new things
>Fairies
>Megas
>Customization
>Amie
>Hordes
>PSS
>Rollerskates
>DexNav
>Soaring
>QR secret bases

Dont be dumb

>>32808305
these games are awful
bw2 had a challenge mode, little handholding, a good dex and good story. They got rid of all of this in favor of dumbing down fucking pokemon even more, throwing 500 mons into one dex, gen 1 pandering every 3 seconds, mega evolution ruining balance, XP share e.t.c.
easily the worst games, the last 3 pokemon games have been marketed towards the smart phone kids crowd, the games will never be as good again

>>32808316
>>Amie
>>Hordes
>>PSS
>>Rollerskates
>>DexNav
>>Soaring
>>QR secret bases
thanks to gamefreak non of this will ever return

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>>32807560
I think they were so focused on creating new concepts and new improvements that they actually forgot to make a great game on its own. Even the existing characters had unique designs and some cities really look great, but it lacked interaction, an involving storytelling. Even though many people in /vp/ hated. SM and Gen 5 did that right (Platinum could be mentioned too) and probably from now on every game with a story that gets worse than that will probably be shitted in those terms.

Also, XY had a big Pokedex and made it also a mess. Lumious had a big hype over it and ended up being big and tedious. It's clear they didn't even thought too much about the gameplay itself.

>>32807560
>sorry excuse for 'rivals'
>you and every npc have the same souless expression with no idle movement
>towns with no memorable qualities
>easy modo exp share
>further power creep up the asshole
>a messy on-rails handholding experience throughout the entire game
>you wan new pokemon? too bad here rucario fuck you
>lumiose city (including the god awful music)

XY was the excrement at the bottom of the barrel and ORAS/SM is the stain at the bottom of that barrel. Colo/XD were the only pokemon games with a story that did it right. No one wants to sit through happy adventures friends for ever cutscenes every town you enter.

>>32808316
Perhaps I was speaking a little too much from a narrative perspective. That tends to be my presiding memory of each game. Gen 5 made a profound impression on me because it was prepared to have a more nuanced narrative than "the evil team wants to rule the world". Of course we went right back to that in BW2 but the suggestion of an ethical quandary was intriguing enough to demand my respect. The gen was far from flawless but to my mind XY had a tough act to follow and they fell short.

I did not wish to imply that XY were completely devoid of refinement or innovation however. You are right. The addition of a new type is a fairly big shake up considering the last time a new type was added was GS. I must give it credit for that.

Trainer customisation was another great addition. It felt very natural given the transition to 3D and I am glad it's not region exclusive like secret bases or followers. Sadly I notice that while megas persist in the game, I get the feeling GF somewhat regret them, given the lack of new megas and the lack of acknowledgement in SM beyond the post-game addition of a mega-stone to your Z-Ring. They were an interesting way to expand the evolution lines of Pokemon.

The PSS was a great. A great way to implement online play and a very good use of the touch screen. I was saddened by its removal in SM. Plaza is no substitute.

Amie, hordes, rollerskates... great touches all.

The latter half of your list applies mostly to ORAS (secret bases, soaring, etc.), not XY. I believe the OP was referring to XY exclusively, but if not then fine, they're good additions too.

So in short... I am not arguing with you. I concede all of your points.

And yet I still feel the same way about XY. Perhaps I am being irrational, but the games failed to inspire me the same way earlier games have done and they followed my personal favourite gen. Maybe it is more unfortunate timing and placement within the series for me than anything the games really lack.

>>32808328

Amie did return though...

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>>32808316
>Fairies
>Megas
>starting off with the two biggest mistakes that completely fucked the balance of the game

>>32807560
XY has quite a lot of flaws, but I gotta give XY the credit to where its due.
XY easily had the strongest early game, with a ton of variety in pokemon and held items, the early game routes and caves actually being well designed (outside of that Rhyhorn bullshit), and the fact that it was lengthly and felt like you were going on an adventure,until you beat Korrina, then the game just jumps off a cliff. It's so tragic that the mid and late game were so rushed and half-assed and the pacing went to complete shit. If XY kept the pacing the games had from Gyms 1-3 for the entire game, people would probably have them in their top games, even with the lack of postgame. For what XY is, the lack of postgame really hurt it because of the shitty pacing before it.

>>32809402
t. dragonfag

>>32809441
Go climb the ladder on Showdown and count the number of Tapus you see.

As for megas, they are nothing more than blatant power creep and do nothing other than put more unanswerable offensive threats in the meta.

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>>32808458
Why you faggots hate Lumiose so much? It was the best city ever.

The only bad thing about XY was

>Shit rivals
>Uninspired evil team
>FUCKING route 13
>No third version

nothing more, the rest was really great, Kalos was a good region.

>>32809980
And the rushed mid-late game, which led to a fucked level curve, with and without the EXP share
and the lack of postgame
and the crappy choices for male clothing

>>32810038
Your first point is valid too

The postgames is always shit in the first games, that doesnt bothered at that moment but no third game fucked up that for me

The male clothes was OK, girls just had a lot more because girls are girls, what I wanted was more hairstyles, it would be cool had a delinquent pompadour, shaved head, a mohawk, spiky hair, a dumb looking bowl cut, etc

The other bad thing was no Vs seeker l:'(